you Men of singular Learning and Piety to Examine it These likewise could discover no dangerous Positions in it except such as were dangerous for a Preacher to deliver but safe for People to Receive in these Troublesome Times And I am Confident that their Iudgement was such They would not be deceived with my Falsehoods and their Honesty such They would not deceive me by their Flattery And now Sir Love cannot Hate but it may justly be Angry Consider how your accusing of me to maintaine dangerous Positions might as the Times stand have undone me and mine and at least have intituled mee to a Prison now adayes the Grave of men alive Times are not as formerly when Schollers might safely Traverse a Controversie in disputation Honourable Tilting is left off since men fell to down-right killing and in vaine should I dispute my Innocence against Souldiers violence who would interpret the Accusation of a man of your Credit to be my sufficient Conviction I have in this my Defence so well as God did Enable me more clearely expressed and strongly confirmed the Positions I formerly delivered and request you to tell mee which are the dangerous Points that here I mainetaine By the Lawes of our Land the Creditor hath his Choice whether he will sue the Principall or the Surety and discretion will advise him to sue him which is most solveable Your Ability is sufficiently knowne and seeing you have beene pleased to be bound for Master Saltmarsh his Booke in your Approving it blame me not Sir if I I will not say sue you but Sue to you for my Reparation If you can Convince me of my Faults herein and I will bring great desire and some capacity to Learne from you I shall owne my selfe your Proselyte thanke God for you and you for my Conversion Yea in a Printed sheet I will doe publique Penance to the open view of the World to shew men that although I had so much Ignorance as to Erre I have not so much Impudence as to Persist in an Errour and shall remaine Yours in all Christian Offices THOMAS FULLER To the Reverend and his Worthy good Friend Master IOHN DOWNAM SIR BEing about to read Master Saltmarsh his examination of a Sermon of mine which you to the Preachers credit and Printers security were pleased to approve for Orthodox and Vsefull mine eyes in the beginning thereof were entertained I cannot say welcomed with this following note An Advertisement returned to the Author by a Reverend Divine to certifie him touching the Licensers allowance of Master Fullers late Sermon of Reformation Sir To satisfie you concerning M. Downams approbation of Master Fullers Sermon of Reformation I assure you I heard him complaine that he was wronged by him in that having taken exception at some passages of that Sermon Master Fuller promised to amend them according to his correction but that he did not performe what he promised Conclude me not guilty if I were moved but sencelesse if I had not beene perplext with this accusation Had it beene true I want a word bad enough to expresse the foulenesse of my deed Yea iustly may my preaching be suspected of falshood if my practise be convicted of dishonesty We know how the Corinthians from the supposed breach of S. Pauls solemne promise were ready to infer the falsity at least the levity of his doctrine till the Apostle had rectified their mistake This added also to my trouble that I can privately enjoy my innocence with more contentment to my selfe then I can publikly declare it with safety to others For the present therefore all that I will returne is this Here is an Accusation without a witnesse or a witnesse without a name and both without truth Would the Inke of this reverend Divine whosoever he was only hold out to blot my name and not to subscribe his owne We know what Court was complayned of as a great grievance because Men therein might not know their Accusers If it cannot consist with our mutuall safety to have my accusers as S. Paul had face to face yet it will stand with equity I should have them name to name till when I account this namelesse note no better then a Libel both on you and me God put an end unto these wofull times before they put an end to us that all outward hostility being laid aside we may have more leisure to attend and comfort to follow that inward Christian Warefare which your paines have so well described Yours in Christ Iesus Thomas Fuller To Master JOHN SALTMARSH Minister of Heslerton in Yorke-shire SIR YOu have almost converted me to be of your opinion that some extraordinary Light is peculiarly conferred on men in this age Seeing what cost me many dayes to make you in fewer houres could make void and confute You examined you say the same pace you read and as is intimated wrote as fast as you examined and all in one ofternoon This if it were false I wonder you would say it and if it were true I wonder you could doe it However I commend your policy herein for besides that you have given the world notice of the Pregnancie of your parts and it is no fault of yours if you be rather heard then beleeved hereby you have done me a great disadvantage For if I at leisure discover some notable errors in your examinations you have a present Plea that you wrote them suddenly and I shall only be repaired for the wrong that you have done me with your raptim scripta whereas you had done God as much Glory the cause as much good more right to your selfe and credit to me if you had tooke more time and more truely And now consider you only endeavour to confute some dismembred sentences of my Sermon of which some are falsely and more of them imperfectly alleged You know how in a continued speech one part receives and returnes strength and lustre unto another And how easie is it to overthrow the strongest sentence when it is cut off from the Assistance of the Coherence before and after it Alas this disiointing of things undoeth kingdomes as well as sermons whilest even weake matters are preserved by their owne unity and entirenesse I have dealt more fairely with you and set downe your whole Examinations thereby not expecting any praise but preventing just censure if I had done otherwise If you demand why my answer comes so late seeing so long silence may be interpreted a consent Know Sir it was the tenth of September before either friend in love would doe me the favour or foe in anger the discourtesie to convey your booke unto me Whether this proceeded from the intercepting commerce betwixt the City and the Country or that your Booke was loath to come out of London as sensible that the strength of your positions consisted in the fortifications thereof When I had received one of your bookes I had not your present parts to answer it Men must doe as
Truth Maintained or POSITIONS DELIVERED in a Sermon at the SAVOY Since Traduced For DANGEROVS Now Asserted For SOVND and SAFE By THOMAS FVLLER B. D. late of Sidney Colledge in Cambridge The Particulars are These I That the Doctrine of the Impossibility of a Churches perfection in this world being wel understood begets not lazinesse but the more industâ—â— in wise reformers II That the Church of England cannot justly be taxed with superstitious innovations III How farre private Christians Ministers and subordinate Magistrates are to concurre to the advancing of a Publique Reformation IIII What parts therein are only to be acted by the Supreme power V Of the progresse and praise of passive obedience VI That no extraordinary Excitations Incitations or Inspirations are bestowed from God on men in these dayes VII That it is utterly unlawfull to give any just offence to the papist or to any men whatsoever VIII What advantage the Fathers had of us in learning and religion and what we have of them IX That no new light or new essentiall truths are or can be revealed in this age X That the doctrine of the Churches imperfection may safely be preached and cannot honestly be concealed With severall Letters to cleare the occasion of this Book I will beare the wrath of the Lord because I have sinned against him untill he plead my cause and execute iudgement for me then will he bring me forth to the light and I shall see his righteousnesse Micah 7. 9. Printed at London Anno Dom. 1643. TO THE Most Sacred and Reverend ASSEMBLY For the REFORMATION of the CHURCH now convened by the PARLIAMENT Most Sacred and Reverend Divines I Have but the thoughts of an Afternoone to spread before you for I Examined the same Pace that J read that if it were possible a Truth might overtake an Errour ere it goe too farre It is not a little Encouragement that I may sit like the Prophetesse under the Palme tree under such a Shade as your selves and what weakenesse soever may appeare in these my Assertions This ayring them under your Patronage will heale them For so they brought forth the sick into the streets that at least the shadow of Peter might touch some of them Thus have I suddenly set up my Candle for others to Light their Torch at and I hope you will pardon me if my Zeale to the Truth made me see Anothers faults sooner then mine Owne Your Servant in Christ Iesus Iohn Saltmarsh TO the Two most Famous VNIVERSITIES OF ENGLAND I Dare not give you such high Epithites as Master Saltmarsh bestoweth upon the Assembly to call you the MOST SACRED Be contented to be Stiled the Two most Famous Vniversities a Title which it is no Flattery to give you but Injury to deny you I have the Studies of some whole dayes to spread before you I am not ashamed to confesse so much but should be ashamed to present your learned Considerations with lesse And will rather runne the hazard of other mens Censure to have studied so long to no purpose then to be guilty to my selfe of so much disrespect to You as to offer to your Patronage what cost me but sleight studying Indeed I examined his Examinations of my Sermon with the same pace that I read them But I could not confute his Errors so speedily as I could discover them nor could I so soon make them appeare to others as they appeared to me and the Evidencing of his Faults did cost me some Paines whereof I hope I shall never have just Cause to Repent I am altogether out of hope that my Truth should quickly overtake his Error which had the Advantage of me both at the Starting and in the Speed And yet I beleeve what I want in the swiftnesse of my Feet I shall have in the Firmenesse of my footing And when I overtake it at last as I am sure I shall seeing on truths will Tire as being better at hand then at length I am confident by Gods Assistance it will get firme and quiet Possession in spight of opposition It is altogether Improper for mee to compare You being Two in number to the Palme Tree under which the Prophetesse Deborah face But the Analogie will hold well if I should resemble You to the Two Olive Trees continually dropping oyle in the Presence of God And methinks Master Saltmarsh his Expression to the Assembly VNDER SVCH A SHADE AS YOVR SELVES making thou t in the Assembly but a Shadow and then what is the Shadow of a Shadow worth under which hee desireth to sit was but an undervaluing and diminutive expressing of their worth I honour you as You Deserve and Counting You a Real and Lasting Substance so I addresse my Respects unto you Humbly requesting you to be pleased to Patronize and defend this my defence the rather because what doctrines therein I deliver not long since I suckt from One of you and in this respect I beleive both Breasts give Milke alike And therefore as your Learning is most Able so your Goodnesse will bee willing to Protect the same not so much because I had them from you as because you had them from the Truth Some perchance may blame my Choice in Choosing You for my Protection who in these troublesome times are scarce able to defend your selves The Universities being now Degraded at least suspended from the degree of their former Honour And I wonder Men should now talke of an Extraordinary great Light when the two Eyes of our Land so you were ever accompted are almost put out However this short Interruption of your Happinesse will but adde the more to your Honour hereafter And here as it were Store of Pride for me to Counsell you so it were want of duty not to Comfort you Know the only Good Token of these Times is That they are so extreamely Bad they can never last long God give you a sanctified Impression of your Afflictions neither to sleight them nor sink under them and so forbearing to be longer troublesome to your more serious Employments resteth The meanest of your Sonnes or Nephewes Thomas Fuller TO THE LEARNED AND MY WORTHY GOOD FRIEND Master Charles Herle SIR WHen I read a Pamphlet of M. Saltmarsh written against me it something moved my Affections but nothing removed my Judgement But when I saw it recommended to the world with your Approbation in this manner Nihil invenio in hoc Libello cui Titulus Examinations or a discovery of some dangerous Positions delivered in a Sermon of Reformation Preached by Tho. Fuller B. D. quin utiliter imprimatur Charles Herle I must confesse it troubled me not a little suspecting either my Eyes or my Understanding that either I misread your Name or had mis-written something in my Sermon Wherefore fearing Partiality might blind me in mine Owne Book knowing that Eli was not the onely Indulgent Father to his owne Off-spring I imparted my Sermon to some whom you respect and they respect
{non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} A Through Rectifying However sometimes the word Reformation is not opposed to things bad in their owne nature but to things that are lesse perfect and may be more perfected as in the Text For the Ceremoniall law of the Jewes was compleat in its kinde as given of God and every thing made by Him must be like Him that made it very good Yet comparatively that law was imperfect and needed a Reformation which was performed at Christs comming Besides though the Ceremoniall Law was good in it selfe yet it was bad as it was abused by the ignorant Jewes For though the knowing Patriarks looked through and beyond the Types to the Messias himselfe yet the dull People mistaking the Shell for the Kernell and the Casket for the Jewell lodged their soules where they should only have bayted and did dote on the shadowes as on the substance it selfe in which respect the Peoples judgements as well as those Ceremonies needed a Reformation The maine point we shall insist on is this That Christians living under the Gospel live in a time of Reformation which will appeare in severall particulars For besides Ceremonies removed according to the principall intent of the Text Manners are now reformed and Doctrine refined Poligamy connived at in the Patriarks now generally condemned the Bill of Divorce cancelled by Christianity which was permitted to the Jewes not because that was good but because they were bad and by this Tolleration were kept from being worse The second Table abused by the restrictive Comments of the Pharisees confining those Lawes which were made to confine them onely to the outward Act are now according to our Saviour interpretation extended to their true demention The mistery of the Trinity clouded in the old Testament is cleered in the New The Doctrine of Gods righteousnesse by faith of the merrit of Christ of the spirit of Adoption of the Resurrection of the Body darkly delivered under the Law are manifested in the Gospel with many other heavenly Revelations Use Let us be hartily thankfull to God who gave us to be borne since the comming of Christ in the time of Reformation Our Twi-light is cleerer then the Jewish Noon-day The men of China use to brag that they because of their ingenious civility have two Eyes the Europaeans one and that all the World besides are starke blinde more truely it may be said that the Christans had two Eyes the Law and Gospell the Jewes but one the Law alone and all people and Pagans besides sit in darknesse and the shadow of death The Jewes indeed saw Christ presented in a land-scept and beheld him through the Perspective of faith seeing the promises a farre off But at this day a Dwarfe-Christian is an overmatch for a gyant Jew in knowledge as appeareth by our Saviours Riddle Mat. 11. 11. Among them that are borne of women there hath not risen a greater then John the Baptist Notwithstanding he that is least in the Kingdome of Heaven is greater then he Which Riddle is thus untyed John Baptist was the greatest amongst the Children of Women because other Prophets foresaw Christ He saw him others spake of Christ He spake to him and had the high honour to baptize him with water by whose spirit he himselfe was baptized Yet was he the least in the Kingdome of Heaven which properly began after Cerists Ascention because though perchance acquainted with the generals thereof the particulars of the time place meanes and manner were as much conceal'd from him as cleerly revealed unto us He never knew that Iudas should betray Christ Caiphas accuse him Peter deny him Pilate condeme him Souldiers crucifie him Nicodemus embalme him Ioseph bury him These and many more Circumstances of our Saviours passion Returrection and Ascention now Histories to our Children were Misteries to Iohn Baptist who though Christs Harbinger to prepare his way yet did not live to see his Master to possesse what he had provided for him Wherefore if Alexander the Emperour did count himselfe much indebted to the Gods that he was borne a Grecian and not a Barbarian how thankfull ought we to be to God who gave us to be borne neither Jewes nor Pagans but Christians since the time of Reformation But this indeed were true if all things in the Church continued at this time in the same condition of Primative Purity whereto Christ Reform'd it Object But long since That falling away foretold by the Apostle is come to passe and that man of sinne hath played his part in the Church therein deforming Manners with Vice Doctrine with Heresie Discipline with Superstition As for any Reformation which since hath happened in England it hath been but partiall and imperfect King Henry the eight brake the Popes necke but bruised not the least finger of Popery rejecting his Supremacy but retaining his superstition in the six Articles The Reformation under Edward the sixth was like the Reformer little better then a childe and he must needs be a weake Defender of the Faith who needed a Lord Protector for himselfe As Nurses to woe their Children to part from knives doe suffer them to play with Rattles so the State then permitted the People infants in Piety to please themselves with some frivious points of Popery on condition they would forsake the dangerous opinions thereof As for Queene Elizabeth her Character is given in that plaine but true expression that she swept the Church of England and left all the dust behind the doore Her Successors have gone in the same path and the same pace with little alteration and lesse Addition in matters of Moment save that besides some old errours unamended many Innovations have broken in upon us which might be instanced in were it as safe as it is easie to reckon them up We therefore desire and expect a Through Reformation to see Christ mounted on his Throne with his Scepter in his hand in the Purity of his Ordinances and we shall grieve and groane untill such a Reformation Answ This objection containes many parts and must be taken asunder Some things therein are freely to be granted and others flatly to be denied and others warily to be qualified We freely confesse the Deformation by Popery as also that the Reforming was by Henry the eight and Edward the sixth good Prince of whom I had said that he dyed too soone but because he dyed when God would have him were but partiall and imperfect Withall we flatly deny that Queene Elizabeth left the dust behinde the Doore which she cast out on the Dunghill whence this uncivill expression was raked up The Doctrine by her established and by her Successors maintained in the 39. Articles if declared explained and asserted from false Glosses have all gold no dust or drosse in them Againe we freely confesse that there may be some faults in our Church in matters of practice and Ceremonies and no wonder if there be it would be a Miracle if there were not
the peeces thereof together And now since the Monopoly of the Popish Clergy ingrossing all matters of Religion to themselves is dissolved it is fit Protestant Ministers lawfull propriety in their calling should justly be maintained I Thus you may take off many honest Labourers in the Vineyard Farre be it from me especially if they be skilfull-Labourers such as will prune the Vines not pluck them up by the roots But this and what you say of those to whom God hath held out his Scepter is nothing to the purpose except you could prove where God in the Scripture hires or cals private men to make a publike Reformation EXAMINER And whereas you tell us that the supreame Power alone hath the lawfull calling as appeares in the Kings of Judah I answer that if so the Parliament were now in a dangerous K praemunire for you know that is suspended from us and yet our state goes on in their worke enabled as they say by their fundamentall power and constitution I shall not here dispute the emanations of this power in ordinances votes and orders they have made it appeare in their owne declarations onely this I read of an ordinance made by the Nobles and Elders of Israel those Lords L and Commons That whosoever would not come according to the Counsell which was taken for Reformations all his substance should be forfeited Here is no King of Judah's hand nor a Cyrus King of Persias but an ordinance of their owne to their owne people onely they have King Cyru's writ for their assembling and consulting Had Christ M and his Apostles waited in their Reformation for the consent of the Roman Magistrate the supreame Power they had not made that holy expedition they did Had Luther and Zuniglius N and Oecolampadius staid for the Emperours Reformation they had not shed halfe that light in the Germane hemisphere There was a time when God tooke part of the spirit of Moses and put it upon O the Elders TREATIS K If so the Parliament were now in a dangerous Praemunire I will not marre a meane Divine of him to make a meaner States-man by medling with matters in the Common-wealth I that maintaine that every man must stay in his calling will not step out of mine owne Let the differences betwixt our Soveraigne and his Subjects which consist in points of State be debated by the Politicians on either side the questions in law be argued respectively by their learned Counsell and the controversies in Religion be dispuputed by their severall Divines But alas such is our misery when all is done the finall decision is devolved to the Souldiers sword on either side and God send the best cause the best successe L Onely this I read of an Ordinance made by the Nobles and Elders of Israel those Lords and Commons By your favour it was a compleat act of state as confirmed by the royall Assent True there was no King of Judah's hand unto it because at that time Judah had no King and who can expect that the Sunne should shine at midnight when there is none in that Horizon Reasonable men will then be contented with the Moon-shine and see that here For Zerobabel shining with borrowed beames and a reflected light from the Persian King in which respect he is stiled Hag. 1. 14. the Governour of Judah concurred to this Ordinance by his approbation thereof Besides this there was also a triple consent of the Persian Kings First the grand and generall grant from Cyrus Ezra 1. 3. which still stood in full force as confirmed by Darius Ezra 6. 12. whereby the Jewes being authorized to re-build the Temple were also by the same enabled to settle Gods service in the best manner by what wholsome lawes they thought fitting Secondly a particular implicite grant in that the Persian King knowing thereof did not forbid it when it was in his power had it beene his pleasure and such a not opposing amounts to a consent Lastly they had a large expresse command from King Artaxerxes to Ezra chap. 7. ver. 26. And whosoever will not doe the law of thy God and the law of the King let judgement be executed speedily upon him whether it be unto death or unto banishment or to confiscation of goods or to imprisonment And now Sir I have the lesse cause to be offended with you for citing mangled and dismembred peeces in my Sermon seeing the Scripture it selfe finds as little favour from your hand for had you compared on place thereof with another you could not but have seen the Persian Kings consent to this Reformation Yea so observant were the Jewes of the Persian Kings that at the first issuing forth of their prohibition to that purpose they instantly desisted building the Temple having their soules so well managed and mouthed with the reines of loyalty that their Kings negative voyce checkt and stopt them as they were running full speed in so good an imployment so little doth the instance alleadged advantage your cause M Had Christ and his Apostles waited in their Reformation for the consent of the Roman Magistrate I answer First Christ and his Apostles were Christ and his Apostles I meane extraordinary persons immediately inspired Secondly the Reformation they brought was mainly materiall indeed being the Gospell without which there was no salvation Thirdly because they had not the Emperours consent to their Reformation they pacified his displeased sword by preferring their necks unto it not repining at the dearnesse of the purchase to buy the safety of their soules with the losse of their lives all the Jury of the Apostles John onely accepted followed their Master to Martyrdome and hence we truly deduced the patterne of passive obedience N Had Luther and Zuniglius and Oecolampadius stayed for the Emperours Reformation Luther was a Minister and so had his share in reforming so farre as to propagate the truth and confute falshoods by his pen preaching and disputations What he did more then this was done by the flat command at lest free consent of Frederick Duke of Saxony under whom Luther lived This Duke owing homage but not subjection to the Emperour counted himself and was reputed of others absolutein his owne Dominions as invested with the power of life and death to coine money make offensive and defensive leagues and the like And although this wary Prince long poised himself betwixt feare of the Emperor and love of the truth yet he always either publikely defended Luther or privately concealed him till at last having outgrowne his fears he fell boldly to publike reforming As for the states of Zurich and Basil wherein Zuniglius and Oecolampadius lived as those Cities in one Relation are but members of the Helvetian Common-wealth so in another capacity they are intire bodies of themselves and in these states the Magistrates did stamp the Character of civill authority on that Reformation which these Ministers did first set on foot by their preaching But if any extravagant action of