Selected quad for the lemma: opinion_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
opinion_n	church_n	council_n	trent_n	1,107	5	10.4717	5	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A63208	The tryal of William Viscount Stafford for high treason in conspiring the death of the King, the extirpation of the Protestant religion, the subversion of the government, and introduction of popery into this realm : upon an impeachment by the knights, citizens, and burgesses in Parliament assembled, in the name of themselves and of all the commons of England : begun in Westminster-Hall the 30. day of November 1680, and continued until the 7. of December following, on which day judgment of high treason was given upon him : with the manner of his execution the 29. of the same month.	Stafford, William Howard, Viscount, 1614-1680.	1681 (1681)	Wing T2239; ESTC R37174	272,356	282

Representative Body of the Commons of England and I confess my Lords to be accused by them was a load especially being added to what lay before upon me more especially to my ●eak Body and weaker mind that I was so afflicted with it and have so continued that I am scarce able to bear up under it For I look upon the House of Commons as the great and worthy Patriots of this Kingdom I ever held them so and I hold them so still My Lords These things being such great afflictions to me and some other accidents which I shall not trouble your Lordships with the telling you of have so much disordered my sense and reason which before was little that I scarce know how to clear my self to your ●ordships as I ought to do or which way to go about the doing of it therefore I do with all humility beg your Lordships pardon if I say any thing that may give an offence or urge that which may not be to the purpose All which I desire you would be pleased to attribute to the true Cause my want of understanding not of innocency or a desire to make it appear My Lords These Gentlemen the Managers of the House of Commons who are great and able men some I am sure if not all of them very well read and have understanding in the Law have set forth to your Lordships Treason in an horrid shape but I confe●s my Lords if they had made it never so much worse it cannot be so horrid as I have often fancied it my self for my Lords I do and did ever hold Treason to be the greatest sin in the World and I cannot use words enough to express it and therefore I hope you will give me leave to clear my self of it and I shall give you one Notion of it which I heard at your Lordships Bar some years ago where you were pleased to here several people of several perswasions give you some reason why Liberty of Conscience should be allowed them And I remember one of them an Anabapti●t I think did tell you that they held Treason to be the sin of Witchcraft and so do ● And next to Treason I hold Murder to be the worst sin But the Murder of the King I looked upon to be so above all others that it is not to be expressed by words My Lords I have heard very much of a thing that was named by these Gentlemen of the House of Commons and that very properly too to wit of the Gun-powder Treason My Lords I was not born then but some years after I heard very much Discourse of it and very various Reports and I made a particular inquiry perhaps more than any one person did else both of my Father who was a●ive then and my Uncle and others and I am satisfied and do clearly believe by the Evidence I have received That that thing called the Gun-powder Treason was a wicked and horrid Design among the rest of some of the Jesuits and I think the malice of the Jesuits or the Wit of man cannot offer an excuse for it it was so execrable a thing Besides my Lords I was acquainted with one of them that was concerned in it who had his pardon and lived many years after I discoursed with him about it and he confessed it and said he was sorry for it then and I here declare to your Lordships that I never heard any one of the Chur●h of Rome speak a good word of it it was so horrid a thing that it cannot be expressed nor excused And God Almighty shewed his Judgments upon them for their wickedness for hardly any of the Persons or their Posterity are left that were conc●rned in it and even a very great Family too that had collaterally something to do in it is in the Male line extinct totally and I do think God Almighty always shews his Judgments upon such vile Actions And I have been told all those persons that were engaged in this wicked Act were all heartily sorry for it and repented of it before they died without which I am sure there is no Salvation And therefore I think it was not the Interest of Religion but a private Interest put them upon it My Lords As to the Doctrine of King-killing and Absolving persons from their Allegiance I cannot say the Church of Rome does not hold it I never heard it did hold it it may be it does it may be not I say not one thing or other but my Lords there was an English Colledge of Priests at Rhemes that translated the Bible and printed it with Authority according to their Translation and in their Annotations upon the fourteenth Chapter of the Epistle to the Romans they do declare their dislike and detestation of that Opinion They say all Subjects ought to obey their Kings as the 〈◊〉 mitive Christians did the Heathen Princes of the Empire and the learned Doctors of the Colledge of Sorbonne did upon an occasion administred to them about that Opinion declare the mistakes that were in it and owned it to be a damnable Principle My Lords I have an Authentical Copy of that Decree of the Sorbonists whether it be here or no I can't tell Yes here it is which does declare that a damnable Position and there is lately come out a Book written by a Priest of the Church of Rome tryed for his life for being in the Plot but acquitted of that in which he says that that Opinion of killing Kings is damnable and herettical and declared so by the Council of Trent My Lords This gives me occasion to believe that the Church of Rome holds it not I do not say that it does not but some particular persons do abhor it which are great in that Church and which weighs far with me but that which further most of all confirms me in my ill Opinion of it is the words of our Saviour when not only he commands us to give unto Caesar the things that are Caesars but asserts our Obedience to our Governours in many other passages of the Holy Scripture and what I find there the whole World is not able to alter my Opinion of I do assure your Lordships in the presence of Almighty God That I do extreamly admire when I hear of any thing like it and I did read with great horror what I found the other day in the Gazette of some imprudent people in Scotland and of their wicked Principles and Practices My Lords I do in the presence of Almighty God who knows and sees all things and of his Angels which are continually about us and of your Lordships who are my Peers and Judges solemnly profess and declare that I hate and detest any such Opinion as I do damnation to my self And I cannot be more desirous of Salvation to my self than I am cordial in hating this Opinion My Lords I know no person upon Earth nor all the persons in the world put together nor all the Power

another Case your Lordships will proceed here only according to your Proofs and your Evidence secundum allegata probata and therefore all we shall say to this is that we hope our Proofs are so clear and evident as will leave no room to your Lordships to believe this Noble Lords Protestations In the next place my Lord is pleased to alledge and withal to lay some weight upon it the voluntary surrendring of himself to Justice and he laid it down as a Rule that as Flight is an argument of Guilt so the Surrendring of a mans self to the Trial of the Law is an argument of Innocency My Lords We admit the Rule generally to be true but in some particular Cases it may be otherwise for a Man that is not very confident of his own Innocency may yet be very confident of the strength of his Party and whether the consideration of the circumstances of Affairs as they then stood and the power and prevalency of the Popish party at that time might not reasonably create such a confidence in this Noble Lord we must leave to your Lordships Judgment My Lords We do conceive that those Persons who contrived Sir Edmundbury Godfrey's Murder had so great Confidence in the favour and protection of some of their Party that they thought themselves able to out-face Justice And we verily believe they intended it as an example to deter all Men from medling so much as with the taking an Examination concerning this Horrid Plot. My Lords I desire to be understood aright in this I lay nothing of the Death of Sir Edmundbury Godfrey to the Charge of this Noble Lord I only use it as an Argument of the presumption of the Popish party at that time My Lords In the next place my Lord Stafford did observe from my Lord Coke that in the Tryals of Treasons we ought very much to guide our Judgments by the Nature and Circumstances of the Fact the Concomitants and subsequents as he termed them with Reference to the Person accused whether they were likely to induce or deter him from such an Attempt and here he was pleased to raise some Arguments from the whole course of his Life and did desire your Lordships to consider those Circumstances therein that might make it improbable or impossible that he should commit a Treason of this Nature He desired also your Lordships to remember that he was descended from an Honourable Family and that his Ancestors were very worthy and very deserving Persons and such as had often ventured their Lives in defence of their Country And here he did likewise mention his own Services to the last King and our present Soveraign in the late Wars It is not my part nor will I derogate any thing from the Merits of this Noble Lord much less from the Honour of his Family but in Answer to this we shall desire your Lordships to consider that this Noble Lord however he is pleased to disown it at present is notoriously known to be a Roman Catholick as they call themselves and such we conceive we have sufficiently proved him to be in the course of our Evidence And as there is nothing in the World so much as a misguided Conscience that can ingage the best of Men into the worst of Actions so we think the Principles of that Religion are such as are more likely to pervert Men from their Duty and Allegiance than any other Religion or Perswasion whatsoever And if the Zeal of this Noble Lord did engage him to endeavour the establishment of that Religion in this Kingdom we may easily believe that his Reason did suggest to him the means by which it must be effected which could be no other but Blood and Confusion My Lords The last thing I shall take notice of is what my Lord Stafford was pleased to say in General as to the Doctrine of Killing and Deposing Princes which his Lordship was pleased to call a private Opinion and not the Doctrine of the Church of Rome But by the way my Lords give me leave to observe that this Noble Lord did upon this occasion fully own and I much commend his Ingenuity in it the reality of the Gun Powder Treason since we know how much that Party have endeavoured to render it Incredible and as length of time hath so fully manifested the particulars of that Execrable Design that it hath brought such as are of that Perswasion to confess the truth of it so we hope this days Tryal will convince both the Age we live in and all Posterity of the Truth and Reality of this present Conspiracy But to go on with that Point from which I did digress I am not I confess much versed in the Canons and Councils of the Church of Rome but my Lords this I know the most famous and celebrated Writers of that Church especially of the Society of the Jesuits have publickly avowed and maintained this Doctrine And we know in all times when there hath been occasion to put it in practice it hath never failed to have been attempted and we likewise know that the Church of Rome and the Pope have always avowed the Acts when they have been done From all which we might very reasonably conclude that it is the Doctrine of that Church so to do But my Lord is pleased to say and admit for Truth That a great many private Writers do hold the contrary I believe it to be so but I do also believe that it is the Policy and Artifice of the Church of Rome to leave this Point of Doctrine in some measure undetermined that so they may make use of it as the occasion serves For if it succeeds then it is owned and justified if it miscarry then the Doctrine is but a private Opinion and the Plot but the Practice of particular Persons that are either desperate or discontented And I am fully of Opinion that This Horrid Conspiracy which is brought this day in Judgment before your Lordships wants nothing but Success to canonize it My Lords As to what concerns the Evidence it hath been so fully stated to You and the Objections that were raised to invalidate it so well answered that I will not trouble your Lordships with any Repitition of what hath been said already All we have further to desire is That your Lordships will please to take our Evidence into your Consideration and to do thereupon what shall be agreeable to Justice Mr. Serj. Maynard My Lords as to Matter of Fact I shall say nothing but only this and I wish it may be spoken with Gratitude to Almighty God that the Discovery of this Plot is rather the Work of God than Man It was first his Act in prevailing upon Oats to make the Discovery and when he stood single almost what came to support his Credit but the Letters of Coleman which were like a Tally to what Oats had said for what Oats informs is in a great part made good by his Letters