that they had also some care to prouide for the poore and that they were such as dyd mynister the sacramentes And in an other Councell they haue authoritie geuen them to make subdeacons exorcists and readers I know thys was a corruption of the mynistery but yet all men see how Maister Doctor looketh as it were a farre of vpon things and therefore taketh a man for a molehill when he would make vs beleeue that these were chauncelors c. In the. 125. page to the admonition desyring that these may be remoued and the eldershyp establyshed according to Gods order M. Doctor aunswereth that that were to place in stede of wise and discrete men vnlearned ignorant and vnapt to rule Let Maister Doctor take heede least in alowing so well of the popishe ceremonies not only as tollerable but as fitte and then acquainting hym selfe with the papistes maner of speaking in saying that the people be ignoraunt and vnlearned he fal or ouer he be aware into some worse thing Moses in Deuteronomie and Salomon in hys prouerbes place the principall wisedome in keeking Gods commaundementes and in fearing god And Dauid sayeth that the secretes and the priuy councell of the Lord is knowen to those which feare hym and I haue shewed out of S. Paule that he geueth to the spirituall man great discretion and iudgement of things If therefore there be in euery church which feare God and keepe hys commaundementes there are both wise and learned discrete men and therefore not to be spoken of so contemptuously as M. Doctor speaketh And God be praysed there are numbers in the church that are hable to be teachers vnto most of the chauncelors in any matter perteyning to the church and are hable to geue a ryper iudgement in any ecclesiastical matter then the most part of them can And besides that the choysest are to be taken to thys office thys ought not to be forgotten that seeing good successe of thinges depend vppon the blessing of God and that blessing followeth the church when the Lordes order is kept simple men which carry no great countenaunce or shew will vndoubtedly doe more good vnto the church hauing a lawfull calling then those of great port whiche haue no such calling In the. 228. page he thinketh the Archbyshoppes Courte necessary but bringeth no reason and further confesseth hym selfe ignoraunt of the estate of it and therefore I know not from whence that good opynion of hys shoulde come onlesse it be from thence that he lyketh of all things be they neuer so euill whych the admonition missyketh The rest which M. D. hath of thys matter is nothing else but great and high wordes And as for the Canon law it is knowen what a stroke it beareth with vs and that a few cases excepted it remayneth in her former effect To the sections beginning in the. 118. page and holding on vntill the. 123. page It was before shewed that of the gouernoures of the church there were some whose charge pertayned vnto the whole church of the which we haue spoken some other whose charges extend but to a part of the church that is vnto the poore and these are the deacons And as in the former part I shewed there were two kindes so in this latter part the same is to be noted that of those whose charge was ouer the poore some had charge ouer all the poore of the church as those which are called deacons some had charge ouer the poore straungers and those poore which were sicke only and those S. Paule calleth in one place Dyaconisses and in an other place widdowes For the deacons dyd distribute vnto the necessyties as well of the poore straungers and the sicke poore as vnto the other poore of the church And the widdowes did employ their laboures to the washing of the feete of the straungers and attending vppon the poore which were sicke and had no frendes to keepe them First I will speake of the deacons whereas M. Doctor cryeth out of daiying with the scriptures for alledging the. 8. verse of the twelfth vnto the Romaines to proue deacons affirming that there is no worde of them Truely I can fynde no wordes to set forth thys so grosse ignorance And had it not bene enough for M. Doctor to haue vttered thys ignorance but he must also with an outery proclayme it and as it were spred the banner of it What doe these wordes note he that distributeth in simplicitie but the office of the deaconshyp For in that place S. Paule reckeneth vp all the ordinary and perpetuall offices of the church as the office of the doctor of the pastor of the deacon of the elder and leaueth not out so muche as the widdow which he comprehendeth in these wordes shewing mercy If the authors of the Admonition doe daily with the scriptures in thys place surely Maister Caluin M Beza M. Bucer Peter Martyr c. doe dally with them And shall all these be esteemed to play with the scriptures and M. Doctor only to handle them seriously And as M. Doctors ignorance appeareth in thys place so hys mynde not desirous of the truth but secking to cauill doth as manifestly shew it selfe For all men see that the admonition alledgeth not the place to the Tessalonians to proue the office of deacons but to shew that idle vagavondes might not haue any of that reliefe which belongeth vnto those which bee poore in deede which thing appeareth both by the placing of the quotation ouer agaynst that allegation by the letter which directeth therunto And whereas M. Doctor sayth that the office of the deacons is not only to prouide for the poore but also to preach and mynister the sacramentes I haue shewed before that it doth not appertayne vnto them to doe eyther the one or the other For the proofe whereof thys place of the Romaines quoted by the admonition is very fit most proper For S. Paule speaketh there agaynst those which not contenting themselues with their owne vocatiōs dyd breake into that which appertayned vnto others as if the hand should take vpon it the office of the eye or of some other member of the body therfore S. Paule doth as it were bound point the limites of euery office in the church so placeth the deacons office only in the preuysion for the poore Thys one thing I will adde to that matter that if the apostles whiche hadde suche excellent and passing gyftes dyd fynde them selues preaching of the woorde and attending to prayer not able to prouyde for the poore but thought it necessarye to dyscharge them selues of that offyce to the ende they myght doe the other effectually and fruitefully hee that shall doe both now must eyther doe none well and profitably or else hee must haue greater giftes then the Apostles had The seconde poynt is touching that there were deacons in euery churche which is well proued of the admonition both by the place of the
oute any wythout good cause that then the Magistrates shoulde compell the churches to doe their duetye In deede the byshop of Rome gaue the election then into the Emperoure hys handes because of the lyghtnesse of the people as Platina maketh mention but that is not the matter for I do nothing else heere but shew that the elections of the ministers by the Church were vsed in the times of the Emperoures and by their consentes and seeing that Otho confessed it pertayned not vnto him it is to be doubted whether he tooke it at the Bishop his handes And if the Emperoures permitted the election of the byshop to that Citie where it made most for their suertie to haue one of their owne appoyntment as was Rome which with their byshoppes dyd often tymes put the good Emperoures to trouble it is to be thought that in other places both Cities townes they dyd not deny the elections of the ministers to the people Besides that certayne of those constitutions are not of Rome but of any citie whatsoeuer And these Emperoures were and lyued betweene 500. and odde yeares vntill the very poynt of a thousande yeares after Christ so that hyther to thys lyberty was not gone out of the Church albeit the Pope which brought in all tyranny and went about to take all libertie from the churches was now on horse backe had placed hym selfe in that Antichristian seate To the next section in the 45. THose that write the Centuries suspect thys Canon and doubt whether it be a bastarde or no considering the practise of the church But heere or euer you were aware you haue striken at your selfe For before you sayde that thys order of chusing the minister by voyces of the church was but in the Apostles tyme and duryng the time of persecution And the first time you can alledge thys libertie to be taken awaye was in the 334. yeare of our Lorde which was at the least 31. yeares after that Constantine the great began to raigne I say at the least because there be good authors that say that thys Councell of Laodicea was holden Anno. 338. after the death of Iouinian the Emperoure and so there is 35. yeares betweene the beginning of Constantines raigne and thys councel Now I thinke you will not say that the Church was vnder persecution in Cōstantines tyme And therfore you see you are greatly deceiued in your accoumpt And if it be as lawfull for vs to vse maister Caluins authoritie which both by example and wrytings hath alwayes defended our cause as it is for you to wryng him and his wordes to things which he neuer meant and the contrary wherof he continually practised then thys authoritie of youres is dashed For maister Caluin sayth where as it is sayd in that councel that the election should not be permitted to the people it meaneth nothing else but that they should make no election without hauing some ministers or men of iudgement to direct them in their election and to gather their voyces and prouyde that nothing be done tumultuously euen as Paule and Barnabas were cheefe in the election of the churches And euen the same order woulde we haue kepte in elections continually for auoyding of confusion for as we would haue the libertie of the Church preserued which Christ hath bought so dearely from all tyranny so do we agayne condemne and vtterly abhorre all barbarous confusion and disorder But if councelles be of so great authoritie to decide thys controuersy then the most famous councell of Nice will strike a great stroke with you which in an Epistle that it wryteth vnto the Church of Egipt as Theodoret maketh mention speaketh thus It is meete that you should haue power both to chuse any man and to geue their names which are worthy to be amongst the clergye and to doe all things absolutely according to the law and decrees of the churche And if it happen any to dye in the churche then those which were last taken are to be promoted to the honor of him that is dead with thys condition if they be worthy and the people chuse them and the bishop of the citie of Alexandria together geuing his consent and appoynting them An other of the famousest councelles called the councell of Constantinople which was gathered vnder Theodosius the great as it is witnessed by the * Tripartite storie in an Epistle which it wrote to Damasus the pope and Ambrose and others sayth thus We haue ordayned Nectarius the byshoppe of Constantinople with the whole consent of the counsell in the sight of the Emperour Theodosius beloued of God the whole Citie together decreeing the same Likewise he sayth that Flauian was appoynted by that synode byshop of Antioche the whole people appoynting him Likewise in the councell of Carthage where Augustine was holden about anno domini 400. in the first canon of the councell it is sayde when hee hath bene examyned in all these and founde fully instructed then let hym be ordayned Byshop by the common consent of the clarkes and the lay people and the Byshoppes of the prouince and especially eyther by the authoritie or presence of the metropolitane And in the Toletane councell as it appeareth in the 51. distinction it was thus ordayned Let not hym be counted a priest of the Churche for so they speake whome neyther the clergye nor people of that citie where he is a priest doth chuse nor the consent of the metropolitane other priests in that prouince hath sought after Moreouer concilium Cabilonense which was holden anno domini 650. in the tenth Canon hath thys If any Bishop after the death of hys predecessor be chosen of any but of the byshops in the same prouince and of the cleargie citizens let an other be chosen and if it be otherwise let that ordination be accompted of none effect All which councelles proue manifestly that as the people in their elections had the ministers rounde about or synodes counceiles directing them so there was none came to be ouer the people but by their voyces or consentes To the next section in the 45. page Thys alteration c. IN deede if you put such darke coleures vpon the Apostles church as thys is it is no maruell if it ought not to be a patrone to vs of framing and fashioning our church after it But O Lord who can paciently heare thys horrible disorder ascribed to the Apostles church which heere you attribute vnto it that euery one hand ouer head preached baptised and expounded the Scriptures VVhat a window nay what a gate is opened heere to Anabaptistes to confirme their fantasticall opynion wherin they holde that euery man whome the spirite moueth may come euen from the ploughe taile to the pulpit to preache the worde of god If you say it is Ambrose saying and not youres I answere vnlesse you allow it why bring you it and that to proue the difference betwene the Apostles times and these
seuered from other men by any note of apparell You say you knowe that the cheefe notes of a minister are doctrine and learning if you meane that the distinction of apparell must supply the rest and that that also hath some force to commend their ministery the prophets and apostles of our sauior Christe left vs no perfect paterne of a minister nor no sufficient glas to dres him by wherof the moste parte neuer vsed any suche seuerall apparell and none of them haue left any commaundement of it For want of store and to make a long boke heere is S. Iohns miter rehearsed thrise in one leafe to the same purpose and in the same wordes And because it was not enough that M. Bullinger and M. Martyr should speake of them you haue preuented them both least you shuld haue semed to haue brought nothing If this be not Coleworts twise sodden I can not tell what is You aske whether the christian magistrate may enioyne a seuerall kinde of apparell to the ministers Either the cause is too weake whych you defende or else it hath gotten an euill patron whych would so gladly shift it and chaunge it with an other For this is an other question which you speake of For although that be graunted vnto you whych you demaunde yet you can not conclude your cause For all be it the magistrate may commaunde a seuerall apparell yet it foloweth not that he may commaund this kinde of popishe apparell and therefore what manner of argument is this of youres the magistrate maye commaunde a seuerall apparell therfore he may commaunde this The colledge walles will tell you that a man can not conclude from the whole to the parte affirmatiuely So you see I might let you fish and catch nothing but I am neyther afrayde nor ashamed to tell you the truth of that you aske so farreforth at least as I am perswaded I thincke therefore it may be such a kinde of apparell as the magistrate commaunding it the minister may refuse it and such it may be as he may not refuse it But whatsoeuer apparell it be this commaundement can not be without some iniury done to the minister For seeing that the magistrate doth allow of him as of a wise learned and discrete man and trusteth him with the gouernement of his people in matters betwene God and them it were somewhat harde not to trust him with the appoynting of his owne apparell and he is probably to be supposed that he hath discretion to weare his owne geare comely and in order that is able to teach others how they should weare theirs and that he should be able to doe that by his wisdome and learning that others do without learning and great store of wisedome that he should keepe order and decencie in apparel which hath learned in the schole of Christ which they doe that had neuer other scholemaster then common sense and reason And if any minister be founde to fault in going either dissolutely or to exquisitely and delicately then the Magistrate may punishe him according to the disorder wherein he faulteth And whereas you would proue that it may be done with the ministers as it is done with Iudges sergeants Aldermen and Sheriffes the case is not like For as for these which be in office their robes and gownes may as their maces swordes somewhat helpe to set forth the maiestie and moderate pompe which is meete for the offices of iustice which they execute and consequently to helpe to strike a profitable feare into their heartes which are vnderneath them which hath nor can haue no place in the minister whose authoritie and power as it is not outwarde so can it not nor ought not to borow any credite of these externall shewes And the Magistrate or the Citie may seeke some honor of the citizens mustering as it were by numbers in one liuerie which ought not to be loked for at the ministers hand because he honoureth and serueth the magistrate an other way nor can not also considering that they are scattered through all the land in euery towne one or not so many as being put in one liuery would make any great shew to the honor commendation of the towne or citie where they remaine And so you see your question answered whereby appeareth they are subiectes as other are and to obay also sometimes where the commaundement is not geuen vpon good grounds The place of Theodoret cited of M. Bullinger maketh mention of a golden cope and that vsed by byshops of Ierusalem and solde by Cyrill a good bishop whereby he declared sufficiently his misliking of such garments in the ministerie of the sacramentes In the place the which hee citeth out of Socrates there is one Sycinius an Nouatian bishop which is sayd to haue worne white apparell and therefore is reprehended as for to muche exquisitenesse finenesse of apparell the B. of Duresine in a letter he wrote alledgeth the same place agaynst the surplice A man would hardly beleue that maister Bullinger shoulde vse these places to proue a distinction of apparell amongst the ministers We are not ignorant but that a cloke hath bene vsed of the ministers in theyr seruice but that was no seuerall apparell of the ministers but common to all the Christians which with change of their religion changed also their apparell as appeareth manifestly in Tertullian de pallio As for the Petalum that S. Iohn ware I see not how it can bee proued to be like a bishops miter For the cap that S. Cyprian gaue the executioner argueth rather that it was the commō apparell which was customably worne for else it would not haue done him so much good As for his vpper garment which hee gaue to hys deacon it was a token of his good will which he would leaue with him as the practise hath bene seene with vs and proueth nothing that it was any seuerall apparell As for the white linnen garment which he suffered in it can not seme strange vnto vs which haue sene the holy martyrs of the Lord executed in Smithfield and other places And it is not to be thought that S. Cyprian had so small iudgement that lyuing in the time of persecution he would by wearing of some notable apparell from the rest as it weare betray him selfe into the handes of his enemies vnles all the christians had done so too for clearer and more open profession of theyr fayth and greater detestation of the contrary religion as Tertullian and the christians in his time did by the wearing of a cloke which reason may be also alledged of the Petalum of S. Iohn It is true Chrysostome maketh mention of a white garment but not in commendation of it but rather to the contrary For he sheweth that the dignitie of their ministerie their safetie and crowne was in taking heede that none vnmeete were admitted to the Lordes supper not in going about the church with a white garment And
not comely and agreeable to the simplicitie of the gospell of Christe crucified they may not be established Concerning your distinction wherby you lesten the idolatrie of the papistes I haue shewed the vanitie thereof But of thys matter you say you will speake againe In deede so you doe and againe wherin you confound the memorie and vnderstanding of the reader and declare your selfe not onlye ignorante of Aristotles rule of katholou proton whych is to speake of one thyng generally and once for all but euen to be voide of that order whych men haue commonly by the naturall logicke of reason Neither can you excuse your selfe in saying that the Admonition geueth you so often times occasion to speake of them and so to lay the faulte vpon it for that it being wrytten by diuers persons of the same matters whereof one knewe not of an others doing can not be blamed for the repetition of one thing twise when as you can not escape blame whych might haue gathered easely into one place y which is sayd of them in diuers Whych thing although it be not so easy for me to doe in your booke as it was for you to doe in theirs yet I will assay to doe it bothe in thys and in all other poyntes that folowe not thincking thereby to bring thys treatise of youres to any good order for that were to cast it new againe and then you would complaine of your minde peruerted but that I might remedy this so great disorder as farre as maye be done wythoute chaunging any thyng of that whych you haue set downe And if there be any other arguments touching any of these poyntes in other places whych I haue not gathered togither into one the fault is in thys that I could not bestowe so muche time in making a Harmonie of the things which are at so great discorde and then that whych is left out shall be answeared in place where I shall finde it Nowe let vs see M. Doctors deuteron ploun and second nauigation touching apparell whether it be any happier or haue any better succes then the first In the. 105. page M. Doctor to proue the vse of the surplice to draw out hys booke into some competent volume boroweth certen places of the examiner for answere wherevnto I will referre the reader to that which is answered vnto the examination as to a full and sufficient answere wherein I will rest and when M. Doctor hathe proued that which he sayth that it is but a childishe cauill he shall then heare further In the meane season it is but a slender Replie to so learned an answere that proueth bothe oute of other authors and out of those same whych the examiner citeth that by a white garment is meant a comely apparell and not slouēly to say it is but a childishe cauill whych a D. of Diuinitie and of xl yeares of age can not answer The place of Ierome vpon the. 44. of Ezechiel the more it be considered the more shall appeare the truthe of the answere Nowe I wil desire the reader to turne vnto the. 237. 238. 239. 240. 242. pages to see whether at thys third voyage M. doctor bringeth any better marchaundise Where first he surmiseth an vntruthe as though the admonition misliked of the taking away of the gray Amis where it sayeth only that there was les cause to take that away then the surplice c. Wherin there is nothing but the truthe sayde for because that was vsed but in few churches and but of few also in those few churches therfore if there were cause to take away that there was greater to take away the surplice And to take away the Amis out of the church and leaue the surplice c. is to heale a scratch and leaue a wound vnhealed Nowe whereas you say that we are alwayes Ad oppositum and that if the lawe commaunded straightly that we shoulde weare none of thys apparell that then we would weare if it should be answered againe that you doe Seruire scenae that is that you are a time seruer you see we mighte speake wyth more likelyhoode then you But we will not take as you doe the iudgement of God out of his handes but will attende paciently the reuelation and discouering of that whych is nowe hid bothe in you and in vs. And although you will graunt vs neither learning nor conscience yet you might aforde vs so muche witte as that we would not willingly and of purpose want those commodities of life whych we might otherwise enioy as wel as you if we had that gift of conformitie whych you haue Wheras you say that the accursed things of Iericho and the oxe that was fed to be sanctified vnto Baall and the woode consecrated vnto the Idoll were conuerted to the seruice of the liuing God when you shall proue that the surplice is so necessary to the seruice of God as gold and siluer and other mettal and as oxen and woode wherof the first sort were such as without the which the temple could not be builte the other suche as were expresly commaunded of God to be vsed in hys seruice then I will confesse that this place maketh some thing for you And yet if your copes and surplices c. shoulde haue suche a purgation by fire as those metalles had or euer the Lord would admit them into his treasure house and shuld be driuen to passe from popery vnto the gospel by the chimney the fire would make such wracke wyth them that they should neede haue better legs then your arguments to bring them into the church Moreouer do you not see heere that you haue not losed the knot but cutte it For the authors of the Admonition obiect the place of Esay and you obiecte againe the places of Deuteronomie and of the Iudges this is to oppose sword against sworde in stead that you shuld haue first holden out your buckler latched the blow of your aduersary As for churches it hath ben answered that they haue a profitable vse and therefore very euill compared with the surplice whych beside that it bringeth no profite hurteth also as is before sayde To be short sayth M. Doctor when he reciteth me almost a whole side word for word as he hath cited before wher he hath had his answere After this he setteth him selfe to proue that they edifye and that first by M. Bucers and M. Martyrs authoritye and yet in their wordes before alledged there is not a worde of edifying If he gather it of their wordes the answere is already made Then he bringeth reasons to proue it whereof in the first he seemeth to reason that because it is commaunded by a lawfull magistrate and lawfull authoritye therfore it edifieth As though a lawful magistrate doth nothing at any time vnlawfully or as thoughe a lawfull and a godly magistrate dothe not sometimes commaund things whych are inconuement and vnlawfull Saule was a lawfull magistrate and did commaund vnlawfull
if thou be neither Christ nor Elias nor of the Prophets why baptisest thou whych had bene no good argument if s Iohn might haue bene of some other function then of those whych were ordinarie in the churche and instituted of god And therefore S. Iohn to establish his singular and extraordinary function alledgeth the word of God wherby appeareth that as it was not lawfull to bring in any strange doctrine so was it not lawfull to teache the true doctrine vnder the name of any other function then was instituted by God. Let the whole practise of the churche vnder the lawe be loked vpon and it shall not be founde that any other Ecclesiasticall ministery was appoynted then those orders of highe priest and priests and Leuites c. whych were appoynted by the law of God if there were any raised extraordinarily the same had their calling confirmed from heauen either by signes or miracles or by plaine cleare testimonies of the mouthe of God or by extraordinarye exciting and mouings of the spirite of god So that it appeareth that the ministerie of the gospell and the functions thereof ought to be from heauen and of God and not inuented by the braine of men from heauen I say and heauenly because althoughe it be executed by earthly men the ministers also are chosen by men like vnto themselues yet because it is done by the word and institution of God that hath not only ordained that the word should be preached but hathe ordained also in what order and by whome it should be preached it may well be accounted to come from heauen and from God. Seeing therefore that these functions of the Archbishop and Archdeacon are not in the word of God it foloweth that they are of the earth so can do no good but much harme in the church And if any man will say the we do the church great iniurye because we doe tie her to a certaine nomber of orders of ministers as it were to a stake so that she may not deuise new functions I say that bothe the churche and Christ doth accuse him againe Christ estemeth him selfe to haue iniurie because that by thys meanes he is imagined not to haue bene careful and prouident enough for hys church in that he hath left the ministerie wherein doth consist the life of the church being that wherby it is begottē so raw and vnperfect that by permitting of it to the ordering of men there is a great danger of error whych he might haue set without all daunger by a word or two speaking The churche of the other side riseth against hym for that he maketh Christ les carefull for her then he was for that vnder the lawe For tell me in the whole volume of the Testament is there any kinde or degre of ministerie wherof God is not the certen and expres author was there euer any man I except Ieroboam and suche prophane men either so holy or so wise or of suche great knowledge that euer did so muche as dreame of instituting of a newe ministerie After the long wandring of the Arke in the wildernesse when it came to be placed in Ierusalem tell me if any besides the Leuites and Priestes the ordinarie ministers and the Prophets whych were immediatly stirred vp of God were found to haue ordained any office or title whych was not commaunded or whether there was at any time any thing added or enioyned to those offices of priesthode and Leuiteship whych was not by the lawe prescribed All men knowe that the Arke of Noah was a figure of the church Noah was both a wise and a godly man yet what doth the Lord leaue to his wisdom when as he appoynteth the matter the forme the length the bredth the heigth the woode the kinde and sorte of woode In the tabernacle the church is yet more expressedly shewed forth Moses that was the ouerseer of the worke was a wise and a godly man the artificers that wroughte it Bezalael and Aholiab most cunning workemen and yet obserue howe the Lorde leaueth nothing to their will but telleth not onlye of the boordes of the curtaines of the apparell but also of the barres of the rings of the strings of the hookes of the besomes of the snuffers and of the thyngs the matter and the forme Let vs come to the temple whych as it was more neare the time of Christ so it dothe more liuely expres the churche of God whych nowe is Salomon the wisest man that euer was or shall be dothe nothing in it neyther for the temple nor for the vesselles of the temple nor for the beautie of it but according to the forme that was enioyned hym as appeareth in the Kings and Chronicles And in the restoring of that temple Ezechiel is witnes howe the Angell by the commaundement of God doth parte by parte appoynt all to be done bothe in the temple and in the furniture thereof Nowe if the holy ghoste in Figures and Tropes dothe so carefully and as a man may speake curiously comprehende all things in the truthe it selfe howe muche more is it to be thought that he hath performed this If in the shadowes howe muche more in the body if he haue done this in earthly things and which are pearished how is it to be thought that he hath not performed it in heauenly and those whych abide for euer And then tell me what are those times of which it was sayd the Messias when he commeth will tell vs all Is it a like thyng that he whych did not only appoynt the temple and the tabernacle but the ornaments of them woulde not only neglecte the ornamentes of the churche but also that wythout the whych as we are borne in hand it can not long stande shall we thinke that he which remembred the barres there hathe forgotten the pillers heere or he that there remembred the pinnes did heere forget the master builders shoulde he there remember the besomes and heere forget Archbyshops if any had bene needefull there make mention of the snuffers to purge the lights and heere passe by the lightes them selues And to conclude that he shoulde make mention there of the moates and heere say nothing of the beames there recken vp the gnattes heere keepe silence of the Camels what is this else but that which Aristotle sayth ta mikra horan kai ta megala paroran that is to looke to small things and not to looke to great which if it can not fall into the Lorde let it be a shame to say that the cheefe piller and vpholder of the churche is not expressed in the scripture nor can not bee concluded of it Moreouer those ministeries without the which the churche is fully builded and brought to perfection and complete vnitie are not to be retayned in the churche but with out the ministeries of Archbishop c. the churche maye bee fully builded and broughte to perfection therefore these ministeries are not
to be retayned And that without these ministeries the Churche may be complete it appeareth by that which is in the Ephesians where it is sayde that Christe gaue some Apostles some Prophetes some Euangelistes some pastors and Doctors to the restoring of the sayntes vnto the worke of the ministerie vntill wee all come to the vnitie of fayth and of the knowledge of the sonne of God and vnto a perfect man. The learned wryters haue thus reasoned agaynste the Pope that for so muche as Apostles Prophetes c. are sufficient for the building of the churche therefore there ought to be no Pope The argument and necessitie of the conclusion is as strong agaynst the Archbishoppe and all one For by the same reason that the Pope is cast away as a superfluous thing for that these offyces are able to make perfect the Churche is the Archbishoppe likewise throwne out of the Churche as a knobbe or some lumpe of fleshe which being no member of the body doth both burden it and disfigure it And as they say that God gaue no Pope to his church therefore the Pope can doe no good so we may well say God gaue no Archbishop to his church therefore the Archbishop can do no good Neyther dyd God geue any archdeacon to his church therefore he can not profite the church But it will be sayde that this argument followeth not because no mention is made heere of the deacon or of the elder which notwithstanding are bothe necessarye in the churche and therefore that there are functions profitable in the church whereof no mention is made heere But how easely doe all men know that the Apostle speaketh of those functions heere only which are conuersant in the worde and haue to doe with the preaching thereof and therefore made heere no mention of the deacon or elder It is sayde agayne that in the Epistle to the Corinth S. Paule speaketh only of Apostles Prophetes and Doctors leauing out Euangelistes and pastors and yet Euangelistes and pastors necessary and so although archbishops are not spoken of in the place to the Ephesians yet they may not be therfore shut out as vnnecessary But they that say so should haue considered that the diuersitie of the matter which the Apostle handleth in these two places bred a diuers kinde of speche For in the Epistle to the Corinthians going aboute to condemne the ambition of men which will thrust them selues into other mens callings and take vpon them to doe all them selues and to be as it were eye and eare and hande and all S. Paule proueth that the churche is a body wherein there are manye members and the same diuers one from an other and that it is not one member only And to proue that it was sufficient to say that he placed some Apostles some Prophets some Doctors without rehearsing all the kindes of functions But in the Epistle to the Ephesians meaning to shew the liberalitie of our sauiour Christ in geuing those which shoulde be able by doctrine and teaching to make perfect and absolute hys church it was necessary that he shoulde recken vp all those functions whereby that worke is done But how commeth it to passe that S. Paule neyther in the one place neyther in the other nor else where maketh mention of the archbishop which is sayd to be the cheefest piller and vnder setter of the church Now I heare what is sayde to this that vnder the pastor is contayned byshop he is not contayned but is the same that pastor How then forsoth say they an archbyshop is byshop well then of byshops some are archbyshops some are what Heere I see that they are hanged in the bush but I will helpe them Of byshops some are archbyshops some are by the common name byshops For if they answere not thus what haue they to say But what an absurd thing were that to say that S. Paule comprehended an archbyshop vnder a pastor or byshop which neyther was at that time nor certayne hundreth yeares after thys were not to deuide but to prophesie And how is it that they neuer marked that S. Paule speaketh of those functions which were in the church and not of those which should be afterwarde and of those that God had geuen and not of those which he would geue for the words are and he hath geuen Moreouer if so be vnder the pastor the apostle comprehended an archbyshop then the archbyshop is necessary and such as the church can not be without and commaunded of God and therefore not taken vp by the pollicie of the church for the time and countrey and other circumstances and such also as can not be put downe at the will of the church which is contrary to the iudgement of those which are the archbyshops patrones The last refuge is that the Apostle made mention of those functions which haue to do with the ministring of the word sacraments not of those which haue to do with order discipline Speake in good earnest had the Apostles nothing to doe with discipline order with what face can you take away the raines of gouernment out of the Apostles hands and put them in the Archbyshops and Archdeacons hands what a peruersenesse is thys that the ministeries inuented by men should be preferred to all the ministeries appoynted and commaunded of God. The Apostles forsoth haue in common with the Archbyshops and Archdeacons the power of ministring of the worde and of the sacraments of binding and losyng and thus farre as good as the Archbyshops and Archdeacons But for disciplyne and order the Apostles haue nothing to doe but herein Archbyshops and Archdeacons are aboue them and better then they Now syr if I would follow your vaine of making so many exclamations as Oh the impudencie Oh the insolencie with twentie other such great Ohs you see I haue occasion both heere and else where but I would not gladly declame especially when I should dispute nor make outcries in stead of reasons But to come to this distinction I had thought before this time that the apostles had bene the * cheefe builders in setting vp the church now I perceiue you make the archbyshops and archdeacons the cheefe builders and the apostles vnder carpenters or common masons to serue and to take the commaundement of the archbishop and archdeacon And wheras it is sayd that the ministers which S. Paule speaketh of are in the worde and sacramentes binding and loosing only and that there be other which are besides these occupyed in the order and disciplyne of the church of which number are archbyshops and archdeacons let vs marke a little what deepe diuinitie heere is And first of all I would gladly aske them with what aduise they haue layde on a greater burden and waight of the archbishops and archdeacons shoulders then the apostles were able to sustaine Secondarily I aske with what boldnesse and vpon the confidence of what giftes any man dare take vppon
witnesses are Popes whereof the first and best ordained that if the Metropolitane did not fetche hys pall at the apostolike sea of Rome wythin three monthes after he were consecrated that then he should lose his dignity as Gratian witnesseth in the decrees y he ascribeth vnto Damasus I doubt not therfore that this is but a forger vpon whom you would father the archdeacon for that Damasus in whose place you put this forger liued An. 387. at what time the sea of Rome had no suche tirannye as thys and other things which are fathered of him do pretēd And if this be enough to proue archdeacons I can with better witnes proue subdeacons acoluthes exorcistes lectores ostiarios these dothe Eusebius make mention of an auncienter wryter then any you bring and out of Ruffine Theodoret Sozomen Socrates c. monks almost in euery page And heere vpon it is more lawfull for me to conclude that monkes subdeacons exorcistes acoluthes ostiarij lectores are necessary ecclesiasticall orders in the church as you conclude the necessity of the archdeacon I perceiue you care not whether the archdeacon fall or no that you bestow so little coste of hym and leaue him so nakedly And if I woulde be but halfe so holde in coniectures and diuinations as you are I coulde say that thys sleighte handling of the archdeacon and sweating so muche aboute the archbyshoppe is thervpon y you woid be loth to come frō being deane to be an archdeacon you liue in some hope of being archbyshop but I will not enter so farre And surely for any thing that I see you might haue trussed vp the archbyshop as shorte as you do the archdeacon For they stand vpon one pinne and those reasons whych establishe the one establishe the other wherevpon also commeth to passe that all those reasons whych were before alledged against the archbishop may be drawn against the archdeacon hauing therfore before proued the vnlawfulnes of them I will heere set downe the difference betweene those archdeacons that were in times past and those whych are nowe whereby it may appeare they are nothing like but in name They were no ministers as appeareth in Sozomen oures are They were tied to a certaine churche and were called archdeacon of suche a congregation or churche oures are tied to none but are called archdeacons of suche a shire They were chosen by all the Deacons of the churche where they be archdeacons oures are appoynted by one man and whych is no deacon They were subiect to the minister of the word oures are aboue them and rule ouer them It was counted to them great arrogancie if they preferred thēselues to any minister or elder of the churche oures will not take the best ministers of the churche as their equalles If therfore archdeacons will haue any benefite by the archdeacons of olde time it is meete they shoulde content them selues wyth that place whych they were in As for the office of a deane as it is vsed wyth vs it is therfore vnlawfull for that he being minister hathe no seuerall charge or congregation appoynted wherein he maye exercise hys ministerie and for that he is ruler and as it were maister of diuers other ministers in hys colledge whych likewise haue no seueral charges of congregations and for that whych is most intollerable bothe he hym selfe oftentimes hauing a seuerall churche or benefice as they call it is vnder the coloure of hys deaneship absent from hys churche and suffereth also those that are vnderneathe hym to be likewise absent from their churches And whereas M. Doctor alleageth S. Augustine to proue thys office to be auncient in deede the name is there founde but besides the name not one propertye of that Deane whych we haue For Augustine speaking of the monkes of those dayes sayeth that the money which they gate wyth the labor of their hands they gaue to their deane which did prouide them meate and drinke and cloth and all things necessary for them so that the monkes shoulde not be drawne away from their studies and meditations throughe the care of worldly things so that thys deane whych he speaketh of was seruaunt and steward and cater to the monkes and therfore only called deane because he was steward and cater to ten monkes Now let it be seene what Augustines deane maketh for the deane whych is nowe and what faith and trust M. Doctor vseth in reciting of the olde fathers And vnto the ende that these testimonies might be more autenticall haue some waight in them M. Doctor addeth that hetherto antichrist had not inuaded the seat of Rome You shall haue much a do to proue that antichrist had not inuaded the sea of Rome when your Clement Anaclete Anicete and Damasus wrote Nay it is moste certaine that then he had possessed it But what is that to the purpose althoughe there was no one singulare head appeared or lifted vp yet corruption of doctrine and of the sacraments hurtful ceremonies dominion and pompe of the cleargye newe orders and functions of the ministerie whych were the handes that pulled hym the fete whych brought him the shoulders that lifted and heaued him vp into that seate were in the church Neither while you doe thus speake doe you seeme to remember that this monster needed nine monethes but almoste nine hundreth yeares to be framed and fashioned or euer he could wyth all his partes be brought to light And although the Loouer of thys antichristian building were not set vp yet the foundations therof being secretely and vnder the ground laid in the apostles times you might easely know that in those times that you speake of the building was wonderfully aduaūced and growne very highe And being a very dangerous thing to ground any order or pollicy of the church vpon men at all whych in deede ought to haue their standing vpon the doctrine and orders of the apostles I wil shew what great iniurie M. Doctor doth to sende vs for our examples and paternes of gouernment to these times whych he doth direct vs vnto Eusebius oute of Egesippus wryteth that as long as the apostles liued the churche remained a pure virgin for that if there were any that went about to corrupt the holy rule that was preached they did it in the darke as it were digging vnderneath the earth But after the death of the apostles and the generation was past whych God vouchsaued to heare the deuine wisedome wyth their owne eares then the placing of wicked error began to come into the church Clement also in a certaine place to confirme that there was corruption of doctrine immediately after the apostles times alledgeth the prouerbe that there are fewe sonnes like their fathers And Socrates sayeth of the church of Rome and Alexandria which were the most famous churches in the apostles times that about the yeare 430. the Romaine and Alexandrian byshops leauing the sacred function were degenerate to a
byshops and cleargie in a prouince and if Cyprian will neyther allow of the title of archbyshop nor of the authoritie and office but in playne wordes speaketh agaynst both we may conclude that M. Doctor hath done very vnaduisedly to lay so great waight of the archbyshop vppon S. Cyprians shoulders that wâ—ilnot only not beare any thing of hym but which hath done all that coulde be to make hym goe a foote and hand in hand with hys fellowes There are other reasons which M. Doctor vseth as thys a notable one S. Cyprian speaketh not of the vsurped power of the byshop of Rome therefore he speaketh of the office of an archbyshop and metropolitane It is hard to call thys argument to any head of fallation for it hath not so much as a colour of a reason I thincke it can deceiue no body but your self An other reason is that all the godlyest best learned meÌ„ do expound the place of Cyprian in the 3. epist. of the first booke of an archbyshop The vanitie of thys saying that the godly learned wryters so expound it I haue shewed before and heere it commeth to be considered agayne I will not say that no godly nor learned wryter expoundeth the place of Cyprian of the authoritie of an archbishop But first I desire M. Doctor to set downe but one and then I will leaue it to thy consyderation gentle reader to thincke whether M. Doctor hath red any learned or godly mans exposition to be suche when he hath not red those which are nearest hym I meane our owne countrey men I say he hath not red them because I woulde thinke charitably so of hym rather then that he shoulde haue red them and yet speake vntruely of them and father those things of them which they neuer speake M. Iewell the byshop of Sarisburie expounded thys place and yet dyd neuer expounde it of the office and authoritie of an archbyshop of all the byshops and clergie of the prouince but cleane contrarywise applyeth it to the authoritie that euery byshop had in hys diocesse hys wordes are these Now therefore to draw that thing by violence to one only byshop that is generally spoken of all byshops is a guilefull fetch to misseleade the reader and no simple nor playne dealing Heere you see that M. Iuel doth not vnderstande thys of any archbyshop but of euery byshop M. Nowel Deane of Poules hauing occasion to speake of this place sayth on thys sort So that when he speaketh meaning Cyprian of one byshop one iudge in the churche for the time or of the byshop whych is one and ruleth the church absolutely he meaneth euery byshop in his owne diocesse wythout exception If he speake specially he meaneth the byshop of the citye or diocese wherof he entreateth whether it be the byshop of Rome Carthage or any other place M. Fore also expoundeth thys of euery byshop wythin hys owne churche or diocese You heare the iudgement of these three wryters that can not picke out neyther the name nor the office of an archbyshop out of Cyprians place and yet I thinke you wil not deny but these were learned and godly wryters Now I haue shewed you three I aske once againe of you one godlye and learned wryter that expoundeth it as you doe And by thys time I suppose all men vnderstande what a small friend S. Cyprian is eyther to the name or office of an archbyshop Let vs heare whether Ierome make any more for the archbyshop then did Cyprian The Hebrues doe deriue the name of time of a verbe whych signifyeth to corrupt because in dede it doth corrupt all and as the times are so are meÌ„ which liue in them that euen very good men carye the note of the infection of the times wherin they liue and the streame of the corruption therof being so vehemeÌ„t and forcible doth not only driue before it light things but it cateth also and weareth the very hard and stony rockes and therfore there is not to be loked for such sinceritie at Ierome his hand whych we found in S. Cyprian considering that he liued some ages after Cyprian what time sathan had a great deale more darkned the cleare light of the sonne of the gospell then it was in S. Cyprians time For as those that came nearest vnto the apostles times because they were nearest the light â–ª did see best so those that were further of from these lightes had vntill the time of the manifestation of the sonne of perdition their heauens more darke and cloudy and consequeÌ„tly did see more dimly whych is diligently to be obserued of the reader bothe the better to vnderstand the state of thys question and all other controuersies whych lie betweene vs and the papistes And although Ierome besides his other faultes might haue also in thys matter spoken more soundly yet we shall easely perceiue that he is a great deale further from eyther the title or office of an archbyshop or else from the authority that a byshop hath with vs then he is from the simplicity of the ministery which ought to be and is commended vnto vs by the worde of God. And heere I must put M. Doctor in remembrance howe vnfitly he hath dedicated his boke vnto the churche whych hath so patched it and peeced it of a number of shreds of the doctors that a sentence of the scripture eyther truely or falsely alledged is as it were a Phenix in thys boke If he would haue had the church beleue hym he oughte to haue setled their iudgement and grounded their faith vpon the scriptures whych are the only foundations whervpon the church may build Nowe he doth not only not geue them grounde to stand of but he leadeth them into wayes whych they can not folowe nor come after him For except it be those whych are learned and besides haue the meanes and abilitye to haue the bokes whych are heere cited which are the least and smallest portion of the church how can they know that these things be true whych are alledged and as I haue said if they could know yet haue they nothing to stay them selues vpon and quiet their conscience in allowing that which M. Doctor would so faine haue them like of Therefore he might haue much more fitly dedicated his booke vnto the learned and riche whych haue furnished libraries Ierome sayeth that at the first a byshoppe and an Elder whych you call priest were all one but afterward through factions schismes it was decreed that one should rule ouer the rest Now I say against this order that the bishop shoulde beare rule ouer all that which our sauioure Christ sayth vnto the Pharises from the beginning it was not so and therefore I require that the first order may stande which was that a byshop elder were all one And if you place so great authoritie agaynst the institution of God in a mortall man heare what Tertullian sayth vnto you
good common wealthes wherein many haue lyke power and authoritie And further if because there is one king in a lande aboue all he will conclude there should be one archbyshop ouer all I say as I haue sayde that it is not agaynst any word of God which I know although it be inconuenient but that there may be one Cesar ouer all the world and yet I thinke M. Doctor will not say that there may be one archbyshop ouer all the world Now M. Doctor commeth to hys olde hole where he woulde fayne hyde hym selfe and with hym all the ambition tyranny and excesse of authoritie which is ioyned wyth these functions of archbyshoppe and byshoppe as they are now vsed and thys hys hole is that all the mynisters are equall with byshops and archbyshops as touching the mynisterie of the worde and sacramentes but not as touching pollicie and gouernment The papistes vse the very selfe same distinction for the mayntenance of the Popes tyranny and ambytion and other their hierarchie Maister Doctor hath put out the marke and conceled the name of the papistes and so with a little chaunge of wordes as it were with certayne new coloures he woulde deceiue vs For the papistes saye that euery syr Iohn or hedge priest hath as great authoritie to sacrifice and offer for the quicke and the dead and to mynister the sacramentes as the Pope of Rome hath but for gouernment and for order the byshoppe is aboue a priest the archbyshoppe aboue a byshoppe and the Pope aboue them all But I haue declared before out of the scriptures how vayne a distinction it is and it appeareth out of Cyprian that as all the byshops were equall one to an other so he sayth that to euery one was geuen a portion of the Lordes flocke not only to feede with the worde and sacramentes but to rule and gouerne not as they which shall make any accoumpte vnto an archbyshop or be iudged of hym but as they which can not bee iudged of any but of god And Ierome vpon Titus sayeth that the elder or mynister dyd gouerne and rule in common with the byshops the churche whereof he was elder or mynister After followeth M. Caluin a great patrone forsoth of the archbyshop or of thys kynde of byshop which is vsed amongst vs heere in Englande And heere to passe ouer your straunge cytations and quotations which you make to put your answerer to payne sending hym sometymes to Musculus common places for one sentence to Augustines workes to Chrysostomes workes to Cyrill to Maister Foxe and heere sending hym to the viij chapter of the institutions as though you had neuer red Caluins institutions but tooke the sentence of some bodye else withoute anye examination whereby it seemeth that you were lothe that euer any man should answere your booke letting I say all thys passe what maketh thys eyther to proue that there shoulde bee one archbyshoppe ouer all the mynisters in the prouince or one byshoppe ouer all in the diocese that amongst twelue that were gathered together into one place there was one which ruled the action for which they mette And that it may appeare what superioritie it is which is lawfull amongst the mynisters and what it is that M. Caluin speaketh of what also the fathers and councels doe meane when they geue more to the byshoppe of any one church then to the elder of the same church and that no man be deceiued by the name of gouernoure or ruler ouer the rest to fancie any such authoritie and domination or Lordship as we see vsed in our church it is to be vnderstanded that amongst the pastors elders and deacons of euery particulare church and in the meetinges and companies of the mynisters or elders of dyuers churches there was one chosen by the voyces and suffrages of them all or the most part which did propound the matters that were to be handled whether they were difficulties to be soluted or punishmentes and censures to be decreed vpon those which had faulted or whether there were elections to be made or what other matter so euer occasion was geuen to entreate of the which also gathered the voyces and reasons of those which had interest to speake in such cases whiche also did pronounce according to the number of the voyces whiche were geuen which was also the mouth of the rest to admonishe or to comfort or to rebuke sharply such as were to receiue admonishment consolation or rebuke and which in a worde dyd moderate that whole action which was done for the time they were assembled which thing we do not deny may be but affirme that it is fitte necessary to be to the auoyding of confusion For it were an absurde hearing that many should at once attempt to speake neyther coulde it be done without great reproch that many men beginning to speake some should be bidden to holde their peace which would come to passe if there should be no order kept nor none to appoynt when euery one should speake or not to put them to silence when they attempted confusedly to speake and out of order Moreouer when many ministers mete together and in so great dyuersitie of giftes as the Lorde hath geuen to hys church there be founde that excell in memory facilitie of tong and expedition or quicknesse to dispatche matters more then the rest and therefore it is fitt that the brethren that haue that dexteritie shoulde especially be preferred vnto thys office that the action may be the better and more spedely made an ende of And if any man will call thys a rule or presidentship and hym that executeth thys office a president or moderator or a gouernour we will not striue so that it be with these cautions that he be not called simply gouernor or moderator but gouernor or moderator of that action and for that time and subiect to the orders that others be to be censured by the company of the brethren as wel as others if he be iudged any way faulty And that after that action ended meeting dissolued he sitte hym downe in hys olde place and set hym selfe in equall estate with the rest of the ministers Thirdly that thys gouernment or presidentship or what so euer lyke name you will geue it be not so tyed vnto that minister but that at the next meeting it shall be lawfull to take an other if an other bee thought meeter Of thys order and pollicy of the church if we will see a liuely image and perfect paterne let vs set before our eyes the most auncient and gospel like church that euer was or shall be In the actes the church being gathered together for the election of an Apostle into the place of Iudas the traytor when as the interest of election belonged vnto all and to the apostles especially aboue the rest out of the whole company Peter riseth vp telleth the cause of their comming together with what cautions and qualities they ought to
Phillippyans and of the Actes for although it be not there sayd that the deacons were in euery church yet for so muche as the same vse of them was in all churches which was in Ierusalem at Philippos and for that the Apostles as hath bene before touched laboring after the vniformitie of the church ordeyned the same officers in all churches the proofe of one is the proofe of all and the shewing that there were deacōs in one church is the shewing in all The place which they alledge out of the first to Timothe is of all other most proper for S. Paule there describing not how the church of Ephesus but simply and generally how the church must be gouerned reckneth there the order of deacons Whereunto may be added the contynuall practise of the church long after the Apostles times which appeareth by the often superscriptions and subscriptions in these words the byshop elders and deacons of such a church and vnto the byshop elders and deacons of such a church And by that it is so often times sayd in the councelles where the churches assembled y there were so many byshops so many elders so many deacons The thirde poynt in thys deaconship is whether it be a necessary office in the church or for a tyme only which controuersy shoulde not haue bene if M. Doctors english tong had bene agreable with hys latin For in a certayne latin pamphlet of hys whereof I spake before he maketh the deaconship a necessary office and such as ought not to be taken out of the church here he singeth a nother song There because he thought the necessitie of the deacon made for hym he wold nedes haue deacons here because it maketh agaynst hym he sayth there is no neede of them wherby appeareth how small cause there is that M. Doctor should vpbrayde the authors of the admonition with mutability and discord with them selues But that thys office is durable and perpetuall it may appeare by that which I haue alledged before out of the sixt of Timothe for the necessitie of elders for the argumentes serue to proue the necessitie of those orders which are there set forth whereof the deacon is one And where as M. Doctor sayth that euery church is not hable to fynde a curate as he termeth hym and a deacon I haue before shewed intreating of the senyors that the churches in the Apostles tymes might best haue sayd thys being poore and persecuted althoughe I see not why the church may not haue a deacon or deacons if moe be needefull with as small charges as they may haue a collector or collectors There remayneth to speake of the widdowes which were godly poore women in the church aboue the age of 60. yeares for the auoyding of all suspition of euill which might rise by slaunderous tonges if they had bene yonger These as they were norished at the charges of the church being poore so dyd they serue the church in attending vpon poore strangers and the poore which were sicke in the church whereof they were widdowes Now although there is not so great vse of these widdowes with vs as there was in those places where the churches were first founded and in that tyme wherein thys order of widdowes was instituted part of the which necessity grew both by the multitude of straungers through the persecution by the great heate of those east countries whereupon the washing supplyng of their feete was required yet for so much as there are poore which are sicke in euery church I doe not see how a better and more conuenient order can be deuised for the attendance of them in their sicknes other infirmities then thys which S. Paule appoynteth that there shuld be if there can be any gotten godly poore widdowes of the age which S. Paule appoynteth which should attend vpon such For if there be any such poore widdowes of that age destitute of all friendes it is manifest that they must needes liue of the charge of the church seing they must nedes do so it is better they shuld do some duety for it vnto the church agayne thē the church should be at a new charge to finde others to attend vpon those which are sicke destitute of keepers seing that there can be none so fit for that purpose as those women which S. Paule doth there describe so that I conclude that if such may be gotten we ought also to kepe that order of widowes in the church still I know y there be lerned men which thinke otherwise but I stand vpon the authoritie of Gods worde and not vppon the opynions of men be they neuer so well learned And if the matter also shoulde be tryed by the iudgement of men I am able to shew the iudgement of as learned as thys age hath brought forth which thinketh that the institution of widdowes is perpetuall and ought to be where it may be had and where such widdowes are founde In deede they are more rare now then in the Apostles tymes For then by reason of the persecution those which had the gift of continency dyd abstayne from mariage after the death of their husbandes for that the sole lyfe was an easyer estate and lesse daungerous and chargeable when they were driuen to flye then the estate of those which were maryed Vnto all the rest vntill the ende of the first part of the admonition I haue answered alredy Yet there is a poynt or two which I must touch wherof the first is in the. 126. page where he would beare men in hand that the authors of the admonition and some other of theyr mynde would shut out the cyuill magistrate and the Prince from all authoritie in Ecclesiastical matters which surmise although I see it is not so much because eyther he knoweth or suspecteth any such thing as because he meaneth heereby to lay a bayte to entrappe with all thinking that where he maketh no conscience to geue he careth not what authority to Princes we will be loth to geue more then the word of God will permit wherby he hopeth to draw vs into displeasure with the Prince yet for because he shall vnderstande we norish no opynions secretly which we are ashamed to declare openly and for that we doubt not of the equitie of the prince in thys part which knoweth that although her authoritie be the greatest in the earth yet it is not infinite but is lymitted by the word of God and of whome we are perswaded that as her maiesty knoweth so shee will not vnwillingly heare the truth in thys behalfe these things I say being considered I answere in the name of the authors of the admonition and those some other which you speake of that the Prince and cyuill magistrate hath to see that the lawes of God touching hys worshippe and touching all matters and orders of the church be executed dewly obserued to se that euery Ecclesiasticall person do that office whereunto he is
the glory of God whereof they saw the sacrament before theyr eyes Neyther is the hyghe priest commaunded to be present to thys ende that he should sitte as iudge of that matter but that he might dissolue the difficulties if any rose of the vnderstanding of the law and that hee myght pricke forward and styre vp by admonition the Princes to whome the iudgement appertayned if so bee he should see them colde slacke to reuenge the iniury done vnto the Lorde Which thing may the better appeare in that the handling of the matter is there appoynted not vnto the priestes but vnto the iudges or princes only and so lykewyse of matrimony and diuorse although the iudgement thereof appertayne vnto the ciuill magistrate yet the minister if there be any difficulty in knowing when it is a lawfull contract when the dyuorse is lawfull maye and ought to bee consulted wyth Thus may the common wealth and church enioy both the wysedome learning which is in the mynister things may bee done in that order which God hath appoynted without suche confounding and iombling of offyces and iurisdictions together For although Aristotles obeliscolychnion and Platoes dorydrepanon that is instrumentes seruing to two purposes bee lawfull in offyces of the common wealth where things are more free and left in greater liberty to bee ordered at the iudgement and aduise of men especially consydering that vppon the diuersitye of the formes of common wealthes varietie of regiment may spring yet in the church of God where things are brought to a strayghter rule and which is but one and vniforme the same may not bee suffered And yet euen those coÌ„mon wealth Philosophers which doe lycence vpon occasion that two offices may meete in one man holde that it is best and conuenientest that euery one shoulde haue a particulare charge For Aristotle sayeth that it is most agreeable to nature that hen shoulde be pros hen that is one instrument to one vse And Plato vseth the prouerbe mede heracleis pros duo against those which wil take vpon them diuers vocations and not content them selues with one so that they make the meting of many functions in one man to be a remedy only in extreme neede pouerty of able men And although both be vnlawfull yet as the case standeth in our realme it is more tellerable that the ciuill magistrate should doe the office of a minister then that the minister shuld intermeddle with the function of the magistrate For when the accountes shall be cast it will fall out that there are more sufficient able men to serue in the common wealth of thys realme then in the churche and greater wante in the one then in the other And if besyde thys both authoritie of the werd of God and lyght of reason wee will looke vnto the practise of the church many yeares after the time of the Apostles we shall finde that the church hath bene very carefull from time to time that thys order should bee kept that the ministers shuld not entangle them selues with any thing beside their ministery and those things which the word of God doth necessaryly put vpon them leâ—st the strength of their minde of their body being distracted vnto many thinges they should be the lesse able to accomplishe their ministery vnto the full Which may also partly appeare by that which I haue alledged out of Cyprian which will not permit them so much as to bee executors of a Testament And in one of the Canons whiche are ascribed vnto the Apostles it is enioyned that they should not entangle them selues with worldly offices but attend vpon their Ecclesiasticall affaires Further in the councell of Calcedon it was decreed that none of the clearkes or cleargie as it termeth them shoulde receiue any charge of those which are vnder age vnlesse they were suche as the lawes dyd necessarily cast vpon hym which it calleth inexcusable charges meaning by all lykelyhoode the wardshyp of hys brothers children or some suche thing Where is also declared the cause of that decree to haue beene for that there were certeine mynisters which were stewardes to noble men And in the. 7. canon of the same councell it is decreed that none of the cleargy should either goe to warfare as souldyers or captaynes or should receiue any secular honors and if they dyd they shoulde bee excommunicated or accursed Now I come to M. Doctors argumentes which he bringeth to establish thys disorder And first he sayeth mynisters of the word may not occupy them selues in wordly busines as to be marchants husbandmen craftes men and such like but they may exercise cyuill offices Where first of all I perceiue M. Doctor is of thys mynde that the order of God is not to be broken for small gayne or when a man must take great toyle of the body to breake it but it may be broken with getting of honor and doing of those things which may be done with out soyle with great commendation there it is lawfull to breake it In deede so the Poete but in the person of an vniust and ambition man sayd ei chre adicein tyrannidos heneca chre that is If a man must do vniustly he must doe it to beare rule Secondarely I doe see that M. Doctor will not be shackled and hyndered from hys ministery by a paire of yron fetters but if he can get a payre of golden fetters he is conteÌ„ted to be hampered and entangled from doing the office of ministery committed vnto hym For onles these should be the causes which should moue hym to take the one and refuse the other verely I see none For where as he sayth it is a helpe maynteineth relygion in deede that is the reason of the papistes which M. Caluin confuteth in hys institution And although it be good and necessary to punish vice and iniquity by corporall punishmentes and by cyuill corrections yet it doth no more follow that that should be done by the mynisters then it followeth that for that preaching and mynistring the sacramentes and excommunication are good and necessary therefore the same is fitte to be executed by the cyuill magistrate I graunt the mynisters haue also to punyshe vice for as the cyuill magistrates punishe lyghter faultes with some penalty of money or losse of membre so the churche and the mynister especially with the church hath to punishe faultes by represions and rebukes And as the cyuill magistrate punisheth greater faultes by death so the mynister with other whiche haue intereste hath with the sworde of excommunication power to kill those which be rebellious to cut them from the church as the other doth from the common wealth And if it be a helpe to the mynisters office that he shoulde meddle with ciuill punishmeÌ„ts why shuld it not be a helpe vnto the magistrates office that he should excommunicate and other things pertayning to the ecclesiasticall disciplyne And where as M. Doctor sayth they may