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reason_n answer_n objection_n reply_n 3,529 5 13.8745 5 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A66962 Considerations on the Council of Trent being the fifth discourse, concerning the guide in controversies / by R.H. R. H., 1609-1678. 1671 (1671) Wing W3442; ESTC R7238 311,485 354

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particular_o
§_o 247._o etc._n etc._n where_o of_o the_o council_n join_v apostolical_a tradition_n with_o the_o holy_a scripture_n as_o a_o ground_n of_o church_n definition_n §_o 264._o §_o 247_o have_v thus_o dispatch_v the_o five_o head_n which_o i_o intend_v to_o speak_v of_o i_o desire_v you_o now_o to_o review_v the_o objection_n which_o be_v propose_v in_o the_o begin_n of_o this_o discourse_n §_o 3._o etc._n etc._n against_o this_o council_n which_o for_o the_o most_o part_n i_o think_v now_o will_v appear_v to_o you_o to_o have_v their_o main_a force_n and_o sting_v already_o solve_v and_o take_v away_o to_o α._o α._n to_o α._n the_o word_n of_o bellarmine_n who_o be_v quote_v here_o by_o the_o archbishop_n be_v not_o ut_fw-la ex_fw-la omnibus_fw-la provinciis_fw-la or_o which_o be_v more_o from_o all_o particular_a church_n which_o the_o archbishop_n say_v but_o ut_fw-la saltem_fw-la ex_fw-la majori_fw-la parte_fw-la christianarum_fw-la provinciarum_fw-la aliqui_fw-la conveniant_fw-la see_v touch_v this_o matter_n what_o be_v say_v before_o §_o 35._o etc._n etc._n 65_o 66_o 67_o 69._o whether_o a_o council_n be_v general_n or_o in_o its_o obligation_n equivalent_a thereto_o much_o matter_n not_o that_o council_n be_v equivalent_a to_o a_o general_n who_o decree_n be_v accept_v by_o the_o much_o major_a part_n *_o of_o the_o church-catholick_n or_o *_o of_o all_o particular_a church_n in_o it_o now_o the_o greek_a church_n do_v agree_v with_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n in_o the_o chief_a point_n determine_v therein_o against_o the_o reform_a etc._n reform_a see_v 3_o disc_n §._o 158_o etc._n etc._n their_o prelate_n also_o be_v invite_v in_o the_o general_n summon_v and_o the_o council_n or_o those_o who_o call_v it_o no_o causer_n of_o their_o absence_n but_o their_o great_a distance_n their_o present_a secular_a poverty_n and_o oppression_n the_o open_a war_n then_o between_o the_o turk_n and_o christendom_n last_o the_o general_a accord_n and_o peace_n in_o their_o church_n as_o to_o the_o trent_n controversy_n §_o 248_o to_o β._n β._n β._n see_v before_o §_o 70_o 75_o 77._o the_o paucity_n of_o prelate_n in_o some_o session_n occasion_v by_o the_o long_a duration_n of_o the_o council_n by_o the_o war_n and_o jealousy_n of_o prince_n by_o the_o bishop_n necessary_a defence_n of_o their_o several_a charge_n at_o home_n against_o the_o reform_a in_o france_n and_o germany_n be_v abundant_o recompense_v *_o by_o the_o ratification_n of_o the_o decree_n of_o those_o session_n by_o a_o very_a numerous_a and_o unanimous_a body_n assemble_v in_o the_o late_a end_n of_o the_o council_n and_z *_o by_o the_o acceptation_n of_o the_o absent_a prelate_n after_o the_o council_n §_o 249_o to_o γ._n γ._n to_o γ._n see_v what_o have_v be_v say_v §_o 47._o etc._n etc._n 80_o 81._o it_o be_v call_v as_o general_a council_n ought_v and_o use_v to_o be_v namely_o by_o the_o prime_a patriarch_n and_o chief_a ecclesiastical_a person_n of_o christianity_n preside_v in_o such_o council_n as_o other_o inferior_a council_n be_v also_o usual_o assemble_v by_o the_o ecclesiastical_a prelate_n preside_v therein_o the_o emperor_n and_o much_o major_a part_n of_o christian_a prince_n consent_v to_o it_o desire_v it_o and_o send_v their_o bishop_n and_o orator_n to_o it_o §_o 250_o to_o δ._n δ._n to_o δ._n this_o title_n represent_v the_o church_n universal_a never_o use_v by_o any_o general_a council_n save_v only_o by_o constance_n and_o basil_n who_o also_o decree_v a_o general_n council_n its_o superiority_n to_o the_o pope_n be_v oppose_v by_o the_o pope_n or_o his_o legate_n not_o because_o he_o hold_v not_o this_o council_n to_o be_v general_n or_o ecumenical_a for_o the_o title_n of_o it_o every_o where_o with_o the_o pope_n approbation_n run_v haec_fw-la sacrosancta_fw-la oecumenica_fw-la &_o generalis_fw-la tridentina_n synodus_fw-la but_o because_o he_o hold_v no_o general_n council_n whatever_o neither_o that_o of_o trent_n nor_o that_o of_o nice_n to_o represent_v the_o universal_a church_n exclusive_o to_o he_o i._n e._n so_o as_o to_o have_v authority_n to_o conclude_v and_o oblige_v the_o whole_a church_n by_o its_o act_n without_o these_o act_n first_o receive_v their_o confirmation_n from_o the_o see_v apostolic_a that_o this_o only_o be_v the_o controversy_n see_v witness_v by_o soave_fw-it p._n 138._o now_o this_o whether_o the_o act_n of_o a_o general_n council_n unconfirmed_a by_o the_o prime_a patriarch_n of_o the_o church_n be_v valid_a the_o dr._n know_v have_v always_o be_v a_o question_n among_o roman_a catholic_n and_o so_o have_v that_o proposition_n in_o he_o haeres_fw-la 11._o s_o 9_o n._n 10._o whether_o the_o universal_a church_n representative_a understand_v so_o as_o not_o include_v the_o apostolic_a see_v may_v err_v or_o whether_o the_o testimony_n of_o a_o ecumenical_a council_n understand_v exclusive_o to_o the_o apostolic_a see_v be_v the_o testimony_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n which_o question_n as_o some_o of_o the_o french_a church_n seem_v to_o affirm_v so_o other_o church_n deny_v neither_o be_v it_o decide_v in_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n of_o which_o see_v what_o be_v say_v before_o §_o 155._o but_o yet_o de_fw-fr facto_fw-la the_o pope_n confirmation_n be_v desire_v by_o this_o council_n see_v the_o last_o act_n sess_n 25._o neither_o do_v this_o thing_n concern_v the_o council_n of_o trent_n more_o than_o any_o other_o general_n council_n nor_o be_v the_o decide_n of_o this_o question_n material_a to_o the_o protestant_n concern_v any_o such_o council_n who_o act_n be_v confirm_v by_o the_o pope_n in_o which_o the_o state_v of_o this_o question_n sure_o be_v needless_a whether_o such_o act_n be_v also_o of_o force_n without_o the_o pope_n §_o 251_o to_o ε._n ε._n to_o ε._n see_v what_o be_v say_v §_o 67_o 64._o neither_o do_v the_o absence_n of_o protestant_a clergy_n such_o as_o be_v not_o bishop_n disauthorize_v the_o council_n for_o such_o have_v no_o right_a to_o sit_v or_o vote_n in_o it_o nor_o the_o voluntary_a absence_n of_o protestant_a bishop_n if_o invite_v if_o secure_v as_o they_o be_v 92._o n_z =_o †_o see_v §._o 68.82_o etc._n etc._n 92._o nor_o last_o the_o exclusion_n or_o non_fw-fr admittance_n of_o they_o if_o guilty_a of_o tenant_n censure_v and_o condemn_v by_o former_a lawful_a council_n as_o many_o of_o the_o former_a protestant_a doctrine_n be_v 198._o n_z =_o ‖_o see_v §._o 198._o the_o several_a cause_n allege_v by_o protestant_n for_o absent_v themselves_o have_v be_v show_v in_o this_o discourse_n not_o sufficient_a or_o satisfactory_a from_o §_o 82._o to_o §_o 122._o and_o from_o §_o 159._o to_o §_o 172._o to_o ζ._o ζ._n to_o ζ._n review_v the_o answer_n to_o see_v the_o reason_n of_o the_o absence_n of_o the_o french_a bishop_n in_o some_o session_n no_o way_n chargeable_a on_o the_o council_n or_o on_o the_o non-freedom_n thereof_o before_o §_o 70_o etc._n etc._n §_o 252_o to_o to_o to_o see_v what_o be_v say_v §_o 167._o where_o be_v show_v that_o the_o nearness_n and_o non-impediment_n of_o the_o italian_a bishop_n by_o reason_n of_o the_o freedom_n of_o that_o country_n from_o lutheranism_n and_o not_o any_o particular_a interest_n of_o they_o thwart_v the_o proceed_n of_o the_o council_n be_v the_o true_a cause_n of_o their_o be_v so_o numerous_a that_o the_o absence_n of_o other_o bishop_n be_v culpable_a but_o no_o way_n their_o presence_n that_o the_o much_o major_a part_n of_o they_o be_v subject_n to_o other_o prince_n the_o emperor_n king_n of_o spain_n duke_n of_o florence_n the_o state_n of_o venice_n etc._n etc._n not_o the_o pope_n and_o do_v manifest_o in_o the_o council_n follow_v and_o adhere_v to_o their_o interest_n and_o instruction_n in_o several_a matter_n that_o as_o to_o the_o protestant_a controversy_n the_o pope_n have_v no_o need_n of_o their_o assistance_n against_o the_o rest_n the_o whole_a council_n in_o these_o unanimous_o according_a and_o that_o as_o to_o the_o contest_v between_o the_o episcopal_a and_o papal_a right_n many_o of_o they_o side_v against_o he_o which_o be_v every_o where_o show_v also_o in_o soave_n history_n describe_v the_o great_a perplexity_n and_o artifices_fw-la of_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o legate_n in_o preserve_v his_o pretend_a privilege_n and_o not_o that_o they_o may_v be_v confirm_v or_o assert_v by_o the_o council_n but_o that_o not_o diminish_v or_o vote_v down_o by_o it_o last_o that_o however_o such_o a_o number_n of_o italian_a bishop_n may_v hinder_v something_o prejudicial_a to_o the_o pope_n from_o be_v vote_v in_o the_o council_n yet_o be_v they_o insufficient_a alone_o to_o vote_n any_o thing_n or_o to_o pass_v any_o decree_n at_o least_o in_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n against_o the_o rest_n because_o no_o such_o thing_n be_v valid_a a_o considerable_a part_n dissent_v as_o the_o non-italian_a or_o also_o the_o bishop_n of_o any_o one_o great_a
ita_fw-la enim_fw-la omnem_fw-la everti_fw-la judiciorum_fw-la ecclesiasticorum_fw-la ordinem_fw-la efficique_fw-la ne_fw-fr pastor_n officio_fw-la svo_fw-la fideliter_fw-la fungi_fw-la queant_fw-la again_o p._n 88_o eos_n qui_fw-la in_o doctrinâ_fw-la aut_fw-la moribus_fw-la scandalorum_fw-la authores_fw-la sunt_fw-la semper_fw-la censores_fw-la suos_fw-la consistoria_fw-la class_n synodos_n seu_fw-la partem_fw-la aduersam_fw-la rejicere_fw-la ad_fw-la eum_fw-la modum_fw-la arrianis_fw-la aliisque_fw-la olim_fw-la haereticis_fw-la adversus_fw-la orthodoxos_fw-la pastor_n semper_fw-la licuisset_fw-la excipere_fw-la and_o quo_fw-la pacto_fw-la say_v they_o iis_fw-la pastor_n se_fw-la neutros_fw-la ut_fw-la loquuntur_fw-la praebebunt_fw-la quando_fw-la praesertim_fw-la tam_fw-la multi_fw-la anni_fw-la intercedunt_fw-la priusquam_fw-la legitimum_fw-la &_o publicum_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la judicium_fw-la obtineri_fw-la potest_fw-la quum_fw-la deus_fw-la illis_fw-la praecipiat_fw-la ut_fw-la serio_fw-la doctrinae_fw-la sinceritati_fw-la attendant_n the_o english_a divine_v there_o deliver_v their_o judgement_n also_o in_o the_o same_o case_n very_o solid_o non_fw-la valet_fw-la say_v they_o ad_fw-la synodi_fw-la huius_fw-la but_o suppose_v they_o have_v say_v tridentinae_n authoritatem_fw-la enervandam_fw-la quod_fw-la causentur_fw-la remonstrantes_n maximam_fw-la synodi_fw-la partem_fw-la constare_fw-la ex_fw-la adversariis_fw-la suis_fw-la neque_fw-la naturale_fw-la jus_o permittere_fw-la ut_fw-la qui_fw-la adversarius_fw-la est_fw-la in_fw-la causâ_fw-la suâ_fw-la judex_fw-la sedeat_fw-la 1._o nam_fw-la huic_fw-la sententiae_fw-la refragatur_fw-la primo_fw-la perpetua_fw-la praxis_fw-la omnium_fw-la ecclesiarum_fw-la no_o in_o synodis_fw-la oecumenicis_fw-la nicaeno_n etc._n etc._n two_o qui_fw-la antiquitus_fw-la receptam_fw-la doctrinam_fw-la oppugnarunt_fw-la ab_fw-la illis_fw-la qui_fw-la eandem_fw-la sibi_fw-la traditam_fw-la admiserunt_fw-la approbarunt_fw-la examinati_fw-la judicati_fw-la damnati_fw-la sunt_fw-la 2._o ipsius_fw-la rei_fw-la necessitas_fw-la huc_fw-la cogit_fw-la theologi_fw-la enim_fw-la in_fw-la negocio_fw-la religionis_fw-la neque_fw-la esse_fw-la solent_fw-la tanquam_fw-la abrasae_fw-la tabulae_fw-la neque_fw-la esse_fw-la debent_fw-la si_fw-mi igitur_fw-la soli_fw-la neutrale_n possunt_fw-la esse_fw-la judices_fw-la extra_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la in_fw-la quâ_fw-la light_n enataesunt_fw-la quaerendi_fw-la essent_fw-la 3._o ipsa_fw-la aequitas_fw-la hocsuadere_fw-mi videtur_fw-la nam_fw-la quae_fw-la ratio_fw-la reddi_fw-la potest_fw-la ut_fw-la suffragiorum_fw-la jure_fw-la priventur_fw-la omnes_fw-la illi_fw-la pastor_n qui_fw-la ex_fw-la officio_fw-la receptam_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la doctrinam_fw-la propugnantes_fw-la secus_fw-la docentibus_fw-la adversati_fw-la sunt_fw-la si_fw-mi hoc_fw-la obtinuerit_fw-la nova_fw-la dogmata_fw-la spargentibus_fw-la nemo_fw-la obsisleret_fw-la ne_fw-la ipso_fw-la facto_fw-la jus_o omne_fw-la postmodum_fw-la de_fw-la illis_fw-la controversiis_fw-la judicandi_fw-la amitteret_fw-la enough_o of_o this_o 2._o again_o 4_o §._o 254._o n._n 4_o for_o the_o just_a and_o oblige_a authority_n of_o this_o council_n and_o the_o credibility_n at_o least_o of_o it_o be_v not_o err_v they_o urge_v delf_n urge_v see_v sess_n 26._o syn._n delf_n christum_fw-la dominum_fw-la qui_fw-la apostolis_n promisit_fw-la spiritum_fw-la veritatis_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la quoque_fw-la suae_fw-la pollicitum_fw-la esse_fw-la se_fw-la cum_fw-la eâ_fw-la usque_fw-la ad_fw-la finem_fw-la saeculi_fw-la mansurum_fw-la matt._n 28.20_o and_o vbi_fw-la duo_fw-la aut_fw-la tres_fw-la in_o ipsius_fw-la nomine_fw-la congregati_fw-la fuerint_fw-la se_fw-la in_o eorum_fw-la medio_fw-la futurum_fw-la matt._n 18.20_o they_o urge_v the_o precept_n of_o the_o apostle_n 1_o cor._n 14.29_o 31._o ut_fw-la judicetur_fw-la de_fw-la iis_fw-la quae_fw-la prophetae_fw-la loquuntur_fw-la and_o prophetarum_fw-la spiritus_fw-la prophetis_fw-la subjecti_fw-la sint_fw-la and_o the_o geneva_n divine_v sess_n 29._o urge_v also_o dic_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la and_o si_fw-mi ecclesiam_fw-la non_fw-la audiverit_fw-la etc._n etc._n 3_o lie_n in_o defence_n of_o the_o protestant_n refuse_v submission_n to_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n 5._o §._o 254._o n._n 5._o because_o it_o be_v a_o party_n without_o their_o allow_v the_o same_o privilege_n to_o the_o remonstrant_n for_o that_o of_o dort_n they_o answer_v 82._o answer_v sess_n 25._o p._n 82._o valde_fw-la disparem_fw-la esse_fw-la hanc_fw-la comparationem_fw-la illos_fw-la enim_fw-la the_o remonstrant_n and_o contra-remonstrants_a eidem_fw-la subesse_fw-la magistratui_fw-la and_o remonstrantes_n membra_fw-la esse_fw-la ecclesiarum_fw-la belgicarum_fw-la &_o reformatarum_fw-la see_v the_o same_o say_v again_o sess_n 26._o p._n 85._o but_o according_a to_o this_o answer_n the_o reason_n why_o the_o protestant_n deny_v their_o submission_n to_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n must_v not_o be_v because_o it_o consist_v of_o a_o adverse_a party_n but_o because_o all_o its_o member_n be_v not_o subject_n of_o the_o same_o prince_n a_o thing_n never_o allege_v before_o but_o here_o i_o ask_v be_v there_o then_o no_o preservation_n of_o the_o church_n unity_n by_o synod_n no_o subordination_n of_o clergy_n no_o rule_n of_o one_o party_n the_o superior_a and_o major_a judge_v another_o the_o inferior_a and_o minor_a any_o further_a than_o only_o in_o such_o little_a parcel_n of_o the_o church_n as_o happen_v to_o live_v under_o the_o same_o secular_a governor_n be_v our_o lord_n promise_n and_o dic_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la all_o confine_v to_o these_o what_o will_v become_v of_o the_o authority_n of_o ecumenical_a and_o patriarchal_a council_n why_o not_o in_o these_o also_o one_o ecclesiastical_a major_a party_n judge_v another_o as_o well_o as_o in_o that_o of_o dort_n credo_fw-la unam_fw-la catholicam_fw-la ecclesiam_fw-la how_o this_o church_n one_o if_o unite_v in_o no_o one_o common_a government_n and_o subjection_n but_o if_o it_o be_v here_o also_o one_o party_n must_v judge_v another_o and_o so_o the_o protestant_n allege_v the_o council_n of_o trent_n a_o adverse_a party_n avail_v they_o nothing_o as_o to_o the_o annul_n of_o its_o judgement_n but_o as_o the_o remonstrant_n yet_o further_o reply_v 26_o reply_v see_v synod_n delf_n sess_n 26_o if_o at_o least_o of_o the_o clergy_n live_v under_o the_o same_o secular_a government_n one_o adverse_a party_n may_v judge_v the_o other_o then_o may_v a_o synod_n of_o the_o catholic_n clergy_n in_o france_n oblige_v the_o protestant_a clergy_n there_o to_o stand_v to_o their_o sentence_n to_o this_o therefore_o the_o synod_n shape_v another_o answer_n as_o i_o seem_v no_o better_o than_o the_o former_a that_o all_o protestant_n be_v free_v from_o be_v try_v or_o judge_v by_o the_o popish_a party_n in_o synod_n 6._o conc._n delf_n in_o acta_fw-la dordrecht_n sess_n 6._o for_o that_o †_o primi_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la reformatores_fw-la pro_fw-la doctoribus_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la pontificiae_fw-la haberi_fw-la noluerunt_fw-la sed_fw-la contra_fw-la ab_fw-la iis_fw-la secessionem_fw-la fecerunt_fw-la again_o ibid_fw-la isti_fw-la nunquam_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la pontificiae_fw-la doctores_fw-la censeri_fw-la voluerunt_fw-la sicuti_fw-la he_o i._n e._n the_o remonstrant_n pro_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la reformatae_fw-la doctoribus_fw-la habert_n cupiunt_fw-la so_o also_o the_o geneva_n divine_v sess_n 29._o deliver_v their_o judgement_n licuit_fw-la say_v they_o nostris_fw-la protestari_fw-la adversus_fw-la concilium_fw-la constantiense_n &_o tridentinum_n quia_fw-la non_fw-la profitemur_fw-la unionem_fw-la cum_fw-la illis_fw-la imo_fw-la ill_a be_o aspernamur_fw-la &_o aversamur_fw-la but_o i_o say_v do_v our_o renounce_n and_o profess_v to_o have_v no_o communion_n with_o a_o lawful_a superior_a ecclesiastical_a authority_n present_o in_o justice_n free_v we_o from_o it_o for_o example_n the_o presbyter_n arius_n his_o renounce_v communion_n with_o the_o bishop_n of_o alexandria_n or_o the_o presbyter_n luther_n with_o his_o ecclesiastical_a superior_n in_o saxony_n be_v there_o not_o a_o due_a subordination_n both_o of_o person_n and_o synod_n from_o the_o low_a to_o the_o high_a as_o well_o in_o several_a as_o in_o the_o same_o secular_a government_n to_o preserve_v the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n not_o only_o belgic_a or_o britannic_a but_o catholic_n which_o gradual_a authority_n all_o those_o be_v oblige_v to_o obey_v and_o conform_v to_o and_o be_v liable_a to_o its_o censure_n not_o who_o voluntary_o profess_v obedience_n but_o who_o true_o according_a to_o the_o church_n canon_n do_v owe_v it_o as_o the_o protestant_n do_v to_o that_o of_o trent_n and_o owe_v it_o not_o a_o whit_n the_o less_o for_o their_o declare_v against_o it_o else_o so_o many_o as_o will_v venture_v to_o be_v schismatics_n and_o divide_v will_v put_v themselves_o out_o of_o the_o reach_n of_o the_o church_n spiritual_a court_n and_o have_v the_o remonstrant_n to_o their_o suppose_a innovation_n in_o doctrine_n add_v a_o separation_n in_o communion_n from_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o belgic_a clergy_n the_o contra-remonstrants_a they_o have_v by_o this_o second_o fault_n free_v themselves_o from_o have_v be_v either_o just_o try_v or_o censure_v by_o the_o synod_n and_o their_o declare_v once_o non_fw-la profitemur_fw-la unionem_fw-la cum_fw-la vobis_fw-la immo_fw-la illam_fw-la aspernamur_fw-la &_o aversamur_fw-la will_v have_v void_v all_o the_o counteractings_a of_o the_o synod_n of_o dort_n as_o these_o dort-divines_a say_v the_o reformed_n like_a protestation_n do_v those_o of_o trent_n §_o 255_o to_o μ._n see_v what_o be_v say_v §_o 125._o leo._n the_o ten_o do_v not_o wrong_v in_o declare_v the_o