we Meet together on the First Day of the Week for to Meet is our Duty and also upon other Days and for this Practice we have both Command and Example The Saints were commanded not to forsake the assembling of themselves together Heb. 10. 25. and we account every day is the Lord's and He that regardeth a Day ought to regard it to the Lord and he that regardeth not the Day to the Lord he doth not regard it Rom. 14. 6. But what Scripture have ye for all such Days as you observe which are called such and such Saints Days Thou sayst Thou hast been the longer on this particular because thou findest it galls us most Answ. When thou hast read our Answer which by reason of thine being so long hath caused ours to be so too thou mayst consider of it and of thy impertinency in quoting the Scriptures to prove your Practice which being well observed doth witness against you and then we doubt not but it will prove that which will gall thee and thy Brethren who are so found in such Covetous practices as the Scriptures plentifully testifie against And for a further Testimony against your Practices read these following Scriptures of which for brevity's sake having been so long already we shall forbear to write the Words they that can may read them in the Bible Isa. 59. 9 10 11 12. Ier. 5. 30 31. Ezek. 13. 19. Ezek. 34. ch Mich. 3. 5 11. Ioh. 10. 12. Tit. 1. 10 11. 1 Tim. 3. 1 2 3. 2 Pet. 2. 14 15 16. Iud. 11 12 13. In the next place thou undertakest to inform him of some Defects in that Religion he had chosen and first thou sayst Our Teachers have no lawful Call to Preach the Gospel and quotest the Apostle's saying Rom. 10. 15. How shall they Preach except they be sent That is sayst thou how can they Preach the true Doctrine of Christ unless they be sent by him or by those Apostles of Christ who received immediate Commissions from him c. Answ. We grant what the Apostle saith How can they Preach except they be sent c But that our Teachers are not so sent thou neither undertakest to prove by Argument nor Scripture although thou hast the confidence to affirm that they have no lawful Call or Commission to Preach the Gospel which we turn back upon thee as a false Accusation and demand of thee to prove and make it appear to be true if thou canst For we do believe that none can be true Ministers but such as are sent by Christ and have their Call and Commission from him and also receive the Gospel which they Preach and their Ability from him For the Scripture is plain that the Gospel-Ministers were sent by him and received the Gospel they Preached and Ability to Preach it from him and not from Men as in Gal. 1. 11 12. And in 2 Cor. 3. 6. the Apostle saith They were made able Ministers of the New Testament not of the Letter but of the Spirit and in the foregoing verse he saith Our sufficiency is of God And Ephes. 3. 7. he declares That he was made a Minister according to the Gift of the Grace of God given unto him by the effectual working of his Power And Peter saith 1 Pet. 4. 11. If any Man speak let him speak as the Oracles of God if any Man Minister let him do it as of the Ability which God giveth that God in all things may be glorified c. And so from him we say we have received our Call by his Eternal Spirit and do wait upon him to receive our Ability daily that what we do may be by the Gift of the Grace of God given unto us that God in all things may be Glorified And if this be not according to the Scripture and the way of God do thou in thy next shew what is And prove your way of being bred up at Schools and Learning your Tongues and taking your Degrees there and observing your Ceremonies in your Ordination and coming forth according to your Traditions and then looking for a Benefice the greatest you can get and then setling in a Parish for so much a Year until you can hear of a Place with a greater Benefice and then remove for Greater Gain and Preferment And while you stay in a Parish take such Lordship upon you that none of your Church or Hearers may have Liberty to Speak or Preach but such as are so Ordained as you are Clear these things in thy next to be according to Scripture if thou canst In the mean while we charge this Method and these doings not to be according to the Rule of the Gospel or Example of the Primitive Ministers That this is your Practice we believe thou canst not deny But in the true Church this Order and Liberty was Ordained by the Apostle as in 1 Cor. 14. 30 31 32. If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by let the first hold his peace for you may all Prophesie one by one that all may learn that all may be comforted and the Spirits of the Prophets are subject to the Prophets But this Liberty which the Apostle Ordained you do not admit of no more than you do of other things which were the practice of the true Church and Christ's Ministers but instead thereof are gone into things which are of Man's Ordaining and setting up And therefore Robert Lacky and all in whom God hath opened an understanding to see you a right have reason enough to forsake you and your Church And as for those Scriptures thou quotest to prove a successive Power to send others They make nothing for your method of Ordination at all for Matth. 28. he said He would be with them c. doth not say They should send others In Acts 1. the Apostles desired one in the place of Iudas to be numbered with them and he was chosen by Lot So here was the Lord's Lot And in Acts 14. 23. it is said They Ordained Elders in every Church Now how these Scriptures do prove a true Succession to your Call and Ordination let all that are wise in heart judge Secondly Thou sayst We have no Sacraments administred in our Religion neither that of Baptism whereby People are admitted into the Christian Church nor that of the Lord's Supper by which they are strengthned and preserved in it Ans. First We demand whence thou hast this Term Sacraments and what is the proper Signification of it We are sure thou hast it not from Scripture And Secondly We put it upon thee to prove whence you have your Authority for that which thou callest Baptism by which thou sayst People are admitted into the Christian Church viz. Sprinkling Infants We deny that you have any Authority from Scripture either by Command or Example for it For we never read in all the Scriptures of either Baptising or Sprinkling Infants There is no such thing in that Scripture by thee quoted Therefore thou
his Church did charge it to be Blasphemy for any to say That Man could do contrary to the Will of God and when it was offered to be proved in an hundred places of Scripture and more where the Will of God was manifest and that Men did contrary to it for if it were not so we should not have Sin committed for in the Scripture all sorts of Sin are forbidden After this was offered he still affirm'd it And further discoursing of what benefit the Reprobate could have by the coming of Christ he said the Devil had a benefit by it but being much desired to shew wherein he could make nothing out Iames Barry makes a Boast of his Hearers most of them being in a state of Grace but if they be not founded upon better Principles than these they are far from being in a state of Grace and Happiness Therefore in Charity we desire they may look to their standing and not to be setled upon such unsound Principles as Iames Barry the Independent Minister as he calls himself labours to settle them in which is opposite to God's Free Grace which brings Salvation Iames Barry also with some of his Hearers did account it an Errour in the Quakers to own Immediate Revelation and said they did disown it Now seeing it is so that the immediate Spirit of Christ and its Immediate Revelation is denied by him we demand of him how he came to be a Minister and whence he hath his Ability and that Knowledge of God he pretendeth to have and from whom he hath received his Gospel that he Preacheth It s evident enough not from Christ for indeed it is not like his nor him who would have gathered the Children of Jerusalem as a Hen gathereth her Chickens and they would not therefore were they rejected because they would not be gathered The Apostle saith 2 Cor. 3. 6. They were made able Ministers of the New Testament not of the Letter but of the Spirit and verse 5. saith Their sufficiency was of God and Gal. 1. 11 12. the Gospel which Paul Preached It was not after Man for he neither received it of Man neither was taught it but by the Revelation of Iesus Christ Eph. 3. he declares That he was made a Minister according to the gift of the Grace of God given unto him by the effectual working of his Power and Peter saith 1 Pet. 4. 11. If any Man speak let him speak as the Oracles of God if any Man Minister let him do it as of the ability which God giveth that God in all things may be glorified c. Now how is this Ability received from God if not by his Spirit and therefore he gave different Gifts of the Spirit for the work of the Ministry and by that they were opened and inlarged and made able But Iames Barry denying this from whom hath he his Call and whence hath he his Gospel and Ability If he saith from God We desire to know how he received it being not by the Spirit he having denied that and if it be not by the Spirit it cannot be from God For what a Man receives of Spiritual Benefit it must be by the Spirit either immediately or mediately by its working through an Instrument Therefore let him make out how he comes by his Call Ability and that Necessity he pretends to be upon him for the Divine Spirit being denied it must be from Man or else from his own corrupt Heart for Self-interest which is most probable that he might get Gain and live upon the People For it is evident his Necessity is not the same that was upon the Apostle 1 Cor. 9. 16. He owns not his way of receiving it nor doth follow his Example in Preaching it And to his Hearers this Advice we give Consider well your State and whether you profit under his Ministry or no For of old they that ran and the Lord did not send them did not profit the People for he denying Revelation by which the Father and the Son is savingly known no other Knowledge is come to without it but by Hear-say which is not that Knowledge Christ speaks of which is Life Eternal And for your satisfaction read the following Scriptures Mat. 11. 27. Christ saith Neither knoweth any Man the Father but the Son and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him So Christ is positive that no Man knows God but by his Revelation Mat. 16. 17. Christ saith it was the Father that Revealed him unto Peter and Gal. 1. 15 16. There you may see the Father Revealed his Son in Paul 1 Cor. 2. 10. The Apostle speaking of the great things God had prepared for them that love him saith God hath Revealed them unto us by his Spirit and in Eph. 1. 17. you may see how the Apostle prayed for the Saints That God the Father of our Lord Iesus Christ the Father of Glory would give unto them the Spirit of Wisdom and Revelation in the Knowledge of the Son and 1 Cor. 14. 30. he saith If any thing be Revealed to another that sits by let the first hold his Peace Here you may see that from the Testimony of the Holy Scripture which your Minister said should be the Standard to try every thing by in the true Church Revelation was expected and to be given way to in the Church and by the Apostle was prayed for that God would give the Spirit and Revelation unto the Church for he knew they could not Worship Pray Preach nor Sing aright without it And what Is this accounted an Error now by your Minister or you Where is your Standard Will you not come to the Scriptures nor to the Spirit neither Where is your Bottom and Foundation that you Build upon What 's your Root that bears you You have got a foolish Builder he will not follow the Example of Paul a wise Master-Builder 1 Cor. 14. 15. Paul said He would pray with the Spirit c. and sing with the Spirit c. Eph. 5. 18. There the Apostle exhorts them To be filled with the Spirit and Rom 8. 26. he saith They knew not what to pray for as they ought but the Spirit helped their Infirmities c. And Christ in the 4 th of Iohn saith That God is a Spirit and they that Worship him must Worship him in Spirit and Truth and such doth the Father seek to Worship him Now let your Minister clear these things up to you how in your Church or Families either he and you denying Revelation can Worship aright Preach Pray or Sing aright and by what you have Ability and know what to Pray for without the Spirits help What! are you so strong of your selves in your Self-Ability that you do not need that which the Apostles and all true Christians sought the help of and could not do without Nay it was that by which they knew what to Pray for and therefore they waited for its Assistance And Paul said he would Pray with
are not in the undefiled Christian Religion which keeps from the Spots of the World and leads into Fellowship with the Father and his Son And therefore there was no such Danger as thou insinuatest in thy Letter in his leaving of your Church of incurring the Damnation of his Soul or choosing an unsafer way to Heaven in coming to that Religion he hath chosen Next we observe thou seemest to take an advantage at his saying It is the Light of God's Grace that let him see the evil of his own Heart that he lived in and the evil of others also and so wouldst strain these words the evil of others particularly to the seeing of the hidden Evils of their Hearts in secret as he saw his own whereas it is not to be questioned but that he intended the Evil that others brought forth into Words or Actions Though when he speaks of himself he names his Heart saying My own Heart yet thou unfairly makest a great deal ado about it to bring him under blame as if he assumed God's Prerogative and plainly contradicted the Apostle Paul in the 14 th chap. of the Romans but that thou hast no just reason for these thy endeavours wise Men may easily comprehend However it is certain that through the Light of God's Grace in the Heart Men may come to see the defects in themselves and also in others without assuming God's Prerogative And as to thy saying It 's a Term often used by the Quakers but not rightly understood by them Thy Charge is false The Quakers understand it and thou canst not make out the contrary though it 's easie for thee and others to accuse But that we leave upon thee to prove and make out But as for his seeing the wickedness of his own Heart it is not to be questioned and also to see the Vanity and Wickedness of others is not difficult For it is apparent enough that Men that are in the Society of the People of your Religion may see what is brought forth daily that is not agreeable to Christianity both in Words and Actions And seeing this and that which Christ lays down being granted that out of the abundance of the Heart the Mouth speaks and a good Man out of the good Treasure of his Heart brings forth good things and an evil Man out of the evil Treasure brings forth evil things Matth. 12. 35. Then according to this Rule of Christ's by what Men bring forth in their Conversations the Heart may be judged And though the Lord search the Heart and try the Reins and to know Secrets is his Prerogative yet what is thus manifested according to the Rule of Christ is no presumption to believe or give judgment in And as to the Apostles Words Rom. 14. Thou makest an impertinent Application of them in bringing them as a Testimony in this concern against him for the case in which they were not to judge one another was in point of Faith or their growth or liberty therein the Weakness of the Faith of a weak Brother was to be born with in that straitness that was upon some as in respect to Meats and the observing of Days which others were grown over that were not to be judged but in point of Faith were to be left to their own liberty and in that case saith he Let not him that eateth not judge him that eateth for God hath received him and he that did eat was not to despise him that did not eat So thou may'st see that the Apostle had a regard to their Growth in the Faith and so would have all walk accordingly in Wisdom with care not to hurt one another But what is this to People of a loose Life whose Words and Actions are contrary to the Law of God and so sinful May we bear no Testimony against such Was it not the Practice of the Prophets Christ and the Apostles to Reprove such and give Testimony against them and yet not contradict Paul in this case How ignorant thou shewest thy self to be of the Scriptures But mark thy Iudgment and where it will fall Have not these many years your Church and Ministry been concerned in Persecuting such as could not for Conscience sake and in the liberty of their Faith Observe Days and other things which you required And when they could not conform to you they have not only been judged by you but sorely abused and cast into Prison put in the Stocks and their Goods spoild Thus have many suffered only for matters of Faith and Conscience towards God And so herein it is evident that your established Church thou speakest of is highly Guilty of the Fact thou chargest to be plainly contrary to the Apostle in that fore-cited Scripture in Rom. and so is judging another Man's Servant in that wherein he ought to be left to his own Master and presumest to meddle with Christ's Prerogative so you are under thy own Condemnation being guilty of that which thou wouldst condemn in others And this to be your practice can be proved by many Witnesses that have suffered upon this account by your Church both in England and Ireland From what is before said it's evident that for a Man to say That he sees the evil of his own Heart by the Light and Grace of God and the evil of other Men which were conversant with him in his loose Conversation doth not bring him under the Censure of the Apostle as thou ignorantly dost imply Therefore thou mayst take it home to thy self and thy Brethren as a just Judgment upon you for the reasons aforementioned Thou further say'st That perhaps we will object that Christ in Matth. 7 16. says Ye shall know them by their Fruits c. To which thou Answerest He does so but tellest us It hath relation to false Prophets and withal wouldst insinuate as if the Teaching Quakers as thou callest them were such But that they are such is a false Insinuation which thou canst never be able to prove And by Fruits thou tellest us that both there and in other places is meant the Doctrine of those false Prophets or Teachers that being the proper Fruits of such men and not their particular Actions Answer That Christ's words here have a relation to false Prophets we grant it and that they are to be known by their Fruits we also acknowledg But that the Fruits there meant are only their Doctrines and not their particular Actions as thou affirmest we do deny And that it is not so as thou sayst doth plainly appear from the words of Christ in many parts of the same Chapter For first he saith They shall come in Sheeps-Cloathing but inwardly they are ravening Wolves so not in the Sheep's Life And what is the Sheep's Cloathing Is it not the Words of the true Phrophets Apostles and Servants of God As appears by the Testimony of the Lord's Servants as may be seen in Ierem. 23. 30. Behold I am against the Prophets saith the Lord that
Presence and before him shall the Hills Fly yea the Sea also shall Fly and Iordan shall be Driven back that his Ransomed may pass on his Redeemed People may Enter into their Rest. Oh! theresore let us Cleave unto the Lord our Saviour and so sollow Christ our Redeemer who can cut a passage through the great Deep let us not be dismayed at any thing that may rise up in our way to oppose us so long as our Leader is with us and our blessed Rock attends us and we feel our dwelling within the Munition thereof our Bread will be sure and our Water will not fail and our Hearts will not be barren nor our Souls will not be faint but we shall grow through the blessing of Israel's God and Live when with all their cunning the enemies of the Truth have contrived our overthrow For there is nothing can hurt us more in the Trying Day than want of Faith in God's Power and Arm of strength which never failed them that put their trust therein And therefore my dearly Beloved with whom my Soul is bound up in the Covenant of Life wherein I have Unity with you and can say although you bear the Burden yet my Heart is concerned for you and also with you in your Godly concern and Testimony for which you Suffer and therefore cannot you be forgotten by me For as we Love the Truth and the Holy Testimony thereof for which you Suffer and are in Bonds in Spirit we are often as Bound with you and fellow-feelers of your Burthens And furthermore we cannot propose to our selves any other than e're long to be Sharers with you to be Partakers of the like Sufferings Trials and Exercises and therefore still it is our safety to be Prepared in our Hearts and into the Will of God to be given up to Do or Suffer for his Name 's sake For our days do seem to be like the Days of Old wherein the Apostle said they were Killed all the Day long and accounted as Sheep for the Slaughter If we look into the Scriptures we have a Cloud of Witnesses and so through what was Written aforetime which was Written for our Learning we may have Comfort and our hope Strengthened and so be Encouraged to Trust in the Lord our Strength and in whom our Hope is And now it is still to be our care as Lambs or Sheep to Live in Innocency and so as Lambs to Suffer for our Innocency and for our Testimony which we are called unto and surely I often consider what more Innocent Practice can we ever be found in than in our Peaceable Meetings to Wait upon the Living God and to Worship him in his peaceable Spirit by which our Hearts come to be cleansed of all Evil and our Spirits gathered into the Peace and Love of God in which we Love God again and not only so but have our hearts filled with Love and Good will towards all Men in the Peace and Sweetness of which we are enabled to Pray for the Good of All even our Enemies And if this must be misinterpreted and our Righteous and Godly Intents counted a Transgression of the Law and a Breach of the Peace I do not know what such who so do can call Innocency For surely every one whose Heart is rightly Exercised in this Godly Duty which the Living God calls us unto must needs be Innocent before God and in that Frame of Spirit wherein we cannot nay dare not desire the Hurt of any but as the Truth ariseth Pray for all Men both for Rulers and People Thus I know under the Exercise of the Righteous Power of Christ in our Meetings are our Hearts qualified and then if we must Suffer for Well doing under the name of Evil-doers we shall be happy and may satisfy our selves with what Christ of old said The Servant is not greater than his Lord For if they accounted him a Blasphemer and said he had a Devil and so Persecuted him we may well look unto him and Comfort our selves in following such an Example And therefore be ye Comforted you Faithful Sufferers with Christ and for him and Comfort your Hearts in the Recompence of Reward which is with God for you and wait for the Spirit of God and of Glory that it may rest upon you And never look out for your Cause is Good it is that which God hath called you unto and you are happy in your Nobility and Valour and whosoever shrinks from their Innocent Testimony in this matter will suffer Loss in their Inward Condition for if any draw back such shall know the Lord will not go with them nor have any Pleasure in them nor be their Comforter but Reprover And therefore my Soul desires that all may be Valiant for the Truth and stand in the Power thereof unto what the Lord hath called unto that so you may be together as a City set on a Hill that cannot be hid For though the Foxes have Holes and the Fowls of the Air have Nests yet remember what Christ said to the Man that said he would follow him And so the Lord give you all Valour and Strength and Enrich you with true Patience which the Tribulation worketh into in the right Exercise that so you may all grow up into the true Experience and so into the Hope which makes not ashamed that the Love of God may be shed abroad in your Hearts every day by his Spirit which he hath given you And then will you all feel a dwelling in his Covenant and in his Peace And so in this Covenant Peace and Love I very dearly Salute you all and in it do I still remain Your Friend and Brother I. B. Castle-Salem in the West of Ireland the 30th of the 10th Month 1682. J. B's Epistle to Friends in Glocester-Prison Dear Friends UNTO you who are Faithful Sufferers in that City with the rest of the Faithful in that City and Country who in your Hearts are given up to Suffer for the holy Name of the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour who hath Called and Redeemed Chosen and given you Hearts not only to believe but also to suffer for his Name 's sake and thus hath counted you worthy as Vessels of his Choice unto you all I say in the Name and Love of Christ Jesus our Lord I send Greeting and with-all the tender Salutation of my Soul and Spirit in that near Affection and holy Union into which by the power of the Holy Ghost we have been gathered and united So that as Members of that one Body into which we have been Baptized by that one Spirit wherein the true access unto God doth stand we have our Fellowship together and so drink together into that one Spirit and are refreshed with the Water that flows from the living Rock that followed Israel of Old who is the Rock of our Age the stay of the Generation of the Righteous in this Day that upon which we have our sure standing so
Who do not profit the People at all who from time to time stand up to teach them and yet they remain in their old Nature not changed from their former Conversation Oh cease Seeing no Fruit is brought forth to God by all your labour Is it not for the love of Mony that you Teach And do ye not seek after the Fleece more than the Flock And do ye not go from one place to another for Rewards Let that of God in your Consciences answer Is not this it which blinds your Eyes that ye do not see what Generation ye are of when you read the Scripture Which testifies who they were that persecuted and who they were that suffered Persecution then in the Apostles days Search the Scriptures and see whether the Persecutors or they that were persecuted were the Saints of God in those Days And whether the way be not the same now in these our Days yea or nay From a Lover of your Souls who is a Sufferer in outward Bonds in the Common Goal in Carlisle for the Truth 's sake J. B. The INNOCENCY OF THE Christian Quakers MANIFESTED The Truth of their Principles and Doctrine Cleared and Defended from the loud but false Clamours base Insinuations and wicked Slanders of Iames Barry Published for the general Satisfaction and Benefit of all who simply desire to know and embrace the TRUTH He that hideth Hatred with lying Lips and he that uttereth a Slander is a Fool Prov. 10. 18. I have not sent these Prophets yet they ran I have not spoke to them yet they Prophesied Ier. 23. 21. Therefore Night shall be unto you that ye shall not have a Vision and it shall be dark unto you that ye shall not divine and the Sun shall go down over the Prophets and the Day shall be dark over them Mic. 3. 6. Prove all things hold fast that which is good 1 Thess. 5. 21. SEveral Papers having past between some of us the People called Quakers of the City of Dublin and one Iames Barry of the same who calls himself an Independent Minister occasioned by his often abusing and frequent reflecting upon us and our Principles as Erroneous in his publick Preaching and sometimes in private Discourse and an account thereof coming to divers of us by several Persons some notice we took of his said Reflections and accordingly sent to him by way of Admonishment but did not pursue it not looking upon it so very material for us to concern our selves with him only returning his false Aspersions upon himself he being reputed a Man so addicted to Rail against divers sorts of People at last were necessitated by the many Informations brought us of his continuing his abusive Reflections upon us and many desiring to see and hear us together that they might be satisfied whether it was so as he had said or no and accordingly sent to him and desired him to give us a publick Meeting and there to make good his Accusations or otherwise to acknowledge the wrong he had done us therein But in answer to our so just and reasonable a Demand he sent a scurrilous Paper wherein he both greatly abused us and the Evidence we had quoted to him as also several of our Friends and their Writings in general terms tho' to this day he hath not produced to us one Sentence out of all their Books that he doth charge to be erroneous yet had the confidence to bid us call in all such Books and let them be burned by the Common Cryer and deny the Authors of them and withall denying he had so said as we were informed We thereupon further examined our Evidence who still affirmed what he had declared as aforesaid was truth And we also having the substance of the matter in two chief points viz. That we denied the Resurrection and Salvation by the Coming of Christ witnessed by another of his Hearers who declared he had heard him so charge us to which we returned him an Answer giving him an account how that we had examined the said Evidence again and that he stood to his said Information and also how that another Person testified as before-mentioned with several Certificates from other Persons of other Abuses and wicked Accusations he had cast out against us We therefore did renew our Demand unto him viz. To give us a Meeting and then appear to make good his said Charges if he could against us and that we would then also appear to vindicate our Principles as laid down either by us or our Friends whom he had so abused whose names he had inserted in his first Paper After a long time he sent us another Paper wherein he tells us that by our method he perceives we are not like to appear in publick to discourse Principles c. and in a boasting way tells us that we will not vouchsafe him the least ground imaginable on which to bottom a hope that we and he shall come to grapple in a publick Contest and so proceeds still in the denial of some of the matter in charge already proved not failing to renew his Reflections upon us and our Principles Now when we had received this boasting Paper of his by which one might think that he on his part should not fail to grapple in publick we returned him Answer seeing he denied some part of the Charge as laid down and made him this offer as a moderate expedient to give him a Meeting and that the Witnesses and he might come face to face and that they might have liberty before the People to declare their matter of Evidence which they had to offer and we to lay down our Reasons why we were dissatisfied and then he to say what he could to clear himself and when all had said what they had to say to the opening of the matter we would quietly leave it to the Consciences of the People to judge and believe as they should find the Justice of the Case in their own understandings and this being done we offered to proceed to discourse with him about those three Principles viz. The Resurrection Iustification and Perfection in Sanctification as to Degrees attainable and further about particular Election and Reprobation of Persons and also offered to dispute with him Principle for Principle so long as might tend to Edification c. And for this end we demanded a Meeting and desired an orderly and peaceable Auditory of sober People that gravely in the fear of God we might go through those things in our Discourse to our Satisfaction and their Edification c. And further offered our largest Meeting house for an Accommodation to the Meeting if he pleased or otherwise we would submit to go to any other convenient place of his appointing and left it to him to make it as publick as he thought good c. Some time after he received this he sent us another scurrilous Paper filled up with Reflections not only upon us but also upon the People that
to themselves but the Stranger the Fatherless and the Widow were to have a share with them they were to be relieved out of the Tithes by the same Law that there might be no Beggars and the Owner himself was also to partake of them as thou mayst see in Deut. ch 14. and ch 26. So it is evident you far exceed them as to Self-advantage you have all to your selves your Ministry is far more chargeable than the Priests under the Law neither Poor nor Owner must have a share with you nor the Payers of the Tithes eased from the burthen of the Poor for all that you get Pray thee tell us how your Tithes come to be of Divine Right Thou sayst It is not hard to prove when demanded We Demand it and also Deny it do thou Prove it if thou canst We are sure if this Law were in force that gave it to Levi you in the using of it walk far beside the Law and so still are under Condemnation Oh! is it not a shame that Men that pretend to be Ministers of Christ and can tell the People as thou dost in thine of forsaking all for Christ and yet in your practices do neither walk answerable to the Freedom and Ease of the Gospel nor Iustice and Equity of the Law of the first Covenant And therefore we advise thee to lay down thy Religious Plea for these Wages of thine for we can account them no better than Balaam's Wages of Unrighteousness which he loved but durst not take spoken of 2 Pet. 2. 15. For it doth appear there were such in the Apostles days that forsook the right way and followed Balaam ' s Errour and certainly we are not without such now in our days But now let us consider what Christ hath Ordained who is the Law-giver under the New Covenant Thou sayst Tho' Paul does not mention Tithes and Offerings yet he speaks what is equivalent to them We desire to know what thou intendest by Equivalent Dost thou mean of an equal Value and Institution with them We grant what Paul saith to be just and reasonable and according to the Gospel that it was no great thing where they had Sown Spirituals to Reap of their Carnal things And thou seest Paul puts it upon an If and says If we have sown Spiritual things he claims no power to it else But this will not serve you you cannot abide within the Gospel-Ordination and Bounds no more than you do the Law about your Tithes but you will reap Carnals where you sow no Spirituals Thou mayst see also the Apostle speaks of feeding a Flock and planting a Vineyard and eating the Milk and Fruit but still it 's the Milk and Fruit of the Flock and Vineyard that they had Fed and Planted and not other Mens But this will not serve you let the Nations bear Witness you will reap whether you sow or not you will eat whether you feed and plant or not you will have it by force like Eli's Sons if you cannot get it otherwise And thou bringst the Apostle's Words Even so hath the Lord ordained that they who Preach the Gospel should live of the Gospel and then queriest doth Paul say the Lord has ordained And will you say the Lord has not ordained Is not this to give the Apostle a flat lie We answer Nay we will not say nor never did that they which Preach the Gospel may not live of the Gospel according to Christ's Ordination but then it must be according to his Ordination and not according to Man's Will and Invention to answer his own covetous Inclination And we also grant what the Apostle saith Let him that is taught in the Word communicate to him that teacheth in all good things but still he must be a Teacher and it is from them that he teacheth that he must expect it But this will not please you but you will have from them that were never taught by you as thousands in Ireland may bear witness So thou mayst see here how impertinently thou wouldst apply the Scriptures to them that have no right to them upon that account thou bringst them but they will not serve thy turn And where is the Wrester of the Scriptures to their own Destruction that thou speakest of Thou hast need to see if thou canst clear thy self of it Thou goest on and sayst Thou canst tell what we will say to these and such like Texts you will I warrant you sayst thou say that Tithes are not mentioned c. But thou mayst see thou wast under a mistake and it was a vain confidence in thee to say so We have something else to say as before But you will allow sure that they enjoin a Maintenance c. thou sayst We will allow that But then let it be what the Lord has ordained and we are content And now let us observe what that is In Matth. 10. when Christ sent forth his Twelve Disciples to Preach and Heal the sick he said Freely you have received freely give and the Allowance he ordained for them when he sent them out without Mony or Gold was That they might Eat such things as were set before them for saith he the Workman is worthy of his Meat And in Luke 10. when he sent out his Seventy he gave them the like Command and told them They might stay in that House into which they had entred eating and drinking such things as they did give for saith he the Labourer is worthy of his Hire and in the 8 th verse he saith Into whatsoever City ye enter and they receive you eat such things as are set before you So here it was such as did receive them that they were to abide with and it was such things as they did give and set before them that they were to eat so it was the free Act of such as did receive them that they were to live upon and be supplied by Here is no liberty to Compel but the Power of the Gospel was to open their Hearts to minister freely of their Carnals as they received freely of the Spirituals from them and this agrees with what the Apostle says in all those places before mentioned so that it is evident he had regard unto what the Lord and ordained But this will not serve your Turn you cannot be content with what Christ ordains and the Apostle approves of 1 Tim. 5. 18. Thou shalt not muzzle the Ox that treadeth out the Corn and the Labourer is worthy of his Reward The question may be by some asked what this Reward is the Apostle clears it up in the 6 th ch 8 th v. having in the former verse told Timothy That we brought nothing into this World and it is certain we can carry nothing out and having Food and Raiment let us therewith be content Here was the Counsel of an Apostle to a Bishop for it 's said he was Bishop of the Church at Ephesus Now things being well weighed according to
the Scripture where is the Divine Right either for Tithes or the other great Revenues you Clergy-men Compel the Nations to pay you It is not from Christ's Command nor the Apostles nor from any of their Examples neither Apostles Bishops Pastors nor Teachers You are without Warrant from the Scripture you have neither Precept nor Precedent for your Practices either as in respect to your great Revenues that you seek after and enjoy nor your manner of forcing People to pay you All we see in Christ's Ordination that was to be done to them that would not receive them and relieve them was they were to shake off the Dust of their Feet as a Witness against them And then Christ shews the danger of their rejecting but refers it to the day of Judgment But this will not serve you though ye pretend to be spiritual Men yet it plainly appears you are for your carnal Ends you cannot trust your selves under Christ's Care to live of the Gospel and what that freely produceth in the Hearts of the People as Christ's Ministers did And you may see what they answered when he questioned them as in Luke 22. 35. And he said unto them when I sent you without Purse and Scrip and Shooes lacked ye any thing and they answered Nothing So here is Faith and Obedience and the Effects also of the Faith and Obedience of Christ's Ministers set before us for an Example But it 's evident you do no more love to follow the Example of the Primitive Ministers than you love to submit to what Christ hath ordained as appears by the great bustle thou makest and the many shuffling Arguments thou usest to invalidate the good Example of the Apostle in that godly Care that was upon him that he might not make the Gospel chargeable which is no more than the real duty of every true Minister of Christ although you make it not your concern as is evident from your practices And what if the Apostle had Power and asserted his Power Thou seest what Power he asserts in these Words Have we not power to eat and to drink and again Have we not power to forbear working c as in 1 Cor. 9. So thou may'st still see that he pretended to no power above his Master's Commission who said They might Eat such things as were set before them The Labourer was worthy of his Meat So still this makes nothing for thee and thy Brethren his Power you will not be content with no more than his Example for then you know you must not live in Pride Highth Fulness and Idleness as ye do And so being his Power will not answer your Ends you fly from his Power which was the Gospel which they that Preached it were to live by to Man's Power and Law for your Maintenance and by that Force and Compel People to pay you for whom you do no Work and to whom you cannot say as he did 1 Cor. 9. 1. Are not you my Work in the Lord But alas how many Thousands do you Compel in Ireland to pay you that are not your Work in this sense he speaks of You have no concern in their Conversion if they be Converted but whether they be or not you matter not you will have your Revenue from among them But thou tellest him He does not consider that the Gospel of Christ was but in its Infancy Paul was but then planting it endeavouring to make it the established Religion of the Nations as now it is Answer That Paul was planting it we grant but that the Religion which he endeavoured to establish is now the Established Religion of the Nations we deny For first there is no such Unity Nationally in Religion as he endeavoured to establish as in 1 Cor. 1. 10. Now I beseech you Brethren by the Name of our Lord Iesus Christ that ye all speak the same thing that there be no Division among you that ye be perfectly joined together in the same Mind and in the same Iudgment Secondly They are not established in Holiness and that Perfection which he laboured to establish and present them in as Col. 1. 28. Warning every Man and teaching every Man in all Wisdom that we may present every Man perfect in Christ Iesus And likewise in Ephes. 4. we read that he gave Ministers and Gifts for the Ministry for the perfecting of the Saints and for the edifying of the Body of Christ c. till they all come in the Unity of the Faith to a perfect Man c. And 2 Corinth chap. 7. verse 1. His Labour was To bring them to perfect Holiness in the Fear of God This is the Religion Paul and others endeavoured to Establish in the Nations and to Establish People in and for this end Peter exhorts the Believers To be holy in all manner of Conversation that as he which had called them was holy so they might be holy 1 Pet. 1. 15. Here is that which they laboured to make the Established Religion of the Nations viz. Unity Perfection and Holiness in all manner of Conversation Thou affirmest That now it is made as he to wit Paul endeavoured to make it If this were true then the Nations would be gathered into Righteousness and Holiness Unity and Peace Love and Good will But alas there appears no such Fruits of the true Religion amongst the generality of the People of the Nations which doth demonstrate that there is no such Establishment of it as thou hast asserted what-ever may be professed in words We take notice how much thou art offended at his telling thee That the Ministers wrought with their Hands and takest occasion at the Word Ministers as if he had said All laboured and then affirmest it 's very false whereas he only saith Ministers in the plural Number not All which is proved true by the Scripture and thy own Confession who grantest That Paul and his Fellow-travelling Apostles did labour with their Hands And then when thou hast Asserted it to be false thou challengest him to shew another Apostle besides them in the New Testament that wrought For sayst thou They for sook their Boats their Nets their Trades for his sake and the Gospel and the New Testament doth not inform us that they ever returned to these Trades again for a Livelihood Answ. We read Iohn 23. that Peter above three years after he was called by Christ with several other Disciples after they had so forsaken their Boats c. went a Fishing and that Peter then had his Fisher's Coat not a long Gown as those called Ministers now wear and we do not believe they went for Pleasure but to get Fish From whence we may groundedly conclude that they used that Imploy for a Livelihood at times when they were not immediately imployed in Preaching the Gospel And we challenge thee to prove the contrary if thou canst Concerning thy querying for a Command for keeping the First Day of the Week or calling it the Lord's Day We say