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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A12557 Paralleles, censures, observations Aperteyning: to three several writinges, 1. A lettre written to Mr. Ric. Bernard, by Iohn Smyth. 2. A book intituled, the Seperatists schisme published by Mr. Bernard. 3. An answer made to that book called the Sep. Schisme by Mr. H. Ainsworth. Whereunto also are adioyned. 1. The said lettre written to Mr. Ric. Bernard divided into 19. sections. 2. Another lettre written to Mr. A.S. 3. A third letter written to certayne bretheren of the seperation. By Iohn Smyth. Smyth, John, d. 1612. 1609 (1609) STC 22877; ESTC S103006 171,681 180

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or_o pour_v of_o bind_v &_o lose_v be_v give_v by_o christ_n to_o the_o disciple_n or_o brethren_n the_o minor_a viz_n that_o christ_n speak_v to_o disciple_n &_o of_o brethren_n be_v manifest_a by_o divers_a particular_a us._n 1.15.21_o the_o disciple_n move_v a_o question_n unto_o christ_n concern_v the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n &_o christ_n teach_v unto_o they_o us._n 15._o that_o the_o little_a one_o that_o be_v the_o brethren_n &_o the_o disciple_n must_v not_o be_v offend_v or_o if_o they_o go_v astray_o &_o be_v lose_v they_o shall_v be_v seek_v again_o &_o us._n 15-17_a teach_v the_o duty_n of_o admonition_n in_o the_o degree_n thereof_o for_o the_o win_n of_o our_o brethren_n &_o perserve_v of_o they_o from_o go_v astray_o therefore_o us._n 18._o he_o speak_v of_o brethren_n &_o disciple_n attribute_v to_o they_o the_o power_n of_o bind_v &_o lose_v &_o us._n 19_o promise_v the_o hear_n of_o their_o prayer_n &_o us._n 20._o promise_v to_o they_o his_o presence_n if_o they_o 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of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n as_o one_o light_n be_v inflame_v of_o another_o be_v of_o the_o same_o nature_n &_o office_n &_o therefore_o a_o false_a ministry_n neither_o can_v it_o suffice_v to_o say_v that_o as_o it_o be_v most_o true_a &_o i_o do_v willing_o confess_v the_o ministry_n of_o england_n be_v much_o refine_v &_o reform_v from_o the_o dross_n of_o popery_n for_o refine_v sugar_n as_o long_o as_o you_o will_v it_o be_v sugar_n still_o in_o nature_n refine_v light_n as_o oft_o as_o you_o please_v from_o brimstone_n light_n to_o a_o tallow_n light_n from_o tallow_n to_o rosen_n from_o rosen_n to_o wax_v from_o wax_n to_o venice_n turpentine_n from_o that_o to_o the_o most_o precious_a subject_n that_o can_v be_v devise_v yet_o the_o light_n be_v of_o the_o same_o nature_n with_o the_o brimstone_n light_n so_o refine_v the_o ministry_n by_o succession_n of_o ordination_n as_o long_o &_o as_o oft_o as_o you_o will_v yet_o it_o be_v still_o of_o the_o first_o nature_n &_o till_o it_o be_v refine_v to_o nothing_o that_o be_v till_o it_o be_v abolish_v &_o extinguish_v a_o true_a ministry_n can_v never_o be_v raise_v up_o again_o for_o who_o can_v bring_v a_o clean_a thing_n out_o of_o that_o which_o be_v unclean_a the_o three_o argument_n the_o true_a ministry_n have_v a_o true_a vocation_n &_o calling_n by_o election_n approbation_n &_o ordination_n of_o that_o faithful_a people_n where_o he_o be_v to_o administer_v the_o ministry_n of_o the_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n of_o england_n have_v not_o the_o true_a vocation_n &_o calling_n by_o election_n approbation_n &_o ordination_n of_o a_o faithful_a people_n where_o thy_o do_v administer_v ergo_fw-la the_o ministry_n of_o the_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n of_o england_n be_v not_o the_o true_a ministry_n which_o christ_n have_v place_v in_o his_o church_n the_o major_a or_o first_o part_n of_o this_o argument_n be_v evident_a by_o these_o scripture_n compare_v together_o act._n 6_o 2-6_a and_o 14.23_o 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by_o successive_a ordination_n as_o sacrifice_v power_n be_v propagate_v by_o genealogy_n in_o the_o old_a testament_n from_o priest_n to_o priest_n then_o the_o priest_n thus_o ordain_v be_v enforce_v upon_o a_o parish_n with_o the_o patron_n presentation_n &_o the_o lord_n b._n his_o institution_n &_o the_o archdeacon_n induction_n &_o his_o own_o toll_n of_o a_o bell_n &_o take_v hold_v of_o the_o ring_n of_o the_o church_n do●e_n contrary_a to_o the_o like_n of_o all_o the_o bad_a man_n in_o the_o parish_n if_o he_o be_v a_o reformist_n &_o contrary_a to_o all_o the_o puritan_n in_o the_o parish_n if_o he_o be_v a_o formalist_n &_o with_o the_o like_n of_o all_o the_o goodfellow_n in_o the_o parish_n if_o he_o be_v a_o dumbdrincking-swagge_a ring_n priest_n &_o if_o this_o be_v the_o true_a vocation_n of_o christ_n true_a minister_n teach_v in_o his_o testament_n then_o be_v the_o minister_n of_o england_n true_a if_o not_o then_o be_v their_o ministry_n false_a &_o for_o this_o point_n i_o appeal_v to_o every_o good_a conscience_n &_o upright_a hart_n in_o england_n if_o any_o man_n be_v make_v minister_v any_o other_o way_n he_o be_v not_o make_v according_a to_o law_n &_o his_o ministry_n be_v void_a by_o law_n &_o a_o mullity_n in_o england_n &_o i_o dispute_v only_o against_o the_o ministry_n establish_v by_o law_n &_o if_o there_o be_v any_o other_o ministry_n beside_o or_o contrary_a to_o law_n which_o you_o mr._n bern._n will_v plead_v for_o let_v it_o be_v describe_v &_o confirm_v by_o the_o rule_n of_o christ_n testament_n &_o when_o we_o know_v it_o we_o will_v then_o acknowledge_v it_o if_o the_o lord_n jesus_n in_o his_o new_a testament_n will_v give_v approbation_n unto_o it_o otherwise_o this_o we_o hold_v for_o the_o present_a concern_v the_o ministry_n of_o the_o assembly_n ecclesiastical_a of_o the_o land_n the_o next_o point_n to_o be_v handle_v be_v the_o answer_v of_o your_o objection_n reason_n &_o cavil_n which_o you_o bring_v against_o this_o doctrine_n which_o we_o teach_v &_o for_o the_o ratefy_v of_o your_o ministry_n to_o be_v true_a &_o i_o tell_v you_o mr._n bern._n you_o have_v need_n bring_v good_a ground_n or_o else_o you_o &_o your_o fellow_n minister_n will_v be_v find_v false_a prophet_n thief_n and_o robber_n math._n 7.15_o john_n 10.1_o that_o which_o you_o allege_v for_o yourselves_o be_v contain_v from_o the_o pag._n 128-146_a of_o your_o book_n the_o first_o point_n whereof_o be_v this_o that_o you_o say_v your_o ministry_n be_v true_a because_o you_o convert_v soul_n i_o answer_v two_o thing_n 1._o that_o you_o convert_v no_o man_n to_o that_o true_a visible_a faith_n teach_v in_o the_o new_a testament_n of_o christ_n whereby_o man_n conversion_n must_v be_v judge_v but_o you_o do_v pervert_v man_n from_o it_o daily_o as_o evident_a experience_n teach_v for_o your_o book_n against_o the_o separation_n your_o preach_n &_o sermon_n against_o the_o way_n of_o the_o lord_n your_o conference_n &_o disputation_n &_o persuasion_n for_o man_n to_o forsake_v the_o truth_n &_o to_o continue_v still_o with_o you_o in_o the_o communion_n of_o your_o antichristian_a abomination_n or_o have_v forsake_v you_o to_o return_v back_o again_o into_o egypt_n these_o &_o the_o like_a course_n of_o you_o most_o frequent_a to_o the_o best_a reformist_n of_o the_o land_n plain_o manifest_a that_o you_o convert_v none_o at_o all_o to_o the_o faith_n of_o christ_n new_a testament_n but_o you_o pervert_v all_o that_o you_o possible_o can_v from_o the_o same_o now_o what_o you_o do_v in_o secret_a betwixt_o the_o l._n &_o the_o soul_n of_o they_o that_o hear_v you_o he_o only_o that_o see_v in_o secret_a know_v in_o particular_a particular_o &_o certain_o we_o know_v not_o nor_o inquire_v not_o see_v more_o of_o this_o point_n in_o that_o which_o be_v write_v before_o &_o in_o the_o letter_n to_o mr._n s._n at_o the_o end_n of_o this_o book_n 2._o let_v it_o be_v grant_v that_o you_o do_v convert_v man_n even_o to_o the_o true_a visible_a faith_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n i_o say_v this_o be_v no_o proor_a sufficient_a of_o the_o truth_n of_o your_o ministry_n that_o be_v to_o say_v that_o you_o be_v those_o true_a pastor_n mention_v eph._n 4.11_o act._n 20.28_o 1._o pet._n 5_o 1-3.1_a tim._n 3.2_o tit._n 1_o 6-9_a for_o these_o officer_n be_v give_v to_o the_o true_a church_n which_o church_n be_v establish_v before_o these_o officer_n be_v &_o these_o officer_n be_v occupy_v about_o the_o feed_v that_o be_v teach_v &_o guide_v of_o those_o particular_a church_n whereto_o they_o attend_v the_o church_n therefore_o consist_v of_o saint_n already_o convert_v to_o the_o faith_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n how_o do_v conversion_n argue_v a_o true_a ministry_n of_o pastor_n or_o elder_a or_o bb._n which_o convert_v not_o as_o his_o proper_a work_n but_o only_o feed_v that_o be_v edifi_v &_o build_v up_o man_n convert_v by_o teach_v &_o guide_v they_o in_o the_o way_n of_o the_o lord_n see_v more_o of_o this_o point_n also_o in_o the_o letter_n to_o mr._n s._n at_o the_o latter_a end_n of_o this_o book_n &_o in_o that_o which_o be_v write_v before_o which_o i_o desire_v may_v be_v consider_v but_o here_o you_o object_n that_o the_o apostle_n that_o be_v one_o send_v prove_v his_o call_n by_o the_o seal_n of_o his_o ministry_n viz._n conversion_n see_v rom._n 4.14.15_o 1._o cor._n 9.2_o &_o 2._o cor._n 3_o 13_a &_o 13.3.5_o &_o that_o it_o can_v be_v prove_v that_o jesus_n chr._n do_v work_n by_o false_a mean_n &_o it_o be_v our_o own_o grant_n i_o answer_v that_o if_o your_o argument_n be_v frame_v into_o form_n it_o be_v this_o he_o that_o convert_v soul_n be_v a_o apostle_n as_o paul_n 2._o cor._n 3_o 12_a the_o minister_n of_o england_n convert_v soul_n
be_v christ_n kingdom_n may_v true_o be_v term_v a_o monarchy_n mat._n 23_o 8-11_a ephes_n 4.5_o jam._n 4.12_o this_o power_n which_o christ_n have_v in_o himself_o can_v pass_v from_o himself_o to_o any_o other_o for_o as_o his_o preisthood_n be_v eternal_a &_o not_o pass_v from_o he_o to_o another_o heb._n 7.24_o so_o may_v it_o as_o true_o be_v say_v of_o his_o other_o office_n &_o particular_o of_o his_o kingdom_n &_o monarchical_a power_n nevertheless_o 2._o the_o lord_n jesus_n have_v ordain_v &_o appoint_v a_o certain_a order_n to_o be_v observe_v in_o his_o absence_n in_o the_o true_a visible_a church_n &_o have_v delegated_a a_o certain_a power_n &_o authority_n to_o his_o servant_n &_o subject_n for_o the_o preferve_n of_o that_o order_n &_o for_o the_o execution_n of_o those_o ordinance_n this_o delegated_a power_n &_o authority_n be_v mention_v marc._n 13.34_o 1._o cor._n 5.4_o this_o delegated_a power_n be_v avouch_v by_o the_o papist_n to_o be_v in_o the_o pope_n by_o the_o english_a prelate_n to_o be_v in_o the_o lord_n bbs._n &_o archdeacon_n by_o the_o presbyterian_o to_o be_v in_o the_o eldership_n by_o the_o brethren_n of_o the_o separation_n to_o be_v in_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n primary_o and_o fundamental_o for_o if_o the_o pope_n prelate_n presbytery_n or_o body_n of_o the_o church_n do_v say_v that_o the_o power_n which_o be_v in_o christ_n jesus_n be_v in_o they_o they_o do_v blaspheme_v most_o fear_v full_o rob_v christ_n of_o his_o honour_n &_o regal_a power_n &_o make_v themselves_o even_o christ_n himself_o the_o pope_n therefore_o be_v not_o antichrist_n for_o that_o he_o usurp_v that_o regal_a power_n which_o be_v proper_a to_o christ_n neither_o be_v the_o bbs._n of_o england_n antichrist_n for_o usurp_v that_o proper_a kingly_a power_n which_o be_v only_o in_o christ_n nor_o the_o presbytery_n antichristian_a for_o challendge_v the_o power_n monarchical_a of_o christ_n but_o they_o be_v all_o antichristian_a for_o usurp_v 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be_v jewish_a &_o so_o antichristian_a for_o in_o the_o old_a testament_n the_o preisthood_n be_v convey_v by_o successivon_n heer_n therefore_o i_o will_v prove_v unto_o you_o by_o undeniable_a argument_n that_o the_o power_n of_o christ_n be_v not_o give_v either_o to_o the_o pope_n bbs_n or_o presbytery_n but_o primary_o it_o be_v give_v to_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n first_o argument_n if_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n be_v give_v by_o succession_n to_o the_o pope_n bbs_n or_o presbytery_n primary_o than_o the_o ministry_n be_v before_o the_o church_n see_v that_o there_o must_v needs_o be_v a_o ministry_n before_o there_o be_v any_o power_n of_o christ_n this_o consequent_a be_v infallible_a but_o the_o ministry_n be_v not_o before_o the_o church_n but_o after_o the_o church_n for_o it_o arise_v out_o off_o the_o church_n as_o a_o part_n off_o those_o holy_a thing_n which_o god_n have_v give_v to_o his_o church_n therefore_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n be_v not_o give_v to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n or_o presbytery_n primary_o but_o to_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n they_o that_o affirm_v the_o ministry_n to_o be_v before_o the_o church_n must_v needs_o hold_v that_o a_o minister_n be_v no_o relative_a to_o a_o church_n but_o that_o a_o man_n may_v be_v a_o minister_n &_o have_v no_o flock_n to_o attend_v on_o yea_o that_o there_o may_v be_v &_o be_v a_o ministry_n when_o &_o where_o there_o be_v no_o church_n or_o that_o the_o charge_n of_o other_o man_n be_v his_o chardg_n or_o that_o the_o world_n be_v his_o charge_n they_o must_v also_o maintain_v that_o all_o grace_n flow_v from_o the_o ministry_n to_o the_o church_n that_o the_o ministry_n be_v a_o more_o excellent_a ordinance_n than_o the_o church_n that_o the_o church_n have_v no_o power_n to_o make_v minister_n but_o that_o the_o minister_n have_v power_n to_o make_v both_o minister_n &_o church_n &_o that_o minister_n be_v proper_o by_o their_o office_n apostle_n over_o the_o whole_a world_n for_o the_o convert_n of_o man_n &_o plant_v of_o church_n &_o the_o like_a absurditye_n second_o argument_n if_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n come_v by_o succession_n to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n &_o presbytery_n then_o the_o ministry_n of_o rome_n be_v a_o true_a ministry_n and_o all_o they_o that_o be_v make_v minister_n by_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o clergy_n be_v true_a minister_n then_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o join_v with_o the_o true_a ministry_n of_o rome_n and_o then_o whosoever_o be_v ordain_v and_o not_o by_o a_o precedent_a ministry_n be_v false_o ordain_v and_o so_o be_v false_a minister_n but_o the_o ministry_n of_o rome_n be_v no_o true_a ministry_n and_o they_o that_o be_v ordain_v by_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o clergy_n be_v no_o true_a but_o false_a minister_n and_o it_o be_v utter_o unlawful_a to_o join_v with_o the_o ministry_n of_o rome_n by_o the_o confession_n of_o all_o the_o protestant_n and_o minister_n may_v be_v ordain_v true_o without_o minister_n by_o the_o confession_n of_o the_o sincere_a reformist_n therefore_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n come_v not_o by_o succession_n to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n &_o presbytery_n primary_o but_o to_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n three_o argument_n if_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n come_v by_o succession_n to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n &_o presbytery_n then_o the_o lord_n have_v absolute_o bind_v man_n to_o sin_n see_v that_o we_o must_v needs_o join_v to_o the_o sin_n off_o the_o minister_n otherwise_o man_n can_v possible_o have_v &_o enjoy_v the_o holy_a thing_n of_o god_n for_o it_o be_v the_o ordinance_n of_o god_n that_o we_o shall_v use_v the_o holy_a thing_n &_o this_o assertion_n do_v avouch_v that_o we_o must_v have_v they_o from_o the_o ministry_n &_o therefore_o let_v their_o sin_n be_v what_o they_o will_v we_o must_v have_v they_o from_o their_o hand_n &_o so_o must_v join_v to_o they_o in_o all_o their_o sin_n but_o the_o l._n have_v not_o bind_v we_o necessary_o to_o join_v to_o other_o man_n sin_n see_v he_o have_v command_v we_o to_o separate_a from_o they_o &_o this_o be_v to_o lay_v our_o sin_n upon_o the_o lord_n most_o blasphemous_o therefore_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n come_v not_o by_o succession_n to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n or_o presbytery_n primary_o but_o to_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n the_o four_o argument_n if_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n come_v by_o succession_n to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n or_o presbytery_n then_o the_o lord_n have_v make_v the_o minister_n lord_n over_o the_o church_n so_o that_o the_o church_n can_v not_o have_v or_o enjoy_v any_o of_o the_o holy_a thing_n any_o of_o the_o l._n ordinance_n except_o they_o will_v agree_v or_o consent_v they_o unto_o for_o their_o holy_a thing_n be_v in_o their_o power_n but_o the_o l._n have_v not_o make_v the_o minister_n lord_n over_o his_o church_n which_o be_v his_o inheritance_n but_o they_o may_v have_v &_o enjoy_v his_o own_o ordinance_n even_o all_o the_o holy_a thing_n contrary_a to_o the_o will_n of_o wicked_a minister_n therefore_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n come_v not_o by_o succession_n to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n or_o presbytery_n primary_o but_o to_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n the_o five_o argument_n if_o christ_n ministerial_a power_n come_v to_o the_o pope_n bbs._n or_o presbytery_n than_o the_o presbytery_n may_v excommunicate_v the_o whole_a church_n then_o the_o bbs._n may_v excommunicate_v there_o whole_a diocese_n or_o province_n than_o the_o pope_n may_v excommunicate_v the_o whole_a church_n universal_a on_o earth_n but_o the_o l._n bbs._n of_o england_n say_v the_o pope_n can_v excommunicate_v england_n the_o reformist_n hold_v that_o the_o prelate_n can_v excommunicate_v their_o diocese_n &_o by_o consequent_a &_o just_a proportion_n the_o presbytery_n can_v excommunicate_v that_o particular_a church_n whereof_o they_o be_v presbyter_n
they_o be_v not_o capable_a to_o choose_v they_o a_o minister_n over_o they_o &_o afterward_o in_o the_o end_n of_o the_o section_n i_o say_v such_o a_o mix_a company_n be_v not_o a_o true_a church_n &_o a_o minister_n choose_v by_o they_o be_v not_o a_o true_a minister_n here_o i_o desire_v that_o it_o may_v be_v observe_v that_o i_o do_v not_o deny_v but_o man_n that_o be_v mix_v may_n appoint_v one_o to_o preach_v the_o word_n unto_o they_o but_o that_o which_o i_o say_v be_v that_o a_o mix_a company_n of_o good_a &_o bad_a be_v not_o a_o true_a church_n &_o that_o a_o man_n choose_v by_o they_o to_o be_v their_o minister_n be_v not_o a_o true_a minister_n if_o man_n desire_v instruction_n i_o deny_v not_o but_o they_o may_v appoint_v one_o to_o teach_v they_o &_o that_o magistrate_n in_o their_o dominion_n may_v appoint_v man_n to_o preach_v the_o word_n to_o their_o subject_n for_o their_o conversion_n &_o that_o it_o be_v a_o lawful_a thing_n for_o the_o people_n to_o hear_v such_o man_n &_o for_o man_n of_o gift_n to_o preach_v to_o such_o a_o people_n this_o we_o see_v practise_v act._n 13.42_o &_o 17_o 19-21_a &_o 28.30_o &_o otherwise_o how_o be_v it_o possible_a that_o man_n shall_v be_v bring_v to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o truth_n &_o mr._n ber._n if_o you_o think_v that_o we_o deny_v the_o lawfulness_n of_o this_o you_o do_v we_o open_a wrong_n &_o if_o his_o matie_z shall_v dissolve_v the_o parish_n ecclesiastical_a assembly_n &_o the_o false_a ministry_n &_o shall_v command_v man_n of_o knowledge_n &_o gift_n to_o preach_v the_o word_n to_o his_o subject_n i_o doubt_v not_o but_o all_o of_o we_o will_v herein_o ready_o yield_v ourselves_o to_o hear_v &_o learn_v the_o truth_n at_o any_o such_o person_n &_o ourselves_o to_o teach_v the_o truth_n to_o such_o a_o people_n but_o to_o say_v that_o such_o a_o people_n be_v true_a church_n or_o such_o preacher_n the_o true_a pastor_n of_o true_a visible_a church_n that_o we_o deny_v &_o that_o you_o shall_v never_o be_v able_a to_o prove_v but_o if_o after_o such_o preach_n by_o such_o preacher_n the_o l._n work_n with_o the_o people_n so_o as_o that_o they_o glad_o receive_v the_o word_n repent_v &_o believe_v &_o desire_v to_o walk_v in_o the_o truth_n &_o thereupon_o do_v promise_n to_o the_o l._n &_o each_o to_o other_o to_o walk_v in_o his_o way_n this_o promise_n make_v they_o a_o true_a church_n &_o then_o if_o they_o choose_v among_o they_o man_n able_a to_o lead_v &_o seed_v they_o &_o appoint_v such_o man_n to_o such_o office_n the_o man_n so_o choose_v &_o appoint_v be_v the_o true_a pastor_n which_o the_o scripture_n describe_v but_o what_o be_v all_o this_o to_o your_o assembly_n &_o minister_n who_o as_o yet_o have_v not_o cast_v of_o the_o yoke_n of_o antichristian_a bondage_n who_o communion_n &_o ministry_n be_v not_o dissolve_v but_o remain_v firm_a the_o same_o in_o nature_n though_o much_o better_v in_o degree_n with_o the_o roman_a assembly_n ecclesiastical_a &_o whereas_o you_o in_o this_o particular_a object_n to_o we_o that_o two_o or_o three_o of_o we_o separate_v from_o you_o &_o gather_v together_o into_o the_o new_a testament_n of_o christ_n assume_v power_n to_o make_v minister_n a_o practice_n as_o you_o say_v far_o from_o plain_a evidence_n of_o scripture_n or_o any_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n these_o thousand_o year_n i_o answer_v it_o be_v no_o matter_n for_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n these_o thousand_o year_n for_o gregory_n the_o great_a bb._n of_o rome_n who_o live_v a_o thousand_o year_n since_o hoist_v up_o antichrist_n into_o the_o high_a exaltation_n against_o god_n &_o his_o christ_n in_o a_o manner_n &_o his_o successor_n especial_o boniface_n &_o some_o other_o have_v maintain_v &_o enlarge_v that_o antichristian_a kingdom_n even_o to_o our_o day_n &_o yet_o the_o mystery_n of_o iniquity_n be_v exalt_v in_o these_o particular_n wherefore_o this_o allegation_n of_o you_o be_v nothing_o to_o the_o purpose_n if_o you_o be_v a_o sound_a protestant_n for_o if_o prescription_n of_o a_o thousand_o year_n be_v good_a in_o any_o thing_n why_o not_o in_o all_o thing_n if_o not_o in_o all_o thing_n then_o in_o nothing_o and_o whereas_o you_o allege_v that_o it_o be_v also_o far_o from_o plain_a evidence_n of_o the_o scripture_n i_o answer_v the_o evidence_n be_v plain_a to_o they_o that_o will_v understand_v &_o i_o will_v know_v what_o be_v plain_a evidence_n of_o scripture_n be_v not_o a_o true_a natural_a consequence_n plain_a evidence_n be_v not_o this_o plain_a evidence_n math._n 18.20_o whersoever_o two_o or_o three_o shall_v be_v gather_v together_o into_o my_o name_n i_o will_v be_v in_o the_o midst_n among_o they_o &_o this_o 2._o corinth_n 6.17_o be_v you_o separate_v &_o i_o will_v receive_v you_o &_o be_v your_o father_n &_o this_o gallat_n 3.16_o the_o promise_n be_v make_v to_o abraham_n and_o to_o his_o seed_n so_o than_o they_o that_o be_v of_o faith_n be_v bless_v with_o faithful_a abraham_n gallat_n 3.9_o if_o christ_n will_v be_v present_v with_o two_o or_o three_o of_o his_o disciple_n if_o god_n will_v receive_v they_o that_o be_v separate_v &_o be_v their_o god_n if_o the_o promise_n be_v give_v to_o they_o that_o believe_v as_o abraham_n believe_v then_o christ_n be_v their_o christ_n god_n be_v their_o father_n the_o promise_n be_v they_o and_o the_o ministry_n be_v they_o by_o plain_a evidence_n than_o they_o may_v assume_v the_o ministry_n &_o use_v it_o as_o god_n have_v appoint_v but_o for_o this_o point_n read_v the_o seven_o section_n &_o the_o paral._n censur_fw-fr observat_fw-la thereto_o aperteyn_a the_o thirteen_o section_n the_o next_o point_n to_o be_v handle_v be_v your_o seven_o in_o number_n viz._n that_o a_o minister_n may_v be_v make_v without_o elder_n ordinary_o i_o mean_v for_o extraordinary_a course_n be_v not_o now_o to_o be_v use_v for_o aught_o i_o see_v this_o point_n you_o blame_v as_o error_n let_v we_o see_v whether_o it_o be_v error_n or_o not_o i_o hold_v that_o a_o minister_n may_v be_v make_v without_o elder_n more_o plain_o i_o say_v that_o when_o the_o church_n want_v elder_n the_o church_n have_v power_n to_o elect_n approve_v &_o ordain_v she_o own_o elder_n also_o to_o elect_v approve_v &_o ordain_v she_o own_o deacon_n both_o man_n &_o woman_n for_o if_o you_o remember_v what_o be_v before_o speak_v to_o your_o five_o position_n viz_n that_o the_o church_n have_v the_o power_n of_o chr_n in_o itself_o viz_n that_o it_o have_v chr._n the_o covenant_n &_o all_o the_o promise_n give_v to_o it_o be_v yet_o but_o few_o in_o number_n &_o that_o the_o church_n have_v these_o thing_n in_o true_a title_n &_o interest_n as_o her_o own_o freehold_n than_o you_o shall_v see_v what_o will_v follow_v heruppon_o namely_o that_o the_o church_n have_v power_n to_o receive_v in_o member_n &_o cast_v out_o member_n to_o receive_v in_o her_o officer_n &_o to_o dischardg_v they_o of_o office_n the_o church_n have_v power_n to_o the_o preach_n of_o the_o word_n to_o the_o administer_a of_o the_o seal_n of_o the_o covenant_n to_o bind_v &_o lose_v which_o work_v she_o can_v do_v herself_o be_v many_o therefore_o she_o appoint_v fit_a person_n thereto_o viz_n such_o officer_n as_o christ_n have_v give_v to_o his_o church_n which_o be_v the_o elder_n still_o notwithstanding_o reserve_v her_o power_n to_o herself_o when_o occasion_n shall_v be_v offer_v these_o thing_n be_v sufficient_o prove_v already_o in_o answer_n to_o your_o five_o imputation_n but_o you_o have_v some_o thing_n perhaps_o to_o say_v for_o ordination_n that_o the_o church_n have_v not_o power_n of_o it_o then_o belike_o all_o the_o promise_n be_v not_o give_v to_o the_o church_n for_o if_o ordination_n be_v not_o give_v to_o the_o church_n than_o the_o ministry_n be_v not_o give_v to_o the_o church_n for_o it_o seem_v you_o make_v ordination_n a_o great_a part_n of_o the_o ministry_n but_o know_v for_o your_o learning_n that_o ordination_n do_v give_v nothing_o at_o all_o to_o the_o minister_n for_o election_n be_v the_o ver●e_a essence_n &_o form_n of_o the_o minister_n for_o in_o election_n power_n to_o administer_v be_v give_v to_o the_o officer_n elect_v for_o when_o the_o church_n choose_v the_o minister_n do_v not_o the_o church_n in_o effect_n say_v we_o give_v the_o a._n b_o power_n to_o administer_v the_o word_n seal_n of_o the_o covenant_n &_o censure_n in_o the_o behalf_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n &_o the_o minister_n elect_n do_v then_o actual_o possess_v &_o assume_v that_o power_n delegated_a unto_o he_o by_o the_o church_n so_o when_o the_o church_n choose_v her_o deacon_n do_v she_o not_o in_o effect_n speak_v thus_o we_o give_v you_o c.d.e.f._n