no maruaill that ye teach a contrary doctrine For though the name of your purgatory be out of some of your bokes Yet are not all purse pykers come to the pillary Barnes FOr allthough perchaunce you knowe nothinge by me yet do I confesse that my thoughtes and cogitaciōs be in̄umerable Wherfore I beseche the entre not in to iudgment with me acording to the sayeng of the Prophet Dauid non in tres in iudicium cum seruo tuo domine and in another place si iniquitates obseruaueris domine quis sustinebir Lord yf thou strately marke our iniquyte who is able to abyde thy iudgment Standish Se I praye you the deuell seduced him so farre that he wold not knowlege any synne but onely cogitacions et cet Couerdale D. Barnes saide not that he had no sinne but all though saide he perchaunce you knowe nothinge by me yet I confesse that my thoughtes and cogitacions are in̄umerable Is this asmuch to saie as I haue no sinne but onely cogitacions and thoughtes Or be not thoughtes and cogitacions sinnes greate ynough Dyd he not cōfesse also with the Prophet that yf god wold strately marke his iniquities he were not able to abyde it Is iniquitie no sinne Not in your iudgment as it appeareth for ye darre boldly affirme that in all your workyng ye committe no sinne Standish Se how he iudged other men perchaunce to knowe no sinne in him et cet Couerdale Yf it be an abhominable vice as it is no doubte to slaundre the scripture or to belye it then verely are ye infecte with abhominable vice that haue misreported it and belied it in so many places of this youre treatise Now yf ye be of counsaill with so many good men that knew such vices in D. Barnes I maruaill ye tell us not what those vyces are As for your mother the vnholy church he called her an harlot many tymes And sure I am that who so knoweth her thorowly and cōpareth her with her frutes to Oolla and Ooliba wil iudge her to be litle better Standish Iudge therfore your selues what auaileth him these his fained praiers et cet Couerdale The praiers that D. Barnes vseth here are the holy wordes of gods scripture and yet ye call thē fayned prayers Now yf the holy goost which is the authoure of the scripture doth abhorre faynednesse as the wise man saieth then verely is it blasphemous to cal those fained praiers that he onely hath taught Againe Yf they be fained praiers why saie ye that ye doubte not but to another man passing in the faith of Christ they shuld haue bene acceptable yee and meritoryous before god Can fained praiers be acceptable to god Can fayned prayers merite or deserue any thing of god Or can he that dyeth in the fayth of Christ vse fayned prayers at his death How agreeth faynedesse with the faith of Christ Full fained and false is your doctrine Oure lord roote it ones out frō among his people Barnes WHerfore I trust in no good worke that euer I dyd but onely in the death of Iesus Christ Standishe To trust in our workes ut in deum credimus that they of them selues et cet Couerdale What an vnstable doctryne is this that ye bring in among gods people and wold bear them in hand that Christ alowed your saieng in the xx of Matthew Where as the parable in the same chapter and the processe of the last parte of the xix chapter hard afore it do utterly cōdemne your doctrine Lord god what a derogacion vnto gods hye glory is this to teach that we maye trust in oure workes that we maie calenge our inheritaunce by our workyng that our workyng maie deserue to receaue immortalite In the later ende of the xix chapter of Matthew doth our lorde affirme that to be saued is a thing vnpossible through the power of men And in this xx chapter doth his parable testifie that like as we are first called by him receaue his promes and are set a worke by his comaundemēt so is not the rewarde geuen for anie deseruing or paynes takynge but acording to his awne promes First where finde ye in anie article of the Christen faith conteined within the holy bible ether commaundement or promes of god or example of anie good man that we maie put anie maner of trust in our workes Againe Yf oure enheritaunce come by the death of Christ and his promes how commeth it by our workyng Is our workynge the death of Christ or his promes Now yf our workyng maie deserue the inheritaunce of immortalite then maie we make satisfaction vnto god for oure offence and that ye haue denyed afore O how well agree ye with youre selfe Standish And this caused Paul boldly to saie .ij. Timo. iiij Bonum certamen certaui et cet Couerdale Whan that holy vessell of god S. Paul had exhorted Timothy to the feruent executing of his dutie in preaching gods worde and had tolde him afore of this present perlous time that men will not suffre wholsome doctrine et cete He shewed him of his owne death saiēge For I am now ready to be offred and the tyme of my departing is at hande I haue foughten a good fighte I haue fulfilled the course I haue kepte the faith From hence forth ther is layed vp for me a crowne of righteousnesse which the lord the righteous iudge shall geue me in that daie not onely vnto me but to all them that loue his commynge What caused Paul now to saie these wordes Any trust or confidence in his owne deseruyng or workes Naye verely He confesseth not onely that the crowne of righteousnesse is laied vp for him but also that god shall geue it him nether sayeth he here that it shall be geuen him for his workyng sake for then were he contrary to his owne doctrine which utterly condemneth yours Roma iij. Ephe. ij Philip. iij. ij Timoth. j. Tit. iij Note well the places your selfe Standish All be it I feare me these his wordes et cete Couerdale Yf whan he dyd anie good worke he caused no trompettes to be blowne before him ner mombled vp longe praiers in the corners of stretes ner disfigured his face to be sene of men whan he fasted then was there the lesse ypocrisie in him It is a prouerbe as true as olde A still pater noster is as good as a lowde Barnes I do not doubte but thorow him to inheret the kyngdome of heauen Standish I beseche god this false and erroneous beleue contrary allmost in euery sentence to our mother the holy church et cet Couerdale Full vnholy and vngracious is your mother and ye as vnwise to take hir parte that calleth it a false and erroneous beleue whan a man doubteth not but to inheret the Kyngdome of heauen thorow Christ Yf that beleue be contrary to your mother then is she contrary to it and so is she the sinagoge of Antichrist
verely as ye saie your selfe the propertye of an heretike and this propertye lerne ye of the father of all heresye euen father Satan Who by angelis suis mandauit et cete wolde proue that a man maye tempte his lord god But like as Satan wrestyng that place of scripture which made moost against him was cōmaunded by oure Sauioure to auoyde so be ye sure that your false doctryne can not stand Dawlbe your wall and spare not for Ezechiel telleth you planely that god wyll sende such a shower of rayne among all lyeng prophetes as shall ouerthrowe it Your laboure is but lost so long as ye dawlbe your wall with vntempred morter Standish Also where he saieth that he hath euer spoken reuerently of sayntes et cet Couerdale Ye graūted afore his wordes to be true whan he sayde that all such as for confessyng Christes name and for his sake do suffre death are sayntes in heauen This reuerent talkynge and praysinge of sayntes dyd ye alowe afore And now contrary to your awne wordes ye saye that ye wote not whether he euer spake reuerently of them or no Yet confesse ye that ye haue heard him fortye tymes Who will now trust you that are so double in your wordes Barnes ANd that oure lady I saye she was a virgyn immaculate and vndefyled and that she is the moost purest virgyn that euer god created and a vessell electe of god of whom Iesus Christe shulde be borne Standish Here yet ignorauntly et cete he goeth forther then the scripture speaketh et cet Couerdale Be these his wordes out of the boundes of scripture or not acording to the scripture Reade them ouer agayne Standishe He wolde neuer willingly graunt anye thynge but that is in scripture Couerdale Then like as ye proue him to haue bene a true messaunger of god in grauntinge to the holy scripture which by your owne cōfession is gods very worde so declare ye that yf he reuoked anie thing that is in it or graunted ought cōtrary vnto it It was done agaynst his will Haue ye not now a great cause to make such tryumphinge of reuocacions in your sermons Standish Albeit here with the church he doth professe that oure lady did continue a virgin still et cete Couerdale Doth not the scripture affirme this doctryne that the mother of oure Sauyoure is the purest virgin that euer god created Will not the Prophecies of Christes birth the perfourmaūce of the same and the practises of the holy goost in Christes blessed mother alowe this doctrine Haue ye noted the worke of god in her no better Yf she had anye nede of you ye shew her but a faynte frendshippe in reportynge that her most pure virginite hath none other grounde but the auctorite of your church Verely such your doting doctrine wil make both you and your church be lesse set by Standish Deus n tantam eam fecit inquit quidam et ce Couerdale Is not your doctryne now well sealed with butter Whan ye haue presumed to cōtroll gods word and to call the blessed mother of Christ with other names then the holy goost geueth her Now to ratifye and cōfirme your false matter ye bring in an heretike to helpe you Can not Christes worthy mother kepe still the gracious names that the holy trenite hath geuen her but she must now haue a sorte of hereticall Ruffyans to become new godfathers vnto her Call her as gods worde teacheth you full of grace blessed immaculate virgin et cete Praye to god that ye maye folowe the fote steppes of her constant faith her feruent charite and godly loue her moost meke and humble behaueoure her vnfained trueth et ce And whan ye talke in matters of Christes religion bring forth playne and manifest wordes of his scripture and no Romysh heretike ner a text out of frame to proue youre purpose withall Barnes THen saide M. Sheriffe You haue sayd well of her before And he beynge afrayed that M. Sheriffe had bene or shulde be agreued with any thing that he shulde saye sayd M. Sheriffe Yf I speak any thing that you will me not do nomore but beckē me with your hand and I wil straight waie holde my peace For I will not be dishobedient in anie thing but will obeye Standishe Now as he faineth he wold gyue no slaunder or offence Sed sero sapiunt Phriges Couerdale At this poynt ye are with D. Barnes that though he be out of this life yet what so euer he sayd in this protestacion or dyd at the tyme therof ye iudge him to the worst and slaunder him But your owne prouerbe that ye bring in doth admonishe you that it is to laite for though ye belye him and slaunder him neuer so much it can not hurt him Standishe Now he saieth he is afraied to displease irep◠dauerunt timore vbi non erat timor et cete Couerdale Like as ye referre to him the wordes which are not his owne so reporte ye of him that he was afrayed where no feare was But was there no feare at the fyre syde The manhode of our sauioure Christ feared death and so dyd that holy Kynge Ezechias As for you ye must nedes be of some bolde and stowte kynde that can kyll a deed man But how serueth those wordes of the Psalme to this youre purpose The holy goost speaketh of such wicked workers as eat vp gods people like bred call not vpon god are afraied to se god stande on ryghteous mens syde and mocke poore mē for putting their trust in god How maketh this scripture now to proue that ther is no feare where a man seyth death present before his eyes O wicked mockers with gods holy worde Standish Now se I praye you how obedient he saieth he will be which before tyme was euer dishobedient et cete Couerdale Ye saye much and proue litle touching this man whose present protestacion and his boke written afore declareth planely his obedience toward his prynce whose wholsome commaundement yf he haue at anye tyme disobeyed contrary to this his doctryne and example I am the more sory But yet haue ye not proued it to be so Touchinge bishoppes which are to be estemed acordinge to their estate I wote not what dishobedience ye haue to proue against him Such bishoppes as laboure in the worde of god and in the doctryne therof are to be counted worthye of double honoure therfore in herkenyng vnto such he dyd well and yf he dispysed such he despysed Christ But yf he folowed S. Iohns bydding and dyd not receaue such false Apostles as bring not the doctryne of Christ then can ye not iustly blame him Barnes AFter this ther was one that asked him what he saide of the sacrament of the altare Then sayde he vnto M. Pope which was there present M. Pope ye know and. M. Ryche yf ye be alyue that ther was one accused before my lord
few yeares by certaine abbottes which thinkyng therby to vpholde their false religions wrought moued or els consented to insurrection within diuerse parties of the realme And yet was the same their wisdome a cause that haisted their owne destructiō And euen so now by youre printinge of the saide protestaciō ye haue brought it so to pas that the thinge whiche ye feared is come to light Thus can god pull downe his enemies houses with their owne hondes Certainlie like as I neuer heard that ther was any copie therof till I sawe it in youre boke so am I credibly enfourmed that it was neuer in printe afore Where as ye saie that it is an erroneous and traiterous protestaciō it is sooner saide then proued nether maketh it greately for youre honestie to knowe many secrete embracers of heresie and treason and not to utter them But ye maie twise saie it afore ye be ones beleued onely they that are of god wil whan thei haue tried and examined al thinges kepe that which is good and eschuethe contrary Standish BVt I trust in allmightie god yf it please you to rede this litle treatise with a louyng zele toward oure mother the holy church et cetera Couerdale Here do ye manifestly declare what zele moued you to write against D. Barnes protestacion Namely not any iust zele or loue toward gods worde or his people but euen because ye feare lest your mother shulde come to shame yf the trueth were knowne therfore to shew youre mother a pleasure ye thoughte to do youre best in defending her Nether helpeth it your pretēce anie thinge at all though ye call hir holy for euery such secte as ye be of hath a sundrie holinesse which commeth not of the sprete that sanctifieth Now like as your owne acte came of that zele which ye beare toward the church of the wicked so wolde ye haue youre treatise red with the same zele to the intent that the readers might smell heresie and treason where none is and be poysoned with such a corrupte iudgment as ye be of youre selfe Agayne how are ye or all men lyuinge able to proue that this protestacion of D. Barnes doth smell and sauoure nothinge but heresie and treason Is it heresie and treason to teach no erroneous doctrine to teach onely those thinges that scripture leadeth vnto to manteyne no erroure to moue no insurrection to be falsly slaundred to confute the false opinion of the Anabaptistes to deteste and abhorre all such sectes to set forth the glory of god obedience to the hyer powers and the true religion of Christ Doth it smell and sauoure nothinge but heresie and treason to beleue in the holy and blessed trenite to beleue the incarnacion passiō death and resurrection of oure lorde and sauiour Iesus Christ Is it heresye and treason for a synner to desire god to forgeue him to trust onely in the death of Christ to set forth good workes to beleue that ther is a holy church to beleue a life after this to speake reuerently of saintes to call oure lady a virgin immaculate and vndefiled to knowlege a Christen beleue concerning the body and bloude of oure lorde to ascribe vnto saintes the honoure that scripture willeth them to haue to praie for the Kyng and his counsaill et cete Do such thinges smell and sauoure nothinge but heresie and treason Wo vnto thē that call good euell and euell good darknesse light and light darknesse swete sower and sower swete Though ye do also esteme them to be heretikes and traitours that take parte with D. Barnes protestacion yet doth not youre estimacion or iudgment discorage me in this behalfe Nether is it my minde or will to medle with his offence yf he cōmitted anie against the Kyng nether to defende this his protestaciō with anie hand or weapen of man but by the scriptures to beare recorde vnto the trueth and to reproue youre peruerse and straunge doctrine which ye do teach against the same Standish FOr surely such as do improue them et cete Couerdale This youre saienge proueth not the cōtrary but that seinge ye resist the trueth I maie tell you your faute and enfourme you better acording to the Apostles doctrine yf god at any tyme will graunt you repentaunce for to know the trueth and to turne from the snare of the deuell et cete If I can vnderstonde that thorow this enfourmacion ye will geue place to the open and manifest trueth godschall haue the praise and I shall thincke my laboure well bestowed Yf the trueth can haue no place in you by faire meanes but he wil stil resiste it obstinately and belye it as ye do here in this youre treatise then verely ye maie be sure to be afterward so handled as the lymites and boundes of gods holy scripture wil suffre I beseche god acordinge to his good pleasure that ye maie haue eies to se eares to heare and an hert to vnderstonde his holy worde to consente vnto the same and in all pointes to liue therafter Amen Here foloweth the protestacion of S. Robert Barnes Barnes I Am come hither to be burned as an heretike and you shall heare my belefe wherby ye shal perceaue what erroneous opynions I holde Standishe I am sory to se the obstinate blindnesse and finall induracion in this his protestacion which wolde clere iustifie and excuse himself by colour and disceate Couerdale Christ oure sauioure makyng mencion of his owne death afore he was hanged apon the crosse saide these wordes Beholde we go vp to Hierusalem and the sonne of man shalbe betraied condemned mocked scourged crucified et cetera Whan a true man commeth to be hanged on the galowes Is it obstinate blindnesse and finall induracion for him so to saie Peraduenture ye will saie vnto me Take ye D. Barnes then for a true man I answere Verely these his wordes proue him no false man for he saide that he came to be brent And sure I am that he came not to the fire to be made a bisshoppe Morouer D. Barnes tolde the people that they shulde heare his beleue et cet And ye laie to his charge for his so doinge that he wolde cleare iustifie and excuse himselfe with coloure and disceate As though he iustified himself with colour and disceate which acordinge to S. Peters doctrine is ready allwaie to geue answere vnto euery man that asketh him a reason of the hope which is in him Was not D. Barnes instantly required to shew his faith and to open his minde in sondrie thinges Againe though he or anie man els wolde clere himfelse from such thinges as are wrongfully laied to his charge did he euell therin Yf it be so then did holy S. Paul leaue us a shrewd ensample in the Actes Standishe Which ought to haue accused condemned and utterly forsaken all that he had offended in si nos ipsos iudicaremus non utique diiudicaremur a domino
Couerdale I answere By youre owne wordes then it foloweth not that he was bounde to accuse and cōdemne himselfe of the thinges that he had not offended in But by youre leue where as ye bring in this text of S. Paul Si nos ipsos et cetera ye peruerte it not alledginge it as it standeth but thus Si nos ipsos iudicaremus non vtique diiudicaremur a Domino That is to saie Yf we iudged oure selues we shulde not be iudged of the lorde But. S Pauls wordes are these Quod si nos ipsos diiudicaremus non vtique iudicaremur Dum iudicamur autem a Domino corripimur ne cum hoc mundo damnemur That is to saie Yf we wolde iudge or reproue oure selues we shulde not be iudged But whan we are iudged we are chastened of the lorde lest we shulde be damned with this worlde Wherfore the peruerting of this texte now at the first bront causeth me the more to suspecte you and to trust you the worse because the deuell himselfe is scolemaster to such chopping vp of the texte As we maie se in the gospell of Mathew and Luke Now go to Yf I finde anie moo such iugling castes with you ye are like to heare of it afore I come to the ende of your boke For weaknesse and ignoraunce can I well awaie withall so longe as it is not wilfull but the peruerting or choppinge vp of a text of holy scripture is not to be borne vnrebuked Standishe Marke here how he vseth Ironia et cetera Couerdale Ye confesse that D. Barnes in his forsaide wordes doth vse ironia and yet contrary to the significacion of the worde ye are not ashamed to affirme that he confessed herewithall both heresie and erroneous opinions Now is ironia asmuch to saie as a mockage derision or meaning of another thinge then is expressed in the wordes Which maner of speakynge is much vsed not onely thorow out the Prophetes in holy scripture but also among the Heithen Poetes And the same phrase of speche haue we in Englische As whan a man saieth to ashrewde boie Come hither good sir ye are a vertuous childe in dede et cete meaninge nothinge lesse For asmuch then as ye your selfe cōfesse that D. Barnes doth here vse ironia it is euidēt that whan he saide these wordes You shall perceaue what erroneous opynions I holde his meaninge was how that the people shulde know that he helde no erroneous opinions As it appeareth by these his wordes folowinge Barnes GOd I take to recorde I neuer to my knowlege taught any erroneous doctrine but onely those thinges which scripture led me vnto Standishe Iustly pondre by the Prophet Psal cxl how greuous offence is partinax excusatio in peccatis et cet Couerdale Like as ye can not iustly laie anie partinacite to D. Barnes for those his wordes so proue ye the greuousnesse therof full slenderly out of the cxl Psalme yf the true readinge of the text be wel and iustly pondred Where as he taketh god to recorde in the trueth of so waightye a matter the scripture is full of holy ensamples that beare him therin What partinacite is there then in that acte He durst avowe also that to his knowlege he neuer taught anie erroneous doctrine and yet are ye not ashamed to ascrybe partinacite vnto him and to call him an obstinate heretike where as S. Hierome in his fourth boke the xxiiij chapter vpon Mathew writeth thus He is an heretike that vnder Christes name teacheth the thinges which are agaynst Christ Yf. D. Barnes therfore had wittingly and willingy taught anye thing against Christ ye might haue laied great partinacite to his charge Trueth it is that he beinge in ignoraunce and disceaued somtime by a multitude as you be did both erre and teach erroneous doctrine for the preferrement of the. B. of Romes vsurped auctorite and other abuses acording as many other lerned men moo in the realme haue done which haue sens both repēted toward god and also receaued the Kynges gracious pardon many yeares agoo Againe yf ye will laie partinacite to his charge because he was somtime in such grosse ignoraunce by the same argument might ye condemne Christes disciples of whose ignoraunce mencion is made in many places of the new Testament I saie not this to excuse ignoraunce but to reprehende the rashnesse of youre iudgment which presume to condemne them whō god hath called to repentaunce But peraduenture the pertinacite that ye laye to his charge is because he saieth he taught onely those thinges which scripture led him vnto For that is no small corsie to youre sore Ye wolde not haue scripture taught onely without other doctrines Neuertheles they that loue gods commaundement will teach nothinge but his worde onely for so hath he himselfe geuen cōmission Of his promises is mencion made both in Hieremie and in the gospell of Matthew As for ensamples we haue sufficiēt both of the Prophetes and Apostles which to die for it wold teach nothinge but scripture Reade the thirtēth chapter of the seconde Epistle to the Corinthians the fiftenth to the Romaines and the moost godly protestacion that S. Peter maketh in his seconde Epistle Let us geue place and cōsente to the holy scripture saieih S. Augustine for it can nether disceaue ner be disceaued The bisshoppes also and clergie of England in the Epistle of their boke to the Kynges grace do affirme that holy scripture alone sheweth men the right path to come to god to se him to knowe him to loue him to serue him and so to serue him as he moost desireth Wherfore they are rather obstinate agaynst god which in steade of his onely worde preach and teach other doctrines But let us heare what D. Barnes saieth more Barnes And that in my sermons I neuer mayntayned any erroure nether moued ner gaue occasion of anye insurrection Standish What blyndnesse wolde he leade us in to Who hath not heard him preach agaynst all the ordinaunce of Christes church et cete Couerdale As for blindnesse ye nede no leader to bring you in to it oure lorde whan his will is bringe you out of it This man toke god to recorde that he neuer mainteined anye erroure Wherby like as he denied not but that he might erre as he did erre grosly whan he lyued in the Papistry euen so lefte he us an ensample to forsake all errours and to maynteyne none Call ye this a leadinge in to blyndnesse Then farewell all good ensamples of humilite and repentaunce To the other parte of youre cauillacion I answere It wolde be to longe a registre for you to rehearce the names of all those which neuer heard D Barnes preach agaynst the ordinaunce of Christes church I also am one of them which haue heard him as oft as euer dyd ye and yet as I hope to haue my parte of gods mercy in Christes bloude I neuer heard
of S. Marke and ther by shall we se how well these two confessions do agree and how clarkly ye haue ioined them together S. Marke reporteth that the legiō of deuels which had possessed a certaine man and taken his right mynde from him et cet cryed out and saide vnto oure sauioure What haue I to do with the thou sonne of the moost hie god Here is it manifest that the deuell cryeth out of oure sauioure Christ and wolde haue nothinge to do with him Whan dyd D. Barnes crye out of him A greate parte of the world can testifie that he hath cryed out of Antichrist and his chaplens yee and that so lowde that he hath awaked a great nombre with his cryenge Yee but to my purpose will ye saye the deuell also confesseth Christ to be the sonne of god I answere Their confessions be not alike For. D. Barnes doth not onely confesse that Christ is the sonne of god but saieth also I beleue that he suffred the moost cruell and bitter death for me et cete Whan dyd the deuell beleue that Christ dyed for him Agayne this confession of D. Barnes condemneth the heresye of the Anabaptistes concernyng the incarnacion of the lord Iesus Whan dyd the deuell condemne anye such false opinion Will ye make it not deuelish doctryne to be of that secte Beware what ye saye Are ye not ashamed then to compare these blessed wordes to the confession of the deuell and yet to wryte that they be well sayde Standishe This youre confession doth not proue you to be a good Christen man Couerdale By youre iudgment to confesse the true beleue in the blessed trenyte to confesse the incarnacion of Christ to abhorre the false opinion of the Anabaptistes to beleue in Christes death resurrection et cete is no profe of a Christen man No though Christ himselfe saie Who so euer doth knowlege me before men him will I knowlege also before my father which is in heauen And. S. Paul To beleue with the hert iustifieth and to knowlege with the mouth saueth for the scripture saieth Who soeuer beleueth on him shall not be confounded Wherfore yf men considre your wordes ye bring youre selfe verely in to a shrewd suspicion for ye seme to fauoure the miscreauntes and infidels euen them that beleue not the articles of the Christen faith It semeth that ye beleue in some other thinge then god els wolde ye make more of the Christen belefe then ye do Standish For the most parte of the heretikes condemned by scripture and oure mother the church et cet Couerdale Where fynde ye in the scripture that he is condemned which beleueth in the sonne of god all though ye call him and wryte him heretike ten thousand times But I se well ye lack helpe I will tell you where ye shall fynde a text of scripture for your purpose S. Iohn the baptist saieth He that beleueth on the sonn of god hath euerlastinge life And Christ oure sauioure saieth a litle afore in the same chapter God so loued the world that he gaue his onely begotten sonne that who so beleueth in him shulde not perishe but haue eternall life et cet He that beleueth on him is not condemned And where as ye saie that then were condemned by the church I answere Yf ye meane the church of Christ which I doubte not to be in Englang aswell as in other realmes then blaspheme ye it for saienge that it condemneth them whom Christ with his owne mouth pronounceth not to be condemned For Christes church neuer condemneth them whom he saueth Yee and in youre so reportinge ye blaspheme the Kynges highnesse chefe and suppreme head nexte vnder god of this saide church of England without whose auctorite no execucion maie laufully be done within his dominion Howbeit amonge the busshes and in a corner without the kynges knowlege a true man somtime maie chaunce peraduenture to be hanged as soone as a thefe Yf ye meane youre owne mother the church of the froward and multitude of wicked doers then verely like a good childe ye haue discloysed and uttered youre mothers secretes and tolde us hir very nature which as she is a very spirituall strompet and comon harlot so is she a mother of murther a shedder of innocēt bloud and by your owne confession a condemner of them whom Christ darre advowe to be saued What ye meane by the censoure of the powers a man can not well perceaue by youre wordes ye speake so confusedly But yf ye meane the sentence iudgment or determinacion of the hyer powers then slaundre ye them as I saide afore in that ye reporte how they shulde be the condemners of those whom Christ hath not condemned Yf by the cēsoure of the powers ye meane your owne vsurped auctorite or the stollen and vntruely gotten auctorite of youre mother the wicked church then we beleue you For in her as the aungell saieth is founde the bloude of the prophetes and sayntes Yf ye meane the fyrepanne that ye cast incense in then maye we se that youre censoure is wheter then other mens fyre and therfore the more persons for anie man to medle withall Yf by the censoure of the powers ye meane the censoure of youre excomunicacion then declare ye youre selues to be the cursers of them whom god hath blessed and so are ye cursed of god which saieth vnto Abraham and in him to euery faithfull beleuer I will curse them that curse the. And he that toucheth you sayeth the Prophet toucheth the apple of gods owne eye Barnes ANd that there is none other satisfaction vnto the father but this his death and passion onely Standish Amonge other this was one of his errours that he reuoked the last Easter at the Spittle Couerdale Here ye take youre pastyme vpon the deed and straye abrode allmoost as farre as sixe leafes of youre treatise will extende And now and then because the comon people that be vnlerned shulde the better vnderstonde youre wordes ye geue them a sentence of latyn and now and then halfe a sentence I coulde tell wherfore yf I wolde Amonge other ye saye this was one of his errours Ye iudge it an erroure to affirme that ther is none other satisfaction vnto the father but the death and passion of Christ onely and yet like a lerned man full sure of youre selfe ye confesse planely on the other side of the leafe in youre boke that no man can satisfie for the offence Vpon this ye must geue me leue to demaunde this question of you Yf it be erroneous to saie that Christ is the satisfaction vnto the father and ye youre selfe confesse that no man els doth satisfie for the offence To whom then shall we ascribe this honoure of satisfienge for oure sinnes A lasse what a grosse erroure be ye in O blinde gydes what waie will ye leade the people of god Vnhappie is the flock that is vnder your keping
whether Paul and you agree and whether ye haue iugled with the texte or no. For I feare me we shall fynd that ye haue played another false cast euen with this same poore texte The wordes of the Apostle are these Yf we wolde iudge or reproue oure selues we shulde not be iudged But whyle we are iudged we are chastened of the lorde lest we shulde be damned with this worlde These are S. Pauls wordes Afore in another place of youre treatise ye bring in this texte for another purpose namely to proue that D. Barnes ought to haue accused and condemned himselfe And now forgetfull what ye sayd afore or els wilfull blind as it semeth ye alledge the same text to proue that euery man must satisfye for the punishment belonginge vnto sinne Thus make ye of gods holy scripture a shipmans hose wresting and wringing it to what purpose ye will Verely such peruerting of the scripture can ye not vse without your awne damnacion excepte ye amende yf S. Peter be true The Apostle shewing the Corinthians the true institucion of oure lordes holy supper and the right vse therof cōcludeth with these wordes sayenge Let a man examen himselfe and so let him eate of this bred and drinke of this cuppe For he that eateth and drinketh vnworthely eateth and drinketh his owne damnacion because he discerneth not the lordes body from other meates Therfore are many weake and sick amonge you and many slepe For yf we iudged oure selues we shulde not be iudged But whyle we be iudged we are chastened of the lord lest we shuld be damned with this worlde Wherfore my brethren whan ye come together to eate tary one for another et cet By the circumstaunce then of this chapter it is euident that these wordes of the Apostle extende to the right vse of the holy sacrament teachinge us that afore we come to the lordes boorde we ought first to iudge to trie to proue and to examen oure selues in what case we stonde towarde god and oure neghboure consideringe that it is no childish playe ner a thing lightly to be regarded but a most waightie and ernest matter concernynge oure saluacion the glory of god and edifienge of the worlde And whan we haue duely and vnfaynedly tryed oure selues by cōparinge oure whole conuersacion both inward and outward to the iust commaundementes of god and by occasion therof haue hartely knowleged and confessed oure synnes beynge sory and penitent for them beleuynge stedfastly in the promises of god receaued the absolucion of his worde entred in to true repentaunce and ernest amendment of oure liuinge beinge reconciled and at one with all men purposinge without fayle so to contynue till oure lyfes ende Then to come and suppe with the lorde This is now the thing that S. Paul teacheth in this chapter and proueth here no such article as ye go aboute Therfore do ye wrong to the texte in wrestinge it to this sense that euery man must satisfye for the punishment belonginge vnto synne By the which youre doctrine like as ye robbe Christ of his worshippe deface the merites and frute of his death and set euery man in Christes rowme Euen so doth your saide article cōdemne euery man For like as Christ onely satisfied his heauēly father for oure sinnes and for the punishmēt due to the same Euen so yf we shulde not auoide the eternall paine of hel which is the second death and rewarde of sin̄e till we made satisfactiō for it oure selues we shulde contynue still in the wrath of god and so be damned for euer Standishe And to proue this satisfaction the wordes of I baptist Matth. iij. be very stronge et cete Couerdale Be these wordes bringe forth the worthy frutes of pennaūce asmuch to say as Ye must satisfye for the punishment due vnto synne Prately well expounded of you O shamelesse controllers of the holy goost Will ye make Iohn the baptist contrary to himselfe Doth he not saie manifestly in another place Who so beleueth on the sonne of god hath euerlastinge life And what is it els to haue euerlasting life but to escape the eternall and seconde death euen euerlasting damnacion and punishment due vnto synne Which as ye confesse youre selfe we do auoyde thorow Christ Why do ye then wrest the scripture to your awne purpose But one question will I aske you who speaketh the wordes which are written in the Prophet Osee saienge From the hand of death will I deliuer them from death will I redeme them O death I will be thy death O hell I wilbe thy stinge Finde me now anie creature in heauen or in erth that maie of himselfe verefie and pronounce these wordes of Christes personne and I shall graunt that he maie make satisfaction for the punishment due vnto sinne which as this text declareth is eternall death and hell Els yf there be but one Iesus one sauyoure one destroyer of damnacion and hell then shall he verely haue my poore voyce to be called also as he is in dede the onely satisfier for the punishment due vnto synne aswell as he is the satisfier for sinne it selfe As for the wordes of Iohn the baptist they proue euydently that whan men conuerte vnto god as those Pharises pretended to do at the baptime of Iohn then shall do it vnfainedly and not to be ypocrites still ner to leane to their olde leuē but to bringe forth the worthy frutes of repentaunce wherof he nameth parte in the thirde of Luke to the people and speaketh of no such satisfactiō as you fayne But Remembre that ye haue named fasting prayer and allmes dedes to be the frutes of pennaunce for I feare me ye will denye it agayne anone whan we come to Cornelius the captaine Standishe Fructus .ii. dignus penitentia est opus restaurans ea et cet Couerdale There are some of you that call us English doctours for writinge so much in English as though in the vnderstondinge of other tonges we were inferiours to you but now ye make us youre English interpreters for putting us to the payne to English the wordes which ye wrappe vp in latyn from the vnderstondinge of the people For the worthy frute of pennaunce saie ye is a worke amendinge those thinges wherof the pennaunce is that is repayringe such thinges as it repenteth us to haue left vndone or to haue committed and this is it that we call satisfaction for sinnes That to bringe forth the worthy frutes of pennaunce is asmuch as to amende wherin so euer we haue thought or done amisse I graunt for the scripture aloweth the same But where as ye call that the satisfaction to god for sinnes ye speake it not out of the mouth of the lorde Againe Ye saide afore that no man can satisfie for the offence and now ye call the frute of pennaunce the satisfactiō for sinnes Is not euery offence sinne Lord god what hold is
called us saieth the scripture vnto good wordes to walke in them but not to make our sauioure or satisfaction to god of them Standishe Christ Luke xj whan he had rebuked the Pharises for their vyce sayde date elemosinam et omnia munda sunt vobis Couerdale That texte yf it be not ironia proueth that we are bound to do good workes to the which though god ioyne his louing promes as he doth comonly thorow out the scripture yet calleth he not them the satisfaction to him for sinnes But like as in the lviij of Esa the holy goost rebuketh the supersticion and ypocrisie of the Iewes that had fallen to workes of their owne inuentynge and then telleth them the true fast and good workes which god requireth addynge a louinge promes to the fulfillers therof Euen so doth oure sauioure here in this chapter For whan the Pharise was so supersticious that he maruayled why he wasshed not his handes afore dyner then sayde he vnto him Now do ye Pharises make cleane the outsyde of the cuppe and platter but your inward partes are full of robbery and wickednesse et cet Neuertheles geue allmes of that ye haue and behold all thinges are cleane vnto you Lo now first he rebuketh their supersticion secondly sheweth them what good workes he aloweth cōmaunding thē to do the same And thirdly addeth a promes therto Standishe And the preacher Eccl. xxj Fili peccastic et ce Couerdale Those are not the wordes of the preacher whō the scripture calleth Ecclesiastes but they are the wordes of Iesus Syrack saienge My sonne hast thou fallen vnto synne Do nomore so but praie instantly for thy former synnes that they maie be forgeuē the. Flie from sinnes euē as thou woldest flie from a non some serpent et cet This text then proueth nomore your fained satisfactiō then it proueth the Iewes circumcision And like as your fond alledging of it declareth that ye are an hider of the scripture from the vnlerned so proueth the holy goost in the texte that yf we haue broken the profession of our baptime and be fallē vnto sinne we shall do nomore so but cōuerte and turne vnto god cōtinuing in the feare of him and in feruent praier to be at the staues end with sin̄e and to abhorre it all the daies of our life Standishe He that thinketh this insufficient et cet Couerdale Suspectinge as it apeareth that your wresting of the former scriptures will not be taken for a sufficient profe of youre fained satisfaction ye bringe in ensamples of Dauid Moses Aaron and the children of Israel as though their punishment had bene their satisfaction But where finde ye that in anie of those places of scripture Yf ye saie Why doth god thē punishe after that he hath remitted the fault I answere Like as he is the father of mercy and god of all comforte so doth he correcte and chasten his owne yee exerciseth and trieth them as the gold in the fire partly because he loueth thē and partly for the ensample of other that they maie beware of such falles The same ensamples therfore that ye bring in make clerely against you and proue manifestly that ye are but blinde and ignoraunt of the scriptures For the Apostle speakynge of the same children of Israel and of their punishment saieth planely that all such happened vnto them for ensamples but are written to warne us that we shulde not lust after euell thinges as they lusted that we shulde not be worshippers of ymages that we shulde not committe whordome that we shulde not tēpte Christ ner murmour against him as they dyd Shame ye not then so vnreuerently to handle the holy worde of the liuinge god Standishe Forthermore Daniel cap. iiij exhorteth Nabuchodonosor et cet Couerdale Yf that texte shulde proue anie satisfaction to be done by man to god as it proueth oure dewtie to oure poore neghbours it shuld rather mainteine a satisfaction for sinne then for the paine belonging to sinne for the texte speaketh of sinnes and iniquities and maketh mencion of no punishmēt Haue ye no better iudgmēt ner clearer sight in discerning of a texte Ye maie be ashamed verely The wordes of Daniel as they include in them a commaundement to do allmes dedes and shew mercy to the poore which thing euery man is bound to do so include they in them a louyng promes to all such as are mercifull in distributing to them that lack helpe And as it is an eternall worshippe for them that folowe this most wholsome counsaill of the Prophet so is it a shame and perpetuall confusion to all churlish hartes and vnkynde people specially to couetous princes rulers and riche men that will not do their best in prouidinge for the poore after the ensample of Daniel who no doubte seinge so many poore presoners and helplesse people driuen frō Iewry to Babilon had a singular respecte to their necessite and therfore spake to the Kyng in their cause Which thing wold god they that are great with princes or of their counsaill were as diligēt to do as they are to make sute in their owne priuate causes And doutlesse they wolde be the more enclined so to do yf it were not for you and such other which alledge not the scripture to such purpose as the holy goost hath caused it to be written for but frowardly wrest it for the mayntenaunce of your owne fond opinions Standish Loke also Ionas iij. what satisfaction the Niniuites made et cet Couerdale The texte declareth that god first sendeth his word which whan it is preached as it was by Ionas the Prophet then the children of saluacion beleue after the ensample of the Niniuites and ernestly turne vnto god from their olde euell waye and from that tyme forth geue ouer them selues wholy to all maner of good workes Then god approueth and aloweth their workes accepteth them hath mercy of them and poureth not vpon them the wrathe that he hath threatened to such as will not repent This is the summe of that whole thirde chapter of the Prophet Ionas But in all the texte is ther no mencion made of anie such satisfaction as you fayne Is it not an vngodly thinge then so to wrest and wringe the scripture violently The euerliuinge and mercifull god amende it It were greatly to be wisshed that like as the Kynge of the Niniuites receauinge gods worde made a proclamacion for all his subiectes to fast and praie ther were euen such restraintes made likewise in euery countre that noman shulde wrest the scripture of god ner alledge anie thing ther of which may not iustly be gathered by the wordes of the holy goost that is that no man shulde belie the text Standish This satisfaction Paul speaketh of Rom. xij Obsecro vos et cet Couerdale I besech you brethren saieth the Apostle for the mercy of god that ye will geue ouer your bodies to be a liuing holy
owne words Who whan he had said to the yong man yf thou wilt entre in to life kepe the commaundementes and tolde his disciples how hard it is for the couetous to entre in to heauen They asked him and said Who can thē be saued Then answered he them saieng With men it is vnpossible but with god are all thinges possible Downe then goeth the Pelagians heresie and litle thanke are ye like to haue for holdinge with it Yf he aske Why then doth god cōmaunde us to decline from euell and to do good yf it be not in our power To the same obiectiō doth S. Augustine make a sufficiēt answere in the secōde chapter de correptione et gracia and not onely refelleth it by S.P. words saiēg It is god which worketh in you both the wil and the dede but also putteth us in minde that yf we be the children of god we are led by gods sprete to do good that whan we haue done anie good thinge we maie geue thankes to him of whom we are led et cet And in another place Therfore doth he commaunde certaine thinges that we can not do because we might knowe what thinge we ought to aske of him The same doctrine teacheth he also in the lxiij sermō de tempore This is confirmed by holy scripture for by the lawe commeth the knowlege of sinne So that euen they which are renewed in Christ fynd by the lawe that whan they wold faine do good for therin is their delite euell is present with them The wordes of oure Sauioure yf ye loue me kepe my commaundementes proue nomore your purpose then your wresting of them proueth you to be a true scolar of his For after those wordes he himself saieth thus I am the waie the trueth and life No man commeth to the father but by me Naie saieth your doctrine we maie come to god by oure selues he commaundeth us nothing vnpossible for us to do Now let me aske you this question Yf Christ whan he saide these wordes Yf ye loue me kepe my commaundementes did meane that it is not vnpossible for us so to do why then immediatly after the same wordes doth he promes us the sprete of conforte What nede haue we of him yf we be not comfortles of oure selues or yf nothing that he commaunded us be vnpossible for us to do What nede haue the whole of a phisician And. S. Augustine writing agaynst them that extolle their owne possibilite in the seconde sermon de uerbis Apostoli saieth Let us be glad to be healed whyle we are here in this church Let us not make oure boast of health beinge yet sicke lest by oure pride we do nothing els but make oure selues incurable Standishe Which to the louers of thē be but light Math. xj.j. Ioh. v and Deut. xxx Couerdale Ergo god cōmaunded us nothinge vnpossible for us to do Is that your consequent Full faintly are ye able to proue it by those thre chapters that ye do alledge First in the xj of Matth. doth our Sauioure bid all them that are laden et cet to come to him And yet saieth he in another place that no man can come vnto him excepte his father draw him Where is now oure possibilite That fifth chapter of S. Iohns first Epistle sheweth that they which are borne of god do ouer come the worlde by the victory of faith Now like as we begat not our selues in the Kyndome of god but he himselfe of his owne good will begat us with the worde of life So is it manifest also that true faith is the onely workyng of god and not oures Where is then I saie our possibilite forsoith euen fled into the yle of weaknesse Yf by the thirtieth chapter of Deuteronomiō ye will proue that god hath commaunded us nothing vnpossible for us to do because Moses saieth This precepte that I commaunde the this daie is not aboue the ner farre from the et cete Then must I require you to take the answere of S. Paul who saieth that it is the righteousnesse of faith which speaketh those wordes and that the worde which Moses there spake of is the worde of faith that Paul himself preached Yf ye thinke there to proue your purpose because Moses laieth before the people life and death good and euel blessinge and cursinge and biddeth them chose life et ce Then must I desire you not onely to remembre the office of the lawe wherfore it was geuen and wher to it serueth But also to considre that in the begynnyng of the same thirtieth chapter Moses himself saieth these wordes The lorde thy god shall circumcise thine hert and the hert of thy posterite that thou mayest loue the lorde thy god with all thy hert and in all thy soule et cet Wherby it is euident that excepte god circūcise our hertes we are not able to loue him ner to kepe his cōmaundementes So that these wordes of Moses do proue rather impossibilite in us For the circūcision of the hert saieth the Apostle is the true circumcision which is done in the sprete and not in the lettre whose prayse is not of men but of god All these thre chapters now proue that like as to be saued to kepe gods cōmaundementes to haue circūcised hartes and to ouercome the world with the lustes therof is the onely workyng of god in us Euen so to them that loue god are his cōmaundementes not greuous not thorow anye possibilite of man but partly because Christ hath takē awaie the curse of the lawe and deliuered thē frō the heuy burthens of their soules and partly because they delite in gods cōmaundementes and esteme his word sweter then hony as Dauid did For loue maketh all thinges light Standish Therfore I conclude in all our workynge we do not cōmitte sinne Couerdale Of an euell Maior and Minor foloweth a weake conclusiō Ye haue wrung and wrested the scriptures violently to make them serue for your purpose and now without anie scripture make ye youre conclusion that in all youre workyng ye do not committe sinne To the probacion wherof because ye bring no scripture your selfe I will helpe you with a text where the scripture saieth thus There is no righteous man vpon erth that doth good and sinneth not Yf ye be a man I wil not reason much with you of righteousnesse for I am a sinfull man miselfe then must ye nedes graunt this scripture to be true Yf ye be no man then am I sory that I haue disputed with you so long for angels haue no nede of my wordes and as for deuels they will not be counsailed Standish No ner our dedes and actes which be good can not be called so et cet Couerdale Of. D. Barnes secrete intent and meaning will not I presume to be iudge but what maye be gathered by the circumstaunce of his wordes I
haue reasoned with you allready Now because ye can not proue this last parte of youre conclusiō by scripture namely that your good dedes and actes are not vnpure ner vnperfecte in this life therfore the Prophet Esaie to recompence you the wrong that ye dyd him in minishing his wordes afore will yet take the paines for you to proue your purpose though it be litle to your minde Whan he saieth All we are become as an vncleane man and all oure righteousnesses are as a clothe stained with the floures of a woman And the wise man saieth also Who maie saie My hert is cleane I am pure from sinne Barnes ANd with this he cast abrode his handes and desyred god to forgeue him his trespas Standishe Extra ecclesiam nulla salus et cetera Couerdale Without the church ye saie is no saluacion Now is it manifest that beside the church made of lime and stone ther is also a congregacion church and multitude of frowarde and wicked doers which not onely gather them selues together like roaringe lyons fatt bulles wanton calues and curre dogges agaynst Christ as the xxj Psalme complaineth but also make lawes cōstitucions statutes ordinaunces and tradicions agaynst gods worde Wherby it commeth to pas that though they boast neuer so much of gods seruice yet all is to them in vaine as the Prophet and Christ himselfe doth testifie Another church is there which is the holy spouse congregacion and company of them that are of the felashippe and communion of Christ and walke not in darknes but in the trueth hauing al their sinnes clensed by his bloude This church continueth in the Apostles doctryne renneth not out from the heauenly felashippe of Christ and his membres distributeth the sacramentes duely and truly ceasseth not frō praieng and well doinge et ce are of one minde and soule are glad to helpe one another as it is manifest in the actes and Epistles of the Apostles The men of this church praie in all places liftinge vp pure handes et cet In this church whosoeuer asketh hath he that seketh findeth and to him that knocketh doth god open In this church is fre pardon and remission of sinnes for all true penitentes For god will not the death of sinners but yf they cōuerte vnto him they shall liue and who so is laden with sinne and commeth vnto Christ findeth rest and ease in his soule and shall not be cast out Forasmuch then as ye condemne D. Barnes thus doinge and iudge him to be none of the church that desireth god to forgeue him his trespace it is euident that in your church ther is no forgeuenes for poore sinners and so is it not the church of Christ Wherfore seinge ye discente frō Christes church where the dore is euer opened to them that knocke youre owne sentence condēneth you that ye can trust to haue no saluaciō by gods promes But alas what blindnesse is in you Though a sinner doth erre or hath erred from the right faith and from the true vse of the holy sacramentes that be in the church of Christ and now commeth to repentaunce desiringe god to forgeue him his trespace Is not this a damnable doctrine to teach that he can not trust to haue saluaciō by gods promes No hath god promised that sin̄ers which repēt shal not be saued The thefe that hanged on the right hand of Christ hath proued the cōtrary Agayne Yf a sin̄er maie not trust to haue saluacion by gods promes wherby thē maie he trust to haue it By himselfe by his owne workes Or by youre merites Euen by your merites as it apeareth wolde ye haue him trust to haue saluacion for ye must nedes be full of merites that in all your workyng committe no sinne as ye saye your selfe Morouer the tenoure of your wordes separateth the mercy of god from his promes as though they cōcurred not together But I pray you who can trust to haue saluacion by gods promes and trusteth not in his mercy Whan the Apostle saieth God gaue the enheritaunce vnto Abraham frely by promes was it not done by his mercy And whan he saieth in the same chapter Ye are the heires of Christ acording to the promes what meaneth he els but as he saieth to Titus that the kindnesse and loue of oure sauioure hath appeared not for the dedes of righteousnesse which we haue done but acordinge to his mercy hath he saued us et cet S. Iames wordes which ye bring in in latyn denieth no forgeuenesse to them that repent but like as he rebuketh them that are but Christen men in worde and not in good workes and dedes so yf parcialite be sinne then doth the circūstaunce of the same text cōdemne your former conclusion that saie ye sinne not in all your workes Standishe Loke the reward of finalis impenitētia et cet Couerdale D. Barnes words testifie what faith and repētaunce he had toward god and what hert he bare toward the comon welth of all Christendome and yet shame ye not to wryte that he dyed without repentaunce and in errours because he wold not denie Christ and reuoke his worde with you Standishe Which died by his wordes without signe or token of saluacion Couerdale Is it no token ner signe of saluacion to beleue in the holy and blessed trenite the incarnacion passion death and resurrectiō of our sauioure and to knowlege the same before men Is all this utterly no token of saluacion Christ and the Apostle Paul are of another iudgment Standishe And so his praier must nedes be voyde Couerdale D. Barnes cast abrode his handes and desired god forgeuenes and yet darre ye affirme that his praier must nedes be voide By the which wordes like as ye denie the article of forgeuenesse mencioned in our Crede and promised in the scripture to euery one that truly repenteth so declare ye euidently that ther is litle mercy in your mother the church of the wicked for in Christes church yf the sonne aske the father a pece of bred he will not geue him a stone but good thinges Standish Marke how he trusteth with in an houre et ce Couerdale Is it blinde arrogauncy whan a man refusing all confidence in his owne workes trusteth to haue eternall life thorow the mercy of god What blynd arrogauncy was in the Apostle whan he saide we knowe certainlie that yf oure earthy house of this dwelling were destroyed we haue a building ordeined of god an house not made with handes but euerlasting in heauen Oure sauioure also geueth this comforte to such as beleue in him that they shall not come to damnacion but passe from death vnto life Are ye not a comfortable Phisician then to mens consciences that shame not to teach other wise then Christ doth But surely these two places of scripture are not for the stablishinge of your soule masses and diriges and therfore
chaunceloure for denyeng of the sacrament and for faulte of a better I was assygned to the examynacion of him in the galery And after longe reasonyng and disputaciō I declared and sayde that the sacrament beyng rightly vsed and accordinge to scripture doth after the word spoken by the prest chaunge the substaunce of the bred and wyne in to the body and bloud of Christ Were not these my wordes sayde he Yee sayde M. pope Thē beare me witnesse said he that I erre not in the sacramēt Standishe Allthoughe you did not denie that sacrament yet haue you et cet Couerdale Ye call it slaunderous raylinge whan a man with gods worde both ernestly rebuke such horryble abuses as Antichrist and his malignaunt church hath brought in among Christen people So lothe are ye to consent vnto gods worde or to vse anie thing according to his holy instituciō What could it then haue helped you yf he had opened his minde farther seing that in his so godly and honest request ye ascribe naughtynesse vnto him He did but shew that he wold haue the sacrament rightly vsed and acording to holy scripture and ye are not content with him Yet well worth the Corinthians for though they were fallen in to abuse aboute this holy misterie and aboute other thinges we read not that they spurned against the holy goost as you do whan they were called to refourmacion Standish Se also I praye you how he saieth et cetera Couerdale Yf you shulde saye that for lack of a better ye dyd write agaynst this protestacion of D. Barnes wolde ye therfore be iudged to thynke that there were not many better lerned men in England to take such a matter in hande then you Barnes THen sayde he haue ye anye thing els to saye There was one then asked him his opynion of prayeng to sayntes Then sayd he Now of saintes you shall heare myne opynion I haue sayd before somwhat I thynke of them how that I beleue they are in heauē and with god and that they are worthy of all the honour that scripture willeth them to haue But I saye through out al scripture we are not commaunded to pray to any sayntes therfore I can not ner will not preach to you that sayntes ought to be praied vnto For then shuld I preach you a doctryne of myne owne head Standish Ther is an olde heresie that saieth sayntes be not yet in heauen et cet Couerdale Is this your next waye to confute him that saieth we are not cōmaunded in scripture to praie to anye saintes Ye brawll with the deed man that saieth nothinge against you in this article of saintes being in heauen Standishe How can it be in scripture thou impudent heretike the prayer vnto saintes Couerdale Be good to the poore man and take not the matter so whote He goeth not aboute to proue that your prayeng to sayntes is grounded in scripture Standish As for in the tyme of the olde lawe et cet Couerdale The doctrine of god is that Christ is the lambe which hath bene slayne sens the begynnyng of the worlde that is euen he whose power and deliueraunce hath clensed and saued all thē that euer put their trust in him Christ Iesus yesterdaie and todaie and the same contynueth for euer Standish Therfore concerning praieng to saintes et cet Couerdale Must we beleue the testimony of men without it be grounded on gods worde Are ye become such an Apostle Because the church and congregacion of Christ must discerne iudge trie and examen all maner of doctryne and so to eschue the euell and kepe the good hath it therfore auctorite to make anye new article or to receaue a doctryne contrary to gods worde Because Christ hath promised his holy sprete of trueth to be allwaye in his faithfull congregacion shall they therfore make ordeyne set vp or beleue ought that is contrary to his owne teachinge Standish Doest thou set nomore by the auctorite of it then so in asmuch as S. Augustyne sayde Non crederem Euangelio nisi crederim Ecclesie et cet Couerdale Euen as ye peruerte the wordes of holy scripture so do ye with S. Augustine As ye choppe and chaunge with it so do ye with him And as ye alledge the scripture for another purpose then the plaine circumstaunce of the text meaneth so do ye here with this holy doctoure For youre purpose is with S. Augustines wordes to proue that youre church by her auctorite may make new articles and that we are bounde to beleue as she beleueth though the same be not grounded in scripture But yf men diligently marke S. Augustynes sayeng the occasion of his wryting and the circumstaunce therof it shall be euydent that ye are as like him in vnderstondinge as the moone is like a grene chese S. Augustyne perceauynge the greate hurte that was growyng thorow the doctryne of wicked Manicheus toke in hande to confute him and his secte his errours were so noisome and deuelish For he had not onely fayned a new gospell of his owne and named himselfe Christes Apostle but also mainteined the heresie which the Anabaptistes lately helde that the sonne of god toke not the nature of man of the blessed virgin and denied rulers to beare office denied mariage denied certayne kyndes of meates to be of god or to be graunted vnto Christen men Taught also that some mens soules dye with the bodyes despysed the exterior worde of god and mynistracion therof and sought other visions without it And many other fond and wicked opynions had he vnknowne to the holy church and flock of Christ Now for the refelling of such pestilent doctryne S. Augustine among other thinges wrote one speciall boke agaynst a certayne Epistle of the Manichees which was called Epistola fundamenti and whan he had shewed the occasions which moued him to abyde still within the vnyte of Christes catholike church then in the fifth chapter he shewed the cause that moued him rather to geue credence vnto Christes gospell then to Manicheus where among other he saieth these wordes Nostis n. me statuisse nihil avobis prolatū temere credere et cet For ye knowe saieth he that I am determined to geue no haistie credence to anye thing that ye speake of your awne heades I demaunde therfore Who is that Manicheus Ye answere An Apostle of Christ I beleue it not Now what canst thou saye or do thou shalt not opteine for thou dyddest promes knowlege of the trueth and now thou wilt compell me to beleue the thinge that I knowe not Peraduenture thou wilt reade me the gospell and therby wilt thou assaie to affirme the parson̄e of Manicheus Yf I shulde fynde anye man then which as yet beleueth not the gospel what shuldest thou do to him that sayeth vnto the I beleue not As for me I shulde not beleue the gospell vnlesse the auctorite of the catholike church dyd moue
there in youre wordes Fie on such doctrine Standishe And here let us note that it is not all one to bringe forth good frutes and to bring forth worthy frutes of pennaunce Couerdale No where haue ye auctorite of gods word for you Be not the good frutes of penÌ„aunce worthy frutes Or be not they good frutes that are worthy O vnworthy teachers What an vnworthy doctrine is this Standish For he that doth committe no deedly synnes et cet Couerdale Yf I shulde teach anie man whan he hath vnlaufully bahaued him selfe to vse vnlaufull thinges still I am sure that like as gods word wolde therin condeÌ„ne me so wolde the prudent rulers of the worlde acordinge to their dewtie loke sharply vpoÌ„ me and iudge me litle better then a sedicious teacher Yf the rulers therfore of the worlde will winck at such a pestilent doctryne and suffre it to be sowne among their people I beseche god to seÌ„d them his discipline to their better enfourmacion and so to lighten the eies of their vnderstonding that they maie aswell remembre what hurt commeth of sedicious doctrine as many of their subiectes yee they them selues also haue proued it by experience Well yet remembre the ende Where as ye separate the frutes of innoceÌ„cy of goodnesse et ce froÌ„ the frutes of penÌ„aunce where finde ye that in holy scripture For albeit that some man offendeth more then another who yet I praie you is not bound to confesse himselfe a synner to declare himselfe sory for the vnperfectnesse of his owne nature to mortifie his flesh and to liue in repentaunce all the daies of his life Yee be he neuer so innocent iust or righteous in the estimacioÌ„ of man Thus by your slendre diuision ye proue but slenderly that the workes of Mary Magdalene and Dauid were not frutes of goodnesse but onely frutes of pennaunce as though penÌ„aunce were not good or as though the frutes of pennaunce were not good frutes As for the carnall libertie of man it must be all waie restrained abuse of all thinges is utterly forbidden Yet must the body of man haue his worshippe at his nede at his nede I saye not at his lust Yf you now thorow anye sâ—â—â—e of wisdone or chosen spritualtie will teach the contrary then is youre doctrine condemned by S. Paul to the Collossians Standishe· Yee and acordinge to the qualite of the offence must be the satisfaction Pro mensura peccati erit plagarum modus Deute xxv Couerdale This text verely as it is slenderly alledged so proueth it youre purpose but faintly Moses wordes which you bringe in are these Acordinge to the measure of the offence shalbe also the measure of stripes But let us se the circumstaunce of the texte and so shall we trye whether ye haue played a iuglers cast or no. And forget not I praie you that ye haue alledged this texte to proue that the satisfaction must be acording to the qualite of the offence Moses wryteth thus Yf there be a matter of plee betwene anie men and they come to the law then loke whom the iudges considre to be iust him shall then declare to be in the right cause and him whom they perceaue to be vngodly shall they condemne for his vngodlynesse But yf they se him which hath offended to be worthy of stripes they shall take him downe and cause him to be beaten in their presence Acordinge to the measure of the offence shalbe also the measure of the strypes but so that they passe not the nombre of fortie et cete This lawe as it is euident was a ciuile ordinaunce made for the commodite of the people and not without mercy The text also speaketh of no such satisfaction as ye meane But here forgettinge the rules of youre logick ye wolde make a qualite of a quantite For in your article ye speake of a qualite and the texte maketh mencion of a quantite nombre or measure Agayne this lawe will that the partie which is to be beaten shal not haue aboue fortie stripes And then by youre doctrine it must folowe that though we be compelled to be punished and so to make satisfaction for the paine due vnto oure synnes yet shulde ech one of us haue but fortie stripes for the text speaketh of no moo Maie ye not be ashamed then thus to mock with the scripture Standishe Not like ner equall in the great offender and the lesse Vnde Apo. xviij Quantum quis se glorificauit et in delicijs fuit tantum illi inferendum est tormentum Couerdale Where as the voice from heauen speaketh of the whore of Babilon and saieth Come awaie from her my people that ye be not partakers of her synnes lest ye receaue of her plages et cete As much as she glorified herselfe and folowed her awne lustes so much geue ye her of punishment and sorowe et cet By the last parte of this texte wolde ye proue that satisfactioÌ„ maie not be equall in the greate offender and the lesse Now saieth the texte Asmuch as she glorified hir self et cete so much geue ye her of punishment Here is rather equalite And where as the texte speaketh of the whore of Babilon ye saie Quantum quis et ce turninge not onely the femynine gendre to the masculyne which a boie that goeth to the grammer scoole wolde not do but also prouinge an vniuersall by a perticular Agayne This texte speaketh of her that is damned to hell and the article that ye go aboute to proue speaketh of those whom ye haue affirmed allready to make satisfaction vnto god for their synnes by the frutes of pennaunce which by youre owne iudgment are not damned vnto hell Lord god whan will this blindnesse haue an ende Standish It is not ynough saieth Chrisostome et cet Couerdale The doctrine of god is that whan Christ hath made us whole for without him is no remission we shall sinne nomore he that hath stollen must steale nomore he that hath not the gift of chastite must for the auoiding of fornicacion take a laufull wife for better it is to mary then to burne On the back syde of the boke therfore is that doctryne writteÌ„ which teacheth that whan a man hath loÌ„g lyued in whordome he shall than abstaine from the laufull vse of holy wedloke for wedloke is the remedy appointed of god against all bodely fornicacion and whordome Standish Wherby we maie perceaue et cet Couerdale Yes there be worthy frutes of repentaunce to bring forth there is a new man to put on the tre hath good frutes to beare the spouse of Christ which is euery true faithfull soule hath laufull children that is laufull thoughtes laufull wordes laufull dedes to bring vp and to norishe Good workes must nedes folowe faith but not that we maye set anye of them in the rowme of Christ ner make them the satifactioÌ„ to god for our synnes God hath