the Souldiers in the Kingdom were published For the fourth Article their countenancing abetting and partaking wish the tumultuous violence of the Apprentices and others against both Houses of Parliament It seems strange to us when they had this in their thoughts to charge it as a Crime upon us they did not think of what themselves are doing and much more that they should urge the force offered to the House then which they declared horrid and treasonable to justifie the violence offered to the House by them of a far higher nature If it were a crim in the Apprentices why do the Army the same thing If it were no Crime why doe they complain of Us for abetting and partaking with it wherefore We say that there is not the least colour or shadow of truth and doe every one of Us for Our selves respectively utterly deny it And for setting up a new Speaker the House of Commons did no more then what in all ages hath been their undoubted right to do in the case of want of a Speaker And as to the Ordinances and Votes then passed We should make a particular Answer thereunto but that by the Ordinance of the 20. of Aug. following they are made void and null in themselves which silences Us for the present For the fifth Article The holding correspondency ingaging and assisting the tumultuous Petitioners last Spring the rebellious Insâ—â—rections in Kent the revolted Ships and Prince of Wales and with the Scots Armie We do every one of Us for our selvel respectively denie the having any hand therein Having thus given Our Answers to those Five particulars wherein the necessity is assigned by which they endeauour to justifie their proceedings against Us Wee leave it to the judgment of their owne Consciences whether they doe not bear witnesse within them that in all these particulars they have groundlesly accused Us of those things of which they for the most part are guilty and know Us to be innocent In these we have used the more brevitie that We might be the more large upon the sixt Section of the Paper wherein they say That when the Army was dispersed and engaged in severall parts of the Kingdome in opposing the Enemies suppressing the troubles these men had raised and when many faithfull Members of Parliament were employed abroad upon necessary publique services and others through malignant tumults about the Citie could not with safetie attend the House then the corrupt and apostatizing party taking advantage of these distractions and diversions which themselves had caused first recalled in those Members c. then they recalled those Votes for non-addresses and Voted a Personall Treatie with the King To all which scandalous aspersions Wee Answer That they are altogether groundlesse if there were any reality in what they would here insinuate That the proceedings of this Treaty were not by the Concurrrence of the House but surrepticiously gayned by taking advantage of the absence of many faithfull Members Why doe they complaine then in other parts of their Paper That the Majoritâ—e of the House is corrupt and take paines to shew how the Majoritie of the House came to be formed to serve the King and other coreupt Interests or what necessitie was there for them to force the absence of two hundred Members of the House at 〈◊〉 for what iâ— done in this Treatâ—e if the complaint here be just that 〈◊〉 proceedings thereunto were through the absence of the Members that could not with safety attend the House and for the distractions in the Countries which they speake of It is manifest to all men that heard the cryes of the Countries at that time who in part occasioned those distempers even in the Countriâ—a neerest and best affected to the Parliament who never during the Warre exprest so high contempt to the authority of Parliament untill the like had bin first done by the Armies quartering upon and amongst them a little before And although the president was followed by Sea and Land almost to the ruine of Parliament and Kingdome yet those Members if they meane such as are imprisoned and secluded which they most uncivilly and nuchristianly requite with the reproach of Apostates were many of them imployed and did improve the utmost of their interests in Laâ—cashire Yorkeshire Lincolneshire Herefâ—rdshire Hampshire Suffolke Essex London and Surrey and many other parts of the Kingdome to quiet distractions and oppose Insurrections which the extremity of the Armies proceedings had iâ— part occastioned We never judged Tumults nor Insurrections the way to Peace and Settlement And for the Charge of some of the eleven Members to have taken Commissious from the Prince Wâ—lay and every of them for themselves affirming the Charge of their taking Commissions from the Prince or any other whatsoever by verieu of his Authority is a most malicious and scandalous asperstion They abhorring to deviate in the least from what their primitive engagements were which they have from first to last continued in and shall doe by Gods assistance notwithstanding all Calamnies cast on them or sufferings though to the utmost for so doing Having thus cleared the entrance to the Treatie from thâ—se prejudices laid in the way therunto We come to that Vote of the House Decemb. 5. That the Answer of the Keâ—â— to the Propositions of both Houses are a â—ound for the House to proceed upon for the settlement of the Peace of the Kingdome Of which they say that though they advanced hither to attend Providence for the opening some way to avoid the present evils designed and introduce the desired good into the Kingdome yee they said nor acted nothing in relation to the Parliament nor any Member thereof untill by that Vote passed Decemb. 5. they found the corrupt majority so resolvedly bent to compleat their Design in bringing in the King c. Doe they call their threatning Remonstrance sent to the House and the Declaration then published to explaine the meaning thereof divers dayes before this a saying nothing in relation to the Parliament and their Marching up to the Citie of London and Westminster with so many Regiments of the Army contrary to the Order of the House a doing nothing in relation to the Parliament By this it seemes the passing of this Vote is the very point of that necessity which they take to justifie all their present actings in relation to the Parliament For before that passed they say they acted nothing therefore We shall be more large upon this Subject We shall therefore first state the matter in difference betwixt the Propositions of the Houses and the Kings Answers As the Propositions to the King in the Isle of Weight contained in them all that security which the Houses have judged necessary to propose for themselves those that have adhered to them in the Warres and for the peace of the whole Kingdome so the King granteth all those Propositions in which the main security resteth viz. His Majestie granted the first Proposition for
it not their Covenant who have taken it as well as ours We say we took the Covenant without any equivocation or mental reservation and by Gods assistance have endeavoured and shall indeavour to continue faithfull therein although they seem here to scorn both it and us If they make this Objection with any sincerity here what is meant in the third page of their Paper by these words viz. Divâ—ns of those whose Principles were more complyant to a closure with the King upon satisfaction in the particular matiers especially concerning the Form of Religion and Church Government which they mainly affâ—ctâ—d There they suggest that wee fall in with Malignants to obtain the Church Government which wee affect and here they insinuat that we break the Covenant in not insisting more for it But for the Covenant wee say the Kings Answer takes away Church Government by Arch Bishops Bishops c. by taking away their Courts and so farre takes away their Power of Ordination that it can never be revived again but by an Act of Parliament so that Episcopacy is divested of any actuall being by the Law of the Land and instead thereof the Presbyterian Government is put into possession by a Law for three yeares And wee say that the King having granted the rest of the Propositions and so much in this the Covenant doth not oblige us to make Warre upon this point to gaine what wee desired after the three yeares and shall really and constantly endeavour to obtain in our places and Callings Nothing could have made the Kingdome more irreconsileable to the Presbyterie then to have made that the sole Obstruction of the Peace and state of Warreâ— and it is evident except wee should put out the eye of our reason that besides the hope we might have of His Majesties comming neerer to us in this point and in the Covenant it selfe upon our comming neerer to Him in the absolute concluding and declarâ—ng of Peace the Parliament by what is granted already is put into a better capacity for setling Presbytery by a perpetuall Law then as things now stand they can reasonably presume of by the continuance of Warre The power of the sword apparently threatning not only the destruction of this Government of the Church but the being of the Church if Almighty God prevent not by striking at the foundations of our Faith contemning conscientious Ministers and Ministery it self taking away their Maintenance obstructing the Reformation of the Universities slighting of learning and professedly promoting a most licentious Toleration for all manner of Errors Heresies Schismes and prophaness in the Kingdome This being our present condition we hope we shall be sufficiently cleared from the least suspition of declining in our zeal to the Covenant which we have taken in what we have done For the Publick Faith passed upon the sale of Bishops lands We say that though the Purchasers might have afforded to have giveâ— the same rates for their purchases if they might have had them assured to them by Act of Parliamentâ—for 99 years and such moderate â—ents reserved as the King â—â—timated in His Answer yet according to His Answer expressing further a satisfaction to be given to them we should not have consented to any such Act of Parliament for setling the remainder in Him and ensuring the said Rents until the Purchasers who were in possession and still held by the same Title under which they bought them should be satisfied And in case they should not be so satisfied we were not by the said Vote concluded from insisting further for a full Confirmation of their purchases having never actually agreed with the King upon any such Terms but prestâ— it is the last to get a full confirmation thereof and only Voted that this was a sufficient ground to proceed further And now we appeal to the Purchasers themselves whether we ought to have made an absolute breach upon this point or thereby should have performed our Publique Faith to the whole Kingdome and themselves As to what is said that the corrupt majority would not lend an Eare to admit a thought towards the laying down their own power or rendring it back to the People from whom they received it Wee answer that this is an unreasonable objection by them who endeavours to perpetuate an Army upon the Kingdome Nor is the continuance of this Parliament objected at large but that we are not willing to render our Power back again to the People by which means as their other Papers and actions tell us a new Representative made by the Army so that the complaint in effect is that we are not willing to render the power put into us for the Government of the Kingdome into the hands of the Army which wee conâ—esse wee think wee ought not to doe But as there is little doubt to be made that before an absolute conclusion of Peace with the King an Act might have been had for putting a Period in short time to this Parliament We for our parts when the Kingdome should had been in quiet possession of these Propositions by Acts of Parliament upon the conclusion and settlement of Peace There are no persons living would be more desirous then our selves to put a Period to our service in Parliament and leave it to the care of succeeding Parliaments to preserve what this hath gained to our Posterity Wee should have ended this point here but for one objection more which is made by their other Papers against any Agreement with the King viz. That whatsoever the King grants in this Treaty hee may plead force to breake it and that for any thing can bee discovered hee is like to use his endeavours to spoile us by policy of what we have gained by the expence of so much bloud For answer hereunto We say first That this objection lies against any agreement with the King though hee granted all the Houses desired or could desire and against any agreement betwixt King and people after a Warre made It can hardly be imagined after such differences but that for sometime animosities will remain and a disposition in those who thinke they have lost any part of their power to regain it It being naturall to all men in power to increase their power That this objection lay as strong against all former Treaties with His Majesty for Peace after the Warre began and against the declared end of the Parliaments Warre and of all just Warre a good Peace with His Majesty But more particularly wee say That the weight of this objection depends only upon an uncertain conjecture of what may or may not bee hereafter and the former experience which this Kingdome hath had in keeping such Agreements made in the heat of former differences strengthened us against the feare of the danger of it And though sometimes the Kings of this Realme and particularly this King have adventured to weaken their owne Grants for a time yet they have ever beene regained with advantage
desire But if instead of Union and Peace in the three Kingdomes the seeds of a longer and more wasting Warre is sowne if in stead of Reformation of Religion 〈…〉 and 〈◊〉 〈…〉 and that Government by the Sword instead of Law slavery and 〈◊〉 instead of Liberty bâ—â— our portion at the end of six yeares warre which we tremble to thinke of wee shall humbly submit to the mighty hand of God who in Judgement for our sinnes and the sinnes of the Nation reacheth out this cup of his sore displeasure to us And in the midst of the greatest troubles have this to comfort us that we did our endeavours according to the best of our judgment and consciences towards the prevention thereof and for the settling this Kingdome in a safe and well grounded 〈◊〉 A List of the Imprisoned and Secluded MEMBERS Imprisoned MAj. Gen. Rich. Browne Col. John Birch Thomas Boughton Esq John â—ulkley Esq Francis Buller Esq Sir Henry Cholmeley Sir John Clotworthy Commissary Lionel Copley John Crew Esq Francis Drake Esq Sir Walter Earle Knight Nathanul â—ines Esq Sir Gilbert Gerrard Baronet Francis Gerrard Esq Thomas Gewen Esq Giles Greene Esq Sir Harbâ—t Grimstone Baronet Sir Rob. Harley Kn. of the Bath Col. Edward Hâ—rley Sir Anthony Iâ—by Knight Richard Knightley Esq Sir Martin Lister Knight Major Robert Harley Col. Edward Leigh Thomas Lane Esq William Lewes Baronet Sir Samuel Luke Knight Major Gen. Edward Massey Sir John Merrick Knight Sir Richard Aneâ—â—â—e Knight Henry Pelham Esq William Priestly Esq William Prynne Esq Sir Robert Pye Knight Sir Benjamin Ruddyard Knight Sir Thomas Soamâ— Knight Edward Stephens Esq Col. William Strode John Swinfen Esq Charles Vaughan Esq Edward Vaughan Esq Sir William Waller Knight Clement Walker Esq Thomas Viscount Wâ—nman William Wheeler Esq Secluded Mr. Pâ—regryne Hobbye Mr. John Holcroft Mr. George Horner Mr. Thomas Hodges Mr. William Jones Col. William Jepson Sir Norton Knathpole Mr. James Cambell Mr. Capell Luckinge Sir Martin Lumley Mr. Cha. Pym Mr. Henry Peck Sir John Pagrove Sir Philip Parker Sir William Playters Mr. John Pelham Sâ—r Thomas Pelham Sir Nâ—vile Pâ—â—i Mr. Edward Pool Sr. Edward 〈◊〉 Sir Thomas Parker Mr. Tho. Povy Mr. Henry Oxenden Mr. Arthur Anesâ—â—o Mr. Arthur Owen Sir Dudley North Sir Robert Needham Mr. John Nash Sir Nicholas Martin Sir Tho. Middleton Mr. Tho. Middleton Sir Oliver Luke Sir William Lâ—tton Mr. Henry Lucas Sir William Lister Mr. John Ash Mr. Robert Packer Mr. John Harris Sir John Seimor Mr. Samuell Vassall Sir Robert Napper Sir Roger North Mr. Tho. Grove Mr. John Selman Mr. Herbert Hay Mr. Robert Genner Sir John Burgen Col. John Barker Mr. John Nelthorpe Mr. William Outfield Mr. William Ellis Mr. Edward Wingate Mr. John Whadden Mr. Thomas Waâ—â—r Sir Richard Win Mr. Richard Winwood Sir Edward Askew Sir Ralph Ashton Mr. Mathew Allen Mr. John Alford Mr. Michael Biâ—ulfe Mr. Peter Brooke Col. â—â—hn Booth Mr. Mor. Bartow Mr. John Buller Sir Ambrose Brown Sir Thomas Trever Mr. Sim. Thelwell Secluded Mr. Thomas Thinn Sir John Temple Mr. Thomas Temple Mr. John Thomas Mr. Samuell Terrick Sir Humphry Tufton Mr. Edward Thomas Sir John Corbet Edward Lo. Clinton Sir John Curson Sir Thomas Dacres Col. William Davies Mr. John Dodrigde Mr. Thomas Earl Mr. William Edwards Mr. Charles Rich Sir William Spring Mr. Simon Snow Mr. Thomas Sands Mr. George Scut William Lord Fitz-William Mr. William Hoxwist Col. John Floid Mr. Richard Gennings Mr. Thomus Gell Mr. Francis Gawdey Mr. Samuel Gardner Mr. Henry Hungerford Mr. Denzill Hoâ—lis Sir Francis Hollis With sundry others driven away Imprimatur Joh. Langley Jan. 20. 1648 9. FINIS 2 Sam. 21 2 3. Page 143. Page 663. 664.
the Army without Order from the House and the Army advanced against the Parliament they say in their Letter to the House July the 8 1647 There have been severall Officers of the Armie upon severall occasions sent to his Majestie The first to present to him a Copy of the Representations and after that some others to tender him a Copie of the Remonstrance upon bâ—th which the Officers sent were appointed to â—leer the sense and intentions of any thing in either paper whereupon his Majestie might make any question There they treated with the King and now they offer violence to the Parliament for treating with the King Then in their Remonstrance Juâ— 23. 1647 it is said We châ—rly professe we do not see how there can be any peace to this Kingdom firms or lasting without a due consideration of and provision for the Rights quiet and Immunities of his Majesties Royall Family and his late partakers Now they judge the Majority of the House corrupt and proceed violently against them for moving one step towards a peace with the King though he hath granted more then all their Proposals and make this a necessity sharp enough to justifie the using of their swords contrary to their Commissions This were cause enough to make the unsoundnesse of this plea of necessity appear to all the world and even to be suspected by themselves that serves to justifie contradictions which they are put to by making themselve Judgess of those things they have no calling to meddle with and taking them out of those hands to whom of right it belongs to judge them 2. This plea of necessity which is made in this paper is destructive to all Government For by the same reason that the General Officer urgeth necessity for acting against the command and persons of his Superiours and makes himself Judge of that necessity the inferiour Officer may urge the same necessity in his judgement to act against the commands of his Generall and the Souldiers may urge the like for acting against their Officers and any other 20000 men in the Kingdom to act against the Army and this Army to act as against this Parliament so against any other Government of Representative that shall be set up and so in infinitum 3. Did the Members of Parliament proceed in Parliament contrary to their trust in the judgement of those that did elect them yet it is manifest that the power of advising voting and acting being placed in the Members of Parliament by the Law of the Land and ancient Rights of Parliament they are not accountable much lesse censurable for the use of it according to their own judgment and consciences though contrary to theirs that chose them They are only in such cases accountable to and censurable by the House which they could not reasonably be if they were censâ—rable by the people that sent them For then the Parliament might judge that good service which the Electors judge evill è conversâ— the Electors may judge that evill which the House may judge to be good and so no man can be safe or free in the service of the Parliament But were power and trust placed in the Members of Parliament by law only to be used or not used valid or null at the Electors judgment yet in such case the Members of Parliament were only accountable to the Counties Cities or Boroughs for which they serve and not to Strangers and in no case are they accountable to the Army who are so far from being those from whom they received their Trust that they are only persons in a subordinate Trust under them for their defence from force Which how well they have performed we leave to the judgment of all those who observe their present proceedings 4. These actions which they undertake to justifie are contrary not onely to their trust but to the express letter of the Covenant and Protestation which they have taken And breach of Oath being a morall evill it is not to be justified by necessity and good intentions Saul though a King and thereby qualified to do justice yet for executing the Gibeonites against a Covenant made many hundred yeers before and gained subtilly by the Gibeonites who were not of the children of Israel but of the remnant of the Amorites with whom he might presume to be more bold and though he did this in his zeal to the children of Israel and Judah yet this necessity in his judgment for publick good could not warrant him God brought a Famine upon the Land for this breach of Covenant which ceased not untill it was expiated by the death of seven of his sons that did commit it See here by this instance what legacy they by their present actions may leave to their posterity Having thus laid down these considerations of this plea of Necessity in generall it thereby appears should we say no more though we should be guilty of the â—ensuing particulars with which we are charged yet they could not be innocent nor justified in what they have done against us But for 〈◊〉 furthâ—â— clecâ—â—â—g and their further conviction we come now to enquilâ— inâ—â— those particulars in this Paper in which they hâ—ld forth the necessity that must bear them one wherein the question betwixt us admitting necessity would justifie thâ—â—â— proceedings is thus Whether that which is assigned in the particulars following in their Paper be that necessity wherein we shall joyn issue with them and freely put it to tryall upon the particulars following which are six in number But before we enter upon them we must take notice of what is said from the end of the second page of their Paper unto the end of the fift page wherein are used many words to shew how the Majority of the House came to be formed to serve the Kings and other corrupt Interests The sum of all which is That by the endeavours of some whom they call old Malignant Members and by the practises used in the new Elections there came in a flood of new Burgesses that either are Malignants or Neâ—ters To which we answer That what is done by the majority of the House it is the act of the whole House so what is done against the majority of the House is done against the whole House And to the Charge against the new Burgesses as it is cleer the Ordinance for new Elections was not carried by those we call old Malignants if there be any such in the House except the major part of the House was alwayes Malignants and before the new Election so for the Members which came in upon the new Election which are called Neuters or Malignants in generall without fixing upon any one particular Member to which a 〈◊〉 all in generall were sufficient Yet we shall further adde that of all those Members of the new Election that are secluded or imprisoned we know none but whose Elections are allowed by the House and who are proper Judges thereof and who
either by their services as Souldiers for the Parliament or in their Committees or otherwise by imminent services or sufferings in their Cause gave a testimony of their faithfulnesse to the Parliament before they were elected which may free them from the name of Neuters and Malignants And it were not hard to shew that many Officers of the Army who came in upon the last Elections are chosen by those places where they were scarce known and wherein they have no interest of their own and by what other influence they obtained those Elections we leave it to themselves to judge 〈◊〉 whom it is best known and so come to the first of those six particulars wherein is assigned the extraordinary necessity to justifie their proceedings in their own words First The betraying of IRELAND into the enemies bands by recalling the Lord Lisle from his command there and putting the best part of that Kingdom and where the Parliament had the strongest footing Munster into the hands of Inchequin a native Irish man who hath since revolted from the Parliament hath lately united with the Irish Rebels and with them and Ormond again engaged with the King To which we answer That if Munster be that part of Ireland wherein the Parliament had the best interest the Lord Inchequin did come in himself and bring that interest to the Parliament whom he served against the Irish Rebels and preserved a possession in Munster for the Parliament during the heat of their Wars in England when they had little other interest in Ireland and lesse means to relieve them out of England That the Lord Lisle was not recalled from his command there but his Commission for Lord Lieutenant of Ireland expiring about the fifteenth of April 1647. his Lordship on the seventeenth of April took shipping for England After the Lord Lisles departure out of Munster the Lord Inchequin proceeded successively against the Rebels and took from them many considerable Forts and Castles the Garrison of Oramanagh Cappâ—quin the Town and Castle of Dungarvan the Castle of Calur and others And upon the fourteenth of November following at the battell of Knocknowes he obtained one of the greatest Victories that ever was gotten over the Rebels Army under the command of the Lord Taff wherein were taken of the enemies Horse two hundred slain of the Foot four thousand Officers taken prisoners sixty eight Arms fix thousand the Lieutenant generall slain For all which we refer the Reader to the Letters and Papers concerning these severall services presented to the House and by their Orders published in print These were such testimonies of his reality to the Parliament long after the Lord Lisles coming out of Munster that the House did not call it into question and nothing to the contrary appeared to the Houses untill the third of April 1648. The Army here having disputed the Parliaments Commands the Lord Inchequin began to enter into Remonstrances and engagements against the Parliament for which he made the Remonstrances Engagements and Declarations of the Army the Summer before both the Cause and President as by the Relation made to the House published in print doth appear We mention not these things in the least measure to justifie the Lord Inchequins revolt from the Parliament but have onely related the truth of the matter of fact for our own justification against the Charge in this Paper of betraying Munster and we leave to the Reader to judge whether the Army hath cause to complain of us or reflect upon themselves for the losse of Munster and proceed to the second particular viz. Their endeavours to bring in the King upon his own Terms without satisfaction and security to the Kingdom viz. upon his Message of the twelfth of May 1647. and to this end with so manifest injustice and indignity to diâ—band the Army before any Peace made or assured For the engagement of the twelft of May it is well known the House of Commons upon the first knowledge of that engagement voted it to be treasonable and afterwards both Houses by Ordinance of the seventeenth of December 1647. put 〈◊〉 incâ—patity upon all those in or about the City of London that entred into or contrived acted or â—â—etted that engagement of bearing any Office in the City of London for that yeer which we take to be a sufficient Evidence to prove us herein a right majority as in other parts of their Paper they take the Votes of the House to prove us a corrupt majority The Charge here lying onely in generall and not fixed upon any particular Yet for our further cleering besides the Testimony we have given against the bringing in the King upon any such tearms by our continued insisting upon far higher tearms to which the King hath agreed in the late Treaty we doe every one of us for our selves respectively professe our utter dislike of that engagement or any endeavour to bring in the King upon any engagement made or contrived without the House And for what is said concerning disbanding of the Army we say that the Votes of the House that eight Regiments of Foot four of Horse and one of Dragoons should be sent out of the Army to Ireland which was desired might be in one entire Body and their resolution to contain ten thousand Foot and five thousand four hundred Horse under the command of the Lord Fairfax for the necessary defence of the Kingdom as the state of affairs then stood in England and Ireland as it was to no such end as is alledged but for the relieving of poor distressed Protestants in Iâ—eland the easing of the heavy pressures lying upon the poor people of this Kingdom and an honourable and fit imploying the Forces of that Army to prevent the high Distempers that since have ensued so as it was no injustice nor indignity to the Armie To the third Article viz. That they endeavoured to protect the eleven impeached Members from justice and endeavouring with them to raise a new War We say that as we desire no other protection then our own innocency and the Laws under which we live so we never gave any other protection to the eleven Members then what stood with Law and Justice And for the mislending of two hundred thousand pounds or the greatest part thereof which wâ—â— designed chiefly for Ireland We say that about eighty thousand pound of that money was paid to Mastâ—â—Nicholas Loftus and others for the service of Ireland and above fifty thousand pound to the Treasurers at Waâ— for the Army which might with more reason be said to be misimployed in regard there is an establishment for their pay another way unlesse part of the Army had gone to do Ireland service for that money then what the Reformado Officers and Souldiers who obeyed the Orders of the House for disbanding who received pressed the more earnestly upon the House for part of their Arrears after their Declarations and Remonstrances by the Army for satisfying the Arrears of all
benefit of the Church And in all things else his Majesty refers himselfe to his former answers And in his former answers dated October 21. 1648. He consents to the taking away all Arch-bishops Chancellours Commissaries Deans and Sub-deans and Chapters Arch deacons Cannons and Prebendaries and all Chanters Chancellours Treasurers Succentours Sachrists old Vicars new Vicars of any Cathedrall Church and all other their under officers out of the Church of England Dominion of Wales and Church of Ireland In these answers as wee conceive the King takes away the government of the Church by Arch-bishops Bishops c. by his taking away their Courts the Bishops having no authority to convent any person send for any witnesse heare any cause passe any censure or judgement or exercise any Acts of Church Government but by and in their Courts which being by this answer abolisht the Government fals And for their power of Ordination though it bee not absolutely taken away yet the exercise of it is suspâ—nded so as it is equivalent for the Bishops can never exercise that power againe in England untill they be restored hereunto by Act of Parliament And if that power had been absolutely taken away yet if the King and both Houses of Parliament restore it it is againe establisht So that the maine desect in this answer is in that the King agreeâ— to settle the Presbyteriâ—n Government onely for three yeares and that at the end of that time there is no Government in the Church untill it bee setled by Act of Parliament Wee professe herein that the Kings Answer comes farre short of what we desired and of what we shall use our best endeavours fully to effect according to former engagements there being nothing wherein wee should more rejoyce then to see as the power and purity of Doctrine so the beauty of Order and golden Reynes of Discipline strengthned and establâ—sht by a perpetuall Law amongst us Yet the King consents to the sâ—â—ling of this Government in this Answer for so long a time as the Houâ—es formerly in their Ordinances presented to him at Newcâ—stle did themselves think fit to settle it This bâ—ing the true stâ—te of the dâ—fference betwixt the Kings Answer and the Proposiâ—ions of the Houses for a safe and well grounded Peace which were the subject of the Houses debate Decemb. the 5th We shall in the next place before We come to those Reasons which induced Us thereupon to Vote that c. We shall premise First by this Vote the House did not determine as We conceive the having no further Treaty with his Majesty before a concluding and declaring of Peace nor was the Houses so bound up hereby that they could not propose any thing further wherein the Kings Answers are defective or from making any new Propositions for the better healing our bâ—eâ—ches or more safe binding up a just and righteous Peace which as it doth appeare by the Words of the Vote it selfe so it is also manifest to bee the full purpose and sense of the House therein by their laying aside the former Vote that the Kings Answers are satisfactory by a Question upon a long debate And at the same time framing and passing this Vote whereby they only lay hold of these large Concessions and declare their judgements thereupon against a breach with the King and continuance of this unnaturall Warre betwixt the King and his people upon the difference at last by the blessing of God brought into so narrow a compasse And this being a true state of the matter then in debate and Our sense in the Vote that passed thereupon Wee judged it most consistent with Our duties as Christians and our Trust as Members of Parliament to make this step having so much ground given Us towards the happy settlement of thiâ— Kingdom in Peace This being publisht in Print to be so high a crime in Us as to justifie whatsoever the Army hath done against Vs and God and Man being appealed unto therein We shall here lay down some of the Considerations both on the one hand and on the other which carryed our Iudgements to the passing this Vote 1. The advantages by this proceeding towards a close with the King upon what hee hath granted are the saving of the Kingdome of Ireland out of the hands of the bloudy Popish Rebels and preserving it to the Crown of England the regaining the revolted Navie and freedome of the Seas the support of the Ancient and well constituâ—ed Government of this Kingdome the honour of Parliament in making Peace after so troublesome a Warre and in a word the stoping the most sad issue of English bloud that ever was opened in this Nation and the putting of the people of this Kingdome into possession of greater security of their Lawes and Liberties against the over growing power of the Kings Prorogative then ever any of Our Ancestors in the greatest of their successes could ever attaine unto The consequences visible in our eyes if we should upon the matter in difference have made a breach with the King are 1. The deposing if not the taking away the life of the King what miseries upon either of these have formerly ensued to this Kingdome our own Histories tell Us Although for the latter which Wee unwillingly mention there was never any president for it in this Kingdome nor ever made by any Protestants in the World and We desire it may never bee done by any in this Kingdome being that which from our harts We doe detest and abhorre We cannot but remember in the end of our Warre the day wherein God hath given Vs prosperity the Declarations which We made in the beginning of Our Warre and the obligations which We laid upon our selves and the Kingdome when we were low In the Petition of Lords and Commons presented to his Majesty by the Earl of Stamford c. April the 8th 1642. are these words viz. That you will please to reject all Councels and apprehensions which may any way derogate from that faithfulnesse and Allegiance which in truth and sincerity We have alwayes born and professed to your Majesty and shall ever make good to the uttermost with our Lives and Fortunes In a Declaration and Protestation of the Lords and Commons assembled in Parliament setting forth the Cause and ends of their taking up Armes to this Kingdome and to the whole World Octob. 22. 1642. are these words viz. We the Lords and Commons in this present Parliament assembled doe in the presence of Almighty God for the satisfaction of our consciences and the discharge of that great Trust which lies upon Vs make this Protestation and Declaration to this Kingdome and Nation and to the whole World That no private passion or respect no evill intention to his Majesties Person no designâ— to the prejudice of his just honour and Authority engaged Vs to raise Forces and take up Armes against the Authors of this Wâ—rre wherewith the Kingdome is now inflamed and We
have alwayes desired from our hearts and souls manifested in our actions and proceedings and severall humble Petitions and Remonstrances to his Majesty professed our loyalty and obedience to his Crown redinesse and resolution to defend his Person and support his Estate with our Lives and Fortunes to the uttermost of Our Power c. A Declaration of the Lords and Commons in Answer c. Concerning the Allegations that the Army raised by the Parliament is to murther and depose the King We hope the Contrivers of the Declaration or any that professeth but the name of a Christian could not have so little chariâ—y as to raise such a scandall especially when they must needs know the Protestation taken by every Member of both Houses whereby they promise in the presence of Almighty God to defend his Majesties Person the Protestations made by the Members of both Houses upon the nomination of the Earle of Eâ—â—ex to be Generall and to live and die with him is exprest that this Army was raised for the defence of the Kings Person In the Solemn League and Covenant for Reformation and defence of Religion and honour and happinesse of the King Thus Having before our eyes the honour aend happinesse of the Kings Majesties Person and his Posterity We shall sincerely really and constantly through the grace of God endevour in our several places and callings to preserve and defâ—nd the Kings Majesties Person and Authority in the preservation and defence of the true Religion and Liberties of the Kingdom that the World may beare Witnesse with our Consciences that We have no thoughts or intentions to diminish his Majesties just power and greatnesse c. And it appeared not unto Vâ— to be consistent with the publike Faith of the Houses in those Declâ—rations nor with other obligations which We have laid upon our selves by these Oaâ—hes Covenants Proteâ—â—ations to hazard the deposig of the King from his Crown dignity much lesse the losse of his Life upon the making of a breach upon the matter in difference 2. We could not but foresee the apparent losse of the Kingdom of Ireland and extirpation of English Protestants and of the Protestant Religion out of that Kingdom into the hands and power of Paâ—ists in Arms there We cannot but believe our tendernesse to make a breach of proceeding out of hearts desire to relieve and preserve the remnant of those poor Protestants which otherwise are like to be a prey to the Popish Rebels who are not satisâ—ied with the lives of many thousands of Innocents whom they have already murthered will justifie Vs before God and Men for what We have done in endeavouring to lay hold upon the grounds given Vs towards the settlement of Peace 3. We could not but apprehend with fear the great advantage to the Popish and Forraign Interests and the disadvantage to the Protestant Cause in this Kingdom and throughout the World by a breach The Prince and Duke of York the two next Heirs to the Crown and Government of three Kingdoms both in Forâ—aign parâ—s and under the 〈◊〉 direction If the Warre be stilll continued by the Parliamâ—nâ— upon the matter in differencâ— it may be feared the Prince may marry with the daughter of a Popish King ostrengthen himself both at Land and Sea by Forraign alliance to which the right of his Inheritance to three Kingdoms is a faire invitation unto which the Popish Interest in Ireland prevailing giving such an advantage together with the assistance of the Papists in this Kingdom what can be expected for Vs but to be certainly the the Seat of Warre and in great danger to be brought under a Popish yoak which We beseech Almighty God to keep us from 4 It is obvious that a breach made at this time upon the grounds afore-mentioned as it will divide Vs amongst our selves hazard the losse of Ireland so it is like to lay a foundation of a perpetuall breach betwixt these two Kingdoms of England and Scotland If there should bee any thought of change of Government here how contrary are their declared Principles both of their State and Church thereunto The King of England is King of Scotland and they are under Allegiance and Covenants for the preservation of the Kings Person and his Posterity as well as We What diffâ—rences are lâ—ke to ensue betwixt the Kingdomes by Government against Govâ—rnment perhaps Title against Title and one Kingdom against the other And this Kingdom being the more wealthy most probable to bee the Seat wherein all the Tragick Sceans and contentions betwixt both Kingdoms shall bee acted what have We in reason or conscience before God or Man to beare us out against these many and Eminent hazards Wee had consideration of the vast debts which the Kingdome lies under and for which the Publique Faith stands ingaged Of which wee see no hope of payment but by a settlement What vast summes of money are owing to this Army and to all the Souldiers in the Kingdom What multitude of extream sufferers in this City and in every County of the Kingdome by what they have lent to and lost for the Parliament Who by the continuance of the Warre are onely like to bee paid with more sufferings and exactions upon what is yet left them and every yeers Warre is like to make new Malignants through discontenting pressures destroy more families increase the Publique debt to be paid and withall increase the Kingdomes wants and make it the lesse able to pay untill at last the Souldier seeing no hope of Pay the People no hope of Peace but generall and desperate tumultuousnesse fall amongst both by laying hold of what is now agreed might bee prevented the King having agreed to what is satisfactory for the payment of Publique debts and damages which yet may in good measure bee performed to satisfie the Souldiers Lenders and Sufferers and ingage them to the interest of our Peace Lastly when we cast our Eyes upon all parts of the Kingdome the present scarcity in the Countries the povertie and disorders in our Cities or when wee look at Sea and behold our Navy divided our Merchants robbed our Trade decayed confusion threatning us on every side These made our bowells yerne within us and call aloud upon us to improve the season and advantage offered by this Vote Before wee conclude this point wee must give Answer to an objection which they insinuate to aggravate the passing this Vote by us in these words Viz. Although the King had finally denyed such things from some of which by their Covenant whereto they had pretended so much zeal and from others by their Publique Faith given they were obliged nos to recede By Which this Paper seems to glance at the Proposition for abolishing of Arch Byshops Byshops c. For sail of their Lands and for settling the Presbyterian Government We cannot but observe its said their Covenâ—â—t and not the Covenant to which they pretended so much zeal Is
obtained and enjoyed in the times of peace The usuall means whereby any of the Kings of this Land have made encroachment upon the good Laws granted to the people and their own agreements have been either by placing corrupt Judges or other Ministers in the Courts of Justice Who though they could not abrogate the Law yet they have made it speak against it self and their good for whom it was made or else by the power of preferring corrupt Courtiers to honour and profit to stop the course of Justice by the Councell-Table for a time Both these meanes are taken away from this King by what is agreed on in this Treatie The first in the Proposition placing the choice of Officers in the Parliament whereby as they have the Lawes they desire so they have the choice of the Judges and Officers that must administer them And the second in the Proposition barring the King from making any new Lords for the future to Vote in the House of Peeres without the consent of the Houses Which are a strong security against a politicke as the Mâ—litia in the Houses is against a forceable breach of this Agreement Lastly we say That it cannot be expected of any Agreement should be made for peace settled after such a Civil War without some hazard of violation or interruption But whether the hazards and dangers be a breach upon such termes as are now in difference betwixt the Houses Propositions and the Kings answer be not more and greater and whether in case endeavours should be used hereafter to violate this agreement the Parliament might not then with more Justice and greater advantage draw the Sword then they can now keepe it unshathed upon the matter in difference Wee leave it to all sober minded men to judge And to what is said That they wanted not good intelligence that had they been suffered to meet all in the House but once more it was designed to have passed some higher resolutions to lay further foundations of such new quarrell so as to carry therein the name and countenance of Parliamentary authority together with the Kings and acceptable pretence of peace to draw men in and then to have adjourned the Parliament for a long time the exclusion of all remedy in the case but by another Warre Wee say the House at the passing Vote upon the Kings Answers immediately appointed a Committee to goe to the Generall and conferre with him and the Officers of the Army to keepe a good understanding betwixt the House and the Army Which shewed the full intent of the House to proceed by all amicable wayes with them not by force but by reason Which they were so far from attending unto as in duty and conscience they ought to have done and to which the Lord Generall promised his readinesse however it was hindered afterwards That they seized upon one of the Commissioners appointed to Treat with them affronted another of them and left no way for any conference that might have given them the the grounds of the Houses proceedings which gives grounds of suspiâ—ion that they were resolved to do what they had designed whatsoever the Houses had endeavoured to the contrary Thus we have the more largely opened the thoughts of our hearts for their satisfaction if it be possible and especially for the satisfaction of those that intrusted us in what we have done upon the result of this Treaty and in passing that Vote Dâ—â—â—mb 5. That the Answers of the King to the Prepositions of both Houses are a ground for the House to proceed upon for the settlement of the peace of the Kingdome for which wee are charged to betray our Trust to bee selfe-servers to complect her in our wicked designs and the like For betraying our Trust as our faithfulnesse hath appeared by our services and sufferings so wee hope it will not be accounted belonging our Trust to endeavour the obtaining of a just peace and for serving our selves our owne hearts beare us witnesse that wee had not respect in this Vote or any private byasse towards our selves so all that know what threatnings were cast into the House in the Anmiâ—s Remonstrance and Declarations in the entrance upon this debate what power of the Army was then in this City what Language was commonly spoke amongst the Souldiers what Guards we then had will judge that we had more cause to be byassed by fearâ— from doing our duties then at that time to thinke to serve our selves by such a vote as this to which nothing but the forceable impulse of our consciences for the discharge of our duties could have led us And we now appeale even to the Consciences of those even the Army themselves although Souldiers whose advantages arise by Warre are not altogether the most competent Judges of constitutions for peace Whether this were to bring in the King upon his owne Termes or upon the Kingdomes Termes Whether the sixt and last particular of their account be ground of necessity to warrant their extraordinary course in secluding us from the House carrying us along the streets of this City by their Souldiers as if wee were their Captive slaves and to imprison our persons and reproach our names And to what they say in the close That these Members who are yet detained in custody they are either such who have beene formerly impeached and in part judged by the house for Treason and other crimes and never acquitted and against whom they can and very shortly shall produce new matter of no lesse Crime or else such who have appeared most active and united in Councells with them against whom also they are preparing and shall shortly give matter of particular impeachment Wee say as wee doubt not but by what wee have said already wee yet stand cleare in the judgements of all men that are guided by the Rules of Religion Lawes or Reason so when all or any of us know what are those new Crimes they say they can charge some of us with and what those charges are they say they are preparing for others and when we know who those some and others are we doubt not but they will make their innocency and integrity appeare against those Crimes and Charges which they have either in pretence or in preparation against them Lastly the Army who hath done this against us and have strengthened their hands to pursue it say they appealâ— to God And wee also appeale unto God who is our strength and besides him wee have none other to cleare our innocency and protect us from violence If in what we have endeavoured wee may bee instrumentall to the settling of this Kingdom in a safe and well grounded peace wherein truth and righteousnesse may flourish If we may contribute to the saving of Ireland the Union betwixt the kingdomes of England and Scotland the peservation of the Parliament the Government and Lawes of the Land the true Protestant Religion and the Liberties of the people wee have our hearts