Selected quad for the lemma: opinion_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
opinion_n	council_n	hold_v	lateran_n	630	5	14.1170	5	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A43554	Theologia veterum, or, The summe of Christian theologie, positive, polemical, and philological, contained in the Apostles creed, or reducible to it according to the tendries of the antients both Greeks and Latines : in three books / by Peter Heylyn.	Heylyn, Peter, 1600-1662.	1654 (1654)	Wing H1738; ESTC R2191	813,321	541

16. And since it is not another thing to say The Holy Ghost is the Spirit of the Father and the Son than that he is or proceeds from the Father and the Son in this they seem to agree with us in eandem fidei sententiam on the same doctrine of Faith though they differ in words Thus also Rob. Grosthead the learned and renowned Bishop of Lincoln as he is cited by Scotus a famous Schoolman delivereth his opinion touching this great Controversie The Grecians saith he are of opinion that the Holy Ghost is the Spirit of the Son but that he proceedeth not from the Son but from the Father onely yet by the Son which opinion seemeth to be contrary to ours But happily if two wise and understanding men the one of the Greek Church and the other of the Latine both lovers of the truth and not of their own expressions did meet to consider of this seeming contrariety it would in the end appear Ipsam contrarietatem non esse veraciter realem sicut est vocalis That the difference is not real but verbal onely Azorius the great Casuist goeth further yet and upon due examination of the state of the Question not onely freeth the Greeks from Heresie but from Schism also By consequence the Church of Rome hath run into the greater and more grievous error in condemning every Maundy Thursday in their Bulla Coenae the whole Eastern Churches which for ought any of her own more sober children are able to discern on deliberation are fully as Orthodox as her self in the truth of Doctrine and more agreeable to antiquity in their forms of Speech For if we please to look into the Antient Writers we shall finde Tertullian saying very positively Spiritum non aliunde quam à Patre per filium which is the very same with that of Damascen before delivered And Ierom though a stout maintainer of the Procession of the Holy Ghost from the Son also yet doth he sometimes fall upon this expression Spiritus à Patre egreditur propter naturae societatem à filio mittitur That he proceedeth from the Father and is sent by the Son which none of the Greek Church will deny But if we look upon the Fathers of the Eastern Churches we shall finde not onely private men as Basil Nazianzen Nyssen Cyril not to descend so low as Damascen to make no mention of the proceeding of the Holy Ghost from the Son at all but a whole Synod of 180 Prelates gathered together in the second General Council at Constantinople to be silent in it though purposely assembled to suppress the Heresie of Macedonius who had denied the Divinity of the Holy Ghost For in the Constantinopolitan Creed according as it stands in all old Records the Fathers having ratified the Nicene Creed added these words for the declaring of their Faith in the Holy Ghost viz. I believe in the Holy Ghost the Lord and giver of Life who proceedeth from the Father who together with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified who spake by the Prophets No word in this of his proceeding from the Son And though this Creed was afterwards continued in the Council of Ephesus yet so far was that Council from altering any thing which had been formerly delivered as to this pa●ticular that it imposed a curse on those who should adde unto it And so it stood a long time in the Christian Church possessing that part in the Publick Liturgies which it still retaineth But in some tract of time some Spanish Bishops in the eighth Council of Toledo added the clause à filioque and made it to run thus in their publick Formulas who proceedeth from the Father and the Son The French not long after followed their example but still the Church of Rome adhered to the old expression Whereupon Charls the Great commanded a Council of his Prelates to be held at Aken Aquisgranum it is called in Latine to consider somewhat better of this addition and caused some of them to be sent to Pope Leo the third to have his opinion in the matter who was so far from giving any allowance unto the addition that he perswaded them to leave it out by little and little And nor content to give this Counsel unto them for fear lest the addition might creep in at Rome he caused the Constantinopolitan Creed to be fairly written out on a Table of Silver and placed it behinde the Altar of St. Peter to the end it might remain unto posterity as a lasting Monument of the true Faith which he professed The like distast did Iohn the eighth declare against this addition in a Letter by him written unto Photius Patriark of Constantinople in which he gives him to understand not onely that they had no such addition in the Church of Rome but that he did condemn them who were Authors of it adding withal That as he was careful for his part to cause all the Bishops of the West to be so perswaded of it as he was himself so that he did not think it reasonable that any should be violently constrained to leave out the addition But after in the yeer 883 Pope Nicholas the first caused this clause à filioque to be added also to the Creed in all the Churches under the Command and Jurisdiction of the Popes of Rome and from thence-forwards did they brand the Greek Churches with the brand of Heresie for not admitting that clause to the Antient Creeds which they themselves had added of their own Authority without the consent of the Eastern Churches or so much as the pretence of a General Council But as my Lord of Canterbury hath right well observed in his learned Answer unto Fisher It is an hard thing to adde and anathematize too And yet to that height of uncharitableness did they come at last that whereas it was the miserable fortune of Constantinople to be taken by the Turks upon Whitsunday being the Festival of the coming of the Holy Ghost this was given out to be a just judgment on them from the Almighty for thinking so erroneously of his Blessed Spirit as if it might not be concluded in as good form of Logick That sure the Knights of Rhodes had in their lives and actions denied Christ who bought them because that Town and all the Iland was taken by the Turks upon Christmas-day or that the People of Chios had denied and abnegated the Resurrection of our Saviour who redeemed them because that Town and therewith all the Iland also was taken by the said Turks upon Easter-day I have now done with so much of the present Article as relates unto the Person of the Holy Ghost which is the first signification of the term or notion as it is taken personaliter and essentialiter We must next look upon the word as it is used to signifie in the Book of God the gifts and graces of the

onely in their single and sole capacities but as convened in Council about sacred matters have held opinions contrary to the truth of God That therefore the whole Church or the Body collective and diffusive over all the world shall universally agree to betray the truth or be given over unto Error One might as logically conclude that because many of the Citizens and some of the Aldermen many of the Parishioners and some of the Ministers and that not onely in their Houses but the very Church or the Guild-hal were swept away at London by the last great plague that therefore the whole City was dispeopled by it not a man escaping Such Arguments as these need no other Answer than to demonstrate the non sequiturs and inconsequence of them But first before we do proceed unto further evidence it will be necessary to lay down the state of the Question which is the Litis contestatio or the point in Controversie And in my minde Becanus states it very rightly We will therefore use his terms though he were a Iesuite and propose it thus viz. An tota Ecclesia Christi vel tota multitudo Christianorum quatenus ex Pastoribus ovibus conflata est errare possit in aliquo Articulo vel puncto fidei that is to say whether the whole Church of Christ or the whole multitude of Christian people consisting both of the Flock and the Pastors too may erre in any Article and point of Faith or publickly profess any point of Doctrine contrary to the Faith and Gospel of our Lord and Saviour This we deny and we deny it on the credit of our Saviours promises Upon this Rock saith he will I build my Church and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it Where by the gates of Hell as the Fathers say he means not onely outward violence but Errors Heresies and false Doctrines which covertly or openly do aim at the ruine of it And of this minde is Epiphanius in Anchorato Origen Tract 1. on Matthew Ierome and Bede upon the place St. Augustine also hence inferreth Haereses omnes de ecclesia exiisse tanquam sarmenta inutilia à vite praecisa ipsam autem manere in radice sua in vite sua that is to say That Heresies were to the Church like unprofitable branches cut off from the Vines the Church remaining still in the Root in the Vine it self How so Quia portae inferorum non vincant eam because the gates of Hell cannot overcome it He promised his Apostles to send them a Comforter who should teach them all things Iohn 14.16 who should guide them into all truth Iohn 16.13 Not that he bound himself hereby to teach them all things or lead them into all truths of what sort soever For it is sure that some things the Apostles were still ignorant of as of the day and hour of the General Iudgment And probable enough it is that there were many Philosophical and Historical truths into which the Spirit did not lead them All things and all truth must be understood of all things truly necessary to a mans salvation In omnem veritatem i. e. Omnem quae expedit ad salutem saith Dr. Raynolds very rightly A promise made indeed to them the Apostles personally for it was unto them he spake and to none but them but made to all the Church in them the whole Church essentially whereof they were at that time the sole Representatives Consolatprium est ex hoc loco cognoscere fide audire quicquid est promissum his Apostolis promissum esse toti ecclesia saith a learned and a modest Papist It is saith he a special comfort to learn and faithfully believe from these words of Christs that the promise made to these Apostles was also made to the whole Church to the Body collective It was not Peter onely as the Papists say nor the Apostles onely as the words may seem to bear to whom these promises were made touching the not prevailing of the gates of Hell and the conducting of their feet in the ways of truth but to the whole Body of the Church represented by them Hence I conclude That the whole Church in the full latitude and universality thereof is free from Error such Errors as do lead to the gates of Hell and are destructive of salvifical supernatural Truths The Church being so far privileged by our Lord and Saviour that when the truth is banished out of one or more particular Churches it is admitted into others and some still opposing those corruptions both in Doctrine and Practise which in the others are defended The Church in this capacity is secure from Error even in the points of smallest moment and so it is confessed by Luther a man not over forwards to ascribe too much unto the Church Impossibile est illam errare posse etiam in minimo Articulo It is impossible saith he that the Church should erre conceive him of the Church essential in the smallest Article But this perhaps will be made more apparent by the matter of Fact than by any other kinde of evidence in an Argumentative way And for this matter of Fact we will take those times in which the truth may seem to be most miserably oppressed by the predominancy of the Arian faction and the tyranny and superstitions of the Popes of Rome That the Arian Heresie did extend no further than the Roman Empire we have shewn before that all the Roman Empire was not poysoned with it we will shew you now For besides all the Bishops of Rome successively from the first rising of this Heresie to the fall thereof who constantly except Liberius onely did maintain the truth the stories of those times acquaint us with the names and merits of some Catholick Bishops who with their Churches did oppose that predominant faction And because it were an endless and indeed a needless labor to recite them all take but those three whom Ierome brings together in one line or passage O Siquidem Arianus victis triumphatorem suum Egyptus excapit Hilarium ● praelio revertentem Galliarum Ecclesia complexa est ad reditum Eusebii sui lugubres vestes Italia mutavit i. e. Upon the overthrow of the Arians Egypt received her Athanasius now returned in triumph the Church of France embraced her Hilary he was Bishop of Poictiers coming home with victory from the battel and on the return of Eusebius Bishop of Vercellis Italy changed her mourning garments By which it is most clear even to the vulgar eyes that not these Bishops onely did defend the truth but that it was preserved by their people also who never had received them with such joy and triumphs had they not been all of one opinion Or had but those three Bishops onely stood unto the truth yet had that been sufficient to preserve the Church from falling universally from the Faith of Christ or deviating from the truth in that particular

a loud voyce saying How long O Lord holy and true delayest thou to judge and avenge our blood upon them that dwell on the earth And of this nature is that passage in St. Lukes Gospel though perhaps it be but Parabolical in which the Soul of Lazarus is carryed into Abrahams bosome as soon as it had left his body So that the wonder is the greater if the tale be true that Paul the third a Christian and a Christian Prelate one of the Popes of Rome in these later Ages should make doubt hereof as they say he did Of whom it is reported that lying on his death-bed he should say to the standers by That he should shortly be assured of three particulars of which he had not been resolved all the time of his life that is to say Whether there were a God Such a place as Hell or That the souls of men were immortal or not A speech which hath so much of the Atheist in it that Christian charity forbids me to give credit to it though possibly his course of life as to say truth he was a man that sought his own ends more than the glory of God might give occasion to the world to report so of him And yet I must confesse my charity is not so perfect as not to beleeve the like report of Pope Iohn the three and twentieth who lived in safer times than this Paul the third and might take liberty to speak whatsoever he thought without fear of giving any advantage to an opposite party For he indeed as it is charged against him in the Council of Constance was of opinion that the Soul of man did die with his body like that of beasts And did not onely hold it as his own opinion but pertinaciously maintained it Quin imo dixit pertinaciter credidit Animam hominis cum corpore humano mori extingui ad instar animalium brutorum as the Council hath it Some who were called Arabici in the former times held the self same error as Eusebius telleth us for which they were accounted for no better than Hereticks and put into the Catalogue of Hereticks of St. Augustines making And yet upon a Disputation which they had with Origen they did desert their error and recant it too the story of which Nicephorus reports at large A Pope may hold the same opinion and pertinaciously maintain it against all Opponents and yet we must not say that he is an Heretick no take heed of that That were to trench too deep upon the privileges of St. Peters Chair But what need any proof be brought from the Word of God to prove the immortality of the Soul of man which was a truth confessed by the very Gentiles who saw no more than what was represented to them by the light of Nature and the dull spectacles of Philosophy By Plato one of the sagest of them it was affirmed expresly and in positive terms who useth also many Arguments in defence thereof Which Arguments though they seem too short to some Christian writers to come up close unto the point yet they approve his judgment in it confessing that De immortalitate animae verum sentiret he held the very truth in that particular But before him Pythagoras and Pherecides did affirm the same although Pythagoras for his part went a way by himself touching the passing of the Soul into other Bodies Transire animas in nova corpora as mine Author hath it It is true that Aristotle seemed to be doubtful of it and problematically sometimes to dispute against it though other-whiles the words 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 eternal and immortal do escape his pen. Nor was it positively denied by any in the Heroick times of learning save onely by Dicearchus Democritus and the Sect of Epicures who placing the chief happiness or summum bonum in corporal pleasures were as it were ingaged to cry down the Soul And yet Lucretius an old Poet and a principal stickler of that Sect doth now and then let fall some unluckly passages which utterly overthrow his cause As this for one Cedit item ●etro de terra quod fuit ante In terras quod missum est ex aetheris oris Id rursum Coeli fulgentia templa receptant Which may be briefly Englished in these two lines To Earth that goes which from the Earth was given And to Joves house that part which came from Heaven In this Lucretius did agree with that of Hermes or Mercurius sirnamed Trismegistus who makes man to consist of two principal parts as indeed he doth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the one mortal which is the body and the other immortal which is the soul And of the same opinion was Apollo Milesius and the Sibylline Oracles both which are cited by Lactantius l. 7. c. 13. and Cap. 18.20 But what need more be said in so clear a case when Tacitus reporteth it for the general opinion of all knowing men Cum corpore non extingui magnas animas That the Souls of great and gallant persons were not extinguished with their Bodies Were it not so the Body were in better case than the Soul by far and of more continuance which doth not onely remain a Body for a while as before it was entire and uncorrupted after the Soul is taken from it but by embowelling imbalming and such helps of Art may be preserved from putrifaction many ages together Which Reasons and Authorities of so many Writers and the general consent of all learned men in the times before him prevailed so far at last on one Aristoxemus that finding no way to decry the Souls immortality he fell into a grosser error Negando ullam omnino esse animam denying that there was any Soul at all Quo nihil dici delirius potest than which a greater dotage could not be imagined as it is very justly censured by Lactantius And yet as great a dotage as it seemed to him though coming from the mouth or pen of an Heathen-man hath been revived again in these times of Liberty and a Book printed with the title of Mans Mortality wherein the Author whosoever he was doth endeavor to prove That the whole man as a rational Creature is wholly mortal contrary to that common distinction of Soul and Body Which if it be not the dotage of that Aristoxemus is questionless the Heresie of the old Arabici This Author teaching that our immortality beginneth at the Resurrection at the general judgment and they that the Soul of man dying with the Body de coetero ad immortalitatem transituram was from thenceforth to pass into immortality Such is the infelicity of the times we live in that the more gross the heresie and the more condemned by those great lights of learning in the former times the better entertainment it is sure to finde with unknowing men I purpose not to make an exact discourse

answer is that Moses did therein consult the frailty of the Iewes his Countrymen who having been very well acquainted with the Idolatries of Egypt might easily have been induced to the worship of Angels had they found any thing in Scripture of that noble subject or else because being acquainted with the things of God he would not trust them with a secret of so high a nature Angelorum non meminit quia scribebat rudibus Judaeis illius secretioris doctrinae parum capacibus saith Estius the Iesuite for the Pontificians That he did purposely omit it Peter Martyr granteth but saith that it was propter hominum proclivitatem ad Idololatriam because of their inclination to Idolatrie For my part I confess these answers do not satisfie me For neither were the Iews so untaught a people as not to have been told of those Ministring Spirits which did so frequently appear to Abraham Isaac and Iacob And if they were so prone unto Idolatrie as they say they were I cannot see but that the pretermission of the Creation of Angels might rather give them some occasion to commit Idolatry then any way divert them from it For when they found by reading in the book of Genesis that not only Lot bowed himself down before the Angels which appeared unto him but that the same reverence or worship call it which we will had been performed unto them by their Father Abraham and yet could not meet with nothing touching their creation might not they probably conclude that sure the Angels were no creatures but rather a nature so divine and excellent that it were no impiety to worship them with religious worship There must be therefore somewhat else which did occasion this omission whatsoever it was And why that reason may not be because it did not fall within the compass of the six days work which Moses only undertook to lay down before us I must confesse for my part I can see no reason That they were made before the fourth day is most plain in Scripture Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the Earth said God to Iob when the morning stars sung together and all the Sons of God shouted for joy St. Augustine hereupon inferreth Iam ergo erant Angeli quando facta sunt sydera facta autem sunt sydera die quarto Therefore saith he the Angels were created before the stars for other Sons of God there were none but they to magnifie and applaud that most glorious work Before the fourth day then that 's clear And I am apt enough to think till I see better evidence to the contrary that they were made before the first Certain I am the Tenor of the Greek Fathers went this way confessedly whose testimonies I would here produce to make good the assertion but that I have confitentem reum For Estius himself doth confesse ingenuously Quod multi Patres Graeci tradunt Angelos aliquandiu creatos ante Mundum corporeum that many of the Greek Fathers were of opinion that the Angels were created for some space of time before this visible and corporeal World And Estius himself for ought I can see is of the same opinion also who telleth it for a manifest truth in another place that the Angels did not fall from the love of God in the first moment as it were of their Creation Sed aliquanto tempore in justitia stetisse but that they did abide awhile in the state of righteousness though they did not persevere therein as the others did Assuredly had they been created in the six days work their continuance in the state of Grace had been so short that it could hardly have been called Aliquantum temporis But whether Estius might so mean I determine not The Greek Fathers as he saith for the most part did and so did many of the Latines Lactantius I am sure was of this opinion and thereby answereth the objection which Hortensius made touching the loneliness and solitude of Almighty God before the making of the World Tanquam nos qui unum esse dicimus desertum ac solitarium esse dicamus Habet enim Ministros quos vocamus nuncios How far this satisfyeth the objection we have shewn before but certainly it doth sufficiently declare his judgment that the Angels were created before the World The old Hermit Cassianus is more plain and positive and he a Latine writer too of approved antiquity Ante conditionem hujus visibilis Creaturae spiritales coelestesque virtutes Deum fecisse c. nemo fidelium est qui dubitat That God before the making of this visible World had made those heavenly and spirituall powers so he cals the Angels there is not any of the faithful who so much as doubteth In which it is to be observed that Cassian doth not only speak this as his own opinion but the opinion of all Orthodox and faithful Christians and an opinion grounded on the words of Iob before remembred by him alledged and applyed for the proof hereof Finally having cleared the received opinion from being any way derogatory to the honour of Christ by whom and for whom all things were created he doth again repeat what he said before though he differ somewhat in the words saying Ante istud Geneseos temporale principium omnes illas Potestates Coelestesque virtutes Deum creasse non est dubium This then was the opinion of the antient Church and it stood uncontrouled by any publick authority till the Lateran Councel about 30. years agoe in which indeed it was declared Omnipotenti Dei virtute mundum et Angelos simul ab initio temporis de nihilo esse condita that by the Almighty God the Angels and the World were both created together in the beginning of time This was indeed determined then But I ascribe not so much to the Lateran Councell or the decrees and definitions which were therein made was not the point of Transubstantiation first established there as to recede from the authority of the antient writers because Pope Innocent the third did not like their tenets especially when I have some advantage of the holy Scriptures to rely upon For when I find that David in marshalling the works of the Creation puts the Angels first not only before the Sun and Moon but before all Heavens I cannot think that he observed only the order of dignity but that he had an eye especially on the order of time And so the Angels being placed before Heaven must consequently be created before that beginning in which as Moses tels us Heaven and Earth were created But whensoever they were made it is out of question that they were all created by the word of God and that they were created both for glory excellent and for their numbers almost infinite Lactantius telleth us in general termes that they were innumerable and so no question but they were For besides those many thousands which fell from God