theyr childrē Iosu v. Exo. iiii The Apostles were the most faithfull ministers of god Thē did not thei omit or leaue the thinge that was not brought in in stede of the circumcision Ergo thei did baptise not onli thē that were of age but also children v. Fyftely we do thus reason vpō the vse custome of the Aposltes The Apostles of Christ did dyrecte al their doinges to the cōueniencie example of the old testamēt This we do proue by ye. iiii Euangelists the Actes of the apostles by the epistles of the Apostles Rom. xv ii Cor. ii ii Tim. iii. ii Peter .i. chap. Ergo they dyd order baptisme after the Analogie and figure of the old Testament The going through the red sea The goynge thorough the read sea is a figure of baptism was a type figure of the baptisme that was to come .i. Cor. x. cha Children were in the fygure for bothe men and women went through with theyr children Ergo the apostles dyd not denie baptisme vnto the children The custome maner of the scripture whiche custome and maner is vsed almost emong al nations is not to reherce by name women children and yet neuerthelesse it doth include them for in the name of the father of the famylie or of the good man of the house al hys whole famylie is comprehended as in the chiefe or head Yf thys were not women shuld be in no small ieoperdy yf therfore they were not of god because that they be not circumcised Al these thynges are done by the meanes helpe of a figure that is called Sinecdoche The sixte argument shal be taken out of the manifest and expresse testimonies of the apostles The apostles did baptyse al whol housholds and famylies ergo they did baptyse children also for the children are in the number of the famylie or housholde Thys we do proue by the .xvii of Gene. For Abraham doth circumcise al the male children that were in his house For he vnderstode the promys of god that saith I shal be thy god the god of thy sede Likewyse in the new Testament whē the goodman of the house had herd beleued the gospell that is to saie the god was his god the god of his sede also he caused all them that were in his house bothe greate and small to be baptized Thus the apostles dyd baptize hole housholds and famylies That the children do perteyne vnto the fathers housholde famylie it is plaine manifest by the .xii. of Exodus ii of the Actes this do I inculcat beate the oftener into mens heades because that I se the Anabaptistes to be at this poynt that they do exclude the children from the famylie houshold for they can not denye but the hole housholds were baptized by the Apostles But who doth not se that this cometh of mere contention For though they could proue that there were no children at all in the famylies housholdes that the apostles dyd baptise yet had they not proued that al families or housholds were or be wtout childrē wherfore we do make againe our argument after this maner The Apostles baptized al wholl housholdes ergo thei did baptise children syth the childrē are the princypal chief part of the familie houshold But let vs put the case that there were no children in those families housholds that the Apostles dyd baptise yet do they perteine belong to the houshold are rekened in it and yf there had bene any they wolde haue baptized thē For they did baptise the wholl housholde The fault then shuld not haue ben in the Apostles nor in the childrē that thei were not baptized but this had bene the cause that they had bene baptized because that there were none For if they had had children they would haue baptyzed them Seuenthlye we do gather by the hystoryes chronicles that the baptisme of children hath continued euer sens the apostles time vnto this time Origene which in the yeare of our saluation c.c .xii. did liue in the church of Alexandria doth in his v. boke that he did wryt vpon the epistle to the Romaines testifie and witnesse that he hath receaued the baptisme of children from or of the Apostles After this time about the yeare of oure Lorde C.C.lv. the holy man Cipryan was he doth proue that with no small argumentes the baptisme of children in the .iii. boke of hys Epistles and viii epistle Adfidum To fidus In the yere of our lord c.c.c.xx Lactantius did wryte in the .iiii. boke of his diuyne Insttucion the baptism was come in the stede of circūcisiō whereby all natyons should be gathered vnto the faith into the church Lactantius in hys iiii boke iiii chapte Hierome which did lyue about the yere of our lord c.c.c. lxx doth with playn expresse scriptures proue the baptism of children to Leta and agaynst the Pelagians In the same self tyme and .xl. yeares after Augustyn beyng a man endued with great holynesse of lyfe with exceading great erudition learnyng with a sharpe and exacte iugement did teche in Aphrica This man writeth many thinges of baptism against the Donatistes to Marcellinus Petilianus where he doth manifestely saye Chryste coulde not be baptized afore the baptism was instituted by Ihō For the lawe dyd regne tyll them that the church hath receiued the baptisme of children from the apostles I haue brought these thynges therfore that thou mayste see vnderstand that the baptisme of children is no new inuention that they whyche teche suche thinges do leane to no truth but to plaine errour For although christ was not baptized tyll he was .xxx. yeares old yet being an infant he was circūcised vpon the eyght daye that I shoulde in the meane season let passe that baptisme was not yet instituted which had hys begynnyng of Ihon. But now we wyll stryke vp our sayle clothes and shewe how vnkunninglye ye gather your argumentes when ye do reason after this maner We do not read that the apostles dyd baptise the chyldren of the faythfull Ergo they oughte not to be baptised If we shoulde onelye goo by coniectures and reason it is more lykelye that the Apostles dyd baptyse the infauntes then otherwyse in the famylye and housholde of Stephana of Lidia of the keper of the prison of other yf at leste there were any infantes in those famylyes and housholdes Do not thynke good reader that we goo about to defende vnwrytten verytes which examples ye shall neuer be able to cōfute There be many things done both by Christ and by the apostles that neuer were written Nor we can not make our argument after this maner This thinge was not done ergo it may not lawfully be done That we shuld graunt vnto you the the apostles did baptise no children yet haue ye not proued therfore that children ought not to be baptized Again we
SI What on the .viii. day IO. We are bound neither to time nor too place but we are fre frō all those thinges by Christ Al thinges thē being considered We are free from al outward ceremonies of the lawe by Christ it is manifest and plaine that the baptism of children is of god against the which sith that the anabaptistes do repugne it is wythout doubt that they do contrary the gospell the election of God and the euerlasting couenaunt They are therfore ouer bold rash they are open violatours or breakers of the couenaunt of god vnfaith ful against god sith that they do exclude and debarre them from the couenaunt of God whome gods grace dothe comprehende in the couenaunte SIMON Yet ye haue no expresse word of God the children ought to be baptized IOIA. Shall not all that we haue hetherto aledged and brought proue the same But go to put the case that we haue no expresse word therof in the scriptures Tell thou where haue ye one expresse word the chyldren ought not to be baptyzed SIM Teache baptyzyng Agayn They came and confessed theyr sinnes Item They that receiued the word gladly were baptyzed Baptisme is in the stead of circumcision And he that beleueth and is baptized IOIA. I haue answered alredy before to all these but so ye are wont to repeate euery foote your bald reasons and argumentes The Anabaptistes are prompte quicke to speake but not redye to gyue place to the truthe For ye are very prompt quicke to speake but not so ready to giue place to the truth I haue not yet hearde in all thine allegations any suche saying or sentence Childrē ought not to be baptized SIM But that doth folow of the places afore alledged IOIA. Thys is neither commaunded there nor yet forbydden Besydes that your consequences are false and wythoute foundatyon If ye be nothinge ashamed of youre false consequences we wyll be nothinge ashamed of our true Therefore when ye crye out saying Where doth the scripture teach that children ought to be baptised we crye agayne Where doth the scripture forbid to baptyse them Ye do answeare in the last of Marke We bring agaynst you Gene .xvii. Marke .x. i. Corinth vii Acte x. Colloss ii Chap. Moreouer we do submit these our sayinges and writinges to the iudgement of all godlye persons Whether that it be more like vnto the truth that they do exclude debarre the children whom Christ hath wasshed with his bloud from the couenaunt of god for why do they denye vnto them the signe of the couenaunte and of the clensinge or that we do teche the children to be of god redemed by Christ Iesus whom he biddeth wylleth to be brought vnto him also too be baptized Iudge thou Symon and tell me whether of theim is more like to be true SIM If the matter be considered by it selfe all contentiō being laid aside the whiche ye say is moste true and most weightie But this I doo wonder and maruaile at that thou doste say that the baptisme of children hath cōtinued in the church euer since the tyme of the apostles which apostles did neuer baptise chyldren Here I doo moste earnestly desire the to bringe furthe whatsoeuer thou hast yet in store I wyll gladly receyue all truthe for manye of vs haue thought hetherto that the baptism of children was brought in by the busshop of Rome ¶ The third Dialogue That the baptysme of chyldren hath contynued in the church of Christ euer since the apostles vnto this time IOIADA No man can denye but the the busshop of Rome the fathers haue added certaine things to the baptism of Christ but no mā that is wise will say that it had his beginnyng of them that is to say that did begin the baptisme of children Those things then that were added and were repugnaunte vnto the word of god were taken away againe lest any man should make any busines for it As for that that ye bringe against vs that the apostles did neuer baptyse children no man lyuyng is able too proue it For I wyll shew no small argumentes that the apostles did baptise children wherby thou shalt easely vnderstand that the baptisme of children hath contynued in the church of Christ euer since the apostles time that it is no new inuentiō of the busshop of Rome i Certayne argumentes against the Anabaptistes First we do make our argument vpon the force strength of the precept and cōmaundement of christ of the doctrine after this maner Christ did send his disciples to preche the gospel to baptise ergo he did send thē to baptise childrē The proue of the consequence or argument SI I denye the consequence IO. But I wil proue it after this maner It is so farre that the gospel shuld reiecte cast backe the chyldren that it dothe rather bring thē vnto Christ Now the doctrine is greater then baptisme .i. Cor. i. cha If the which is greater that is to say the gospel is the chyldrens that then which is lasse that is to say baptisme shal be theirs Ergo the apostles dyd baptise the chyldren ij The seconde argument may be made and gathered vpon the nature of him to whome baptysme is due and whyche is able too receyue baptisme As manye as god doth recken emong the fideles or faithfull they are fideles or faithfull For Peter dyd heare this sayinge of the Lorde That god hath purifyed or made cleane call thou it not common or vncleane Actes x. chapter He doth put the chyldren in the number of the faithfull Ergo the children are of the number of the fideles or faithfull and oughte to be compted reputed of vs emong the fideles or faithfull onlesse we will repugne against god and be stronger then he Now it is most certayne that the apostles did baptise all them that Chryst commaunded them to baptyse Christe commaunded them too baptyse the faythfull as ye youre selues do graunt and confesse Ergo the Apostles did baptyse the chyldren The seconde proposition which is that the children are of the number of the faythfull is knowen well ynough iii. The thyrd argument is gathered vpon the fact of Peter which is peculier but yet in it the publike administraction of baptism is touched He coulde not forbyd theym the water of baptisme that had receyued the holy ghost but sealed them as the people of god Ergo he could not deny baptisme vnto the children syth that he had learned in the gospel that the chyldren be of god that the kyngdom of heauen is theyrs Who woulde thynke that any man is mete for the kyngdom of heauen wtout the holy spiryt iiii We do make gather the fourth argument vpon the strength force of circumcision in stede wherof baptisme is in the church of Christ As many as were the seruātes of god did afore al thinges labour endeuour thēselues to circumcise
thou canst do it The chyef Argumentes of the Anabaptistes agaynste the Baptisme of infantes SIMON In the last of Marke Christe sayth to hys apostles go throughout all the wholl worlde and preach the gospell to euery creature He that beleueth and is baptyzed shall be saued He that beleueth not shall be condempned Also in the laste of Mathewe it is wrytten after this maner Al power is giuen vnto me in heauen and in earth goyng therfore teache ye al nations baptizing in the name of the father of the son and of the holy ghost By these it semeth to folow and that necessarely that baptisme ought onely to be ministred vntoo them that can be taught and instructed For he sayth first teache them and then afterwardes baptyse them whereby it foloweth also that baptisme is a signe of the faith that wente before For he saithe he that beleueth and is baptyzed shall be saued Let vs nowe adde and ioyne vntoo these and ponder dilygently both the examples and factes of Ihon and of the apostles and that whych I say shal be manifeste and playne For Ihon dyd baptise them onelye that dyd confesse theyr sinnes Actes .ii. Chapter Actes .ii. Chap. Luke doth wryte after this maner And they which receyued gladlye the worde were baptyzed Philip doth then at lengthe baptyse the stewarde of Quene Candace after that he had declared vnto him ye. liii Chap. of Esay had questioned wyth him of his faith Actes viii Chapter Actes viii chapter All the apostles after that they had preached the Gospell and that the faith was receyued did baptise the faithefull It foloweth then that baptysme as a signe is due vnto thē that can both heare and receyue the doctryne Infantes because that they want the vse of reason can neyther heare nor receyue the doctryn therfore they haue no faythe For Paule teacheth that faith commeth by hearynge and hearyng by the word of god Rom. x. Chap Roma .x. Sith then that Children can neyther heare nor vnderstande the worde of god they can not beleue Ergo baptisme is not due vntoo them which is a signe of the faythe that goeth before Yf thou canste A solution to the argumentes of the Anabaptistes answere me to these I wil tell and set forth myne other argumentes hereafter IOI Thou hast rehersed the chief and principal foundatyons of the Anabaptystes that haue anye showe or appearaunce but thys is noo newe thynge vnto vs whych haue learned and red in hystories that aboue three hundreth xlviii yeares agone that is to saye in the yeare of Christe M.C. lxxxii there haue bene heretykes The sum of the Anabaptistes argumēts that haue taught the same doctrine But because that ye do leane vpon a weake brickel foundatiō your fote shal easely be subuerted ouerthrowen in al your doctrin ye do most vrgently beat this into mens hedes the baptisme is a signe of the faithfull or of them that haue faith alredy Infantes or yonge babes haue no fayth Ergo baptisme ought not to be ministred vnto infantes In very dede if the wordes be wel and truly expounded and vnderstanded we do gladly graunt this thinge vnto you That baptysme is a sygne of the faithfull people But we do not deffyne cyrcumscribe This word fidelis faithfull or fidel ought not to be limited as the Anabaptists wil haue it or limite the faythful as ye do for yf no man shoulde be baptised but they that beleue truly and from a sincere hearte Iudas Simon of Samaria Demas and other hipocrites had neuer ben baptized Let no man thus take my sayinges although I would haue baptysme to be ministred vnto theym whome it is manyfeste and playne to be infydels but myne intente is to shewe that by thys word fidelis faythfull some what more is to be vnderstanded then the Anabaptistes do expresse SIMO What canst thou make of a faythfull but a faythfull I can not vnderstand how infantes and yong babes can be faithful sith that they do wante the vse of reason IO. But in thys busynesse we do soo speake of the faythfull that we do in noo wise exclude the children from the number of thē syth that the children and infantes are of god whome god doth alwaies admitte and receyue into his churche emonge the faythfull SIM It behoueth the to haue proued the same Who be the fideles faythfull Gene. xvii Chapter O comfortable sayinge both to vs and too oure children as I haue alredy proued the contrary IOI I wil proue it Genesis xvii chapi Where god doth make a couenaunt with Abraham the lorde doth peculyarly comprehend the chyldren in the couenaunt for he sayth I shall be thy god and the god of thy sede after the. And afterwards he commaundeth the infantes to be cyrcumcised vpon the eyght daye to receyue the signe of the Testament Wherby it foloweth that god is not only the god of thē that be of age and canne beleue in God but also of the infante Children are fideles or faithful and be in the churche the members of Christe which for lacke of age can not yet beleue for they through grace and the promyse are receyued in to the couenaunt and number of the faythfull SIM I care not for the olde Testamente of the Iewes these olde thynges are abolished by the gospel IO. By Iesu Christ the ceremonies are abolished and the figures fulfylled What parte of the olde testament is abolyshed by Christ but the couenaunte made with Abraham standeth styll Elles god were not our god and the God of our sede and shuld be made by Christ more vnmerciful and more straunge thē he was to the aunciaunte fathers before Christ Which to thynke were a foolysh thyng that I should not say an vngodly specially syth that in the newe Testamente The faythfull are the chyldren of Abrahā Roma iiii Gala. iiii Mat. viii Luke .xiii. and .xix. Chapter Ihon .i. Chapter alsoo the faythfull are called the chyldren of Abraham Rom. iiii Gal. iiii Mat. viii Luk. xiii .xix. Chap. Besides these Christ which expresse words doth say Suffer yonge children to come vnto me for to suche doth belong the kingdō of heauē Paul speaking of the children of the christians saithe Youre chyldren are cleane How should that be onlesse it were thorow grace mercy the promise of god It foloweth then that the children of the christians are of god ought to be numbred emong the children of god SIM These thinges do altogether repugne vnto the scriptures and gospell as thoughe the carnall birth should auaile some thyng before god wheras Ihon saith Whych were not borne of bloud nor of the will of the flesh or of man but were born of god Ye say that the chyld doth belong to the church because that his parentes are of the churche IOIA. We doo saye thys through the grace mercy of god wherof is the promise The children are of the
may not to thys affyrmatyue The apostles dyd baptyse them that were of age did beleue inferre or bringe in this negatiue Ergo childrē ought not to be baptized for we may neuer neither in the prophane nor yet in the holy scriptures make oure argument a facto ad ius To argument or reasone a facto ad ius is whē we go about to proue a thynge to be lawfull because the it was don afore or elles to be vnlawfull because it was not don afore but then it is lawfull to bringe the fact and dede for a law whē it is proued that the dede was done rightfully SIMON As I do hear the controuersye is of the facte and of the ryghte or lawfulnes IOI Thou saiest truth if anye thinge be lawfull as soone as thou hast done it thou hast done well though that none of the apostles did it afore the. Therfore baptisme oughte not to be denyed vnto infantes because that we do not reade expressely that the apostles did baptise infantes Both because that it may be that they did baptise infants as we haue proued shewed alreadye and hereafter if nede be wil shew more largely yet it was not writtē also because that no mans factes ought to be preiudicial vnto the law much lesse the things that are left vndone Therfore if it were written any where with plain expresse words of the apostles after this maner The apostles dyd not baptise infauntes yet it shoulde not folowe that they oughte not too be baptyzed but we oughte too enquyre and searche whether that they lefte it vndone because that it was notte lawfull Christ did not baptise Christ did not baptis yet we ought to baptise Ihon. iiii Ergo after or according to your saying we ought not to baptise at al. Who is so mad to say so For the Apostles did baptise that lawfully Ergo If the apostles did baptise lawfully though christ him silf did neuer baptise we shal also lawfully baptise infants though the apostles did not baptyse There is no diuersitie at al yea we haue gotten the better end of the staffe syth that we haue Christ the did not baptise yet we ought to baptise and ye onelye haue the apostles Bring ye therfore any lawe that forbiddeth to baptise children We do not go about by these reasons examples as by some strong foundaciō to proue or strengthē the baptism of infantes For we haue many other strong arguments foundations But we will shewe the ye do both rashely lyingly say that the apostles dyd neuer baptise infantes or yong babes For ye haue no testimonye of that thynge And though ye had neuer so much yet it shuld not folow therfore that infantes ought not to be baptized For vpon a thyng that is done or left vndone nothing can besureli concluded but onely vpon that whyche is sure by goddes worde to be lawful Agayne we did bryng so many reasons examples to this intente that we myght proue that it is more likely that they dyd baptyse chyldren than otherwise SI Thou doest bost much of foundations The chyldrē are as wel of the people of god by the strength of the couenaunt as theyr parētes but thou bringest forth very lytle I praie the which be these strong foundations IO. I haue cast thys foundation that the children of the faithful are as wel wtin the church and emonge the Children of god as the parents that by the force and strength of the promys as wel as they were in the olde Testament Besides the circumcision as touching the sacramental meaning was the same thynge vnto them that baptisme was vnto vs. Dyd I not alredie both saye proue these things Why sayest thou then that I haue brought yet litle or nothing SIMON Why dost thou take all thinges out of the olde Testament IO. I know what the matter is ye cast away the olde Testament for ye se that the baptisme of chyldren may be proued defended by it Dyd not both Christ and his Apostles a alege the old Testament whē so euer they wold proue and strengthen their sayings Or tell me now when Christ doth byd the Iewes to serch the scriptures doth he not send them to the old Testament SIM I do not denye that IOI Why do ye blame vs then if we folowyng the example of Christe do strengthen confirme our sayings with the scriptures of the olde Testament The newe Testamēt the olde are included one with in an other The new testament is included in the old and the old doth shadowe proue the new If thou be sufficyentlye perswaded in this conclusion let vs passe furth to the other SI Certain thinges do please me wel but that thou doest recken number the children in the familie and houshold I do not se it proued yet IO. Diddest thou neuer se then that men are borne of men that parents I meane fathers and mothers do nourish kepe brynge vp their chyldren Haste thou so caste of all humayne reason vnderstandyng and affectyon But yet in thys moste plaine matter I wyll bringe and alege the scriptures Actes .ii. Chapter We reade after thys maner And all they that beleued were together or in one place and had al thynges commen emonge theym Here I doo aske the whether the faythefull hadde theyr chyldren with them or not If they hadde them whye shoulde they not be then of theyr famylye and houshold If they had them not whye do we not reade then that the faythefull tooke thoughte because they myghte not haue theyr children wyth theym Or was the spiryte that gouerned them so cruel that it did teache them to put away their children SIMON We wyll not say that they had not theim wyth theym or that they dyd not brynge theym vp but that they were not in the famylye and housholde of Christe IOIADA Whome do ye comprehend then vnder the name of famylye or housholde SSMON Suche as be of that age alreadye that they may know what the law is what synne is For he that wyll be baptyzed muste repente sythe that infauntes can not repente they can not be comprehended vnder the name of the famylye or housholde IOIADA Whye doest thou styll make vp a rope of sande haue we not proued alreadye before that not onelye they that be of age oughte too be baptyzed But yeare soo styffe necked that ye wyll in noo wyse beleue that anye maye be baptyzed onlesse he maye repente of hys misdedes And by and by ye do conclude that ergo children ought not to be baptised But in the meane season ye haue not yet shewed anye lawe the orbiddeth to baptyse the chyldren We as we haue declared before alreadye do knowe Isaac Agar Ismael that Isaac being an infaunt was so of the familie houshold of Abraham that he did cause his father to put awaye the bond woman with her childe For