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A79817 The reclaimed papistĀ· Or The process of a papist knight reformd by a Protestant lady wth [sic] the assistance of a Presbyterian minister and his wife an Independent. And the whole conference, wherby that notable reformation was effected. J. V. C. (John Vincent Canes), d. 1672. 1655 (1655) Wing C435; Thomason E1650_1; ESTC R209116 94,350 241

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for the worlds conversion carried any written Gospell at all wth them wch might be made by themselves much less is it to be thought that they staied to write out theirs having their own breasts so well fraught wth all that and far more than they found ther written especially considering that two of the Evangelists were but their pupills and disciples Nay before those Gospels were written out and completed especially that of S. John the Church of God was spread up and down the world and flourisht in all the duties of Christianity By wch it may appear that even the written Gospell is neither it self necessary to the being of the Church nor the reading or expounding of a text the essentiall work of Christianity As for the Epistles wch be the other part of the new Testament written by S. Paul and others These t is well enough known were pend a long while after the Church of God was perfectly formd and grown up in most parts of the known world in particular after those Churches of Rome Corinth Ephesus Galatia Thessalonica and the rest unto whom they are addrest were perfected in all the essentialls of Christian faith and they were occasiond merely accidentally upon the creeping in of some disorders and errours in those places contrary to the tradition of faith they had received as may soon appear to him that reads and understands the tenour of those spirituall Epistles So then the Church is antecedent to her Scriptur and altogether independant theron either for her being or profession helps of memory as all these writings be do presuppose both the memory and the things to be remembred before those helps were brought to light And so the reading of these Scriptures or hearing them expounded can no wise be the essentiall work of Christian religion or the totall exercise therof but somthing that is altogether independent of them more ancient than they be and that is more intrinsecally a worship homage adoration and service of the most high God than hearing or looking upon words and syllables can be I make no doubt but the whol Scriptur or writing of the new Testament both Epistles and Gospells was merely casuall and accidentall For I find it long ago foretold by the Prophets that the law and government of the Messias should in this differ from the Law of Moses that Moses Law was all committed to paper but the doctrin of Iesus should be writ in the heart and entrailes of his Church You may see one place in the Prophet Ieremy c. 31.33 wch the Apostle in his Epistle to the Hebrewes applies unto Christ our Lords dayes Heb. 10.16 and S. Paul doth not obscurely allude unto it in one of his letters he wrote to Corinth c. 3.3 Indeed to imprint in the churches breast a law from wch she should never deviat is in my judgment a greater argument of divinity than any written Gospell could afford The things wch Solon Numa Lycurgus Draco and other such like men contrived and dictated for the good of their common wealths did much commend their gravity vigilance and wisedome and elevated them above other men not above manhood Moses himself the most profound judicious Lawmaker the world ever had by the excellency of his written Laws hath merited the title of a divine and sacred legislatour but he is known to be a man by his hand-writing and the paper he wrote on He is a God that writes on the velin of the heart characters indelible unto eternity The Law of Christ onely is written not wth ink but wth the spirit of the living God not in tables of stone but in fleshly tables of the heart I do also verily think that the religion wch the Son of God deliverd to his church was neither commanded by him to be written nor yet ever intended either by the Euangelists or other of those primitiv writers to be totally set down under the notion of a rule of faith altho so much as ther is of it drawn principally for the use of devotion and charity be a rule of faith also What the occasion might be that moved the four Euangelists to write their compendious Gospells by the little learning I have I could never yet assuredly gather altho I remember I have read somthing thereof in a learned latin book made by a friend of mine called Systema fidei put forth some few years ago wherein be very many things of excellent learning worthy of the Authour but I have not now the book at hand Wt occasion moved S. Paul to write his Epistles unto Rome Corinth and other places is manifest enough and I shall afterward declare it when I shall come to discover the religion of the Apostles and Euangelists and make it appear that they were all papists and of the very self same religion Catholiks be of at this day All this put together that Christ himself neither wrote any thing nor comanded any thing to be written yea gave notice that he would use his speciall prerogative of legislatourship and write his law in hearts promising to animate the body of his Church wth his own spirit wch should lead them into all truth and that the church was disperst over the earth before any Christian writting was made wch was afterwards drawn to confirm and strengthen the faith and devotion it found already planted All this being true it follows apparently that hearing or reading or preaching upon a text is not the great capitall work of Christian Religion Indeed t is childishnes to think that God unto whom all prostration adoration all homage service and worship both of the outward inward man is more than due should be sufficiently served wth a little labour of the lips or ears when a man thinks good so to do Preaching is indeed necessarily antecedent to Christian faith yet it onely disposes unto furrher actions as may easily appear both by autority of Scriptures wch exclaime bitterly against such as hear and go no further and also by the very natur of hearing and all kind of exhortation wch ever tends to somthing besides it self For who ever heard onely to hear and no further who but our mad reformers ever preacht onely to be heard And how can speaking on one side and hearing on the other complete the whol duty of man to his God as if one were nothing but tongue and ear or had receivd nothing from him but those two organs Tell me Madam ingenuously Do not you think you have sufficiently done your duty to God if you go but forth once a Sunday to hear a Sermon and if you read a chapter or two in a week day this is nothing else in effect altho by your favour you do not think you self bound under sin to either but if you like the weather or the parson pleases or your clothes be neat and handsom then you will go forth to church if not you will stay at home if you find your self
I am fully assured of that the Protestant is not abl to bring any one argument for himself against the Independent but what he borrows from the Catholik church and which being admitted and prest home will destroy all his own protestancy that is to say all thoss negative wherby he differs from the Catholik and wch he hath striven thes hundred years to defend and therfore it behovs him to take heed wt he does for the Independent is quick and resolut and as well verst in his principles as himself and able I am sure wth the Protestants own grounds to convince him neither to be fish nor flesh nor yet good red herring as the proverb speaks neither sound Catholick nor pure reformd The Catholik doctrin is all fixt and permanent and therfor every reformation can find what to deny of it but they can never all agree together wt and how much therof to affirm the latter still denying more of the Catholick faith than the former had don alltho it proceed upon the same principles wth it The Church will easily make good all her affirmativs against you all so soon as you shall agree al together how much you will deny But so long as you jar one amongst another and speak contraries it is not possible to stop all your mouths at once In a word all the changes made by the Independent are either legall just and religious or els protestancy it self is an unjust illegall and impious apostasy for if all men be obnoxious to errour and the Scriptur sole judg and guid of faith by wt right can the Protestant oblige men to her tenets further than they approov of them by the test of Scriptur wch they hav in in their own hands if thos principles be fals wth wt justice did the Protestant himself revolt from the Catholik upon those sole grounds Nay the Independent is far more honest and excusabl than the protestant for he prefers his judgment onely before a Church that profest her self to be fallible but the protestant rebeld against an infallible guid and one that profest her self such And altho the Catholik Church wer not infallible yet professing her self infallible she has that caus of blaming the revolting protestant wch the protestant can never hav against the Independent for an infallible Church may well expect an universall subjection whereas the protestant professing herself fallible cannot in modesty either oblige peopl to her cannons or dislik their freedom of judgment however dissenting from her own And so she must needs have the Presbyterian excusd and the Presbyterian he cannot do otherwise than comend the Independent as the nimbler work man For sith both of them went about to mend the Protestant reformation and correct the dictats of that fallible mistres the Independent did his work more speedily and fully than the other and so indeed may be maliced by him as the better workman but never blamed Finally if this last reformation of Independency be indeed an abolishing of all reliques of popery hanging upon the Protestant and not clearly casheerd by the Presbyterian then does the Catholik and Independent stand like extrems having the intermediat reformations of Protestancy and Presbytery and the like between then two as white and black be the two extrems of colours between which are red blew green and the like borrowing their existency from the natur of both in a severall mixtur And all other reformations interjacent are diversified in themselvs according as they do mor or les partake of the Catholik positivs and Independents negativs These two claim an absolute liberty of conscience in their own territories the Catholick a freedom of the Churches judgment the Independent of his own particular And either all is true that the Catholik affirms or all the independent denys MIN. I mean not to interpose my self in the busines of reformations let them be as they will but do maintain onely in the generall that reformation of popery is good lawfull not executed without the speciall commission instinct Spirit of Christ VIC So it is written Without me ye can do nothing Jo. 15. KN. And I likewis do onely in generall wish you to consider yet two or three things wherby you may suspect this busines not to be of God and consequently the whol work of reformation unlawfull Thes speciall commissions do ever bring with them some peculiar seals and letters patents such as heaven uses to send to mankind as be signs wondrous operations and miracles wthout wch man cannot in reason desert his station Reformers had none of thes to show But I will not insist hereon altho it be a worthy and waighty consideration becaus t is copiously don by others I say then First it would seem strang to a reasonabl man and a thing of much suspition that all reformations are but negativ abolitions of the ancient Catholik religion without any positiv institution at all T is an odd kind of dressing a garden still to be grubbing up trees and never plant any in the place nor is it likly God should send workmen into his vineyard onely to destroy and pull up Again reformers do all of them equally pretend to be sent from God wth an extraordinary commission to enlighten the world And yet they all hitherto did their work to the halfs keeping still as much popery as they cast away Gods extraordinary messengers use not to do their work imperfectly or remain themselvs in that errour they were sent on purpos to correct Martin Luther that extraordinary light of the world did if we may beleeve the succeeding reformations both liv and dy in as much popery as himself abolished If popery be so damnable as both Luther and other reformers cry out and say it is I should think that half a score swinging articles of popery are enough to sink a man and so much Luther must keep stil if we beleev the following reformation and this detaind no les if we may credit the third The purity of these times found so much popishnes still hanging on Protestants skirts that they thought it worth the hazard of their lives to brush it off And som think that even these purest are not themselves absolutly free from it and surely never wil be so long as the Bible wch is the Popes book and sent immediatly from him into this island is yet in their hands Ar all these reformers sent from God why then did non of them doe their work to the full till at the end of a full age the Independent stept in to accomplish it if yet he hath himself don the deed to the utmost Why should I think ill onely of the Catholik whom Luther raild against and not as well hate Luther whom Calvin condemnd or judg Calvin whom the Protestant church of England censurd in many things and forsook or detest also the Protestant Church wch the purity of thes times have destroied Sith we be all so much severd from
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in fractione panis in his breaking of bread Luk. 24.35 For that religious work they knew was done by none but Christ himself or his Priests This discours upon the words of Scriptur I hav somwt inlarged beyond my custom not to teach Catholiks for altho the Greek should be rendred by them in templo they know well enough that every place where that most sacred rite is done is a temple and so t is indifferent to them to translate it either in templo or in sacro but to let others who be not Catholik understand that more is implied in such expressions than they do ordinarily think of and that the religion of the primitiv Christians was not preaching wherof here is no mention at all but prayers supplications sacrifice or fraction of bread Wch religious emploiment is in another place of the sam chapter yet more fully exprest They were saith he firmly persisting in the doctrin of the Apostles and in comunion and in fraction of bread and supplications v. 42. They firmly persisted both in the Apostles doctrin unanimously united in faith wthout schisme division or any singularity of opinions wch might separat them from the main body into particular conventicles and also in comunion one wth another both by fraternal charity Ecclesiasticall obedience and Christian Sacraments in Fraction of bread wch was the great Cardinall capitall work of their faith and the very quintessence of Christianity and in supplications in the plurall number both for living and dead both for pastour and people for every degree for every necessity This was a right Catholik body and the right exercise of their Catholik faith And such and no other is the faith religion of all Catholiks to this day those I meane who are traduced by frivolous people under the notion name of Papists wch is a barbarous word and neither Latin Greek or Hebrew nor yet good English and if it signify any thing it is as much as to say Fatherists because they persist unanimously and firmely in the doctrine of Apostolical pastours and fathers in comunion with them in fraction of bread and supplications day by day persevering in sacro and breaking the bread at their houses wch they take together in exultation and singlnes of heart praysing God and having grace towards al good people Pray God bless thē all To make themselvs worthy of this Holy comunion our Catholiks do frequently examin and clens their consciences as P. Paul advises to do wch clensing and examining of conscience none but Catholiks know wt it means This sacred Action and venerable service of God was by the first Christians named Missah a notion they had out of the old Testament where the Sacrifice of the Messias peculiar onely to his people and religion by way of constitution distinction from all others is so named and the Latin and western part of the church did ever keep the name as well agreeing to the Latin tongue But the Eastern and Greek churches called it ordinarily 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or Liturgy wch was their own language and o word wherby that sacred action was exprest in the new Testament In the Acts of the Apostles t is frequently called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 breaking of bread The primitiv Christians gave it severall names the Eucharist the Synaxy the Dominicum and the like changing the word as souldiers do the watchword that uncircumcised paynims should not know wt they meant as our Catholiks now in England use some by-expressions therof for concealment And the antient doctours of the church wrote very cautiously of it especially in such books as they thought might haply fall into the hands of pagans as may be seen in severall places of Origen S. Austin and others I observed the last time I read over S. Austin de civitate Dei a very notable passage to this purpose tho I have not now the book to turn to it where speaking accidentally of the venerable bread of Christians he presently recalls himself saying they know wt I mean whose bread this is and in whose cause I write And a certain Roman prelat in antient times denied to send by writing an answer of som doubts propounded by ultra-marin Christians concerning some circunstances of the mass least the pagans intercepting his letters should therby discover the mystery of Christian Religion but he promist to send a messenger to the petitioners who should inform them by word of mouth So carfull they were not to cast this pearl before swine Yet as soon as Paganism was subdued their writings came abroad copiously and gave ample testimonies therof S. Ambrose was in the third age of the church and yet he began to be bold and writ not onely of the substance of the thing but betrayed the very name wherby it was generally known and called namely missa or mass But they all frequently spake of the Altar and Priests the Sacrifice and service of the most high God performd in Christian Religion and the like And the writers of the last twelv hundred years speak so amply and so plainly therof that the very citation of their evidences would fill a volume For this divine service were all our churches in England erected by Catholiks in the form of a cross the high Altar now called the Chancell being placed in the head of the church and the Tabernacle over it for the body of our Lord to repose on for Christian mens solace wth candles and lamps before it below it was the quire for the clargy to sing prayses night and day before their redeemer on both sides of the church lesser Altars for other priests to celebrate in at their devotion and the nave or body of the church kept clenly and vacant for the people to kneel in continue wth one accord in their supplication and prayer according as it is written My hous is the hous of prayer If churches had been onely buylt for preaching and hearing Sermons they would not have been made in the form of a cross as they be but of a theater or amphitheater rather wth scaffolds about for that purpose and such stalls or pews below as now all our churches are pesterd wth in Catholik times utterly unknown And if a man look into the places of devotion the Christians resorted unto in times of paganism before they had any churches erected wch were for the most part in dens and caves bottoms of mountains wherof many are still to be found in all Kingdoms of Europ he shall easily discern what their busines was there I once saw one of them in a hill neare Paris cald mount Dammartin wch descended as I remember three score steps into the hill at the bottom there is a place of the bignes of a chamber and an Altar stone at the head of it in part still remaining and a hole in the same rock over the Altar for the Priests chalice to stand in And generally wher ever such