that is every doctrine which men bragging of the Spirit do teach but trie them whether they be of God no a Examine all things hold fast that which is good a 1 John 4.1 b 1 Thes 5.21 C. Whereby shall I try them M. By the Scriptures John 5.39 Acts 17.11 C. I am unlearned and the Scriptures are hard to be understood M. There are indeed many things in them hard to be understood 2 Pet. 3.16 but such things as are necessary to be known of all to salvation are plainly set down Prov. 8.9 The meaning of which place is this The Word of God in points necessary to salvation is easie unto all that have a desire unto it Turn to the places of Scripture added to every answer of the Catechism and you shall find this to be most true C. Is there no other way and means whereby to try and know the truth and the true professors M. Yes it may be done even by the aforesaid grounds of Religion Whatsoever Doctrine is agreeable thereunto is true and to be received but whatsoever is contrary to the same is false and to be rejected but whatsoever is contrary to the same is false and to be rejected As many as do sincerely and soundly imbrace profess and practise the same they are the Catholick Church that is parts and members of the Catholick Church and true Catholicks indeed But such as teach profess and practise things contrary thereunto are not the Church nor true Catholicks C. The Papists say that they only are the true Church and true Catholicks and that we are not M. So the Jews cried a The Temple of the Lord b We are the seed of Abraham the children of God a Jerem. 7.4 b John 8.33 41. But Christ told them they were the children of the Devil John 8.44 C. Are not the Papists then good Catholicks M. No but rather gross Hereticks C. What is an Heretick M. One that doth erre in any fundamental point of Christian Religion and doth obstinately teach maintain and defend the same C. Do the Papists erre in the fundamental points of Religion M. They do teach and maintain many false opinions against the very grounds of Religion as by and by shall be shewed in many particulars C. Are all Papists then Hereticks M. No for there are no doubt many of them that do erre of simplicitie and ignorance and which would be brought from their errors if they had the means namely the Scriptures in their own language preaching catechizing and the like We do not therefore account them all Hereticks but onely those before mentioned C. How do you prove that they are not good Catholicks M. I prove it thus They are good Catholicks which are of sound faith and good life Aug. lib. quaest in Mat. cap. 11. but Papists are neither of sound faith nor good life therefore they are no good Catholicks C. How do you prove that they are not of sound faith M. Even by the Apostles Creed which may serve instead of a rule whereunto the faith of all men ought to agree contrary whereunto they teach many things C. Shew me wherein M. The Creed is a confession of faith containing the sum of the Gospell and of such things as are necessary to be believed of all that will be saved They have devised many other new Articles of Faith besides and contrarie to the Articles of the Apostles Creed which they hold necessarily to be believed of all that will be saved As namely Indulgences and a treasurie of Saints merits the reall presence the Popes Supremacie Purgatorie and such like In the Council of Trent the curse Anathema is pronounced upon all such as deny these or any of them Master Perkins first vol. Page 621. The Creed teacheth what every one in particular is to know and believe and a true faith cannot stand without certain knowledge The Papists maintain an implicite or an ignorant faith namely that it is enough to believe as the Church beleiveth though they know not what the Church is nor what the Church believeth And they commend this faith by the example of an old devout father a Colliar who being tempted of the Devil and asked how he believed answered That he believed as the Church believed being asked again how the Church believed he answered As I believe whereupon the Devil as they say was fain to depart C. It should seem it was but a simple Devil for if he had been wise he would have asked him this question What if the Church believe that thou art a fool what would the Colliar think you have answered then M. I think he would have said nothing for if he should have said I believe so too the Devil might then have begged him for a food indeed And yet such fools are the simple and ignorant Papists which content themselves with this kind of faith for thus one may reason with them You are to believe as the Church believeth but the Church believes that you are fools therefore you are to believe so too This their implicite faith every one of himself may have The Devils in some fence may be said to have a better saith then this for they know what is contained in the Scriptures and believe it to be true Mat. 4.6 Iam. 2.19 This fond and ridiculous kind of saith is a notable means to nuzzle people in blindnesse superstition and perpetuall ignorance Again Faith is a certain and true perswasion of the heart whereby we are perswaded and in some measure assured of the forgivenesse of our sins and eternall salvation The Papists say it is presumption to be assured of salvation and will have men to doubt thereof the which is contrary to tht nature of true faith They call the certainty of remission of sins a faithless perswasion and the faith of Devils not of Apostles Concil Trid. Sess 6. cap. 9.12 13. Rhem. Annot. 1. Cor. 9. Sect. 9. DIALOGUE 2. C. Shew me I pray you what things in particular they teach contrary to any Article of the Creed M. I could shew you many but I fear that then I should be tedious to you I will therefore set down onely the chiefest In the second and third Article is described and set forth unto us both the person and office of our Mediator namely that he is both God and man a Prophet Priest and King Concerning his Person although in words they confess him to be God and man yet in deed they deny it for they ascribe to him a body invisible and infinite they teach that he is corporally present in infinite places at once which is proper onely to God and contrary to the nature of a true body And so in effect they do even deny his Manhood The Son of God is called Jesus because he is a Saviour yea the onely and perfect Saviour which saveth us from our sins That is hath delivered us not only from the blame or guiltiâ—ses but fully also from the punishment due to our
with all other sound Protestants in Christendom In other things there have been are and will be diversities of opinions and differences to the worlds end They should first pluck out the beam of their own eyes for we can truly charge them with greater differences As namely with that sharp and bloody contention between the Franciscans and the Dominicans and with the late bitter contention between the Jesuites and the secular Priests wherein the Priests did write as bitterly against the Jesuites and namely against Parsons as ever did any Protestant nay there was never any Protestant writer that did lay such foul and odious crimes to their charg as the Priests did And herein they verified the old proverb When thieves fâ—ll by the ears true men come to have their goods For one dissention that is among us they have at least ten among themselves D. Willet in his fourth Pillar of Papistry hath set down at large First the contradictions and divers opinions of old Papists and new Secondly The contradictions of the Jesuites amongst themselves Thirdly that their stoutest Champion Bellarmine is at variance with himself shamefully forgetting himself saying and unsaying now of one opinion by and by of another And no marvel Oportet enim mendacem esse memorem A lyer had need to have a good memory Fourthly he sheweth the repugnances inconveniences and inconsequent opinions which Popish Religion hath in it self And thus you see how they charge us with that wherein themselves are most faulty DIALOGUE 16. C. Are there none among us that maintain any strange and new opinions contrary to the grounds of Religion M. If there be any such our Church doth not approve of them but rather censure and punish them C. There be some that profess the former grounds of Religion as we do and yet say that there is no true Church among us and therefore will not joyn with us in prayers hearing the Word and in the use of the Sacraments but separate themselves from us what say you of such M. I say that they are possessed with the spirit of pride and singularity and that in so doing they do even deny these Articles of Faith the Catholick Church and the Communion of Saints and are such as the Apostle speaks of Rom. 16.17 Heb. 10.25 39. Master Perkins in his first Vol. pag. 409. calls them a schismatical and undiscreet company and saith that they are full of pride thinking themselves to be full when they are empty to have all knowledg when they are ignorant and have need to be catechised Another saith thus of them The error of those men is full of evil yea of blasphemy who do in such manner make a departure from this Church as if Christ were quite banished from hence and that there could be no hope of salvation to those that abide here And further he saith that if they cannot find Christ here they shall find him no where The errors of these men you may see in a little Treatise set forth by M. Barnard called The Separatists Schism C. I pray shew me some example that they ought not to separate themselves from us and that they do sin in so doing M. In the Church of Corinth the incestuous man was not punished fornication was lightly regarded yea there were some that even denied the Resurrection yet S. Paul doth account and call them the Church and Saints he doth not perswade any to make a separation but doth plainly rebuke them and sheweth how they should punish the evil doer I speak not this to excuse any gross sin that reigneth amongst us for I wish that the same might be severely punished but to shew that where the Word is truly preached and the Sacraments rightly administred as in our Church they are none ought for any cause to separate themselves And that such as do it do sin grievously I will shew you by a familiar example A mother conceiveth and bringeth forth a son and that with great travel and pain She traineth him up to mans estate and that not without great care and labor This son at length espying some spot and blemish or some infirmity in his mother forsaketh her and will not acknowledg her to be his mother what would you now think of him C. Surely I should think such a one to be a very wicked and unnatural son M. Even such are they who for some seeming faults in our Church deny it to be a true Church and do separate themselves from it whereas this Church hath conceived them brought them forth and nourished them For if ever they were truly begotten unto Christ and born a new it hath been by our Church and our Ministery by which likewise they have been trained up and brought to that knowledge which they have C. There are many amongst us that make great profession of Religion but I can see no good works come from them nay they are not only barren in good works but also live in some one gross sin or other Are these the true Church and true Catholicks M. Though they live in the Church yet they are not of the Church they are but Hypocrites and shall if they repent not have the reward of Hypocrites yea it shall be easier in the Day of Judgment for many Papists then for them because by their barren and fruitless yea wicked life they have caused the Name of God his Gospel and the true Professors thereof to be evil spoken of Let all therefore that will be accounted the true Church and true Christians he careful to adorn the Doctrine of God our Saviour in all things and that by a godly conversation and by doing of good works C. The name of God be blessed for this our conference whereby I find my self much edified There remaineth yet one thing more which I will demand of you and that is How I may come to know and be assured that I am indeed a member of the true Church and that I shall certainly be saved M. Be diligent to hear the Word of God preached Read the Scriptures Receive often the Sacrament Acquaint your self throughly with the aforesaid grounds of Religion Joyn hereunto earnest and hearty prayer Set apart some time for these things specially be careful to spend the Sabbath herein And to all these things joyn an holy conversation indevouring above all things to have always a clear conscience toward God and toward men In doing this you shall at length come to that full assurance whereof S. Paul speaketh namely that you are the Child of God and that nothing shall be able to separate you from the love of God which is in Christ Rom. 8.38 Babylon is fallen it is fallen Rev. 14.8 Praise honour glory and power be unto him that sitteth upon the Throne and unto the Lamb for evermore Amen Revel 5.13 FINIS Courteous Reader THese Books following are Printed for and sold by William Miller at the Gilded-Acorn in S. 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suffered c. by which he hath made a full and perfect satisfaction for the sins of his elect and for the whole punishment thereof both eteâ—â—al and temporal The Papists teach that Christ hath satisfied for sins going before baptism but concerning sins following baptism the fault is remitted by the passion of Christ the punishment which of infinite is made finite is to be satisfied for by men themselves either here or in Purgatory that is men themselves must satisfie the justice of God for the temporal punishment of their offences either on earth or in Purgatory There is say they a certain infernal place in the earth called Purgatory in the which as in a prison house the souls which were not fully purged in this life are there cleansed and purged by fire before they can be received into heaven Bell. de Purgat lib. 1. cap. 1. cap. 3. lib. 2. cap. 6. Rhem. on 1 Cor. 3. Sect. 4. They say also that it is an Article of Faith to believe that there is a Purgatory and that he which believes it not is sure to go to hell Bellar. ibid. l. 1. c. 15. But this is so far from being an Article of Faith as that it is a meer fable and contrary to an Article of Faith The blood of Christ is the Purgatory of our sins 1 John 1 7. Afflictions are called the fiery tryal 1 Pet. 1.7 4.12 whereby we are cleansed from our corruption as gold is from the dress by fire No other Purgatory is to be found in Scriptures The Scriptures mention but two sorts of men believers and unbelievers and but two places after this for them heaven for the one and hell for the other Luke 16.25 26. John 3.36 Revel 20.14 15. 21 7 8. They that die in the Lord rest from their labors which cannot be true if any of them go to Purgatory Their works follow them that is the reward of their works Revel 14.13 If any man should have gone to Purgatory then the thief upon the Cross had gone thither who repenting at his end wanted time to make satisfaction for the temporal punishment of his sins but Christ said to him To day shalt thou be with me in Paradise The Doctrine of Purgatory came into the Church out of the Heathen Writers for the Philosophers and Poets were the first that ever wrote of it and Popish Purgatory was unknown to the Fathers many hundred years after Christ Perkins 2. Vol. 568 569. C. If Purgatory be but a fable contrary to an Article of Faith then what is the cause that the Church of Rome so stifly maintain it M. There is great cause why they should so do for it keeps in the fire in the Popes Kitchin for if the fire of Purgatory were not great the fire in the Popes Kitchin would be but small for by this means they have store of Mony for Pardons Masses Diriges and other such like Trumperies DIALOGUE 5. C. Do they teach any thing else contrary to the Creed M. Yes The sixth Article saith that Christ ascended into Heaven c. and the Scriptures say that the Heavens must contain him c. Acts 1.11 3.21 They teach contrary hereunto namely that Christ is corporally present in the Sacrament and that in many places at once The which is contrary to the nature of a true body and contrary to the nature of the Sacrament which is a remembrance of Christ Virgilius against Eutychus lib. 4. saith thus When it that is the flesh of Christ was on earth it was not in Heaven and because it is now in Heaven it is not on Earth This is the Catholick Faith and consession It is an Article of Faith to believe the Catholick Church and faith is the evidence of things not seen Heb. 11.1 Therefore the Catholick Church is always unto the world invisible and not to be espied but by the eyes of Faith because things seâ—n are not believed The Papists teach that the Catholick Church is and hath been always visible Rhem. on Mat 5. Sect. 3. The Church is said to be Catholick that is universal because it is not tied to any one special place but is spread abroad over the face of the earth They tie it to Rome alone which can be but a particular Church and not Universal In the Church there is a Communion of Saints and these are they that are sanctified by the blood and Spirit of Christ having the perfect holiness of Christ put upon them by imputation of Faith and the quality of imperfect holiness poured into their heart by the spirit of sanctification And such are the Faithful here on earth 1 Cor. 1.2 Psal 16.2 The Papists acknowledge none to be Saints but such as are in heaven They teach that the Pope can canonize Saints whereas to make one a Saint is only the work of God 1 Cor. 11. The Pope hath canonized many that indeed were never true Saints of God but wicked men and rank Traitors to their Princes as Becket with many others This canonizing of Saints was never heard of with the Fathers until the year Eight hundred and eighty and then Adrian took up this authority And Alexander the Third after him confirmed it in his decrees In the Creed we profess to believe the forgiveness of sins that is I believe that God for Christ his sake doth freely forgive the sins of his Elect and my sins also And herein consisteth our justification namely in this free forgiveness of our sins and the imputation of Christs righteousness to us The Papists teach many things contrary to this Article First That men are to make satisfaction for their sins Now satisfaction for sins and forgiveness of sins are contraries If we satisfie in our own person we are not justified freely if we be justified freely as most certainly we are Rom. 3.23 then we make no satisfaction at all If a man can satisfie and pay a debt then he needs no forgiveness but if the debt be forgiven him then it is plain that there is no satisfaction made The satisfaction for our sins was made by Christ and not by us C. Did not the Ancient Fathers teach men to make satisfaction for their sin M. The satisfaction which they maintained was an Ecclesiastical and publick mulct or penalty imposed upon notorious offenders thereby to testifie their repentance and to satisfie the Church whom they had offended Perkins 1. Vol. 577 c. 2. vol 165. 2. D. 166. The efficient cause of our justification is God alone It is God only that forgiveth our sins Esay 43.25 Mark 2.7 Rom. 8.33 They teach that the Pope can forgive sins and we know that he gives pardons not only for the time past but also for the time to come yea they teach that priests have right to remit sins and they alledge these places to prove to it Matth. 16.19 John 10.23 Now we are to note this that as none can forgive a debt but the party to