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power_n authority_n church_n key_n 4,079 5 9.8284 5 false
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A85045 A discourse of the visible church. In a large debate of this famous question, viz. whether the visible church may be considered to be truely a church of Christ without respect to saving grace? Affirm. Whereunto is added a brief discussion of these three questions. viz. 1. What doth constitute visible church-membership. 2. What doth distinguish it, or render it visible. 3. What doth destroy it, or render it null? Together with a large application of the whole, by way of inference to our churches, sacraments, and censures. Also an appendix touching confirmation, occasioned by the Reverend Mr. Hanmore his pious and learned exercitation of confirmation. By Francis Fulwood minister of the gospel at West-Alvington in Devon. Fullwood, Francis, d. 1693. 1658 (1658) Wing F2500; Thomason E947_3; ESTC R207619 279,090 362

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exercise_v the_o matter_n for_o which_o person_n though_o baptize_v be_v to_o be_v deny_v the_o supper_n or_o the_o ground_n of_o deny_v the_o same_o to_o such_o person_n the_o formal_a ground_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o the_o power_n itself_o by_o which_o the_o church_n deni_v the_o sacrament_n to_o such_o the_o ground_n on_o which_o this_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v build_v so_o that_o the_o present_a discourse_n be_v visible_o engage_v upon_o these_o two_o question_n quest_n 1._o what_o be_v the_o just_a and_o lawful_a cause_n for_o which_o the_o church_n may_v deny_v the_o sacrament_n to_o baptize_v person_n quest._n 2._o on_o what_o be_v this_o power_n of_o the_o church_n to_o deny_v the_o sacrament_n upon_o such_o cause_n fix_v or_o whence_o be_v it_o take_v or_o derive_v quest_n 1._o first_o then_o what_o be_v the_o just_a and_o lawful_a cause_n of_o deny_v the_o sacrament_n to_o baptize_v person_n i_o answer_v that_o these_o cause_n be_v either_o privative_a viz._n the_o want_n of_o some_o necessary_a qualification_n conditional_a to_o this_o communion_n or_o positive_a viz._n some_o apparent_a ill_a quality_n or_o blemish_n for_o which_o a_o person_n though_o baptize_v aught_o to_o be_v debar_v from_o this_o communion_n the_o first_o be_v more_o eminent_o note_v in_o 1_o cor._n 11._o and_o the_o latter_a in_o 1_o cor._n 5._o the_o first_o may_v be_v term_v unworthiness_n 1_o cor._n 11._o 29._o the_o latter_a wickedness_n or_o scandal_n 1_o cor._n 5._o ult_n person_n under_o the_o first_o of_o these_o may_v be_v think_v to_o be_v unfit_a and_o to_o be_v keep_v off_o upon_o principle_n of_o care_n and_o merciful_a caution_n person_n under_o the_o latter_a may_v be_v think_v to_o be_v und_fw-ge eserve_v and_o to_o be_v cast_v out_o upon_o principle_n of_o justice_n the_o first_o be_v therefore_o rather_o not_o to_o be_v admit_v ratione_fw-la cautelae_fw-la who_o suspension_n call_v
same_o ground_n viz._n without_o a_o censure_n may_v it_o not_o answ_n i_o must_v have_v leave_n to_o speak_v my_o mind_n and_o to_o say_v it_o do_v not_o follow_v indeed_o there_o seem_v to_o be_v the_o same_o reason_n for_o both_o have_v not_o god_n in_o scripture_n otherwise_o dispose_v i_o affirm_v that_o person_n find_v ignorant_a may_v be_v deniedt_fw-mi his_o communion_n without_o a_o church_n censure_n upon_o the_o foresay_a ground_n and_o i_o grant_v that_o so_o also_o may_v the_o scandalous_a but_o that_o god_n have_v provide_v a_o heavy_a punishment_n for_o they_o mat._n 18._o 17._o 1_o cor._n 5._o by_o the_o censure_n of_o the_o church_n if_o it_o be_v god_n will_v that_o scandalous_a person_n must_v be_v excommunicate_v and_o thus_o deny_v this_o sacrament_n what_o be_v our_o reason_n to_o the_o contrary_a therefore_o the_o consideration_n of_o such_o as_o will_v not_o examine_v themselves_o as_o appear_v by_o their_o obstinacy_n in_o scandal_n be_v to_o be_v refer_v to_o the_o next_o head_n viz._n of_o censure_n and_o the_o case_n of_o ignorance_n alone_o be_v to_o be_v try_v here_o quest_n 4._o but_o who_o be_v those_o that_o appear_v by_o ignorance_n not_o able_a to_o examine_v themselves_o answ_n certain_o not_o only_o child_n fool_n and_o madman_n nor_o these_o proper_o indeed_o these_o be_v reduce_v under_o the_o rank_n of_o the_o ignorant_a but_o even_o thereby_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o ignorance_n be_v more_o proper_o attribute_v to_o person_n of_o year_n and_o in_o the_o use_n of_o reason_n then_o unto_o these_o however_o child_n etc._n etc._n be_v debar_v quia_fw-la ignorant_a the_o ignorant_a as_o such_o and_o not_o as_o child_n or_o as_o in_o any_o other_o consideration_n be_v immediate_o incapable_a of_o perform_v the_o condition_n of_o self-examination_n and_o therefore_o as_o such_o be_v not_o to_o be_v admit_v and_o it_o be_v all_o as_o proper_a to_o say_v that_o grow_v affect_o ignorant_a person_n can_v examine_v themselves_o as_o child_n fool_n if_o we_o know_v they_o can_v by_o reason_n of_o ignorance_n the_o duty_n to_o be_v perform_v be_v such_o as_o necessary_o require_v knowledge_n and_o where_o there_o be_v want_n of_o knowledge_n whether_o natural_o or_o moral_o there_o we_o be_v sure_o the_o condition_n of_o right_n be_v want_v and_o consequent_o admission_n be_v to_o be_v deny_v when_o all_o be_v do_v this_o text_n be_v conditional_a or_o not_o if_o not_o than_o none_o for_o want_v of_o self-examination_n be_v to_o be_v suspend_v no_o not_o so_o much_o as_o child_n etc._n etc._n but_o if_o then_o all_o that_o appear_v not_o to_o be_v able_a to_o examine_v themselves_o be_v to_o be_v suspend_v equal_o with_o they_o and_o i_o despair_v of_o see_v any_o reason_n to_o the_o contrary_a for_o if_o person_n quia_fw-la non-self-examining_a be_v forbid_v than_o all_o person_n non-self-examining_a be_v forbid_v and_o consequent_o all_o ignorant_a person_n whatsoever_o quest_n 5._o but_o what_o degree_n of_o ignorance_n be_v sufficient_a to_o ground_n suspension_n upon_o answ_n this_o must_v be_v leave_v in_o the_o hand_n of_o prudence_n and_o charity_n but_o it_o may_v be_v measure_v by_o its_o influence_n upon_o this_o duty_n of_o self-examination_n if_o a_o person_n have_v not_o so_o much_o knowledge_n as_o in_o any_o good_a measure_n to_o see_v his_o sin_n and_o to_o discern_v the_o lord_n body_n aright_o in_o the_o sacrament_n of_o which_o he_o be_v to_o examine_v himself_o this_o be_v a_o sufficient_a ●ause_n of_o deny_v the_o sacrament_n to_o such_o a_o person_n in_o my_o opinion_n digression_n 5._o the_o ground_n of_o deny_v the_o sacrament_n to_o some_o church-member_n formal_o consider_v we_o have_v last_o consider_v the_o object_n about_o which_o this_o be_v conversant_a or_o to_o be_v exercise_v we_o proceed_v to_o the_o ground_n or_o principle_n of_o it_o formal_o consider_v the_o authority_n whence_o it_o be_v derive_v 1._o negative_o 2._o positive_o the_o power_n of_o the_o church_n to_o keep_v back_o the_o ignorant_a from_o the_o reason_n the_o ground_n of_o deny_v the_o sacrament_n negative_o consider_v 1._o not_o reason_n lord_n table_n be_v not_o found_v in_o reason_n as_o if_o because_o that_o through_o ignorance_n man_n have_v no_o rational_a capacity_n of_o improve_n this_o sacrament_n therefore_o reason_n discover_v this_o shall_v warrant_v the_o church_n in_o deny_v the_o sacrament_n to_o they_o this_o be_v but_o a_o be_v wise_a for_o god_n than_o he_o be_v for_o himself_o it_o be_v but_o bad_a reason_n against_o god_n will_n if_o god_n will_v have_v such_o in_o covenant_n as_o can_v express_v consent_n and_o such_o seal_v in_o covenant_n as_o in_o reason_n can_v improve_v it_o what_o be_v that_o to_o we_o god_n may_v do_v what_o he_o will_v with_o his_o own_o this_o will_v reason_v child_n out_o of_o the_o church_n and_o covenant_n out_o of_o baptism_n and_o circumcision_n as_o well_o as_o the_o supper_n who_o be_v all_o as_o capable_a of_o act_v at_o a_o few_o year_n old_a in_o eat_v and_o drink_v bread_n and_o wine_n as_o of_o suffer_v at_o a_o few_o day_n old_a in_o circumcision_n or_o baptism_n or_o in_o their_o church_n and_o covenant-relation_n as_o soon_o as_o they_o be_v bear_v and_o as_o able_a to_o improve_v that_o as_o these_o 2._o neither_o be_v this_o power_n ground_v in_o prudence_n or_o a_o prudential_a prudence_n nor_o prudence_n care_n and_o caution_n for_o the_o good_a of_o our_o people_n soul_n who_o not_o discern_v the_o lord_n body_n may_v eat_v and_o drink_v judgement_n to_o themselves_o prudence_n be_v a_o good_a assistant_n but_o a_o bad_a principle_n of_o church_n power_n interest_n in_o privilege_n especiul_o this_o of_o the_o supper_n fall_v under_o the_o head_n of_o spiritual_a property_n and_o right_a which_o prudence_n serve_v well_o to_o discern_v but_o not_o to_o make_v or_o alter_v prudence_n ought_v indeed_o to_o labour_v to_o the_o utmost_a that_o person_n come_v not_o to_o the_o supper_n unworthy_o but_o doubtless_o she_o go_v beyond_o her_o last_o if_o she_o once_o venture_v to_o deny_v those_o who_o god_n do_v not_o or_o who_o he_o do_v deny_v if_o she_o have_v no_o call_n thereunto_o matter_n of_o property_n be_v matter_n of_o necessity_n and_o justice_n as_o before_o but_o prudence_n have_v to_o do_v only_o with_o thing_n in_o themselves_o indifferent_a 3._o neither_o be_v mutual_a consent_n in_o ecclesia_fw-la consederata_fw-la by_o a_o consent_n nor_o mutual_a confederation_n or_o consent_n church-covenant_n a_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o th●s_n power_n as_o if_o because_o a_o company_n of_o people_n do_v agree_v together_o not_o to_o give_v the_o sacrament_n to_o the_o ignorant_a etc._n etc._n therefore_o they_o may_v deny_v it_o to_o such_o it_o be_v know_v that_o upon_o this_o ground_n a_o learned_a man_n of_o late_a have_v m._n l._n m._n fix_v all_o church-power_n but_o i_o very_o believe_v that_o the_o confederated_a church_n dare_v not_o trust_v themselves_o upon_o this_o foundation_n or_o venture_v their_o power_n or_o government_n to_o stand_v or_o fall_v upon_o this_o bottom_n doubtless_o mutual_a consent_n be_v of_o great_a power_n in_o all_o society_n and_o may_v dispose_v even_o of_o all_o indifferent_a thing_n for_o order_n and_o decency_n in_o christian_a society_n or_o church_n but_o be_v deny_v sacracrament_n cast_v out_o church_n etc._n etc._n thing_n indifferent_a the_o person_n under_o church_n power_n be_v allow_v this_o dommunion_n in_o the_o word_n of_o god_n or_o not_o if_o they_o be_v allow_v it_o by_o the_o word_n how_o can_v mutual_a consent_n warrant_v the_o church_n to_o disallow_v it_o if_o not_o than_o it_o be_v determine_v before_o by_o the_o word_n that_o such_o person_n shall_v not_o be_v admit_v that_o wicked_a person_n shall_v be_v put_v away_o from_o among_o we_o and_o then_o the_o power_n in_o the_o church_n to_o do_v this_o be_v plain_o derive_v thence_o i_o mean_v from_o those_o scripture_n and_o not_o from_o mutual_a consent_n though_o this_o be_v very_o useful_a quoad_fw-la exercitium_fw-la for_o the_o put_n of_o this_o power_n in_o execution_n according_a to_o those_o scripture_n to_o i_o this_o seem_v nothing_o but_o a_o pretty_a device_n to_o make_v the_o confederated_a church_n fall_v to_o the_o ground_n between_o two_o extreme_n they_o have_v hitherto_o plead_v much_o for_o scripture_n for_o every_o circumstance_n of_o church-government_n but_o thus_o they_o shall_v stride_v too_o large_a from_o hence_o upon_o the_o sole_a ground_n of_o prudence_n and_o mutual_a consent_n for_o the_o very_a substance_n of_o it_o as_o if_o the_o former_a basis_n will_v bear_v neither_o any_o long_o 4._o neither_o be_v this_o power_n ground_v on_o mat._n 7._o 6._o or_o such_o like_a scripture_n for_o we_o here_o treat_v of_o that_o power_n to_o suspend_v such_o person_n as_o be_v not_o censure_v but_o dog_n and_o swine_n