vsed vpon them in publike assemblyes Diuers Churches also among vs are called by the names of those Saincts which they were dedicated vnto but to say that we do therefore dedicate Churches vnto them is very ridiculous In the City Athens there was a place of Iudgement which bare the name of Mars S. Luke calleth it by the same name doth he therefore dedicate it also vnto that heathen God of battaile When we call S. Peters Church or Paules Churchyard it is but to distinguish them by the names by which they are commonly knowne and called Then follow our Comminations Rogations Purifications Touching Comminations they be a part of the Canonicall Scripture which is to be read in the Church Rogations I take to be the compassing in of the limits and bounds of Parishes which is commaunded only to auoide contention and strife that might growe and there is nothing in the booke of Common Prayer touching these that euer I could finde Purifications are annexed only to make vp your riming figure for neither the booke nor the doctrine of the Church of England doth speake of any Purification but only in the bloud of the Lambe There is a Thanksgiuing prescribed for Women after Childbirth but neyther for Iewish Purification or Popish Superstition therefore not in such sort to be condemned After comes in our Tithes Offerings Mortuaries For the Tithes and Mortuaries I do not finde them once named in the booke the Offrings in déede are But ye will say that is no great matter séeing they be in our Church That is true but yet they are but for maintenance of the Ministerie not as a matter tyed of necessitie vnto a Priesthoode as in the time of the Lawe and if they were the error could not be fundamentall In the next place are brought in our manner of visiting the sicke and howsling them with the Sacrament our Absolution blasphemous Dirges and Funerall Sermons ouer and for the dead There is prescribed a manner of visiting the sicke and so is there in the leiturgies of some other Churches that professe the Gospell but where haue ye séene it practised or the practise vrged by those that haue the gouernment of our Church at their hands which are able and diligent Pastors Whereby your iniurious dealing may appeare in charging all the assemblies as they generally stand in England with matters which the greater part do not practise nor yet are required For if the sicke man be by the Minister of the word instructed exhorted comforted and strengthened in faith and repentance yea euery way prepared to depart ioyfully in the Lord it is that which the booke aimeth at neither is there any more required although he vse no prescript forme set downe By your phrase of howsling with the Sacrament ye would make the simple beleeue that the Popish Howsling is retained among vs. This is but a false kind of packing seeing our Church vtterly condemneth all the wicked blasphemous corrupt doctrine of the Papists touching the Lords Supper and also denyeth that a man is of necessitie to receiue this Sacrament at his death If yes replie that howsoeuer we teach yet the booke implyeth a necessitie which appeareth by that it doth appoint a priuate Communion I answer that euen the booke doth denie it to be a matter of necessitie and doth appoint it but to relieue the trouble which might arise in weake consciences through the want thereof for these be the words of the booke The Curates shall diligently from time to time but specially in the Plague time exhort their Parishioners to the often receiuing in the Church of the holy Communion of the bodie and bloud of our Sauiour Christ which if they doo they shall haue no cause in their suddaine visitation to be disquieted for lacke of the same And if any sicke person that would receiue this Sacrament hath any impediment that he can not the Booke willeth the Minister to instruct him that if he do truly repent him of his sinnes and stedfastly beléeue that Iesus Christ hath suffered death vppon the Crosse for him and shead his bloud for his redemption earnestly remembring the benefites he hath thereby and giuing him hartie thanks therefore he doth eate and drincke the Bodie and Bloud of our Sauiour Christ profitably to his soules health although he do not receiue the Sacrament with his mouth How maliciously then do you charge the assemblies in England with howsling the sicke with the Sacrament when all the learned faithfull diligent Pastors do as the booke requireth exhort those that be of their flockes to the often receiuing of this holy Sacrament in the publike assemblie as the due place for publike seales and the people by instruction being growen so strong that they do not in their sicknesse require it and so in the most Congregations which are well taught the thing is not practise◠The Sinagog of Antichrist deuised a purgatorie which is blasphemous against the bloud of Christ They had indéed their Dirges euen blasphemous prayers for the dead That Purgatorie do we vtterly deny as a wicked inuention we condemne prayer for the dead and therfore where ye tearme those prayers which are read at burials blasphemous Dirges ouer and for the dead yee are more then impudent in lying Funerall Sermons I finde not inioyned by the booke nor commaunded by any Lawe Ye adde further our corrupt manner of administring the Sacraments the Font the Crosse in Baptisme Baptisme by women Gossippings the blasphemous Collects that we vse vnto this Sacrament Byshopings with all the hereticall Collects of the Booke which as ye say is a wearines vnto ye to repeate though not to vs both to tollerate and defend When ye shewe some reason why the Font is an abhomination I shall knowe what to say Touching the Crosse it must needes be confessed that it was blasphemously and horribly abused in Poperie they ascribing vnto it power to driue out and expell Deuils and worshipping it with deuine honour In my iudgement also the holy Church of God within short time after the blessed Apostles and the reuerend godly Pastors did offend in taking ouermuch libertie to ordeine Ceremonies Symbolicall as that and such like yet no doubt very reuerend godly learned men led by the example of those holy Fathers of olde haue iudged it lawfull for the Church to ordeine such Ceremonies Touching the Baptisme by women it is condemned both by the chéefe gouernours in our Church and others and is not practised vnlesse it be among the popish and supersticious ignorant sort By Gossyppings I suppose yée meane the witnesses at baptisme a thing vsed in the best reformed churches and thought to be expedient so that yée doo not heerein condemne the Church of England but all Churches Bishoping of children is little practised for vnlesse the people require it by offering their children few Bishops doo vrge them thervnto onely this excepted that they be taught and instructed in the Catechisme The
the Pastour doth keepe backe some for ignorance c. Heere you confesse that very many Churches in England want godly Pastours and that there all are admitted and that he that admitteth them is the worste of the company Thus you make the most Chuches in England in a very bad estate and so farre foorth you affirme your article But yet you know some Churches c. I did confesse and doo still with gréefe that in very manye assemblies in England all are admitted to the Table of the Lord which offer themselues euen the most prophane and grosse sinners I shewed also the reason of this gréeuous offence namely that the ministers which should repell such open offenders are many times the worst or at least negligent in that behalfe And moreouer that the Church of England dooth neither approoue such admission of prophane men to the Sacrament nor yet suffer it in practise wholy For touching practise there be many congregations in the land where sundrie for ignorance and open wickednesse are by the ministers kept backe and not suffered to communicate vntill they shew repentance And for not approouing such admission I said the booke of Common prayer dooth prescribe and commaund the repelling of notorious wicked offendours and also that some are excommunicated iustly not admitted to publike praier This was the first part of mine answer wherein I prooue your accusation false The other is that the godly are not polluted by the companye of the wicked which are suffered to communicate with them in Gods worship and the thing not in their power to redresse And for example I alledged the Church of the Iewes By which I prooue that if your accusation were true yet it destroyeth not the Church Now let vs examine how you ouerthrowe this by your replye Yée aske whether there were no more prophane in the parish besides those twenty or thirty which are repelled And whether those other prophane were not admitted I answer If there were yet the repelling of twenty or thirty in a flock dooth shew that you accuse falsely when yée say all the prophane without exception of any one person are reteined in the body and bosome of our Church But to prooue your article at once as yée say by a more direct course yée bring an argument And yée demand if I know anye in all the realme of England vnbaptized Is not Baptisme say you a Sacrament belonging to the Church by which all the faithfull and their séed doo enter into it Wherevpon yée argue thus All being baptized it followeth that all are receiued into the body of your Church Now being once receiued in they can no way be cast out but by excommunication And it is manifest that the Parson and all his parish hath not the powre which Christ hath left vnto his Church to excommunicate any offender be he neuer so obstinate or notorious c. This being the onely reason by which ye stand to prooue the truth of your accusation I must bestow the more paines about it Thus it must be set in forme Where all are receiued in by Baptisme and no power to cast foorth any by excommunication there all the prophane multitudes are without exception of any one person receiued into reteined in the bosome and body of the Church But in the Church of England all are receiued in by Baptisme and there is no power to cast foorth any by excommunication Therefore in England all the prophane multitudes without exception of any one person are receiued into and reteined in the bosome and body of the Church In your proposition there are to be excepted such as are repelled from the Sacrament who are in some sort for the time remooued out of the bosome of the Church And also such Papists Heretikes and Scismatikes as depart out of themselues It is further also to be considered in it that all the baptized continuing outwardly obedient they cannot be iustly called the prophane multitudes Your presumption in which ye charge the Church of England with a principall transgression for receiuing in all by Baptisme and hauing no power to cast foorth any by Excommunication is with foule error and falsehood Touching the Baptisme of Infants this appeareth to be your iudgement that the children of prophane men which remayne in the Church and professe the faith of Christ belong not to the couenant and therefore ought not to be Baptised No doubt the Church doth offend when open notorious sinners are not Excommunicate and brought to repentance or at the least to such a shewe of repentance as that men can not further iudge them but as Brethren It is also an offence where such not being cast foorth their children are receyued vnto Baptisme and that without care to sée them brought vp and instructed in the Christian Religion and to leade a Godly life agréeable to the same But to say that the children of prophane men taking prophane men as you doo which professe Christianitie and remayne in the Church are not to be Baptised is a very wicked iniurie to Gods people and contrarie to the manifest doctrine of the holie Scriptures and can not without Heresie be mayntayned First touching prophane people it is certayne that all Heathen Heretikes all Scismatikes open contemners of the holie Religion and all obstinate wicked men whiche despise the censure of the Church that hath passed vppon them may be called prophane But you Brownists go further and condemne them all as Infidels and prophane which professe the faith of Christ because notwithstanding they doo it in some weakenes and infirmities which is a wicked presumption and intrusion into Gods seate and in which as I haue shewed before yée breake the rule of discipline giuen by our Sauiour Christ by which no brother that is none which professeth the true faith is for his sinnes and impenitencie to be iudged as heathen vntill he haue despised the admonition of the Church and so be cast foorth You take vppon yée to plucke vp all the Darnell yée are commaunded the contrarie least yée plucke vp the Wheate Math. 13. You dare and that in most sauage and desperate manner rend and teare vp the weake plants yée doo it vnto whole assemblyes in which there be many that vnfaynedly sorrow and mourne for their sinnes and studie to please God all that feare the Lord may tremble at this your intollerable wickednes But now to procéede Ye will not allowe the children of prophane men the Sacrament of Baptisme And what is your reason they bée not the séede of the faithfull In déede in this yée say true that none are in theyr infancie to be admitted to this Sacrament but the séede of the faithfull but when yée take it that the children whose next parents are hypocrites or wicked and prophane persons which yet remayne in the Church and professe Christ be not the séede of the faithfull at all and in any respect and so within the couenant and to be baptized
false manner their worship being made of c. I did deny that by affirming that the worship of our Church is the imbracing the holy Bible by the doctrine thereof c Ye say I beg the question and prooue not our worship by the Bible And I say if yée call it begging you beg the question would haue that graunted vnto yée as true which is most false For excepting imperfections wants spots blemishes faults which destroy not the true worship of God our Church dooth worship the Lord aright without heresie blasphemy or idolatry The doctrine of our Church is published if yée can take exception against any point to be heresie or blasphemie bring it foorth that it may be tried by the Bible Then next yée complaine further that I do not answer one of those 4. apparant reasons which yée bring why it is false and contrary to the Bible Well then they may now be considered Thus yée haue noted them with figures ouer the head our worship being made of the 1 inuention of man euen of the 2 man of sinne 3 erronious and 4 imposed vpon vs. I know not for what cause they should be called apparant vnlesse by a farre fetched trope of Metonymie because they manifest and make apparant your vanitie and Anabaptisticall error For the first thrée be no more but one bare affirmation of that principall transgression which yée charge vs withall For all false worship is mans inuention whether it be the inuention of the man of sinne or of any other man it is all one before God who respecteth not persons but the wickednesse of the sinne Also to be mans inuention in Gods worship and to be erronious is all one For whatsoeuer man inuenteth in Gods worship is erronious and whatsoeuer in the same is erronious hath béene inuented by man So that the thrée first are all one bare affirmation and the very same with your article Your Anabaptisticall error is in the fourth for yée challenge such a fréedome to the Church as that nothing may be imposed vpon the flockes no not any thing that the Church gouernours shall decrée by the word which dooth ouerthrow the discipline in a great part Then yée procéed and say for further manifestation of our worship in particular let the booke of Common prayer be examined by the word of God which yée terme a great pregnant idoll full of errors blasphemies and abhominations If the booke stand to be tried by Gods word there is no doubt but as all things done by men euen the best it shall be found vnperfect He that will haue it to be no true worship of God in which there be errors and spots holdeth the heresie of perfection which is very foule and detestable for it is as farre beyond our power to bee perfect in Gods worship as to performe perfect obedience in the second table of the lawe And touching the booke of Common prayer let the reader consider it is not the question betwéene vs whether there be faults in it great faults or how many but whether it be a great pregnant idol full of heresies blasphemies and abhominations I confesse that all men ought with vtter detestation to shunne our worship if it be such as you accuse it But indéed your accusation is false your slaunders are foule and impudent This shall appeare by following your words as they be set downe where yée name those blasphemous abhominations which yée charge the booke withall in their seueral rankes Yée aske vs where we find in the new Testament our Romish fasts our Ember daies Saints éeues and Lent I am indéed out of all doubt and most assured that if a man read ouer not onely the new Testament but also both old and new from the very beginning to the end he shall neuer finde any allowance of Romish fasts I say likewise of the Booke of Common prayer that there be no Romish fasts in it and that yée doo most iniuriously slaunder and belie vs in matching our Church in this point with the blasphemous synagog of Rome For that Antichristian Church de rogating in all things from the Crosse of Christ hath vpon certaine daies and at certaine times times appointed an abstinence from meates placing therein the worship of God remission of sinnes and the merite of eternall life The Church of England dooth vtterly condemne this as the doctrine of Diuels 1. Timoth. 4 pronouncing them enimies to the crosse of Christ which maintaine meritorious fasting We teach that the kingdome of God is not meat and drinke but righteousnes and peace and ioy in the Holy-ghost Rom. 14. And that there is no holinesse in eating or not eating but an abstinence whereby we may humble our selues and be more feruent in prayer The politike lawes of this land which appoint that vpon certaine daies men shall not eat flesh doo it in respect of the common-wealth as to maintaine Nauigation so much the better by incouraging men to fish and for the spare of the bréed of yoong cattle appointing moreouer a penaltie for such as shall take the daies to be obserued as meritorious Romish fasts Therefore let all men héere at the first consider how sophistically yée doo argue that the Church of England dooth absteine from flesh vpon ember dayes Saints Eues and in Lent therefore the Church of England dooth maintaine and obserue Romish fasts Thus dooth one cracke of your great ordinance vanish onely into smoake Then yée say your idol feasts your Alhallowes Candlemas seuerall Lady dayes Saints dayes and dedicating Churches vnto Saints Héere also yée thunder out terror as if the Church of England did worship idols and celebrate feasts in the honour of false gods and yet all is but a starke lie and a wicked slander And I would wish all men to obserue the boldnesse and eloquence which yée haue in this vaine For whereas the synagog of Antichrist denying the onelye mediation of our blessed Lord Iesus did set vp the Saints as mediators did praye vnto them worship them celebrate holy dayes in their honour and dedicate churches vnto them the Church of England for these and such like abhominations hath separate her selfe from them teaching by the holye Scriptures that there is one God and one mediator betwéene God and man the man Iesus Christ That the same only true God is to be worshipped alone and called vppon through the only mediation of his beloued Sonne in whome he is well pleased That Saincts are not to be worshipped neyther the blessed Virgin nor any other nor no dayes to be celebrated in their honour nor Churches dedicated vnto thē how bitterly then do you sclaunder Ye will reply that the Saincts dayes be kept in our Church yea but ye must shewe that they be kept in their honour which ye shall not be able to doo séeing the contrary is manifest the Statute expressing that our Church doth call thē Holydayes not for the Saincts sakes but for the holy exercises
blasphemous collects which we vse in the Sacrament and all the hereticall collects of the booke doo trouble yée very sore and weary yée to repeat But if it pleased God I would ye were as weary of lying and slaundering as ye should be in séeking in all the collects of the booke if yée were bound to séeke and to finde I will not say some faultes séeing all things framed by the best men may haue imperfections and faults but some blasphemies or heresies If yée haue any regard at all what ye say gather your wits together consider what is blasphemie and what is heresie and then note the collect where it is and what it is There shall neuer any man be able to prooue that the Church of England dooth tollerate much lesse defend either blasphemie or heresie Yet you as if your words were true as the Gospell clap your wings and crowe saying but this candle may not be lighted least the people should sée into the abhominabl◠ingredients which you their Antichristian ministers doo giue them or rather sell them in the whore of Babilons cuppe All this is but your foule toong which is no way so eloquent as in rowling out slaunderous accusation of blasphemies heresies and abhominations with such like Moreouer whereas the case standeth thus in the church of England that there is controuersie about the Booke and that one part dooth approoue all things in the same as good and alowable or at least as tollerable the other condemne certaine things as corruptions and such as néede reformation I would know how ye could abandon all the assemblyes to this ye make a double answer first that vsing a part they do homage to the whole This is a foolish answer void of all reason for can we not praise the good things in a man but we shall allowe his faultes and imperfections Your second answer is this Neither can the cunningest of ye all make the best part of it other then a péece of Swines flesh an abhomination to the Lord. Who could imagin that such a frensie might take hold of any that in mad furie they should not spare after a sort to strike at God and to blaspheme that which is most holy for ye knowe right well that there is in the booke of Common Prayer much of the sacred Canonicall Scripture there is the Lords prayer the tenne Commaundements with many other partes and sentences there be the articles of the Christian faith are all these become Swines flesh an abhomination to the Lorde Let not simple men wonder that ye are bold to proclaime all the Ministers of the Gospell within this land to be the marked seruants of Antichrist when ye dare presume to set your stincking brand of pitch vpon the most holy things of God Ye will héere cry out of iniurie and say that ye estéeme all those parcels of the sacred Canonicall Scriptures in thēselues to be holy and pure What is it then which turneth them into Swines flesh and maketh them an abhomination to the Lord is it because they be bound together and make one booke with the hereticall Collects then take you héede least being in prison and fettred with heretikes ye be turned also into Heretikes If ye say it is our abuse which turneth so holy things into Swines flesh I aunswere that the abuse of holy things is abhominable but the things themselues remaine vndefiled and ye must remember that we deale touching the partes of the booke but abuse is no part thereof When ye say the best part thereof is no other then a péece of Swines flesh it can not be transferred from the partes vnto the abuses If it were graunted vnto ye which yet is to be denied as most fantasticall that all read prayer offred vp vnto God as a sacrifice is Idolatrie neuerthelesse your saying is wicked and blasphemous seeing that the reading is not any part of the booke neither doth it peruert or defile the things themselues which are read Thus your first accusation that we worship the true God after a false manner is with false sclaunder and furious outrage of spéech crying out of Idolatrie blasphemies and abhominations when as ye can shewe no one ground of the holy Religion and worship of God which is not holden sound and entire among vs only ye rippe vp corruptions and spots in Ceremonies orders and circumstances which touch not the foundation but are such as men may erre in and yet be Gods déere children and true woorshippers The Brow Iohn 4. 23. 24. God is a Spirit and must be worshipped in spirit and truth The reasons why wee disalow of read prayer in stead of spirituall prayers that though they may be read for meditation as any other mens writs yet is it Idolatry to offer vp to God such manner of sacrifices eyther priuately or in publique assemblyes 1 No apocripha must be brought into the publique assemblyes for there only the liuely voyce of Gods owne graces of the word and the spirit must be heard in the publique assemblyes And more lawfull is it to vse Homelyes then reade prayers vnto God 2 To do any thing in the worship of God without the testimonie of his word is sinne but there is no ground in the Scripture for such manner of praying as hauing no witnesse of the word whether God be pleased with them or no. 3 Admitte that it were a thing indifferent as we call it for the forme of prayer which is but a mockery to call reading in stead of spirituall calling on God to be but altering the forme or chaunging the manner whereas in deede it is changing the worke of the Spirit into an Image or Idoll Yet is it a bondage and breaking of that libertie which Christ hath purchased for vs and therefore most detestable 4 Because true prayer must be of faith and knowledge vttered with the hart and liuely voyce vnto God I am perswaded it is presumptuous ignorance to bring a booke to speake for vs such things as we could not otherwise vtter in Gods sight 5 To worship the true God after another manner then he hath taught is Idolatry but he hath commaunded vs to come vnto him being heauy loden with contrite hearts yea to cry out vnto him in the griefe of our soule yea and as S. Paule sayth The Spirit helpeth our infirmities with groning and sighing that can not be expressed and how dare we then being a dead tree vnto God to stand reading of the same in stead of faithfull petitions quenching the Spirit 6 We must striue in prayer with continuing with feruency without wauering which we can not doo vppon a booke 7 We must call vppon God in prayer at all times as the necessities of the time requireth not making a babling of many things whereof we haue not any present necessitie but stinted seruice cannot be so applyed so it is but a babling of vaine repetitions 8 All the deuises of Antichrist though it were otherwise lawfull not
taught his holy Prophets and seruants to vtter in their prayers and that this is the reason why there be so many prayers prescribed in the booke of the Psalmes and in other bookes of the Scriptures that whatsoeuer thing befall a man wherein he is in the feruent affection of his heart to pray vnto the Lord if he haue in memorie the spéeches which holy men in such distresse vttered it is a great help vnto him if not he may help his memory with a booke To this you reply that touching the vse of sentences and phrases of scripture you could easily consent but that ye perceiue I would not agrée with ye in certaine points the first that this is required only at the hands of Gods children with promise to be heard and accepted I wonder with what eyes ye can sée that I would not agrée with ye in this thing I put ye out of doubt I hold assuredly that none haue promise to be heard and accepted but Gods children though they vse neuer so much the sentences of Scripture in their prayers The first hinderance of your consent is remoued The second is that ye sée I would not agrée with ye that the same spirit doth now teach Gods childrē to pray which taught the Prophets holy men in other ages I professe vnto ye that I hold it a wicked opinion to deny that the same spirit doth nowe teach Gods children to pray which taught the Prophets c. and so the second let is remoued In déede héere you and I dissent that I hold that as our faith is wrought by the word of God so is it nourished and quickned vnto prayer and euery good work by the same and that the holy Ghost hath not only taught matters by the Prophets Apostles but also spéeches and phrases sit for to vtter y e same And you hold that because the same spirit now teacheth to pray which taught the Prophets Apostles that either we may not or we néede not vse their spéeches The third stop remaineth which is that I take it God should be delighted with words and sentences You greatly mistake it and do but cauill for I shewed my minde not that God would regard words sentences but we should be holpen and comforted by them Thus the third and last hinderance is also remoued and now you may consent that in our prayers we may vse the prescript formes sentences and phrases of the word of God To my next wordes where I sayd the reason why there be so many prayers prescribed in the booke of the Psalmes is that whatsoeuer distresse befall a man c. you reply yée thinke I halt greatly that our question being about Idolatrous leiturgies I séeke to shrowd my selfe vnder the vse of Canonicall scripture Indéed this would be a learned question whether idolatrous leiturgies be idolatrie or whether it be not idolatry to pray an idolatrous praier who would looke for so childish a shift you know our question is about the reading of a praier when one prayeth And if it be not idolatry to vse the praiers of the scriptures euen in their prescript forme then all read praier offred to God as a sacrifice is not idolatrie I reason thus it is not idolatry to pray the Lords praier or any other prescript forme deliuered in the Canonicall scriptures therefore it is no idolatry to vse a prescript forme of praier which is framed after the rules of true praier as to aske of God alone through the onely mediation of his sonne and for no matters but such as he hath promised to giue Yée say it is not true doctrine that those Psalmes and Scriptures were written that we should vse in our praiers the words there set downe Your reason is because there be other vses I doo confesse there be other vses but that might yet be a speciall reason why there be so many praiers prescribed Then yée say yée do not disalow the speaking according to the word of God but that we might not affect so much the phrases of spéech as the true féeling of our wants He that hath not the féeling of his wants in praier but affecteth phrases is but an hypocrite But ye are in a vaine opinion if ye thinke the vse of the phrases and sentences of scripture being fitly applied is any hinderance either to the féeling or opening our wants because where skill or memorie faileth I would haue them vse the helpe of a booke I am you feare papistically affected vnto words and sentences I haue already shewed that this is not to affect the words and sentences but the instruction the support and quickning which our faith receiueth by those words sentences And this doctrine is not as you charge it disagréeing from the counsell of the Holy ghost which willeth vs to continue in praier to striue in praier nor contrarie to Dauid which said O my soule c nor to Paul who teacheth that the spirit helpeth our infirmities and maketh request for vs. But your doctrine which saith we must continue in prayer therfore we may not vse such helps the spirit dooth helpe our infirmities and maketh request for vs therefore we may not be holpen by the praiers or by the words of the holy scripture is phantasticall for the Holy ghost doth helpe our infirmities and teach vs to pray by the written word You thinke it were hypocriticall worshipping of God to take helpe by a booke when we know not what to aske If a man know not what to aske he shall be able to vnderstand little by the booke But a man may know what he should aske and yet not so well able to expresse the same without helpe both for memory and feruencie Stinted praiers yée say are as Cushions for idle papists hypocrites and Atheists I graunt that such people doo abuse all the best things shall the godly therefore be debarred from the vse I doo teach that whether a man of himselfe pray without a booke or vpon a booke if he pray not in spirit with faith he dooth but offer the sacrifice of fooles his praier is abhominable Therfore it is but your lauish spéech when ye say I giue libertie to the lame sacrifices on the contrary if a man pray in faith vpon a booke or without a booke it is true praier and such as God heareth God will haue no strange fire put vpon his Altar say you I graunt it is so but praiers framed by the rules of scripture and offered vp in faith are not strange fire Yée wish all men to take héed of this craftie doctrine and I wish all men not to be to hastie in receiuing new phantasticall opinions Your answer vnto those two Psalmes which I noted were giuen as a prescript forme of praier to be vsed of the Church and the forme of blessing prescribed to the Préests to blesse the people withall Num. 6 is more then friuolous For touching the first which is 92 appointed for the
Sabaoth yée graunt it was at their méeting to magnifie the praises of God many other Psalmes But yée demaund what this maketh for stinted leiturgies papisticall and erronious imposed c. I say it maketh nothing at all for that which is papisticall and erronious But it prooueth that all read praier is not idolatrie and that it is no stinting of the spirit to vse a prescript forme of praier These fantasies of yours are first confuted thereby Then next I argue thus If I may vse a whole praier of the scripture and no idolatrie then a praier that is composed by the rules of the scriptures may be vsed and no idolatrie You deny that the argument drawne from the vse of the Psalmes dooth follow because praiers composed by men are not equall to the Canonicall scripture and so shut out all praiers if yée marke well what yée say that are framed by the Preacher For let them be holy and good yet yée may not set them as equall with the Canonicall scriptures Againe yée deny the argument by affirming that singing of Psalmes was no part of praier but onely for instruction and meditation ye take vpon ye to prooue this a little after and when I come to that ye shall haue answer The Psalm 102. ye say was not a praier of the Church because it is said O Lord heare my prayer and not O Lord heare our prayer a poore shift when vsually the church speaketh of her selfe in the singular number Touching the blessing ye say that forme of words was not to tie them to vse those words but after that manner which is manifestly false Touching the orders of singers appointed by Dauid I alledged it to no such end as you séeme to drawe it vnto But that in singing the Psalmes they did read them vpon the booke Héer now ye do not onely deny that singing of psalmes was any part of praier but also ye will prooue it by the testimony of S. Paul to the Ephesians and to the Collofs where he exhorteth thē to speake vnto themselues in psalmes hymnes and spirituall songs It is a foule audacitie contrary to the manifest word of truth to affirme that the Psalmes were not sunge to God séeing that not onely the speeches be directed in a multitude of places vnto him but also the Holy-ghost doth call vpon men in this wise Sing vnto God sing a new song vnto him sing praises vnto the Lorde But beside this you go further for in both places by you cited ye leaue out the latter part of the sentence which is that they should sing vnto the Lorde with grace in their hearts Let the reader peruse the places and iudge what kinde of tricke this is It is most cléere that they did reade the Psalmes vpon the booke when they did sing them It is also out of controuersie that they did sing them to the Lord vnlesse we will deny the flat word of the Holy-ghost and also affirme that albeit the spéech be directed to God yet they did not in singing speake vnto him It cannot be denied but that many of the Psalmes be full of petitions Also praise is a part of prayer and a spirituall sacrifice this was offered vp to God in reading vpon the booke for it is saide Sing praises to the Lorde therefore I conclude that read prayer hath warrant by the word and the reading dooth not make it idolatrie or contrarie to spirituall praier Héere yée complaine againe that this argument dooth not follow because praiers composed by men are not to be matched with the Canonicall scriptures I haue answered this poore stale shift already that the praiers composed by men are no further lawfull then they be framed by the rules of Gods word for prayer Thus haue I not as you charge me laid aside the question to make new questions but haue disprooued that your olde question by shewing that reading the praier which is godly dooth not make it contrary vnto spirituall praier nor idolatry Argu. 3. We may not in the worship of God receiue any tradition which dooth bring our liberty into bondage Read Prayer vpon commaundement in the assemblies is a tradition that dooth bring our libertye into bondage Therefore read prayer c. To the assumption of this argument I answered at the first which I particularly rehearsed how can yée then with any shew of truth say my words import a deniall of the Antecedents assumption and all My words are these The third argument saith that the forme of praier is a bondage and breaking our libertie with c. The prooues which I bring do onely ouerthrow the assumption for I did and doo acknowledge the proposition which you say my words import a deniall of I would wish yée to vse more simplicitie I say it is vngodlye and néere vnto blasphemy to affirme that prescript forme of prayer is a tradition bringing our libertie into bondage and a changing the worke of the spirit into an idoll My reason was and is that the Lord by Moyses prescribed a forme of blessing which the Préests should vse Nomb. 6. The Prophets as in the Psalmes prescribed many formes of prayses and prayers to be vsed of the Church Our Sauiour Iesus Christ prescribed a forme and sayd when yée pray say Our Father c. If the verie reading or vsing the prescript forme commaunded were a bondage breaking Christian libertie or a changing the worke of the Spirit into an idoll then the Lord God Moyses the Prophets and our Sauiour Christ are charged with a great fault Your reply is with some roughnesse of spéech which I omitte because it is but your fashion But for proofe that read prayer is mans inuention and thrust vpon the Church by constraint ye say England knoweth by wofull experience There hath béene I graunt in the Church of England variance about some matters to be read which are commaunded in the Leiturgie but not about the commaunding a prescript forme of prayer to be vsed for therein our Church doth agrée with all godly Churches that a prescript forme of publike prayers is conuenient yea the reformed Churches haue and do practise the same Héere therefore I would wishe the Reader to obserue that you Brownists doe not only condemne the Church of England but all the reformed Churches whatsoeuer and can be none other but méere Donatists For héere in this your third argument ye affirme that prescript forme of prayer commaunded is the changing the worke of the spirit into an idoll a tradition breaking Christian libertie and therefore most detestable In your fift Argument ye say it is a dead letter which doth quench the spirit But all reformed Churches doo by commaundement receyue and vse prescript forme of prayers Consider then what sentence yee haue giuen against all the visible Churches of our time and of former ages for it will come to passe that as the Donatists tooke themselues to be the only true Church in earth so must you
Brownists of necessitie if your spéeches be weighed séeing all Churches haue and doo things which you affirme to be most detestable idolatry but let the matter come into question to be debated among the Churches and you will be found Anabaptists for imagining such a Christian libertie and fréedome in the Church that nothing is to be receyued which is imposed by commaundement Then ye say that it breaketh our libertie S. Paul proueth most plainely to the Galathians and Colossians I pray ye then that we may sée such plaine proofe which as yet none but your selues can espy note the sentences that will prooue the matter You take it there is no warrant to set foorth any prescript forme of prayer because Christ hath prescribed a forme Ye thinke I might more safely reason thus Christ hath prescribed a forme of prayer therefore neyther Pope Byshop or Prelate ought to impose any other vpon Gods children vntill they can shewe some warrant from Gods word so to do I am fully of your minde that none ought to impose any other forme vntill they can shewe warrant from Gods word But nowe marke how the Argument will followe Moyses the Prophets and our Lord Iesus gaue prescript formes of prayer and praysing God to be vsed by the Church therefore the reading of a prescript forme of prayer when one prayeth or offreth vp the sacrifice of prayse to God doth not change the worke of the Spirit into an idoll nor is not a breaking Christian libertie nor idolatrie for the holie Scripture is farre from appointing any idolatrous thing Then I reason further that if the Prophets and our Sauiour gaue prescript formes to be vsed the Church may take order to sée them vsed And from hence it doth followe that the Church may impose prescript forme of godlie prayers which are framed aright If any thinke this a strange consequence let them consider that the Lords prayer in generall conteyneth in it matter touching the substance and summe of all prayers which haue béene made or are to be made aright The Psalmes and other prayers in the Scriptures doo expresse particulars with sundrie sentences and phrases most fitte to expresse the same Nowe the Church hath power and authoritie not onely to expound these prayers but also to applye them vnto euerie seuerall vse and necessitye This I adde withall that the Church hath no authoritye to bring in any one thing in prayer which is not conteyned in those prayers of Gods word but when the prayers be composed and framed of nothing but the doctrine of the Scriptures and after the rules of true prayer nothing is brought in which God hath not commaunded Lay aside therefore all your shiftes touching Apocrypha mens writings and inequalitie with Canonicall Scriptures and bring your Arguments against the prescript forme and the reading to prooue that they make a prayer holie in it selfe to become abhominable and contrarie vnto spirituall prayer That yee say our Sauiour neuer vsed the words of the Lords prayer when he prayed neyther commaunded his Disciples to say ouer these words neyther doo we reade that the Apostles did euer vse or enforced others to vse certayne words c. ye speake vntruly for the Disciples desired him to teach them to pray as Iohn taught his disciples to pray and he commaundeth when yée pray say thus Our Father which art in heauen hallowed be thy name c. Luke 11. and S. Mathew an Apostle with S. Luke the Euangelist hath deliuered the same to the whole Church if we reade not any where that they did vse the Lords prayer or commaunded others to vse it Will ye reason thus we do not reade that the Apostles or the Church in their time did baptize Infants therefore Infants were not baptized or will ye reason thus we neuer read that the Apostles did pray eyther before or after they preached therefore they did not your argument is the very same with these two former yet from hence ye will néeds conclude y t we will impose vpon whole Churches certaine words euen our own words stinting the spirit of God I haue alreadie shewed that the Church hath not authoritie to bring any forme of prayer into the assemblies but such as is agréeable to the rules appointed for prayer by the word of God And where ye call it a stinting of the Spirit I aunswere that the Spirit of God is not stinted but some men are furthered by prescript formes their infirmities requiring such an eye as I haue shewed before Argum. 4. Because true prayer must be of faith vttered with heart and liuely voyce it is presumptuous ignorance to bring a booke to speake for vs c. Argum. 5. To worship the true God after an other manner then he hath taught is Idolatrie But he hath commaunded vs to come vnto him heauie laden with contrite hearts c. How dare we then bring a dead letter vnto God to stand reading of the same in stead of faithfull petitions quenching the spirit Argum. 6. We must striue in prayer with continuance c. therefore not vpon a booke These thrée I ioyned together as hauing no waight Ye say I answere by playne contradiction without Scripture or proofe In déede you quote Scripture to prooue those things which are not doubted of as that true prayer must be of faith vttered with hart that to worship God after an other manner then he hath taught is idolatrie that we must striue in prayer with continuance But what scripture do ye bring to prooue that it is presumptuous ignorance to vse the help of a booke that those which reade vpon a booke come not with faith and contrite hearts c. but stand reading a dead letter which quencheth the Spirit and that a booke is no helpe for continuance in prayer what Scripture I say bring yee to prooue any of these is not my bare denyall as good as your bare affirmation and in this farre better that I haue before proued the vse of reading by y e word of God Dauid say you would prayse the Lord with hart and doyce therefore not vpon a booke S. Paule would pray with the spirit and with vnderstanding therefore not vpon a booke Dauid and Paule had not so much néed of the booke as other men But whē they will other to sing prayses to God as in Psalmes Himnes and spirituall songs did they not send them to the booke or to the prescript formes wherein others might praise God together with them although they binde not men alwaies to the booke Then yée adde a reason why praier read cannot be true praier which is that in reading we fetch the matter from the booke which mooueth the heart In true praier we fetch the matter from the heart which causeth the mouth to speake as I beléeued and therefore I spake This is a most ridiculous vanitie for tell me this when we bring foorth in true praier matter from the heart which causeth the mouth to speake
hath not the heart béene first mooued with the word of faith why may not the heart be mooued againe with hearing or reading the word and so vtter true praier the heart is mooued when one heareth the praier of the minister and presently sendeth forth praiers together with him Do ye imagine that the heart cannot both be mooued and pray at the same instant Is it not possible for one to pray in singing a Psalme Argu. 7. We must pray as necessitie requireth But stinted praiers cannot bee as necessitie requireth Therefore stinted prayers c. To this I answered approouing the proposition and in the assumption I did distinguish of matters to be praied for as that there be things necessarie to be praied for at all times and of all men of these a prescript forme may be vsed at all méetings of the Church There be matters not at all times néedfull to be praied for touching these there can be no prescript forme to be vsed continually yea some things fall out so rare that it were hard for as it is a fault to omit that which néedeth continually and of all men to be praied for so is it a grose babling to pray for things whereof there is no néed And if yée obserue the prescript praiers of all Churches yée shall find the regard of these two things that nothing necessary be omitted y t no praier be for such things as fall out sildome but they are limited to the time And further that which falleth out beside the prescript formes the ministers of the word are to supply And in the Church of England the Preachers are not limitted touching the matters of their praiers But if I meane by the things which be necessary to be prayed for at all times the Sacraments or any such thinges as Christ hath set foorth in his word wee should thinke our Sauiour Christ you say to haue forgotten himselfe that when he did commaund them to preach and baptize that he did not prescribe some forme of wordes for their praiers before their doctrine and Sacraments To this I aunswer I doo not holde that for the administration of the worde and Sacramentes it is of necessitie there should bee a forme of praier prescribed for the Minister may conceiue the prayers at the administration of the Sacraments as well as at the preaching of the worde But prescript forme is for conueniencie Neither am I of the minde that one precise forme is of necessitie Therefore yée reason verye fondlye in saying wee might thinke our Sauiour forgat himselfe that he did not prescribe a forme of wordes for their prayers before their doctrine and Sacramentes Your nexte wordes that then I must further saye that all things necessarye in the worship of GOD are not conteined in the Canonicall Scriptures and so euerye waye vpholde the Papists are euen as farre wide For all things necessarye and conuenient in Gods worshippe bee conteined in the Canonicall Scriptures But are you ignorant of this that there be many thinges conteyned in the Scriptures which are not in particular expressed but to bee gathered from the generall groundes and rules of doctrine What if one should obiect vnto yée there is no commaundement nor example of the Apostles in the scriptures for anye prayer to bee made at the Preaching of the worde and administration of Sacraments Therefore it is not conteined in the Scriptures that there should bee anye and so a thing not necessarye Would yée not flie to this that although it bee not expressed by anye commaundement that there should bee such prayers yet is it to bee gathered out of the doctrine conteined in the Scriptures How grosse are yée then in saying that this dooth vpholde the Papists But yée saye it were well I set downe what it is that may bee fitte at all times and for all persons to craue I maruaile anye should be so babling as to propound such a matter making doubt For can yée be ignorant that going through the whole Lords praier and opening the particulars there is no one petition but almost all branches of it are necessary to bee craued at all publike méetings and of all persons When will there bee a time and an assemblie in which it shall not bee fitte for all to make supplication that the name of the Lorde may bee sanctified that they may receiue the giftes and graces of the Holy-ghost to imbrace the true light of the Gospell to increase in knowlege faith and repentance to praye for Princes for the whole Church and for the ouerthrowe of Christes enimies to haue grace to obey and to walke worthy of the Gospell To craue all benefites for our necessary sustentation and the pardon of our sinnes with deliuerance from the deuill They bee all conteined in the Lordes praier but wee as children néede to haue them particularly expressed in that manner which may best helpe and guide vs. And touching praiers at the Sacraments they may verye well be the same séeing the thinges doo euer remaine the same which we are then to craue Vnlesse yée will maintaine that there bee thinges in administration of Sacraments at sometime to be prayed for and not at other Then so farre as prescript forme of prayer dooth fullye and fitlye expresse our néede it is no babling and so this your argument dooth not condemne it Read prayers were deuised by Antichrist and maintaine superstition and an idol ministerie Therefore read praiers are not tollerable c. Antichrist deuised manye blasphemous wicked prayers But to say that the reading or following a prescript forme of praier was his deuice is most false for there were leiturgies in the Church of olde before Antichrist was set in his throne And moreouer the prescript formes deliuered in the scriptures to be vsed and which were vsed and practised by the Church shewe that the thing is allowed by God Yée say I haue confessed that I neuer read in the scriptures any warrant to reade praiers vnto God and then it must néedes follow that it is antichristian I say you know that yée doo falsifie my spéech For I said and haue prooued that it is great audacitie to affirme that there is no warrant in Gods word for prescript forme of praier But I doo not remember that euer I read in the scriptures that God dooth commaund a man to reade the praier vpon the booke My reason is rendered that God dooth commend such diligence in all his seruants as to haue in memorie c. Will ye gather thus it is not expressely commaunded therefore there is no warrant it is not expresly commaunded that euer I read that the Minister shal make praier before and after his sermon Will yée charge me héerevpon that I say there is no warrant for it in the word There would sundrye inconueniences growe for want of prescript forme of publike praiers I did onely mention this that euery frantike spirit of which sort there may bee some in the Ministrie will not onely
consider what it is to excommunicate or to cut not onely particular persons but whole assemblies from Christ it would abate their horrible presumption Then for the suspension from the Sacrament by which the vnworthy either for ignorance or open wicked life are seperated from the néere fellowship of the Church I said yée might demaund by what right the minister dooth it Yée say that indéede would be knowne adding moreouer that if it be in the nature of Excommunication it were no small presumption in the Minister to arrogate such absolute authoritie to himselfe I hold it somewhat in the nature of Excommunication in such as haue béene before admitted but yet not to be compared as any thing néere so great as Excommunication and neuerthelesse I déeme it no presumption for the Minister to repell the vnworthy from the Sacrament He is to take héede to himselfe that he giue not holie things to dogs He is to beware of that which may giue publike offence and bring the holie mysteries into contempt It is in déede no small matter to debarre from the Sacrament The Minister therefore may easily offende in this case diuers wayes as namely if he be carried with euill will for priuate respects toward any and so aggrauate their offences and make that heynous which is not or if he doo not make the matter apparant so much as he can that the flocke may sée there is iust cause to repell them and no iniurie offered the crimes for which they are remoued being notorious Now because I sayd the booke of common Prayer doth warrant this héere yée set vp your bristles and first it may not be let passe but noted that euen the best of our Churches stand vnder this Idoll by our owne confession This is a speciall note and well marked Why did ye not knowe that we vse the booke in publike prayer and administration of Sacraments Then yee aske if the booke be Christs newe Testament that we must fetch our warrant and direction from that Idoll I might aske you a question whether ye be in your wits for doo we dispute héere whether a Minister is warranted in conscience before God to repell any from the Sacrament I thought that you Brownists whiche take vppon yee to iudge and vtterly to abandon and cast foorth whole assemblyes which professe the Gospell and which are estéemed of the godly Churches as Sisters had made no doubt but that by Gods word the Minister is warranted to repell a notorious wicked man from the Sacrament But I supposed yee would obiect that by the established order and gouernment of our Church all power to keepe the Sacraments from wicked prophanation is taken away from the Ministers and for this I alleadged the booke Let the Reader now iudge how fitlie yee clap your wings and crowe saying In déede it is a fit Portesse for such Priests and the suspension ye vaunt of a fit toole for such workemen euen the instruments of that foolish Shepheard If the iudgement of God you say were not vppon our right eye we might sée how our Lords the Byshops doo dresse vs and perceyue how this weapon that they allowe vs wanteth both edge and poynt c. You speake as if the Byshops did take vppon them and we submitte our selues vnto them as Lords ouer our faith and consciences and as though we were at theyr allotting when as in déede they bée but ministers to sée those orders kept which bée alreadie established and haue not authoritie to take from any Minister that power which the booke doth giue him much lesse can one word of maister Commissaries mouth heale the greatest wound as you say we can make with it Yee say not one in the Parish setteth a flye by it Yee speake so confidentlie and with such shewe of honestie that I should beléeue yee in these things if I had not for sundrie yeares tryed and séene your words false by experience I sayd such as be iustly Excommunicate as some are be not admitted to the publike prayer Héere yee bid sée how God insnareth me in mine owne words and how hard a bad cause is to defend What is the snare which I am héere caught in Forsooth I doo héere openly iustifie Excommunication by the Commissarie because we haue no other power or meanes and our Church wardens doo stand sworne to that Court But how shall I get out of your snare I must be fayne to breake it if it be not loose of it selfe What if when I say some are Excommunicate iustly I haue respect not to those which Excommunicate but to the desert of them that be Excommunicated Againe it is vntrue that ye say our Church hath no power but the Commissaries Court as I haue alreadie shewed Touching your next spéech wherein yee charge vs that we thincke to heale or at the least to couer enormities with these two drie withered figge leaues the one that we can not remedie the matter the other that priuate men are not to reforme the aunswere shall be more fitte when wée come to shewe what priuate men may doo Now let vs come to the other part of mine Answer which denyed the consequence though your accusation were true which is this Wicked prophane men are receyued in and retayned in the bosome and bodie of their Church therefore the Couenant is disanulled with them and they are no longer Gods people but a false Antichristian synagog To disprooue this I did alleadge that there were but a fewe true worshippers that frequented the Temple among multitudes of prophane and vngodly men To which ye reply that comparing our Church to the Temple of God and still begging the question I frame my Arguments as though our people were faithfull and our prayers holie I pray yee what is the question which I begge This say you is the question whether the assemblyes in England be the true Church of God and then yee woulde beare the Reader in hand that I reason in such sort as I would first haue this graunted that it is a true Church of faithfull people and holie worship You should haue done well to haue shewed how I frame my Arguments from the Question graunted But the truth is yee can shewe no colour héere of any such thing Nowe may I charge you and that iustly which I wyll also make apparant to all which will not shut theyr eyes that in stead of answering yee doo not onely cauill but most sottishly with a blinde shift For our question heere is this the Church of England doth receyue in and retayne in her bosome the prophane multitude therfore the Church of England is not the true Church To disproue this I reason thus the Church of Israel retayned the multitude of wicked ones in her bosome for there were but fewe true worshippers frequented the Temple among multitudes of prophane vngodly men Therefore this fault doth not destroy the béeing of a true Church neyther is the worship and prayers of the faithfull
being necessary ought to be abhorred of true Christians especially such reliques as maintaine superstition but to reade other mens bookes to God in stead of true prayers and stinted seruice were deuised by Antichrist and maintaine superstition and an Idoll Ministerie therefore ought to be disallowed The prayers and worship of such Ministers and people as stand vnder a false gouerment are not acceptable nor haue any promise in Gods sight not only because they aske amisse but because they keepe not his commaundements G. G. Read prayer is one chiefe thing for which yee condemne our worship as Idolatrous and most detestable and for that cause to be annexed vnto this first accusation God is a Spirit and must be worshipped in spirit and in truth The Brow THE Scripture doth most briefely and pithily seuer all fantasticall deuises of man from the pure and sincere worship of God prescribed in his Word For seeing all flesh is grasse and the wisedome thereof foolishnes with God it must needes follow that mē earthly minded should please themselues in such pretended religion as agreeth nothing with the diuine nature of God It is needfull then in the worship of God that we thus alwayes consider with our selues we haue to do with God himselfe and not with men who is so farre differing from vs that those things which are most easy and pleasing vnto vs is a wearisomnes and abhominable sacrifice in his sight and although God dwelleth in the heauens in his diuinitie incomprehensible yet haue we a perfect rule whereby we know what is agreeing to his will namely his written word for that we may be heere taught 1. That all hipocrisy in such things as hee hath commaunded be carefully auoyded 2. That wee attempt not to do any thing in his worship whereof we haue not speciall warrant from his word of which sort we take all manner of stinted prayers offered vp as a worshipping of God disagreeing from the nature of God which seeth in secret and so agreeth with our fleshly nature that we can not pray as we ought so we seeke to help our selues with such a broken staffe wearying our selues with our owne deuises without any promise to receyue blessing thereby And therefore where you affirme that a man may pray in spirit and truth with sighes and grones proceeding from faith when prayer is read that is not true for if their sighes came from faith it would minister matter and prayer without a booke yea no doubt a troubled mind is the penne of a readie writer and to worship God in spirit is when the inward faith of the heart bringeth forth true inuocation and it is then in truth when simply it agreeth with Gods word But you would teach men in stead of powring forth their harts to help themselues vpon a booke yea to fetch their cause of sorrowing sighing from an other mans writing euen in the time of their begging at Gods hand We graunt that prayers conceaued without faith ar not acceptable yet may the same be called spirituall because it is the gift of the Spirit though not sanctified in him that so hipocritically mocketh with God But what maketh this to our question of stinted read prayers in Gods worship But say you to make read prayers only to serue for meditation is false doctrine wherein me thinke you offer great iniurie for we affyrmed that it had such vse as other of mēs writings haue But it seemeth you make little cōscience to slander vs and heere you fall into an error your selfe affirming and going about to proue that reading of prayers is not for meditation at all the proofe you bring is that Christ said not to his disciples whē ye meditate say thus Our Father but when you pray say thus c. Where beside that you make no difference between your owne Liturgies the holy word of God which is not of any priuate interpretation Besides this I say you seeme to proue that the Lords prayer all other prayers in the Canonicall Scripture serue not at all for meditation Well you haue hereby made the matter apparant that read prayers vpon a booke are as acceptable as faithfull prayers conceiued by the spirit vttered with vnderstanding You say that prayers read or conceiued being void of faith is but vaine babling we say the same but what of this forsooth you cannot see by what censure it can be called Idolatry If false worship cannot be called Idolatry let the first and second Commaundements be witnesses so that it is not our pennes but the penne of Gods own finger that hath iudged all deuises of man hipocriticall worship of Idolatry And although all the breaches of the first Table were not Idolatry yet you know that to worship our own deuises is Idolatry Is not prayer a speciall part of the first Commaundement and our Sauiour Christ comprehendeth all the foure first Commandements in this that we loue God aboue all the transferring of any part whereof from God must needs be idolatry But say you if we do thus hold withall that no idolator can be saued thē surely are all lost c. This is countrey diuinity if the Salt haue lost his sauour what should be sesoned therwith we hold that no idolator cā be saued without true repentance renouncing their sinne so far as God shall shew it thē yea craue with Dauid for pardon for their hidden secret sins And doo you thinke any man liuing is void of idolatry either inwardly or outwardly so long as we liue or that we can keep any one cōmandement in perfection The Lord therfore giue vs repentance for in some things we sin all Methinks this should not be M. Giffords language to be so ignorant in the principles of religion if you haue waighed our arguments no better then your preface it shall be greeuous to me to make any aunswer To condemne and ouerthrow read prayer yée bring as the ground or foundation of all your matter this sentence God is a spirit and to be worshipped in spirit Iohn 5. This scripture indéed is cléere and strong to cut downe all carnall worship as disagréeing from the nature of God And if any doo maintaine that the very bodily action of reading prayer is the worship of God it may fitly be alledged against them But to apply it in that manner which you doo against red praier is friuolous vnlesse as I say yée could prooue that a man cannot pray by the spirit of God with sighes and grones procéeding from faith when the praier is read vpō the booke or vttered after a prescript forme To this you reply with diuers arguments The first is that if the sighes and grones were of faith it would minister matter of praier without a booke This reason by a connection is drawne from and dependeth wholy vpon the force and effect of faith to minister matter of prayer It is to be framed thus If the prayer with sighes
and grones were of faith it would minister matter without a booke but the matter of their prayer with sighes and grones is not ministred without a booke therefore it is not of faith to make this argument strong and sufficient from the connection of faith and the liuely efficacie thereof to vtter prayer yée must adde two things the one that faith is perfect vnto this efficacie to minister matter of praier and néedeth no helpe The other that the effect and power of faith to minister matter of prayer cannot stand nor be ioyned with any outward helpes Vnlesse I say yée adde these two with the cupling together faith and the effect which are both of them hereticall there can be no necessarie consequence To make it yet more manifest let it be drawne into an other forme of syllogysme thus That which hath power and efficacie of it selfe to minister matter of prayer néede not any outward helpe nor cannot touching the vtterance of matter in prayer stand with any outward helpe But faith hath force and efficacie in it selfe to minister matter of prayer Therefore faith néeds not the helpe of a booke nor cannot stand with any outward helpe touching the vtterance of matter in prayer And so consequently the sighes and grones in prayer red cannot be of faith This consequence shall neuer be brought in vnlesse yée frame your argument after that sort So that both these fantasticall errors be included in your spéech the one that faith touching the efficacie to minister matter of praier is so absolutely perfect that it néedeth no outward helpe the other that it cannot touching prayer stand with any outward helpe I doo acknowledge that there be no sighes nor grones nor any praiers that can be regarded of God but such as come from faith I doo also hold that faith is not in any without some efficacie and power to vtter some matter of praier But now we must consider the degrées thereof for doubtlesse if there were in men a perfection of knowledge of faith and of quicknesse there should néed no outward helpe but the best come farre short of that Such as approche néerest there vnto néed so much the lesse any outward helpe But the most are ignorant weake short of memory dull and slow and néed all helpes to stirre them vp and to direct them euen as children that are to be stayed vp and led by the hand Praier indéed is a spirituall worke procéeding from faith which is a spirituall gift but yet it doth stand with outward meanes and helpes The Holy-ghost alone dooth worke faith in man but yet it commeth by hearing Rom. 10 Faith bringeth foorth prayer but we must consider that as the same faith commeth by hearing and is grounded vpon the word so is it cherished supported increased continued and quickened in efficacie and made more forcible vnto euery good worke by those helps of outward meanes For further confirmation ye adde yea no doubt a troubled minde is the penne of a ready writer Let it stand in forme of syllogisme thus That which is the pen of a ready writer néedeth not the helpe of a booke But a troubled minde is the pen of a ready writer therefore it néedeth not the helpe of a Booke The proposition is true if by the pen of a ready writer yée vnderstand an absolute perfection of knowledge chéerefulnesse direction memorie and vtterance But that was not in Moses Daniel Paul or any other Therefore héere againe yée runne vpon the rocke of an hereticall opinion of perfection Your assumption where yée say no doubt a troubled minde is the pen of a ready writer is vtterly false and your bold affirmation without scripture is not enough séeing there be many so perplexed and confused in the trouble of their minde and oppressed with ignorance that they cannot pray nor know not what to vtter which when they haue instruction and consolation ministred vnto them by some godly man or if that chéefe help faile by reading vpon a booke poure foorth teares and supplications Your next reason is in many words which yet I will repeate To worship God say you in spirite is when the inward faith of the heart bringeth foorth true inuocation and it is then in truth when it simply agreeth with Gods word But you would teach men in steed of powring foorth theyr hearts to helpe themselues vpon a booke yea to fetch the cause of their sighing and sorrowing from an other mans writing euen in the time of their begging at Gods hand I will also drawe it into a syllogisme to the end it may the better be iudged of None worship God in spirite but they which from the inward faith of the heart bring foorth true inuocation that is such as simply agréeth with the word of God But all such as read vpon the booke the prayer which they pray fetch the cause of their sorrowing from an other mans writing in the time that they pray and doo not from the inward faith of the heart bring foorth true inuocation Therfore none that reade their praier vpon the booke doo worship God in spirit The proposition I assent vnto as sound and good for it is no true inuocation except it agrée with Gods word It is not to worship in spirit vnlesse it procéed from faith out of the heart But your assumption which is that all that reade the praier which they pray doo not from the inward faith of the heart bring foorth true inuocation I cannot allowe séeing yée bring nothing for proofe thereof but that which is most friuolous For whereas yée say in the first part of your confirmation that we would haue men in stéed of powring foorth theyr hearts to helpe themselues vpon a booke yée speake vntruly and foolishly For we wish men to vse the helpe of a booke that they may the better poure forth their hearts to God Being such as are not otherwise throughly able The next part of your confirmation is euen to as great purpose when yée say We would haue men fetch the cause of their sighing and sorrowing from an other mans writing euen in the time of their begging at Gods hand For how fondly doo yée make that to be the cause which dooth but manifest the cause for the cause of all sighing and sorrowing is the sinne and miserie which is within vs which we may the better behold and expresse by instruction I haue gréeuous sinne and wrath belonging therevnto which I doo partlye know and can make some moane therein and praye I come into the publike assembly where I heare the minister preach the word which dooth more fully laye open and display my sinne and misery I am héereby driuen into déeper sighing and sorrowing with vehement praier in my heart vnto God shall it be saide that I doo now fetch the cause of my sorrowing from an other mans spéech in the time of my begging at Gods hands If not then why should I be said to fetch the cause
from the booke which also dooth instruct me the like may be said when the congregation dooth pray with their pastor they fetch not the cause of their sighing from him but are stirred vp by him Your next words stand thus The reasons why we disalow of read prayers in steed of spiritual prayers that though they may be read for meditation as any other mens writs yet is it Idolatrie to offer vp to God such manner of sacrifices either priuately or in the publike assemblies Yée are very angrie that I termed your reasons by which yée oppose read praier vnto spirituall praier spirituall fantasies But take you héed that they grow not to be worse Yée are also gréeued that I call them your stuffe but how good stuffe it is let the pure word try I said it is false doctrine to make read prayer serue only for meditation My proofe was this that Christ saith not when ye meditate but when ye pray say thus Our Father which art in heauen and héere ye fling about as if ye had Béez For first ye exclaime that I make smal conscience to sclaunder ye because I said ye make read prayer serue only for meditation which is false doctrine Meditation as I take it comprehendeth all that is done in studying and musing when one readeth the praying is another If ye can shew a third vse when one readeth prayer I will confesse an error otherwise though ye haue not expressed the word only yet ye haue in effect vttered so much when ye say read prayer is not to be prayed Secondly ye charge me to deny that read prayer serueth for meditation at all which is in deede false doctrine because I said Christ saith not when ye meditate but when ye pray say thus Our Father which art c. Do I not say truly that Christ saith not when ye meditate but when yée pray say thus Our Father which art c. How can you then but like Spiders sucke that poyson from thence Thirdly ye accuse me that I make no difference betwéene our owne Leiturgies and the Canonicall Scripture which is a most friuolous cauill séeing our question is about reading of prayer whether it be Canonicall Scripture or framed from thence according to the rules of godly prayer Thus haue ye answered nothing at all vnto that commaundement which I alleaged giuen by our Sauiour to vse that prescript forme of prayer but only by shift and cauill Then ye goe about to proue that euery sinne against the first Table of the Lawe is Idolatry but with no shewe of reason And heere ye scoffe because I sayd if euery sinne that is against the first Table be Idolatry who shall be saued and ye demaund who is frée from Idolatry an absurd spéech for the Scripture doth not call the godly either murtherers théeues idolaters or such like I thought we had not reasoned about the reliques of sin which remaine in the best so long as they liue héere but of such grosse idolatry as a Church is to be condemned and forsaken which is defiled therewith But séeing ye confesse that all men be idolaters that is touching the remnants of sinne it must néedes followe that there is no Church frée from all spottes for if all the partes and members be defyled the whole can not be cleane This doth ouerthrowe all the arguments which yée bring to condemne the Church of England which haue no force vnlesse yée will maintaine a perfection for if a Church and euery member in it can not but of necessitie be spotted and defyled with some remnants of idolatrie euen by your owne confession then can ye not reason thus this is a fault it is idolatrie therefore this or that assemblie which is spotted is no true Church but to be forsaken But ye must stand to prooue that the idolatrie is so grosse that it destroyeth the faith ouerthroweth Gods true worship and so destroyeth the verie life béeing of a Church Thus much about your preface now follow your argumēts No apocrypha is to be brought into the publike assemblyes All read prayer is apocrypha Therefore no read prayer is to be brought into the publike assemblyes In my first answere I did deale only with the assumption or second part of this Argument affirming that I could not sée how it can be proued and shewing sundry absurdities that would follow as namely that a prayer of the Canonicall Scripture being read when one prayeth should become apocrypha c. But you replyed that those absurdities grow from my mistaking your words and I sawe it was so for our question being about the reading of prayer and not about the matter it selfe I tooke it that although yee hold the Lords prayer and other prayers in the holy Scripture to be Canonicall in themselues yet being read to become apocrypha because ye say all read prayer is apocrypha and did not expresse it with this restraint all read prayer framed by men is apocrypha I must now take the Argument as you say your meaning is and deale with both the parts thereof First then touching the proposition no apocrypha is to be brought into the publike assemblies what can be more false Apocrypha is opposed vnto Canonicall if nothing may be brought into the Church but the Canonicall Scriptures then the Sermons and prayers of the pastors and teachers are to be banished I knowe your meaning is not at all to exclude these although your words taking apocrypha as it is in vse among vs do in déede shut them foorth and not only them but any paraphrase vpon the Scripture as the Psalmes in Metre Now to your assumption which saith all read prayer is apocrypha first it is false touching the Psalmes and the Lords prayer which be Canonicall when they be prayed Then further I sée no fitnesse in applying the name apocrypha vnto our spéech to God though it be vsed for that which is not his vndoubted word to vs. For by what name opposite to apocrypha will ye call those prayers which ye do allow ye will not call them Canonicall this Argument therfore is false and friuolous Argum. 2. We must do nothing in the worship of God without warrant of his word Read prayers haue no warrant of his word Therfore read prayers are not to be vsed in the worship of God To this I answer at the first that it is great audacitie to affirme that there is no warrant of the word for read prayer whē there be sundry testimonies to warrant the same vnlesse ye will make a difference betwéene that which a man readeth vpon the booke that which he hath learned out of the booke Further I said I do not remember that euer I haue read in the holy Scriptures that God commandeth the prayer shall be read vpon the booke for he commendeth this diligēce in all his people that they should throughly learne to vnderstand not only the matters but also the sentences and phrases which his spirit
and Teachers doo examine and make triall and choose him whome they shall finde euery way qualified for so worthy a function The matter being made knowne to as many as may be and especially to that flocke ouer which he is to be set that if any can alleadge iust cause why he is vnworthy of such an office they be heard otherwise after a due kind he is ordeyned and put into possession of his Ministerie Then touching your assumption the Ministers of the Church of England as ye say be imposed If ye vnderstand by imposed that they be all thrust vppon the flockes against theyr will and liking or that the flockes haue no power to take exception yee speake vntruly For there be many flockes in England which haue those Pastors and Ministers of the Gospell whome they haue desired to haue and made choyse of I meane by suite both to the Patrones and to the parties whome they desire to haue and if any of the people can shew iust cause against the partie which is to be ordeined the Byshop may not admit him There follow now many boasting words with which yee march in tryumph it is pitie to put them out of their array You require one reason at the least to confirme our Ministerie I confesse it is a reasonable request but first I must answere that which ye bring for to ouerthrowe it To proue our Ministerie not to be of Christ but to haue his negatiue Yée say yée finde not in his Testament the names we carry the offices we beare the manner of our entrance and administration our support and maintenance Touching our names we are called Ministers of the Gospell Pastors and Teachers which be the Tytles giuen in Gods word The names of Parsons and Vicars are not to make any distinction of the Ministerie but of the state of maintenance annexed vnto the same The Offices we beare are to teach and instruct our flockes by the wholesome word of God to administer the Sacraments and to make publike prayers And I am sure these are prescribed in Christes Testament and if your eye were not malignant yee might espy them there Our entrance is not by intrusion but by calling and that in many by the desire of the flockes as I haue shewed before and for the manner of our administration it hath béen dealt in at large in the first accusation Our support by Tythes and such like is not mayntayned as a matter of necessitie but as the most conuenient The word of God hath giuen the generall rule that the Minister of the word is to be liberally mayntayned the manner touching circumstances is to be ordered for most conueniencie by the Church and power of the Christian Magistrate For many things are lawfull and in the power of the Church to ordeyne which are not particularly named in Gods word but conteyned in generall rules Your next words are farre sharper and cut more déepely yea euen so déepely that wo bée vnto vs all if you haue not the venemous toong of liers and false accusers Yée vse a gradation to set foorth our pedigrée for we are yée say the children of the Byshops The Byshops are the creatures of the Pope The Pope is the eldest sonne of Satan and his vicar generall in earth Now as yée haue set vs héere vnder a verie honorable parentage so doo yée shewe vs great kindnesse in setting vs foorth not to be degenerate but to beare the image the marke the power and life of the Pope and together with him to growe liue raigne stand and fall as the branches with the trée Héere is the verie bottome of your gall héere is your poysoned sting thrust as déepe as is possible But let your words be examined and by the stepps that you ascend I will descend The highest is the Deuill the father of lyes Next vnto him the Pope his eldest sonne and vicar generall in earth In déede I am resolutely perswaded that the Pope is the Beast vnto whome the Dragon gaue his power his Throne and great authoritie Reuel 13. of whome it is sayd in the same place that all the world wondred and followed the Beast They worshipped the Dragon which gaue power to the Beast and they woorshipped the Beast saying Who is like to the Beast who is able to warre with him This no doubt is that man of sinne who hath exalted himselfe aboue all that is called God or that hath imperiall maiestie sitting in the Temple of God and boasting himselfe as God whose comming should be by the effectuall working of Satan with all lying signes and wonders 2. Thess 2. He hath set vp the verie worship of Deuils with all abhominable Idolatrie and blasphemous heresies and lyes He hath not only vsurped and challenged a ciuill power and Lordship ouer Kings but also a spirituall Dominion ouer the consciences and faith of man to make Lawes at his pleasure contrarie to Gods word to binde the same this is the vicar generall of the Deuill Then to come to the next steppe where there is no question nor doubt neyther to be made but that all Popish Byshops be the creatures and children of the Pope in as much as they haue their calling and consecration and power deriued from him in as much as they sweare obedience vnto him to mayntayne his dignitie his tyrannie his doctrine and his lawes and in as much as they challenge together with him a Lordship and tyrannie ouer the conscience But the Byshops of the Church of England haue not their calling consecration or power frō the Pope but frō our Church which hath forsaken the Church of Rome as the Sinagog of Satan The Byshops of England acknowledge no subiection to the Pope but by an oath renounce his vsurped power tyranny The Bishops of Engl. are not ordeined to maintain or defend y e religion lawes of Antichrist but quite contrary they promise and professe to aduance the Gospell of Iesus Christ by the liuely word to cut downe all idolatrie heresies and popish abhominations Finally the Bishops of Engl. do not vsurp a Lordship ouer the faith consciences of men for the power which they haue peculiar in the Church is only in the administration of externall gouernment It is therfore with manifest wicked sclander that ye tearme the Bish of Engl. Antichristian the creatures of the Pope and such as haue his power life in thē yea such as whosoeuer is ordeined by thē hath his ministry frō Antichrist and from the Deuill There is controuersy about the state gouernmēt by Bishops whether y e Church of Engl. hath not erred in cōmitting into their hands the execution of discipline which is the matter to be handled in your fourth accusation but to gather from hence a pedegrée from the Pope is verie foolishe Let vs come then to the lowest step which is in the ministers We haue laboured in studie of holie things to be fitte for the Ministerie and so furnished