is to shew that members of visible Churches haue onely right unto the publicke ordinances administred therein As for others they are not to be judged that is in those publicke things the Church hath no relation to them nor may I say in this respect haue communion with them And hence I reason thus If the infants in questiō are without then may they not be admitted unto Church communion and so consequently not to baptisme But they are without Therefore c. The proposition is manifest by this Scripture 1. Corint 5.12 The assumption is evident and needeth no proofe After this hee tels us of 3 sorts of persons which may be said to be without 1. Members of a visible Church wanting true faith 2. Infidells and Heathens 3. Those that for the present live not under the Discipline and Gouvernment of some particular Church and yet make profession of the same Religion with the true visible Churches c. This later practise some imperfect communion with them and therefore in some sence may be said to be of such Churches Answ 1. Howsoever the Lord knoweth who are his yet cannot Mr. Paget nor any man else judge men to be without true faith and so no members of the invisible Church specially they standing members of some particular Congregation and therefore his talke here is altogether fruitles and nothing concerneth the place 1. Cor. 5.12 which hee pretendeth to answer 2. The difference which hee puts betweene men without is without warrant of Scripture Paul as Paraeus * Comment on 1. Cor. c. 5. v. 12. p. 272. well observes on this place divides all men into two ranckes the first and greater without the later and lesser within And howsoever th 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for personall gifts and graces are not alike notwithstanding as they stand in relation to a visible Church-state they differ not But are all alike excluded from actuall communion in the publicke ordinances thereof As wee see in a desert or willdernes diversitie of trees some good some bad some are thornes and brambles others are vines and fig-trees nevertheles in respect of a Vineard or Orchard they are quite out of the same a like 3. For his imperfect communion it is a perfect invention of his owne head for the word of God teacheth no such thing Againe where hee sayth they are members of the Church in some sence and not in another this likewise is another of his fictions And observe here how hee pleads for the prophaine multitude just as doe the Papists for their Pope in one respect hee is a man in another respect hee is more then a man Iew. Defen Apol. 6. part c. 20. Divis 3. p. 784. One way hee may erre another way hee cannot erre But not minding to spend much time about the thing for the naming of it is a sufficient resutation this I say a man must either be a member of a particular Church formally otherwise hee cannot be reputed a visible member of it in any sence or respect at all If hee can proove the contrary by the word of God it lyeth him now upon it to doe it In the meane time let the discreet Reader judge whither hee be not guilty of venting new conceits and opinions of his owne And whither by these his new conceits and opinions hee doe not gratifie the Valentinians Marcionites and Gnostikes Who as Irenaeus a Advers Haer. 8.3 c. 7. l. 1. c. 1 reporteth did seeke to bring into the Church mens devises And whither hee doe not gratify the Trent-Councell b Conc. Trid. Sess 4. dec 1 Fathers and the Papists yea moreover the Cabala or Talmud c 4. Esd 14.26.48 of the Rabbins and the Montanists d Tertul. de praeser adve Haer. c. 52. For the sinne for which these chiefly are condemned is because they haue broched many lies and beastly vanities as if all things concerning faith and manners were not contained in the Scriptures Thus wee haue examined Mr. Pagets Answers to the allegations of Scriptures brought by Mr. Davenport Now least hee should complaine against me for some partialitie I thinke it not amisse to write a few words touching that Scripture which hee mentioneth in pag. 44. namely Mat. 3. If hee cannot find a better ground then this to lay his unlimited Baptisme upon surely then the same will never proove to be lawfull For 1. the persons there specifyed through Iohns doctrine powerfully caried home to their consciences had their hearts deeply wounded ‡ Paraeus Comment in Mat. c. 3. v. 6. p. 29. with the sence of sinne and thereupon made open confession thereof 2. That which they did was done freely * Aret. in Mat. 3. pag. 119. and voluntarily 3. The same was accompanied with a desire * Muscul in Mat. 3. p. 24. and purpose of amendment of life 4. They were members of a visible Church 5. The Baptiser was no ordinary Minister Now then how can Mr. Paget hence proove that men not humbled by the word preached not manifesting any sorrow for sinne not shewing any desire of reformation of life not members of any particular Congregation may neverthelesse haue their infants lawfully baptised by a Pastour or Teacher they saying Yea or nodding with the head to some questions imposed upon them or having others to doe it in their behalfe I doe not thinke it strange that hee could not prevaile as hee sayth with Mr. Davenport by such conference in the point for in truth as this allegation so is the rest there of his talke a rope of sand as an overblowne bladder that will burst of it self and vent the wind thereof without pricking And thus much for this Section SECTION V. WHereas Mr. Paget hath so often called upon me by name to proove the Protestation published against him to wit that hee hath bene many wayes injurious to our Congregation My purpose is by the Lords assistance in this and the following Sections to set downe the same And because all our troubles haue proceeded as it were from two causes viz. the Baptisme of Non-members and the denying of the Churches power I shall therefore speake of these two things the more fully And first of the Baptisme Now the reasons which I haue against it are these ARGVMENT I. To breake that sacred order which God hath set in his visible Church for all his Saints to keepe and walke by is a great sinne But to baptize infants whose Parents are not members of any particular Congregation is to breake that order c. Therefore it is a great sinne to doe it The proposition is evident by these Scriptures 1. Cor. 14.33 ult 1. Cor. 5.13 Num. 23.9.10.11.21 and 24.5.6 1. King 14.1.17 Son 6.4 The assumption is as cleare For let it be observed that unto all Church-actions as there is Faith so order also necessarily required And hence is the difference onely betweene Christian-communion and Church-communion to practise Christian-communion there needeth
that no infant under the Law was to be circumcised except hee were a member of that visible Church seeing therefore they leave this patterne it must follow as I sayd that they make the argument voyd and of no effect and so refute their owne writings and destroy againe the things which they haue builded 3. Seeing by comparing their practise with their profession they are not so true to their owne grounds as they ought this custome becomes the greater blot and dishonour unto them That they are not true to their grounds I have manifested before To which this further may be added In a Synod held at Dort Anno 1578. it was there agreed that all Parents before they brought their children to be baptized should got unto the Ministers or Elders that so they might give notice unto the Church whose child it was that should be baptized Now for what end should the Parents be enjoyned to acquaint the Church Officers with this thing unlesse their meaning was that none but members children should be baptised If they had intended that things should be as they are now baptise all brought to the Congregation then truely with reverence be it spoken they made a very unnecessary article for what need is there of telling the Church whose children they are if all brought there must be baptised Lastly let it be considered whither the unsound doctrine of the Papists get not countenance by this custome who teach * Aegid Topiar in Epist. Euang. p. 293. that Gods commaundements must sometime give place unto mens traditions Object 2. Compassion towards infants mooveth many Ministers to baptise them Answ Wee may not doe any thing against the expresse will of God under a pretence to shew mercy unto others ‡ 1. King 20.42 that pitty which the godly are to manifest must be rightly-bowelled * 1. Pet. 3.8 that is commaunded of God both for the matter and manner of it It is well knowne that Origen ‡ August de Civit. Dei lib. 21. c. 17 through to much compassion of the wicked thought that the Divels themselves should be saved at lenght unlesse men therefore are carefull to set bounds unto their affections their affections will lead them bejond their bounds To conclude this point my hearts desire is that every godly Minister would be pleased duely to regard these things It was no dishonour unto Iob that hee tooke the councill of his hand-maid Neither did it darken Apollos reputation that hee learned some thing of Aquila and Priscilla A wise Generall of a feild dispiseth not the advise of the meanest souldier in matters of greatest waight Wee are told of a Papist * Picus Mirand an Papa sit supra Concil that wee ought to beleeve a simple plaine Husband man c. if hee speake the truth For my part I should not presume to commend what I haue said to their judicious consideration unlesse I had by diligent inquiry first seene the same to be a truth and so setled my conscience in the certainty of it SECTION VII TO let his scoffes alone which hee merrily puts forth in pag. 71. 72. I will here give him a direct answer unto the thing which hee there demaundeth that is What that due power is by which wee would have the Church to be gouverned and unto which wee would willingly be subjected It is that Polity-Ecclesiasticall which the Lord Iesus the King of his Church hath ordained in the New Testament and given unto all the Churches of his Saints whereby they are to chuse and call into office such as are fit and exercise all other spirituall ordinances in among themselves immediately from him This gouvernment wee hold to be the perfection of all as comprehending in it whatsoever is excellent in all other bodies politicall As man being the perfection of all creatures comprehends in his nature what is excellent in them all Having being with the elements life with the plants sence with beasts and with the Angells reason Those which haue written about the Politike gouvernment of common-wealths as Aristotle a L. 5. Pol. c. 1. l. 3. c. 11. Herbertus b L. 1. Hist Pol. Tolosanus c Lib. 4. c. 5. Bodin d L. 2. c. 7. l. 6. c. 74. Iunius e Par. 1. Qu. Pol. Qu. 4. Danaeus f L. 4. Pol. c. 5. Richterus g Dict. axim 63. Althusius h C. 32. Pol. Contarinus i Hist. Venet. others doe mention three kindes as lawfull and good Monarchicall Aristocraticall and Democraticall Now all these three formes as the Learned ‡ D. Whita cont 4. Q. 1 pag. 14. Refut D. Down Serm. l. 2. par 2. pag. 106. Pet. Mart. loc com Clas 4. c. 5. pag. 783. Keckerm System S.S. Theol. lib. 3. p. 400. judiciously observe haue their places in the Church of Christ In respect of him the head it is a Monarchy in respect of the Eldership an Aristocracy in respect of the body a popular state Further I doe affirme that this Ecclesiasticall gouvernment is unchangeable ordinary best and perpetuall common to all true Churches and unto which all estates must be subject as brethren so every officer likewise And good reason too for it is a matter of faith a point of the Gospell yea of the substance of it and necessary to salvation so farre I meane as other of Gods ordinances But not to speake any more of the necessity and excellency of this Church Gouvernment there being in print many learned Treatises of it I will here lay downe my reasons to proove the former Assertion viz. that every particular visible Church hath from Christ absolute intyre power to exercise in and of herself everie ordinance of God and so is an independent body not standing under any other Ecclesiasticall authoritie out of it self And this I will doe if God permit ARGVMENT I. If those Churches planted by the Apostolique institution had power fullie in themselves immediately from Christ to practise all his ordinances Then have all Churches the like power now But the first is true Therefore the second The proposition is cleare and certaine by these Scriptures 1. Cor. 5.2.3 Act. 14.23 2. Cor. 16.2 Col. 2.5 2. Thess 3.14 The assumption is acknowledged by sundry of our best Divines That first gouvernment of the Church sayth Mr. Brightman * On Revel chap. 2 p. 65 edit 3. is common to all times and places and that it is not to be permitted to be at the arbitrement of men to follow what way they list but that alwayes in reforming a Church wee must have recourse unto the first beginnings to the which as our onely rule wee must call back whatsoever strayeth from it and that they are not to be turned tuned according to the crookednes and jarring sound of the succeeding Churches Mr. Parker * Polit. Eccl. l. 1. c. 23. pag. 59. l. 3. p. 95. 300. hath in
at all Many other perswasions by words as a so by writing were delivered in Dutch Notwithstanding for all this they would not revoake their sentence but confirmed it a new Is Israel a servant is hee home borne why is hee spoiled But to the point this record to use Mr. Pagets * Pag. 49. words in the like case is an authentick witnes not lyable to exception for what I have here said is recorded in the Acts of our Consistory * Octob. 12. 1631. And that this was to hard a dealing with us I proove it thus 1. There ought to bâ— nothing as Beza * Epist 83. saith imposed on a people against their wills Now imagen that our owne Eldeâ—ship should decree a thing either to be done or not yet could they not enjoyne us by any Law of God to obey them in it further then wee our selves doe see the same to be lawfull and so voluntarily assent unto it And if it be so then by what authority can Officers of other Congregations require us to stand to their acts specially when wee neither like them nor judge them good It seemes Zwinglius was against such doings Ad Valent. Compar for hee saith Whosoever with a Councill of Bishops shall impose on Christian people any Law or observation at their owne liking hee meaneth without the peoples consent hee invadeth the Churches right by a violent commaund Artic. 64. In another place Such Elders as without the Churches consent decree things at their owne pleasure are in name Elders but indeed Tyrants Cyprian * Cypria l. 4 Ep. 21.34.46.26.32 14.31 in sundry places writes that all matters ought to be determined by the Bishops Elders and the people present and consenting Otherwise sayth hee matters are not firme and sure For this very case Chemnitius * Exa Conc. Trid part 1 pag. 3. condemneth the Councill of Trent viz. because they set downe their decrees as it were uncontroulably and not under the examination of the Churches D. Bilson * Cont. Ap. p. 9â— saith that no Councill can bind a whole Church except there be a generall consent 2. Seeing the authority of particular Congregations is as Mr. Parker ‡ Polit. Eccl. l. 3. c. 13. p. 130. saith and largely prooveth it above all Synodes I cannot see what reason a few men haue to take upon them the subjecting of a whole Congregation to their decrees yea and to * Yet thus dealt the Claswith our Eld. because they admitted Mr. Hooker to the Pulpit contrary to their act De Ro. Pont. pract pag. 2. Censure the Eldership if they though with the Churches liking doe contrary to it It was not the manner of Bishops saith D. Whitaker in the primitive times to assume unto themselves jurisdiction and gouvernment over others 3. If it be right * See Park-Pol Eccl. l. 3 c. 12. p. 88. that the common desire of a particular Congregation in things lawfulll should take place before one mans opposition to it then I take it the matter was not well caried when Mr. Paget prevailed against the Eldership and Church too 4. This practise is contrary to the old rule generally received among the learned That ‡ Amb. lib. de dig Sacerd 3. which concerneth all ought of all to be approoved But some may say how is this to be done I answer in the words of D. Fulke * Learned Discours of Eccles disci p. 86. That the Elders sayth hee may have their sentence to be the sentence of the Church they must when they have travailed in examining of cases propound them to the whole multitude that it may be confirmed by their consent Observe here how according to this mans opinion the Classis should first have propounded the thing to our Congregation and if wee jointly had approoved thereof then might they have concluded that it was a Church Act otherwise not 5. Howsoever the Classes have joyned with Mr. Paget against us and they together deprived us of Mr. Hooker and Mr. Davenport notwithstanding hetherto wee have not seene them to warrant their proceedings by the Scriptures and therefore in this respect wee also take it that they have dealt too hardly with us For who knoweth not that in all questions of this nature no other testimony or argument can strike the stroake to perswade the conscience but the word of God for as one * Chrisost in Psal 95. ad finem well saith If any thing be spoken without Scripture the mind of the heareth halteth now sticking at it sometimes turning from it as frivolous sometimes turning to it as probable But when the testimony of the speaker commeth from Divine Scripture it confirmeth both the speach of the speaker and mind of the hearer But as for the Classis all that wee haue yet heard or seene from them for the justification of their Acts against us hath bene either the order * This is the reason they give in their act against Mr. Hooker why hee should not preach it was against the order of the Churches in these Countries of the Church or custome or tradition Now what saith God by Ieremy ‡ Cha. 10.3 The customes of the people are vaine Whatsoever savoreth against the truth is Heresie even old custome said Tertullian * De veland Virg. Custome saith ‡ Cypr. Ep. 74. ad Pomp. another without truth is the mother of errour And in another place * In l. 2. Ep. 3. ad Cicil. Wee must not follow the custome of men but the truth of God To the same purpose speakes Beza ‡ In Luc. 23.27 and others As for orders wee are so farre to be ordered by them as they accord with the order of the Gospell Touching Traditions wee know well enought what they say against them when they deale with the Papists Besides doth not Mr. Page tell us and that * Pag. 37. truely that many worthy Divines are sometimes mistaken Why then may not they be mistaken in our differences In truth wee have the more reason so to thinke considering they bring us no proofe for their doings herein saving bare authoritie And here by the way I thinke good to observe a little of Mr. Pagets talke in pag. 25. having set downe a great part of the Acts and sentences which the Classicall Assembly made against Mr. Hooker also what the Deputies of the Synod did in like manner judge of the thing Hee immediately begins to hold up his head and to looke so big upon us as if there were no remedie but wee must needs runne away and veeld him the cause Had these complaynants saith hee bene wise and considerate persons they would rather have sought to bury the memorie of these things then by their importunate complaints compell me in my owne defence to write these things which otherwise I should not have done But good Sir wherein lyeth the weight of this terrible matter what is it
2 sect 4. Excommunication precisely and chiefely pertaineth to the Church and that she hath authority to commit the execution thereof to some speciall persons for that purpose and chosen for that end To the same effect Willet a Synops cont 4. qu. 4 p. 2. And Tailor b Comm. on Tit. ch 3. v. 10. p. 712. sayth that excommunication is the common action of the Church and not of any private person or persons VVhat more obvious and cleare by these mens testimonies then that every particular Congregation hath power fully in it self to performe all Gods ordinances But hath not Mr. Paget in the meane time just cause to blush who denies to the Churches of God that due power which the Learned of all professions doe grant unto her For the Non-conformists I have already shewed that they consent fully with us Pag. 23. Notwithstanding some thing more I will here speake of them and the rather because time was when Mr. Paget did esteeme them to be a multitude of Godly and learned Ministers and was or at least made a shew hee was of their judgement and practise Hee that reades the controversy betweene Downame and the Replyer shall there see this very point betwixt Mr. Paget and us largely handled The Doctor stoutly maintaineth Mr. Paget position viz. that particular Churches are dependent and stand under another Ecclesiasticall authoritie out of themselves The other sayth otherwise and often affirmeth * Li. 2. par 2. p. 104. that the administration of all Church-matters at first was in everie congregation the right in the Church the execution in the Presbyterie thereof For this purpose hee instanceth Cenchrea * Li. 1. part 2. p. 22.23 howsoever it was the port of Corinth and not farre from it as Radcliffe or lime House to London yet it was a distinct Church from that of Corinth and alike indued with full power ‡ Note of Ecclesiasticall gouvernment Mr. Parker speakes downe right in this thing and prooves by Text of Scriptures judgement of ancient Fathers Confession of Protestant Divines and many unanswereable reasons that a Pol. Eccl. l. 3. c. 6. all Ecclesiasticall power is alwayes in the whole congregation from hence it flowes as from the fountaine and to the same it returneth as to the sea And here by the way I doe demaund of you Mr. Paget seeing every Minister as the Learned b Par. in 1. Cor. 3.2 Park Pol. Eccl. l. 3. c. 12. Tilen Specu Antichri p. 14. D. Whitak de con qu. 5. p. 118. rightly say is the Churches servant and under her authoritie and administreth for her VVhat warrant then you and others haue to make any decree or sentence against the mind and liking of a whole Church and to require them to submit thereto Me thinkes such doing becomes not servants And whither this be not to be Lords over Gods Heritage contrary to Peters charge I desire the humble and Godly to consider In Title page Vnto these wee will adde the Authour of the English Puritanisme a Booke as the Publisher reports containing the maine opinions of the rigidest sort of those that are called Puritaines * He meanes the foreward professours which stand out against the Ceremonies in the Realme of England among other truths 1. They hold and maintaine that every company Congregation or Assembly of men ordinarily joyning together in the true worship of God is a true visible Church of Christ and that the same title is improperly attributed unto any other convocations Synods Societies combinations or Assemblies whatsoever 2. They hold that all such Churches or Congregations communicating after that manner together in Divine worship are in all Ecclesiasticall matters equall and of the same power and authority and that by the word and will of God they ought to have the same spirituall Priviledges Prerogatives Officers Administrations Orders and formes of Divine worship 3. They hold that Christ Iesus hath not subiected any Church or Congregation of his note this to any other superiour Ecclesiasticall Iurisdiction then unto that which is within it self so that if a whole Church or Congregation shall erre in any matter of faith or Religion no other Church or spirituall Church-Officers have by any warrant from the Word of God power to censure punish or controule the same But are onely to advise them and so to leave their soules to the immediate iudgement of Christ and their bodies to the sword of the civill Magistrate c. 4. They hold that every established Church ought as a speciall prerogive wherewith shee is indued by Christ to have power and liberty to chuse their owne spirituall and Ecclesiasticall Officers c. 5. They hold that if in this choyse any particular Churches shall erre that none upon earth but the Civill Magistrate hath power to controule or correct them for it c. 6. They hold that the Ecclesiasticall Officers and Ministers of one Church ought not to beare any Ecclesiasticall office in another but ought to be tyed unto that Congregation of which they are members and by which they are elected into office c. There is nothing here sayd but many others of our learned Country-men have sayd the like as D. Ames a Casconsc l. 4. c. 29. Mr. Banes b Dioces Triall conclus 4. Mr. Bates c Pag. 66. Mr. Fenner d Against Bridg pag. 15.16 Mr. Vdall e Demonst. Discipl pag. 24.25 c. In the English Church at Franckford in Queene Maries dayes it was agreed upon that ‡ Discours of troub Frank. pag. 115. the Ministers and Seniours severally and iointly shall have no authority to make any manner of Decrees or Ordinances to bind the Congregation or any member thereof But shall execute such ordinances as shall be made by the Congregation and to them delivered Againe None shall be excommunicated untill the matter be first heared by the whole Church That the Ministers and Seniours and every of them be subiect to Ecclesiasticall discipline as other private members of the Church be Neither shall Mr. Hookers * In his answer to Mr. Pagets 20. quest Answ 11. Testimony be unremembred who affirmeth that a particular Congregation may lawfully and without sinne call a Minister without or against the approbation of the Classis And hee gives this reason for it They which had complete and perfect Ministers before any Classis had power fully to call them But a particular Congregation had perfect and complete Ministers perfectly and completely called before any Classis Ergo c. Thus Reader thou mayst perceive that Mr. Paget hath left the way of Non-conformitie yea and shewes himself to it a great adversary Indeed so sore a one that in his own words I may truely say As Herod to kill one infant Pag. 73. spared not to kill a multitude of other infants so hee that hee might undermine us and blow us up into the ayre hee cared not
viz. Ministers-must be chosen with the free consent of the Elders and the whole Congregation By the like authoritie as they were elected they may be deposed But nothing herein must be attempted without the determination of the whole Church VVhat those Synods were of whom Mr. Paget speaketh in pag. 66. who decreed that particular Congregations should not practise among themselves all Gods ordinances I doe not yet know but this I know that no Reformed Church hath made this an Article of their faith And therefore it is certaine if such a thing be it was onely the invention of some particular men For Conclusion now of this Section Howsoever I haue alleidged the opinions of many learned men Notwithstanding it is the word of God which I appeale unto for to haue the matter in controversy betwixt us onely tryed by and herein I doe no more then others doe which know they haue the truth on their side namely to call their opposites unto the Scriptures and to require of them to stand unto the undeceiveable sentence and judgement thereof Thus the Protestants a D. Whita de cont qu. 3 c. 3. D. Morton Apolo Cath. p. 2. l. 1. c. 32. Sutclif def Pont. Rom. l. 2. c. 9. p. 132. B. Iew. Apo. par 2. c. 5. D. 1. doe with the Papists And the Reformists b Par. Pol. Eccl. l. 1. c. 24. c Dever Eccl. Refor rat againe with them And for this purpose hath Zanchy ‡ a worthy speach in his writing unto D. Knols All things touching worship and Discipline ought to be examined not by the uncertain rule of humans judgement but by the touch-stone of Divine Scripture SECTION IX THat those who haue read Mr. Pagets Booke may not thinke that I haue purposely omitted any thing his jests slaunders and unchristian termes excepted which carieth with it the shew of any matter touching the maine points in question I haue thought good in this Section to set downe some brief answers unto certain colourable or rather carnall pretences which hee useth in the defence of himself and cause His first reason is this If particular * Preface Congregations should not stand under any other Ecclesiasticall authoritie out of themselves manifold disorders confusion and dissipation of Churches would follow Answ 1. VVhen God hath established an order for the administration of his owne house what presumption of man dares change it Thinkes hee that hee is wiser then the Almighty and can by his foolish way and devise bring more peace and profit to Gods house then the way of the all wise God But what will not dust and ashes presume to doe against his maker And that with shew of conveniency and to correct and reforme that which they conceive to be imperfect in his doings But it seemes in the meane time that these little consider how streightly the Lord hath forbidden such practises and what dreadfull plagues hee threatneth against men for it As Mr. Paget therefore wisheth others to take heed what new formes of Churches and Church-gouvernment Preface they frame unto themselves or command unto others So I desire that hee himself will make a proffitable use of his owne counsell 2. Be it well considered that God alwayes abhorreth all good intentes of men that are contrary to the good pleasure of his will revealed in his word The Church sayth Whitaker b De Rom. Pont. cont 4. qu. 1. p. 16. must not be gouverned as the wit of man thinketh fit but as Christ the Lord and King thereof will have it 3. This objection taken here up by Mr. Paget is the very same which the Papists and those that way affected use for to haue Ecclesiasticall Gouvernment by Presbyters rejected and their owne Popish Hierarchy everywhere received and practised viz. because the putting by of the later tendeth c Sarav de Tripli Epis in Prolog Sand. de visibl Monar l. 5. c. 4. Sculting Hier. Anarc l. 10. c. 20. l. 11.119.137 c. unto all mischief and the establishing of the former d Whitg Tract 3. c. 4 div 4. divis 8. pag. 169. Loe compl Chu p. 164 causeth uproares in the Church dissipateth it and overthrowes all good order therein 4. If particular Congregations must loose their right and power because of the offences which some men haue committed in the exercise thereof Then surely by the same reason if Mr. Pagets reasoning be worth any thing ought Classes and Synods to lay downe that superiour authority which they haue taken over many Churches because they in many things many times haue offended in and about the execution And this I am sure no good Christian will deny I could give divers instances for it but it needs not Onely it is not amisse to set downe Nazianzens ‡ Epist 42. ad Proc. words who was an Elder or Bishop I am minded sayth hee to shunne all assemblies of Bishops because I never saw any good event in any Councell that did not rather increase then diminish our evills Their contention and ambition passeth my speach VVhither things are better caryed now then they were in his time I will not nor am able to judge 5. If the infirmities of the people be a good reason to take away their liberty in practising among themselves all Gods ordinances then the contrary vertues which oftentimes haue bene found in them as instaying the rage of the Scribes and Pharisies a Mat. 21.26 Act. 3.26 in preferring sincere Christians before Arrians b Zezo l. 7. c. 7. and being themselves sound in the faith c Theod l. 2. cap. 7. when their Ministers haue bene Heretickes is a good reason to maintaine their liberty still Another thing which hee talkes much off Pag. 72. is that the power which the Classis exerciseth is ancient and hence names it the old beaten path Pag. 105. c. Answ 1. Sundry errours are as ancient as the Apostles time yea began before the most famous Churches in the world were planted Therefore as Cyprian d Epist. 63. sayth Wee must not regard what any others did before us or thought fit to be done but what Christ did who was before all 2. Howsoever Mr. Paget for the credit of his cause names it the old and ancient Discipline yet sure I am to proove it so hee never will nor can There are many and I thinke hee knowes it which doe affirme that the Ecclesiasticall Gouvernment by Classes and Synods is a weed that grew many yeares after the Apostles A late devise e Bilson perp gouver c. 16. p. 387 and that in all antiquitie there doth not appeare any one stept thereof f Sutclif Discipl c. 8. p. 138. Also that at Geneva subjecting of Churches to this order first begun g Brancroft surv c. 22. p. 353. Comp. Ch. p. 91. 93. 94. And before Calvin came there everie Congregation was free in it self h Hooke Ecc. Polit. Pref. Touching these
hold for an infallible maxime that to reforme corruptions and abuses in states a better course cannot be taken then to reduce things to their primitive originall Hereto agrees D. VVhites * Of the Church l. 2. pag. 49. saying The first in any kind or sort of things is truest and best 4. If it should be granted that particular Congregations by this kind of gouvernment shall haue peace profit credit and other worldly respects yet this is no sufficient reason to induce them to embrace it For 1. wee must seeke peace by lawfull meanes 2. Outward quietnes is not alwayes necessary for the Church the Truth is like unto Camomill the more you presse it downe the faster it groweth and spreadeth further and smelleth sweeter 3. Religion can subsist without externall peace I say safely in the midst of contentions 4. It is better to want this freedom of which hee speaketh holding fast the truth then in sinne to haue it and perish for it 5. It is a rule among Lawers ‡ Bartol Distinct pag. 2. that publicke profit must not take place against Law this holds firme in all cases of Religion To conclude then in Nazianzens * De Moderat in disceptat Servand words Let no man be wiser then is meet not more just then the Law more bright then the sun streaghter then the rule nor pretend more obedience then God requireth c. This hee speakes of Discipline Another of his reasons is this Pag 72.153 The power for which hee standeth hath bene determined limited and agreed upon in many Nationall Synods And all Reformed Churches use it Answ 1. It is a received opinion among the Learned that Councills may erre yea and often haue as I could shew in many particulars Besides who knowes not that almost all the Fathers as they are called were infected with the errour of Millenaries And almost all the Greeke writers and Latine with the doctrine of free-will merits invocation on the Saints and the like And therefore as one well sayth ‡ Sibrand Lubbert de princ Christ l. 7. c. 10. p. 694. Wee must not conclude a thing to be Apostolicall because the Church observeth it And to the same effect write some Papists * Tho Aqui in quod l. 9. Art ult Abb. Panor de elect c. significat 2. These testimonies are all humaine and therefore it is enought if wee say with our Lord ‡ Mat. 19.8 From the beginning it was not so Or as hee sayd once Woman what have I to doe with thee So in matters of faith what haue wee to doe with men Away with mens writings sayth Augustine let the voyce of God sound unto us Let the Booke of God come amongst us Let us heare what Christ saith and what the truth speaketh For our judgements and expositions without these witnesses have no credit sayth Origen 3. This reason is the same which the Papists use viz. the Decrees a Whitak cont 4. Qu. 5. c. 10. Sarav de Tripl Episc in Prolog Io. Ainsw Large writing 2. of Synods the opinions of the Fathers the custome of men and practise of the Church But marke what answer our Protestant Divines make to it No b D. Rain Confer p. 195.257.459 D. Bilson to the Semina part 4. pag. 360.300.301.299 D. More Apol. p. 2. c. 14. Casaub Epi. ad Per. Car. p. 32.33 humaine proofe is sure in Divinity truth is not to be tried by consent of Fathers Never shall they perswade us any thing in matter of Religion which they cannot proove by Moyses and the Prophets Make us good proofes out of Scriptures Otherwise if ye cite not onely 9 but 9 skore Fathers wee regard it not Now this answer will serve me as well seeing Mr. Paget and they doe use one and the same reasoning Another objection which hee hath against us is Because wee haue not framed our accusation and protestation against him before this present seeing the practise hath continued among us many yeares c. Answ Formy part I never knew that our Congregation was in such deepe bondage untill Mr. Hookers troubles began but thought verely that our owne Eldership with the Brethren jointly together had full power among themselves to practise every ordinance of God And the thing specially which induced me so to thinke was his owne words * Arâ—ow against sep pag. 116. writen to Mr. Ainsworth reporting how hee was first made our Minister hee sayth The Dutch Eldership in this City being desired hath for their counsell and help in his ordination deputed three of their Brethren to assist us in this busines c. this they did not as assuming authoritie ‡ Note to themselves over us but in our name and by our request Being now established when as of late another Minister was called unto our Congregation wee used not their help herein as before but his ordination was performed by our owne Ministerie and Eldership without them If the Classis assumed not then any authority unto themselves over us how comes it to passe that they doe it now Or how will it hang together that their power is ancient and yet 20 or 30 yeares past they used it not This to me seemes grosse contradiction and that hee eates his owne words as Saturne did his children But I gesse what hath caused him to tell two contrary tales namely the difference of the people against whom hee hath writen The first were Separatists and therefore no marvaile though against them hee pleaded for a free Congregation for hee well knew that unlesse hee went this way to worke hee should fall with dishonour in the controversie between them The other are the oppressed and burthened members of the English Church in Amsterdam Now to keepe these under their burden and oppression hee sees that hee must let goe his former hold and on the contrary say wee are not a free Congregation but stand under another Ecclesiasticall authoritie out of our selves Thus a good wit will serve a disputant in good stead for by it if hee list hee can as the Poëts fable of their Proteus turne himself into all shapes Like him who having made an excellent speach in the commendation of justice afterwards spake as wittily to the contrary shewing that there was no justice at all in the world Or like a Gentleman of whom I haue heard that in an Assembly of States such as wee call Parliaments was absolutely the best speaker yet nothing respected and that for a most sufficient reason which was this They knew full well hee could speake as well and as moovingly to that which was quite contrary And I willingly professe that Mr. Paget hath a rare faculty this way to turne a thing which way hee will and make it say either I or no or both when hee pleaseth Notwithstanding this I must tell him the very thing which hee speakes off touching Mr. Robinsons Booke is now true concerning his owne former writing It is sicke of King Iehorams incurable desease Arrow pag. 59. the guttes of it fall out day by day Yea hee openlie pluckes out some of bowells thereof with his owne hands There are some other objections of the like nature which hee useth against us partly to disgrace our persons partly our cause as that wee doe not agree among our selves touching the due power of the Church That the practise which wee stand for is Brownisme c. Answ Such cavillations the a Celsus pag. 802. Lactant. l. 4. c. ult Isod Pelus Epist 90. Heathens haue used sometimes against Christian Religion so Papists b Bellar. de not Eccl. against Protestants and the like they c Brone Serm. pag. 103.104 Casend Answ to Abstract p. 210. c. Whitg p. 888. Loe comp cha p. 47. D. Bridg. l. p. 134. against Reformists Now I will not stand to make any particular answer hereto because the folly and vanity of it is sufficiently shewed by others d Iew. Def. Apol. p. 3.8.2.1 Whitak cont 4. qu. 5. c. 8. Sutclift de Eccl. p. 109. D. Mort. Apol 1. l. 2. who haue had occasion hereto-fore to reply unto such idle objections This onely for conclusion I desire may be noted that whereas hee seekes to disgrace Christs Gouvernment and to haue his owne honoured and embraced in this hee doth as one said in Tully of Hortensis when hee immoderately praysed eloquence that hee would have lift her up to heaven that hee himself might have gone up with her So I perceive Mr. Paget would faine haue the Classicall Discipline advanced that hee by it might haue worldly credit also Ioh. 13.17 If ye know these things blessed are ye if ye doe them FINIS ERRATA For were read where pag. 3. l. 13. For fayling read faylings p. 4. l. 22. For partialty read partiality p. 10. l. 33. For contended read contented p. 12. l. 15. For take read talke p. 15. l. 26. For word read world p. 33. l. 27. For conquest read conquer p. 51. l. 22. For notwithstand read notwithstanding p. 74. l. 15. For touching read touch-stone p. 77. l. 25.
If a father should withhold from his children seasonable and holesome food were it not a sufficient cause of weeping and mourning For our parts wee cannot judge otherwise of his caraige towards us howsoever hee blesseth himself in it The 11 and last injury is to all that take pleasure in these offences hee being a meanes to harden them in sinne Answ This is onely a begging againe of the question and therefore it is answered before For conclusion then here I may in his owne words say Pag. 32. Such reproaches are quicklie broched but the guilt of them is not so quicklie and easilie taken away Besides these I find many other untruths and reproaches laid upon me in his Booke unto all which I shall give answer in time But as for the writer of them I will say no more but that which the Reader shall find by experience Pro. 25.28 That as abattered city without walles so is hee that cannot rule his affections for his eger desire to fasten upon us hee cared not what hath left his writings naked without all reasonable and honest defence SECTION IV. IN this Section my purpose is to examen Mr. Pagets answers unto certaine Scriptures alleaged by us and Mr. Davenport in our writings First to proove that Christ hath given full power unto every particular Congregation to chuse freelie their owne Ministers wee mentioned Act. 6.3 and 14.23 Mr. Paget to refute us deviseth 8 Answers Pag. 18.19.20.21.22 amongst which there is not one that answereth to the thing at all nor serves his turne in the least for which hee bringeth it It is not necessary that I should here write downe all his words I will therefore onely take the substance of them which is thus 1. Wee accuse other Ministers besides himself 2. The order against which wee complaine hath bene formerlie observed in our Church 3. Wee are partiall because wee disliked not the thing sooner 4. Hee tells us what order the Synods have devised about the calling of Ministers 5. Wee are taught a thing never doubted of that the Elders ought to goe before the people in all the publick actions of the Church 6. If this be not so great absurditie will follow 7. If wee were apart well examined hee assures himself that few of us would be found to agree with one another touching the due order of elections 8. It is an heinous crime no lesse then sacriledge to deprive the Church of her lawfull power But is this to answer or rather in truth to play the Trifler For what are these 8 Replies but so many shifts and windings even miserable starting holes and scope doores for him to fly out at doth hee not here turne his backe upon the case as not willing to stand to it I wish hee would once againe read our Scriptures and his answer to them and to perswade him hereto I will presume though I looke to be requited with shrewd words for my labour to propose it to his view in this manner If the complaint made by William Best and the Subscribers with him be against Mr. Paget others If the order against which they complaine be ancient If they haue done ill in not blaming the thing till now If the Synods haue prescribed and order of calling Ministers If the Elders ought to goe before the Church in all publike actions If hurt will follow otherwise If the Complaynants cannot agree among themselves touching the due order of elections In short if it be a great sinne to deprive the Church of her due power Then doe not these Scriptures Act. 6.3 and 14.23 proove that Christ hath given full power to his Church to chuse freely their owne Ministers But the first is true Therefore the second Mr. Paget needs not to take it amisse that I have syllogistically framed this argument for him For beleeve it unlesse it goe this way a man may say of his reasoning here as of them in the Proverbe Hee asked for hookes and they say they have no mattocks Notwithstanding I doe not impute this to his insufficiency but to the badnes of his case Hee perceiving in likelyhood that these Scriptures made for us and against him thought of a course how to put them by and save his owne credit too and that was by holding his Reader in a long talke For will not many thinke when they shall read 7 or 8 scoore lines writen to confute 3 or 4. But the thing is soundly done 2. For the matter in pag. 20. I would willingly know why he hath writen a whole side to proove that the Gouvernours of the Church ought to goe before c. hath this thing ever bene in question Knoweth hee not that our difference is not about our owne Eldership But whither Officers of other Churches have ought to doe as by power with the administrations of our Congregation This indeed wee deny but nothing els Why therefore doth hee spend time in unncecessary talke If his heart be upright and hee thinke his case good let him speake out plainely and directly in it VVee affirme that the election and ordination of all Ecclesiasticall Officers ought necessarily to be made by the free chose of the Congregation wherein they are to administer and none else have a calling to meddle therewith For this wee bring the word of God Act. 6.3 and 14.23 Not wrested to serve our Turne but understood in that sence which the learned expound it as Cartwright a Refut Rbem on Act. 14.23 Bates b Pag. 66. Vdal c Demonst discip pag. 24.25 Danaeus d In 1 Tim. c. 5. p. 350. Fenner e Sacr. Theol. l. 7. c. 10. pag. 106. Polanus f Syntag. l. 7. c. 16. p. 543 Piscator g In Act. 6. Observ 2. Beza h Annot. in Act. 14.23 the Authors of the admonition to the Parliament i Lib. 1. p. 3 Church gouvernment k Pag. 40. Necessity of Discipline l Pag. 28. Defence of Ecclesiasticall Discipline m Pag. 40. and many others But Mr. Pagets profession and practise is otherwise Hee sayth * Preface that particular Congregations are not independent but stand under other Ecclesiasticall authority out of themselves And to have his Reader to be of the same mind with him hee tels him in pag. 19. and 66. that the Synods in these Countries have agreed to have it so If hee had told us and prooved it that Christ or his Apostles had so commaunded wee would haue embraced it forthwith but not the sooner because men have done it Our reasons are these 1. It doth not belong unto Synods as the Learned * Beza de Eccles c. 5. p. 125. Piscat Thes Theolog. loc 23. p. 372. Iusti. Mart. n Dial. cum i Tripho affirme to make new Articles of Religion nor to bring any thing into Gods house which hee hath not commaunded in his word Ministers sayth one ‡ D. Whita cont 4. quoe
then to apply Act. 20.28 to the matter in hand whereas Paul appointeth the Ephesian Elders unto the care and charge onely of their owne particular Congregation and no further it followeth necessarily this being writen for our imitation that every Minister under the Gospell is to containe himself altogether within the bounds and circuit of his owne Church and not to exercise any act of his ministerie otherwhere For to doe it is meerely intrusion and a taking of to much upon him 1. Cor. 7.24 Therefore Let every man wherein hee is called therein abide with God Els others will be injured good order broken scandalls raysed and the doer severely punished for his irregular walking Observe againe how Mr. Paget makes use of the Papists argument for thus writeth Scultingius The Calvinists sayth hee object that the authority of Bishops and Archbishops is not from the Apostles Hierarch l. 10. p. 79. because Act. 15. the controversie there was not confirmed by them but by the whole Church Now marke how prittily hee answereth to it This will not follow for the authority of Bishops Archbishops might be exercised at other times in the Apostles dayes although then it were not Thus hee drawes out Antichrist sword against us onely hee puts a new scabbard upon it His third answer is that Pastours and Teachers are bound to exercise some acts of their ministery towards those who are no members of their Church And why so Because they ought to invite and call others even those that are without Prov. 9.3.4.5 Mat. 28.19.20 Answ 1. I would willingly know of him whither his office be so with him and alwayes about him that hee cannot performe some good actions but they must needs be actions of his Ministery I and others are otherwise minded our reason is because wee are told that as a man and wife a father and child so a Pastour and a Flock are relatives Now in my understanding as I am a father I exercise no proper acts of a father but towards my owne children what good soever I doe to others it cannot properly be said to be the act of a father but rather of a freind a neighbour a Christian c. Now let him make further application of it 2. For his two Scriptures 1. Mat. 28.19.20 is very unskilfully quoted for howsoever the Apostles exercised some Acts of their ministery towards men without yet this prooves not that ordinary Ministers may doe so too but onely a thing so conceited of him The other place is answered before 4. Hee saith that a Pastour may administer the Sacraments both of Baptisme and the Lords Supper in neighbour Churches and this hee sayth hee hath prooved against Mr. Ainsworth in Arr. pag. 17.18 and againe from pag. 109. to 114. Answ 1. As Parents love their owne children because they begat them how ill-favored and black soever they are So Mr. Paget in this place applaudeth his old writings because they are the inventions of his owne head I have 3 or 4 times read the places over and I doe assure thee Reader I find not any thing there prooved of which hee here so vainely boasteth For either hee takes that granted which hee is not able to proove to wit that the Elders Deacons and widowes of one Church may administer in another by vertue of office or els like the unwise mans building his whole discours is without foundation Hee tels us that the Eldership of the separated companie of Leiden did help Mr. Ainsworth in his Controversie with Mr. Iohnson VVhat then must it follow that they exercised some acts of their Ministery in another Congregation For sooth so hee concludeth but how truely I will here manifest in this argument If the Magistrates of Amsterdam performe sometime a worke of mercy to the people at Harlem then they exercise there some acts of their Magistracy but the first is true Therefore the second If Mr. Paget will compare his manner of reasoning with this hee shall see that blood is not more like to blood then these two one the other But I gesse what causeth him to erre herein Hee thinketh that Officers of a Church cannot be helpfull in some causes unto other people but they exercise acts of their Ministery But the thing is not so for whatsoever they doe in such cases they doe it not as Officers but as Christians neither can they now doe more though Ministers in other Churches then any other Brother may doe being indued with the like gifts One thing here I cannot let passe and that is touching his unsound reasoning in pag. 110. Hee tels Mr. Ainsworth that his similitude from a Husband is against himself The reason hee gives for it is because a Husband notwithstanding his relation and bond unto his owne wife may yet become a protectour and guide of the poore widow that wants a Husband to performe these dueties If Mr. Paget will stand to justify the true proportion of his argument as it must necessarily hold or els it is mere vanity I will hence proove from his writing that adultery is lawfull for thus I reason That which is the peculiar duety of husbands to be performed towards their wives is to give them due benevolence But husbands notwithstanding the relation and bonds unto their owne wives may performe the peculiar dueties of husbands to poore widowes Therefore husbands notwithstanding the relation and bond unto their owne wives may have the use of the bodies of poore widowes If hee doe not grant this hee reasoneth without reason For I hope hee will not deny but a man that is no husband may performe many kind offices to poore widowes yea I thinke hee will confesse that a man unmaried may doe as many good turnes to poore widowes as any husband If so then of a certainty either hee must maintaine whoordome as I sayd before or confesse that which hee writes here is most impertinent and that the comparison holds no further but thus viz. that any man out of office may in other Congregations performe as much duety as those which are not Ministers there I hope his sinne here was of ignorance rather then of wilfullnes and that hee had a devotion to serve God a right though hee tooke not in this the right way wherein hee will be served And thus much is sufficient to confute whatsoever hee hath there said Let us therefore proceed to the next For his 5 answer I can better understand his meaning then make either sence or good English of it To proove that a Pastour is bound to exercise his Ministery in some acts thereof towards those who are no members of his Church hee brings the example of Classes and Synods where many Ministers doe meet together for the administration of Discipline in them and to determine and decide by a joint authority the cases and controversies of sundry Congregations and this hee sayth is to be seene in Act. 15.1.2 Answ Who seeth not that this plea is none
neither was it a seale of the Covenant of grace to Noe and his seed But was commaunded to Abraham and his seed and house-hold and such onely as would be of that Church and partake of the Passeover Therefore it not being commaunded to Noes sonnes such as abode in his faith howbeit scattered afarre of were doubles in the Covenant of grace still and saved as well as wee I say without circumcision for the same was not imposed on them And this is the judgement of learned men viz. Paraeus a Comment in Rom. 3.1 9.4 D. Willet b Comment Rom. ch 3. Q. 1. p. 146 Galatine c Lib. 11. c. 7. pag. 581. and the Hebrew writers d Maimony in Misneth Treat of Kings ch 10 sect 7. Treat circums ch 1. sect 3.6 say as much The next Scripture is Act. 2.39 For the promise is unto you and to your children and to all that are afarre off Even as many as the Lord our God shall call His whole answer hereto is this Though the promise be made unto such as are called yet who can shew that such are not to be counted outwardlie called and in some measure within the priviledge of the Covenant who being themselves alreadie baptized and withdrawing themselves from other sects and Churches doe bring their infants unto the true Church to be baptized being there also readie to make a publicke profession of their faith before the Congregation Thus hee Answ 1. For his phrase here to count men outwardly called I see no warrant for it in all the Scriptures For whomsoever in the judgement of charity wee can judge to be outwardlie called them I take it are by us to be judged inwardly called also Philip. 1.7 1. Cor. 13. I confesse indeed if wee haue respect unto God then it may be said that some are onely outwardlie called But who these some are wee cannot tell and therefore wee may not give sentence in it Ro. 14.14 If hee say that hee intended both then I answer 1. Hee should haue done well to haue spoken out plainly so 2. Then it must follow that all such Parents whose infants hee and others baptise be their conversation never so bad are notwithstanding in his opinion the elect and chosen of God 3. Hee ought not to keepe backe one of them from his Congregation if they desire to be members thereof Againe But if hee say hee judgeth them not to be inwardly called then by his owne confession it must follow that they want true faith and repentance and so hee giveth and that of knowledge holy things to the unworthy and to persons wholy uncapable thereof 2. I cannot tell what hee intendeth by the priviledge of the Covenant if hee meane Baptisme then I answer This ordinance is given to the Church and no person lawfully may be admitted to it unlesse hee be a member thereof * See the two next Sections If hee have any other meaning when I know it I shall be ready to give a further answer to it 3. For what reason doth hee add these words viz. and withdrawing themselves from other sects and Churches Is it not because as I sayd before hee would haue people thinke that it is not their practise to baptise all infants brought unto them Me thinkes if his heart perswades him that his case is good hee should not seeke thus closely to with-draw the Reader from the question but speake out clearely in it and to this purpose say It is the custome of the Dutch Church and my practise also that what infants soever are brought unto us for Baptisme to baptise them be the Parents of them holy or unholie members of any particular Church or not Yea howsoever wee know that the children presented unto us are Bastards yet if the Parents or in their absence some other doe shew a consent unto certaine questions either by nodding with the head or saying Yea Amen or so be it wee put them not backe neither ought wee but give them the holie seale of remission and pardon of finne Indeed this had bene plaine dealing and nothing but the truth And therefore whereas hee tels us of men outwardlie called withdrawing themselves from other sects And againe * Pag. 145. of having more knowledge of the truth c. then some of those that are members of the Church What is this but meere dawbing for what use serves it but like the rough garment to deceive Hee knowes and wee know it too If infants be brought in the manner aforesayd all is well it matters not whose children they be viz. whither English Dutch French c. nor how vile and wicked the Parents of them haue formerly alwayes bene to that houre and time I would not speake so often of this thing but that hee constraineth me to it in regard hee laboureth to hide from the Readers the true knowledge of the point in question But hence let it be considered whither in this hee give not cause of just suspition unto them to thinke that hee is ashamed to appeare a Defendant ‡ So hee cals himself in pag. 146. in the case as it stands simply and nakedly betweene us The last Scripture is 1. Cor. 5.12 For what have I to doe to judge them also that are without doe not yee judge them that are within To this first Mr. Paget answereth It is not plainely discribed how Mr. Davenport applies this sentence to the question in hand it had bene good if hee had shewed how hee had drawne his argument from hence Answ M r Paget among many Disputers had the least reason to make a complaint this way for hee in his writing not onely leaves the maine points in controversy untouched but also for the unnecessary matters which hee bringeth in they are such oracles or rather riddles as to understand them a man had need hee were either another Oedipus or had hee himself present to expound them Notwithstanding hee should have remembred that hee being the doer of the things in this controversy the burden of prooving lay directly on his shoulders And therefore it had bene his part plainely to have demonstrated from the Scripture that which hee affirmeth touching the Classis and Baptisme for one testimony or argument rightly drawne from the Apostolicall writings to justify these assertions will easily draw us to acknowledge them But till then though hee write ten volumes more and each of them ten times greater then this yet never shall hee be able to convince the conscience of any indifferent Reader in the points which hee hath undertaken to be a Defendant to wit 1. that particular Congregations are to be dependent bodies and to stand under other Ecclesiasticall authoritie out of themselves 2. That infants may be baptized whose Parents are not joyned to any particular visible Church But to the point This Scripture fitly serves to proove the point in hand for the scope and drift of the Apostle there
be feared I say againe those that offend this way may justly feare Gods punishment because hee doth not manifest more displeasure against any sinne then the prophanation of his ordinances nor threatneth to inflict soorer punishments upon any then offenders herein a Levit. 10.2.4 Chron. 13.10 And this is the judgment of sundry of our best Divines viz. Iunius b Anal. expl Levit. c. 10 p. 27. Brentius c Comment in Am. c. 4. v. 4.6 Piscator d Observ 3. in Levit. 10. Paraeus e In Am. 2.12 Cartwright f Catech. pag. 102. and others SECTION VI. HOwsoever I could be well contended in these our differences to deale with Mr. Paget by the Scriptures alone as the booke of all truth knowing as Augustine * De Doct. Christ l. 2. c. 9. sayth that all things concerning faith and manners are contained in them Notwithstanding in regard hee * Pag. 15. vainely boasteth to be caried away with the streame of the Learned who concurre in judgement with him c. I haue thought good to make inquirie about the opinions of men in this matter betwixt us as being loth hee should oppresse the truth and make all men afraid of it by making them beleeve that is desolate and forsaken of all freinds Beginning therefore with our writers I judge it meet and convenient to alleadge in the foremost place the mature sentence of Maister Cartwright In his Reply to D. Whitgift * Pag. 172. l. 1. hee writes thus I doe see that Maister Doctor doth make of the Holy Sacrament of Baptisme which is an entry into the house of God and whereby the familie of God must onely ‡ Note that enter a common passage whereby hee will have cleane and uncleane Holy and prophane as well those that are without the Covenant as those that are within to passe by and so maketh the Church no Houshold but an Inne to receive whosoever commeth * Iust so doth Mr. Paget I will answer therefore all most in as many words as the questions be asked If one of the Parents be neither drunkard nor adulterer the child is holie by vertue of the Covenant for one of the Parents sake If they be both and yet not obstinate in their sinne whereby the Church hath not proceeded to excommunication themselves yet being of the Church * Note their child cannot nor ought not to be refused Againe a few lines after speaking of Papists and other ungodly men Hee affirmeth absolutely that their children ought not to be baptised In the next place wee will consider the Authour of a certaine Booke Pag. 111.112 entituled The Covenant betweene God and man hee there maintaineth this point which wee here professe Baptisme sayth hee is to be administred to them onely that are in the Covenant and that the Reader might understand whom hee meanes to be in the Covenant Hee addeth immediatelie They are such as professe the faith joyne themselves together in a fellowship craue to have their names enrouled and registred in the Church and so partake of the manifould graces of God which are distributed therein To these wee will adde Maister Viret * Ground Reli. p. 230. a rare light of the Gospell and partner with Mr. Farell in planting the Church at Geneva before Calvin came there None sayth hee are to be baptised but the children of the faithfull and beleevers all except these are to be instructed in the doctrine before they be admitted thereunto Piscator likewise is as plaine as can be They onely sayth hee are to be baptised which belong to the Church On Mat. ch 28. Obse in v. 19. For as in old time they circumcised the children of the Iewes because they belonged to the Church and covenant so now c. Mr. Fenner a Doct. of the Sacra sayth the very same so Paraeus b In Mat. 3.5 Erastus c De excom p. 18.24 Melancton d Loc. Com. pag. 383. Keckerman e System Theol. l. 3. p. 453. speaking of the lawfullnes of the baptising of infants gives this as the reason of it viz. because they are members of the Church The like saying wee find in a Booke named a generall confession of Christian Churches Because God receiveth into his Church the children with the fathers Wee say by the authoritie of Christ infants begotten of faithfull Parents ought to be baptized Also Beza * In 1. Cor. 7.14 sayth Such as doe permit all children to be baptized doe a thing unheard off in the primitive Church Neither may Tertullians testimony be omitted speaking as Iunius interprets him of such children as were strangers from the Covenant of God Let them come when they are growne to yeares Let them come when they have learned and are taught wherefore they come Let them then be made Christians when they can know Christ Moreover this is the unanimous confession of all the Reformed Churches to wit that Baptisme appertaineth to such infants as are in the Church and borne of beleevers And for this reason they say they administer unto them the seale of the Covenant viz. because with their Parents they are received into the Church Thus write the Churches of Saxonie a Harm Conf. Art 18. Bohemia b Chapt. 12. France c Art 35. Scotland d Harm Conf. p. 24. Helvetia e Art 20.21 and Belgcik f Art 34. Object 1. But this thing hath been in these Countries a long time practised and therefore it is not meet that so ancient a custome should be laid downe Answ 1. When the truth is knowne sayth Augustine ‡ L. 2. Ep. ad Gaudent let custome give place unto it For * Ambr. l. 4. Virg. wee must not allwayes imitate whatsoever our Elders have allowed but try by the Scriptures whither the things are good which they allowed And thus doe these Churches * A generall Confess of Christ. Church in their writings professe to the world that they judge it of small force in controversie of Religion to be urged with the bare sentenoes of Fathers or with the Decrees of Councills much lesse with received custome or with continuance of time For wee admit they say no other judge in matter of faith then God himself pronounced in his Word 2. By this custome they give the Anabaptists great advantage and nihilate the best argument which our Divines use against them for the lawfullnes of baptising of infants And that this is so let it be observed that the Reason which they in this point doe stick most too is this namely that children of Christians by the same warrant * Calv. in Mat. 18. v. 10. Gerhard Harm Euang c. 12. pag. 352. Cent. 1. l. 2. c. 4. p. 355. D. Willet on Rom. 6. p. 303. Cartwr Christ Rel. c. 37. p. 223. are now to be baptized that the infants under the Law were circumcised Now I haue prooved before
Assertions I cannot see how Mr. Paget or any other is able to disproove them It is acknowledged on all sides that in the first hundred yeares after the Apostles Ministers and Brethren of sundry Congregations met sometimes to conferre mutually together of common Church-affaires yet so as every particular Congregation had alwayes as the Centuries i Cent. l. 2. c. 4. p. 391. write power and authority in themselves to chuse their Officers reject Heretickes excommunicate offenders and the like So againe for a hundred yeares next after wee read in Eusaebeus k L. 3. c. 22. L. 5. c. 16. L. 3. c. 19. Iraeneus a L. 3. c. 1.2.3 Nicephorus b L. 4. c. 23. and others that neighbour Ministers came often together when there was any daungerous errour broched or weighty points to be determined serving for generall good but this they did of liberty not of duety partly to preserve mutuall society as Zipperus * L. 3. c. 7. sayth and partly that they might hereby be the more able to resist adversaries as Mr. Parker ‡ Eccl. Pol. p. 329. 330 sayth This ancient combination wee hold to be lawfull and necessary that is when there is just occasion that then Ecclesiasticall Officers and others doe come together to conferre of things yea and conclude if they can what they judge meet and good Notwithstanding whatsoever they doe in such cases the same is of no force at all I mean as to be counted a Church-act or sentence unlesse the Church first know it and give their free consent unto it the reason is because the power and authority to make Church-acts is in the body of the Congregation as wee haue before shewed As for any other kind of combinations of many Ministers together otherwise then wee haue here related as the word of God sheweth it not neither doth antiquity If by antiquity the first and best ages of Christian Churches be understood I will not here dispute how things went about Constantines time because as the Learned say viz. Casaubon a Ad Card. Peron Obs 4. p. 30. 31 D. Whitaker b De Rom. Pont. cont 4 pag. 5. Mornaeus * Hist Pap. pag. 37. 38. Brightman ‡ In Apoc. ch 2 p. 67. and others that men began then to devise a new order and manner of Gouverning Churches according as they thought fittest to agree with the times And so much wee find testified by Cyprian e De Lapsis Epist l. 4. c. 4. Eusaebius f Lib. 8. cap. 1. and Ambrose g In 1. Tim. 5. For the change it self This new created Discipline was not Classicall but rather Episcopall so that howsoever they are both children of the earth notwithstanding this I doe affirme that of the two the Hierarchie is the oldest And howsoever Mr. Beza is very streyt to the people hardly granting the liberty which the very Iesuits * Maldon upon Mat. 18. doe yet hee is constreyned to confesse that the first Deacons were chosen by them but sayth hee ‡ In respons ad Tract de Ministr Euang. de grad c. 22. fol. 154.155 this manner of election was neither essentiall nor perpetuall For after when experience taught that confusion and ambition rysing by the occasion of the multitude increasing was to be prevented The Synod of Laodicea prudently tooke order by their 13 Canon that the election of such as were chosen to the sacred Ministerie should not be permitted to the multitude or people My purpose is not to say any thing now of that Synod how of the 59 Canons mentioned by Gratian * Distinct. 16. some are false others foolish and many very superstitious This onely I desire the Reader to note whereas it is here objected that this Synod prohibited the body of the Congregation from using that liberty and power which they before alwayes had in Ecclesiasticall gouvernment and gave it as hee sayth a little after to assembly of Pastours By this testimony then that which I sayd but now is further confirmed namely that the Classicall authority is neither divine nor ancient for this Synod of Laodicea was held after the death of Iovinian the Emperour Anno 370. or thereabout Thirdly hee pretendeth that the Discipline which hee standeth for is a sanctuarie against Tyrannie ‡ Pref. and if men had not libertie to appeale unto Classes they should have cause to bewaile their slaverie and bondage * Pag. 83. Answ 1. It is a strange course when there ariseth a controversy touching two contrary opinions which of them is true and to be embraced to draw the resolution hereof to the consideration of the usefullnes of the opinions or practises questioned As if because a thing is usefull therefore it is to be concluded it is true And not rather in case it be found to be true yea the very truth of God the rule whereof is Gods word therefore wee ought to conclude it is usefull and be carefull to make such use of it as wee are commaunded But what more common now a dayes then for me to obtrude their owne devises upon people upon a bare pretence of the usefullnes of them in mans judgement But in the meane time doe not those which take such courses for the maintenance of their way manifest hereby that their cause is desperate and that it seemes they haue no grounds for their opinions out of the word of God I say when they runne out unto such divinations as these for the supporting of their labouring and wavering cause As for example if the Scriptures doe directly teach That every particular Congregation hath power to exercise Ecclesiasticall Gouvernment and all Gods other spirituall ordinances in and for it self immediately from Christ shall wee not embrace this for a truth unles it appeare in our phantasie more usefull then the contrary 2. Let it againe be observed that the Papists and Hierarchie for their Discipline give the very same reason viz. to preserve the unitie and peace of the Church a Duaran Dist 8. for the avoyding of sehismes and faction b D. White of the Church l. 3. p. 157.158 that there may be no Tyranny and oppression among Brethren c Sand. de visib Mon. l. 5 c. 4. c. yea the corrupting at first of Church-gouvernment was done to prevent evill d Hieron ad Engr. but as one sayth e D. Whita cont 4 pref p. 3. the remedie was worse then the desease And truely so wee may say of all devises of men brought into the worship of God although the Authours doe it to prevent this or that evill notwithstanding the invention it self prooves and wee haue seene it by experience more hurtfull then the thing pretended against 3. I doe deny that this Gouvernment by Classes and Synods serves better for the Churches wellfaire then that which the Apostles instituted and the primitive Churches first practised Wise Politicians in their institutions of Gouvernment doe