grown to that height that it had quite taken away from the Pastors that rule that of right did belong unto them And for the Reduction of it to the ancient form of Synodicall Government And therefore in the Judgement of this learned and reverend Antiquary our Provincial Assembly at Preston where the Pastors of the Churches are members as he acknowledgeth of right they ought to be in such Assemblies would not have been accounted a new termed Provincial Assembly But you go on and tell us That other parts of our Paper are full of darkness to which you say you cannot so fully assent till further explicated and unfolded by us We cannot apprehend any such darkness in our Paper as you speak of But yet because in yours you question what authority we have from the civil Magistrate for what we do and likewise the extent of it and your mistakes of our meaning may perhaps some of them arise from your unacquaintedness with the rule we walk by Although we were not to be blamed for any mistakes that might arise ab ignorantia juris whether simple or affected that we determine not but leave you to examine Before we come to make Answer more particularly to what follows we are willing to be at some paines to give you some further account of the power we are awarranted by the civil Authority for to exercise To what persons within our bounds it extends it self and what some of those rules are that are prescribed unto us by civil Authority to walk by in the exercise of that power we are betrusted with It is a general and common mistake amongst many that the Presbyterian Government was established by the Parliament but for three yeers and that therefore it is now expired and out of date But if you peruse all that passed in Parliament touching it no such matter will appear The directions of the Lords and Commons Assembled in Parliament after advice had with the Assembly of Divines for the Electing and chusing Ruling Elders in all the Congregations and in the Classical Assemblies for the Cities of London and Westminster and the several Counties of the Kingdom For the speedy setling of the Presbyterian Government bearing date August 19. 1645. Their Ordinance together with Rules and Directions concerning suspension from the Sacrament of the Lords Supper in cases of Ignorance and scandall dated Octob. 20. 1645. The Votes also of the said Houses for the Choise of Elders throughout the Kingdom of England and Dominion of Wales in the respective Parish Churches and Chappels according to the directions before mentioned And touching the power granted to the Tryers of Elections of Elders Of the date of Feb. 20. 1645. and Feb. 26. 1645. Their Ordinance for keeping scandalous Persons from the Sacrament of the Lords Supper the inabling of Congregations for the choice of Elders and supplying of defects in former Ordinances and Directions of Parliament concerning Church Government bearing date March 14. 1645. The Remedies prescribed by them for removing some obstructions in Church Government dated Aprill 22d 1647. And their Ordinance for the speedy dividing and setling the severall Counties of this Kingdom into distinct Classicall Presbyteries and Congregationall Elderships dated Jan. 29. 1647. We say all these were passed absolutely without any proviso's at all limiting the time of their continuance that is expressed in any of them Indeed in the Ordinance of Parliament giving power to all the Classical Presbyteries within their respective bounds to examine approve and ordain Ministers for severall Congregations dated Nov. 10. 1645. It is provided in the Close of it That it shall stand in force for twelve moneths and no longer As it is provided in another Ordinance for the Ordination of Ministers by the Classicall Presbyters within their respective bounds for the severall Congregations in the Kingdom of England bearing date August 28. 1646. That it shall stand in force for three years and no longer Which latter might give to some that took but the matter upon report an occasion to conceive that the Presbyterian Government was settled but for three years Although that was but ill applied to all the severall Ordinances that had passed before which belonged onely to one But the Ordinance especially from which chiefely as we conceive the mistake arose about settling the Presbyterian Government for three years onely was the Ordinance that passed June 5. 1646. The title whereof is An Ordinance of the Lords and Commons Assembled in Parliament for the present settling without further delay of the Presbyteriall Government in the Church of England In the Close whereof it is ordained That this Ordinance shall continue for the space of three years and no longer unless both Houses think fit to continue it But if the matter of this Ordinance be consulted it is manifest it was but touching a Committee of Lords and Commons to adjudge and determine scandalous offences not formerly enumerated appointed by the Ordinance in stead and place of Commissioners mentioned in the Ordinance of March 14. 1645. And also shewing how the Elderships were to proceed in the examination of such scandalous offences And touching what power was granted to the said Committee and in what sort they were to proceed as is clear to any that shall but take the paines to peruse that Ordinance The ground whereof in the preface to it is made to be this The Lords and Commons in Parliament holding their former resolution that all notorious and scandalous offenders shall be kept from the Sacrament have thought fit to make a further addition to the scandalous offences formerly enumerated for which men shall be kept back from the Sacrament And least the stay of the enumeration and the not naming of Commissioners to judge of Cases not enumerated should hinder the putting in execution the Presbyterian Governement already established They have thought fit c. And do therefore ordain a Committee therein particularly nominated in stead and place of Commissioners The groundlesness of the mistake about settling the Presbyterial Government for three years onely that might arise from the proviso in this Ordinance is so clear to any common understanding that the bare recitall of the sum of the matter of this Ordinance and the ground of making it doth make it so fully to appear that it were but lost labour to use any more words about it But we have particularly mentioned all that ever passed the Parliament so far as we have either seen or heard of that hitherto concerned Church Government untill the year 1648. When the form of Church Government to be used in the Church of England and Ireland was agreed upon by the Lords and Commons Assembled in Parliament after Advice had with the Assembly of Divines and was ordered by them to be printed August 19. of the said year 1648. And this Ordinance wherein all that had passed the Parliament before in parts and at severall times and what ever was but temporary by vertue of
catechized publickly in the Congregation But as for those that are conscious to themselves that they are very ignorant if these should be called forth to publique Catechizing it were more likely to drive them from the publique Assembly and so from the use of all means for their information then be availeable to this end As touching what was propounded by us in our paper as the way for their information though it was not intended for any such a purpose as to exclude publique Catechizing it was done in way of condescension to the weakest and to shew our willingness to apply our selves to any course so we might be instrumentall to bring poor dark and blinde Souls to the knowledge of Christ and which in our Judgement is more likely to be attained in many as the case stands with them in a more private way of Catechizing in any of the wayes propounded by us then if we should Catechize all the severall Families publiquely before the whole congregation 2 Touching those that erre so grossely whether in Doctrinals or points of discipline thereby renting from a true constituted Church you say we speak nothing either of their sin or punishment yet you hope we with you do hold that the Churches lawfull Pastors have the power of the keyes committed to them to excommunicate such offenders We have given you the reason already why we made not such express mention of these offenders as of the former although as you will hereafter perceive we are not wholly silent touching eirher the sin or punishment of these Onely at present because you profess to allow of that previous course of admonition prescribed by Christ in reference to the scandalous Mat. 18. before they be excommunicated but here say nothing of any such course to be taken with the hereticall or schismaticall though we hope also of you that you disallow it not we shall briefly declare what course is to be held by the rules of the Presbyterian Government before the sentence of excommunication pass against these offenders and whereof our paper was not silent This Government however it gives no toleration to any such errours as subvert the faith or any other errours which overthrow the power of godliness if the party who holds them spreads them seeking to draw others after him or to any such practises as in their own nature manifestly subvert that order Vnity and Peace which Christ hath established in his Church These being offences censured by this Government and of which further afterward yet this Government prescribes the exercise of patience and long suffering even toward those that do grossely erre in Doctrine as well as toward those that are scandalous in life in the use of all means for the convincing them of their errours by reasoning with them out of the Scriptures as we see was practised in the Synod that was held at Jerusalem and as we see the Fathers of the Nicene Council did not disdain to reason and dispute with Arrius though he denyed the Deity of Christ before they condemned him And as also other Fathers did with other Hereticks in the Synods although oftentimes in vain That so none might have any just cause to complain that they were condemned before they were fully heard And as touching such as run into such practices as in their own nature tend manifestly to the subverting of that order and unity which Christ hath established in the Church it labours with these also in the use of all gentle means to reclaim them and bring them back again to the Church they have rent themselves from before it proceed to censure As it doth also put a difference between the seducers and ring-leaders of a Sect and those that are misled Having respect not only to the nature of the offence but also to the quality of the offender and exerciseth patience and forbearance towards all so long as there is any hope of reducing them by milde correction Being ever more desireous to heal then cut off any member And thus having declared our selves in this we go an with you 3 For you say For such as are scandalous and wicked in their lives admonition private and publique is to be observed according to Christs rule Mat. 18. But if they still continue and will not reform the Churches lawfull Pastors have power to excommunicate such In this you fully come up to what we hold as to the means that is to be used for the reformation of these and we are glad there is an agreement in judgement betwixt you and us thus far Neither can we see how upon this concession you can in reason finde fault with our proceedings if there should be occasion for our censuring any such persons as for their notorious offences and their obstinacy therein might justly merit the highest censure For however perhaps you may say you stumble chiefely at this that our ruling Elders that in your judgement may be but meer Lay-men do joyn in the Government with us yet we see not how this can be any just ground of scruple to any of you who if we mistake not were all of you satisfied in your consciences touching the lawfulness of the late Government of Episcopacy as it was then exercised at least as to submission to it and wherein High-Commissioners Chancelors and Commissaries that were as much Lay-men then as ruling Elders can be in your judgement now had so great a share as to suspend Ministers from the exercise of their Ministry upon such complaints as according to the orders that were appointed in those dayes they might take cognizance of and so far as to decree the sentence of excommunication against them and others as there was occasion for it But here we must yet further profess we do not know whom you mean by lawfull Pastors to whom you here grant the power of excommunication Dr Hammond Some we know there are that would make the Diocesan Bishops the onely Pastors of the Church and that other Ministers do but officiate by deputation from them and under them We hope you are not of the minde of these For then as the dissent in judgement betwixt you and us would be far greater then as yet we apprehend it is so hence it will follow that till Prelacy should be restored there must not if you would provide for the safety of the persons and estates of them that should mannage the Government be the dispencing of any Church censures at all For you may easily know that not only by Acts and Ordinances of Parliament before made for the abolishing of Archbishops and Bishops c. and which are confirmed by the late humble Advice assented unto by his Highness sect 12. the office and jurisdiction of Diocesan Bishops is taken away But there is yet a further Barre put in against Prelacy in the 11. sect of the aforesaid humble Advice where it is expresly cautioned and we judge it was out of a conscientious mindfulness of what had been
not finde that the Presbyterian Government hath lyen hid so long as that for the space of 1500 years it could never be found till this present You have heard what rule did anciently belong to Presbyters notwithstanding that through the corruptions that crept into the Church in after times the exercise of that power was long disused And the like may be said of Ruling Elders and as hath been shewed by others But it is what de jure ought to be and not what de facto is or hath been which is that which you and wee are chiefly to attend and concerning which the Scripture must be the onely Judg as wee have said before But you say now subjection to our present Government is required by us and then demand Whether all that observe not our rank and order and subject not themselves to our present Government must be taken for lawlesse persons for so say you doth this close connexion of ours seem to import viz. Many who do not subject but live c. But here you do reason fallaciously à bene conjunctis ad male divisa For in our Paper wee speak of such as did live in a sinfull and total neglect of the Lords Supper That were scandalous and offensive in their lives drunkards unclean persons and that will not subject themselves to the present Government but live as lawlesse persons And therefore the lawlesse persons wee meant and as might plainly have been gathered from our words were such who as they subjected not themselves to the present Government of the Church so they were also scandalous and offensive in their lives wee joyning these altogether whom you divide And whether such as will neither submit themselves to the Laws of God nor the Government that is settled in the Church by the Civil Power be not lawlesse persons we leave it to you to judg But yet we do here also minde you That however we do not judg all those to be lawlesse persons that do out of conscience not come up to the observation of all those Rules which are or shall be established by Authority for regulating the outward worship of God and Government of this Church being otherwise blamelesse yet both you and wee may well remember that such as should have refused to have subjected themselves to the late Prelatical Government would have been accounted in those times to have been lawlesse persons But you say When wee make it an Order that notice shall be taken of all persons that forsake the publick Assemblies of the Saints you would gladly know how farr wee extend this Saintship this Church and Assembly of Saints To which wee answer as farr as the Apostle did when writing to the Church of Corinth and the Churches of Galatia hee calls them Saints and Churches notwithstanding there were some in those Churches that were leavened with unsound doctrine and grosly erroneous In Corinth some that denied the Resurrection made rents and schisms and sundry grosly scandalous In the Churches of Galatia such as mixed works with Faith in the point of Justification and of which the Apostle Paul would have those Churches to take notice even to the censuring of them they being spots to those Assemblies and however Saints by profession and in regard of outward calling being in Covenant with God and having been baptized yet answered not their profession by suitable conversation And therefore however there be sundry of the like stamp in our Assemblies wee do not therefore unchurch them or make our Assemblies not the Assemblies of Saints because of the corruption of such members And seeing our principles and practices are manifestly known to be utterly against the opinions and practices of the Donatists of old and those that have of late rent themselves from our Churches because of the scandalousnesse of the corrupt members that are found in them though the sin of these in our Churches is aggravated by giving that occasion you might well have spared your pains in transcribing out of Augustine what hee justly said unto those schismaticks that hee had to deal with Nay you might rather have gathered from our Paper That seeing wee said that notice should be taken of all those that should forsake the publick Assemblies of the Saints our purpose was to have censured such as the Donatists were That wee purposed to observe and censure those that did maintain and hold up private meetings in opposition to the publick That crie down our Churches and publick Assemblies Ministery and Ordinances as you know several sorts do and who as they hold sundry grosse errors that subvert the faith so in regard of those and other their practices that in their own nature do manifestly subvert the order unity and peace that Christ hath established in his Church do justly fall under Church censure according to the rules of our Government above mentioned And that therefore wee were not altogether silent concerning either the sin or punishment of such as did err grosly in doctrinals or in discipline so as to make such dangerous rents from the Church as the fore-named Sectaries do Contrary to what you say of us in your Paper And further by such as forsake the publick Assemblies of the Saints of whom wee said notice should be taken you might have gathered our meaning was that such of which sort there are but too many amongst us who out of a principle of carelesnesse sloth worldlinesse or manifest prophanenesse do on the Lords day either idle out the time or else are worse imployed when they should resort to the publick Assemblies and who as they are no friends to any private meetings for the good of their souls in the use of any private means of conference or prayer for that end So they do also Atheistically turn their backs on all the publick Ordinances forsaking them and the Assemblies where these are dispensed should be taken notice of in order to censure if there was not reformation and to neither of which sort of persons any indulgence is granted by any Laws of the Land that wee know of And if you had gathered thus much from our Paper as your mistake had been far the less so your Charity had been the more then to have reckoned us in the number of such Persons as the Donatists were And yet we did not mean That we intended to take notice in order unto censure of such who being sound in the faith and godly in life though differing from us in point of Discipline and Government had their distinct Assemblies from ours they indeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of Peace They not being censurable by the rules of our Government as is manifest by what we have declared before Although we remember how all that submitted not to the former Government were counted schismatical Neither did we reckon these in the number of the lawless Persons we speak of who subjected not themselves to our Government and whom we account to be
Churches lawfull Pastors have the power of the Keys committed to them to excommunicate such offenders 3. For such as are scandalous and wicked in their lives Admonition private and publique is to be observed according to Christs rule Mat. 18. but if they still continue and will not reform the Churches lawfull Pastors have power to excommunicate such Thus far we accord in judgement touching the way of informing the ignorant and reforming wicked persons and schismatical which course is so fully warranted by the Word of God and the constant practise of the Catholique Church that we are not so wavering and unsetled in our apprehensions of the case as to submit either it or them either wholly or in part to the contrary judgement and determination of a General Council of the Eastern or Western Churches much less to a new termed Provincial Assembly at Preston wherein we no little differ from you Other parts of your Paper are full of darkness to which we cannot so fully assent till further explicated and unfolded by you For 1. Whereas you say That in the several congregations if not in all belonging to this Association there are many persons of all sorts that are members of congregations c. you seem to hint that though your grief may be general as ours for all offenders yet your censures extend onely to those who have admitted themselves members of some Congregation within your Association and yet live inordinately and will not be admonished If so then we who never were any members or associates of yours are not within the verge and compass of your Presbyterian discipline for what have you to do to judge those that are without 2. But whereas your complaint and offence taken is That many there are of all sorts who will not submit themselves to the present Government of the Church but live like lawless persons out of their rank and order If by the present Government of the Church you mean your own as may strongly be conjectured you do then are we also comprehended therein and must fall within your censure and not onely we but all Papists Anabaptists and all other of what Profession and Religion soever who live within the Parish must be taken for members of some one Congregation within your Association and so driven into the common fold of Presbytery and be subject to your Government And this as we suppose is the cheif design of you in this as in other transactions of yours to subject all to your Government which you garnish over with the specious title of Christs Government Throne and Scepter Presbytery is the main thing driven at here and however she cometh ushered in with a Godly pretence of sorrow for the sins and ignorance of the times and a duty incumbent upon you to exercise the power which Christ hath committed to you for edification and not for destruction yet these are but as so many waste papers wherein Presbyterie is wrapped to make it look more handsomely and pass more currently but beware we must for latet anguis in Herbâ Object But you say For want of the vigorous exercise of this Ecclesiastical discipline ignorance Atheism and Licentiousness grows upon us and men live as lawlesse persons out of their rank and order because not subject to your present Government Sol. We pray for the establishment of such Church Government throughout his Highness Dominions as is consonant to the will of God and Universall practice of primitive Churches that Ecclesiasticall discipline may be exercised in the hands of them to whom it was committed by Christ and left by him to be transferred from hand to hand to the end of the World and shall readily joyn with you in humble addresses to his Highness and his great Council for the establishment of such a Church Government In the mean time though there may be such who as you say live as lawless persons out of their rank and order yet are they subject to law and therefore subject to punishment for though your Ecclesiastical sword cannot take hold on them the civill sword doth reach them Your Class may do well then not to contemn as in charity we hope you do not the authority of the civill Magistrate but in stead of warning all and every member belonging to them to complain to the Eldership of those that walk disorderly and will not be reclaimed to the end they may excommunicate them That they exhort them to complain to the civill Magistrate whose sword of Justice is sharper and longer and likely to work a greater reformation in the lives and manners of men by a corporal and pecuniary Mulct then any sword of excommunication or other Church censure your Eldership can any way pretend unto There are other parts of your paper do remain likewise dark which we desire may be made plain unto us for whereas you say There are many persons of all sorts c. That will not submit themselves to the present Government of the Church but live as lawless persons out of their rank and order Our Quaeres thereupon are 1. Why Government in singulari is there no Ecclesiasticall Government but yours may not another Church have its Government different from yours yet not different from that which Christ hath prescribed in his Word Calvin saith yea Scimus enim unicuique Ecclesiae c. And accordingly there are other Churches in England different in Government from yours and as good as yours But if you say yours is the Government 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by way of eminency as Christs own Government more immediatly and jure divino which you so much defend then why the present is there no present Government in any Church or Assembly of Saints but where your discipline is erected Are all the rest at present without Government or where hath yours been this 1500. years past till this present Hath Antichristianism so overspread the face of the Church that Christs own Government could never get footing till this present But now subjection is required thereto of all yet many of all sorts will not subject but live as lawless persons out of their rank and order Our next Quaere is What must all those that observe not your ranks and orders subject not themselves to your present Government be taken for lawless persons out of their rank and order Yea for so this close connexion of yours seems to import viz. many who do not subject but live c. In your paper you further proceed and make it an order That notice shall be taken of all persons that forsake the publick assembly of Saints We would gladly know how far you extend this Saintship this Church and assembly of Saints if to your own Church onely and such as subject themselves to your Government then S. Augustines Answer against the Donatists who would not acknowledg a Church in the World but amongst themselves may also be yours O Impudentem Vocem saith he Illa non est Quia
tu in illa non es Vide nè tu ideo non sis nam illa erit etsi tu non sis But if your charity reach further then to your own assemblies then you make lawless persons such as will not subject themselves to your Government Saints and members at least of the invisible Triumphant Church though none of your present visible militant Church and then your charity over reacheth Again we are unsatisfied in the Word Publique the publique assemblies of the Saints What do not private assemblies please you We presume you are not against private meetings your own practice speaks the contrary But you will binde all notwithstanding your private Assemblies to frequent your publique also other wayes they shall be taken notice of What though they cannot submit to your Government Leave you no room for tender consciences The Laws of the Land have otherwayes provided And if you under color of authority will make Laws and Edicts and publish them openly in the Church for all to obey upon pain of excommunication contrary to the Laws in force whether you do it in contempt of the civill power or through ignorance of the Laws which later is rather to be supposed in a charitable and favourable construction yet in what sense soever it be taken we much question and it concerns you to look to it whether you have not run your selves into a praemunire Again whereas you say That like notice shall be taken of all scandalous persons Our next Quaere is Whether those that forsake the publique Assemblies of Saints in the 2d order may not be taken for scandalous and so comprehended in this 3d. If so Quare oneramini ritibus why do you lengthen out your paper and burden us with traditions in multiplying of orders sine necessitate ad Arthritim usque After the 2d and 3d orders against those that forsake the publique Assemblies of Saints and such as are scandalous comes in a fourth touching the Catechumenists in the first order mentioned viz. That the Minister when he Catechizeth the severall Families shall exhort such persons in them as he findes be of competent knowledge and are blameless in life that they present themselves to the Eldership that they may be admitted to the Sacrament of the Lord supper But what if they will not present themselves before the Eldership The Minister must exhort and admonish them What if still they refuse Their names shall be published openly in the several congregations and they warned before all to reform That 's the 9th order Mark Men of blameless life and knowledge must be warned before all to reform But what if after all this they will not reform but continue obstinate Then no admission to the Sacrament that 's implyed in the fourth order There 's their Excommunicatio minor But that 's not all a higher censure yet They shall be cast out and excommunicated So saith the 6th and last order the great Excommunication which casteth out of the Church also and judgeth them no better then Heathens and Publicans notwithstanding all their piety and knowledge So that in brief all wilfully ignorant and Scandalous are to be excommunicated and not onely they but the knowing and blameless of life if they present not themselves to the Eldership These things premised lying sadly on our spirits and consciences as not sound and orthodox for which we cannot so readily joyn with you till further satisfaction be given us and which the publisher of your Paper promised should be given to all that did desire We therefore thought fit to signifie these our scruples to you and shall wait earnestly for a speedy satisfaction in the particulars remaining Your Brethren desirous of Truth Vnity and Peace in the Church Isaac Allen. Jo Pollett Tho Prestwich Leonard Egerton Ferdinando Stanley c. At Manchester Feb. 23. 1657. The Answer of the First Classis within the Province of Lancaster unto a Paper presented unto them at their Classical meeting Jan. 12. 1657. by certain Gentlemen subscribed by them and sundry others within the bounds of this Association Gentlemen WEE have perused your Paper and do finde in it sundry mistakes and some manifest wrestings of our plain meaning in that Paper of ours which was published in our several Congregations And wee are also sensible of the sharp reflections in it upon the Government that is committed to our mannagement and on our selves But wee shall not go about to answer you in that kinde and therefore laying aside animosities and putting away gall and bitternesse in the spirit of love and meeknesse however in faithfulnesse and plainnesse wee shall endeavor to shew you your Errors and rectifie your mistakes And wee do thus farr acknowledg your fair dealing for which wee give you hearty thanks that you addresse your selves unto us giving us thereby the opportunity both to vindicate our selves and give you a right understanding of the maters wherein you are mistaken Our leasure will not permit us to spend time about impertinencies but yet that you may not conceive wee are destitute of Civil Authority which you in your Paper minde us not to contemn and wee our selves do professedly testifie all due respects unto as in duty wee are bound wee intreat you to take notice That the Lords and Commons assembled in Parliament having resolved to establish the Presbyterian Government throughout the Kingdom of England and Dominion of Wales did August 19. 1645. publish their directions after advice had with the Assembly of Divines for the electing and chusing of ruling Elders in all the Congregations and in the Classical Assemblies for the Cities of London and Westminster and the several Counties of the Kingdom for the speedy settling of the Presbyterian Government In these directions as may be seen pag. 8. they did ordain That in the several Counties certain persons Ministers and others should be appointed by authority of Parliament who should consider how the several Counties respectively might be most conveniently divided into distinct Classical Presbyteries and what Ministers and others were fit to be of each Classis And that they should accordingly make such division and nomination of persons for each Classical Presbytery Which divisions and persons so named for every division the appointed should be certified up to the Parliament And they further appointed That the said several Classes respectively being approved by Parliament within their several precincts should have power to constitute Congregational Elderships According to these directions the persons by them appointed for this County met and did consider how it might be most conveniently divided into distinct Classical Presbyteries and what Ministers and others were fit to be of each Classis and also made such a division and nomination accordingly and certified the same up to the Parliament All which being done according to their directions and appointment It was resolved by the Lords and Commons assembled in Parliament Oct. 2. 1646. That they did approve of the division of the
this time and to such Persons we think herein we owed the Provinciall Assembly unto whose Authority we profess our selves to be subject so much respect and duty as to submit our apprehensions in a Case of this nature which they had propounded unto us to be seriously weighed as they had done to the rest of the Classes within this Province unto their Judgement and to take their concurrent approvall along with us before we proceeded to practise in a matter of this weight And yet we have declared before That however we are not so wavering and unsettled in matters of faith as to resolve our belief into the determination of Synods or Councils believing no more nor no otherwise then as they determine Yet that it is not out of the compass of the authority of a Synod to examine try and authoritatively to censure Doctrines as well as matters of Discipline And we think how confident soever you may be of the soundness and orthodoxness of what in your Paper you propound in way of exception against any thing in ours you have not such clear and inquestionable grounds from Scripture for the same that you were to be accused of wavering or unsettledness if you had submitted the same to have been examined and tried by a Provincial Assembly and much less if you could have had the opportunity of submitting it to the Censure of a General Council But whereas mentioning our Provincial Assembly at Preston you call it a new termed Provincial Assembly If your meaning be that the terming it a Provincial Assembly in stead of a Provincial Synod is a new term then this is but onely a Logomachia and not much to be insisted on Although we frequently call it a Provincial Synod as well as a Provincial Assembly But if your meaning be That it is a new termed Provincial Assembly at Preston Because Provinciall Synods or Assemblies have been held but lately at Preston we see not if Provincial Assemblies be warrantable and have been of ancient use in the Church that having been long in dis-use they begin of late to be held at Preston that can justly incurre your censure But if the Antiquity of such Assemblies be that you question Then we referre you to what Dr Bernard in the Book of his above quoted shews was the Judgement of Dr Vsher who is acknowledged by all that knew him or are acquainted with his works to have been a great Antiquary however we alleadge him not that you should build your faith upon his Testimony and which we think may be sufficient to vindicate Provincial Assemblies in your thoughts from all suspition of novelty In that Book you have in the close of it proposals touching the Reduction of Episcopacy unto the form of Synodical Government received in the ancient Church And it thus begins By the Order of the Church of England all Presbyters are charged to administer the Doctrine and Sacraments and the Discipline of Christ as the Lord hath commanded and as this Realm hath received And that they might the better understand what the Lord hath commanded herein The exhortation of Paul to the Elders of Ephesus Acts 20.28 is appointed to be read unto them at the time of their Ordination A little after it is acknowledged That Ignatius by Presbytery mentioned by Paul 1 Tim. 4.14 did understand the Community of the rest of the Presbyters or Elders who then had a hand not onely in the delivery of the Doctrine and Sacraments but also in the administration of the Discipline of Christ And for further proof Tertullian is alleadged in his Generall Apologie for Christians Where he saith that in the Church are used exhortations chastisements and divine censure For Judgement is given with great advice as among those who are certain they are in the sight of God And it is the chiefest foreshewing of the Judgement to come if any man have so offended that he be banished from the Communion of Prayer and of the Assembly and of all holy Fellowship The Presidents that bear rule therein are certain approved Elders who have obtained this honour not by reward but by good report There also is further shewed That in matters of Ecclesiastical judicature Cornelius Bishop of Rome used the received form of gathering together the Presbytery And that Cyprian sufficiently declares of what Persons that consisted When he wisheth him to read his Letter to the flourishing Clergy which there did preside or rule with him And further That in the 4th Council of Carthage it was concluded That the Bishop might hear no mans cause without the presence of the Clergy And that otherwise the Bishops sentence should be void unless it were confirmed by the Clergy And yet further That this is found inserted into the Canons of Egbert who was Archbishop of York in the Saxon times and afterwards into the body of the Canon law it self It is here also acknowledged That in our Church this kind of Presbyterian Government hath been much disused Yet that it did profess that every Pastor hath a right to rule the Church from whence also the name of Rector was at first given unto him and administer the Discipline of Christ as well as to dispence the Doctrine and Sacraments c. By all which it is acknowledged and also proved That the form of Government by the united suffrages of the Clergy is ancient and which is there in express termes asserted as it might be demonstrated by many more Testimonies but that we conceive these already mentioned are sufficient and being alleadged by the aforementioned Author As also evidencing what his own Judgement was in this point may be more likely to sway with you if in that there should be a dissent betwixt you and us then any thing that we could our selves produce But in this reduction of Episcopacy to the form of Synodical Government received in the ancient Church there are proposals of Assemblies of Pastors within certain limited bounds Which saving that they are some of them somewhat larger then ours which is but a circumstantial difference do hold proportion with the Classical Provincial and National Assemblies mentioned in the form of our Church Government As also the times propounded there for their meeting the power of these Assemblies and what they were to have Cognizance of and the subordination of the lesser to the greater with liberty of Appeal if need should require and are the same in substance as with us And all these were propounded as the way of Government in the ancient Church and in the year 1641. after the troubles that had risen in Scotland about Episcopacy and the Ceremonies and before the setting up of the Presbyterian Government in this Land had so much as fallen under debate in the Parliament so far as ever we heard of as an expedient to prevent the troubles that did after arise in this Land about the matter of Church Government being for the moderating of Episcopacy That at that time was
other Ordinances so far as was intended for continuance are moulded up into a complete body with a supply of sundry things that had been never mentioned nor published before in other Ordinances is without any limitation of time for its continuance and remains unrepealed to this day for any thing we have seen or heard to the contrary Nay we think as we shall touch upon anon That by the humble Advice assented to by his Highness this Ordinance as well as others receives strength But by this full account given we think we have made it sufficiently to appear that we have had the Authority of the civill Magistrate to bear us out in what we have acted since the first setting up of the Presbyterian Government untill this present Except there be any that can come forth and charge us to have transgressed the rules appointed by the Parliament for us to observe in our actings against which our own innocency only shall be our defence It now remaines for your further satisfaction and our own vindication that we recite some things particularly out of the form of Church Government which we conceive are thereunto subservient In the very first Words of the Ordinance according to what we have before recited in the directions for the electing and choosing of ruling Elders and is there also to be found you may find it thus Be it ordered and ordained by the Lords and Commons in Parliament Assembled and by Authority of the same That all Parishes and Places whatsoever within the Kingdom of England and Dominion of Wales as well Priviledged Places and exempted jurisdictions as others be brought under the Government of Congregationall Classicall Provinciall and Nationall Assemblies c. Where it is to us unquestionable That by vertue of this appointment such as live within the bounds of our severall congregations and Parishes are under the power of some one or other of the Congregational Elderships constituted by Authority of Parliament within our severall Parishes And that all those that live within the bounds of our Classis mentioned before are under the power of our Classicall Assembly constituted in like manner by the said Authority What power is given particularly to the congregationall Elderships you may finde in the aforesaid form of Church Government and unto which we refer you onely we shall minde you That by vertue thereof they have power as they shall see just occasion to enquire into the knowledge and spirituall estate of any member of the Congregation to admonish and rebuke to suspend from the Lords Table those who are found by them to be ignorant and scandalous and to excommunicate according to the rules and directions after following And it is thereby ordained That the Examination and Judgement of such Persons as shall for their ignorance in the points of Religion mentioned in that Ordinance not be admitted to the Sacrament of the Lords Supper is to be in the power of the Eldership of every Congregation All which will appear by the express Letter of the said Ordinance to any that will consult it and which not only justifies all that is practised in that case by the severall Elderships but also shews what grounds this Classis had for that which was mentioned in our Paper touching both what is therein appointed to the Minister about Catechizing Families and also concerning the Ministers exhorting such as in the severall Families he should finde to be of competent knowledge and know to be of blameless life That they should present themselves to the Eldership The Triall and Judgement in this case not belonging to any one Minister alone but to the Eldership There are also rules and directions given in this Ordinance to be observed by the severall Elderships concerning suspension from the Sacrament of the Lords Supper in cases of scandall which may be seen there particularly But there is no rule given that will allow either the Eldership or Classis according to the several powers to them therein granted either to warn before all or to excommunicate knowing and blameless men for their meer not presenting themselves before the Eldership The rules of this Government prescribe otherwise as we our selves must also needs profess that we are not conscious to our selves that we have given any just occasion by our management thereof That contrary to the express rules appointed therein to be observed by us and to the plain sense of our expressions used in our Paper of which afterward any such a thing should have been so much as supposed to have been intended from any thing there expressed Give us leave to proceed a little further to lay open the order that is prescribed in the above mentioned form of Church Government touching the order of proceeding to excommunication which as it will awarrant the publishing of mens names openly in the Congregation and warning them before all to reform being such as are justly censurable by the rules thereof and particularly where it prescribes that several publique admonitions shall be given to the offenders c. So it will awarrant us in any thing that is made censurable by that Paper of ours that was published To make this to appear as also to shew what reason we had to make known to the several congregations within our bounds what our Paper held forth We shall here declare what offences are censurable with this greatest and last censure of Excommunication according to the order that is there prescribed and which as it requires that it be inflicted with great and mature deliberation and after all other good means have been essayed so it appoints in these express Words That such Errours in practice as subvert the Faith or any other Errours which overthrow the power of Godliness if the party who holds them spread them seeking to draw others after him and such sins in practice as cause the Name and Truth of God to be blasphemed cannot stand with the power of godliness and such practises as in their own nature manifestly subvert that order unity and Peace which Christ hath established in his Church and particularly all those scandalous sins for which any Person is to be suspended from the Sacrament of the Lords Supper obstinately persisted in these being publiquely known to the just scandall of the Church The sentence of Excommunication may and ought to proceed according to the directions after following But the Persons that hold other Errours in Judgement about which learned and Godly men possibly may and do differ and which subvert not the faith nor are destructive to godliness or that be guilty of such sins of infirmities as are commonly found in the Children of God or being otherwise found in the faith and holy in life and so not falling under censure by the former rules endeavour to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of Peace and do yet out of conscience not come up to the observation of all those rules which are or shall be established by
Authority for regulating the outward worship of God and Government of his Church The sentence of excommunication for these causes shall not be denounced against them These things this Classis taking into Consideration together with the power they were betrusted with by God and Man for the dispencing the censures of the Church in the cases censurable by the rules here laid down and elsewhere in the form of Church Government And there having been in the Provinciall Assembly severall debates touching such Persons as in the several Congregations were ignorant and scandalous who offered not themselves to the Sacrament not to the Eldership in order to their admission to it and they commending it to the several Classical Presbyteries to be considered of whether some further course was not to be held for the information of the one and the reformation of the other then yet had been taken notwithstanding their neglect and what they judged fittest to be done for the attaining those ends and to represent their thoughts therein to the next Assembly This Classis upon the whole concluded to represent their apprehensions in the Case as is expressed in the Paper that was published which was approved of before by the Provincial Assembly and which they judge is sufficiently awarranted in regard of any thing therein contained by the rules expressed in the above mentioned form of Church Government We having thus far shewed what we have been and are awarranted to practice by the several Ordinances above mentioned we shall now proceed further to declare That however we are no Lawyers and therefore leave the determination of the Case to the learned in the Law to judge of to whom it belongs yet if it may be lawfull for us to judge of a matter of this nature from the principles of reason It seems to us that the above mentioned Ordinances about Church Government as well as other Ordinances of Parliament are confirmed in the humble Advice assented unto by his Highness in the 16. section thereof Where we finde these Words And that nothing contained in this Petition and Advice nor your Highness consent thereunto shall be construed to extend to the repealing or making void of any Act or Ordinance which is not contrary hereunto or to the matters herein contained But that the said Acts and Ordinances not contrary hereunto shall continue and remain in force in such manner as if this present Petition and Advice had not at all been had or made or your Highness consent thereunto given Whence we gather that if in the several Ordinances for Church Government there be nothing contrary to the humble Advice or to the matters therein contained they are not thereby any more then any other Acts or Ordinances of Parliament repealed but left to remain in force At least there seems to us to be a plain intimation that they have a force in them which is not by this humble Advice repealed and made void For it doth not appear to us That there is any thing in the Form of Church Government or any other Ordinances of Parliament about that matter that is contrary to the humble Advice or matters therein contained And whereas in the 11th section there is mention made of some that differ in worship and discipline from the publique profession of these Nations held forth to whom some indulgence is granted It seems to us there is an acknowledgement and owning of what the late Parliament held forth in regard of these the Directory for worship and form of Church Government which they passed as the publique profession of these Nations in regard of worship and discipline And in which apprehensions we are the more confirmed because here in this section mention is made of a confession of faith to be agreed on by his Highness and the Parliament there having nothing in that kind passed the late Parliament that established the Directory for worship and form of Church Government However there had been a Confession of faith drawn up by the late Assembly of Divines Whence it seems to us clear that they own the Directory for worship and the form of Church Government to be that which they hold forth as the publique profession of the Nation for worship and Government To the same purpose we find in the Government of the Commonwealth of England Scotland and Ireland c. As it was publiquely declared at Westminster Decemb. 16. 1653. pag. 43. Sect. 37. Where also they express a worship and Discipline publiquely held forth which must needs referre to the Directory and form of Church Government by us recited There being no other worship or discipline that then had or now hath the civill Sanction in this Nation We have been large in what we have here represented in the generall before we come to speak more particularly to the rest that now follows in your Paper But our pains being greater to make this full representation unto you then it will be for you to read it we must intreat you to excuse us considering it tends as well to rectifie your mistakes as to vindicate our selves being also desirous not to be mistaken any more as also because it layes a foundation for our briefer and more particular Answer unto what follows and to which these things being thus premised we now come In the things wherein you profess your selves to dissent till further explicated and unfolded by us 1 The first thing we meet with here is That by the many Persons of all sorts that are members of Congregations and mentioned in our Paper in your sense thereof we seem to hint that thereby we mean onely such who have admitted themselves members of some Congregation within our association and yet live inordinately c. And that therefore you who never were any members or associates of ours are not within the verge and compass of our Presbyterian discipline c. Unto which we say That we have constantly professed against those of the separation That the several Assemblies of Congregations within this Land that make a profession of the true Christian and Apostolique Faith are true Churches of Jesus Christ That the several members of these Congregations are by their birth members as those that were born in the Jewish Church are said to be by the Apostle Jews by nature Gal. 2. That this their membership was sealed to them in their Baptism that did solemnly admit them as into the universal Church so into the particular wherein they were born We have also constantly maintained against the afore mentioned Persons That the Ministers of these Churches are true Ministers notwithstanding that exception of theirs against them that they were ordained by Bishops who also themselves were true Ministers in our Judgement though we cannot acknowledge that by divine right they were superiour to their fellow brethren either in regard of order or jurisdiction And that therefore the Word and Sacraments the most essential marks of a true visible Church according to the professed
Judgement of our Divines against the Papists on the one hand and those of the separation on the other dispensed by these Ministers were and are the true Ordinances of Jesus Christ And that hereupon our work was not when the Presbyterian Government was appointed to constitute Churches but to reform them onely And that therefore none within our bounds except they shall renounce Christianity and their Baptism can be deemed by us to be without in the Apostles sense and so therefore not within the compass and verge of our Presbyterian Government Neither is it their not associating with us in regard of Government that doth exempt them from censure by it if they should be such offenders as by the rules thereof were justly censurable It not being a matter arbitrary for private Persons at their own will and pleasure to exempt themselves from under that Ecclesiastical Government that is setled by Authority And as you know it would not have been allowed of under the former Government 2 And therefore whether you and all others within our bounds be not comprehended within our Government according to the rules laid down in the Ordinance of Parliament above mentioned appointing the form of Church Government to be used in the Church of England and Ireland and therein ordaining as hath been recited before in the first page thereof and to which we refer you Especially considering that all within the bounds of our several Parishes that are no other now them formerly even Papists and Anabaptists and other Sectaries were under the late Prelatical Government we leave it to you to judge Onely if so we wish you to consider that then you are brought under the Government of Presbytery not so much by us as by the Parliament appointing this Government And then we think you who warn us not to contemn civil power might well out of respect to the Authority ordaining it but especially considering the word Presbytery is a known Scripture expression 1 Tim. 4. and interpreted by sundry of the Fathers as we do as hath been declared before have used a more civil expression then to have called it a common fold into which it should seem your complaint is that you should be driven Although Presbytery layes restraint on none but such as being scandalous in their lives and so contemning the Laws of God are therefore truely and indeed the lawless Persons that we speak of But whereas as you suppose This is our chief design in this as in other transactions of ours to subject all to our Government We do refer our selves to our course of life past and hope it will witness with us to all that will judge impartially what our designs have been in our other transactions And as touching our design in the Paper published whether it hath been ought but the information of the ignorant and reformation of the scandalous to the Glory of God and their salvation we leave it to be judged by those that will judge of mens intentions by what is expressed in their words and actions We know very well we are charged by some that we affect Dominion to Lord it over the People and to have all sorts of Persons of what rank soever to stoop to us But we do openly profess that the Government of the Church that is committed unto men is not Despotical but Ministerial That it is no Dominion but a Ministery onely And that the Officers that are intrusted with it are themselves to be subject both in regard of their bodies and estates to the Civil power That by the Ordinance of God they are appointed to be under and that in their Government they have nothing to do with the bodies and estates of any Persons but with their Souls onely Although here we desire to enquire of you whether if you be indeed for the settling of any Government at all in the Church as you profess to be you do not think that all should be subject to it We cannot judge you to be so irrational as to be for a Government and that yet subjection to it must be denyed And if the late Government of the Prelacy was not blamed by you because it required subjection to it we wish you to consider whether upon this account you have reason to censure us But further whereas you tell us That we garnish our Government with the specious title of Christs Government Throne and Scepter We wish you to consider what in your Answer to an objection that you frame out of our Paper your selves do say You there tell us You pray for the establishment of such Church Government as is consonant to the will of God and universall practice of primitive Churches That Ecclesiastical Discipline may be exercised in the hands of them to whom it was committed by Christ and left by him to be transferred from hand to hand to the end of the World The expressions you here use are as high touching that Government you would have established as any have been that ever we have used of ours For your prayer is That Ecclesiastical Discipline may be exercised in the hands of them to whom it was committed by Christ and left by him to be transferred from hand to hand to the end of the world The Government then that you are for must be with you Christs Government Throne and Scepter And why do you then condemn us if we have used such expressions concerning our Government till you have convinced us that it is not such When yet you take to your selves the Liberty to use the like language concerning the Government you pray may be established But whereas you say Presbytery is the main thing driven at here and that however she comes ushered in with Godly pretence of sorrow for the sins and the ignorance of the times and the duty incumbent upon us to exercise the power that Christ hath committed to us for edification and not for destruction and that these are but so many waste Papers wherein Presbytery is wrapped up to make it look more handsomely and pass more currantly We do earnestly desire That in the examination of your consciences you would seriously consider whether you have not both transgressed the rules of Charity in passing such hard censures upon us and also usurped that which belongs not to you in making your selves judges of what fals not under your cognizance The things you mention belonging only to be tried by your and our Master to whom we must all stand or fall But we are heartily sorry that Presbytery which stands in no need of any painting or cover to make it look more handsomely and passe more currantly should be accounted by you the anguis in herba whereof you had need to beware it having never given that offence to any as to merit such language But now you frame an objection out of our Paper and return your Answer professing That you pray for the establishment of such Church Government throughout his Highness Dominions
as is consonant to the will of God and universall practice of primitive Churches c. In that you do here joyn the will of God and the universal practise of primitive Churches together as you joyned the Word of God and the constant practise of the Catholique Church before you seem to us to make up the rule whereby we must judge what Government it is that you pray might be established of these two viz. the will of God and the universal practise of primitive Churches Or that it is the universal practise of primitive Churches That must be our sure guide and comment upon the Word of God to tell us what is his will revealed these touching Church Government and discipline If this be your sense as we apprehend it is we must needs profess that herein we greatly differ from you as not conceiving it to be sound and orthodoxe It being the Word of God alone and the approved practise of the Church recorded there whether it was the universall and constant practise of the Church or no that is to be the onely rule to judge by in this or any other controversies in matters of Religion But yet admitting for the present the rule you seem to make we should desire to know from you what that Church Government is which is so consonant to the will of God and universall practise of primitive Churches For our own parts we think it will be very hard for you or any others to demonstrate out of any Records of Antiquity what was the universall practise of primitive Churches for the whole space of the first 300. years after Christ or the greatest part thereof excepting so much as is left upon record in the Scriptures of the new Testament the Monuments of Antiquity that concerne those times for the greatest part of them being both imperfect and far from shewing us what was the universall practise of the Church then though the practises of some Churches may be mentioned and likewise very questionable At least it will not be easie to assure us that some of those that go under the names of the most approved Authors of those times are neither spurious nor corrupted And hereupon it will unavoidably follow that we shall be left very doubtfull what Government it is that is most consonant to the universall and constant practise of primitive Churches for that time But as touching the rule it self which you seem here to lay down we cannot close with it We do much honour and reverence the primitive Churches But yet we believe we owe more reverence to the Scriptures then to judge them either imperfect or not to have light enough in themselves for the resolving all doubts touching matters of faith or practise except it be first resolved what was either the concurrent interpretation of the Fathers or the universall and constant practise of the Churches of those times Besides that admitting this for a rule that the universall and constant practise of the primitive Churches must be that which must assure us what is the will of God revealed in Scripture concerning the Government which he hath appointed in the Church our faith is hereupon resolved into a most uncertain ground and so made fallible and turned into opinion For what monuments of Antiquity besides the Scripture can assure us touching the matters of fact therein contained that they were such indeed as they are there reported to be the Authors of them themselves being men that were not infallibly guided by the Spirit But yet supposing we could be infallibly assured which yet never can be what was the universall and constant practise of the primitive Churches how shall that be a rule to assure us what is most consonant to the will of God When as we see not especially in such matters as are not absolutely necessary to salvation Even as a Generall Councill it self is subject to errrour but that the universall practise of the Churches might in some things be dissonant to the will of God revealed in Scriptures And so the universall practise of primitive Churches can be no certain rule to judge by what Church Government is most consonant to the will of God revealed in his Word We know there are corruptions in the best of men There was such hot contention betwixt Paul and Barnabas Gal. 2. as caused them to part asunder Peter so failed in his practise as that though before some came from James he did eat with the Gentils yet when they were come he withdrew himself fearing them of the Circumcision And hereupon not only other Jews dissembled with him but Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation Whence it 's clear that the examples of the best men even in those things wherein they went contrary to the rule of Gods Word are of a spreading nature and the better the Persons that give the bad example are the greater the danger of the more universall leavening Nay we finde that not only some few Apostolicall men had their failings but even Apostolicall primitive Churches did in the very face of the Apostles they being yet alive make great defection both in regard of opinions and practises As from the examples of the Churches of Corinth Galatia and the Churches of Asia is manifest The Apostle also tels us that even in his time the mystery of iniquity began to work And in after times we know how the Doctrine was corrupted what gross superstition crept into the Church what domination was striven for amongst the Pastors and Bishops of the Churches Till at length Antichrist was got up into his seat unto which height yet he came not all at once but by steps and degrees Besides it is of fresh remembrance that notwithstanding the reformation happily brought about in our own Church in regard of Doctrine and worship after those dismall Marian times yet the corruption in regard of Government continued such during the time of the late Prelacy which yet was taken away in other reformed Churches that the Pastors were deprived of that power of rule that our Church acknowledgeth did belong to them of right and which did anciently belong to them however the exercise thereof did after grow into a long disuse as hath been shewed before And therefore when we consider on the one hand that the superiority which the Bishop obtained at the first above the Presbyter in the ancient Church and which was rather obtained consuetudine Ecclesiae then by Divine right did at the length grow to that height that the Pastors were spoiled of all power of rule so we cannot much wonder on the other hand that the ruling Elder was quite turned out of doors For the proof of the being and exercise of whose office in the purer times there are notwithstanding produced testimonies of the ancients by Divines both at home and abroad that have written about that subject and to which we do therein refer you As there do remain some footsteps and shadow of
wee do not apprehend why this should hinder us from warning the Members of our several Congregations to make complaint to the Eldership of those that walk disorderly and will not be reclaimed to the end they may be further dealt with as the nature of their offence may deserve Wee being fully assured from the word of truth That Excommunication is Gods ordinance appointed for the reformation of the scandalous and as you your selves acknowledged in the beginning of your Paper and being a spiritual punishment for the nature and kinde of it through the blessing of God may be more available for the destruction of the flesh and the thorough humiliation of the offender then any corporal or pecuniary mulct that reaches but the outward man can be And as it was blessed with great successe for this end for many years together whilest the Church was destitute of Christian Magistrates Although in a Christian State wee see not why wee should divide what God hath joyned together Wee having not yet learned either from the Scriptures or sound reason that the conjunction of the Civil and Ecclesiastical Sword is not more likely through the same blessing of God to work a greater reformation in mens lives then either of them alone remembring that old Maxime Vis unita fortior And as touching our selves and the power wee are intrusted to exercise wee shall commit our endeavors unto his blessing in the use of his own appointed means who is able and wee doubt not but hee will make the same effectual for the ends for which hee hath appointed them But you say There are other parts of our Paper that do likewise remain dark which you desire to be made plain Although wee conceive not so of them yet wee shall as willingly go along with you to give you further answer as you to desire the same of us And therefore whereas wee having said in our Paper That there are many persons of all sorts that will not submit themselves to the present Government of the Church Your first Quaere thereupon is Why Government in singulari Wee answer because it is the onely Government that at present is established in this Church by Civil Authority The Prelatical being put down and cautioned against in the humble Advice in regard of any liberty to be extended to it for the exercise thereof And there being no other Government but the Presbyterian which is our Government that is owned as the Church-Government for the whole Nation by the Civil Authority And as it is that which wee judg to be most agreeable to the will of God so also wee conceive that whatever is of Christs prescribing in any other different Government whether Episcopal or Congregational is to be found here As wee do apprehend the redundancies of them both to be taken away in this and the defects of them both to be here supplyed And however there may be differences amongst godly men concerning Church-Government which it is that Christ in particulari hath prescribed in his Word yet wee judg that the Government which Christ hath prescribed in his Word is but one As all those must say so too that not being Erastians do hold That one Church-Government or other is of divine Right But whereas you bring in Calvin saying Scimus enim unicuique Ecclesiae c. To this wee say The circumstantials of Government that are but matters of order onely and which must be suited to the time or place or persons for whom they are made and concerning which if you had quoted the place where Calvin useth these words wee believe it would appear hee speaks these being variable and so but the accidentals of Government may not be one and the same in all Churches But if Christ have prescribed a Government in his word for the substantials of it it must needs be de jure one the same in every Church And that the Presbyterian Government is that in particular which is there prescribed in Calvins judgment is so manifest by his works to the whole Christian world that it needs no proof But if the Government which Christ hath prescribed for the substantials of it be onely one then that alone is good and all other Governments differing substantially from it must needs be bad and this onely jure divino and Christs own Government and the rest not And therefore whereas in the next place you suppose Wee may assert that our Government is the Government by way of Eminency as Christs own Government more immediately and jure divino To this and to what you further hereupon do inquire wee say wee have declared already That wee call'd it the present Government because it is the onely Government setled in the Church by the Civil Power But whether it be the Government by way of Eminency and jure divino that was not the thing referred unto in the phrase wee used And as to the resolving of your doubts and scruples wee conceive it is here for us not material to go about the proving of the Jus divinum of it wee having proved That it is the Government that is established by the Civil Magistrate and which doth lay as good a foundation to evidence the lawfulnesse of your submission to it as for the lawfulnesse of your submission to the former Government and touching which wee suppose you were satisfied your exceptions lying as much against the High-Commissioners Chancellors and Commissaries then as they can do now against the office of Ruling Elders and which is the chief thing wee apprehend is stumbled at in our Government But yet if you desire to have satisfaction given you touching that which wee are not ashamed to professe viz. the Jus divinum of the Presbyterian Government wee referr you to what is so fully spoken touching this point by sundry learned Divines both of our own Church and the Reformed Churches abroad that wee know not what can be added more a The Assemblies Propositions about Church-Government The Jus Divinum by London Ministers The Provincial Synod of London their vindication of the Presbyterian Government Rutherfords due right of Presbyteries Aarons Rod by Gillaspie And yet wee do not say That there is no present Government in any Church or Assembly of Saints but where our Discipline and Government is erected intirely in all the parts of it no more then wee should deny him to be a man in whom there were a defect of some integral parts or in whom there were some superfluous members But as when Antichristianism so overspread the face of the Church in those dark times before the Reformation God preserved a Church Ministery and Ordinances though not without the mixture of many corruptions in doctrine and worship even amongst the Papists themselves So there was some of Christs Government and Discipline in the worst times though not intirely nor without the mixture of much corruption in that Discipline and Government And yet if you consult Antiquity you will
parts of the universal visible Church militant here on earth however they have also their publique Assemblies distinct from ours though sundry of them as there is occasion resort to ours also But how we should hereupon make either these or the lawless Persons that we speak of members of the invisible Triumphant Church all which we have reckoned to belong to the visible they must have eyes quicker then Eagles that can discern how this follows and therefore there is no fear our Charity should so far over-reach as you supposed it might But still you are unsatisfied For you know not it seems what we mean by the word Publique the publique Assemblies of the Saints By our professions and practises in our owning the publique Assemblies and where the publique Ordinances of the Word Sacraments and Prayer are dispenced which we our selves do constantly frequent and stir up others to frequent also it was plain enough what we meant by publique Assemblies And we are heartily sorry that you understanding our meaning as is clear by what you say anon should by this but make your way to give a lash at our Private meetings which are none of them such as we need to be ashamed of And which when we meet either for conference about matters of Religion or to pray together and humble our selves for our own sins and the sins of these times When there is not the opportunity of a publique Assemby or when personal or Family occasions call for a private is surely as commendable at the least as a private meeting upon domestical civil or political occasions and therefore not to be secretly girded at And on the other hand we do not meddle with the censuring of those who being godly and sound in the faith in the main points of Religion do yet differ from us in judgement in matters of Discipline and Government And have their Assemblies for Gods publique worship distinct from ours as we are barred from it by the rules of our Government as we have often said before And therefore we leave room enough for Consciences that are truely tender Though we cannot say so much for the Prelatical Government Neither do we transgress any Laws of the Land which have made no provision to except any Persons that we meddle with and are made censurable by the rules laid down in the form of Church Government nor have we under Colour of Authority made any Laws and Edicts but according to that power that the civil Authority hath committed to us have onely openly given notice in our several Congregations of what offences are censurable by the rules of our Government that the offenders might take heed they incurre not that censure of Excommunication which Authority hath awarranted us to inflict upon the obstinate and otherwise incorrigible And therefore except to execute what we are appointed to do by the civil power be to contemn it we cannot be thought to have done any thing in contempt of the civil power as it is not our ignorance of the Laws in force that we are confident being grounded in reason fight not one against another and which is your more charitable and favourable construction that hath led us into any practises that are transgressions of them And therefore though you much question upon what account soever it be that we have been led into what we have acted and think it concernes us to look to it whether we have not run our selves into a premunire Yet we are assured we are as sufficiently secured against that danger as all the Justices in the Land are that have acted upon other Ordinances of Parliament which they have judged to be in force as we do also those to be that have been the ground of our proceedings But you have yet further to except for whereas we said That like notice should be taken of all scandalous Persons Your next Quaere is Whether those that forsake the publique Assemblies of the Saints in the second order may not be taken for scandalous Persons comprehended in the third order Here we perceive you understood who were meant by those that did forsake the publique Assemblies of the Saints viz. Those who forsaking the Assemblies where the publique Ordinances were dispensed were upon that account really and indeed scandalous and so being comprehended under the latitude of that expression might justly merit to be censured as scandalous Persons And thus conceiving you were not mistaken yet we who were to express our selves popularly and so as we might be understood considering some of that stamp though they forsook the publique Assemblies of the Saints and constantly turned their backs as on the Lords Supper so on all other Ordinances yet if not drunkards and swearers whoremasters c. did not take themselves to be scandalous Persons Do not think that in this we are any more to be blamed by you we using variety of expressions onely for this end that we might be better understood then we blame Lawyers and Attorneys and wherein we judge them not to be blame worthy for using variety of expressions and Multiplicity of Synonnymous Words to make the matter more clearand out of doubt where yet one and the same thing is understood by all But now hereupon your complaint is That we burden you with Traditions in multiplying of orders fine necessitate ad Arthritim usque and cry out Quare oneramini ritibus And tell us of lengthning out our Paper which yet is not by these few words hereused made very much longer But if you had remembred the multitude of Canons and burthensom Ceremonies that were rigorously pressed even to the highest censure in Case of refusall and under the burthen whereof sundry truely conscientious Persons under the late Prelacy did sigh and groan When those that were scandalous enough in their lives escaped censure and which some have cause not so soon to forget we think you would have seen little
shall be privately admonished according to the order prescribed by Christ Mat. 18. once or twice to see if they will reform and that the Minister when hee catechizeth the several families shall exhort such persons in them as hee findes to be of a competent knowledg and are blamelesse in life that they present themselves to the Eldership that they may be admitted to the Lords Supper 5. That if they will neither hearken to private admonition nor admonition of the Eldership their names shall be published openly in the several Congregations and they warned before all to reform 6. That if after all this they shall continue obstinate they shall be cast out and excommunicated These things this Classe thought fit to give publick notice of being very sensible that for the want of the vigorous exercise of Church discipline ignorance Atheism and licentiousnesse grows upon us to the great dishonor of God scandal of Religion the hazzard and undoing of many pretious souls and the laying a blot on several Congregations and therefore they are resolved seeing themselves necessitated to this severity of discipline for the freeing themselves from the great guilt of neglect of their own duty that otherwise they shall be under to make use of that power that Christ hath committed to them for edification and not for destruction although it would be their farr greater joy that there might not be occasion of using sharpnesse and therefore they do earnestly in the bowels of Jesus Christ beseech all those that are ignorant that they would apply themselves diligently to the use of all publick and private means for their information submitting themselves with all readinesse to be instructed and to consider that without knowledg the minde cannot be good and they do also in the name of Jesus Christ exhort and warn all such as live scandalously and in the practice of open sins that they break off their iniquities by repentance and turn unto God speedily with their whole heart that they neither incurr the censure of being cast out of the Church here nor by continuing in their sinfull course be kept for ever entering into the kingdome of Heaven hereafter And touching such as turn their backs of the Lords Supper constantly this Classe doth wish them seriously to consider what an account they will be able to give unto Jesus Christ for their living in the dayly neglect of an ordinance that is so exceeding necessary for their own comfort and growth in grace and that they would lay aside all prejudice whatever it is that hinders and submit themselves unto wholesom doctrine for their own good as this Classe hath been ready on their part to expresse all tendernesse toward the weak and a willingnesse to condescend to the meanest for the removing all occasions of stumbling so farr as lies in their power And yet considering the fearfull danger that all such do lay themselves open unto that shall eat and drink the Body and Blood of the Lord unworthily they do warn whosoever comes to the Lords Table to take special care so often as they come to examine themselves lest they eat and drink their own damnation But because the exercise of Church discipline must begin at private persons and that if they neglect their duty of watching over and admonishing one another and bringing complaints to the Eldership as there is occasion little or nothing can be done for the thorow reformation of the several Congregations this Classe doth therefore warn all and every of the members belonging unto them to consider the great guilt they will lye under if they through their neglect obstruct so needfull and necessary a work and doth expect therefore in all faithfulnesse laying aside all partiality slavishnesse and self-respects they should addresse themselves to the discharge of their duties that if any walk disorderly and will not be reclaimed by private admonition they making complaint thereof to the Eldership course may be taken for excommunicating of the obstinate and thereby purging out the old leven to the glory of God the delivering their own souls from that guilt they will otherwise lye under the preserving the Ordinances from prophanation and the rest of the lump from being levened the stopping of the mouthes of such as seek occasion against us and finally the everlasting welfare and salvation of the souls of those that go astray By the Provincial Assembly at Preston Octob. 6. 1657. RICHARD HEYRICKE Moderator pro tempore This Presentation is approved by the Provincial Assembly THOMAS JOHNSON Moderator EDWARD GEE Scribe To the Eldership of the severall congregations belonging to the Association of the First Classe at Manchester within the Province of Lancaster These Give us leave to salute you in your own Terms VVE have seen and seriously weighed that paper draught Intituled A presentation of the first Classe at Manchester dated the 8. of Sept. 1657. confirmed by the Provincial Assembly at Preston Octob. 6. and published at Manchester Church the 22. of Nov. in the aforesaid year and do publish this our sense and Apprehension of it as far as is plain to us not resting in the Judgement and determination of any General Council contrary thereunto if any such should be much less to one of your Provincial Assemblies Though you seem to submit to your Provincial what you will hardly grant to a General Council In which we dissent from you Though in other things we shall joyn as first 1. We joyn with you in a deep sense of the severall gross sins and errours of the times desiring earnestly to mourn first for our own next for the sins of others of our Christian Brethren and fellow members of that Church whereof Christ is the Head We are grieved together with you for the Scandalous and offensive lives of such as live in drunkeness uncleaness swearing prophanation of the Sabbath c. 2. We are also sensible with you that there are sundry persons grossely ignorant in the main points of Christian Religion 3. You with us again we hope are sensible and grieved though you do not at all mention them for the gross errours in judgement and the damnable Doctrine of many who have rent themselves into as many severall heresies as they have into Sects and Schismes Thus far we agree nay more touching the way of informing the ignorant and reforming the wicked and erroneous we shall not much dissent 1. And first for the information and instruction of the ignorant by way of Catechizing before they be admitted to the Sacrament The course by you published provided it be in publique little differeth from the order prescribed by the Church of England and other reformed Churches abroad before any be admitted to the Sacrament of the Lords supper 2. For those who erre so grossely whether in Doctrinals or points of discipline thereby renting from a true constituted Church Though you speak nothing either of their sin or punishment yet we hope you with us do hold That the