Selected quad for the lemma: scripture_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
scripture_n	apostolical_a	church_n	tradition_n	4,989	5	9.5918	5	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A11927	The three partes of commentaries containing the whole and perfect discourse of the ciuill warres of Fraunce, vnder the raignes of Henry the Second, Frances the Second, and of Charles the Ninth : with an addition of the cruell murther of the Admirall Chastilion, and diuers other nobles, committed the 24 daye of August, anno 1572 / translated out of Latine into English by Thomas Timme minister.; Commentariorum de statu religionis et reipublicae in regno Galliae. English. 1574	Serres, Jean de, 1540?-1598.; Hotman, François, 1524-1590. De furoribus gallicis.; Tymme, Thomas, d. 1620.; Ramus, Petrus, 1515-1572.	1574 (1574)	STC 22241.5; ESTC S4897	661,140	976

loke for imposition of handes of the Phariseys that he might execute that office which God had committed vnto him And when he woulde confirme his Apostleship he speaketh not onely of the Myracles whiche he had done but also of the fruites of his preaching The which also we may say of so many kingdomes and prouinces which haue receiued the Gospell by our preaching notwithstanding so many lettes and impedimentes to hinder the same and we thinke that there cannot be required of vs a more firme confirmation of oure Ministerie seyng the vertue and power of God is manifest in vs the which neither bondes neither imprisonment neither fire neither banishments nor death could let Albeit sayth Espensius bring ye me one onely example done a thousand fiue hundred yeare agone like vnto yours Al things sayth Beza that haue happened are not put down in histories but howsoeuer the matter be it doth not folow that this our example is not manifest inough and set forth of God in his due time who went not about to giue a new Gospell but ment to renewe that olde Gospell which was exquisitly written by the Apostles and sufficiently confirmed by Miracles And so by a certain vnwonted and singular meane or way he caused that bright light to shine But concerning Traditions what foolishe madnesse is it to make them either equall with the Scripture or else more certaine than the same bicause of the diuersitie of interpretations For what shall be the staye and foundation of oure faith if we stande in vncertaine opinions But what so euer men do this notwithstanding is most certainely to be imbraced That truth shall be most firme and constant although for a time it seme neuer so obscure and although heretikes do abuse it yet neuerthelesse ought we alwayes to leane to the same Also touching the place of Tertullian which Xainctius willeth me so diligentlye to consider I haue so certainely considered the same as I am sure he hath falsely cited Chrisostome in whom that shal neuer be founde which he hath falsely fayned We will not denie but that Tertullian was deceyued in certayne places and yet notwithstanding the place cited beyng rightly vnderstoode and the ende thereof considered it shall be verie easie to be expounded For it was his purpose to declare that we muste not dispute in vayne against heretikes but as the Apostle Paule sayth they beyng once or twice reprehended must be reiected But shewe vnto vs with what Heretikes he had to doe surely euen with those whiche being conuicted by the worde of God obstinately thrust in certaine testimonyes of scripture transformed to maintaine their errors Against these men Tertullian bringeth in the traditions of the Churche the whiche he sheweth ought to be of greater waight than the new deuises of many men First of al therfore it is méete that we should be conuinced by the word of God that we may be brought from error For if we should simply leane vnto traditions which are neither Apostolical nor agréeing to their doctrine we should set open a way to a thousand deceites and at length peruert and ouerthrow the certaintie of the Scripture And why dothe Tertullian cast the heretikes in the ●…éeth saying that They contrary to Scripture doe beleeue without Scripture but onely to teache them that they must leane and cleaue to the certaine truth of the Scriptures and by them conuince errors But if the traditions and ceremonies which are at this daye obiected vnto vs of our aduersaries were Apostolicall and alwayes vsed of the Churche we might otherwise thinke and determine but seyng we can shew their beginnings it followeth that they are not come from the Apostles And truely Tertullian dothe greatly reprehende them which thought that all things whiche appertained to saluation were not put downe to vs by the Apostles Therfore when truth comes in question we must haue recourse to the Apostles whom Christe hath sent to teache the Churche But how shall we agrée of the Apostles doctrine but by their writings For therefore were they called of God to that office that they might plainely teache and instructe vs in all things that appertained to our saluation After the same maner also the place of Chrisostome may be explaned in the which we haue these words Christ lefte nothing to the Apostle in writing did he therefore forbyd them to leaue anye thing in writing No truely But he dyd rather illuminate them by his holy spirit to the ende his doctrine being put in writing mighte abide for euer Howbeit the Apostles taughte certayne things which they haue not written We denie it not But we say that those things whiche they haue not written doe not appertaine to oure saluation For those things whiche mighte appertayne to certaine rytes profitable for that time and to the order and gouernement of the Churche they haue shewed and declared by woorde of mouthe But bycause those things are of suche condition that they maye be diuersely altered accordyng to the circumstaunces of the place tyme and persons therefore they neither oughte nor can bynde the consciences of men And as concerning these wordes Not begotten Consubstantiall Trinitie and suche like althoughe they be not to be founde so expressely in the Scripture yet notwythstanding their sense effect and meaning is plentifully to be founde therein Wherevpon afterwards to auoyde the subtil ●…lightes of heretikes these and such like wordes were founde out and receiued of the ancient fathers Thus Beza answered to those obiections that white Monke 〈◊〉 in the meane time crying out against him interrupting him and still inculcating this thing that neither the virginitie of the virgin Marie nor the baptizing of infantes coulde be proued by testimonies of Scrip●…ure And thus crying and exclaming still after the manner of scholes he was verie troublesome to the whole assembly At the last after this confused disputation to and fro the Cardinall of Loraine perceiuing the inciu●…litie of his fellowes as it may seeme least they should be reprehended of the Quéene he himselfe ended this controuersie as though the question had ben sufficiently handled Upon which silence the Sorbonistes afterwards persuaded them selues to haue gotten the victorie Then the Cardinall began to speake concerning the Lordes Supper protesting in the name of al the Prelates that they woulde procéede no further vntill that question were fully determined and answered both for that it was the principall pointe of all controuersies and also bycause the Ministers hadde so playnely declared their opinion and iudgement concerning the same in that their first Oratiō that the rumoure thereof is gone thoroughout the whole Realme Therefore he demaunded of the Ministers whether they woulde receiue and imbrace the Augustane Confession And the Ministers on the contrarie part demaunded if they also would receiue the same The Cardinal faring as though he woulde answere to this demaunde began to bring for the the iudgement of certaine Ministers of

maner of kissing one another in going bareheaded in signe of authoritie which is cōtrary to the common custome of many people All these things therfore ought to be considered before a custome be established as apostolicall least the Apostolicall authoritie and custome be abused to the disturbing of the churches as it came to passe after the Apostles tyme for the feast of Easter and in the Apostles time for the authoritie of the Church of Hierusalem as appeareth by Luke How then shall we thinke that the Apostles founde oute so many ceremonies in which afterwards was placed remission of sinnes when as plainely they haue testified the contrarie Augustine complained of these things long ago and there is no doubte but that if he had bene in these our dayes he shoulde haue had greater occasione to complaine To be short therfore we wishe that the Scripture which is very plaine in these matters maie Iudge betwene traditions that are good and euil betwéen holy and prophane betwene profitable and hurtful and betwene such as are necessary and those that are super flucus The which being graunted this question may easily be resolued namely VVhether the Church be aboue the scripture The which questiō semeth so absurde vnto me as if a mā shuld demaund whether the father were inferior to the sonne or whether the wife were aboue the husband or mā aboue God. And truly the true Church neuer complaineth and murmureth against God in this matter but alwaies modestly submitteth it self vnto him Neither maketh it any matter that the Church was before the Scriptures For that word which was afterwardes written is more ancient thā the Church seing of the same the Church was conceiued begotten brought forth hath also of the same his denominatiō And to disproue this the saying of S. Austine is brought against vs when he saith I would not beleue the scripture were it not that the authoritie of the church did force me thervnto But we must consider that S. Austine speaketh here in the person of Manichaeus For whē two mē do contend about the truth of some instrument to whom in the end shal they go but to the Scriuener or Notary that hath the first draught or coūterpane of the same Notwithstanding it doth not here vpō folow that the authoritie of the instrument doth depend vpō the person of the Notary the which should be no lesse firme and strong althoughe the Notarie being aliue woulde refuse to giue testimonie of the same The same answere muste be made to those whiche thinke the authoritie of the Canonicall bookes of scripture to depende vpon the determination of the Church But I will content my selfe to adde vnto that wherof I haue spoken before one only argument confirmed by the authoritie of certaine approued Fathers The argument is this Christe him selfe did so muche estéeme of the doctrine of the Prophet that he sought to confirme hys doctrine by their testimonies After the same maner the Apostle Paule went about to confirme the Thessalonians in his doctrine Peter also the Apostle commendeth vnto vs and alloweth this order of teaching Therefore it is not méete that they which call them selues Christ his vicars and the successors of Paule Peter shuld refuse the same condition Furthermore thus sayth Saint Hierō The error either of the fathers or of the elders ought not to be followed but the authoritie of Scriptures And Chrisostome sayth He which will knowe which is the ●…ue Church of Christ Howe shall he knowe the same in so great confusion of likenesse but by the Scriptures Also in the same place he sayth Let them whiche are in Iudea flee into the mountaines that is to say They which are in Christianisme let thē busie themselues in the Scriptures But why would he haue all Christians at that time be occupied in the scriptures Bycause so soone as heresie hadde entered into the Churches there coulde not be had a true probation of Christianisme neither can they which would knowe the truth of faith finde any other refuge than the holy scripture Whosoeuer therefore woulde know the true Church of Christ how shuld he know the same but by the Scriptures In like maner the Lorde knowing that there should come so great confusion in the latter dayes commaundeth Christians which will haue the assurance of true faith to haue no other refuge than the holy Scripture otherwise if that they seeke for other meanes they shall be offended and perishe not vnderstanding what is the true Church and so shal fall headlong into the abhomination of desolation which is placed in the holye place of the Churche Also Basill sayth If whatsoeuer be not of faith be sinne as sayth the Apostle and faith commeth by hearing and hearing by the word of God then whatsoeuer is beside that worde giuen by diuine inspiration is sinne Also in the sermon of the confession of Faith he saith If God be faithfull in all his woordes and if all his commaundementes be firme and certaine for euer framed in truth and righteousnesse it is a forsaking of the faithe and a poynt of arrogancie to retect any part of those things which are written or to bring in any thing not written Thus far O Quéene we haue answered copiouslye according to our knowledge to the first principall point of the Oration made by the Prelates concerning the authoritie of the Churche being readie paciently and quietly to heare whatsoeuer shall be shewed contrary to that which we haue spoken There remaineth yet to be spoken of the Article of our Lords Supper the which if it seeme good vnto your Maiestie I will nowe pretermit both for that I haue heide you and the whole companie ouer long and also bicause we desire to haue this conference hereafter framed in better order Notwithstāding if it shal séeme good vnto your Maiestie that wee procéede anye farther we are readie to vtter those things which the Lorde shall put in oure heartes alwayes submitting our selues vnto those things which shall be obiected vnto vs oute of the Scriptures moste humblye praying and beseeching your Maiestie O Queene to be fully persuaded in this one thing that nexte vnto the glorye of oure God wée wishe and desire nothing more vehemently than the dignitie of your Maiestie and the peace tranquillitie of the Realme After that Beza had thus ended his oration then the Cardinall beckning to Claudius Espensius a Sorbonist willed him to make his oration Thē Espensius beginning to shew that not long agoe he had wished to haue this mutuall conference and that he alwayes vtterly abhorred those cruell punishmentes which were vniustlye vsed againste those which imbraced the Religiō he sayd that those things which were alreadie spoken of the Church and of the markes and succession of the same were in his iudgemente verye true adding herevnto that if this way had been taken in hande at the first all controuersies had been by this

to be buried forgottē but there shall be alwayes one or other of his seruaunts which shal know that which ought to be knowē shal follow that which ought to be followed as we see it happened to Helias in time of the captiuitie of Babilon in Israell in the time of Christ his cōming when as there was scarsly left one Zacharias one Elizabeth one Ioseph one Uirgin Mary one Anna the Prophetesse which among so many corruptiōs of the Scribes Phariseis Saduceis had the true vnderstanding of the Prophecies concerning the cōming of christ These interruptiōs therfore lets which fall into the Church of God are as it were a certaine tempest cloude which God driueth away by the cōming of his Sonne that is to say of his word according to the dispensing of the secretes of his iudgementes mercies May we not condemne general councels God forbid For ye know that if we shall go about to reforme or amēd any thing by them ye shall chaunge and alter manye more things thā we in the which not long ago ye trauelled Notwithstanding we require this thing at your hande that the worde of God may be as a touchstone that whatsoeuer is eyther spoken or done in the Churche maye be tried by the same If this thing séeme straūge vnto you I pray you my Lordes consider that noble place of Augustine where he writeth to Maximinus Arrianus being in the seconde booke and fourth chapter saying Is there a more approued Councell than the firste Nicene Councel None I beleue VVhat was the councel of Ariminū It was reiected condemned and that iustly But whereof doth S. Augustine intreate in that place Surely of one of the principal articles of our faith so oftentimes concluded cōfirmed namely of Consubstantiatiō of the Sōne of god Neuerthelesse S. Austine confesseth that he wil neither be tried by the coū●…el of Nice nor by the coūcel of Ariminū but by the scriptures which he calleth indifferent witnesses for both partes But if here we will obiecte say that the scriptures are harde and obscure we must confesse with Saint Paule that the carnall man doth not vnderstan●…e the things that are of God and with the Apostle Peter that the scriptures haue not a priuate explication And if the obscurenesse of the Scriptures be such that they cannot manifest themselues vnto vs why doth not Christe sende vs to some other thing rather than to them when he saith Search the Scriptures Furthermore what did they which vsed onely the writings of the Apostles before there were any commentaries of the Doctors I remember my Lorde Cardinall that ye saide that the firme and vndoubted interpretation which was alwayes in the Church euery where and of all men receiued oughte to be imbraced But who will certifie vs of those thrée principall pointes Furthermore if we come to these wordes Alwayes and Of all men at what time shall we begin but onely at the Apostolicall Churche And who shall be counted the first but the Apostles thēselues whose stories Luke hath so faithfully described and are also to be séene by their writings Therefore bicause all truth dependeth vpon God which hath made the Prophetes and Apostles to be interpreters of our saluation we alwayes come to this foundation of Scriptures And yet neuerthelesse we reiect not the iudgementes of Councels and of the Fathers so that they agrée with the Scriptures the which as S. Austine saythe are so tempered and placed by the holy Ghost that the same which in one place is spokē obscurely in another place is more plainly vttered Notwithstanding here remayne certaine doubtes to be opened and expounded For there are many which thinke that the will of God as touching our saluation is not fully contained in the writings of the Apostles But I pray you consider with your selues if this be graunted what a way is made to all errors And truely by this way Sathan hath greatly broken into the Lordes vineyarde Neuerthelesse we doe not denie that God before Moyses time ordered and taught his Church by visions and reuelations and that the Apostles builded the Churches with their owne voyce before they had written any thing But why would God the number and wickednesse of men increacing haue this doctrine to be described which was preached and knowne to all men for this cause truly that he might preuent their subtill craftes which colour all their doings wyth the names of tradition of reuelation and of custome But if this doctrine be onely written in part what shall this remedie profite Ihon truely speaketh not thus of the Scriptures whē he sayth These things are written that ye mighte beleeue that Iesus is Christ the Sonne of God and that in beleeuing ye might haue life the which no doubt should be false if there were any other doctrine necessarie to saluation In like manner the Apostle Paule expounding the vse of doctrine and in the person of Timothie instructing all the ministers of the Churche had not sayd that The Scriptures make the man of God that is to say the minister and euery faithfull man perfecte and fully giuen to all good woorkes if any thing oughte to be ioyned to the same Notwithstanding we doubte not but that there haue bene alwayes from time to time vnwritten traditions as touching the order and maner of doing But bycause manye of late dayes do abuse this worde Traditions we will shewe what Traditions oughte to be receyued The which shall be easily done if these two things be considered namely if the doctrines be conformable and fyt to edification For this is alwayes firme and certaine that the Apostles and true shepeherdes neuer appointed rites either dirictly or inderectly contrary to holesome doctrine or other things which might in any point or ●…ot draw men from the spirituall worship of god Therefore when this rule shall be obserued and kept it will be an easie matter to discerne true doctrine from traditions and true traditions from those that are false You also may remember how greatly Tertullian in his tractation of the Scriptures condemneth those which sayd that the Apostles lefte somewhat obscure not sufficiently expounded which appertained to our saluatiō I will say more namely that the same which the Apostles haue done here is not perpetual not as though they were not by al exception the greater witnesses but bicause they did beare somewhat with the infirmitie of the Iewes by the rule of charitie as in willng them to abstaine frō things offered to Idols from strangled and in that also which Paule did in Timothe in himself the which things at this day ought to haue no place but onely by a generall rule of indifferent things which of themselues are neither good nor euill in which things we ought to applye our selues to the infirmitie of our brethren These things also may be gathered of the rytes which agréed with their times as the

time ended But as touching that principall poynte of the Succession of the Churche I haue sayth he oftentimes maruelled with my selfe by whose authorite and by whose calling ye are entered into the Church and haue taken vpon you the office of teaching seing that ye are not come in by the ordinary way nor by such as haue ordinarie authoritie nor haue not receiued of thē the impositiō of hands Here vpō he gathered that the ministers of the reformed churches were not true lauful pastors for so much as they could not say that they were come in by ordinarie successiō much lesse by extraordinarie bicause extraordinarie vocatiō ought to be cōfirmed by miracles euē as Moises being raised vp of God to deliuer the people was established by extraordinarie miracles or else truly these extraordinarie callings ought to be cōfirmed by some expresse testimonie of scripture as the calling of Ihon by the testimonie of Malachy Both the which seing they lacked he cōcluded that their calling ministery was not lawflul As concerning traditions the interpretatiō of scripture if ther shal happē to be any disputatiō about thē thē we must run haue regard to ordinarie successors as to those to whom the holy Ghost is promised who were ordained to that end purpose as it is manisest by the example of the Leuites with whom in time past mē ought to consult from whose iudgement it was not lawful to decline Many things yea euē those that are most certaine farthest from all doubt are retained by traditiō As the the father is not begottē that the sonne is of like substance with the father that infantes ought to be baptized y the virgin Mary was a pure virgin after the birth of Christ so remained such like the which being receiued from the fathers although they be not plainly writtē in the word of God the is to say in the bookes of the prophets Apostles yet notwithstanding they are not of lesse credit and authoritie Moreouer he said the whatsoeuer was cōcluded determined by generall coūcels were ought to be accounted most certaine true seing the councels coulde not erre in those things that appertained to doctrin For the which saith he you haue alledged out of S. Austin that one coūcell was corre●… 〈◊〉 proued by another coūcell following neuer came to passe in those things which appertained to Religiō For there were only thrée councels in the time of S. Augustine namely the coūcell of Nicene against the Arriās the coūcell of Constantinople against the Macedoniās the Ephesine councel specially against Nestorius none of the which were afterward reproued amēded That which you brought in cōcerning Paphnutius it is neither certainly true nor yet doth it appertaine to the purpose Here vpō he repeated that which was spoken cōcerning the Supper disputing a little about the corporall presence he alledged many things out of the books of a certaine author which as he saide the ministers could not refuse meaning Caluine one of whose bookes he brought forth It was said that Espensius at the cōmandemēt of the Cardinal of Loraine of purpose begā to reason concerning the Supper to the intent he might finde conuenient occasion to breake off the conference While Beza was about to make answer to that which Espēsius had said a certain Sorbonist a white monke whose name was Xainctius being fully bent to dispute rose vp making a long tedious repetitiō of those things which were spokē by Espensius before said that traditions had a more firme foundatiō than the scripture it self bicause the scripture might be drawen euerye waye by the varietie of interpretations for the which cause he saide that Cyprian contended with many Affricans affyrming that Christ said not I am custome but I am the way the truth the life The which sentence frō that time forward was many wayes wrested trāsformed To the same effect he cited the testimonie of Tertulliā in his booke of prescriptions of heretikes said that Beza had spoken very stately sending him to the same place of Tertullian to reade it more diligently Who saythe Quoth the Monke that Heretikes bring in the scriptures and do leade the ignorant into error beyng moued by the authoritie ther of And thus he concluded that the Scriptures ought not to be vsed and that from them simply we ought not to take weapons to conuince heretikes for bicause of thynges so vncertaine the certaine victory of truth cannot be gotten At the last he obscurely sayde that God beside his Councell had giuen vnto vs his doctrine in writing saide that Chrisostome was the author of this saying Here Beza made answere that those long tedious words of the Monke were very impertinent to their conference and nothing helping to that peace and concorde which they wished and directing his oration to the Quéene he did besech hir to prouide that they might neuer afterward swarue fall into perturbations troubles not seruing to the purpose Therefore sayth he that I may answere to the firste doubt of Espensius from whence the Ministers of our Churches had their calling seing they were not called by ordinarie meanes neither had receiued the imposition of handes know ye that Imposition or laying on of handes is not the speciall note of lawfull calling for the principall and substantiall notes are the Inquisition of maners and doctrine and Election from the which two if imposition of handes shall be wanting yet we muste not thinke the calling to be any whyt the lesse lawfull We are elected Ministers and approued of our Churches which with one consent haue allowed our Ministerie But wheras we haue not had imposition of handes nor appointed by those whome ye call Ordinaries that oughte not to séeme straunge seing that in so greate confusion of all things in the Churche of Rome wée would not receiue imposition of hands of those whose vices superstition and false doctrine we disalowe for that they were open enimyes to the truth It is out of all doubte that the Prophetes in olde time had no greater aduersaries than the Priestes whiche reiected sounde doctrine and neglected their office and duetie Did the Prophetes therefore at any time which were raised vp of God to be enimies vnto them desire the confirmation or approbation of their offices vnto the which they were called and appointed of God And yet notwithstanding who will say that they did intrude themselues into those offices which they executed and discharged faithfully with great perill and daunger of their life The which also we ought to do at this time And it ought not to be said that Myracles are necessarily to be required to extraordinarie callings for that which is written concerning the calling of Moyses is not common to all For by what Myracles were the callings of Esayas Daniel and Zacharias confirmed Did the Apostle Paule