Selected quad for the lemma: saint_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
saint_n	bishop_n	peter_n	succession_n	1,339	5	9.9497	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A13707	The trying out of the truth begunn and prosequuted in certayn letters and passages between Iohn Aynsworth and Henry Aynsworth; the one pleading for, the other against the present religion of the Church of Rome. The chief things to be handled, are. 1. Of Gods word and Scriptures, whither they be a sufficient rule of our faith. 2. Of the Scriptures expounded by the Church; and of unwritten traditions. 3. Of the Church of Rome, whither it be the true Catholike Church, and her sentence to be received, as the certayn truth.	Ainsworth, John, fl. 1609-1613.; Ainsworth, Henry, 1571-1622? aut	1615 (1615)	STC 240; ESTC S100498	226,493	192

It is sayd to be full of ba●iy And the 1. ●●eg 7. 15. It is sayd that the bra●en pillars were thirty eight cubi●●● in length and yer 2. Parall 3. 19. but thirty five Math. 1. 8. It is sayd that Joram bega● Qzia● but in the 4. book of the Kings which the Protestants call the second it is written that Joram was father to Ochozias Ochoizas to Joas Joas to Ama●●●s not Joram to Ozias otherwise called Azarias Mat. 1. 3 16. Joseph is called Jacob wheras S. Luk. 3. 23 nameth him 〈◊〉 Mat 10 10. the Apostles sent to pr●ach are forbidden to have a ●reffe in their ●a●ds and yet S. Mark 6 8 ba● them take onely a staffe or rod in their hand Mat. 26 34 and Luk. 22 34. sayth that before the cock did crow Peter should deny him thrice but S. Marke the 14. 30. sayth Christs words were Before the cock shall crowe twise thou shalt thris● deny me Mar 15 25. ●ayth our Saviour was crucified at the third howre but S. John 19 14 saith it was about the sixt houre before he was condenmed by P●●ate So that you see the comparing of place onely with place often times may bring a poore man into a maze or circle except he adde to this the authoritie of the Church and the holy Fathers and the learned Doctors exposition by whose helpe all these seeming contrad●●tions will easily be salved Now wheras you may answer that these difficults are in matters of fact and not of doctrine so it much imports not whither a man reconcil●s these places or no I graunt the first but I deny the sequ●●● For since you teach that al difficults of scripture may be helped by comparing of one place with another now when as ignorant men shall folow this your rule as an unfallible guide when they see themselves ledd by it vnto a contradiction they doe not onely begin to cal into question this but al other things conteyned in the scriptures seing the self same truth affirming the little as well as the great and as much abhorring from cōtradiction of a litle matter as of a great The second braunch of my antecedent which I bring is that holy scriptures hath many senses litterall and spirituall yea and often many senses literrall and many senses spirituall All this you deny wonder that I doe not prove it I answer that no disputant useth to prove como●m●●●mes and principles and we use not to prove cōmon 〈◊〉 at most Protestants allow of viz. of a litterall and a spirituall sense the l●s● wherof they divide into three members into an all g●ricell tropological anagogicall sense yea and not without great cause they allow of this since D. August lib. 11. confess cap. 26 et lib. 11. De ●●●●tate Dei c. 19. sayth also that the scripture often ha● many litterall senses But you against the holy fathers held that it hath onely one sense but as you answer appliable to diverse places times and persons Here I wonder that you should be so considētly hoveld with your own conc●●t and so caried away with your privat spirit that you see not that which to most manifest But even as a pigeon that is seeled in your soaring spirit you see onely the way at length to your own downfall though in your conceit you ascend bolt upright for a season But that the scripture hath many senses we leave as proved and if to prove fitter for another place Now it sufficeth for this place to show that which you graunt to sufficient to prove the second part of my antecedent For if that one sense hath reference to diverse tymes places and persons it must needes be very difficult require some common help besides themselves to obtaine their severall true expositions nay here me thinks you graunt that the scriptures hath diverse senses since you graunt diverse as it were formalities of senses respecting divers places tymes and persons Here also in prosecuting of this point you seem to mistake our doctrine For we hold that neyther Apostle or the Pope have domintō over our faith or authoritie to institut Sacraments of themselves neyther can they make what they will as a matter of faith or tradition But it must be received tyme out of mynde by the vniform cōsent of that Church which hath kept her pe●petuall succession of Bishops from S. Peter and then S Aug. in epist. 118. will teach you that insolentissimae infaniae est existimare non certe fieri quod ab vniversa ecclesia fit that it is a most insolent madness to think that it should not be right that the whole church doth teach Besides the Pope doth not make a matter of faith but declareth onely that such and such a thing is to be beleeved and that by the inspiration of Almighty God guiding him as he is the head of the church Neyther dooth he for all this omitt to use all humane helpes of counsell and consultatiō with the learned that though as he is head of the church he hath a promise frō Almighty stil to assist him yet in that he might not seeme to presume in omitting the vse of naturall and prudentiall helpes and meanes he vseth all diligent ser●tinp therein The place of 15. of the Acts which you examine of mine where I lay that in the counsel held at Hierusalem all was concluded with this of S. Peter the head It seemed good to the holy Ghost and to us This I sayd and still averr makes much against you For here the Apostles to end the controversy in hand trusted not their own several spirits but to a mature deliberation and counsell where S. Peter was h●ad and vin●eere though he vsed an Apostolicall inguisition and therfore it is noted in the 7. verse that Peter role up showing thereby that he was head and had the preemine●ce of place first to speak noting also his priviledge that the first Gentills were chosen by his mou●h though S. Paul was design●d to convert them Now unto that which you 〈◊〉 that verse 13. and 14. S. James 〈◊〉 stan●● all and that hence we might rather hold him head of the Church I answer that doth not hence folow in that S. James in that he was an Apostle and Bishop of Hierusalē gave his sentence nert For surely S. Paul and S. Barnabas also spake though their speach is interposed for the better declaration of the question to be decided and for the greater confirmation of S. Peters sentence And though S. James sayd in his speach I judge he doth not meane thereby that he gave the principal definitive sentence since he and all the rest followed and seconded by their suff●ages the decision of S. Peter as it is plaine in the text The whole assembly for reverence of his person and approbation of his sentence holding their peace The which S. Hier●m affirmeth saying all the multitude held their peace and into his sentence James the Apostle

know that of old dayes God amongst us chose that the Gentils by my mouth should heare the word of the Gospel and beleeve In which chapter first we may note by the way verse 6. that the Apostles and auncients assembled to consider of this word which place ●ōfutes your proceedings that would have all men to give their voice and to be present in Councel which is the place of the Apostles and auncients and not of many others though holie men that were at Jerusalem according to that of Deut. 17. Malach. 2. Agge 1 2 Lur. 10. 16. where the sentence of the Preist is sayd to settle that which is hard difficult doubtful must keep the law must be heard as God 73. 2. I note the 7. verse that when there was made a great disputation ech partie producing his reasons and arguments for their assertion S. Peter rising up and speaking by his authoritie composed that great disputation that is settled the height of their differēce which argues superioritie For what decorum or manners were it if two Doctors of like authoritie disputing the third of the same or of lesse authoritie as Calvin would have should stop the current of their disputation when it touched the point of the difficultie when there was a great disputation when their reasons as the text both not obscurely note were in aequi librio unsettled whē there was made a great disputation So that we see it is a signe of great authority to speak so first as to interrupt the great disputation to prefixe an end to firme a definition to the proposed question 74. As for that which you object out of the 13. and 19. verse frō that of S. James giving sentence from the scriptures sh●wes that out of your partial affection you would be content to give with Calvin primacie to S. James so to derogate from St. Peters and the Popes authoritie Whē nothing else cā be inferred out of S. James but that which S. Hierome epist. 12. inter epistolas Aug inferro that which is implied in the 12. verse et tacuit omnis multitudo and all the multitude held their peace showing thereby the power of his decision and that as Saint Hier inferrs S. James and all the Apostles did passe Who wil not then acknowledge a general authoritie in him that with his sentence composeth different suffrages and motives 75. That which S. James speakes verse 15. and 16. is nothing else but a confirmation or an explication of S. Peters sentence First he approves S. Peters vocation mentioned by S. Peter by the testimonies of the Prophets and nextly he doth as to win the goodwil of the Judaizing Christians moderate that sence of S. Peter that would have all legal ceremonies removed that so they might take that speech better at his hands then at S. Peters S. James being their Bishop of Hierusalem he expoūds that which he thought most conventent to be done And the whole Councel and not onely Sainct James promulgates determines that decree So that we see the definition of the principal question is onely S. Peters and the prudential Councel to the setling of the busynes to each parties liking is onely S. James 76. But presently after to signifie his willingnes to say something he objects that Peters sitting still would rather argue authority thē his rising up To which I answer that admitting most true it were his sitting doth argue his authoritie as well as his rising up and S. Peters judiciall and attentive hearing the debating of the question till there was a great disputation and then being noted to begin to rise that to rising the heat of disputation comming to head and the disputers vehemencie requiring a period that he beganne then to rise argue preheminencie of authoritie And it is not sayd that he did speak these words risen but when he was rising what have you then concluded 77. But on goes our subtil disputer to prosecute his great doubt and argues out of the 5. of the Acts 34. where Gamaliel is sayd to rise up in the councel of the Jewes v. 34. But here he conceals what the Church distinguisheth calling him a Doctor of the Lawe and so signifying that it was his office as Doctors that be Cardinals doe in the Popes conclavi to cramine matters by way of argument and not to determine and define then he conceals the immediate cause of his rising up including a farr inferior office then that of the head v. 35. to cōmaund the men to be put forth onely a while to signifie that he spake rather like a freind then like a judge And that Gamaliel did secretly favour the Apostles then the very wordes of the text teacheth and notes how your doctrine not grounded on God and reasons as yours s●●●l come to ruine he bidds them take heed what they mean to doe with these men showing that Th●●●as and foure hundred men Judas and his companie that followed all perished and here inferring that they should leave to persecute them For if their work were not of God of it self it would come to ru● as all other heresies and sects have and shall so that we see the text cited by you is the pronouncer of your own ruin 78. And that Gamaliels sentence was rather a favorable perswasion then a chief Judges resolution appeares that howsoever he was a pollitike statesman yet he was a secret favourer of the Apostles and their preaching For he did procure S. Stephens burial 20 myles from Jerusalem as B Lucianus Martyr notes in the invention of the bodie of S. Stephen Also he receives and nouriseth Nicodemus when he was spoiled and expelled by the Jewes buried him there by S. Stephen as B Lucianus testifieth 79. And that which you bring out of the 17. of the Acts 16 rather hinders then furthers your purpose since we may gather that as S. Paul being intreated by the princes of the synagogue verse 15 to preach took upon himself without any more to doe rising up and with his hand beckening for silence showes there that he was the cheife preacher so S. Peter rising and composing their controversie shewes that in that kind he was the cheefe So that we see we have woven the webbe to intangle flies of your own kind 80. That which you bring before out of the 2. of Peter v. 20 cited by me thus No prophecie is made by privat interpretation you call but doe not prove it a bastard phrase showing that such ill befitting termes proceedes from a bad conscience Your glosse Ephes. 4 4. Rom. 12 4. 1 Cor. 12 4. v. 8 9. urges against your selfe For though there is the very self same soule in the head and foot and in each part yet it worketh otherwise in the head then in the foot as the spirit in the cheese of his Church then his members so as it is the office of the head to decyde

motives and to see which religion had greater credibilitie 116. 2. This being presupposed I will prove that our Romaine Catholicke church compared with what religions soever of the Heathens ceremontal of the Jewes heresies and sects of Christians is to be preferred in any reasonable mans judgment before any of them Since I will prove that the motives of our religion are of evident credibilitie 117. 3. I am to prove that the motives of our Catholick religion are to be and are of most evident credibilitie whether they be taken by themselves or whether they be parralleld with the doctrine of the Gentile Jewe or heretick and the motives of our religion must be of evident credibilitie appeareth out of the Psal. 9 2. Testimonia tua credibilia facta sunt nimis Heb. 2. the preaching of the Apostles is said to be confirmed by signes and myracles 2. if there were not motives of evidēt credibility no man prudētly should be thought to assent vnto faith 118. And that the motives of our religion are of evident credibilitie appeareth in the particular relation of them 119. The first motive of our religion is from the author of our religion who to have been is as certaine as that Alexander or Aristotle was And that our Savieur did not teach false things of ignorance or mallice appeareth by his doctrine preaching and his virtues and power prophecied by the Prophets and by the Syb●liacs by the silence of oracles of whom S John Baptist honoured so by the very Jewes for sanctitie of life doth give such testimonie of whō the Apostles also did testifie and not of ignorance since they preach those things they sawe nor of mallice or gaine since they preached without any hope of temporal commoditie or preferment they being condemned and despised of all And it appeares out of Josephus lib. 18. Antiquitatum and by Tertullian libro cōtra Celfum and Porphyrius where it is sayd Deos gentium etc. The Gods of the Gentiles pronounced Christ to bee wise and godly 120 The second Argument and motive of edident credibilitie is taken out of particular prophecies concerning our Saviour which motive Justinus in his Qbus Orthodoxos q. 2. et 146. Tertull. in Apoll. c. 20. D. Chrysost 18. in Iohannem D. Aug 1. De consensu Euangelico c. 28. usque ad finem Also the prophesies of our Saviour propagation of the Church conversion of Gentiles persecutions of Christians are daily seen to be fulfilled 121. Hetherto all Christians may vsurpe these motives as then own But when those that they shall seek to perswade shall aske of them what the essentiall pointes of their religion are without which it cannot stand If they be demaunded which of the Apostles schollars did teach these points of doctrine that they boast they teach and say they have received different frō the Romane Catholiks grounds Where their church hath lurcht this thowsand five hundred yeares Whie none of the auncient Fathers writings are for them no hystories the records of time whether their nation was first converted to their religion here they are gravelld and can vse no other or further motive which hath been the reason why yet never any nation to this day hath been converted to their religion To these and other questions of the self same nature Mr H. A d●st not and yet dares not answer I or no though ther be 13 in number and of great moment set downe in my last letter 122. But here our Church can goe forward with her third motive of most evident credibilitie which is ●ercht from the antiquitie of our religion and doctrine Which Argument S. August contra epistolam ●auda Manich. vseth Justinus also in adhortatio ad Gentes Lact. lib. 2. Divinarum institut c. 14. Cyrillus Alexand contra Iul Aug. 18. de civit Deic 18. Iosephus the record of our antiqui●ie libio 1. contra Ap●onem showes that it exceeds all prophane mom●ments Iustin Apolog 2 Tertull. Apolog. c. 19. e●alij And if wee understand of Christ Jesus and the Apostles doctrine it appeares by the perpetual succession of Bishops from S Peters chaire which Argument Irenaeus lib. 3 c. 3. Tertull. De praescript c 6. et Hieron contra Lucifer versus finem vseth to prove our church to be the most aunent true and Apostolical church 123. Which antiquitie also doth appeare out of the name Catholicke which wee have still reteyned though our adversaries have laboured what in them lieth to deface that name so the Montanists called Catholicks Psychias that is animales in that they refused to observe their three fasts and the Calvinists termes vs Papists But al in vaine For no sooner can a man aske where a catholick dwells but presently they will direct them to some of vs which argumēt S. Aug. vseth 124 Our 4. Argument may be the sanctitie of our doctrine teaching most congruous to reason and so behooful in respect of God our neighbour and our selfs as appeareth by our fasts religious vowes of Preists so that all is conformable to that of the Psal. 18. his law is an immaculate law converting soules 125 The fif● motive is out of the admirable and divine manner of promulgating our faith both in the Apostles tymes and in their Apostolicall followers that our faith should be first established by poore fishermē 2 in that the things they preached wēt against mens wil and against the haire of humaine inclination 3. In that they did perswade men to this religiō not with hope of privat lucre or styles of honor but by coūselling of a pecfect resignatiō of our wils to God in all things 4. In that by the efficacie of this their doctrine most potent eloquent and learned men have been converted according to that the 1 Cor. 2. Se brethren our vocation qua non multi sapientes which Argument Justinus Apolog 2. Christ. homil 34. in Math. Aug. 22. de civit det c. 5. Dainast 4. de fide c. 4 vseth 126. The 6 Motive is that since God and his servants have been ever mamfested from deluders and imposcers by true myracles doon to the proffit of many and not for ostentation as appeareth in the conflict of Moyses and Aaron with Pharoes Magi Exo. ● Elias with Baals Prophets B. S. Peter with Simon Magus as Egisippus relates Of Eugenius the Catholick Byshop with Cittola the Ariā Byshop as Greg. Turonensis witnesseth lib. 3. ●ist c. 3. The which success hath animated our Catholicks to vrge the Gentlies to the triall of their religion by true myracles as Arnobins lib. 1. et Tertull. apolog lib. 23. And S. Joh. 5. our Saviour affirms that the works he did gave a greater testimonie of him then the testimonie of S. John Baptist and Joh 8. We know that that comes from God And Erodi 4. Whereas Moyses objected that the people would not heare him he gave him the power of myracles And as our Saviour vseth this Argument Joh.