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A00919	A Catholike confutation of M. Iohn Riders clayme of antiquitie and a caulming comfort against his caueat. In which is demonstrated, by assurances, euen of protestants, that al antiquitie, for al pointes of religion in controuersie, is repugnant to protestancie. Secondly, that protestancie is repugnant particularlie to al articles of beleefe. Thirdly, that puritan plots are pernitious to religion, and state. And lastly, a replye to M. Riders Rescript; with a discouerie of puritan partialitie in his behalfe. By Henry Fitzimon of Dublin in Irland, of the Societie of Iesus, priest.; Catholike confutation of M. John Riders clayme of antiquitie.	Fitzsimon, Henry, b. 1566.; Rider, John, 1562-1632. Rescript.; Rider, John, 1562-1632. Friendly caveat to Irelands Catholicks.	1608 (1608)	STC 11025; ESTC S102272	591,774	580

kinred fostrers ●●quaintance resorted into the Picts contry although in small ●umbers yet they became the third inhabitāts of Britanie but so 〈◊〉 they remayned fee farmers to the Picts into whose dominion ●●ey came Both nations thus cōioyned being more distrustfull to ●●e Britōs they inuoked the Saxōs English Beda loc cit cap. 15. other Germain na●ōs to their succours These of defēders became offēders vsurped all the choise part of the lande to thēselues hauing first plighted a leag with the Picts Of frendshipp also made with the Sco●● dwelling amōg the Picts the same may be imagined by means of their cōsociation with thē who otherwyse for their late coming into Britanie small numbre are not by authors once mētioned Beda in historial 3. c. 4 33. In the yeare 565. S. Columb Kille sayled into the Picts prouince and conuerted the Northren part of them and of them receaued to him and his successors the Iland of Hye now called Mula This also was an occasion why many Scots passed into those parts Beda lib. 1. hist. c. 1. After a whyle Edan who is by Beda called Reuda of the composition Rye and Eda signifying King Eda and in latin is called Edanus sonn of Gabrahan sayled as I take it in the yeare 603 into Britanie with a puissant armie and what by force what by fauor intruded among the Picts and is therfor sayd to be the conquerour that first planted Scots in Britanie to witt out of all subiection of others Which Iocelin she weth to haue bene fore prophecied by S. Patrick in these words Iocelinus Monachus Furnensis in vita S. Patricij cap. 137. Of his linadge proceeded the most couragious Edanus sonn of Gabrahan who subdued Scotland which is now called Albanie and Ilands bordering therto in which his successiue posteritie remayneth The subduing of Scotland called Albanie is imputed vnto him by his attempting it first and planting them by whom it was done long after as the begyning of Rome is imputed to Aeneas who dyed long befor it was begon 34. The name of Edanus the circumstance of tyme and of all things els as his powerful strength and the rest do command me to thinke this to be the Edan King of Scots that inhabited Britanie Beda in hist lib. 1. c. 34. who assaulted Edelfrid King of Northumberland Motus eius profectibus only for emulation of his prosperitie more aduentourouslie the● prosperously For being repulsed with great losse nether he nor any of his progenie after sayth Beda returned into Britanie against the English nation vnto the tyme that Beda did wryte his historie Wherby also appeareth that the first King mentioned of the Britanian Scots and all the rest following dwelled out of Britanie and consequently in Irland for other Kingdome of Scots ye● or princely prouince or place fit for their Kings nether euer was by ancient author nor by new can be named the rather that Bed● telleth how the Picts recouered into libertie the land of their possession Beda ibid. l. 4. c. 26. which the English and Scots that weare in Britanie and part of the Britons possessed which hetherto they inioye toward 46. yeares Wherby is first apparent the Scots to haue come after the Picts into Britanie and into ●●●ir parts only Picti secundum veram historiam ante Scotos in Britania 〈◊〉 Picts cōfesseth Iohn Maior lib 1. c. x. according to the true historie ●●e befor the Scots in Britaine Next the Picts not to haue had the ●et inheritance in Britanie befor the yeare of our Sauiour ●rist 446. Thirdly King Edan or in the Irish tong Rye Eda or ●da not to haue florished befor the yeare 603. and to haue bene ●e first guid of multituds of Scots into Britanie Lastly the Picts haue soone after recouered their whole dominions into their ●●ne iurisdiction 35. Thes all putt together we may also assuredly suppose at neuer King of Scots had any dominion peculiarly named ●otland in Britanie whils the Picts had Kings and as Beda sayth ●●d he that adioyned the Epitome to his historie Beda l. 3 c. 4. Epitome historie Anglorum in fine potentissimos re●● tyrannos most mightie Kings and Tyrants to the yeare of Christ 765. ●herfor it was no meruayle that S. Rumuld sonn to Dauid King Scots bishope of Dublin liuing anno 750. was called sonn of ●●h King of Scots notwithstanding he was an Irishman Ioan. Domins de vita S. Rumuldi Molanus de natalibus VValt Carthus Hect. Boeth ther ●ing no wher els any Kings of Scots till after the destruction of ●cts Nether also among the Britanian Scots was ther any cal●d Dauid to the yeare of Christ 1129. So coherent is trueth to it ●●fe and to all monuments of vnsuspitious authors in our be●lfe The same shal be concluded against our aduersaries out of ●eir owne chronicles in thes verses Primus in Albanis fertur regnasse Kenedus Filius Alfini prelia multa gerens Ioan. Maior in hist. Scotica lib. 2. c. vlt. Expulsis Pictis regnauit is octo bis annis Fame sayth First Alban King was Keneth stowt Alfins Martial sonn who Picts shutt out He raigned sixten yeares without all doubt 36. This destruction of Picts or rather extirpation Hect. Boeth for the ●ots vtterly abolished their name and of spring hapening about ●e yeare of Christ 846. and Kenedus being professed in the Alba●an or Britanian Scotish Chronicles to be the first Albanian ●otish King dwelling in Albanie it may be accompted an infal ●●le rule that vntill that tyme at least the Scotish name belon●d only to Irland For to testifie an vnion of the Britanian Scots ●ith Irishmen they named their purchase the lesser Scotland as ●e Spaynards denominated their purchase in America noua His●nia Hispaniola c. new Spayne and litle Spayne c. Therfor for they had purchased their dominion the name of Scots belonged alone to the Irish the belonging to whom of the Albanian Scots them selues being the cause why it was brought into Britanie and by the Irish permitted to remayne theirin to testifie them to haue bene one only people befor and then first separated rather by distance of place then affections For betwixt both nations ther hath bene and still remayneth a natural concord and consociation 37. The sainctitie of both Irish and Scotish appertayning to our contry at least till after 840. yeares as is pregnantly demonstrated what wrong to Irland is it of late Albanian wryters to wreast and distort testimonies of wryters in this maner Georgius Thomsonus in suo libello de antiquitate Christianae religionis apud Scotos yf they say Columbanus to haue bene an Irish man their meaning is that he was only of the mountain part of the lesser Scotland Yf they say Kilian came out of Irland their meaning to haue bene yea their wordes he came out of some Ilāde of this Scotlād Haue not such perfidious glosses made all strangers

the ●aptising of 12000. Christians be wonderfull Wonderfull yf ●he entier and total conuersion of a stiff-necked people not only ●●r the present tyme but also by his prayer for the future not ●nly against Infidels Danes Normans Aimoinus l. 4. c. 100. Eginardus de gestis Caroli Magni Vide Bosium de signis Ecclesiae lib. 8. c. 1. Ostmans yf they were ●●uers but also against hereticks Arians Pelagians Puritans be 〈◊〉 wōder of Irland incomparable aboue all other nations whom ●oth infidelitie and heresie ether altogether or for the most ●art some tyme or other infected after their first Christianitie Wonderfull yf all signes and wonders or markes of a lawfull vo●●tion as the gift of prophecie of tongues of remedying al maner ●f diseases of displacing mountayns of power ouer all elemēts of ●●pernatural fastings of angelical conuersation of holynes at ●ome of peerles reputation abroad be wonderfull O what à ●epth am I vnwittingly trāsported into when I relate or rather 〈◊〉 collect part of his wonders to beleeuers neglecting the contra●etie of winds expecting me among misbeleeuers from aduan●ng into the hauens of their conceits But as much as I haue ●●uentured hetherto was out of Strangfoord hauen where the ●●rrent is so strong that maugre any racke and gale to the contrary yet could not be hindred to fall out so farr with so noble a tyde into an Ocean yf I would sayle therin of endles scope Yet I will returne into the baye of my matter and ryde at ancre vpon the point of Irlands primatiue Christianitie and pietie to demonstrat of what sorte and conformitie to their or our profession they weare Volateran in Anthropologia 7. And first such as are already specifyed S. Patrick for being a Regular canon or religious man abstayning from fleash during his whole lyfe deuout toward the Crosse a perswader of perpetual chastitie to virgins an erecter of Abbayes and Sedulius for commending adoration of Crucifixes as by Gods assistance I intend to shew in the 152. Celius Sedulius Scotus Ibernensis venerabilis a Gelasio papa dictus vt habet Gratianus dist 15. number and so of the residue it is most euident they could nether fauour nor further Puritanisme as being diametricaly opposit and repugnant to such their godly proceedings and conuersations Nether did their successors degenerat from their example as confesseth euen Camden him selfe a sectarist of these tymes the learnedest of that kinde among the whole crue saying Camdenus fol. 683. 684. 685. de chronographica descriptione Britania Edit Franceford anno 1590. The disciples of Patrick so surpassed in Christian pietie that in the age following there was nothing more holy nothing more learned then those Monks In confessing them to haue bene Monks vnaduised Camden and yet so holy so learned how lowdly dost thou condemne thy brethren and M. Rider in particular first in maligning the holynes of Monks and next in clayming a conformitie betwixt the first Christianitie planted among vs and their Puritan profession so distant from it of Monks But not to halt at euery occasion such indeede was their abundant holines and singular renowme of godly doctrin that Marianus of the next age to S. Patrick Marianus lib. 2. pag. 375. Auienus libello Orae maritimae Beda lib. 3. hist c. 7. wryteth Irland to haue bene full of Saincts Auienus affirmeth that it was tearmed the sacred Ilande Beda informeth that out of France they repayred therto legendarum gratia scripturarum For more profound knowledge of scriptures Wherunto also S. Brandons lyfe accordeth 8. But because I am now entring to an information that many can not choose but repyne therat as by change of tyme not only incredible but also disdaynefull that men in the downefall and depth of ignorance inciuilitie and abiection should now appeare to haue bene formerly most learned most vertuouse and most respected I craue of you Contrymen to afford such vntrue surmisers this true defense that all monuments being silent in our Contryes cause and the present countenance of our Contry ●ost remote from former florishing estate they had no reason to ●ppose better therof then according their wonted maner Ne●er had other knowledge bene as yet attayned yf Gods great ●rouidence had not permitted the liues of Saincts by late here●●cks to be derided and distrusted and inspyred Catholick wry●rs to iustifie and publish them in which among other innume●able benifits true knowledge of antiquities are most assuredly ●●wght and discouered Out of these fountaynes Camden Bale and ●ther lyke tooke their drawghts and together dronke vpp the ●orsayd notice of Irlands owld dignitie Surius Molanus Serrarius Bosius VVion Others fynding purer ●prings and sucking thereat throwgh purer pypes the same ●nowledge haue also more purely powred owt running streams ●o our Contryes commendation Out of which I am now to the ●orie of God and your cōsolation to fill all emptie caskes duely ●isposed to be replenished yet nothing without direct deriuation ●rom the purest well springs of vnsuspitious Authors 9. And first who may be more vnsuspitious towards vs then ●e forsayd Camden whether we regarde his Contry or conscien●e He then affirmeth Irlands fame to haue bene so great as they ●nly weare accompted among the English nation of laudable ●ducation who had bene trayned O diuersitie of tyme therin Camden pag. 117. ●or proofe wherof he alleadgeth this prouerbial awnswer when ●uestion was made wher any of qualitie was instructed Amanda●us est ad disciplinam in Iberniam He is sent into Irland to his studyes For ●onfirmation wherof he addeth a verse frequented in common ●peeche Exemplo patrum commotus amore legendi Iuit ad Ibernos sophia mirabile claros Ibidem pag. 678. Of custome ould desyring knowledge sownd To Irish teachers graue the way he found Many other arguments he alleadgeth to verifie the same Ibid. 684. 117. 122. 630 which for breuitie and auoyding suspected ambition I ouerslipp 10. But although his authoritie may seeme forcible in this ●ause as being from one of his disposition yet I iudge it my part ●ot to suffre it to depend vpon his only credit but to auerr it by ●enerable Beda and hee an English man who florished nyne ●undred yeares agoe in incomparable reputation of religious ●ynceritie Thus then he recordeth Beda in hist. Eccl. l. 3. c. 27. This affliction wrought also great ●estruction in Irland VVherin at that tyme weare many of the Nobles and ●ommons of the English nation who in the tyme of Finan and Colman forsaking their owne Iland repayred thether partly for diuine Doctrine partly for 〈◊〉 continent lyfe And truely some did streight conforme them selues to the conuersation of Moncks Others circuiting the cells of teachers ioyfully applyed their studie whom the inhabitants most willingly intertayning cherfully bestowed vpon them their dayly diet bookes to studie and their teaching freelye Agayne he recompting how in Magio which I thinke to be Mayo in Conacht a Seminarie was

builded by S. Colman and the Earle of Mayo Ibidem l 4. c 3. 4. l. 3. c. 26. for the English thus he concludeth to witt which monasterie is to this daye possessed by English-men And it is now become great of a litle one and is commonly called Iniugeo So euery one long since being conuerted to better instructions it contayneth a rare compagnie of Moncks who being collected from the prouince of English in great continencie and synceritye liue by the laboure of their hands according the example of their venerable forfathers vnder rule and a Canonical Abbot Camden pag. 678. 11 Breeflly to contayne many proofs in one Camden confesseth that in Iberniam tanquam ad bonarum artium mercaturam vndique confluxerunt They flocked from all places into Irland as vnto a market of all sciences What say you now Deerly beloued Contrymen can you beleeue your eyes in behoulding this quondam florishing dignitie of your now debased contrye what thinke you was it for Puritanisme or rather for regular discipline more continent life obedience vnder a religious Monck or Abbot that such flocking was into Irlande Of your greatest emulators who lifteth to regard these authorities yf they will admyre as amazed at them yet the most impudent will not hereafter dare to denye them Camden pag. 685. Eginard Aimom S. Bernard loc infrà citandis 12. But how was this florishing deuotion and doctrin vtterly extinguished Camden awnswereth by many forrein inuasions Beda Eginardus Aimoinus and S. Bernard do confirme the same Of whom Beda greatly reproueth Ecgfrid King of Northumberland Beda l. 4 c. 26. because vastauit misere gentem innoxiam nationi Anglorum semper amicissimam ita vt neque Ecclesijs quidem aut monasterijs manus parceret hostilis He miserably wasted the harmeles Irish people and to the English nation most frendly so that he did not spare ether Churches or Abbayes S. Bernard specifyeth so cruel to haue bene the persecutions of pirats that in one day in one only abbaye of Benchor they killed nyne hondred Moncks 13 Besyd which ruine of our ancient glorie I fynde another great desolation in Irland to haue suddenly hapned by a general feruour of our godly doctors conueying them to infidel ●ontryes to imparte vnto them the cleere brightnes of the gos●●ll I say I fynde such voluntarie peregrination to haue disabled ●●d impouerished Irland by their absence as much as they bew●fyed and benifyted other Contryes by their presence Of which ●niuersal transmigration thus wryteth Henricus Antisiodorensis Henricus Antisiodorē in epist. ad Carol. Caluum Quid ●erniam commemorem contempto pellagi discrimine pene totam cum grege ●ilosophorum ad littora nostra migrantem quorum quisquis peritior est vltro ●●i indicit exilium VVhy should I remembre Irland almost altogether 〈◊〉 trowps of philosophers the danger of sea vnregared to these our Coasts ●oting of whom as euery one is most learned so he entreth into banish●ent more promptly When therfor the chefe of our learned saincts ●bandoned their natiue soyle to displaye and plant Religion ●broad is it any merueil that the Contry at home was disfur●ished and all the glorious ornaments therof deminished and ●ithered 14. As their zelous Apostolical spirit conducted them to all ●laces wher they might edifie to saluation of which places ●ome few for certaintie sake are to be mentioned so in England so great weare their vertuous trauayles Camden pag. 117. 157. that as Camden ●cknowledgeth in many places to them yf not only yet ●heefly their deuotions weare addicted their towns and ●hurches dedicated their patronage by all implored To which ●amdens relation do approach and belong thes words of Beda Beda l. 3. c. 3. ●y them the yong and ould of the English weare instructed in studyes ●nd obseruation of regular discipline Agayne they being teachers Ibid. l. 4. c. 26. the ●hole care was to serue God and not the worlde to fill the soule and ●ot to pampre the bodye So that the habit of Religion was then ●n great veneration in so much as wher soeuer any Clercke or Monck ●ould come he would cheerfully be receaued by all as the seruant of God ●lso yf he weare found in his iournie they would ronn to him and bowing ●heir heads couet to be crossed with his hands or blessed with his ●●outhe Was this puritanisme was this ould Catholick Religion different from this late Catholick Religion who will ●ere after thynke so whose senses and witt are at libertie and whom puritan protestations haue not benummed of all vnderstanding But I list not to lingre or trifle in a case so perspi●uous 15. As in situation France is next England so also was it to the godly visitation of our Euangelical pilgrims I will conioyne their fructifying therin and in the low Contryes the bordres therof in one declaration Of the Mellifluous S. Bernard I expect the filling of my sayles with a prosperous bonace and forwynde that I may safely ariue at the port of perswasion trueth and irrefragable authoritie being my lead starr and inoffensiue manifestation of Irlands owld estate my pilot and thou Benchor Abbay the blessed rode from which I will begynn my nauigation S. Bernardus in v. S. Malachie 16. Of this Abbay sayth S. Bernard it was à most noble Monasterie befor vnder Congellus first parent therof yeelding many thousand Moncks and being head of many Abbayes A place in trueth holy fertil of saincts most abundantly fruictfull to God So that one of that holy congregation named Luanus is reported to haue alone fownded in France as Florarium a written martyrologe in our librarie of Louain contayneth a hondred Abbayes VVhich I therfor relate that by this one the Reader may coniecture how surpassing had bene the residue 17. To be breefe the budds or branches therof so replenished Irland and Scotland that the verses of Dauid seeme spoken of those tymes Thow hast visited the earth and made it dronken thow hast multiplyed to enriche it The flood of God is filled with waters thou hast prepared the foode of them for so is the preparation therof Making dronke the bankes of it thou hast multiplyed therof in the stilling dropps wherof the fructifying will reioyce I and in lyke maner they which follow Add not only into the forsayd but also into other strange Contryes thos heaps of saincts powred out them selues as a ouerflowing streame Of whom S. Columban aryued into thes our parts of France erected the Abbay of Lexouium and increased ther into a great multitude They report to haue bene so many as one quyer succeding another the solemne diuine seruice perpetualy continued so that no moment of day or night was vacant from Gods prayses Let this suffice of the ould glorie of the Abbaye of Benchor This being in tyme past destroyed by Pirats Malachias for the remembrance of the ancient dignitie therof tooke it in hande as yf he

of our poore Dublinian bakers that buy their corne in the Market and must beare sesse and presse watch and ward c. But why might not S. Austins sentence haue place in this arbitrement against my wrytings S. Aug. l. 5. con Faust c. 11. quorum oculum maleuolus error in solampalcam nostra segetis ducit nam triticū ipsi viderent si esse veilent whose eye malignat error leadeth to our chaff only for wheat they might behowld yf they wereof our fraternitie S. Gregorie was of a different disposition to both these Puritans S. Greg. l. 8. ep 37. ex registro Martin Marr-Prelat and M. Rider as well in all things els as in thinking other mens flower and paste daintie in respect of his owne Si delicioso cupitis pabulo saginari beati Augustini opuscula legite ad comparationem siliginis illius nostrum furfurem non queratis yf you desyre to be fedd with delicat foode read the small treatises of S. Austin and in comparison of his purest flower you will not effect our branne As for aunswer to M. Riders vawnts I say only that my first and last aunswer being subiected now not only to his censure but to other men it will appeare whither his boulter was course or noe or his bread made therof be whyte or browne And for all his repetions of the same promises and other reproaches I say as a Gentleman sayd to a Piper that eftsoons reiterated the same song he hauing once giuen him fower pence Frend varie they note yf thou wilt haue me increase my grote Yet this I add that among other parcels of wysedome sondrie euidēces by M. Rider are affoorded that my copie deliuered to him was very legible For at euery stepp he carpeth according to his maner therat with like successe as the gugion carpeth the bayte on hooke and lyne Rider 7. The first positition which Maister Fitzsymon was vrged to proue was this That the Corporall presence of Christs bodie bloud in the Sacrament was neuer taught by the Fathers of the first fiue hundred yeares after Christ Now M. Fitzsymon knowing it impossible to be prooued by him or any in the world because it was hatched seuen hundreth yeares after that he altereth the state of the Question and saith That Christ is realy in the blessed Sacrament and thus starteth like a broken bowe from the manner of the presence which hee should prooue to the matter of the presence which was neuer in question betwixt Protestant and Papist And so in this scroule hudleth vp many Fathers speaking of the matter of the presence to the worthie prepared receiuers by faith But not one word of the Corporall presence Page 11. and to bee receiued by the mouth And most fondly and childishly would maintaine the opposition to bee betwixt Real and Figuratiue not betwixt Corporall and Spirituall Besides he sheweth there to prooue his presence a great deale of ignorance in a little Philosophie nay Fooloso-fie all which I praye you wish him to mend them and multis alijs with his pen least they come in print to his shame and vtter disgrace And I assure you and al that read this Maister Fitzsimon with all his words and wit or rather witlesse words hath not proued one syllable in question nor infringed any authority that I brought against him 7. Title VVhether the corporal presence of Christ vvas hatched tvvelue hondred yeares after Christ Fitzimon 7. MY whole wrytings being replenished with aboue a hondred disproofs of this Paradox should I now resume them superfluously should I dispute against him that only for purchasing of tyme during his not being confuted audaciously affirmeth what all Christians as well Catholicks as Protestants doe denye and denyeth what they affirme he being in fact and woord disabled by the state for his enorme ignorance and being so assuredly alredie disproued Let my Treatises be perused and no reasonable man but will iudge such satisfaction to be manifowldly exhibited wherby this labor may seeme to be well spared and now should foolishly be wasted Worthely sayd S. Austin S. Aug. l. 6. con Faustum cap. 8. in altogether a lyke case Eadem sepè vana reperere istum non pudet sed eadem sepè quamuis vera respondere me piget Often to repeat the same vayne things to him is noe shame but to aunswer often euen true things I accompt it ablame Agayne Fortassis autem paulo prolixior ista respōsi● sic lectorem iustruet vt in caetaris responsionibus non a nobis tam multa verba requirantur Perhapp our first aunswer a litle prolixe wil so instruct the reader that in other aunswers many woords of vs will not be requyred Which as I sayd to haue place in our replye to M. Riders Caueat impudencie it selfe will not gayn-say 8. Our second position was this Rider That Gods Church had not their seruice in an vnknowne tongue but in such a language as euery particular Church vnderstood Maister Fitsymon knowing this to be true yet willing to say something for feare of scilence and censuring altereth the state of the question and saith that scripture seruice haue beene in vnvulgar tongues but hee should haue shewed that they were vnvulgare and vnknowne and not vnderstood of that vulgar where they were practised yea and that within the compasse of the first fiue hundred yeares after Christ his ascention then hee had said something but now omitting the circumstance he hath failed in the substance and so proued iust nothing And I pray you admonish him of his falsifying of Beda wresting him to prooue his Latine seruice wheras his words be these Hac in presenti quinque gentium linguis c. This Iland saith Beda searcheth and confesseth at this present time one and the same knowledge of the highest veritie and truest sublimitie with the tongues of fiue nations that is to say the Saxons Brittaines Scots Pictes Latines whose tongues by meditation of the scriptures is become common to all the rest I pray you intreat him with all his Iesuiticall Transmarine Logicque but to make out of Beda one sound Syllogisme in mood and figure to prooue the matter in question and then erit mihi magnus Apollo I protest vnto you Gentlemen I doe not spite him for his enuie but pittie him for his ignorance thus to abuse the dead Father and liuing Reader and all to vnderprop declining errors 8. Title VVhether Beda be falsifyed concerning scriptures in the lating tonge 8. M. Rider will whether I would or noe Fitzsimon proue him selfe Riderial Of my proofs what they were may be gathered in my treating whether the Masse had euer bene in the lating tong that diuine seruice hath neuer bene in the vulgar tong to be at the capacitie or handling of the vulgar he in this place affirmeth that I sayd scriptures and diuine seruice had bene in vnuulgar tongues but should proue that they were