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opinion_n church_n council_n trent_n 1,107 5 10.4717 5 true
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A41439 A full survey of Sion and Babylon, and a clear vindication of the parish-churches and parochial-ministers of England ..., or, A Scripture disproof, and syllogistical conviction of M. Charles Nichols, of Kent ... delivered in three Sabbath-dayes sermons in the parish church of Deal in Kent, after a publick dispute in the same church with the said Mr. Charles Nichols, upon the 20. day of October 1653 / by Thomas Gage ... Gage, Thomas, 1603?-1656. 1654 (1654) Wing G111; ESTC R5895 105,515 104

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dispute_n and_o argument_n upon_o the_o first_o proposition_n affirm_v parochial_a church_n to_o be_v babylonish_n as_o for_o his_o second_o proposition_n concern_v his_o own_o church_n and_o congregation_n and_o what_o be_v by_o argument_n object_v against_o it_o i_o shall_v speak_v of_o that_o after_o i_o have_v more_o full_o clear_v my_o judgement_n unto_o you_o yet_o concern_v our_o parochial_a church_n and_o to_o what_o have_v be_v already_o say_v add_v such_o strong_a reason_n and_o argument_n as_o want_v of_o time_n upon_o the_o day_n of_o dispute_n suffer_v not_o to_o come_v forth_o to_o light_n but_o before_o i_o satisfy_v your_o expectation_n and_o desire_n herein_o i_o must_v first_o clear_v myself_o from_o the_o harsh_a judgement_n and_o censure_n of_o mr._n nichols_n his_o party_n against_o i_o for_o grant_v rome_n to_o be_v a_o church_n in_o some_o substantial_o which_o distinction_n they_o wave_v i_o be_o
comparative_o in_o respect_n of_o jew_n and_o turk_n they_o be_v good_a and_o true_a or_o else_o sure_o the_o title_n of_o learned_a mr._n fuller_n his_o book_n call_v the_o holy_a war_n and_o the_o holy_a state_n be_v false_a wherein_o he_o treat_v of_o the_o christian_n war_n against_o the_o ●u●ks_n and_o against_o jerusalem_n and_o of_o their_o state-government_n in_o the_o city_n of_o jerusalem_n and_o other_o place_n subdue_v by_o they_o but_o the_o christian_n than_o be_v most_o such_o as_o live_v under_o popery_n and_o as_o christian_n they_o join_v together_o against_o the_o enemy_n of_o christ_n that_o the_o name_n of_o christ_n may_v be_v propagate_v and_o confess_v where_o it_o be_v most_o hate_v and_o blaspheme_v and_o this_o work_n by_o all_o writer_n be_v call_v a_o holy_a work_n then_o i_o infer_v that_o where_o such_o holy_a endeavour_n be_v for_o christ_n name_n and_o the_o propagation_n of_o it_o there_o christ_n in_o substantial_o be_v acknowledge_v and_o to_o confess_v and_o acknowledge_v christ_n be_v some_o part_n and_o character_n of_o a_o people_n and_o church_n of_o god_n ergo_fw-la they_o be_v a_o church_n in_o some_o part_n and_o in_o some_o substantial_o of_o a_o church_n but_o five_o i_o answer_v that_o this_o my_o opinion_n be_v no_o such_o strange_a doctrine_n as_o mr._n nichols_n and_o some_o other_o will_v judge_v it_o to_o be_v it_o have_v be_v hold_v by_o many_o sound_n and_o orthodox_n divine_v both_o at_o home_n and_o abroad_o learned_a morneu●_n du_n plessis_n who_o write_v against_o rome_n and_o have_v be_v hold_v always_o a_o ●ound_n protestant_n in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr ecclesia_fw-la pag._n 343.350_o hold_v rome_n to_o be_v a_o church_n and_o his_o chief_a argument_n be_v indeed_o the_o same_o that_o have_v always_o move_v i_o to_o this_o opinion_n before_o ever_o i_o read_v it_o in_o he_o which_o be_v this_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o antichrist_n must_v in_o full_a height_n sit_v in_o templo_fw-la dei_fw-la in_o the_o temple_n of_o god_n what_o then_o be_v that_o or_o where_o be_v that_o but_o in_o the_o church_n ●rom_o whence_o i_o form_n this_o syllogism_n if_o the_o pope_n be_v antichrist_n he_o must_v sit_v in_o the_o temple_n and_o church_n but_o the_o pope_n be_v antichrist_n ergo_fw-la he_o si●s_v in_o the_o temple_n and_o church_n then_o further_o but_o the_o pope_n as_o antichrist_n sit_v in_o no_o temple_n or_o church_n except_o it_o be_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n ergo_fw-la the_o pope_n either_o be_v not_o antichrist_n or_o rome_n be_v a_o church_n but_o the_o pope_n be_v antichrist_n and_o must_v sit_v in_o a_o temple_n or_o church_n ergo_fw-la rome_n be_v a_o church_n but_o rome_n be_v not_o a_o church_n in_o her_o corruption_n supersttion_n and_o idolatry_n ergo_fw-la rome_n the_o seat_n of_o antichrist_n be_v a_o church_n in_o some_o substantial_o so_o morn●y_v also_o discourse_v in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr ecclesia_fw-la pag._n 349.350_o with_o these_o word_n which_o i_o have_v faithful_o transcribe_v in_o that_o we_o affi●●_n that_o antichrist_n rul●th_v there_o we_o consequent_o hold_v that_o it_o be_v the_o church_n in_o as_o much_o as_o he_o can_v sit_v any_o where_o but_o in_o the_o church_n but_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n to_o separate_v ourselves_o from_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n defile_v by_o antichrist_n and_o another_o thing_n to_o depart_v from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n again_o we_o depart_v not_o from_o the_o temple_n but_o from_o the_o idolatry_n commit_v in_o the_o temple_n nor_o from_o the_o commonwealth_n but_o from_o the_o tyranny_n which_o oppress_v the_o commonwealth_n nor_o from_o the_o city_n but_o from_o the_o pestilence_n which_o in●ecteth_v the_o city_n nor_o from_o the_o communion_n and_o fellowship_n of_o the_o people_n but_o from_o the_o conspiracy_n of_o antichrist_n and_o of_o his_o maintainer_n we_o therefore_o renounce_v not_o their_o baptism_n but_o we_o ratify_v it_o and_o further_o for_o this_o point_n of_o baptism_n that_o for_o substance_n it_o be_v true_a in_o rome_n he_o ●aith_v thus_o pag._n 147._o it_o be_v not_o the_o heretic_n that_o baptize_v as_o long_o as_o baptism_n remain_v sound_a but_o christ_n by_o the_o hand_n of_o the_o heretic_n wherein_o we_o follow_v the_o practice_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n and_o the_o determination_n of_o the_o fi●st_a council_n of_o nice_a that_o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v by_o heretic_n renounce_v their_o here●ie_n they_o shall_v not_o be_v rebaptise_v except_o those_o that_o have_v be_v baptize_v by_o the_o samo●arens_n who_o keep_v not_o the_o essential_a word_n of_o baptism_n and_o doctor_n reynolds_n speak_v wary_o of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n deny_v it_o not_o to_o be_v a_o church_n but_o say_v ecclesia_fw-la romana_fw-la nec_fw-la est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la catholic●_n nec_fw-la s●num_fw-la mem●●um_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la ca●holicae_fw-la it_o be_v neither_o the_o catholic_n church_n not_o a_o sound_a member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n in_o which_o word_n he_o seem_v to_o acknowledge_v it_o a_o disease_a member_n or_o a_o sick_a member_n which_o indeed_o put_v i_o in_o mind_n of_o what_o i_o have_v read_v of_o a_o commence_v doctor_n long_o since_o in_o oxford_n who_o question_n be_v ecclesia_fw-la roma●a_fw-la non_fw-la 〈◊〉_d ecclesia_fw-la u●●a_fw-la the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v not_o a_o true_a church_n and_o in_o his_o p●●ition_n or_o to_o speak_v proper_o in_o oxford_n stile_n in_o his_o supposite_a he_o show_v the_o many_o conception_n and_o spiritual_a disease_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n a_o doctor_n reply_v on_o he_o use_v this_o argument_n ecclesia_fw-la vive_n est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la vera_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la romana_fw-la est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la viva_fw-la ergo_fw-la vera_fw-la the_o minor_a be_v deny_v the_o opponent_n proceed_v thus_o ecclesia_fw-la aegra_fw-la est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la viva_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la romana_fw-la est_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la aegra_fw-la ergo_fw-la viva_fw-la thus_o you_o see_v that_o by_o other_o sound_a divine_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v be_v hold_v a_o church_n though_o sick_a disease_a unsound_a in_o her_o corruption_n which_o argue_v that_o under_o those_o disease_n and_o corruption_n there_o be_v some_o life_n yet_o in_o she_o and_o some_o truth_n of_o substantial_o as_o c_o rist_n baptism_n the_o scripture_n ordination_n and_o the_o like_a 1._o object_n but_o it_o may_v he_o object_v that_o i_o speak_v thing_n contradictory_n and_o do_v aver_v two_o contradictory_n in_o the_o same_o subject_n simul_fw-la &_o semel_fw-la at_o once_o and_o the_o same_o time_n say_v they_o be_v a_o true_a church_n and_o yet_o again_o say_v that_o in_o their_o corruption_n superstition_n and_o some_o doctrine_n they_o be_v a_o false_a church_n but_o true_a and_o false_a be_v contradictory_n not_o predicable_a of_o the_o same_o subject_n at_o the_o same_o time_n ergo_fw-la i_o seem_v to_o speak_v thing_n contradictory_n answ._n to_o which_o i_o answer_v that_o contradictory_n be_v not_o predicable_a of_o the_o same_o subject_n at_o the_o same_o time_n if_o take_v in_o one_o and_o the_o same_o respect_n but_o in_o several_a respect_n they_o may_v be_v predicable_a as_o i_o may_v say_v peter_n be_v a_o man_n and_o peter_n be_v not_o a_o man_n and_o in_o several_a respect_n both_o may_v be_v true_o verify_v peter_n true_o be_v a_o man_n in_o respect_n of_o the_o substantial_o and_o essential_o of_o a_o man_n in_o he_o and_o peter_n be_v not_o a_o man_n but_o a_o beast_n in_o respect_n of_o his_o madness_n and_o beastly_a conversation_n rome_n likewise_o be_v and_o may_v be_v say_v a_o church_n and_o not_o a_o church_n a_o church_n in_o respect_n of_o some_o substantial_o in_o it_o belong_v to_o a_o church_n and_o not_o a_o church_n in_o respect_n of_o the_o filthy_a corruption_n idolatry_n and_o superstition_n in_o it_o and_o doctrine_n contrary_a to_o the_o ●●uth_n of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n 2._o object_n second_o it_o may_v be_v object_v if_o in_o some_o substantial_o rome_n be_v a_o true_a church_n why_o then_o do_v i_o separate_v and_o do_v all_o england_n separate_v from_o rom●_n where_o be_v our_o warrant_n to_o separate_v from_o a_o true_a church_n ans._n to_o which_o i_o answer_v that_o we_o have_v warrant_v sufficient_a to_o separate_v from_o rome_n though_o not_o for_o the_o substantial_o which_o they_o yet_o maintain_v their_o idolatry_n their_o ●superstitions_n their_o false_a doctrine_n be_v warrant_v sufficient_a to_o we_o out_o of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n to_o separate_v from_o they_o true_a it_o be_v every_o disease_n must_v not_o keep_v a_o man_n from_o his_o neighbour_n society_n a_o man_n be_v animal_n sociabile_fw-la a_o sociable_a creature_n bear_v into_o the_o world_n among_o other_o end_n for_o commerce_n and_o society_n with_o his_o neighbour_n yet_o so_o infectious_a and_o contagious_a so_o filthy_a and_o loathsome_a may_v the_o disease_n be_v
they_o to_o do_v they_o good_a but_o i_o will_v put_v my_o fear_n in_o their_o heart_n that_o they_o shall_v not_o depart_v from_o i_o jerem._n 32.40_o three_o god_n have_v bring_v we_o out_o of_o the_o egyptian_a bondage_n of_o that_o roman_a antichrist_n which_o be_v another_o part_n i_o have_v hear_v the_o groan_a of_o the_o child_n of_o israel_n who_o the_o egyptian_n keep_v in_o bondage_n and_o i_o have_v remember_v my_o covenant_n exod._n 6._o vers_fw-la 5._o four_o because_o we_o have_v the_o book_n of_o the_o covenant_n which_o be_v read_v to_o we_o as_o former_o by_o moses_n to_o the_o people_n who_o take_v the_o book_n of_o the_o covenant_n and_o read_v in_o the_o audience_n of_o all_o the_o people_n and_o they_o say_v all_o that_o the_o lord_n have_v say_v will_v we_o do_v and_o be_v obedient_a exod._n 24._o vers_fw-la 7._o we_o have_v the_o holy_a commandment_n and_o the_o gospel_n the_o word_n of_o the_o covenant_n exod._n 34._o vers_fw-la 28._o and_o it_o be_v a_o special_a prerogative_n to_o god_n people_n to_o have_v the_o word_n of_o god_n as_o paul_n observe_v in_o the_o jew_n prerogative_n and_o advantage_n what_o advantage_n then_o have_v the_o jew_n much_o every_o way_n chief_o because_o unto_o they_o be_v commit_v the_o oracle_n of_o god_n rom._n 3._o vers_fw-la ●_o 2_o which_o david_n also_o set_v down_o as_o a_o great_a privilege_n and_o prerogative_n he_o show_v his_o word_n unto_o jacob_n his_o statute_n and_o his_o judgement_n unto_o israel_n he_o have_v not_o deal_v so_o with_o any_o nation_n ps._n 14._o v._n 7_o 19_o 20._o all_o which_o bind_v up_o in_o one_o bundle_n of_o a_o impartial_a judgement_n &_o true_a consideration_n will_v make_v it_o to_o appear_v unto_o the_o world_n that_o sure_o mr._n nichols_n his_o assertion_n be_v most_o erroneous_a and_o false_a affirm_v as_o much_o as_o this_o that_o a_o people_n offer_v their_o prayer_n to_o god_n in_o the_o name_n of_o jesus_n christ_n take_v the_o same_o jesus_n christ_n only_o for_o their_o mediator_n and_o advocate_n condemn_v as_o babylonish_n the_o mediation_n and_o advocation_n of_o all_o saint_n and_o angel_n partake_v of_o the_o covenant_n make_v by_o god_n to_o his_o people_n through_o jesus_n christ_n have_v true_a knowledge_n of_o god_n word_n and_o his_o law_n write_v in_o their_o inward_a part_n have_v the_o fear_n of_o god_n possess_v their_o heart_n have_v be_v bring_v out_o of_o babylonish_n and_o antichristian_a bondage_n have_v the_o book_n of_o the_o covenant_n read_v unto_o they_o have_v the_o holy_a commandment_n the_o gospel_n the_o word_n of_o the_o covenant_n and_o acknowledge_v obedience_n due_a unto_o they_o and_o enjoy_v that_o peculiar_a privilege_n and_o prerogative_n of_o jacob_n and_o israel_n in_o the_o word_n yet_o notwithstanding_o all_o these_o particular_n and_o sure_a truth_n out_o of_o scripture_n that_o such_o a_o people_n be_v no_o true_a church_n but_o babylonish_n and_o antichristian_a mr._n nichols_n may_v say_v so_o but_o i_o be_o sure_a the_o scripture_n say_v the_o contrary_a which_o must_v be_v you_o and_o my_o guide_n to_o the_o which_o i_o beseech_v you_o to_o lean_v as_o you_o tender_v your_o soul_n for_o my_o part_n i_o be_o so_o convince_v out_o of_o the_o word_n of_o the_o contrary_a to_o mr._n nichols_n his_o assertion_n that_o i_o hope_v i_o shall_v never_o be_v so_o seduce_v nor_o blind_v as_o to_o incline_v to_o so_o gross_a and_o false_a a_o opinion_n and_o i_o hope_v my_o good_a god_n my_o true_a guide_n my_o prophet_n and_o only_a teacher_n will_v not_o hereafter_o judge_v or_o condemn_v i_o for_o the_o light_n which_o in_o this_o particular_a point_n of_o controversy_n i_o be_o resolve_v till_o death_n to_o follow_v all_o these_o argument_n upon_o the_o day_n of_o dispute_n shall_v have_v be_v object_v against_o mr._n nichols_n have_v he_o answer_v like_o a_o scholar_n categorical_o to_o every_o proposition_n and_o not_o so_o much_o endeavour_v with_o speech_n and_o oration_n to_o stop_v the_o stream_n of_o they_o many_o more_o i_o can_v propound_v unto_o you_o be_v it_o not_o that_o i_o have_v already_o find_v the_o work_n to_o increase_v like_o the_o widow_n oil_n much_o in_o my_o hand_n and_o nothing_o yet_o speak_v of_o the_o second_o proposition_n which_o i_o know_v you_o expect_v to_o have_v it_o further_o clear_v unto_o you_o than_o it_o be_v the_o other_o day_n by_o a_o few_o objection_n against_o it_o but_o before_o i_o come_v unto_o it_o i_o must_v brief_o answer_v the_o scruple_n of_o one_o or_o two_o of_o the_o clergy_n my_o fellow-labourer_n who_o impatient_a muttering_n against_o parochial_a church_n wherein_o they_o serve_v and_o can_v willing_o enjoy_v the_o milk_n of_o such_o flock_n be_v take_v notice_n off_o by_o some_o who_o seem_v not_o to_o deny_v parochial_a church_n in_o mr._n nichols_n his_o sense_n counsel_v or_o preach_v a_o separation_n from_o they_o but_o in_o another_o sense_n presbyterial_a they_o will_v fain_o call_v it_o but_o unjust_o as_o disagree_v with_o the_o classical_a way_n and_o with_o provincial_a church_n which_o one_o of_o they_o tell_v i_o be_v to_o be_v call_v only_a church_n and_o parish_n not_o true_o church_n but_o only_o integral_a part_n of_o such_o classical_a or_o provincial_a church_n so_o that_o the_o whole_a county_n be_v divide_v into_o class_n the_o parish_n also_o be_v to_o be_v divide_v so_o as_o that_o a_o competent_a number_n be_v to_o belong_v to_o such_o and_o such_o a_o class_n as_o former_o to_o such_o and_o such_o a_o cathedral_n and_o all_o that_o number_n of_o parish_n to_o make_v up_o but_o one_o church_n to_o be_v rule_v by_o officer_n and_o elder_n according_a to_o the_o word_n but_o single_o every_o parish_n take_v by_o itself_o not_o to_o be_v call_v a_o church_n which_o opinion_n be_v but_o a_o cavil_v as_o i_o suppose_v against_o myself_o by_o the_o party_n insist_v on_o it_o i_o sh●ll_v wave_v as_o unwilling_a to_o disturb_v and_o as_o willing_a to_o submit_v for_o peace_n and_o quietness_n sake_n especial_o in_o this_o which_o well_o understand_v do_v not_o cross_v my_o opinion_n and_o judgement_n of_o hold_v parish_n society_n to_o be_v true_a church_n nor_o my_o opinion_n cross_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o learned_a and_o reverend_a divine_n of_o the_o presbyterial_a way_n who_o affirm_v the_o presbyterial_a government_n by_o preach_v and_o rule_v presbyter_n in_o congregational_a classical_a and_o synodal_n assembly_n to_o lay_v the_o true_a claim_n to_o a_o divine_a right_o according_a to_o the_o scripture_n with_o who_o own_o doctrine_n i_o shall_v confirm_v this_o truth_n that_o parochial_a congregation_n be_v to_o be_v call_v true_o church_n the_o aforesaid_a divine_n in_o their_o book_n of_o the_o divine_a right_n of_o church-government_n take_v notice_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n the_o whole_a body_n of_o christ_n and_o of_o large_a particular_a member_n of_o that_o body_n of_o christ_n and_o three_o of_o small_a single_a congregation_n which_o threefold_a distinction_n of_o church_n be_v true_o ground_v upon_o the_o scripture_n thus_o paul_n call_v the_o whole_a body_n of_o christ_n church_n now_o you_o be_v the_o body_n of_o christ_n and_o member_n in_o particular_a and_o god_n have_v set_v some_o in_o the_o church_n first_o apostle_n secondary_o prophet_n three_o teacher_n 1_o cor._n 12._o vers_fw-la 27.28_o so_o match_n 16._o v._n 18._o and_o often_o elsewhere_o so_o likewise_o large_a particular_a member_n of_o that_o body_n of_o christ_n such_o as_o provincial_a church_n be_v in_o scripture_n call_v church_n as_o the_o church_n of_o jerusalem_n act_n 8._o vers_fw-la 1._o the_o church_n of_o antioch_n act._n 13._o v._n 1._o the_o church_n of_o co●inth_n 2_o cor._n 1._o vers_fw-la 1._o and_o the_o church_n of_o ephesus_n unto_o the_o angel_n of_o the_o church_n of_o ephesus_n write_v these_o thing_n revel_v 2._o vers_fw-la 1._o in_o which_o place_n there_o be_v no_o doubt_n many_o single_a church_n and_o congregation_n as_o appear_v plain_o in_o corinth_n where_o paul_n teach_v apollo_n teach_v and_o cephas_n teach_v and_o in_o ephesus_n where_o eusebius_n emissenus_fw-la reckon_v up_o above_o threescore_o several_a church_n and_o congregation_n all_o which_o in_o scripture_n be_v call_v one_o church_n and_o i_o can_v hear_v but_o declare_v my_o judgement_n upon_o those_o word_n of_o john_n rev._n 2._o vers_fw-la 1._o unto_o the_o angel_n of_o the_o church_n of_o ephesus_n that_o certain_o if_o there_o be_v in_o ephesus_n many_o single_a congregation_n and_o particular_a church_n and_o yet_o call_v but_o church_n as_o if_o but_o one_o church_n be_v there_o than_o it_o appear_v evident_o that_o those_o many_o single_a church_n make_v up_o one_o provincial_a church_n as_o integral_a part_n of_o the_o whole_a which_o i_o will_v not_o deny_v to_o my_o caviller_n though_o
and_o have_v deny_v my_o minor_n which_o immediate_o i_o prove_v thus_o from_o st._n paul_n to_o the_o hebrew_n 4._o argument_n st._n paul_n in_o hebr._n 6._o chap._n vers_fw-la 1_o 2._o set_n down_o with_o baptism_n imposition_n of_o hand_n to_o be_v a_o principle_n of_o th●_n doctrine_n of_o christ._n but_o baptism_n because_o it_o be_v a_o principle_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n ●ught_v never_o by_o any_o church_n to_o be_v omit_v to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n ergo_fw-la imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o the_o presbytery_n in_o ordination_n also_o ought_v never_o by_o any_o church_n to_o be_v omit_v to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n here_o mr._n nichols_n begin_v to_o perceive_v his_o error_n and_o want_v of_o knowledge_n in_o the_o scripture_n when_o he_o deny_v the_o minor_a and_o that_o imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o the_o presbytery_n be_v a_o doctrine_n of_o the_o principle_n of_o christ_n which_o be_v make_v clear_a unto_o he_o he_o can_v give_v no_o answer_n to_o it_o and_o so_o my_o syllogism_n be_v in_o the_o discretion_n and_o sound_a judgement_n unanswerable_a and_o unanswered_a but_o mr._n nichols_n his_o moderator_n perceive_v the_o unresistible_a force_n of_o the_o arment_n and_o see_v his_o friend_n mouth_n almost_o shut_v up_o speak_v a_o word_n to_o this_o purpose_n that_o it_o be_v doubt_v by_o some_o author_n whether_o that_o place_n of_o paul_n h●br_n 6._o vers_fw-la 1_o 2._o do_v intend_v imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o the_o presbytery_n in_o ordination_n or_o some_o other_o end_n in_o imposition_n of_o hand_n in_o that_o place_n to_o who_o i_o ●ad_v reply_v have_v not_o mr._n nichols_n his_o mouth_n begin_v to_o open_v again_o for_o my_o beloved_a some_o of_o the_o author_n which_o understand_v that_o place_n of_o paul_n not_o of_o imposition_n of_o hand_n in_o ordination_n but_o to_o some_o other_o end_n intend_v that_o end_n to_o be_v imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o the_o bishop_n in_o confirmation_n who_o judgement_n i_o can_v follow_v neither_o will_n mr._n nichols_n or_o his_o moderator_n dare_v to_o follow_v that_o opinion_n unless_o they_o will_v acknowledge_v bishop_n again_o among_o we_o to_o confirm_v and_o bishop_n our_o child_n that_o such_o a_o principle_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n in_o that_o sense_n may_v not_o be_v omit_v in_o our_o church_n which_o i_o be_o sure_a mr._n nichols_n his_o moderator_n who_o i_o respect_v as_o a_o divine_a of_o sound_a judgement_n do_v not_o allow_v but_o only_o to_o strengthen_v his_o friend_n in_o his_o weakness_n and_o that_o in_o the_o mean_a time_n he_o may_v recollect_v himself_o for_o some_o better_a answer_n be_v please_v to_o make_v such_o a_o motion_n and_o put_v in_o such_o a_o ca●●at_n some_o other_o author_n understand_v that_o place_n of_o paul_n hebr._n 6._o vers_fw-la 1.2_o to_o mean_v lay_v on_o of_o hand_n on_o the_o sick_a which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n continue_v to_o this_o day_n superstitious_o maintain_v extreme_a unction_n and_o anoint_v the_o sick_a with_o oil_n hallow_v by_o their_o bishop_n either_o of_o which_o opinion_n have_v mr._n ni●h●●●_n insist_v on_o i_o shall_v soon_o have_v show_v he_o his_o error_n and_o such_o a_o second_o trouble_n to_o have_v befall_v he_o as_o the_o poet_n speak_v off_o say_v incidit_fw-la in_o scyllam_fw-la cupiens_fw-la vitare_fw-la charybdin_n and_o as_o the_o jew_n speak_v to_o pilate_n so_o the_o last_o error_n shall_v be_v worse_o than_o the_o first_o matth._n 27._o vers_fw-la 64._o this_o belove_v i_o do_v mention_n but_o to_o call_v you_o to_o mind_n to_o remember_v it_o that_o you_o may_v take_v notice_n how_o with_o the_o strength_n yea_o evidence_n of_o my_o argument_n which_o true_o to_o i_o be_v undeniable_a mr._n nichols_n be_v put_v to_o his_o shift_n and_o so_o indeed_o after_o a_o while_o he_o betake_v himself_o to_o another_o shift_n say_v that_o imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o the_o presbytery_n in_o ordination_n have_v be_v so_o abuse_v and_o corrupt_v by_o the_o bishop_n and_o by_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n that_o now_o by_o the_o godly_a it_o be_v think_v fit_a to_o be_v omit_v and_o lay_v aside_o ah_o belove_a and_o can_v this_o answer_n persuade_v any_o sound_a conscience_n to_o slight_v a_o principle_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n must_v bishop_n or_o rome_n corruption_n make_v we_o more_o corrupt_a must_v their_o corruption_n make_v we_o deny_v our_o principle_n may_v not_o mr._n nichols_n as_o well_o have_v answer_v that_o because_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v corrupt_v baptism_n with_o rite_n and_o superstitious_a ceremony_n therefore_o we_o ought_v utter_o to_o forsake_v to_o forget_v slight_a and_o omit_v baptism_n which_o also_o be_v a_o principle_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n sure_o for_o all_o this_o his_o answer_n you_o will_v be_v unwilling_a to_o deprive_v your_o child_n of_o baptism_n so_o pure_o and_o right_o administer_v in_o england_n because_o in_o rome_n it_o be_v corrupt_v and_o so_o shall_v i_o for_o all_o this_o poor_a shift_n of_o mr._n nichols_n be_v as_o unwilling_a to_o deny_v imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o the_o presbytery_n in_o ordination_n as_o a_o principle_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n because_o in_o rome_n it_o be_v corrupt_v with_o anoint_v with_o oil_n the_o thumb_n and_o fore-finger_n of_o the_o priest_n and_o with_o other_o foolish_a superstitious_a needless_a rite_n and_o ceremony_n never_o practise_v by_o the_o apostle_n but_o yet_o to_o show_v mr._n nichols_n his_o folly_n in_o this_o answer_n i_o demand_v of_o he_o why_o then_o if_o he_o make_v such_o scruple_n of_o we_o minister_n who_o have_v be_v ordain_v by_o bishop_n former_o with_o their_o presbyter_n and_o of_o those_o reverend_a presbyter_n who_o in_o some_o place_n of_o this_o land_n do_v still_o ordain_v without_o bishop_n why_o then_o have_v he_o not_o the_o imposition_n of_o hand_n by_o some_o minister_n near_o in_o judgement_n unto_o himself_o who_o have_v be_v beyond_o the_o sea_n in_o holland_n and_o doubtless_o there_o be_v ordain_v by_o some_o pure_a presbyter_n who_o never_o succeed_v bishop_n these_o at_o least_o may_v better_o have_v ordain_v he_o than_o the_o people_n who_o have_v no_o power_n to_o ordain_v nor_o any_o power_n of_o the_o key_n but_o this_o last_o mr._n nichols_n deny_v and_o affirm_v the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n to_o be_v in_o the_o people_n i_o reply_v against_o it_o thus_o 5._o argument_n the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n wheresoever_o it_o be_v must_v be_v in_o that_o subject_a which_o christ_n have_v ordain_v but_o christ_n ordain_v not_o the_o people_n to_o be_v the_o subject_a of_o the_o key_n ergo_fw-la the_o people_n be_v not_o the_o subject_a of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n the_o major_a proposition_n he_o grant_v and_o the_o minor_a without_o any_o distinction_n at_o all_o he_o deny_v to_o which_o i_o reply_v if_o christ_n ordain_v the_o people_n to_o be_v the_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n than_o the_o people_n must_v needs_o be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n but_o the_o people_n be_v not_o the_o proper_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n ergo_fw-la christ_n ordain_v not_o the_o people_n to_o be_v the_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n the_o major_n be_v grant_v and_o the_o minor_n be_v yet_o deny_v to_o the_o which_o i_o reply_v with_o another_o syllogism_n if_o the_o people_n be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n than_o they_o be_v th●_n first_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n but_o the_o people_n ●re_n not_o the_o first_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n ergo_fw-la the_o people_n be_v not_o the_o proper_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n this_o minor_a also_o he_o deny_v that_o the_o people_n be_v not_o the_o first_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o t●●_n key_n till_o a_o friend_n whisper_v he_o in_o the_o ear_n make_v he_o to_o see_v and_o ●●flect_v upon_o his_o oversight_n and_o better_a to_o consider_v what_o he_o have_v deny_v but_o i_o forthwith_o reply_v against_o he_o thus_o if_o the_o people_n be_v the_o first_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n than_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n be_v in_o they_o first_o and_o before_o it_o be_v in_o the_o apostle_n convert_v and_o baptise_v they_o but_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n be_v not_o in_o the_o people_n first_o and_o before_o it_o be_v in_o the_o apostle_n convert_v and_o baptise_v they_o ergo_fw-la the_o people_n be_v not_o the_o first_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n here_o belove_v mr._n nichols_n find_v himself_o by_o this_o syllogism_n quite_o cast_v upon_o his_o back_n follow_v his_o whisper_a friend_n as_o be_v suppose_v good_a counsel_n and_o though_o
of_o the_o people_n the_o text_n will_v ●au●_n declare_v it_o thus_o unto_o we_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o when_o they_o have_v ordain_v to_o themselves_o elder_n and_o not_o as_o it_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d when_o they_o have_v ordain_v they_o elder_n as_o speak_v of_o other_o mr._n selden_n have_v a_o large_a discourse_n in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr syned●iis_fw-la veterum_fw-la hebraeorum_n show_v that_o the_o word_n signify_v to_o elect_n decree_n ordain_v and_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v of_o the_o apostle_n act_n in_o this_o place_n and_o not_o of_o the_o people_n what_o comfort_n then_o can_v mr._n nichols_n have_v from_o this_o place_n especial_o if_o he_o understand_v greek_a and_o the_o whole_a context_n and_o from_o those_o many_o more_o produce_v by_o i_o and_o unanswered_a by_o he_o to_o satisfy_v his_o conscience_n when_o thus_o by_o scripture_n he_o be_v full_o convince_v to_o be_v no_o lawful_o ordain_v minister_n of_o jesus_n christ_n which_o be_v the_o first_o thing_n i_o discover_v by_o argument_n against_o his_o church_n or_o congregation_n that_o it_o be_v not_o the_o house_n of_o god_n not_o be_v the_o pillar_n and_o ground_n of_o the_o truth_n where_o the_o truth_n of_o ordination_n according_a to_o the_o word_n of_o christ_n and_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o apostle_n so_o much_o fail_v and_o be_v by_o he_o oppose_v thus_o far_o belove_v my_o argument_n reach_v upon_o the_o day_n of_o our_o dispute_n against_o mr._n nichols_n his_o second_o proposition_n and_o see_v we_o be_v come_v to_o this_o main_a point_n of_o the_o controversy_n of_o these_o time_n concern_v popular_a election_n and_o ordination_n and_o popular_a government_n in_o the_o church_n which_o popular_a man_n too_o much_o affect_a popularity_n for_o their_o end_n to_o draw_v away_o our_o people_n from_o our_o church_n have_v devise_v and_o of_o late_o stir_v up_o i_o shall_v yet_o a_o little_a more_o enlarge_v my_o judgement_n and_o discourse_n for_o the_o better_a resolve_v a_o doubt_n so_o necessary_a in_o these_o time_n to_o be_v unfold_v this_o monstrous_a opinion_n can_v plead_v no_o scripture_n except_o those_o three_o place_n by_o i_o above_o rehearse_v out_o of_o the_o act_n of_o the_o apostle_n to_o that_o whereon_o mr._n nichols_n lean_v i_o have_v answer_v as_o also_o to_o that_o of_o act._n 6._o chap._n where_o although_o the_o people_n look_v out_o honest_a man_n for_o deacon_n yet_o the_o apostle_n appoint_v they_o over_o that_o business_n and_o to_o that_o ordain_v they_o by_o imposition_n of_o hand_n which_o show_v more_o than_o a_o mere_a look_v out_o for_o they_o and_o approve_v or_o allow_a of_o they_o the_o three_o place_n be_v out_o of_o act._n 1._o vers_fw-la 23._o they_o appoint_v two_o joseph_n call_v barsabas_n who_o be_v surname_v justus_n and_o mathias_n from_o whence_o some_o of_o the_o separation_n will_v settle_v ordination_n upon_o the_o people_n because_o in_o this_o peculiar_a work_n the_o people_n be_v join_v with_o the_o apostle_n but_o observe_v first_o from_o this_o place_n that_o there_o the_o electour_n be_v eleven_o apostle_n to_o guide_v the_o other_o but_o mr._n nichols_n will_v allow_v those_o to_o choose_v he_o who_o have_v no_o officer_n to_o guide_v they_o among_o who_o no_o doubt_n but_o there_o be_v very_o many_o weak_a person_n second_o it_o be_v very_o easy_a to_o choose_v one_o of_o these_o two_o joseph_n or_o mathias_n who_o have_v accompany_v with_o the_o apostle_n all_o the_o time_n that_o jesus_n go_v in_o and_o out_o among_o they_o vers_n 21._o this_o be_v easy_a to_o know_v but_o to_o choose_v a_o man_n fit_a for_o a_o pastor_n require_v more_o skill_n than_o so_o three_o in_o this_o election_n god_n be_v peculiar_o see_v the_o apostle_n not_o know_v who_o it_o shall_v be_v four_o in_o vers_fw-la 26._o they_o give_v forth_o their_o lot_n and_o their_o lot_n fall_v upon_o mathias_n they_o that_o will_v make_v any_o thing_n of_o this_o place_n may_v as_o well_o make_v cast_v of_o lot_n a_o essential_a to_o ordination_n as_o give_v this_o power_n to_o the_o people_n who_o be_v never_o constitute_v appoint_v or_o ordain_v by_o christ_n to_o be_v either_o the_o proper_a first_o or_o immediate_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n which_o i_o shall_v endeavour_v to_o clear_v thus_o unto_o you_o that_o which_o be_v the_o first_o subject_n be_v the_o proper_a subject_n no_o doubt_n of_o this_o but_o the_o proper_a subject_n be_v reciprocate_v and_o convertible_a with_o his_o accident_n as_o for_o example_n a_o live_a creature_n be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o sense_n and_o feel_n a_o man_n be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o laugh_v or_o laughter_n and_o from_o hence_o we_o say_v reciprocal_o every_o man_n be_v risible_a and_o every_o thing_n that_o be_v risible_a be_v a_o man_n every_o live_a creature_n have_v sense_n and_o feeling_n and_o so_o likewise_o every_o thing_n that_o have_v sense_n and_o feeling_n be_v a_o live_a creature_n this_o be_v call_v axioma_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d but_o every_o axiom_n that_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d do_v include_v in_o it_o the_o rule_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d where_o the_o predicate_a be_v true_a of_o the_o subject_n in_o all_o place_n and_o at_o all_o time_n this_o be_v true_a of_o a_o live_a creature_n and_o feel_v of_o a_o man_n and_o risibility_n and_o so_o if_o the_o people_n or_o the_o fraternity_n be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n it_o must_v be_v true_a that_o they_o be_v and_o have_v be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n omni_fw-la tempore_fw-la &_o omni_fw-la loco_fw-la in_o all_o place_n and_o at_o all_o time_n but_o if_o we_o find_v the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n exercise_v in_o time_n before_o there_o be_v a_o christian_a fraternity_n then_o certain_o there_o be_v some_o other_o subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n in_o who_o this_o power_n be_v as_o in_o a_o proper_a subject_n when_o paul_n come_v to_o corinth_n he_o preach_v authoritative_a and_o with_o power_n and_o commission_n e●go_n then_o the_o power_n o●_n the_o key_n be_v in_o some_o subject_n but_o the_o fraternity_n at_o that_o time_n be_v none_o en●_n have_v no_o be_v in_o christianity_n how_o then_o can_v they_o be_v the_o subject_n and_o if_o then_o they_o be_v not_o the_o subject_n how_o can_v they_o now_o be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n who_o be_v not_o in_o all_o place_n and_o time_n the_o proper_a subject_n of_o it_o yet_o mr._n nichols_n can_v grant_v that_o the_o people_n be_v the_o subject_n the_o proper_a subject_n and_o the_o fi●st_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n but_o he_o tru_o may_v as_o well_o have_v grant_v that_o in_o these_o time_n man_n be_v the_o proper_a subject_n of_o risibility_n but_o be_v not_o always_o and_o that_o at_o some_o time_n man_n be_v not_o risible_a nor_o at_o some_o time_n a_o live_a creature_n the_o subject_n of_o s●nse_n and_o feeling_n though_o now_o he_o be_v bu●_n second_o this_o absurdity_n will_v appear_v thus_o those_o who_o be_v the_o effect_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n be_v not_o the_o fi●st_o subject_a of_o it_o but_o the_o fraternity_n be_v the_o effect_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n it_o be_v so_o in_o all_o the_o church_n which_o the_o apostle_n gather_v and_o be_v indeed_o to_o this_o day_n so_o that_o which_o be_v primum_fw-la subjectum_fw-la the_o fi●st_a subject_n be_v immediatum_fw-la subjectum_fw-la the_o immemediate_v subject_a but_o how_o can_v the_o fraternity_n be_v the_o immediate_a subject_n of_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n since_o than_o mediantibus_fw-la apostolis_n by_o mean_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o now_o mediantibus_fw-la ministris_fw-la by_o mean_n of_o the_o minister_n the_o fraternity_n be_v make_v up_o i_o but_o the_o elector_n be_v before_o the_o elect_v it_o be_v true_a of_o christ_n who_o elect_v the_o apostle_n and_o give_v to_o they_o the_o key_n from_o who_o by_o a_o continue_a succession_n of_o minister_n still_o the_o fraternity_n be_v make_v but_o have_v not_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n have_v some_o effect_n there_o have_v not_o be_v a_o fraternity_n to_o choose_v a_o officer_n though_o they_o be_v now_o in_o time_n before_o he_o who_o they_o now_o elect_a yet_o they_o be_v not_o before_o he_o or_o they_o qua_fw-la fratres_n who_o by_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n in_o the_o ministry_n make_v they_o capable_a to_o choose_v a_o officer_n therefore_o the_o power_n of_o the_o key_n be_v in_o some_o subject_n before_o they_o beside_o election_n be_v no_o power_n of_o the_o key_n therefore_o to_o argue_v the_o people_n elect_n ergo_fw-la they_o be_v the_o first_o subject_n of_o the_o