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saint_n body_n church_n mystical_a 1,460 5 10.3110 5 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A11509 An apology, or, apologiticall answere, made by Father Paule a Venetian, of the order of Serui, vnto the exceptions and obiections of Cardinall Bellarmine, against certaine treatises and resolutions of Iohn Gerson, concerning the force and validitie of excommunication. First published in Italian, and now translated into English. Seene and allowed by publicke authoritie; Apologia per le oppositioni fatte dall' illustrissimo & reverendissimo signor cardinale Bellarminio alli trattati, et risolutioni di Gio. Gersone. English Sarpi, Paolo, 1552-1623. 1607 (1607) STC 21757; ESTC S116732 122,825 141

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but_o in_o the_o bull_n itself_o it_o be_v not_o say_v so_o it_o be_v true_a that_o it_o prohibit_v such_o appeal_n but_o the_o reason_n be_v because_o they_o have_v reference_n to_o that_o which_o be_v not_o and_o of_o which_o there_o be_v no_o certainty_n when_o it_o shall_v be_v in_o the_o mean_a time_n the_o poor_a be_v oppress_v by_o the_o mighty_a offence_n remain_v unpunished_a rebellion_n be_v foster_v against_o the_o first_o sea_n it_o be_v free_a for_o every_o one_o to_o offend_v all_o ecclesiastical_a discipline_n and_o hierarchicall_a order_n be_v confound_v where_o you_o may_v perceive_v that_o pius_n 2._o do_v not_o allege_v his_o superiority_n for_o a_o reason_n which_o have_v be_v a_o evident_a and_o pregnant_a argument_n because_o there_o be_v no_o appeal_n but_o to_o a_o superior_a let_v no_o man_n reply_v that_o though_o it_o be_v not_o express_v yet_o it_o may_v be_v collect_v out_o of_o those_o word_n for_o there_o be_v no_o likelihood_n that_o he_o will_v so_o 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peter_n aut_fw-la soluerit_fw-la aut_fw-la liga_fw-la verit_fw-la which_o last_o word_n i_o have_v put_v down_o in_o latin_a as_o loath_a to_o restrain_v they_o to_o either_o of_o their_o two_o signification_n in_o which_o respect_n i_o hold_v it_o yet_o better_a to_o recite_v it_o all_o in_o latin_a manet_fw-la ergo_fw-la petri_n privilegium_fw-la ubicunque_fw-la ex_fw-la ipsius_fw-la fertur_fw-la aequitate_fw-la iudicium_fw-la nec_fw-la nimia_fw-la est_fw-la vel_fw-la severitas_fw-la vel_fw-la remissio_fw-la ubi_fw-la nihil_fw-la erit_fw-la ligatum_fw-la nihil_fw-la solutum_fw-la nisi_fw-la quod_fw-la beatus_fw-la petrus_n aut_fw-la soluerit_fw-la aut_fw-la ligaverit_fw-la and_o s._n gelasius_n a_o predecessor_n of_o s._n gregory_n some_o 15_o papanties_n say_v i_o will_v quote_v his_o own_o word_n in_o latin_a that_o no_o exception_n may_v be_v take_v to_o their_o translation_n cui_fw-la est_fw-la illata_fw-la
the_o family_n over_o he_o saint_n cyprian_n say_v that_o the_o supreme_a power_n of_o choose_v such_o priest_n as_o be_v worthy_a and_o refuse_v unworthy_a do_v principal_o rest_v in_o the_o people_n and_o if_o the_o author_n will_v read_v the_o place_n he_o shall_v perceive_v that_o he_o speak_v of_o bishop_n particular_o though_o in_o the_o word_n allege_v he_o mention_v priest_n and_o withal_o that_o it_o be_v not_o only_a cyprian_n epistle_n but_o the_o epistle_n of_o 36._o bishop_n and_o write_v to_o the_o common_a people_n of_o leon_n asturia_n and_o emerita_n and_o if_o he_o will_v let_v he_o read_v the_o 14._o epistle_n of_o the_o 3._o book_n such_o authority_n as_o these_o we_o ought_v to_o allege_v for_o the_o maintenance_n of_o our_o cause_n and_o not_o come_v in_o with_o such_o mystical_a and_o those_o enforce_a explication_n as_o the_o author_n do_v in_o this_o place_n where_o if_o he_o have_v be_v dispose_v to_o deal_v sincere_o he_o shall_v have_v allege_v that_o place_n of_o saint_n luke_n entire_o quis_fw-la putat_fw-la est_fw-la fidelis_fw-la dispensator_fw-la &_o prudens_fw-la quem_fw-la constituit_fw-la dominus_fw-la super_fw-la familiam_fw-la svam_fw-la ut_fw-la det_fw-la illis_fw-la in_o tempore_fw-la tritici_fw-la mensuram_fw-la and_o than_o it_o make_v against_o the_o author_n for_o this_o servant_n can_v be_v a_o general_a dispen●er_n of_o all_o the_o lord_n treasure_n to_o who_o he_o have_v commit_v nothing_o save_v only_o the_o distribution_n of_o the_o corn_n there_o be_v many_o other_o thing_n to_o be_v distribute_v as_o meat_n drink_n and_o apparel_n all_o which_o his_o lord_n will_v commit_v unto_o he_o if_o he_o behave_v himself_o faithful_o in_o this_o particular_a office_n for_o thus_o he_o say_v beatus_fw-la ille_fw-la seruus_fw-la quem_fw-la cum_fw-la venerit_fw-la dominus_fw-la invenerit_fw-la ita_fw-la facientem_fw-la veer_fw-la dico_fw-la vobis_fw-la quoniam_fw-la super_fw-la omne_fw-la quae_fw-la possidet_fw-la constituet_fw-la illum_fw-la let_v he_o read_v the_o place_n and_o see_v whether_o it_o can_v receive_v any_o other_o interpretation_n if_o either_o the_o pope_n or_o any_o other_o to_o who_o the_o charge_n of_o all_o thing_n be_v already_o commit_v be_v that_o faithful_a steward_n what_o be_v those_o other_o thing_n which_o shall_v afterwards_o be_v commit_v unto_o he_o for_o have_v so_o well_o discharge_v his_o duty_n in_o this_o administration_n if_o the_o author_n will_v say_v that_o we_o be_v to_o understand_v those_o word_n of_o the_o celestial_a paradise_n we_o must_v answer_v that_o the_o charge_n thereof_o be_v peculiar_a to_o christ_n and_o the_o angel_n the_o holy_a pope_n enter_v into_o the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n receive_v from_o god_n a_o reward_n of_o their_o labour_n but_o their_o government_n they_o leave_v behind_o they_o and_o be_v for_o ever_o exempt_v from_o labour_n as_o for_o the_o word_n that_o follow_v quod_fw-la si_fw-la dixerit_fw-la seruus_fw-la ille_fw-la in_o cord_n svo_fw-la etc._n etc._n from_o whence_o the_o author_n will_v gather_v that_o if_o god_n high_a steward_n do_v misbehave_v himself_o he_o reserve_v the_o punishment_n of_o he_o to_o himself_o and_o will_v not_o impart_v it_o to_o his_o family_n i_o answer_v that_o the_o consequence_n do_v not_o hold_v in_o all_o steward_n neither_o can_v the_o example_n which_o he_o bring_v of_o a_o vice_n roy_fw-fr avail_n he_o to_o this_o purpose_n it_o be_v one_o thing_n when_o the_o father_n of_o a_o family_n be_v absolute_a lord_n of_o it_o do_v commit_v the_o government_n to_o another_o but_o if_o the_o father_n of_o the_o family_n shall_v give_v leave_n to_o his_o family_n to_o choose_v they_o a_o governor_n with_o such_o and_o so_o great_a authority_n over_o their_o master_n treasure_n as_o he_o himself_o shall_v set_v down_o it_o be_v a_o case_n of_o far_o different_a consideration_n in_o like_a sort_n different_a it_o be_v when_o a_o king_n who_o have_v no_o dependence_n of_o his_o kingdom_n shall_v constitute_v a_o viceroy_n and_o when_o he_o give_v leave_v to_o his_o subject_n to_o choose_v they_o one_o with_o such_o authority_n as_o he_o himself_o shall_v prescribe_v for_o in_o the_o first_o case_n i_o acknowledge_v that_o the_o family_n have_v no_o power_n over_o their_o governor_n nor_o the_o subject_n over_o the_o viceroy_n but_o in_o the_o 2._o case_n as_o the_o family_n have_v power_n to_o institute_v he_o so_o have_v it_o also_o power_n to_o censure_v his_o action_n and_o the_o subject_n in_o like_a sort_n the_o action_n of_o the_o viceroy_n and_o as_o the_o cardinal_n bellarmine_n say_v that_o the_o authority_n which_o the_o church_n have_v of_o choose_v the_o pope_n be_v nothing_o else_o but_o a_o apply_v of_o the_o power_n to_o the_o person_n so_o gerson_n in_o his_o book_n which_o he_o write_v upon_o this_o occasion_n say_v that_o when_o the_o church_n do_v judge_v the_o pope_n it_o do_v no_o more_o but_o separate_v the_o power_n from_o that_o person_n if_o christ_n have_v so_o institute_v the_o pope_n as_o it_o shall_v have_v be_v in_o their_o power_n to_o appoint_v their_o successor_n peradventure_o that_o may_v have_v follow_v which_o the_o author_n will_v infer_v that_o the_o church_n shall_v have_v no_o power_n over_o the_o pope_n but_o he_o which_o affirm_v that_o god_n have_v give_v power_n to_o the_o church_n to_o annexe_v power_n to_o the_o person_n shall_v also_o have_v show_v that_o it_o have_v not_o the_o self_n same_o authority_n to_o remove_v it_o but_o the_o common_a doctrine_n that_o the_o pope_n have_v no_o authority_n of_o elect_v a_o successor_n do_v evedent_o declare_v that_o he_o be_v not_o a_o governor_n of_o the_o first_o sort_n depute_v immediate_o from_o the_o father_n of_o the_o family_n but_o of_o the_o second_o elect_v of_o the_o family_n by_o the_o father_n appointment_n and_o with_o this_o doctrine_n do_v gerson_n answer_v that_o of_o pasce_fw-la oves_fw-la meas_fw-la and_o all_o other_o place_n of_o scripture_n like_o unto_o it_o namely_o that_o although_o he_o which_o be_v by_o the_o owner_n appoint_v to_o be_v over_o the_o flock_n be_v not_o subject_a to_o the_o flock_n yet_o if_o it_o be_v such_o a_o flock_n as_o have_v power_n to_o choose_v a_o shepherd_n the_o shepherd_n when_o he_o be_v choose_v shall_v be_v subject_a unto_o it_o the_o faithful_a flock_n of_o christ_n ought_v to_o resemble_v sheep_n in_o humbleness_n and_o innocence_n yet_o ought_v they_o not_o to_o be_v so_o sheepish_a or_o foolish_a as_o to_o forgo_v the_o authority_n which_o their_o owner_n have_v bestow_v upon_o they_o either_o of_o choose_v they_o a_o good_a shepherd_n or_o of_o judge_v a_o wicked_a saint_n augustine_n do_v prove_v with_o reason_n unanswerable_a that_o doctrine_n be_v to_o be_v ground_v only_o upon_o the_o literal_a sense_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o not_o upon_o any_o mystical_a interpretation_n whosoever_o will_v read_v all_o that_o chapter_n shall_v easy_o understand_v the_o meaning_n of_o our_o saviour_n and_o the_o literal_a sense_n of_o the_o gospel_n he_o speak_v to_o his_o disciple_n and_o consequent_o to_o all_o christian_n beginning_n at_o those_o word_n about_o the_o middle_n of_o the_o chapter_n dixitque_fw-la ad_fw-la discipulos_fw-la suos_fw-la that_o they_o shall_v not_o take_v think_v for_o the_o thing_n of_o this_o world_n because_o god_n have_v prepare_v another_o kingdom_n for_o they_o that_o they_o shall_v be_v watchful_a in_o well_o do_v as_o not_o know_v when_o the_o lord_n will_v call_v that_o if_o the_o goodman_n of_o the_o house_n know_v at_o what_o hour_n the_o thief_n will_v come_v he_o shall_v find_v he_o watch_v in_o like_a sort_n they_o shall_v be_v prepare_v because_o christ_n will_v come_v at_o a_o hour_n when_o we_o think_v not_o then_o peter_n say_v unto_o he_o master_n tell_v thou_o this_o parable_n to_o we_o or_o even_o to_o all_o christ_n reply_v who_o think_v thou_o be_v that_o dispensator_fw-la fidelis_fw-la &_o prudens_fw-la etc._n etc._n infer_v thereby_o that_o he_o speak_v to_o all_o whereas_o if_o it_o have_v be_v speak_v only_o to_o his_o vicar_n it_o will_v follow_v that_o the_o commandment_n of_o watch_v of_o not_o regard_v the_o thing_n of_o this_o world_n of_o wait_v for_o the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n and_o the_o unexpected_a come_n of_o christ_n shall_v have_v be_v give_v to_o he_o alone_o but_o because_o such_o commandment_n as_o these_o be_v equal_o give_v to_o all_o the_o faithful_a the_o literal_a meaning_n be_v that_o they_o all_o be_v these_o faithful_a steward_n which_o god_n have_v command_v to_o exercise_v their_o charity_n by_o impart_v their_o good_n and_o other_o ability_n which_o god_n have_v bestow_v upon_o they_o to_o the_o rest_n of_o his_o family_n this_o be_v that_o measure_n of_o wheat_n and_o that_o office_n for_o the_o faithful_a administration_n whereof_o god_n will_v multiply_v his_o blessing_n upon_o they_o this_o then_o as_o all_o interpreter_n
give_v he_o the_o seat_n etc._n etc._n and_o he_o shall_v reign_v for_o ever_o this_o be_v that_o you_o choose_v not_o i_o but_o i_o choose_v you_o this_o be_v the_o kingdom_n in_o the_o apocalips_n and_o thou_o have_v make_v we_o to_o our_o god_n a_o kingdom_n this_o christ_n be_v the_o father_n of_o the_o family_n who_o be_v owner_n of_o it_o and_o it_o his_o child_n and_o servant_n which_o for_o that_o it_o be_v compose_v of_o visible_a man_n the_o father_n himself_o will_v that_o it_o shall_v be_v govern_v also_o by_o a_o man_n visible_a and_o have_v appoint_v the_o authority_n which_o he_o shall_v have_v and_o institute_v one_o of_o they_o before_o the_o church_n be_v found_v but_o for_o the_o residue_n of_o time_n after_o it_o be_v found_v have_v leave_v on_o earth_n the_o power_n to_o choose_v a_o successor_n now_o with_o this_o doctrine_n which_o i_o be_o assure_v the_o author_n will_v admit_v yea_o rather_o will_v say_v that_o without_o it_o no_o man_n be_v catholic_a the_o reason_n be_v answer_v that_o the_o church_n be_v not_o a_o commonwealth_n as_o venice_n or_o as_o geneva_n which_o give_v as_o much_o authority_n as_o themselves_o please_v to_o their_o duke_n nor_o a_o kingdom_n which_o may_v change_v the_o manner_n of_o govern_v it_o neither_o invisible_o nor_o visible_o because_o that_o christ_n have_v prescribe_v the_o manner_n much_o less_o be_v it_o such_o a_o kingdom_n as_o france_n which_o have_v a_o blood_n royal_a where_o the_o king_n succeed_v by_o birth_n neither_o as_o some_o other_o by_o testament_n but_o as_o touch_v the_o inward_a government_n and_o mere_o spiritual_a it_o be_v not_o like_a unto_o any_o because_o it_o have_v a_o perpetual_a and_o immortal_a king_n in_o the_o visible_a government_n it_o have_v a_o minister_n as_o concern_v his_o authority_n institute_v by_o christ_n and_o undepend_v of_o the_o church_n as_o concern_v the_o application_n of_o the_o authority_n to_o the_o person_n elective_a and_o depend_v of_o it_o wherefore_o when_o he_o allege_v and_o i_o be_o constitute_v a_o king_n by_o he_o our_o lord_n god_n shall_v give_v he_o you_o choose_v not_o i_o thou_o have_v make_v we_o to_o our_o god_n a_o kingdom_n all_o these_o place_n and_o such_o like_o other_o be_v mean_v of_o the_o invisible_a kingdom_n the_o spiritual_a interior_a where_o the_o pope_n have_v no_o government_n at_o all_o but_o only_o the_o saviour_n which_o know_v the_o heart_n and_o can_v inflowe_v into_o they_o and_o bestow_v on_o they_o the_o grace_n and_o gift_n whereby_o they_o be_v make_v citizen_n of_o the_o heavenly_a jerusalem_n christ_n also_o be_v that_o father_n of_o the_o family_n which_o depend_v not_o of_o it_o the_o high_a bishop_n be_v a_o servant_n ●et_o over_o the_o family_n by_o the_o father_n thereof_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o authority_n but_o which_o the_o family_n itself_o have_v place_v over_o itself_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o election_n of_o the_o person_n so_o as_o touch_v the_o authority_n it_o be_v from_o christ_n as_o touch_v the_o application_n it_o be_v from_o the_o church_n but_o the_o author_n make_v the_o church_n a_o family_n depend_v of_o the_o father_n who_o he_o acknowledge_v to_o be_v christ_n and_o this_o be_v settle_v he_o conclude_v that_o the_o father_n do_v not_o depend_v of_o the_o family_n nor_o have_v his_o authority_n from_o it_o therefore_o the_o pope_n can_v be_v subject_a to_o the_o church_n and_o pass_v from_o the_o father_n of_o the_o family_n which_o be_v christ_n to_o the_o steward_n elect_v by_o the_o family_n itself_o which_o be_v the_o pope_n let_v he_o stand_v firm_a in_o the_o similitude_n for_o he_o shall_v never_o find_v in_o the_o gospel_n that_o any_o other_o be_v call_v father_n of_o the_o family_n but_o god_n the_o father_n or_o else_o christ_n his_o son_n by_o nature_n the_o minister_n be_v a_o servant_n it_o be_v not_o fit_a to_o attribute_v the_o propriety_n of_o god_n to_o another_o for_o which_o cause_n the_o example_n serve_v meruailous_o for_o gerson_n as_o also_o the_o example_n which_o the_o author_n bring_v of_o a_o viceroy_n be_v much_o for_o the_o same_o purpose_n if_o a_o king_n of_o france_n as_o s_o lewis_n the_o 9_o shall_v go_v to_o the_o conquest_n of_o the_o holy_a land_n &_o shall_v say_v to_o the_o kingdom_n i_o leave_v you_o my_o cousin_n for_o viceroy_n with_o authority_n to_o administer_v justice_n but_o not_o to_o make_v law_n not_o to_o assemble_v the_o state_n etc._n etc._n and_o in_o case_n he_o happen_v to_o fail_v choose_v you_o another_o in_o his_o place_n with_o the_o same_o authority_n the_o authority_n of_o the_o elect_a shall_v be_v from_o the_o king_n and_o master_n the_o person_n which_o the_o kingdom_n shall_v choose_v shall_v be_v subject_a to_o the_o kingdom_n this_o be_v that_o which_o gerson_n teach_v throughout_o all_o his_o work_n where_o it_o be_v see_v that_o very_o the_o force_n of_o the_o reason_n conclude_v for_o he_o out_o of_o the_o thing_n abovesaid_a i_o will_v not_o conclude_v that_o the_o opinion_n of_o gerson_n in_o this_o point_n of_o the_o supreme_a power_n ecclesiastical_a either_o be_v true_a or_o be_v false_a but_o only_o that_o the_o author_n conclusion_n that_o gerson_n be_v deceive_v and_o that_o he_o be_v deceive_v that_o do_v follow_v he_o and_o go_v contrary_a to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n of_o the_o sacred_a counsel_n and_o of_o manifest_a reason_n have_v need_n of_o other_o proof_n than_o those_o abovesaide_a the_o author_n proceed_v bellarmine_n bellarmine_n and_o if_o he_o shall_v say_v that_o which_o gerson_n himself_o wont_v to_o say_v that_o it_o be_v write_v in_o saint_n matthew_n in_o the_o 18._o chapter_n tell_v the_o church_n and_o if_o he_o will_v not_o hear_v the_o church_n let_v he_o be_v to_o thou_o as_o the_o heathen_a and_o the_o publican_n i_o will_v answer_v that_o in_o that_o place_n by_o the_o church_n be_v mean_v the_o prelate_n who_o be_v the_o head_n of_o the_o church_n and_o so_o do_v saint_n john_n chrysostom_n expound_v it_o homilia_fw-la 61._o in_o matthew_n and_o pope_n innocent_a 3._o cap._n novit_fw-la de_fw-la iudiciis_fw-la and_o so_o do_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n of_o all_o the_o world_n and_o of_o all_o time_n declare_v that_o he_o who_o will_v denounce_v a_o sinner_n to_o the_o church_n and_o observe_v this_o precept_n do_v not_o assemble_v a_o council_n but_o have_v recourse_n to_o the_o bishop_n or_o to_o his_o vicar_n it_o be_v not_o sufficient_a to_o the_o author_n to_o have_v dispute_v with_o gerson_n but_o he_o also_o give_v solution_n to_o his_o reason_n but_o in_o this_o place_n of_o many_o which_o gerson_n bring_v and_o deduce_v paolo_n friar_n paolo_n the_o author_n content_v himself_o to_o produce_v one_o only_o and_o to_o dissolve_v it_o and_o this_o be_v take_v from_o the_o authority_n of_o saint_n matthew_n tell_v the_o church_n unto_o which_o he_o answer_v the_o church_n that_o be_v the_o prelate_n and_o of_o this_o exposition_n he_o make_v chrysostome_n the_o author_n although_o the_o parisian_n say_v that_o chrysostom_n do_v not_o say_v so_o but_o it_o seem_v when_o a_o thing_n be_v accustom_v to_o be_v allege_v every_o man_n allege_v it_o without_o once_o view_v it_o chrysostome_n expound_v tell_v the_o church_n namely_o the_o bishop_n and_o praefident_n this_o be_v that_o which_o gerson_n say_v to_o the_o church_n representative_o because_o it_o be_v not_o possible_a to_o assemble_v the_o whole_a it_o be_v come_v represent_v by_o the_o assembly_n of_o bishop_n and_o precedent_n and_o therefore_o they_o add_v that_o under_o the_o name_n of_o the_o church_n their_o can_v be_v mean_v one_o person_n for_o in_o vain_a shall_v that_o ensue_v if_o two_o of_o you_o shall_v consent_v upon_o earth_n concern_v every_o thing_n whatsoever_o they_o shall_v ask_v it_o shall_v be_v do_v to_o they_o of_o my_o father_n which_o be_v in_o heaven_n for_o where_o there_o be_v two_o or_o three_o gather_v in_o my_o name_n there_o be_o i_o in_o the_o midst_n of_o they_o and_o for_o confirmation_n of_o this_o sense_n they_o bring_v that_o saint_n paul_n who_o receive_v the_o information_n against_o the_o incestuous_a there_o be_v plain_o hear_v fornication_n among_o you_o etc._n etc._n it_o follow_v i_o indeed_o absent_a in_o body_n but_o present_a in_o spirit_n have_v already_o judge_v as_o present_v he_o that_o have_v so_o do_v in_o the_o name_n of_o our_o lord_n jesus_n christ_n you_o be_v gather_v together_o and_o my_o spirit_n with_o the_o virtue_n of_o our_o lord_n jesus_n to_o deliver_v such_o a_o one_o to_o satan_n where_o they_o note_v that_o saint_n paul_n who_o be_v then_o in_o philippi_n do_v not_o write_v by_o his_o brief_n i_o excomunicate_v such_o a_o one_o but_o write_v to_o the_o church_n that_o be_v