Selected quad for the lemma: opinion_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
opinion_n	bishop_n	call_v	presbyter_n	718	5	10.7016	5	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A45214	A defence of the humble remonstrance, against the frivolous and false exceptions of Smectymnvvs wherein the right of leiturgie and episcopacie is clearly vindicated from the vaine cavils, and challenges of the answerers / by the author of the said humble remonstrance ; seconded (in way of appendance) with the judgement of the famous divine of the Palatinate, D. Abrahamvs Scvltetvs, late professor of divinitie in the University of Heidelberg, concerning the divine right of episcopacie, and the no-right of layeldership ; faithfully translated out of his Latine.	Hall, Joseph, 1574-1656.; Scultetus, Abraham, 1566-1624. Determination of the question, concerning the divine right of episcopacie.	1641 (1641)	Wing H378; ESTC R9524	72,886	191

desires to goe a Mid-way in this difference holding it too low to derive Episcopacy from a merely humane and Ecclesiasticall Ordinance holding it too high to deduce it from an immediate command from God and therefore pitching upon an Apostolicall institution rests there but because those Apostles were divinely inspired had the directiōs of Gods spirit for those things which they did for the common administration of the Church therefore and in that onely name is Episcopacie said to lay claime to a Divine right howsoever also it cannot be gainsaid that the grounds were formerly laid by our Saviour in a knowne imparity of his first agents Now surely this truth hath so little reason to distaste them that even learned Chamier himselfe can say Res ipsa coepit tempore Apostolorum vel potius ab ipsis profecta est And why should that seeme harsh in us which soundeth well in the mouthes of lesse-interessed Divines but because the very title of that book hath raised more dust then the treatise it selfe Bee pleased Readers to see that this very question is in the very same termes determined by that eminent light of the Palatinate Dr. Abrah Scultetus whose tract to this purpose I have thought fit to annex Peruse it and judge whether of those two writers have gone further in this determination And if you shall not meet with convincing reasons to bring you home to this opinion yet at least-wise find cause enough to retaine a charitable and favourable conceit of those who are as they think upon good grounds otherwise minded and whilest it is on all parts agreed by wise and unprejudiced Christians that the calling is thus ancient and sacred let it not violate the peace of the Church to scan the originall whether Ecclesiasticall Apostolicall or divine Shortly let all good men humbly submit to the Ordinance and heartily wish the Reformation of any abuses And so many as are of this mind Peace be upon them and the whole Israell of GOD. AMEN THE DETERMINATION of the question Concerning the Divine Right of EPISCOPACY By the famous and learn'd Divine Dr. Abrahamus Scultetus late Professour of divinity in the Vniversity of HEIDELBERG Faithfully translated out of his Observations upon the Epistles to Timothy and Titus LONDON Printed for NATHANIELL BVTTER 1641 The Question Whether Episcopacie be of Divine right That is whether the Apostles ordained this Government of the Church that not onely one should be placed over the people but over Presbyters and Deacons who should have the power of Imposition of Hands or Ordination and the direction of Ecclesiasticall Counsels THis was anciently denyed by Aerius as is related by Epiphanius in his 75 Heresie and by Iohn of Hierusalem as appears by Hierome in his Epistle to Pammachius And there are not wanting in these dayes many learned and pious men who although they acknowledge Aerius to have erred in that he should disallow of that manner of Ecclesiasticall government which had beene received by the whol World yet in this they agree with him that Episcopall government is not of Divine Right From whose opinion why I should sever my judgement I am moved by these strong reasons famous examples and evident authorities My judgement is this First in the Apostles Epistles the name of Bishop did never signifie any thing different from the office of a Presbyter For a Bishop Presbyter and an Apostle were common names as you may see Act. 20. Phil. 1. v. 1. Tit. 1. 1. Pet. v. 12. Act. 1.20 Next In the chiefe Apostolicall Church the Church was governed by the common advice of Presbyters and that for some yeers in the time of the preaching of the Apostles For first of all companies must bee gathered together before we can define any thing concerning their perpetuall government Then the Apostles as long as they were present or neere their Churches did not place any Bishop over them properly so called but only Presbyters reserving Episcopall authority to themselves alone Lastly after the Gospell was farre and neere propagated and that out of equality of Presbyters by the instinct of the Devill Schismes were made in Religion then the Apostles especially in the more remote places placed some over the Pastors or Presbyters which shortly after by the Disciples of the Apostles Ignatius and others were onely called bishops by this appellation they were distinguished from Presbyters Deacons Reasons moving me to this opinion First Hierome upon the 1. Chapter of the Epistle to Titus writeth that a Presbyter is the same with a Bishop and before that by the instinct of the Devill factions were made in Religion and it was said among the people I am of Paul I of Apollo but I of Cephas the Churches were governed by the common counsell of Presbyters afterwards it was decreed in the whol world that one chosen out of the Presbyters should be placed over the rest From whence I thus argue When it began to be said among the people I am of Paul I of Apollo but I of Cephas then one chosen out of the Presbyters was placed over the rest But whiles the Apostles lived it was so said among the people As the first Epistle to the Corinthians besides other of St. Pauls Epistles puts it out of doubt Therefore while the Apostles lived one chosen out of the Presbyters was placed over the rest Againe There can be no other terme assigned in which Bishops were first made then the time of the Apostles for all the prime successors of the Apostles were Bishops witnesse the successions of Bishops in the most famous Churches of Hierusalem Alexandria Antioch and Rome as it is in Eusebius therefore either the next successors of the Apostles changed the force of Ecclesiasticall government received from the Apostles according to their owne pleasure which is very unlikely or the Episcopall government came from the Apostles themselves Besides even then in the time of the Apostles there were many Presbyters but one Bishop even then in the time of the Apostles 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hee that was placed over the rest which afterwards was called Bishop did impose hands or ordaine Ministers of the Word which Presbyters alone did not presume to doe Even then therefore the calling of Bishops was distinct from the Office of Presbyters If any desire the examples of Apostolicall Bishops the books of the antient are full of the Episcopal authority of Timothy and Titus either of which howsoever first performed the office of an Evangelist yet notwithstanding ceased to be an Evangelist after that Timothy was placed over the Church of Ephesus and Titus over the Church of Crete For Evangelists did only lay the foundations of faith in forraign places then did commend the rest of the care to certaine Pastors but they themselves went to other Countries and Nations as Eusebius writes in his third Booke of Ecclesiasticall History and 34. Chap. But Paul taught sometimes in Ephesus and Crete and laid the foundations of

Were it so pleasing to his Majesty and the State to decree it we should be well content to submit to this ancient forme of Election the forbearance whereof is neither our fault nor our prejudice so as you might well have bestowed this breath to a better purpose and rather conclude that notwithstanding this forme of different choice our Bishops and those of former times are not two SECT VIII WEE follow you into the execution of our Episcopall Office wherein you will show ours and the Apostles to be two so clearely that he who will not wilfully shut his eyes may see a latitude of differences and that in three points The first in sole jurisdiction which you say was a stranger yea a monster to former times and will make it good by the power of that which in all wise writers was wont to be contra-distinguished Ordination For this maine point let my Answerers know that the Ordination is the Bishops but the sole in their sense is their own neither did our Bishops ever challenge it as theirs alone without the Presbyters but as principally theirs with them so as if the power be in the Bishop the assistance is from them the practise in both so is it in the Bishops that ordinarily and regularly it may not be done without them and yet ordinately it may not be done without them by the Bishop which hath bin so constantly and carefully ever observed that I challenge them to shew any one instance in the Church of England to the contrary Say Brethren I beseech you after all this noyse what Bishop ever took upon him to ordain a Presbyter alone or without the concurrent imposition of many hands They no lesse then Cyprian can say Ego collegae Although I must tell you this was in the case of Aurelius made a Lector And in that other testimony which you cite out of his Epistle 58. he speaks onely of the fraternities consent and approbation not of their concurrence in their act this is small game with you Neither is it lesse the order of the Church of England then of the Councell of Carthage Cum ordinatur Presbyter c. When a Presbyter is ordained the Bishop blessing him and holding his hand upon his head all the Presbyters that are present shall likewise lay their hands upon his head with the hands of the Bishop With what conscience can ye alledge this as to choak us in our contrary practise when you know this is perpetually and unfailably done by us But now that the Readers may see how you shuffle shew us but one instance of a Presbyters regular and practised ordaining without a Bishop and carry the cause else you do but abuse the Reader with an ostentation of proving what was never denied But here by the way brethren you must give me leave to pull you by the sleeve and to tell you of two or three foul scapes which will trie whether you can blush First that you abuse Firmilianus in casting upon him an opinion of Presbyters ordaining which he never held He in his Epistle to Stephen Bishop of Rome speaking of the true Church in opposition to heresies describes it thus Vbi praesident majores natu qui baptizandi manum imponendi et ordinandi possident potestatem under this name expressing those Bishops who presiding in the Church possesse the power of Baptizing Confirming Ordaining you injuriously Wire-draw him to Presbyters and foist in Seniores et Praepositos which are farre from the clause and matter Be convinced with the more cleare words of the same Epistle Apostolis et Episcopis qui illis vicariâ Ordinatione successerunt Secondly that you bewray grosse ignorance in translating Ambroses Presbyteri consignant by Presbyters ordaining Who that ever knew what belonged to antiquity would have beene guilty of such a solecisme when every novice knowes that consigning signifies confirmation and not ordaining Thirdly you discover not too much skill in not distinguishing of the Chorepiscopi some whereof had both the nature and power of Episcopacy to all purposes and therefore might well by the Bishops licence in his owne charge impose hands others not And lesse fidelity in citing the Councell of Antioch can 10. and the 13. of the Councell of Ancyra if it were not out of our way to fetch them into tryall Lastly I cannot but tell you that you have meerly cast away all this labour and fought with your owne shadow for how ever it were not hard to prove that in the first times of the Church it was appropriated to the Bishop to Ordaine which you cannot but cōfesse out of Ierome and Chrysostom yet since we speaking of our owne time and Church doe both professe and practise an association of Presbyters with us in the act of Ordination whom have you all this while opposed It is enough that you have seemed to say somthing and have showne some little reading to no purpose SECT IX YEt still you will needs beat the ayre very furiously and fight pitifully with your selves Alas brethren why will ye take so much paines to goe wilfully out of your way and to mis-lead the reader with you Who ever challenged in that sense which you faine to your selves a sole Jurisdiction Why will you with some show of learning confute that which you yeeld us to confesse we confesse this sole cryed downe by store of Antiquity we doe willingly grant that Presbyters have and ought to have and exercise a jurisdiction within their owne charge in foro conscientiae we grant that in all the great affayres of the Church the Presbyters whether in Synodes or otherwise ought to be consulted with we grant that the Bishops had of old their Ecclesiasticall Councell of Presbyters with whose advise they were wont to manage the greatest matters and we still have so for to that purpose serve the Deanes and Chapters and the Lawes of our Church frequently make that use of them we grant that Presbyters have their votes in provinciall Synods But we justly say that the superiority of jurisdiction is so in the Bishop as that Presbyters neither did nor may exercise it without him and that the exercise of externall jurisdiction is derived from by under him to those which execute it within his Dioces Thus it is to Timothy that S. Paul gives the charge concerning the rebuke of an Elder or not receiving an accusation against him It is to Titus that S. Paul leaves the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 correction of his Cretians Thus the Canons of the Apostles 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. Thus the blessed Martyr Ignatius in his undoubted Epistle to those of Smyrna 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. Let no man doe any thing in matters belonging to the Church without the Bishop Thus the Councell of Antioch orders that whatsoever belongs to the Church is to be governed managed and disposed by the judgement and authority of the Bishop who hath 〈◊〉

avoweth your goodly proof therefore is in the suds But to meete with you in your own kinde if you will goe upon divers Readings what will you say to that vers 20 where the Angel of Thyatira is encharged Thou sufferest 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 thy wife Iezebell for so it is in very good Copies to teach and seduce yea so it is in that memorable Copy of Tecla forementioned which is to be seene in the Princes Library under the custody of the industrious and learned Mr· Patrick Young as my owne eyes can witnesse and thus St. Cyprian reads it of olde What shall wee thinke shee was wife to the whole company or to one Bishop alone I leave you to blush for the shame this very proofe alone casts upon your opinion Secondly you tell us it is usuall with the Holy Ghost even in this very booke to expresse a company under one singular person as the Beast is the Civill state the Whore and the false Prophet the Ecclesiasticall state of Rome But what if it be thus in visions or emblematicall representations must it needs be so in plaine narrations where it is limited by just Praedicates or because it is so in one phrase of speech must it bee so in all Why doe you not as well say where the Lambe is named or the Lion of Juda this is a collective of many not an individuall subject The seven Angels you say that blew the seven trumpets and poured out the seven phialls are not to bee taken literally but synecdochically perhaps so but then the synecdoche lyes in the seven and not in the Angels so I grant you the word Angel is here metaphoricall but you are no whit nearer to your imagined synecdoche The very name Angell you say is sufficient proofe that it is not meant of one person alone as being a common name to all Gods Ministers and Messengers As if he did not well know this that directed these Epistles and if hee had so meant it had it not been as easie to have mentioned more as one Had he said the Angels of the Church of Ephesus or Thyatira the cause had been cleare now hee sayes the Angell 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the denoted person must be singular for surely you cannot say that all the Presbyters at Ephesus were one Angel The same reason holds for the Stars had he said to the Star of Ephesus I suppose no body would have construed it of many but of one eminent person Now he speaks of so many Stars as Angels to wit seven in those seven Churches Your fourth Argument from the Text it selfe is no better then ridiculous poorely drawn from what it doth not say Lo hee saith the 7. Candlesticks which thou sawest are the 7. Churches but he doth not say the 7. Stars are the 7. Angels of the seven Churches but the Angels of the 7. Churches Forbear if you can Readers to smile at this curious subtilty because the seven is not twice repeated in mentioning the Angels there is a deep mystery in the omission what Cabalisme have we here Had he said the seven Stars are the seven Angels of the seven churches now all had been sure but he saith not so but onely thus the seven Stars are the Angels of the seven Churches It is plaine that every Church hath his Angell mentioned and there being seven Churches how many Angels I beseech you are there now because he doth not say expressely in termes seven Angels of the seven Churches we are foyled in our proofe judge Reader what to expect of so deep speculations Lastly it is evident you say though but one Angell be mentioned in the front yet the Epistles themselves be dedicated to all the Angels and Ministers and to the Churches themselves who ever doubted it the foot of every Epistle runs what the spirit saith unto the Churches not to one Church but to all seven If therfore you argue that the name Angel is collective say also that every of these seaven Angels is the whole company of all the seaven Churches which were a foule non-sence you might have saved the labour both of Ausbertus and the rest of your Authors and your own we never thought otherwise but that the whole Church is spoken to but so as that the Governour or Bishop is singled out as one that hath the maine stroke in ordering the affairs thereof and is therefore either praised or challenged according to his carriage therein although also there are such particularities both of commendations and exceptions in the body of the severall Epistles as cannot but have relation to those severall Over-seers to whom they were endorsed as I have else where specified Had all the Presbyters of Ephesus lost their first love had each of them tryed the false Apostles Had all those of Sardis a name to live and were dead Were all the Laodicean Ministers of one temper these taxations were no doubt of individuall persons but such as in whom the whole Churches were interessed As for those conjecturall reasons which you frame to your selves why the whole company of Presbyters should be written to under the singular name of an Angel if yee please your selves with them it is well from me they have no cause to expect an answer they neither can draw my assent nor merit my confutation Take heed of yeelding that which ye cannot but yield to be granted by D. Raynolds Mr. Beza Doctor Fulke Pareus and others that the Angel is here taken individually but still if you be wise hold your own that our cause is no whit advanced nor yours impaired by this yieldance Let him have been an Angell yet what makes this for a Diocesan Bishop much every way For if the Church of Ephesus for example had many Ministers or Presbyters in it to instruct the people in their severall charges as it is manifest they had and yet but one prime Over-seer which is singled out by the Spirit of God and stiled by a title of eminence the Angel of that Church it must needs follow that in St. Johns time there was an acknowledged superiority in the government of the Church if there were many Angels in each and yet but one that was the Angel who can make doubt of an inequality It is but a pittifull shift that you make in pleading that these Angels if Bishops yet were not Diocesan Bishops for that Parishes were not divided into Diocesses I had thought Dioceses should have been divided into Parishes rather in S. Iohns dayes for by the same reason I may as well argue that they were not Parochial Bishops neither since that then no Parishes were as yet distinguished As if you had resolved to speak nothing but Bulls and Soloecismes you tell me that the seven Stars are said to be fixed in their seven Candlesticks whereas those Stars are said to bee in the right hand of the Son of God But say you still not one Star was over divers Candlesticks

have not yet attained the cognizance of their Purification Baptisme the other of those which are now come on so farre as to professe the Christian Religion in this latter ranke are appointed some which do inquire into the lives and manners of those that come that they may be a meanes to keepe off such Candidates of Religion as doe carry themselves amisse from their Assemblies And the rest that are like themselves they may gladly receive In which passage it is most evident that Origen speakes of those which are newly admitted into the Church who by reason of their late knowledge and acquaintance with those which they left behinde them in Pagan superstition might bee fit Monitours to knowe and notifie the condition of such Candidates as did offer to come into the Church Now these trusty Answerers would make the World believe that this is spoken of some Sage Elders that were to governe the Church and to deceive the Reader unfaithfully turne the words Nonnulli Praepositi sunt as if they were some ruling Elders indeed Whereas the word signifies and intends onely a designation of such Novices as were well approved to an Office of Monitorship concerning those which would professe to bee Converts And now to return your owne words wee would gladly knowe whether these were not as it were Lay Elders As for those other testimonies which you have drawne hither out of Augustine Optatus and the Letters of Fortis and Purpurius out of Baronius I could if neede were double your files in this kinde might that doe you any service I could tell you out of the acts of the Purgation of Foelix and Caecilianus of Episcopi Presbyteri Diaconi Seniores out of the Synodal Epistle of the Cabarsussitan councell as mentioned by Saint Augustine in his Enarration upon the Psalmes Necesse nos fuerat Primiani causam Seniorum literis ejusdem Ecclesiae postulantibus audire atque discutere which is a more pregnant place then any you have brought and could reckon You up yet more out of the Code of the African Canons Can. 91. Out of Gregory Turonensis who speaking of the Bishop of Marselles brings him in to say Nihil per me feci c. I did nothing of my selfe but that which was commaunded me à Dominis nostris Senioribus Out of Gregory the great in his Epistles more then once I could weary you with supply of such authorities But Brethren I shal sadly tel you that you do herein nothing but abuse your Reader with a colourable pretence For all those places you alleage are nothing at all to the purpose in hand VVho can make question but that Carthage and Hippo and other African Cities had old and grave men in them VVho can doubt that they had Magistrates and men in authority Such as we stil are wont out of the ancient appellation to style Aldermen Who can doubt that they did in all great occasions of the Church take the advise and assistance of these prime men But wil it hence follow that in the sense you contend for they had a Setled Lay Presbytery Was their Church ere the more according to your construction governed by Pastors Elders Deacons That these forecited were such as we have intimated is most evident in the Affrican Canons Can 100 they are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the old men And in the 91 Canon we find as a Commentary upon this point Debere unumquemque nostrum in civitate sua convenire Donatistarum Praepositos aut adjungere sibi vicinum Collegam ut pariter eos in singulis quibusque Civitatibus per Magistratus vel Seniores locorum conveniant That is That every one of us should in our own Cities meet with the chiefe Governours of the Donatists and take with him some neighbour as his Colleague or Assistant that they together may give them a meeting by the Magistrates or Elders of the places But you will say there were those which were called Seniores Ecclesiastici ecclesiasticall Elders also True there were such Iustellus confesses so much and learned Isaacus Causabonus whose manuscript notes I have seene and his worthy Sonne Mericus Causabonus in his notes upon Optatus yield no lesse but these they do truly say were but as our Church-wardens men that were trusted with the utensils stock and outward affairs of the Church or as I may more fully compare them our vestry-men who are commonly and of old designed under the name of the eight men or twelve men in every great parish as I am sure it is in the Western parts to order the businesses of Seats and rates and such like externall occasions now that those places which you have cited intend no other Elders then these you shall he convinced out of your own testimonies The place which you bring out of Saint Austen cōtra Cresconium Grāmaticum runs thus Omnes vos c. All you Bishops Presbyters Deacons and Elders do know c. where you see plainly that the Elders which hee means are below Deacons and so you shall find them wheresoever they are mentioned now those that you contend for are by your own claime in a Key above them Optatus whom you cite is cleer against your sense whiles he makes only quatuor genera capitum only four sorts of mē in the Church Bishops Presbyters Deacons the faithful Laity And in his first book against Parmenian Quid commemorē Laicos c. he reckons up meer Laicks Ministers Deacons Presbyteros secundo sacerdotio constitutos Presbyters in the second degree of Priesthood principes omnium Episcopos and the chiefe of all Bishops Shortly brethren that there were in the Church of old ruling Elders which were in a rank above Deacōs and had together with the pastors a setled power of governmēt in the Church it is an opinion no lesse new then unjustifiable I do here solemnly professe that if any one such instance can be brought I wil renoūce Episcopacie for ever Do not thē against the light of your own knowledge set a face on proofs of those things which never were but give glory to God in yielding to so undoubted and cleer a truth SECT XVI XVII.XVIII THe rest that remaines is but mere Declamation not worthy of any answere but contempt and silence It is most true that the religious Bishops of all times have strongly upheld the truth of God against Satan and his Antichrist What can you say to this You tell mee of some irreligious ones that have as strongly upheld Satan and his Antichrist against the truth of GOD What is this to the calling can not I tell you of some wicked and irreligious Presbyters shall the function it selfe therefore suffer You tel us What an unpreaching Bishop once said of a Preacher I challeng you to shew any unpreaching Bishop in the Church of England this day it is your slander this not their just Epithete the scandalls of our inferiour Ministers I professe I