Selected quad for the lemma: saint_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
saint_n	catholic_a	church_n	creed_n	1,395	5	10.7130	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A17962	A treatise, vvritten by M. doctor Carier, vvherein hee layeth downe sundry learned and pithy considerations by which he was moued, to forsake the Protestant congregation, and to betake himselfe to the Catholke Apostolike Roman Church. Agreeing verbatim with the written copye, addressed by the sayd doctor to the King his most excellent Maiestie.	Carier, Benjamin, 1566-1614.	1614 (1614)	STC 4623.5; ESTC S115898	33,947	58

with the light of the Gospell held in extreame ignorance are not yet so vncapable but they will be glad to heare of the truth when it shall be simply and euidently deliuered by honest men and then they will plainly see that their light of the Gospell which they so much talke of is but a counterfeit light in a Theeues lanterne whereby honest mens eyes is dazeled and their purses robbed And it will also appeare that there is not indeed any such irreconciliable opposition betwixt the Church of England and the Church of Rome as they that liue by the Schisine doe make the world beleeue there is neither in matter of Doctrine nor matter of State 21 For matter of Doctrine there is no reason that your Maiesty or the Kingdome should be molested or burthened for the maintenance of Caluinisme which is as much against the religion of England as it is against the religion of Rome and will by necessary consequence ouerthrow not only the Catholike Church the Communion of Saints and the forgiuenes of sins but also all the Articles of the Creed sauing only so much as the Turke himselfe will be content to beleeue which will be easie to proue vpon better leasure The Doctrine of England is that which is contained in the Common-prayer booke and Church Catechisme confirmed by Act of Parliament and by your Maiesties Edict wherein all English-men are Baptised and ought to be confirmed and therefore there is some reason that this should be stood vpon But this Doctrine in most of the maine points thereof as hath bin touched before and requireth a iust treatise to set downe in particular doth much differ from the current opinions and Catechismes of Caluinisme or doth very neere agree with or at least not contradict the Church of Rome if we list with patience to heare one another And those points of Doctrine wherm we are made to be at warres with the Church of Rome whether we will or not do rather argue the corruptions of that State from whēce they come then are argued by the grounds of that religion whereupon they stand and the contradiction of Doctrine hath followed the alteration of State and not the alteration of State bin grounded vpon any truth of Doctrine 22 For when the breach was resolued vpon for the personall and palticular ease of King HENRY the eight and the children of his latter wiues it was necessary to giue euery part of the Common-wealth contentment for which they might hold out in the heat of affection and studie to maintayne the breach otherwise it was likely that in the clearnesse of iudgement it would quickly haue growne together againe then the Authors therof must haue been excluded and giuen account of their practise 23 Therefore to the Lords and Fauorites of the Court were giuen the lands and inheritance of the Abbeyes and Religious houses that hauing once as it were washed their hands in the bowels and bloud of the Church both they and their posteritie might be at vtter defiance therewith And so hauing ouerthrowne and prophaned the good workes of the Saints it was necessarie for them to get them Chaplains that might both dispute preach and write against the merits of good Works the Invocation of Saints the sacrifice of the Altar praier for the Dead and all such points of Catholike doctrine as were the grounds of those churches and religious houses which they had ouerthrowne and prophaned And it was not hard for those Chaplains by some shew of Scripture to proue that which their Lords and their followers were so willing to beleeue 24 To the Commons was giuen great hope of reliefe for their poucrtie ease of Subsidies and of the burden of so great a Clergie and many other goodly gay Nothings And for the present they should haue libertie and the benefit of common law that is leaue to liue by such Lawes as themselues list to make and to contemne the authority of the Church which although it were for their benefit euery way yet because it crossed their affections like way ward children they could neuer abide it And was not this reason enough for them to hold out the breach and to studie Scripture themselues that they might be able to confute Confession Satisfaction Penance and to declaim against all that Tyrannie of the Church of Rome whereby themselues and their forefathers had beene kept in awe and obedience vnto God and their Kings 25 To the Clergy men that would turn with the times besides the possibilitie of present preferment by the alteration was giuen shortly after leaue to Marrie and to purchase and to enioy the profit and pleasure of the World as well as the Laitie And what carnall minded Monke or Priest would not with might and maine keepe open the breach after he was once plunged in it rather then be in danger to forgoe so pleasing a commoditie Hence did arise a necessitie of speaking and writing against Vowes Virginitie Pouertie Fasting Praying Watching Obedience and all that austeritie of life which is by the Lawes of the Church required in a Monasticall and Priestly conuersation 26 Vpon these conditions the Lords the Commons and the Clergie were content to beleeue that the King was supreme head of the Church of England not that they did thinke so indeede or that they desired to augment his authoritie but that they might be protected by him and freely enioy those commodities which they thought Schisme had brought vnto them and feared the vnitie of the Church might againe take from them Hence did arise a necessitie of inveighing against the Pope and the Church of Rome as against Antichrist and Babilon and the greatest Enemies of the state of England In so much that that Clergie man was most acceptable to them and in their opinion most worthie of prefermēts that could most confidently preach and write the most foule and monstruous assertions of the Pope and the Church of Rome though they were neuer so false These and such like are those temporall respects which would faine seeme the daughters of those doctrines which them selues haue brought forth and to bee diuided from the Catholike Church by doctrine when they themselues haue caused the doctrine of diuision 27 In all these and all other doctrine of diuision Men haue receiued great countenance encouragement from Geneua For although M. IOHN CALVIN were neuer any good Subiect or Friend to Bishop Duke or King yet he did so fit the Common people with new Doctrine that no Gospell can be so pleasing to them nor so lightsome as his For finding Geneua to be fallen out both with their Bishop who was their ancient Prince and their Duke to whom they pretended against their Bishop and to be all in a combustion among themselues for want of gouernment although he were then a stranger and a very yong man of some six and twenty or seuen and twenty yeares old at the most yet he thought good vpon the oportunity

soone downe and a storme vpon the sea which hauing raised the billowes to the height is nourished by the motion thereof and cannot settle againe in a long time But there is a time for all things And seuen yeares is a long time when a man is in the middest of his anger it pleaseth him not to be entreated by his neighbours much lesse by his seruants but when a man hath chidden and punished vntill he is wearie he will be content to heare his seruant speake reason And though he be not the wisest yet hee is the louingest seruant that will venter to speake to his Master in such a case God himselfe is exorable and it pleaseth him to be intreated by his seruants for his enemies I am perswaded there is no good Catholike in the world that can be your Maiesties enemie And therefore I doe assure my selfe that God will be pleased with you to heare them speake and not angrie with mee for mouing you thereunto And if your Maiestie doe but vouchsafe so much patience as to giue equall hearing I doubt not but you shall receiue such satisfaction as will giue you great quiet and contentment and disquiet none of your subiects but those onely that doe for their aduantage misinforme your Maiestie and mislead your people And if your Maiestie haue no such vse of the Schisme as King HENRY the eight and Queene ELIZABETH had and that it doth neither encrease your authoritie nor your wealth nor your honor but rather hinder them all and depriue you of that blessing which otherwise you might expect from Christ and his Church from your Catholike neighbour Princes and subiects and from the Saints in heauen in whose communion is the greatest comfort of euery Christian both in life and death then whatsoeuer some great Statesman may say to the contrarie I doe verily beleeue they doe but speake for themselues and that there is no true reason that may concerne your Maiestie to hinder you from admitting a toleration of Catholikes and Catholike Religion that those who cannot command their vnderstanding to thinke otherwise may finde the comfort they doe with so great zeale pursue in the vnitie of the Catholike Church amongst whom I confesse my selfe to be one that would thinke my selfe the happiest man in the world if I might vnderstand that your Maiestie were content that I should be so 38 But although your Maiestie sit at the sterne and command all yet you are caried in the same ship and it is not possible to weild so great a Vessell against winde and tide And therefore although it doe not concerne your Maiestie in your owne Estate yet if your Lords and your Commons and your Clergie doe reape any great benefit by the Schisme it will be very hard for your Maiestie to effect vnitie But if vpon due examination there be no such matter then it is but the crie of the passengers who for want of experience are afraid where there is no danger and that can be no hindrance to any course your Maiestie shall thinke to be best for the attaining of the Hauen 39 For mine owne part for the discharge of my dutie and conscience I haue considered of all their states and can resolue my selfe that I haue not preiudiced the state of any good subiect of yours but mine owne in comming to the Catholike Church And first for your Lords and Nobles It is true that many of their Ancestors were allowed a very good share in the diuision of the Church when the Schisme began and therefore it concerned them in reason of their State to maintaine the doctrine of Diuision But I thinke there are very few in England either Lords or other now possest of Abbey lands which haue not paid well for them and might not aswell possesse them in the vnitie of the Church as in the Schisme And there was a declaration made by the Pope to that purpose in Queene MARIES dayes so that there is now no need at all to preach against the merits of good Workes nor the vertue of the Sacraments nor the Inuocation of Saints nor the rest of Popery that built Churches vnlesse it be to helpe the Hugonots of France to pull them downe 40 But perhaps the Commons of England doe gaine so much by the Schisme as they cannot abide to heare of vnitie Indeed when the Puritan Preacher hath called his flocke about him and described the Church of Rome to be so ignorant so Idolatrous and so wicked as hee hath made himselfe beleeue she is then is he wont to congratulat his poore deceiued audience that they by the means of such good men as himselfe is are deliuered from the darkenesse and Idolatrie and wickednes of Poperie and there is no man dare say a word or once mutter to the contrarie But the people haue heard these lyes so long as most of them beginne to bee wearie and the wisest of them cannot but wonder how these Puritan Preachers should become more learned and more honest then all the rest that liued in ancient times or that liue still in Catholike Countries or then those in England whom th●se men are wont to condemne for Papists Neuerthelesse I confesse there bee many honest Men and Women amongst them that being caried away with preiudice pretext of Scriptures doe follow these Preachers more of zeale and deuotion to the truth as my selfe did vntill I knew it was but counterfeit And these good people if they might be so happy as to heare Catholikes answere for themselues and tell them the truth would be the most deuout Catholikes of all other But the most of the people were neuer led by Sermons if they were the Catholike Church is both able and willing to supply them farre better then the Schisme But it was an opinion of wealth and libertie which made them breake at the first and if they doe duely consider of it they are neuer the better for either of both but much the worse 41 For wealth the Puritan vnthrift that lookes for the ouerthrow of Bishops and Churches Cathedrall hopes to haue his share in them if rhey would fall once and therefore he cannot choose but desire to encrease the Schisme that he may gaine by it but the honest Protestant that can endure the State of the Church of England as it is could be content it were as it was for he should receiue more benefit by it euery way The poore Gentleman and Yeoman that are burthened with many children may remember that in Catholike times the Church would haue receiued and prouided for many of their sonnes and daughters so as themselues might haue liued and died in the seruice of God without posteritie and haue helped to maintaine the rest of their families which was so great a benefit to the Common-wealth both for the exoneration and prouision thereof as no humane policie can procure the like The Farmer and Husband-man who laboureth hard to discharge his payments and hath little

can do nothing but preach the Word as they call it which Lay-men must iudge of and may preach to if they will where occasion serues if the studie and knowledge of Antiquity Vniuersalitie and Consent be not necessarie but euery man may expound Scripture as his owne spirit shall moue him if I say these and such like opinions be as true as they are among the Caluinists in the world common and in England too much fauoured and maintained there will certainly appeare no reason at all vnto your Parliament whensoeuer your Maiestie or your Successor shall please to aske them why they should be at so great a charge as they are to maintaine so needlesse a partie as these opinions doe make the Clergie to be They can haue a great many more Sermons a great deale better cheape and in the opinion of Caluinisme the Clergie doe no other seruice They that doe in England fauour and maintaine those opinions and suppresse and disgrace those that doe confute them they although themselues can be content to be Lords and to goe in Rochets are indeed the greatest enemies of the Clergie And it were no great matter for the Clergie they might easily turne Lay and liue as well as they doe for the most part But it is a thing full of compassion and commiseration to see that by these false and wicked opinions the Diuell the father of these and all other lies doth daily take possession of the soules of your subiects both of Clergie and Laytie These kinde of Clergie men I confesse I doe not desire to satisfie any other way then as I haue alwaies done that is by the most friendly and plaine confutation of their errors to shew them the truth As for other Clergie men that are conformable to the Religion established by law as well for their Doctrine as for their Discipline if they be good schollers and temperate men as I know many of them are they cannot but in their iudgements approue the truth of Catholike Religion and if it were not for feare of losse or disgrace to their wiues and children they would be as glad as my selfe that a more temperate course might be held and more libertie afforded vnto Catholikes and Catholike Religion in England These Clergie men I am and euer shall be desirous to satisfie not only in respect of themselues but also in respect of their wiues and children whom I am so far from condemning and misliking as that I do account my selfe one of them and I desire nothing more in this world then in the toleration of Catholike Religion to liue and die among them And therefore I haue had so great care in this point as before I did submit my selfe to the Catholike Church I receiued assurance from some of the greatest that if your Maiestie would admit the ancient subordination of the Church of Canterburie vnto that Mother Church by whose authoritie all other Churches in England at the first were and still are subordinate vnto Canterburie and the first free vse of that Sacrament for which especially all the Churches in Christendome were first founded The Pope for his part would confirme the Interest of all these that haue present possession in any Ecclesiasticall liuing in England And would also permit the free vse of the Common-prayer book in English for Morning and Euening prayer with very little or no alteration And for the contentment and securitie of your Maiestie he would giue you not only any satisfaction but all the honor that with the vnitie of the Church and the safetie of Catholike religion may be required which seemed to me so reasonable as being before satisfied for the truth of Catholike Religion I could aske no more So that I am verily perswaded that by yeelding to that truth which I could not deny I haue neither neglected my duetie and seruice to your Maiestie and your Children nor my respect and honor to your Lords and Commons nor my loue and kindnesse to my honest friends and brethren of the Clergie but rather that my example and my prayers shall doe good vnto all 46 But that which I must trust to when all the rest will faile me is the seruice of God and the sauing of my soule in the vnitie of that Church which was founded by Christ himselfe and shall continue vntill his comming againe wherein all the Saints of God haue serued him on earth and doe enioy him in heauen without which Catholike Church there is no communion of Saints no forgiuenesse of sinnes no hope of resurrection vnto life euerlasting I beseech your Maiestie let not CALVINS Ecclesia Predestinatorus deceiue you it may serue a Turke as well as a Christian it hath no Faith but opinion no Hope but presumption no Charitie but lust no Faith but a fancie no God but an Idoll For Deus est omnibus Religionibus commune Nomen Aug. Ep. All Religions in the world beginne their Creede with I beleeue in God But homini extra Ecclesiani Relligio sua est culius phantasmatum suorum and error suus est Deus suus as S. AVGVSTINE affirmeth 48 I haue more things to write but the hast of answering your Maiesties commandement signified to mee by Sir THOMAS LAKE his Letters haue made mee commit many faults in writing this very sodainly for which I craue pardon and cut off the rest But for my returning into England I can answere no otherwise but thus I haue sent you my SOVLE in this Treatise and if it may finde entertainment and passage my BODIE shall most gladly follow after And if not I pray God I send my Soule to heauen and my Bodie to the graue assoone as may be In the meane time I will reioyce in nothing but only in the Crosse of CHRIST which is the glorie of your Crowne And therefore I will triumph therein not as being gone from you to your Aduetsarie but as being gone before you to your Mother where I desire and hope for euer to continue Your Maiesties true seruant and Beadsman B. CARIER Liege Decemb. 12. An. 1613. PSAL. 119. VERS 5. 6. Multum incola fuit anima mea Cum bis qui oderunt pacem eram pacificus cùm loquebar illis impugnabant me gratis Pac. 17. 19. Luc. 15. 4. Heb 15. 25 Psa. 83. 12.