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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A42125 An answer to some queries concerning schism, toleration, &c. in a letter to a friend ... Gandy, Henry, 1649-1734. 1700 (1700) Wing G197; ESTC R8150 50,034 60

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the_o make_v a_o bishop_n priest_n or_o deacon_n as_o baptism_n to_o make_v a_o christian_a and_o unless_o the_o dissenter_n can_v produce_v a_o better_a that_o be_v a_o more_o ancient_a charter_n than_o the_o bishop_n have_v which_o i_o be_o sure_a they_o can_v never_o do_v the_o sole_a power_n of_o ordination_n must_v be_v still_o in_o they_o and_o those_o that_o pretend_v to_o it_o must_v be_v usurper_n and_o consequent_o schismatic_n dr._n sherlock_n say_v but_o by_o what_o authority_n i_o know_v not_o that_o the_o 108._o vind._n of_o some_o prot._n princ._n p._n 108._o church_n of_o england_n do_v not_o deny_v but_o that_o in_o case_n of_o necessity_n the_o ordination_n of_o presbyter_n may_v be_v valid_a but_o he_o say_v with_o respect_n to_o the_o dissenter_n that_o the_o case_n of_o schism_n be_v a_o different_a thing_n and_o i_o believe_v say_v he_o our_o author_n himself_o will_v not_o say_v that_o schismatical_a presbyter_n may_v take_v this_o power_n or_o that_o their_o ordination_n be_v valid_a if_o they_o do_v and_o this_o be_v the_o case_n between_o we_o and_o the_o dissenter_n they_o ordain_v in_o a_o schism_n and_o though_o necessity_n may_v make_v a_o irregular_a act_n valid_a yet_o schism_n will_v not_o the_o novatian_o be_v episcopal_a and_o so_o be_v the_o donatist_n say_v mr._n 330._o vindic._n of_o the_o prim._n ch._n p._n 330._o baxter_n and_o yet_o how_o have_v they_o be_v judge_v of_o for_o their_o schism_n i_o need_v not_o tell_v they_o be_v very_o much_o to_o blame_v that_o say_v the_o presbyterian_o or_o independent_o trouble_v the_o primitive_a church_n it_o be_v impossible_a for_o they_o to_o be_v troublesome_a before_o they_o be_v at_o all_o it_o seem_v all_o the_o sect_n and_o schism_n of_o that_o time_n think_v they_o have_v no_o right_a to_o pretend_v to_o be_v a_o church_n unless_o they_o have_v bishop_n but_o these_o anti-episcopal_a separatist_n be_v reserve_v it_o seem_v for_o the_o last_o time_n as_o the_o severe_a curse_n and_o judgement_n that_o can_v befall_v the_o church_n those_o episcopal_a schismatic_n indeed_o divide_v the_o church_n but_o these_o quite_o dissolve_v it_o it_o have_v be_v the_o tradition_n and_o doctrine_n of_o the_o christian_a 324._o saywel_n of_o unity_n p._n 324._o church_n in_o all_o age_n even_o from_o the_o apostle_n time_n to_o this_o very_a day_n that_o no_o ordination_n be_v valid_a or_o aught_o to_o be_v make_v but_o by_o bishop_n to_o who_o the_o great_a authority_n of_o govern_v the_o church_n be_v commit_v i_o admire_v this_o episcopal_n government_n and_o institution_n because_o 1._o faith_n and_o practice_n of_o a_o church_n of_o eng._n man_n cap._n 1._o under_o it_o i_o be_o in_o no_o doubt_n of_o the_o validity_n of_o the_o ordination_n of_o our_o minister_n or_o of_o the_o validity_n of_o the_o sacrament_n by_o they_o administer_v for_o we_o have_v our_o order_n by_o a_o continue_a succession_n from_o the_o ancient_n and_o so_o from_o the_o apostle_n which_o be_v the_o only_a ordinary_a way_n that_o i_o know_v of_o for_o a_o man_n to_o be_v commissionated_a to_o act_v in_o christ_n name_n i_o suppose_v no_o man_n will_v deny_v that_o all_o ordination_n in_o schism_n 50._o thorndike'_v rts._n of_o the_o ch._n p._n 147._o review_n of_o mr._n m._n hs._n notion_n of_o schism_n p._n 50._o be_v mere_a nullity_n though_o make_v by_o person_n right_o ordain_v because_o against_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n we_o believe_v with_o st._n jerom_n that_o the_o power_n of_o ordain_v belong_v only_o to_o the_o bishop_n and_o your_o dissenter_n ordination_n make_v by_o presbyter_n be_v all_o void_a and_o null_a and_o till_o you_o can_v prove_v the_o contrary_a we_o take_v you_o for_o no_o more_o but_o a_o parcel_n of_o lay-intruder_n into_o those_o holy_a function_n to_o which_o you_o have_v no_o right_n those_o of_o you_o only_o except_v who_o have_v be_v episcopal_o ordain_v in_o the_o first_o place_n i_o must_v put_v he_o in_o mind_n that_o as_o no_o man_n 21._o id._n p._n 51._o mat._n 28._o 18._o jo._n 2._o 21._o be_v to_o meddle_v with_o the_o sacred_a office_n except_o he_o be_v call_v of_o god_n no_o man_n to_o preach_v except_o he_o be_v send_v so_o no_o man_n be_v to_o call_v or_o send_v as_o from_o god_n but_o he_o that_o be_v authorise_a by_o he_o for_o that_o purpose_n neither_o can_v i_o see_v any_o reason_n why_o a_o man_n may_v not_o as_o well_o be_v a_o minister_n of_o jesus_n christ_n without_o any_o mission_n at_o all_o as_o by_o the_o mission_n of_o those_o person_n who_o never_o be_v send_v themselves_o i_o believe_v there_o never_o be_v any_o case_n of_o absolute_a necessity_n for_o lay-ordinations_a 53._o id._n p._n 53._o but_o if_o possible_o such_o shall_v happen_v as_o the_o gentleman_n mention_n of_o a_o company_n of_o layman_n be_v cast_v upon_o a_o island_n or_o remain_v in_o some_o country_n when_o their_o pastor_n be_v all_o kill_v or_o turn_v heretic_n i_o be_o apt_a to_o believe_v that_o bishop_n and_o minister_n due_o ordain_v may_v be_v have_v from_o other_o country_n and_o if_o not_o methinks_v it_o will_v be_v reasonable_a and_o fit_a that_o we_o shall_v first_o see_v what_o god_n will_v do_v in_o such_o case_n before_o we_o presume_v to_o do_v any_o thing_n of_o ourselves_o for_o which_o we_o have_v no_o scripture_n warrant_v basil_n be_v so_o resolute_a upon_o his_o prerogative_n that_o he_o will_v not_o endure_v 550._o vindic._n of_o the_o prim._n ch._n p._n 550._o they_o chorepiscopi_fw-la shall_v ordain_v as_o much_o as_o the_o inferior_a clergy_n as_o deacon_n subdeacons_a reader_n and_o several_a other_o which_o the_o church_n of_o that_o time_n reckon_v among_o the_o clergy_n without_o his_o consent_n and_o if_o they_o do_v let_v they_o know_v say_v he_o that_o whosoever_o be_v admit_v without_o our_o consent_n shall_v be_v repute_v but_o a_o layman_n what_o will_v he_o have_v say_v if_o they_o have_v pretend_v to_o ordain_v presbyter_n or_o bishop_n in_o opposition_n to_o they_o the_o bishop_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n desire_v no_o more_o than_o st._n basil_n assume_v that_o none_o shall_v be_v repute_v priest_n or_o deacon_n that_o be_v ordain_v in_o their_o diocese_n without_o their_o consent_n and_o that_o by_o simple_a presbyter_n who_o be_v never_o chorepiscopi_fw-la or_o have_v any_o character_n to_o distinguish_v they_o from_o other_o presbyter_n therefore_o the_o case_n ought_v not_o to_o be_v reckon_v so_o hard_o as_o it_o be_v common_o represent_v by_o the_o more_o moderate_a nonconformist_n who_o pretend_v this_o point_n of_o re-ordination_a the_o only_a bar_n that_o keep_v they_o out_o of_o the_o church_n since_o there_o be_v never_o any_o other_o church_n not_o any_o in_o ancient_a time_n will_v have_v receive_v they_o upon_o any_o other_o term_n and_o they_o must_v have_v remain_v nonconformist_n under_o basil_n athanasius_n and_o all_o the_o ancient_a bishop_n who_o name_n be_v and_o always_o have_v be_v have_v in_o veneration_n with_o all_o christian_n not_o one_o of_o these_o will_v have_v ever_o be_v persuade_v to_o own_o a_o pastor_n that_o his_o presbyter_n have_v ordain_v in_o opposition_n to_o he_o nay_o hardly_o can_v they_o have_v be_v prevail_v with_o to_o admit_v such_o as_o any_o other_o bishop_n shall_v ordain_v within_o their_o diocese_n so_o extreme_a punctilious_a they_o be_v in_o this_o matter_n and_o there_o be_v hardly_o any_o one_o thing_n that_o cause_v so_o frequent_a and_o dangerous_a contention_n between_o they_o as_o the_o point_n of_o ordination_n q._n may_v order_n give_v in_o a_o schism_n be_v make_v afterward_o valid_a a._n tho_o as_o be_v say_v above_o all_o ordination_n in_o schism_n be_v 148._o thorndike'_v right_o of_o the_o ch._n p._n 148._o mere_a nullity_n and_o though_o make_v by_o person_n right_o ordain_v yet_o we_o find_v such_o ordination_n make_v valid_a by_o the_o mere_a decree_n of_o the_o church_n without_o ordain_v a_o new_a as_o the_o meletian_o in_o egypt_n by_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a in_o epiphanius_n and_o the_o church_n history_n and_o as_o pope_n melchiade_n much_o commend_v for_o it_o by_o st._n austin_n offer_v to_o receive_v all_o the_o donatist_n in_o their_o own_o rank_n beside_o divers_a other_o that_o may_v be_v produce_v the_o only_a reason_n why_o some_o thing_n though_o they_o be_v ill_o do_v yet_o ibid._n id._n ibid._n be_v to_o stand_v good_a be_v because_o the_o power_n that_o do_v they_o extend_v to_o they_o but_o be_v ill_o use_v so_o when_o the_o power_n be_v usurp_v as_o in_o all_o schism_n or_o when_o that_o be_v do_v which_o the_o law_n make_v void_a it_o can_v be_v to_o no_o effect_n therefore_o when_o the_o act_n of_o schism_n be_v make_v valid_a it_o be_v manifest_a that_o the_o order_n of_o bishop_n and_o presbyter_n be_v confer_v in_o point_n
the_o party_n from_o he_o that_o will_v never_o be_v unfaithful_a to_o the_o k._n etc._n etc._n to_o suspend_v be_v a_o judicial_a act_n which_o can_v be_v do_v without_o council_n bp._n london_n council_n hear_v the_o cause_n when_o the_o king_n command_v a_o judge_n he_o command_v he_o to_o act_n as_o a_o judge_n the_o ecclesiastical_a commissioner_n will_v not_o declare_v the_o bishop_n of_o london_n suspend_v till_o he_o have_v be_v full_o hear_v the_o prince_n of_o orange_n in_o his_o declaration_n represent_v the_o proceed_n declaration_n p._n o._n declaration_n against_o the_o bishop_n of_o london_n as_o one_o of_o the_o great_a grievance_n he_o come_v to_o redress_v the_o commissioner_n say_v he_o suspend_v the_o bishop_n of_o london_n only_o because_o he_o refuse_v to_o obey_v a_o order_n that_o be_v send_v to_o he_o to_o suspend_v a_o worthy_a divine_a without_o so_o much_o as_o cite_v he_o before_o he_o to_o make_v his_o own_o defence_n or_o observe_v the_o common_a form_n of_o process_n the_o substance_n of_o what_o be_v say_v in_o answer_n to_o this_o query_n be_v 1._o that_o a_o clergyman_n can_v be_v regular_o deprive_v but_o by_o bishop_n 2._o that_o a_o clergyman_n can_v be_v suspend_v but_o by_o a_o legal_a process_n 3._o that_o a_o bishop_n can_v be_v try_v or_o deprive_v but_o by_o his_o colleague_n that_o be_v bishop_n 4._o that_o those_o that_o be_v deprive_v without_o a_o hear_v or_o by_o incompetent_a judge_n can_v be_v so_o proper_o say_v to_o be_v deprive_v as_o violent_o thrust_v from_o their_o place_n and_o therefore_o it_o will_v follow_v 5._o that_o a_o bishop_n be_v not_o regular_o deprive_v be_v to_o all_o intent_n and_o purpose_n the_o canonical_a bishop_n of_o his_o see_n and_o a_o priest_n the_o true_a and_o lawful_a pastor_n of_o his_o flock_n and_o the_o people_n consequent_o owe_v obedience_n to_o they_o and_o can_v forsake_v their_o communion_n without_o incur_v the_o guilt_n of_o schism_n q._n be_v not_o the_o protestant_n in_o q._n mary_n day_n guilty_a of_o schism_n in_o make_v separate_a meeting_n under_o the_o then_o deprive_v bishop_n a._n i_o willing_o grant_v that_o in_o time_n of_o manifest_a corruption_n and_o 6._o long_a be_v an._n to_o hales_n of_o schism_n p._n 147._o reform_v justify_v p._n 6._o persecution_n such_o as_o the_o roman_a and_o marian_n be_v private_a meeting_n be_v lawful_a and_o necessary_a duty_n because_o if_o man_n do_v forbid_v what_o god_n have_v command_v it_o be_v better_a to_o obey_v god_n than_o man._n it_o be_v plain_a that_o the_o schism_n be_v on_o the_o side_n of_o the_o papist_n who_o upon_o pretence_n of_o papal_a authority_n do_v withdraw_v themselves_o from_o the_o communion_n of_o their_o own_o bishop_n after_o a_o universal_a agreement_n and_o concurrence_n in_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n for_o ten_o or_o eleven_o year_n together_o and_o make_v a_o formal_a division_n in_o the_o church_n which_o be_v before_o unite_v in_o peace_n and_o truth_n the_o popish_a bishop_n that_o be_v set_v aside_o in_o q._n elizabeth_n reign_n 14._o id._n p._n 14._o do_v possess_v the_o place_n of_o lawful_a bishop_n yet_o live_v or_o unite_v themselves_o to_o such_o as_o do_v possess_v they_o therefore_o they_o be_v schismatical_a and_o no_o lawful_a bishop_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n for_o as_o soon_o as_o these_o lawful_a bishop_n be_v turn_v out_o other_o be_v put_v into_o their_o place_n and_o not_o only_o so_o but_o contrary_a to_o all_o rule_n and_o orderly_a government_n in_o the_o church_n for_o the_o most_o certain_a fundamental_a constitution_n of_o the_o church_n in_o all_o age_n and_o the_o constant_a order_n of_o all_o society_n which_o be_v always_o tacit_o suppose_v though_o not_o formal_o observe_v be_v that_o while_n particular_a church_n keep_v to_o the_o faith_n and_o unity_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n as_o we_o have_v do_v all_o thing_n ought_v to_o be_v manage_v by_o the_o archbishop_n and_o bishop_n of_o the_o province_n and_o so_o by_o the_o chief_a governor_n and_o main_a body_n of_o the_o society_n or_o else_o thing_n can_v regular_o be_v do_v it_o be_v confess_v that_o 14_o or_o 15_o bishop_n be_v turn_v out_o or_o go_v 17._o id._n p._n 17._o away_o in_o q._n elizabeth_n day_n but_o according_a to_o our_o author_n be_v own_o argument_n they_o be_v schismatic_n and_o no_o lawful_a bishop_n because_o they_o come_v into_o the_o place_n of_o lawful_a bishop_n while_o they_o be_v alive_a or_o else_o be_v ordain_v by_o and_o communicate_v with_o such_o schismatic_n i_o add_v they_o usurp_v their_o place_n by_o turn_v out_o the_o metropolitan_o and_o major_a part_n of_o the_o bishop_n of_o each_o province_n and_o so_o can_v have_v no_o lawful_a authority_n or_o jurisdiction_n the_o true_a right_n and_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v in_o those_o 18._o id._n p._n 18._o lawful_a bishop_n that_o be_v make_v in_o k._n edward_n day_n and_o that_o be_v the_o true_a church_n of_o england_n which_o do_v adhere_v to_o their_o constitution_n they_o q._n mary_n bps._n be_v no_o lawful_a bishop_n because_o they_o 20._o id._n p._n 20._o either_o do_v schismatical_o invade_v the_o place_n of_o the_o lawful_a bishop_n or_o else_o be_v willing_o consecrate_a and_o do_v join_v in_o communion_n with_o those_o schismatical_a bishop_n when_o the_o queen_n eliz._n therefore_o do_v set_v they_o aside_o she_o do_v but_o dispossess_v man_n who_o have_v no_o just_a right_n and_o remove_v those_o by_o her_o civil_a authority_n who_o have_v no_o power_n but_o what_o they_o have_v by_o force_n and_o the_o secular_a constitution_n all_o else_o but_o thirlby_n be_v ordain_v by_o or_o communicate_v with_o 25._o id._n p._n 25._o they_o during_o their_o schism_n and_o usurpation_n and_o therefore_o neither_o the_o ordainer_n nor_o ordain_v have_v any_o right_a or_o jurisdiction_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n that_o which_o be_v essential_a and_o the_o authority_n and_o power_n to_o execute_v 27._o id._n p._n 27._o the_o sacred_a office_n of_o a_o bishop_n or_o priest_n in_o their_o respective_a charge_n be_v derive_v from_o the_o bishop_n of_o the_o province_n and_o after_o great_a violence_n and_o disorder_n from_o as_o many_o or_o the_o major_a part_n of_o they_o which_o survive_v every_o bishop_n and_o priest_n orderly_o constitute_v in_o his_o place_n do_v ibid._n id._n ibid._n act_n by_o the_o power_n and_o appointment_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n and_o they_o contemn_v the_o catholic_n church_n that_o desert_n and_o disturb_v they_o in_o the_o performance_n of_o their_o office_n hence_o we_o may_v understand_v our_o saviour_n meaning_n when_o he_o say_v if_o he_o neglect_v to_o hear_v the_o church_n let_v he_o be_v unto_o thou_o as_o a_o heathen_a man_n and_o a_o publican_n which_o in_o the_o first_o place_n do_v require_v we_o to_o hear_v our_o own_o particular_a parish_n priest_n and_o bishop_n whilst_o they_o be_v constitute_v and_o 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