am cast out with the Fathers saith he he meanes Catholique Fathers you may be sure And Qui profitentur fidem Catholicam saies S. Austen homil 10. in Apocal. speaking of Antichrist and his leud company Of whom also he addes that Imago eius the Image of the beast simulatio eorum est is their counterfetting and hypocrisie qui fingunt se esse quod non sunt c. Loe the marke of the Church as the Adioynder counts it is the Image of the beast as S. Austen construes it when it is falsly pretended namely the name Catholique Shall we not rest then in the Bishops most graue ponderation Vtriè re magis nomen habeant which of vs two best deserue the title And turne the Adioynders witty descant wherein he doubles vpon the Bishop with Ex ore tuo te iudico because we call them Catholiques to Non ex ore tuote because his neighbours word is to be heard before-his owne iustifying himselfe But of these things hitherto The shippe Euplaea retaines her name though encountred with all crosse lucke at Sea to the laughter of the beholders standing vpon the shore And notwithstanding the name yet she is the game of the tempests Right so is the case when Petri celox as Bembus calls it iets in her titles of magnificence vp and downe after her other scandalls so palpably layd open Not the badge 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 though prognosticating a calme but S. Pauls piety preserued the shippe sayling to Rome Acts 28. as it had the marriners before Acts. 27. in despite of the sea In like sort here Badges and ensignes titles and tearmes protect not Churches but inward worth and diuine grace § 46. IT followes in the Adioynder Num. 35. And the like I may also say concerning his graūt in another matter to wit that our Bishops are true Bishops and that the Protestant Bishops of England had their Ordination from ours yea from 3. of ours for so he giueth to vnderstand whereupon he also inferreth that he and his fellow Superintendents haue a true ordination and succession from the Catholique Church whereas the quite contrary followeth vpon his graunt For if our Bishops be true Bishops as hauing a true succession from the Apostles and that the Protestant Bishops haue no other lawfull ordination but from ours two consequents doe directly follow thereon the ore that we haue the true Church and doctrine if the Bishop his fellow and friend M. Barlow say true who in his famous Sermon mentioned by me elsewhere affirmeth the successiue propagation of Bishops from the Apostles to be the maine root of Christian society according to S. Augustine and the maine proofe of Christian doctrine according to Tertullian as I haue shewed amply in my Supplement and prooued thereby that M. Barlow and his fellowes are heretikes and schismatikes The other consequent is that if the English Protestant Bishops had no other lawfull ordination then from the Catholiques they had none at all for that at the change of Religion in Queene Elizabeths time they were not ordained by any one Catholique Bishop and much lesse by three as the Bishop saith they were but by themselues and by the authority of the Parliament as I haue also declared at large in my Supplement Then Num. 37. Wherupon I inferre two things one that they haue no Clergie nor Church for hauing no Bishops they haue no Priests because none can make Priests but Bishops and hauing neither Bishops nor Priests they haue no Clergie and consequently no Church as I haue shewed in my Supplement out of S. Hierome The other is that the Bishop and his fellowes are neither true Bishops nor haue any succession from the Catholique Church as he saith they haue nor yet any lawfull mission or vocation that therefore they are not those good shepheards which as our Sauiour saith enter into the fold by the doore c. § 47. I answer in one word to his redoubled collections multiplied obseruations beginning with the first of his two inferences concluding with his ground from which he sets out as false as they and more too No Bishops no Priests saies he because only Bishops can make Priests without both them without all Clergy consequently without a Church as I haue shewed in my Supplement out of S. Hierome For still we must heare of the Supplement in any case or els it is no bargain But as for Hierome we may oppose Tertulliā to him that Quod quis accepit dare potest whatsoeuer a man hath receiued he may giue again if occasion be offred in Ecclesiasticall passages And so our Sauiour sets the Date against the accepistis instructing his Apostles about the vse of their gifts which they had receiued of him 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 saith S. Peter And 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Let euerie body communicate a gift as hee hath receiued and As good stewards of the manifold grace of God Though ordinarily it is reason that the treasure should be onely in the Bishop keeping as the faithfullest depositarie to auoid euill dealing 1. Tim. 5. 22. Nemini citò manus imposueris And we know iurisdiction is so restrained in Bishops by the Adioynders owne confession in diuerse places of this booke yea in Priests too who are limited to their quarter for their ordinarie seruice though their power conferred vpon them originally in their ordination extend to euerie member of the Church But I speake what may be done in casu as I said and vpon an exigent only Which if euer it was presented then for certaine when all was so out of frame in the Romane Church Though I might quarrell him also for that where he inferres againe thus No Priests no Church Their Rhemists note that our Sauiour Christ made not the Apostles Priests till his last Supper And yet I hope Christ and his companie were a Church before that time and a Church of the new Testament or else more incongruities will follow I beleeue then the Adioynder will salue vp in hast S. Paul calls Philemons house a Church Yet himselfe was a lay man as the Fathers hold which perhaps would not haue been but that a Church figuratiue may be without a Minister Why not then a true I would but fish their iudgements I am to sift some things for disputation sake For though Archippus was a Minister and Philemons sonne as some thinke yet their houses were distinct as appeares by S. Hieromes Commentarie vpon this place Ambiguum est vtrum Ecclesiam quae in domo Archippi sit an eam quae in domo Philemonis significare velit Apostolus cum dicit se scribere Ecclesiae quae in domo eius est sed mihi videtur non ad Archippi sed ad Philemonis referendum esse personam c. Yea Haymo saies directly asking why S. Paul salutes no Bishops Priests or other
his reading this text and the vprightnes of it Woe is me for that diuine man M. Casaubone that speaking of his monument I should speake ambiguously of his tombe or of his writings But what that hath deuoured these shall eternize and now is no time to bewaile our losse Because Peter had lambkins and lambs and sheepe committed to his charge to be fed by him suppose incipientes prosicientes perfectos the leafe the blossome and the ripe almond in Aarons rod suppose all the steps in Iacobs ladder at least as it signifies the Church here militant suppose Prophets and Apostles Kings and Emperors the boundlesse latitude of the Church Christian Ergò quid who can replie with patience to such emptie stuffe Doe we looke it should haue beene said Feede all saue the Apostles or all saue Princes why should Princes and Apostles not profit by Peter why should they be denied the benefit of his feeding why should not all the Apostles feede all the world why should not one Apostle feede another Peter his fellowes and they Peter As I thinke Paul fed him and that with his staffe too tipt with iron I haue heard some construe virgam ferream so Apoc. 2. and Psal 2. as alluding to the sheepehooke I meane with his reproofe and that at Antioch his owne seat not onely with fodder or with greene bowes As againe Iames fed him with viri fratres audite me Act. 15. 14. you would thinke this were rather the successor of Christ of whome that was said Heare you him And againe ver 19. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 To say nothing of Simeon narrauit in the 14. ver Not Peter now but bare Simeon Doth this prooue a Monarchie ouer the Apostles Or if Kings be content to lend an eare to his pipe and to graze vpon such leaues as he shall cast before them the word and the Sacraments that refection of immortalitie quorum vis inenarrabiliter valet plurimùm what is this to your moderne frighting omnipotencie Me thinks I heare Constantine rauished with his note to yeild thus much Be you Bishops in the Church and I without Me thinks I heare Valentinian call for such a Prelate as he may safely lay his head in his lappe but safely beeing the head which is the head of the world as euen the heathen Poet could say But doth this prooue the terrible power that you striue for which is neither of kin to Peters feeding and the daungerousest resort for a Kings head that may be Nay how if the Iesuit haue so mistaken himselfe in his curious distinction betweene lambs and sheepe that he hath cleane exempted both Apostles and Kings from Peters iurisdiction to bring whome in and to range them within the compasse of that supreme power the distinction onely was at first deuised For if oves and agni onely be S. Peters walke and he the sheepeheard where are arietes where are the rams The rams beeing the Apostles by Turrian his exposition or the successors of the Apostles that is the Bishops And againe the rams beeing meant by Kings as Tolet will haue it vpon the 15. of S. Iohn Annot. 3. Two Iesuits you see I bring him and the one a Cardinall made for his learning which I thinke will neuer be his lot But hath not he spun a faire thread I say shutting them out both Apostles and Kings whome by that very tricke he would haue shut in § 35. And so much of his answer to the first exception that the Bishop makes against their argument drawne from Pasce oues meas consisting in the authorities of Austen and Ambrose § 36. IN his second saith he he seekes to retort the Cardinals argument vpon himselfe to prooue the Kings supremacie by the word Pasce for so much as God said also to Dauid Tu pasces populum meum Israel Thou shalt feede my people Israel Where no man can denie saies the Bishop but that a King was made the Pastor of all Israel yea of the Priests themselues except he will deny them to be part of Israel But what faies F. T. thinke you to this Thus argueth this learned and sharpe Doctor ouerthrowing his owne argument sufficiently by his owne conclusion graunting in effect that if the Priests were not a part of the people Israel the King was not their Pastor These are his prefaces if wee had time to ponder them And yet it is almost the modestest clause in the Book of them wherein he bespeakes the Bishop that the Reader may pardon me if now and then I be mooued euen more then he is aware or pitie me when I am compelled as often I am for want of leisure to swallow such curteous girds in silence The summe is that in answering to the Bishops retortion hee would haue the Priests to bee no part of Israel And once againe you shall discerne the spirit of the man who thus sets forward To this purpose then it is to be considered what I haue amply debated in the first Chapter of my Supplement concerning the exemption and separation of the Priests and Leuites from the temporall estate by the expresse words of Almightie God Numb 8. who gaue the Leuites to Aaron and his children not to the temporall Prince Tradidi eos dono Aaron filijs eius de medio populi And againe Num. 1. The tribe of Leui shall not be numbred nor haue any part with the rest of Israel but the Lord must be their possession portion and inheritance I must bee short And so shaking off the Supplement with other idle complements though he is not ashamed to set a trūpet to his Pharisaicall cheeks and euerie where to display his owne worke as if there were no other storehouse of learning in the world no file but this Philistines to whet a witte vpon consider we as well as we can what is to bee said to this point of the exemption of Leuites from the state politick that is from their subiection to ciuill Magistrates for else he saies nothing sith we knowe the Leuites were not lay-men and the Priests Priests not populars Yet he implyes such a thing when hauing quoted the text and not daring to vtter that audacious proposition that Priests were not subiect to the ciuill Magistrate he saies onely this that God reserued them for his owne seruice which no doubt is the true meaning of the place but how doth this ouerthrow ciuill obedience § 37. To speake particularly to the places As for Num. 1. to beginne with that Non numerabitur tribus Leui I could send him to a place as he does vs where hee should finde his answer if Datin be no eie-fore to him alreadie shaped to a man of his coate and as it seemes verie reuerently esteemed by him I meane Iohn Eudoemon of Crete but the summe is this A viewe of the people was to be taken there either as landed men or sufficient for the wars From both which the Leuites beeing
Cùm tibi placet quod scribo noui cui placeat quoniam qui te inhabitet noui Hee meanes that the holy Ghost dwels in Simplicianus which would haue made a faire shew in a Popes style Largitor enim omnium munerum per tuam sententiam confirmauit obedientiam meam c. He speakes of obedience yeelded to Simplician who yet was not his superiour Againe In meo ministerio dixit Deus fiat factum est Hee calls it his ministerie or his seruice and sets him almost in the place of God In tuâ verò approbatione vidit deus quia bonum est At least there he makes him his God or his superiour directly Generally of all Bishops thus wee read in S. Austen Epist 168. In alijs ciuitatibus tantum agimus quod ad ecclesiam dei pertinet quaentum vel nos permittunt vel NOBIS IMPONVNT earundem ciuitatum Episcopi fratres consacerdotes nostri What is lesse in imponunt then in the iniungunt that you vrge Iniuncta nobis à Zozimo necessitas Yet here you see imponunt is an act that any Bishop might exercise towards S. Austen euen his brothers and fellow-priests fratres consacerdotes not onely Zozimus So Ruffinus in exposit symbol ad Laurent which Laurence was no Pope though he be called Papa there i. a reuerent personage One Laurentius stood with Symmachus for the Popedome I graunt but hee lost it as you knowe Well what saies Ruffinus He calls it pondus praecepti because Laurentius desired him to put his exposition which he had preacht vpon the Creede in writing the weight of his charge or the charge of his commandement Againe Astringis me vt aliquid tibi de side c. Yet Laurence had no power that I know of binding Ruffinus Lastly expositionis à te impositae necessitatem sayes he which answers word for word almost to that which you bring out of S. Austen Iniuncta nobis à Zozimo necessitas But of Zozimus saith hee hereafter wherein we will attend him § 19. First therefore of Liberius a most wretched proofe Certaine Arian hereticks obtained his letters for their restitution to the assemblie of Tyana and by vertue of them they were restored though they did but dissemble in that they feigned their conformitie with the Church of God inwardly remaining deepe Arians Is not this fit to be brought in behalfe of the Pope to shew how wel he stands vpon his watch how meete a man he is to inherit the trust of all Christian soules that suffers such knaues to beguile him in this sort As for that that Liberius letters were of force so should any other graue and worthie Prelates haue been vpon whose testimonie the Synod might relie especially when if there had beene no doubt of their repentance they should haue needed no other mediatour happily then themselues But because he hath quoted S. Basil in the margent let vs heare his words and see what confidence he puts in Rome or in the Bishop thereof Epist 74. thus he saies of Liberius and his restoring of Eustathius that Arian heretick which suspition to say truth Liberius was not free from enclining thither himselfe when time was The rather might he write in the behalfe of an Arian 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. Since therefore from thence he meanes from Rome and from the Westerne Churches this Epistle bearing inscription to the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the Bishops of the West since from thence he hath receiued power to hurt the Churches and the libertie that you gaue him Liberius with the rest he to the subuersion of many hath abused it is necessarie that reformation should spring from the same place and that you should send word to the Churches for what cause he was receiued and how beeing changed since in his opinion he makes void the grace that was then giuen him not by Liberius so much as by the Fathers that is they of the Councell of Tyana of which before And in the same Epistle a little afore this place S. Basil giues two reasons why he implores the aide of the Italian Bishops in these words 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. The first is because if onely the Easterne Bishops appeare against Eustathius it may be thought to come of emulation and partialitie one Bishop of the same countrey opposing another 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 But you the farther of the better beleeued Which to say truth hath alwaies bin the Popes felicitie But you see he flies not to them for any vniuersal authoritie or prerogatiue as they imagin frō Peter deriued but for the distāce of the place which makes them seeme to be more incorrupt The second reason is from the consenting of many Bishops together and the power of that to preuaile with peoples minds when there shall be a concurrence 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 That is But of with ioynt consent many shall auerre the same thing the very multitude of them that are of one minde will make it to be entertained without contradiction By which you see the Pope can doe little alone And so speakes Basil in his greatest extremitie euen when he needes the Pope most Else we know how sharply he can taxe Rome and giue the Popes their owne when occasion serues 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the Westerne pride saith he haereses propagant they spread heresies or multiplie heresies Epist 8. ad Euseb Samosat § 20. Of Iulius and Athanasius I spake before The same was the cause of Marcellus and Asclepas Paulus and Lucian and the rest restored as you say by Iulius Pope tanquam omnium curam gerentem as bearing care of all Tripart l. 4. c. 15. As if euery Bishop were not obliged to doe his seruice to the whole Church as farre as he can which were easie to demonstrate but that I haue done it before and quoted Origen very lately for the same yet Iulius the rather because the prime Bishop but prime in order onely and in a certaine excellencie propter sedis dignitatem as the Tripartite here speakes in the very words that this man quotes not propter auctoritatem S. Austen calls it Speculam his watchtower Besides that this same Iulius is many yeeres before S. Austen and yet he professes to reckon vp onely such as liued in S. Austens time Doe you not see how he labours to vtter his prouision Finally in Sozomene who reports the same matter and is quoted by this man to that very purpose cap. 2. num 8. In Sozomene I say lib. 3. c. 7. thus we read That the persons to whome Iulius wrote in behalfe of the aforesaid catholicke Bishops though they acknowledged the Church of Rome primas ferre apud omnes to be the chiefe Church in euerie bodies estimation as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the schoole of the Apostles and the mother citty of piety not for any succession into the authoritie of S. Peter in particular and yet
deny they say they cannot but the first authors of Christian relligion sprang from the East not from Rome neuertheles indignati sunt se posteriores ideâ—ferre quòd magnitudine ecclesiae superarentur idque cuÌ„ virtute pio viuendi instituto longè superiores essent they thought much that they should be set any whit behind the others because their Church was not so great or so ample as theirs specially when in vertue and godly life they farre excelled them Thus they I compare not now the opinions of Arians with Catholiques in that point of their dissention which the Scripture hath determined and right faith compounded but as for East and West you see what estimation one had of the other and how little our Grecians thought themselues short of Rome Therefore they are so confident a little after as to challenge Iulius for doing against the Councell and their owne definition Insimulà runt Iulium ceu transgredientem ecclesiae leges And whereas Iulius a little before had threatned them they threaten him againe and Sozomene calls the letter that they sent to Iulius plenam minarum atque ironiae full not onely of threates but mocks and taunts vnlesse you will otherwise construe it So miserably were they afraid of the Popes authoritie in those daies diuided from equity Pollicentur paceÌ„ communionem Iulio si approbaret abdicationem factam sin resisteret decretis eorum c. They promise Iulius to be of his communion if he will doe as they would haue him if not to leaue that is to disclaime him you would say to excommunicate him if it made for you And indeede in the 10. Chap. of Sozomene soone after they doe so in good earnest § 21. The next is Damasus In whom I must bee short What tell you vs of titles and tearmes and styles what though they called him most blessed Lord raised to the height of Apostolique dignitie holy father of fathers Damasus Pope c. Thinke you that the boyes would forbeare laughter hearing this argument That the Bishops of Africa call him Damasum Papam Pope Damasus c. therefore Damasus Pope might receiue appeales out of Africa If that be not in their style the rest is vulgar and nothing to the matter Who was not Papa in those dayes which you engrossing bewray your selues Yea but nothing might goe for currant concerning important affaires as deposition of Bishops say you nisi ad noticiam vestrae sedis delatum fuerit vnlesse your Sea knew of it To which I answer noticia is one thing consensus another Men may seek for resolution and yet not be subiect to authoritie vnlesse themselues please 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that the soueraigne stroke in euery businesse should be the Metropolitanes of the Prouince the Councell of Nice determined verie cleerely Can. 4. of more authoritie then your Damasus his epistles or to Damasus § 22. But is not that a braue confuting of the Mileuitan Canon alleadged by the Bishop against appeales beyond the sea that S. Hierome sought to Damasus for his iudgement about Hypostasis This also may prooue an appeale in time when appeales grow scant It hath been answered by our Diuines ouer and ouer it is nothing to our question therfore I insist not vpon it Neither yet that of Ambrose if it be Ambrose who liuing within Italy that is Damasus his prouince saies Damasus gouerned the house of God the house no doubt wherein hee liued and wrote at that day But how if he had called it as it followes in S. Paul columnam firmamentum veritatis which S. Paul does Ephesus wherein Timothy liued yet neither Ephesus that infallible one that you imagine Rome to be for truth of doctrine nor Timothy a monarch or vniuersall Bishop § 23. That Peter of Alexandria was restored to his Bishopricke vpon Damasus his letters you shewe not they were mandatorie we thinke rather commendatorie Damasus certified good things of Peter and the people receiued him illis confisus trusting they might be true or they did what they desired and longed to doe vpon so good a hint The Pope gaue not Patriarkships in those dayes yea had any so challenged the Alexandrines would haue torne him in peices they were so violent § 24. Vitalis an heretique and an Antiochian was examined and censured by Pope Damasus But you dissemble not that Paulinus their Bishop permitted it The wonder had beene if Damasus had intermedied against his consent One Bishop may referre his Priest to be examined by another whome he will Things were not so well setled with Paulinus at this time in Antioch as it should seeme through intestine discords which long continued So Damasus might prescribe a forme of abiuration to Vitalis the heretique though otherwise prescribe is but an imperious word of your owne deuising and to draw him a forme which he meant should be vsed by him vpon his returne to Antioch had beene enough Your author whome you quote in Ep. 2. ad Cledon saies onely thus Damaso postulante edidit or literis consignauit fidem at Damasus his instaÌ„ce he pen'd a forme of his beleife not Damasus for him but he to Damasus Which Athanasius also did at the Emp. Iouians request not to purge suspicion but to instruct him in the truth Of prescribing to Paulinus I read nothing in that place In Damasus his Epistle I finde this qualification both that tuae voluntati tuo iudicto omnia derelinquimus we leaue all to your will and your iudgement and in the ende this Non quòd haec ipsa quae scribimus non potueris conuertentium susceptioni proponere sed quò noster consensus liberum in suscipiendo tibi tribuat exempluÌ„ Not that you could not of your owne selfe haue propounded these things to conuerts ere they were receiued but that our concurrence might yeeld you freedome of example to receiue them And if freedome how prescription § 25. It is a wonder how you dare mention the name of Flauianus who by the Emperors fauour kept his seat against so many Popes one after another striuing to vnhorse him and all in vaine The paines that Chrysostome and Theophilus tooke to make a peace betweene him and Damasus shewed their good care of the Churches vnity and worthily entitles them to the blessing of peacemakers But that which you call pardoning Flauianus offence and restoring him to the communion of the Church againe was no more then was vsuall in those dayes between Bishop and Bishop if they misliked one another to forbeare communicating mutually if satisfaction were giuen to returne to fellowship and communion againe which you perhaps to amplifie the Popes power would haue vs think to be excommunication and absolution Where you say that the people of Antioch were IN TIME REDVCED to concord and vnitie with Flavianus their Bishop through this act of Damasus it shewes it was rather the relenting of their mindes and appeasing their stomacks out of
Clergy-men writing to the Galatians as he does whē he writes to other Churches Quia nondum habebant neque Episcopum neque Rectorem aliquem ideoque facilius sedici potuerunt And yet Galatia a Church or many Churches in Galatia as it is cap. 1. v. 2. But so much may suffice to his first collection § 48. Now to his second That the Bishop himselfe and other his colleagues here of the Church of England are neither true Bishops nor of any succession mission or vocation viz. because they enter not in by the doore that is are not ordained by Popish Bishops in whom alone the streame of succession runs along as he surmiseth though to this last I shall speak more distinctly by and by Yet in the meane while to answer to his wise illation iuxta prudentiam hominis as Salomon biddes vs Pope Nicholas their first was of another minde as it may seeme at least by his answer ad Consulta Bulgarorū c. 14. where when the people of that place would haue had a certaine Grecian to haue lost his eares to haue his nose slit and other such disgraces for preaching Christ though to the benefit of the people yet without any lawfull ordination the Pope dissents from them and qualifies the matter by these words of the Apostle Siue occasione siue QVOCVNQVE MODO Christus praedicetur non laboro yea hee concludes thus euen of the generall question out of another Popes mouth his predecessor a Pope you see quoting his predecessor Pope and the Apostle S. Paul too Non quaerite quis vel qualis praedicet sed quem praedicet It is no matter who nor what kind of man it is that preacheth but whom hee preacheth viz. whether hee preach Christ or no. Which last words are as strange to me as contrarie to the Adioynder in this place And so perhaps is that peruerting of the Apostles sentence before cited For when wee say Non interest quis praedicet vel qualis we are not to meane it of morall idoneity or morall sufficiencie but of Ecclesiasticall as the Schoole teaches So is the Pope to the Adioynder and the Schoole to the Pope and hard but the truth to them all contrarie In the 16. chapter of the said Responsa it seemes the people had executed their wrath vpon that poore caityfe that had fained himselfe Priest and cropt his eares and done him the despight which afore they trauailed with but questioned whether they might doe it lawfully or no. Belike the Popes answer had not come to their hands or else passion was deafe to milder aduise Whereupon in reproouing their hard vsage of him hee proceeds thus to excuse the matter Si Dauid esse se furiosum finxit vt suam tantum salutem operari posset quam noxam contraxit qui tot hominum multitudinem QV OQV O MODO de potestate Diaboli aternae perditionis abstraxit In English thus If Dauid fained himselfe mad onely to saue his life what fault was he in that pluckt so many men out of the power of the deuill and from eternall perdition IT IS NO MATTER HOVV Is this good diuinitie Or may you plead so and not wee § 49. As for that which he produceth out of Bishop Barlowes Sermon to fortifie this point yet a little better against vs it is meerely ridiculous because when Bishop Barlowe speaks of the succession of Bishops to be the root of Christian fellowship and the proofe of Christian doctrine he meanes as Irenaeus takes succession cum charismate veritatis with the gift of truth which in you is wanting in your hands in your mouthes is found nothing as the Psalmist speakes Doe we not read in S. Austen that Iudas Iudae succedit aliquoties Com. in Psal 141. and lupi agnis id est Apostolis Act. 20. 29. or nox dici as Gregory Nazianzene speakes and morbus sanitati that is one bad man suceedes another and good men are succeeded by the bad many times neither of which successions auaile you any thing or are to be gloried in Neither againe are we heretikes for dissenting from them of whome we tooke our ordination as you rashly imply in your numb 35. For the power of ordination is not taken away de facto from an heretical Bishop vnles he be sentenced and inhibited by authoritie And after that too perhaps the orders are good that he conferres though himselfe doe amisse in peruerting discipline and violating the commission of his superiours Fieri non debuit factum valuit as the common saying is § 50. But to come at last to the third point which is the ground and bottome of the other twaine and so an ende of this matter and in the next of the whole if God say Amen You say Our Bishops in the beginning of the raigne of Queene Elizabeth ordained themselues by mutuall compact beeing destitute of other helpe from Welsh and Irish which in vaine they sollicited And you produce your author one Thomas Neale a worthy wight no doubt though no more be said in conmendation of him Yet you adde that he was Reader of the Hebrew Lecture in Oxford afterward it may well be And thus you haue approoued as you thinke at least that our men were not consecrated by lawfull Bishops and lawfully called I meane ordained of them that your selues call Catholiques From whence what flowes That Clergy wee haue none nor Church none and the Bishop is no Bishop against whom you write c. But these two inferences we haue discussed before how well they follow out of the premisses though they were graunted As for the Bishop in particular that reuerend Prelate the obiect of your enuy and the subiect of our controuersie I might say much and yet conuince in short that the defect of oyle cannot hinder his 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as the Philosopher said wittily that it was not possible that Hercules should be debarred heauen because he was not initiate so that the Bishop should be no Bishop for lacke of Ordainers But the greater his worth the more my silence and his scorne of these reproaches à magnitudine animi non à superbia as Tully saics of Socrates bridles me euen dumbe The summe is that when we say our Bishops were ordained by yours we meane by such as were first ordained by your Bishops though not persisting in their Relligion happily They were yours by Primitiue ordination not yours by constance of profession And this was enough to make good their act For the power by them receiued through imposition of hands makes them fit ordainers not the stedfastnesse of their faith or keeping close to the doctrine or else euery faithfull man might be a lawfull ordainer which you are loath to grant to euery faithfull Priest and much more to Lay-men It were not hard to shewe who consecrated the first Bishop in Queen Elizabeths time which was Archbishop Parker Bishop Barlow I trow was one
first Bishop of Bath and Wells then of Chichester who was made both Priest and Bishop in the time of King Henry the 8. And therefore you may be sure by men of your Relligion and by Popish Bishops Bishop Scory Bishop of Chichester first and after of Hereford was another who was made Priest in King Henries time and Bishop in King Edwards Bishop Hodgkin Suffragan of Bedford made Bishop in Queene Maries time Miles Couerdale Bishop in King Edwards time c. So as neither did our Bishops consecrate themselues by compact or playing booty as you malitiously slaunder them and the other Bishops that were vsed in their consecration were partly made Priests partly Bishops in former Princes raignes those Popish but all before the raigne of Queene Elizabeth I might adde much more here as I haue read it taken out of the originall Archiues of the Church of Canterbury about the iudgment of 6. Doctors of the Ciuill Law who all subscribed that the Commission for their consecration graunted by the Queenes Maiesty to the persons abouenamed was iustifiable and lawfull viz. William Maye Robert Weston Edward Leeds Henry Haruey Thomas Yale Nicholas Bullingham I thinke your Neale himselfe if he had been of the profession and not reading his Ebria or addicted to lyes rather then to the lawes would not haue dissented from the opinion of so many sages Marry if you meane of Bishop Cranmer his consecration is more pregnant yet and confirmed by sundry Buls of Pope Clement the seuenth as if need were might be specified at large The first whereof was to King Henry the 8. two other to the elect himselfe Thomas Cant. the fourth to all the brethren and suffragans of the Church of Canterbury the fifth to the Clergy of the Citie and Diocesse of Canterbury And so diuers more which here I omit for breuitie sake He was consecrated 1533. ann Reg. Henrici 8. 24. March 30. by Iohn Bishop of Lincoln and Iohn Bishop of Exceter and Henry Bishop of Asaph The same day also accepit pallium Yea he paid the Pope 900. duckets in gold for his Bulls But as far as I perceiue you cauil not the consecration of Archbishop Cranmer but onely them that were made in Queene Elizabeths dayes viz. Archbishop Parker and the rest And the reason to me seemes to be this because the Pope had a fleece out of the ones consecration none out of the others nor neuer since Certamen mouistis opes All your stirres are for Peter-pence and smoak-pence and golden duckats and such were irritamenta malorum § 51. This which I haue assirmed of the consecration of these two Archbishops not onely Mr. Mason of his exact knowledge will iustifie to your head or any of you all notwithstanding your braue Appendix at the ende of your Adioynder then which I neuer saw a more filly plea but almost any nouice in the Church of England And if my leasure would permit or that were now my taske how easily might I detect the sundry absurdities that your Appendix containeth First Num. 4. you alleadge a statute of Ann. 1. Eliz. cap. 1. and Dr. Stapleton vrging it against Bishop Horne That no Bishop should be held for a Bishophere in England without due consecration before had c. Yet you argue in the same place but more importunately soone after Num. 9. that both Stapleton and Harding would neuer haue pressed Bishop Iewel and the rest with want of due consecration if this Register had been true or any such thing to haue beene shewed in those times But if Stapleton and Harding bee so authenticall with you that whatsoeuer they once vrge vs with is straight vnanswerable then I confesse we are in a wofull case And yet to say somewhat in defence of them too without graunting your slaunder of our first Bishops in the Queenes time what if the mislike that they had to those consecrations was because they were not consecrated by Popish Bishops for Protestant Bishops is of your putting in into Mr. Hardings words num 11. and not such as were ordained by the Popish Are you not ashamed to confound these things so grossely and vtterly to mistake the state of the question If Harding and Stapleton therefore were so considerate men that a false imputation could not proceed from them their meaning was this What Bishop consecrated you that is what Popish Bishop or Catholique Bishop in your sense But if they meant that they rusht in either without any consecration or basely agreed to consecrate one another a deuise meeter for boy-Bishops such as Popery aboundeth with then for godly and graue Prelates of the Church of England they were doubtlesse inconsiderate and if neuer before this time or neuer in any any other matter which is more then the fame that goes of them yet for this one part iustly to be so censured Vnlesse their absence from their country and not consulting of the Register might plead their pardon in tanto I graunt not in toto but howsoeuer it be this is a strange argument of yours to confront a Register with the life of things past the image of truth the memory of times the light of memory that Harding and Stapleton would neuer haue been so bold as to contradict it if it had beene so Nay then why should Queene Elizabeth prouide by Statute as your selfe here tell vs and her graue Counsellors deuise vnder her which Counsellours you may bee sure neither wanted foresight and were most faithfull to her in all her proceedings That no Bishops should goe for Bishops here in the Church of England which wanted due consecration if she meant shortly after to set vp and authorize a generation of pseudo-Pseudo-Bishops in the same Church her selfe Had not this been to kill the very life of her intents and to alienate the people from embracing the Relligion that she was minded to promote with all her power For this Act of Parliament you say was Ann. 1. of Q Elizabeth But both the Arch-bishop the other Bishops were not consecrated till about the beginning of the second yeare of the Queenes raigne Bishop Parker in December Bishop Iewel in Ianuary c. Now then let me aske you a ratte trackt to death by the apparant euidence impression of your owne marks for I assure you but for your owne text here I had neuer considered of this statute of Queene Elizabeth let me aske you I say Is this good Logicke Harding and Stapleton though prickt with passion and enuying other folkes good fortunes would neuer haue accused Bishop Iewell their aduersary if the case had not been cleere And is not this much more forcible Queene Elizabeth and her sage Counsellors would not haue forbid that thing by act of Parliament which shortly after she meant to licence and to put in practise in the open view of the whole world But what should I stand arguing with such a beastly iangler that calls Bishop Iewells answer
discouering them at least I am not he that can diue into their secrets the word Defender and Maintainer of the Church will stretch to as much Supremacie as either his Maiestie now assumeth or we avow more by much then the Papists will graunt him yea it is that which they oppose with might and maine that results from these very words of Defence and Maintenance For how can a King defend the Church maintaine the vnity preserue the beauty vnlesse he haue power to reforme both spirituall faults let me call them so for this once I meane heresies blasphemies schismes the like and that in spirituall persons too euen in the loftiest of the crew who sting their nurse as dāgerously as another nay farre more dangerously many times both by their scandalous liuing especially by their broaching of pernicious doctrins Quia omne malum ex Sanctuario and the thundrings and lightenings came out of the Temple Reu. 16. 18. to signifie that the Churchmen are the cause of all plagues as Ribera notes well vpon that place In scelere Israel omne hoc But the Papists think that Kings are blocks and stocks like the Heathens images that Baruch speakes of not to stirre but as they are lifted Ducitur vt neruis alienis mobile lignum Nay not able so much as to wipe off the dung from their faces that the little birds let fal vpon them they allow them no actiuitie no pricking censure which is the very nerve of Defence Church-maintenance Might this conceit stand it were somewhat that the Adioynder replyes to our argument but it is so stale and so grosse that the little boyes here laugh at it though old gray-bearded Papists and the Adioynder for one are not ashamed to reiterate it § 83. But will you heare an elegancie a queint deuise In his Numb 63. Though the Puritanes are defectiue in their opinion of Supremacie yet both they and the Papists are better subiects then the Bishop for you are to know that still he is the Bishops good friend because all of vs yeelding the title of Defender and Maintainer of the Church to the Kings Maiesty the title they if he will but not the Thing as I haue shewed before not in due extension at least for then there would remaine no controuersie between vs yet they beleeue it as a matter of faith the Bishop but onely as a matter of perswasion c. Thus does he ruminate and re-ruminate his cud againe and goe ouer his abolita atque transacta as S. Austen speaks But for the Puritanes of Scotland whom he quotes in his margent I finde no such thing in the words alleadged by him that they hold the Supremacie to bee a matter of faith the Papists Creed I know is not yet perfected and they may take in what they list Nay I thinke it neuer came into their minds good men to trouble their braines with such a nice speculation whether the case of Supremacie be de fide or no but howsoeuer it be I haue answered it before that our perswasion thereof is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 we will neuer be driuen from it neither by force nor by fine words Errore nec Terrore though the Adioynder thinke we will not loose sixpence for the defence of it our liues not onely our liuelihoods beeing not deare vnto vs in the contestation of this iustest quarrell That the KINGS MAIESTIE is the cheife maintainer cheife head of the Church chiefe gouernour and cheife defender of it in all causes and ouer all persons next vnder God and his Sonne Christ § 84. Yea But what the Puritanes teach concerning this point you haue heard in the last Chapter by the testimonie of Mr. Rogers approoued and warranted by all the Clergie of England to wit that Princes must be seruants to the Church subiect to the Church submit their scepters to the Church and throwe downe their crownes before the Church c. Whereupon I gather saith the Adioynder two things The one that the Supremacie which as the Bishop saith the Puritanes doe acknowledge in the King is to be vnderstood onely in temporall matters The other that all reformed churches are also of the fame mind seeing that they professe the same doctrine concerning the Kings Ecclesiasticall Supremacie that the Puritanes doe as the Bishop himselfe confesseth c. § 85. Then Numb 66. for I would gladly take in all Besides that albeit we should graunt that the Puritanes and Reformed Churches doe allow the Teporall Magistrate to haue some power and authoritie in Ecclesiasticall matters yet it is euident that they doe not allow them that spirituall iurisdiction and authoritie which our Parlaments haue granted to our Kings that they may giue dispensations licenses make Ecclesiasticall Lawes giue commissions to consecrate Bishops to excommunicate suspend censure visit and correct all Ecclesiasticall persons Reforme heresies and abuses c. and with this the beast breathes out his last or almost his last To whome I answer in order and as briefly as the nature of such obiections will permit Princes may serue the Church and submit their scepters subiect their Crownes before the Church though all supreame Magistrates doe not weare Crownes that I may tell him that by the way and we now by Prince vnderstand all yea and licke the dust of the Churches feete as the Prophet Esay speakes and yet retaine their Supremacie firme and inuiolable How so Marry it is a shame for the Adioynder not to see it of himself without a guide remembring who calls himselfe the seruant of seruants and yet pleades for a Lordship limitlesse ouer the Church at least the Adioynder will agnise him for his good Master though he goe for a Seruant but neuerthelesse we will helpe him The one by loue by zeale by care by filiall respect and duties of all sorts to the great mother the Church of God teeming and trauailing here vpon earth whether the generall to his power or the particular within the territories where he raigneth and swayeth The other by vnderstanding the right of his place and accordingly also executing and exercising of it to the controll of all that stands in his way and to the purging of all scandals out of Gods floare to the banishing of sin to the chasing away of all wickednesse with his very looke and browe as Salomon speakes or whatsoeuer may be said in the loftiest style for the aduancing this high authoritie principally destinated to the benefit of Gods Church and setting forth of his glorie Doe I speake riddles or are others of the same minde Dominotur sacerdotibus Imperator saies S. Gregorie l. 4. Regist ep 15. ita tamen vt etiam debitam reuerentiam impendat Let the Emperour on Gods name beare sway ouer Priests but so that he reuerence them as meet is And he addes withall Atque hoc excellenti consideratione faciat And let him so doe vpon excellent consideration
we come to the place which is Chap. 3. num 36. as we are told by you In the meane time you recken without your host the Bishop graunts nothing that he will not stand to Be you but content with that which he pitches and the controuersie will soone be at an ende But did you euer heare such an impudent varlet that plaies vpon the word temporall primacie and denies they giue any such to the Pope What is their primacie but a primacie of power and if the power then be temporall is not the primacie so Now for that let but Bellarmine declare his opinion who intitles his 5. booke de Pontif. Rom. De potestate Pontificis temporali Of the temporall power of the Pope This is plaine but in the argument of the sixt chapter of the same booke more plainly Papam habere temporalem potestatem indirectè That the Pope hath temporall power at least indirectly Whereas we neither ascribe to the King spirituall primacie ouerhastily nor are wont to call his power spirituall If the Bishop haue so done let the place be named and the imputation verified wherewith F. T. chargeth vs Num. 15. though very wrongfully as if we nourished a doctrine of the Kings spirituall primacie Yet they say Sixtus Quintus would haue had those works of Bellarmine to be burnt perhaps for giuing him temporall power onely and not temporall primacy totidem verbis And here our lepus pulpamentum quaerit a wretch and most obnoxious to all manner of scorne flourishes and descants with his leaden wit vpon a corporall Bishop as he calls him Bonner I trow who excused his corpulencie wherewith hee was wont to be painted with saying he had but one doublet too little for him and the knaue hereticks alway painted him in that If you talke of a punisher of bodies he was one We doe not know God be thanked that our Bishops haue any such power in these daies by the examples we see but that you tell vs so And there was a time when your Popes themselues could inflict no punishments of this nature saies Papirius Massonius in the life of Leo the second Now all their strength stands that way And so I might say of the punishing of the purse and the gaines of the Bishops court which you so enuie wheras not onely he is not forward to deale punishments and much lesse to gain by the parties punished but I haue heard his Chancellour whom certenly you meant when you taxed the Courts vtterly disanow that their Courts condemne any body in mony howsoeuer offending How beit if Kings to whome all the power of the sword is cōmitted that is all kind of coactiue punishment should giue the Bishops leaue to mulct the purse rather then their censures should be contēned what is that to the Popes either exercising or challenging to himself I know not what tēporal power by vertue of his Apostleship and originall calling without donation or delegation from Princes Though againe if this be graunted which I beleeue not as yet because I haue beene otherwise informed as I said that the Bishops are so licensed by authoritie from his MAIESTIE here in England yet the Bishop whome you shoot at is so farre from delighting in any such markets that he had rather redeeme offences with his losse then raise profit to himselfe out of punishments Imperatorem me peperit mater said Scipio non bellatorem when one chidde him as too remisse and loath to fight So he S. Theodoret saith sweetly that there are no punishments in heauen in regione hyacinthina of which farther you may heare in his due place And the Bishops calling is a kind of heauen How much more when it is ioyned with conscience and clemencie Which is so proper to the Prelate of whome we speake as you may wonder both his Office and Sea sauouring of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of mercie and compassion rather then of rigour but his nature much more And if S. Chrysostomes argument for Kings be good that they are called to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 because unnointed 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is called to mercy because annointed with oyle it may guide you to conceiue aright herein of the Bishop whose practise acquites him without hidden emblemes or forced hieroglyphicks Vnlesse you thinke that because he handled Tortus somewhat roughly or the Cardinall either therefore he is more vindicatiue out of his disposition But for that you may remember that he was the Kings Almoner and dealt his liberalities as they had beene best deserued Now leauing the digression that this mans malepertnes hath driuen vs vnto what saies he for substance to the Bishops third exception as himselfe branches it § 43. IT is enough saies he that Cyrill and Austen denie not the temporall power of Peter though they auerre it not in their commentaries Forsooth they expound not Pasce halfe perfectly wherein surely they are to blame in so large a Commentarie as few haue written vpon that Scripture to say nothing of a thing so materiall as that or so principall rather and yet so obuious when the text lies naked before their eyes For it is a necessarie consequent the temporall power saies our Iesuit here of the spirituall Which yet Mr. Blackwell will neuer beleeue nor those authors whom he quotes to the contrarie that make it a point like the new-found lands or vnfound rather so wholly vndefined and vnresolued whether the Pope haue any such peece of dominion yea or no. Besides he should haue shewed the necessarie consequence betweene the two powers which because he does not I thinke he either saw it not or lacked abilitie to expresse his minde Me thinkes nothing easier then to conceiue so of them that though linked in vse yet diuided in nature and so likewise in subiect as Gelasius gaue caution long agoe very well of not confounding them like the two armes in a mans bodie or the two lights in the firmament so farre I am content to goe with Bonifacius yea or the two swords themselues ecce duo gladij whereof one questionlesse depended not of another though your exposition be so good that Stella is ashamed of it and diuerse more of your owne men § 44. That S. Austen acknowledged the Popes temporall primacie implyed in those words Pasce oues meas you bring no other places then we haue hitherto answered and it might be thought too largely but that you bring them againe as primus Apostolorum and propter primatum Apostolatús of which no more Let them preuaile as they can So likewise I say of representare personam which you inforce here againe to be supreame gouernour ouer the Church This is your riches that runne round in a ring and choake the children of the Prophets with your crambe and yet cry out of the Bishop for his nakednesse and pouertie in proouing the cause Numb 15. As for that you here adde that no other
same page and within halfe a score lines one of the other but howsoeuer it be the authoritie is not worth a rush For first what is this to the temporall primacie which we descry here to be the Emperours and not the Popes by Iustinians driuing him into banishment they call it I know Bellisarius his act but in the power of Iustinian no doubt and for a secular matter viz. for treason So as the Pope is subiect to the Emperours censure for ciuill faults Secondly let him bee Pope ouer the Church of the whole world that is in order of preheminence not in right of gouernment or confirmed iurisdiction as the cheife Patriarch which is euident by the comparison or disparison rather of earthly Kings there vsed whereof one hath no such reference of order to an other but the Patriarchall Seas are fixed saith S. Leo by inviolable Canon legibus ad finem mundi mansuris and admit no confusion Thirdly there is this difference betweene Kings and Priests that Kings are confined to their owne dominions and if they be taken without them they loose their priuiledge and stand but for little better then subiects in those parts whereas the Priest may exercise his acts of office in euery part of the Christian world as bind or loose or preach or administer or ordaine also if he be therevnto called And if he be restrained from any of these it is Ecclesiâligante as your Tapper telleth vs and Viguerius and diuerse more quae ligat ligare which euen binds out binding and for orders sake confines that but to certaine places which is indifferent to all by primitiue ordination See your selfe of this point cap. 2. numb 50. 52. Whosoeuer is Pastor in any one part of the Church is capable of Pastorall iurisdiction in any other though he be restrained to auoid confusion And Basil saies of Athanasius pag. 304. of the Greeke by Frobenius for the Epistles are not numbred That hee takes no lesse care for the whole Church or rather all the Churches then that which was specially committed to him by our Lord. So Chrysostome sayes of the Priest that he is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the father of the whole world Where by the way also you may see the vanitie of your reason which you magnifie so much when the Councell of Chalcedon calls the Pope their father Which is no more then Chrysostome giues to euery Minister to be father of the whole Church though not in authoritie yet in louing care 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is all that the Councell sayes there of Leo and explaines it selfe by beneuolentiam praeferens of which happily hereafter The same Chrysostome againe Epist 176. ad Paeanium twice attributes as much to him to be rector or rectifyer as he there speakes of the whole world And doth not S. Hierome beginne his Epistle ad Salvinianam so that the care of euery Christian belongs vnto him as he is a minister of Gods Church pro officio Sacerdotij that their good proceeding is his glory S. Salvian also ad Salon l. 1. adv Avar. Ad fidei meae curā pertinet as if not his Charities onely nequid ecclesiastici operis vacillare permittā When S. Chrysost went into banishmēt you may please to remēber how the Monks saluted him that the sun might sooner loose his light thē his vertue be eclipsed yet I hope his iurisdiction did not stretch in your opiniō as farre as the sunne which if Patareus Apollo had but said of Sylverius you would presently haue concluded in fauour of him I omit many things to come to an ende Of Iustinians Constitutions about matter of faith directed to the Bishops sometime of Rome sometime of Constantinople which you so often tell vs of Doe you see therefore what power the Emperour had in spirituall causes to giue forth Constitutions That Agapetus deposed Anthimus and set vp Menas but causa perorata apud Iustinianum Iustinian hauing first the hearing of the cause by his authoritie no doubt though a Bishop was vsed to sentence a Bishop as was most meete far forme Like as Menas was preferred to Anthimus his place but how as a speciall fauorite of Iustinian saith the storie and so you may be sure by his direction That Agapetus his iudgement of Anthimus was faine to be scanned in a Councell of Constantinople gathered for that purpose by the Emperor before the proceedings of a Pope could giue satisfaction to the Church That Patarensis doth not excuse Bishops in generall from the Emperours censure as you would haue it but onely mooues him to shew respect to Sylverius for the amplitude of his place And lastly the Emperour as he binds him ouer to triall to see whether he were guiltie of treason or no so if he were found guiltie he forbids him Rome which shewes that the Pope and Rome may be two and bodes but ill as if some Emperour one day or Imperiall man should make the diuorce On the other fide it sets out Iustinians praise that was content to punish treason so moderately as not vtterly to take his Bishopricke from him but onely to send him packing to Palmaria or Fonicusa as now they call it Lastly whereas he reuerenced you say the Sea Apostolick let them perish hardly that reuerence not the very place where the doue hath troad fleeing to the windowes but with meete proportion because corrupted since To the second Chapter about sundrie passages in the Councell of Chalcedon IN the Romane discipline when of fendours were many they vsed a course call'd Decimation to chastise euery tenth person onely for the misdemeanour of a multitude So must I herafter but point as it were at euery tenth soloecisme which occurres in the perusing of the Adioynder it beeing hard I graunt for any to auoid faults in multiloquio as the wise man tells vs but specially for him as I should thinke who so purposely studieth it as if he meant to oppresse vs with a flood of tearmes and wearie the Reader whome he cannot perswade Wherein he could not shew himselfe more aduerse to his aduersarie whose praise is compendiousnes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 like the gold coynes that include great worth in small compasse and Timantus pictures presenting more to the minde then to the eye § 2. And for so much as I haue professed as the truth is that my taske now was to iustifie the allegations onely of the Bishops booke against such idle scruples as this man casts in euery where hauing shewed as I may say by the blow in the forehead so by this first encounter that if neede were I could take more aduantage and rippe vp this Golias this bulke of paper as the other was of flesh to his greater shame I will now proceede with all possible breuitie § 3. About the Bishops allegation of the Councell of Chalcedon the 28. Canon partly he struggles to shift it off
What then though the same in another place be done vpon all that is the Church is said to be built vpon all the Apostles and all to receiue the Keyes of the kingdome of heauen and the strength of the Church to be equally grounded vpon them all Yet indeede one is chosen among the twelue that a Head beeing appointed occasion of schisme might be cut off Is this no cooling card to the other authoritie For you that tell vs of dice I may doe well to speake to you in a sutable metaphore and not abhorring from your trade As the Philosophers say the braine in a mans bodie tempers the heat of the heart beneath so doe not the words precedent allay the force of these latter which yet the Cardinall onely set before vs For the threefold equalitie which S. Hierome before ascribed to all the Apostles one of their equall interest in the foundation another in the keyes of the kingdome of heauen and the third which is reiterated for deeper impression of bearing the whole strength or stresse of the Church leaues onely now this sense of caput that Peter was chosen to haue such a kind of Headship that is of prioritie among the twelue as should not derogate from paritie and yet exclude schisme or garboyle or confusion Which is the primacie of order that we haue often told you of and you would faine diuert to a primacie of Maiestie I could not answer your fallacie in a directer fashion yet I know you haue replies as that caput in the last place addes great force to super quem fundata est in the first Which we remit to the iudgement of the indifferent Reader whether so many equalities yeelded to the Apostles in the words afore doe not rather force vs to construe caput as hath beene sayd not derogating from the equality of their power in the keyes nor from bearing the groundworke of the Church ioyntly that is as you construe it from beeing gouernours thereof Besides that Caput is onely a borrowed word and signifies primum or the first in that kinde which we grant to Peter with all readines and lastly tempered with such a modest clause to keepe out schisme or disorder onely § 9. You say there is more daunger of schisme nowe then among the twelue For they were confirmed by speciall grace we not so And therefore they were not so likely to runne into schisme for which they should haue a head As though Paul and Barnabas were not running into a schisme a paroxysme at least that is the first grudging of the other ague as though when Peter confirmed his brethren tu confirma Luk. 22. 32. they had the lesse vse of him as their head against a schisme And though the will of God be to confirme some here yet not without meanes neither at first to rectifie them nor afterward to continue them in their good course to the ende Of which meanes this might be one of which S. Hierome speakes Was any man more confirmed then S. Paul rapt into the third heauen c. yet he struggles with his nature least preaching to others he should be a reprobate himselfe So here Besides that this schisme which our Sauiour preuented by appointing an Head as S. Hierome saies might be schisma populorum not Apostolorum and therefore he saies vt occasio schismat is tolleretur that the Christian people seeing who was eminent in the Colledge of the Apostles might not euery one rashly set vp their principall and so fall into schisme § 10. But at least we neede a Head now a daies as much as they As if we haue not our Head in our manifold regiments Dedit quosdam pastores Eph. 4. Obedite praepositis Hebr. 13. Terribilis sicut castrorum acies ordinata and so forth Is there no Head but of an vniuersall Bishop yea theirs was of order onely and to shun confusion ours of power and commands subiection Besides Kings and Princes which God hath giuen to our times as to feede his Church and to giue them milke which very milke is Discipline so to bring home wanderers from the high waies and the hedges to the feast of the great King that 's to suppresse schismes as S. Austen often but namely contra Gaudent l. 1. c. 25. § 11. For where you tell vs that Princes may cause these schismes themselues and so contemning spirituall censure and proceedings must either be hampered with another coerciue power extending to bodies and to estates or els all runne to nothing and the Church be cleane extinguished you bewray your spirit sufficiently and a man may read your drifts in your forehead which at another time you would so faine couer and smooth ouer Sermo tuus indicat te may be our speech to the Pseudo-Peter as was once to the true Doe you thinke then that S. Hierome would giue this leaue to Priests or the Prince of Priests as you would haue him to bind Kings in materiall chaynes and to load their Senators with such iron fetters as no metaphore hath mollified to vse such other violence as commonly goes herewith Though of you I lesse wonder if you giue them iron in their chaynes to whome you haue giuen it in their crownes as Clement to Charles if Platina say true in Clem. 7. But to S. Hierome How then does he construe these words of Dauid Against thee onely haue I sinned to haue been spoken in that sense because Dauid was a King and not to be proceeded against by any temporall punishment or coactiue hand of a mortall man How does he say in his Epistle to Heliodore de obitu Nepotiani that a King rules men against their wills a Bishop no farther then they will themselues They subdue by feare these are giuen vs for seruice and many the like How does Basil vpon the 37. Psalme 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and he knew his power as he bore his name A King is subiect to no iudge How does Chrysostome professe so often that he can goe no further then words 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Shepheard though he be yet he may not fling a stone at a wolfe but rate him onely 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. Again in his 2. de Sacerd. c. 2. 3. at large againe in the Homil. which is not extant in Greeke but in Latin onely Cum ageretur de expulsione S. Iohannis Statis omnes non ferro sed fide deuincti Tom. 5. And in Act. Apost hom 3. in Morali the people to the Minister are not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 not subiect to him or in his hands but hauing their obedience free in their owne power Againe in the same place within a fewe lines 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Magistrates rule by feare so doe not these viz. the Ministers And yet more frankly 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 There things are caried by order and by appointment here
Apostle bestowes it and the Archbishop of Ravenna in one of the Councells was honoured by the same style So cleane is petra Christi beside your purpose either as too little or too much § 24. Of S. Chrysostomes testimonie we haue said enough before to your first chapter Vertex and Princeps is found too light Magister orbis is not Monarchae orbis And for all S. Iames his Be not many masters in this case many Masters were sent out into the world whereof Iames was one Yea Chrysostome himselfe as Theodorus entitles him Nothing cleerer with Chrysostome in the place you quote then that all the Apostles had the charge of the whole world 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 You will tell vs I know of Peters ordinarie power But in all antiquitie we finde no such difference And yet another testimonie of Chrysostome we haue cited to you els-where out of his Comment vpon the Acts affirming that Peter did nothing by way of authoritie in ordering Church-businesse What can be plainer § 25. As for Iames his beeing onely Bishop of Hierusalem as if that might disparage him in comparison of Peter it was not because his power was narrower then Peters for our Sauiour confined not Iames to Hierusalem but priuate election but to shew that S. Iames abode there as thinking his paines best employed in that place Peter in the meane while trauelling farther into the world In the 3. of ler. 17. v. one would thinke Hierusalem the higher seat thē Rome besides that it was our Sauiours prouince as I told you and so perhaps to be preferred in that respect So farre is Peter from any excellence aboue Iames. § 26. I might passe by your argument out of the 44. Psalme In stead of fathers thou shalt haue children whome thou maist make Princes in all lands Suppose first that this were Monarchicall princehood or a princehood of power of maiestie and of authoritie which is nothing lesse for Ite praedicate carries no such commission Yet then they were sent into all the world then they were made Princes in all lands But whatsoeuer it be what is this to Peter Is it not common to all does it not extend to all And not onely Peter is not designed to be he but no one Prince magnified before another though we should graunt the singularitie to be his if anies And shall all the Apostles now haue their successors shall all their authorities be conueied to after-commers I had thought Peters onely had beene permanent Yet here of all Pro patribus tuis nascentur filij euery Apostle hath his sonne his successor and euery ones sonne is made a Prince throughout all the world You will say perhaps it makes for temporall power in the Episcopall calling though not for Peters successors in speciall But to omit that Princehood here is regnare verbo and regnare praconio in which sense Virgil saies a diligent husbandman imperat aruis as a King at his worke and in his calling though homely You may remember that Chrysostome and Theodoret turne it another way to the Apostles succeeding the Patriarkes not to the Bishops succeeding the Apostles Though he that considers the tenure of the place and how the holy Ghost speakes to the Church there in the person of her husband the Lord Iesus will soone resolue it to beare this sense vnder correction that as young brides that are loath to leaue their parents yet for loue of their husband and hope of issue are content to abandon their owne natiue home c. So should shee Hespere qui coelo lucet crudelior ignis Qui natam poscas complexu avellere matris Yet this for Christs sake and for the great reward Therefore it followes Then shall the King haue pleasure in thy beautie and in stead of thy parents thou shalt haue children euen royall children whome thou maist make Princes in all lands Whome we may construe to be the faithfull and beleeuers in generall who are Kings Priests apoc 1. a royall priesthood S. Peter himselfe calling them so not the Apostles onely or their proper heires the Ministers And to recall you to a place Sir of your owne citing before Esa 32. Princeps digna Principe eogitabit a Prince will deuise of things worthie of a Prince Their princehood then beeing thus as I haue described you must looke they should content themselues therewith not moyle with temporall matters impertinent Whereunto euen that perswades which you touch vpon soone after in the same number viz. 43. that Dauid faies of them in the 19. Psalme Sonus eorum their sound is gone out into all worlds and their words as you read it into the boundes of the earth For by them they rule by words and by sound not by forcible engines Whereas happily if the Pope should domineer no farther then his voice were heard or his sound went out preaching especially not onely a bulls hide might measure out his territories as they say of Carthage but ere a taper were cleane burnt out wee might get forth of his cōfines with greater ease I suppose then Pius quintus his nephew did when his Vnkle once discharged him in such a sort vpon displeasure § 27. Nought remaines that I know of to be cleared in this Chapter but your doubtie collection vpon the Bishops words If the twelue had a head to preuent schisme as S. Hierome saies or if a head may be appointed ouer a competent number that he can conueniently prouide for and the same endued with a power proportionable as the Bishop graunts much more had we neede of one after the Church is so multiplied c. to exclude the disorders which are likelier to arise betweene many then few To which I answer That we are not so destitute of a Head as F. T. imagines nay of many subordinations of heads and gouernours not without reference to a Principall though we intertaine no Pope The Deacons to the Priests the Priests to the Bishop the Bishop must be subiect to Christ saies Ignatius euen as he is to his father and Pope he knowes none Dionysius also will shew you how the Church is raunged in his Epistle ad Demophilum where he makes the scala thus from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as they call it or the last pitch is in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the coordinate faithfull not one but many So the prime in Christendome for we denie not a prime with his Synode of Bishops as the Councells both of Basil and Constance would haue it though the Iesuites repugne may serue for that vse in the Church of God not to call for Constantine which Peter emong the twelue Though Peter was the apter to be trusted with that place principium actionis
Flavianus good demeanure and other such considerations then the Popes sentence or bare definition For then what neede long time to worke it Neither was that a signe of Damasus his supremacie that Flavianus sent his embassage to Rome For when two are to meete why should not the inferiour come to the superiour rather then otherwise I meane inferiour in order as Flavianus here to Damasus Antioch to Rome but not in authoritie Though the embassage was not intended so much to Damasus as to cleere the scandall that went of Flavian and to satisfie the whole Church of God in those parts that East and West might no longer continue in iealousie and alienation § 26. And now to come to his successor Syricius as your owne words are how doe you prooue his vniuersall iurisdiction I know it wrings you to be held to this point but there is no remedy to that you must speake Forsooth the Councell of Capua committed the hearing of Flauianus his cause to the Bishop of Alexandria and the Bishop of Egypt with this limitation as S. Ambrose witnesses I report your owne words that the approbation and confirmation of their sentence should be reserued to the Roman sea and the Bishop thereof who was then Syricius Suppose this were so how farre is it from arguing vniuersall iurisdiction For as the Councell might make choice of the Bishop of Alexandria and the Bishops of Egypt to take the first knowledge of Flavianus his cause into their hands so out of the same authoritie might it reserue the after iudgement and the vp shot of all to the Bishop of Rome it might doe this I say out of it owne libertie and for the personall worth of Syricius Pope not for any prerogatiue of his Sea And rather it shewes the preheminence of the Councell that might depute the Pope to such a busines as likewise the Bishop of Alexandria and Egypt The Eusebians made an offer witnes Athanasius in his Apologie to Iulius Pope of Rome to be their iudge if he thought good Iulio si vellet arbitrium causae detulerunt But if Iulius had no other hold it was a poore supremacie that might content him Yet Ambrose in the Epistle 78. which you quote saies not so much Rather of Theophilus somewhat magnificently Vt duobus istis tuae sanctitatis examen impartiretur confidentibus Aegyptijs that your Holines might haue the scanning of these mens cause while the Bishops of Egypt were your assessors And againe Sancta Synodus cognitionis ius unanimitati tuae caeterisque ex Aegypto consacerdotibus nostris commisit The holy Synod of Capua committed the power of iudging this matter to your agreement and the Egyptian Bishops What then of the Pope Sanè referendum arbitramur ad sanctum fratrem nostrum Romanae sacerdotem Ecclesiae Sure we are of the minde that it were good it were referred to our holy brother the Priest of Rome First brother then Priest of Rome lastly arbitramur The Synod belike not ordering so but Ambrose giuing his opinion thus And Quoniam praesumimus te ea iudicaturum quae etiam illi displicere nequeant because we presume you will resolue in such manner as shall not be displeasing to him See you how one of them is as free from error as the other in S. Ambrose minde And he is content that Syricius should haue the cognusance of the cause after Theophilus not that Theophilus errour might be corrected by Syricius but that ones concurrence might strengthen the other § 27. Doe you looke I should answer to Syricius Decretall sent to Himerius or does the conueying of it to France and Portugall prooue vniuersall iurisdiction exercised by the Popes in S. Austens time But with such baggage you make vp your measure Himerius askt and Syricius answers What then And Himerius was within the Romane Patriarchship caput corporis tai not caput corporis vniuersalis saies Syricius himselfe in the ende of his Rescript But proceede Optatus say you calls Peter principem nostrum our Prince Now he could not meane Peter to be that Prince for he was dead and gone and so nothing worth Therefore Siricius who then liued and was his successor in the Popedome Brauely shott and like a Sadducee Yet in the same booke Optatus calls Siricius in plaine tearmes not princeps noster but socius noster our frend and fellow as S. Ambrose a little before his brother and priest § 28. That in the African Councell Can. 35. the Fathers decreed that letters should be sent to their brethren and fellow-Bishops abroad but especially to Anastasius to informe them how necessary their latter decree was in fauour of the Donatists contradicting a former Canon made against them what is that to Anastasius his vniuersall iurisdiction Doe you see how you are choaked if you be but held to the point yet they sent to others no lesse then to Anastasius But to him especially you say It might be so for the eminencie of his Sea as we haue often told you And the Donatists beeing too strong for them as appeares by that decree which controules the former they were glad to take any aduantage I warrant you to countenance their proceedings Durum telum necessitas est § 29. That the Bishops of Africa requested Innocentius to vse his authoritie to the confirmation of their statutes against the Pelagian heretiques it was not because the ordinances of prouinciall Synods are not good in their precincts without the Pope as I thinke your selues will not denie but that the Pelagian heresie beeing farre spread throughout the world might be curbed within the places that Innocentius had to doe in as well as in Africk where the Councel was held Which taking so good effect as it seems it did S. Austen cries out that they were toto Christiano orbe damnati condemned ouer all the Christian world not that Innocentius authoritie was irrefragable but the concurrence of so many Pastors in the cause of Gods truth was of force at that time to rectifie the consciences of such as wauered before In this sense Possidius might well call it iudicium catholicae dei Ecclesie the iudgement of the Catholique Church of God when Innocentius Zoâ—â—mus accursed the Pelagians because it sprang from the consent of so many godly Fathers as incited those Popes to that act of iustice and lead them the way in this daunce of zeale as I may so call it Not that the Church stood in them two or as if they had the vniuersall iurisdiction that he talkes of or rather dares not talke of but captiously and crookedly inuolues onely in impertinent allegations § 30. I might spend time about S. Austens authoritie Epist 92. writing thus to Innocentius That the Lord hath placed thee in sede Apostolicâ And doth this prooue vniuersall iurisdiction or is there no Apostolique sea but the Romane By which reason wee shall haue many vniuersall iurisdictions Or that it were negligence to coÌ„ceale ought from his
base flatterers lend their hand to vnmanly butcheries vpon euery hope of Quid mihi dabis and good men are promiscuously massacred and made away Wherefore S. Austen saies more particularly in the same place that Doeg signified Iudas the betrayer of our Lord who was a spirituall man not a temporall as you know And yet the original of Christs death proceeded from him not from Kings nor from Ciuill Magistrates which is worth your noting Though accomplished it could not be without Pilates faint concurrence and the rather that our Sauiour might shew his subiection to such a silly one onely for authorities sake In this sense the same Father Com. in Psal 1. makes earthly Kingdomes to be Cathedra pestilentiae the chaire of Pestilence though afterward he accommodate it to False Teachers rather that is to Churchmen Not that Ciuill princedome is so in it owne nature as Mr. Sanders would gladly haue it de Clave Dauid lib. 1. cap. 2. Quòd saecularis potest as non potissimum in laudando praemijs afficiendo sed in occidendo vitam auferendo vim suam ostentet which is starke false and trayterous but when abused to tyrannie and to iniquitie It is called the Chaire of Pestilence saies he because the pestilence is a disease that rages generally and sweepes away whole multitudes with it where it comes And so this is a vice that euery bodie is sicke of desire of preheminence ambition and vaine glorie Regis quisque animum habet as the Poet could say more Kinging stinging then Kings themselues if they might be let alone though they complain of Kings Els we are not to doubt but S. Austen is of the same minde that Seneca seemes to be of lib. 2. de Benef. cap. 20. Quòd optimus civitatis status sit sub rege iusto and that Brutus was to blame for beeing wearie of Monarchies who was iustly therfore frighted with the apparition of a blacke dogge for his abhominable assasinate Yea S. Austen himselfe acknowledges as much in plaine tearmes lib. 20. contra Faust cap. 14. Ibi regna foelicia esse vbi omnium pleno consensu regibus obeditur That Kingdomes are there happie where all men obey the King with full consent § 80. To your mistaking of our Act of Parlament in your Num. 57. as if that gaue more power of censure to Kings thē the Reuerend Bishop in his grauest ponderation of these matters alloweth and so the King might excommunicate suspend c. I answer as before for you doe but goe ouer the same thing again as if we had neuer heard of it though nothing be more triuiall Excommunications are not coactions sauing onely as they are inflicted contra voluntatem personae And the Parlament giues power onely coactiue to the King though true it is that without his countenance their very Spirituall proceedings cannot well take place in a wanton age and a contemning nation And if the Kings of our Land may excommunicate by Parlament why neuer doe they so Why doe they let that sword to rust for lacke of vse If they may administer any Spirituall Iurisdiction whatsoeuer as you thinke they may by Act of Parlament why doe they neuer practise some specialties of it at one time or another neuer preach neuer baptize neuer consecrate Bishops c For you cannot say it is for lacke of leisure for leisure they haue as little to many Temporall businesses in their world of employments And some time at least would be set apart for these if it were but to keep their title in vre As for skill and sufficiencie you will neither disparage I hope the times past so much but that skill there was enough to indite a Censure though who knows not how many that might be borrowed of and for the fulnesse of perfection in all manner of faculties that are incident to the wit of man but especially of the Booke which is deliuered him vpon his Throne you may remember who gouernes at this day But no doubt Praxis Consuetudo est optima legū interpres they practise none of this no not in all their life time It is a signe therefore they challenge none by vertue of their Lawes though Parsons and Saunders and the Adioynder cry out neuer so loud that they doe for want of better matter to stuffe their pages and to abuse their Auditours § 81. THE last point of all is about the Bishops defending of those whome we call Puritanes against the scandalous imputation that Bellarmine chargeth them with of dissenting from the Supremacie Whereunto I haue spoken once before What can be more godly thē the Bishops practise to defend all that may be defended euen in the aduersaries themselues euen in them that gather with vs but in halfe to cherish if need be the dimme light and the drooping candle and the smoking flaxe after the example of our Sauiour As we read of Atticus Archbishop of Constantinople that he excused Nouatus and praised Asclepiades an old Bishop of the Nouatians not for loue of the sect I thinke but either to gaine the parties or as not turning from the truth though with aduantage to his aduersaries Socrat. l. 7. c. 25. But this part is handled somewhat crookedly by the Adioynder with cringings and wrenchings now for the Puritanes then against thē but all to bring preiudice to the good Bishop the Truth Howbeit nothing is more easie then the Answer to all The Puritanes saies he defend as good a Supremacy as the Bishop What then It may be that was the very ground of the Bishops assertion that the Reformed Churches maintaine the same opinion about the Supremacie all of them that we doe What shame then can arise to the Bishop from hence Is it not matter of praise and felicitie rather that we are all of vs of one mind in auouching the right that belongs to Kings and oppugning the Papists the opposers thereof But let vs heare his reason For they also say saies he that the King is to gouern and preserue the Church in externis c. And haue we not shewed before that as no bodie can reach to the interna properly by his immediat action not the Priest himselfe but only the holy Spirit of God so the Kings sword is as piercing as anothers to wound the soule and to mortifie vice and corruption in vs and to reforme vs to all pietie and newnesse of life the most part beeing readier to yeeld for feare then either to amend for conscience or for loue of vertue § 82. Neither is that so small a matter as the Adioynder would make of it where he saies the Bishop ioynes with the Puritanes that allow the King no more power ouer the Church then onely to maintaine it and to defend it For whatsoeuer the Puritanes opinion be of this matter which they may abridge in conceit after they haue enlarged in style no bodie
spiritualia autem in voluntate non in necessitate sic Principes spirituales Principatus corū in dilectione subditorum debet esse positus non in timore corporali Which last authoritie is cited by Bellarmine lib. 4. c. 21. de Pontif. Rom. you may wonder how he can digest it In English thus For as all carnall matters are subiect to force not to free liking and all spirituall matters to free liking not to force so are also spiritual superiours Their cheifdom or princehood ought to stand in the loue of such as are vnder thē not in their bodily feare c. Which bodily feare the Pope is wholly for driuing his subiects into and without that he is nothing But thus farre the Fathers because I spare the rest § 12. The Scriptures also banish vs from like forcible dealing in more thē one place if we had leisure to produce them The minister must be no striker The seruant of the Lord must be patient and long suffering expecting men till God giue thē a mind to returne home We wrastle not with flesh blood that is with materiall enemies No maruell then if the weapons of our warfare be not carnall nor materiall but spirituall Armastulti pastoris sunt gladius baculus Our commission is in our tongue 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that I may explaine that by the way We beare no rule ouer your faith that is ouer you the faithfull people of God like vestra Sanctitas limiting his power and preseruing his reuerence to the Christian people both in one Lastly we beseech you in Christs stead be reconciled vnto God Yet with you if there be no coaction all is marred § 13. You say that Bishops in their Courts mulct the purse and sometime imprison the bodies c. Though I thinke you are scarce perfect in this part of your lesson for I haue heard otherwise of a very sufficient Doctor yet suppose it were so This leaue comes of the King strengthning the arme of spirituall censure by that meanes least the prophane and wanton of the world should contemne it Originally there is no such power in a Bishop Will you then retort vpon the King with his owne license or vnnaturally gall him with his owne quils Is not this the way rather to spoile all and to disarme the Church of the royall protection § 14. You say that he which hath command of the soule hath also of the bodie And therefore the spirituall power which is acknowledged to be in the Minister drawes the temporall with it as a consequent Truely I graunt that he which can commaund the soule out of an absolute power it is likely the body is also subiect to him But neither the ministers power commaunds the soule by any forcible impression for as we cannot make one haire white or blacke so no more can we make one soule merrie or sad further then as God shall cooperate with our endeauours and the perswasions that we vse they are directed no lesse to the sauing of the bodie then to the gaining of the soule Both the Magistrate and the Minister deale both with the soule and the bodie But the Magistrate violently applies himselfe to the bodie to reclaime the soule if neede be and the Minister perswasiuely carries himselfe to the soule to the ende the bodie may be made pliant to righteousnesse Rom. 6. The proceeding not the subiect then is that which makes the difference betweene the two powers and howsoeuer your Casuists say a lame-handed man cannot regularly be made a Minister yet that is for Pashurs turning Magor-mishabibs Ier. 20. the kingdome that we send to as it is not built with hands so it requires no violence to conuey thither § 15. If in the nonage of the Church the Apostles were endued with power of punishing men corporally to the ende the Gospel should not be trampled vnderfoote by vnreuenged scornes yet now the Magistrate supplies that place beeing himselfe turned Christian and suppose that should faile and all things revolue to barbarous Heathenisme as in former time which God forbid yet we are to thinke that the like extraordinarie prouidence would still attend the Church but howsoeuer it were no priuate man might be too forward and much lesse a Minister which seemed then so inconuenient that the opposers were deliuered to the deuill to be tormented in defect of Magistrates rather then the Iesuiticall mutinies which F. T. here pleads for should take place § 16. THe substance of your Discourse beeing thus disprooued it were no hard matter to gather vp the spoyles and note certaine scapes of smaller importance In translating the Bishops words numb 22. Quod toties iam nobis seriò inculcat Cardinalis you handle it thus Which the Cardinall doth now so often and earnestly inculcate vnto vs. What thinke you of inculcate first you that muster the tearmes of the Bishop of Lincolnes booke for so hares may plucke dead lyons by the beard though nothing so vncouth as your Rhemish Testament hath Praepuce Sindon to Euangelize the orient c. But to omit that Does the Bishop meane that Bellarmine pleades earnestly in the case or rather maruell that hee is in earnest at all the argument beeing trifling and not worth the naming yet thus you say so often and earnestly as if SO might augment his earnestnes too Did you vnderstand the booke that you tooke in hand to confute And as this is your eloquence so view your conscience numb 27. you say the Bishops haue their proper talent of calumniating Bellarmine Againe calumniate as good a word as inculcate before And if common to both how proper to either yet you say both haue their proper talent Be like not quarto modo But Sir who taught you to call vices talents Is this your reuerence that you beare to Scripture or doe you so confound God with the deuill What remaines but you call grace chaffe and vertue cockle and the rest as your vngodly Rhetorique shall inspire you But well doe you fulfill the measures of your fathers 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the thunder bolts walke not as Nazianzen saies of them that abused S. Basil So Campian in the tower ieasting at his aduersaries for the weakenes of their argument said he could make as good sport about the Incarnation Another I thinke Rastall or but a letters difference at least paints his margent thus Luthers lying with a Nunne in the Lord. What vengeance remaines for such gracelesse companions And are these Diuines and handlers of Gods cause foming out such shame which were intollerable in him that followed the plowtaile Yet you haue vp with the Bishop and Eudaemon before you for his pleasant veyne forsooth in writing You may remember your iolly preface to Parsons Discussion which I touched at before If you had your will you would make vs daunce about another maypole without hose or doublet as
you did our forefathers while your power lasted Thanks be vnto God that hath shortned those dayes abridged your malice Yet Elias confounded Baals priests with a ieast and S. Chrysostome commenting vpon the 140. Psal bids vs make much of the frumpes of the godly which is your fault to haue profited no more by the Bishops kinde reproofes Yet in all the passages of that Reuerend man there is no one word contumelious to pietie or disgracefull to relligion or preiudiciall to grauity and good manners Whereas Sir Thomas More the champion for your Clergie as it were vicarius in spiritualibus he was such a buckler to the Bishops as Stapleton saies the common voyce was in those dayes yet he I say vndertaking the Churches cause wrote a booke so gamesome and so idly idle that dissembling his owne name he was faine to father it vpon Gulielmus Rossaeus a title that one of your fellowes hath taken vpon him of late to shroud his virulences vnder as he did his vanityes and lastly the great Philosopher kept a foole at home as the same Stapleton records to make him merry no doubt though his wit was able to prouoke laughter in others as full often it did And if More be of no more authority with you you may looke backe to your owne Cardinall that dry Child that sage Sobrino yet he excuses himselfe in one place of his controuersies a worke a man would thinke that did not fit so with mirth Ignoscat Lector quòd temridiculè Tilemannum exceperim Let the Reader pardon me for beeing so merrie or so pleasant with Tilemanne This he Yet because you haue descried such a veine in the Bishop as you thinke at least might you not haue answered your selfe touching that which you obiect to him here about Iouinian that it sauoured but of Ironie For what more fit to be hit in your teeth who euery where crake to vs of Iouinians heresies then when you bring that in earnest to countenance your Poperie which S. Hierome puts vpon Iouinian by supposall At dices tu Iouiniane scilicet Though the Bishop doth not challenge him for such an absolute Iouinianist but onely saies Probè in to secutus Iouinianum the Cardinall therein following Iouinian very handsomely Which words are enough to dissolue your cauill that the Bishop should lay absolute Iouinianisme to his charge which you say surpasses all impudencie Such a rustique you are an arrant clowne not discerning what is ieast and what is earnest Howbeit it will be hard for you to prooue Iouinian to haue beene an hereticke Epiphanius and Philastrius doe not recken him among the catalogue and they that may conclude him to haue held a falshood will finde some a doe to condemne him for an hereticks Neither is the meaning of that word by all agreed vpon neither doe all take it in euery place alike Yet because this scandall rests vpon Iouinian for the most part you may be pleased to remember Sir out of S. Austen what other monsters Iouinian fostered and therein if you thinke good compare his doctrine with ours As that all sinnes are in like degree heinous which is the Stoicall paradoxe no way cleauing to vs though you slaunder vs so vniustly for not holding veniall sinnes which Roffensis himselfe held not That fasting and abstinence profits nothing Can you charge vs with any such impietie That the regenerate man cannot sinne after baptisme wherein he comes neerer to you then to vs. As for your merits you may keepe them the badges of your insolencie and in you Sir of your ignorance not to know what merit meanes all this while Yet beware how you magnifie the Virgin against the married least the Councell of Gangra condemne you not for an hereticke now but a cursed hereticke Can. 20. giuing you 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 if you doe but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 though you condemne not marriage if you but swell out of the conceit of your single life And so Minutius Foelix most diuinely Inuiolati corporis virginitate fruimur potiùs quà m gloriamur After that he had said Vnius matrimonij vinculo libenter inhaeremus S. Chrysostome goes further If the perfection of Monkerie it selfe may not stand with marriage all is spoil'd See Comm. in ad Hebr. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in ipso fine And why should Virginitie then be exalted aboue marriage if the perfection of the strictest Monks themselues be compatible therewith And he closes his discourse with that diuine 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as Pindar saies should be taken 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a iunket alwaies in the ende of a feast 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. Vse marriage moderately and thou shalt be the very first in the kingdome of heauen Indeede therefore all the Saints are lodged in Abrahams bosome in the married mans bosome as the same Father cannot denie lib. de Virg. in extremo Once the Trinitie in his tent and now the Saints in his bosome Yet still the married man and not the worse for his marriage As for the rewards of the faithfull that they are not equall in the heauen that we looke for and that the sacred Virgin suffered no decay of her maidenly honour by the stainlesse and immaculate birth of our Sauiour let Iouinian thinke what he will though S. Hierome neuer imputes this latter to Iouinian in the 2. books that he wrote against him yet not onely you but troupes in the English Church so teach And would the time giue leaue is there not a Montane and a Tatian to make you blush for your abhominable heresies about meates and marriages as well as you haue a Iouinian to twitt vs withall But because I now onely assoyle the Bishop from your wicked slaunders it is well his integritie hath so acquitted him without me that your selfe dare not speake of him but with It may be and Except such a hooke his fame hath put in your nostrills who onely in this may be resembled to Iouinian to Paphnutius rather that in single life he defends the libertie of other folkes marriages But hast we to an ende § 17. To the other places of S. Hierome as Matth. 16. which in great good will you aduise the Bishop to read ouer forsooth what saith S. Hierome there That our Sauiours dicere is facere his saying is doing therefore calling Peter a rocke he made him so But I hope good Sir as doing and saying went together in our Lord so both of them in his owne meaning not in your mistaking What is this then to prooue Peters Monarchie or smaller regencie either if such could content you And if it could yet it were hard I say to boult it out of this place of S. Hierome where no syllable of authoritie or power once appearing for explanation sake as reason was if you meant to speede he saies onely that Peter for beleeuing in the rocke our Sauiour bespake him and yet not properly but in