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power_n bishop_n call_v presbyter_n 3,415 5 10.3134 5 false
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A78958 The papers which passed at Nevv-Castle betwixt His sacred Majestie and Mr Alex: Henderson concerning the change of church-government. Anno Dom. 1646. Charles I, King of England, 1600-1649.; Henderson, Alexander, 1583?-1646. aut; Marshall, William, fl. 1617-1650, engraver. 1649 (1649) Wing C2535A; ESTC R213547 25,945 67

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that_o all_o these_o congregation_n be_v under_o one_o presbyterial_a government_n because_o they_o be_v for_o government_n one_o church_n act_n 11._o 22_o 26._o and_o because_o that_o church_n be_v govern_v by_o elder_n act_n 11._o 30._o which_o be_v elder_n of_o that_o church_n and_o do_v meet_v together_o for_o act_n of_o government_n and_o the_o apostle_n themselves_o in_o that_o meeting_n act_n 15._o act_v not_o as_o apostle_n but_o as_o elder_n state_v the_o question_n debate_v it_o in_o the_o ordinary_a way_n of_o disputation_n and_o have_v by_o search_n of_o scripture_n find_v the_o will_n of_o god_n they_o conclude_v it_o seem_v good_a to_o the_o holy_a ghost_n and_o we_o which_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o learned_a may_v be_v speak_v by_o any_o assembly_n upon_o like_o evidence_n of_o scripture_n the_o like_a presbyterian_a government_n have_v place_n in_o the_o church_n of_o corinth_n ephesus_n thessalonica_n etc._n etc._n in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o 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time_n 2._o concerning_o baptism_n a_o private_a person_n may_v perform_v the_o external_a action_n and_o rite_n both_o of_o it_o and_o of_o the_o eucharist_n yet_o be_v neither_o of_o the_o two_o a_o sacrament_n or_o have_v any_o efficacy_n unless_o it_o be_v do_v by_o he_o that_o be_v lawful_o call_v thereunto_o or_o by_o a_o person_n make_v public_a and_o clothe_v with_o authority_n by_o ordination_n this_o error_n in_o the_o matter_n of_o baptism_n be_v beget_v by_o another_o error_n of_o the_o absolute_a necessity_n of_o baptism_n 7._o to_o that_o which_o have_v be_v say_v concerning_o your_o majesty_n oath_n i_o shall_v add_v nothing_o not_o be_v willing_a to_o enter_v upon_o the_o question_n of_o the_o subordination_n of_o the_o church_n to_o the_o civil_a power_n whether_o to_o king_n or_o parliament_n or_o both_o and_o to_o either_o of_o they_o in_o their_o own_o place_n such_o a_o headship_n as_o the_o king_n of_o england_n have_v claim_v and_o such_o a_o supremacy_n as_o the_o house_n of_o parliament_n crave_v with_o appeal_v from_o the_o supreme_a ecclesiastical_a judicature_n to_o they_o as_o set_v over_o
my_o reason_n nor_o do_v i_o conceive_v how_o 1_o cor._n 2._o 5._o can_v be_v apply_v to_o this_o purpose_n for_o there_o saint_n paul_n only_o show_v the_o difference_n between_o divine_a and_o human_a eloquence_n make_v no_o mention_n of_o any_o kind_n of_o interpretation_n throughout_o the_o whole_a chapter_n as_o indeed_o saint_n peter_n do_v 2_o pet._n 1._o 20._o which_o i_o conceive_v make_v for_o i_o for_o since_o that_o no_o prophecy_n of_o scripture_n be_v of_o any_o private_a interpretation_n first_o i_o infer_v that_o scripture_n be_v to_o be_v interpret_v for_o else_o the_o apostle_n will_v have_v omit_v the_o word_n private_a second_o that_o at_o least_o the_o consent_n of_o many_o learned_a divine_n be_v necessary_a and_o so_o à_fw-la fortiore_fw-la that_o of_o the_o catholic_a church_n aught_o to_o be_v a_o authentic_a judge_n when_o man_n differ_v and_o be_v it_o a_o good_a argument_n because_o mat._n 4._o 4._o 7._o 10._o scripture_n be_v best_a interpret_v by_o itself_o therefore_o that_o all_o other_o interpretation_n be_v unlawful_a certainfull_a you_o can_v think_v thus_o have_v show_v you_o that_o we_o differ_v about_o the_o meaning_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o be_v like_a to_o do_v so_o certain_o there_o ought_v to_o be_v for_o this_o as_o well_o as_o other_o thing_n a_o rule_n or_o a_o judge_n between_o we_o to_o determine_v our_o difference_n or_o at_o least_o to_o make_v our_o probation_n and_o argument_n relevant_a therefore_o evade_n for_o this_o time_n to_o answer_v your_o 6_o consideration_n not_o i_o assure_v you_o for_o the_o difficulty_n of_o they_o but_o the_o start_n of_o new_a question_n i_o desire_v you_o only_o to_o show_v i_o a_o better_a than_o what_o i_o have_v offer_v unto_o you_o newcastle_n july_n 3._o 1646._o c._n r._n for_o mr._n alex_n henderson_n a_o particular_a answer_n to_o mr._n alex_n hendersons_n july_n 3._o 16._o 1646._o his_o majesty_n five_o paper_n until_o you_o shall_v find_v out_o a_o fit_a way_n to_o decide_v our_o difference_n in_o opinion_n concerning_o interpretation_n of_o scripture_n than_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o father_n and_o the_o universal_a practice_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n i_o can_v but_o pass_v you_o my_o judgement_n anent_o those_o 6_o consideration_n which_o you_o offer_v to_o invalidate_v those_o authority_n that_o i_o so_o much_o reverence_n 1._o in_o the_o first_o you_o mention_v two_o rule_n for_o define_v of_o controversy_n and_o seek_v a_o most_o old_a way_n to_o confute_v they_o as_o i_o think_v for_o you_o allege_v that_o there_o be_v more_o attribute_v to_o they_o than_o i_o believe_v you_o can_v prove_v by_o the_o consent_n of_o most_o learned_a man_n there_o be_v no_o question_n but_o there_o be_v always_o some_o flatter_a fool_n that_o can_v commend_v nothing_o but_o with_o hyperpolick_a expression_n and_o you_o know_v that_o supposito_fw-la quolibet_fw-la sequitur_fw-la quidlibet_fw-la beside_o do_v you_o think_v that_o albeit_o some_o 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error_n be_v always_o breed_v in_o the_o church_n i_o shall_v not_o deny_v it_o yet_o that_o make_v little_a as_o i_o conceive_v to_o your_o purpose_n but_o if_o your_o meaning_n be_v to_o accuse_v the_o universal_a practice_n of_o the_o church_n with_o error_n i_o must_v say_v it_o be_v a_o very_a bold_a undertake_n and_o if_o you_o can_v justify_v yourself_o by_o clear_a place_n in_o scripture_n much_o to_o be_v blame_v wherein_o you_o must_v not_o allege_v that_o to_o be_v universal_o receive_v which_o be_v not_o as_o i_o dare_v say_v that_o the_o controversy_n about_o free_a will_n be_v never_o yet_o decide_v by_o ecumenical_a or_o general_n council_n nor_o must_v you_o presume_v to_o call_v that_o a_o error_n which_o real_o the_o catholic_a church_n maintain_v as_o in_o rite_n of_o baptism_n form_n of_o prayer_n observation_n of_o feast_n fast_n etc._n etc._n except_o you_o can_v prove_v it_o so_o by_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o it_o be_v not_o enough_o to_o say_v that_o such_o a_o thing_n be_v not_o warrant_v by_o the_o apostle_n but_o you_o must_v prove_v by_o their_o doctrine_n that_o such_o a_o thing_n be_v unlawful_a or_o else_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n be_v warrant_n enough_o for_o i_o to_o follow_v and_o obey_v that_o custom_n whatsoever_o it_o be_v and_o think_v it_o good_a and_o shall_v believe_v that_o the_o apostle_n creed_n be_v make_v by_o they_o such_o reverence_n i_o bear_v to_o the_o church_n tradition_n until_o other_o author_n be_v certain_o find_v out_o 5._o i_o be_v teach_v that_o de_fw-fr posse_fw-la ad_fw-la esse_fw-la be_v no_o good_a argument_n and_o indeed_o to_o i_o it_o be_v incredible_a that_o any_o custom_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v erroneous_a which_o be_v not_o contradict_v by_o orthodox_a learned_a man_n in_o the_o time_n of_o their_o first_o practice_n as_o be_v easy_o perceive_v that_o all_o those_o defection_n be_v some_o of_o they_o may_v be_v just_o call_v rebellion_n which_o you_o mention_n 6._o i_o deny_v it_o be_v impossible_a though_o i_o confess_v it_o difficult_a to_o come_v to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o universal_a consent_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n therefore_o i_o confess_v a_o man_n ought_v to_o be_v careful_a how_o to_o believe_v thing_n of_o this_o nature_n wherefore_o i_o conceive_v this_o to_o be_v only_o a_o argument_n for_o caution_n my_o conclusion_n be_v that_o albeit_o i_o never_o esteem_v any_o authority_n equal_a to_o the_o scripture_n yet_o i_o do_v think_v the_o unanimous_a consent_n of_o the_o father_n and_o the_o universal_a practice_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n to_o be_v the_o best_a and_o most_o authentical_a interpreter_n of_o god_n word_n and_o consequent_o the_o fit_a judge_n between_o i_o and_o you_o when_o we_o differ_v until_o you_o shall_v find_v i_o better_o for_o example_n i_o think_v you_o for_o the_o present_a the_o best_a preacher_n in_o newcastle_n yet_o i_o believe_v you_o may_v err_v and_o possible_o a_o better_a preacher_n may_v come_v but_o till_o then_o must_v retain_v my_o opinion_n newcastle_n july_n 16._o 1646._o c._n r._n the_o end_n
infallible_a for_o bilson_n i_o remember_v well_o what_o opinion_n the_o king_n my_o father_n have_v of_o he_o for_o those_o opinion_n and_o how_o he_o show_v he_o some_o favour_n in_o hope_n of_o his_o recantation_n as_o his_o good_a nature_n make_v he_o do_v many_o thing_n of_o that_o kind_n but_o whether_o he_o do_v or_o not_o i_o can_v say_v to_o conclude_v this_o point_n until_o you_o shall_v prove_v this_o position_n by_o the_o word_n of_o god_n as_o i_o will_v regal_a authority_n i_o shall_v think_v all_o popular_a reformation_n little_o better_o than_o rebellion_n for_o i_o hold_v that_o no_o authority_n be_v lawful_a but_o that_o which_o be_v either_o direct_o give_v or_o at_o least_o approve_v by_o god_n 2_o concerning_o the_o english_a reformation_n the_o first_o reason_n you_o bring_v why_o q._n elizabeth_n do_v not_o finish_v it_o be_v because_o she_o take_v not_o away_o episcopacy_n the_o hit_v of_o reason_n against_o which_o government_n you_o say_v i_o take_v no_o 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