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A67003 A short letter modestly intreating a friends judgement upon Mr. Edwards, his booke he calleth an Anti-apologie, with a large but modest answer thereunto framed, in desire, with such evennesse of hand, and uprightnesse of heart, as that no godly man might be effended at it : and with soule-desire also, that they, who are contrary-minded, might not be offended neither, but instructed. Woodward, Ezekias, 1590-1675.; Hartlib, Samuel, d. 1662. 1644 (1644) Wing W3502; ESTC R18279 37,876 40

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fitted to every mans taste and yet some did strangely dis●●lish it A. Who can relish this I pray you They call themselves exiles B. Call themselves so They were so indeed and in truth Reader I cannot say a little to this and indeed it is not so fully to my scope yet this I 'le say As sure as by the patience of a good God I breath in His aire so sure I could cleare this even to M. Edw. himselfe that these his brethren justly call themselves exiles A. Voluntary and willing if not wilfull exiles he sayes B. He saith what he pleaseth and so he hath a contradiction in terminis No man that may live in his Countrey and enjoy quietly all the sweets there with Gospell liberties take that with you will leave his Countrey willingly sure No these brethren were forced-out their persons forced their consciences forced c. but I 'le say no more A. They make an Apol. for themselves and therin a motion to the High Court and is that well relished thinke you B. Yes truly I thinke very well relished That they should take liberty to make a motion and speake for themselves It is no more than what is permitted to Church-robbers Traytors yea and Sorcerers too All these sayes one are permitted to make a motion and speake for themselves Are they so Then give the same liberty to the faithfull servants of the Lord to make a motion that they may be permitted to serve their God after the way which I and you simple ones may call heresie But they are perswaded that in that very way they worship the God of their fathers beleeving all things which were written in the Law and in the Prophets A. If it be so reasonable a motion why is it not granted B. I professe unto you I cannot tell but I can tell that you and I must shew more manners than to aske more questions touching this matter It is a reasonable motion so we are concluded It is committed to the highest Judicature in the Kingdome there we leave it and so an end A. Not yet you must remember there is one reason more out of their politicks why they will forbeare to make answer Because it will but widen the difference and lay-open their Church-way to more open scandall B. I humbly conceive none of all this can be but the contrary It will close-up and heale the difference And cleare their way to all unprejudiced beholders or give them cleare knowledge that those brethren are a little out of the way And this answers their supposed politicks why in policie they will not make reply A. 2. It is resolved by some They cannot make reply through weakenesse B. But I can never beleeve that I hold it as feosible a thing as any thing that has been done this many yeares and a work also of quick dispatch for I suppose 1. That all personall things shall be cast away Wherein they have failed in point of practise they will thanke him for telling them all that and be carefull with all their care to correct it Moreover they have a good God to goe unto the Father of mercies And for the people of God the Church she is the mother of mercies I remember Luthers words here in the very like ease I have much ignorance in me about matters of God and have carried things negligently sometime but my ignorance the Church will beare with and my saults she will pardon for she is the Queene of mercy and nothing else but c. These personall matters therefore touching these brethren shall not blot paper these shall be transacted in the closset betwixt God and their soules 2. What things may be unjustly urged against them which sure are very many they can heare with silence and beare with patience so be the glory of God and honour of their profession be not concerned therein As surely all this is concerned when things which the Apo● knew not are taken-up upon trust and urged against them and yet they should make no reply whereby to reprove him to his face 3. And for their reproaches as Melanct. said in the very same case Their Lord Christ will give them strength to beare for him * Who bore away the curse from them they can suffer for Christ and goe away rejoycing More than all this can I beare for Christ said he smitten with the tongue in the same manner None of all this neither shall blot paper no It is spread as the Kings Letter before the LORD He will answer it by Himselfe 4. Touching M. Edw. his walkings in and out his scatterings here and there not a word of that let him and his friends lay open their own nakednesse they will not And so now the Answer is in every ma●s judgement cut short by twenty sheets Now for the worke and body of the Answer I can say nothing to that only I am perswaded in my heart that the Spirit of the Lord is with them the secret of the Lord is revealed unto them because they ask it as the most comprehensive blessing * They obey from the heart and so they feare Him and doe His will surely they shall know of the doctrine a for they can professe that they hated mans inventions all along in his will-worship and that they never leant to their own wisedome they abominated that in their search and enquiry after Truth they followed the most unerring patterne and when any sparke of light was communicated to them they desired no more but to see the clearenesse of Heaven come along with it and then they followed on to seeke the Lord And knowing the terrour of the Lord they would perswade with us simple ones in this That we would feare to kindle a fire of our own to compasse our selves with sparkes for this is the judgement of the Lord in that matter walke in the light of that fire and sparkes which ye have kindled This shall ye have of My hand ye shall lie downe in sorrow Thus Sir I have for the satisfaction of the simple Reader it is great reason he should be satisfied removed the politick reasons which were resolved upon would with-hold a Reply to the Anti-Apol and cleared in passage how able work-men we have for the work how easie the work is and how quickly framed and raised upon the Advantage ground of Truth Whether these servants of the Lord will apply themselves or their Answer to M. Ed. that I cannot tell I think not They cannot sure thinke him worthy of an Answer who has done so unworthily But the people and Church of God they are worthy And now what will this man doe with his Rejoynder and Letters Rejoyne 〈◊〉 what will be Rejoyne to this Thou shalt not raise a false report h Or to this Consider of it take advice and speake i Doubtlesse the man will put his Rejoynder and Letters both to some private shame or open pennance
way their zeale may goe-forth at the dispute about it and passion may get in Then Reasons like a bad hound speeds upon a false sent and forsakes the question first started Sir you are at the end of my Preface now to my undertaking The Authour first then to his Epistle and so to the Booke and some resolves thereupon and then an end The Authour you are pleased to Name him so will I for honour sake But before I come at him I will reach forth my hand unto him and my heart for these shall never goe single My heart is towards him and to God for him That the Lord would shine upon him and his gifts that so neither he nor they may runne-out any more to waste as persons and graces doe which doe not promote the Glory of God and the salvation of soules Now I am come to him I suspect my selfe and my loving respects towards him least they carry me beyond my bounds in his commendation Truly I cannot tell in what one thing the man is wanting to make him compleat except in Charity that is a great exception and some say he is so wanting therein that he has no charity at all yet that is the everlasting grace and compleats all yea some doe not straine to say he is a man of a malignant spirit and he hath shewed forth openly nothing else he must be content to fall under censure Truly I think they say not well and so good he thinks himselfe he cares not what they say and there he may be too carelesse But for my part I would rather I could say he is a man of an excellent spirit but then my love transporting me I should say too much Yet this I must say he is very high in my thoughts not a whit higher in others account almost as he is in his owne and he hath improved his growth not a little within these foure yeares for then he was matched by he knoweth whom surely the Lord would have had him accounted that as a spetting in his face and now he hath attained to that height in the eyes of all the learned that he is too tall a match for a woman Good man Indeed the best have their failings God hath left him to himselfe as he hath said of his Brethren To try him that he might know all that was in his heart And now all know it I thinke better than himselfe for palam est It is all abroad and in every mans eare and eye what was in his heart so secret there this seven yeares upon my knowledge And here I could tell the Reader something from thence from what I know more what I heard from an excellent Master in Israel and his best Disciples in Hartford But I must not doe that my selfe which I must reprove in him for I never spake with him about it neither alone nor before others Nor would I for a world render Gath and Askelon debtors unto me Bristoll and Oxford God forbid That I should give the Philistines there matter of rejoycing or the uncircumcised there cause of Triumph Whether the reverend Authour of this Anti-Apolog hath not more rejoyced the Adversaries to the Truth than edified her Friends in their most holy Faith requires his most retired serious and saddest thoughts That so he may as he may see cause give check to his busie pen in his zeal for God and his cause he hath given his word he will not cease writing lest while in his zeal for the beating-out and clearing the Truths of God and the way of his Servants he darkens those Truths and layes scandals in the way whereby to grieve the Brethren and rejoyce the enemies to all Righteousnesse And then the more paines he takes the more worke he makes for repentings The Lord be a Light and Guide unto him now That his after-labour may be a labour of love and his worke a worke of Faith Then may he be patient in hope That he shall see the travell of his soule So I would bespeake him now and assure him That neither his Person nor his Graces have one graine the lesse waight in my esteeme because he is for the Presbyterian-way So are they and they the most the savour of whose Graces are now as is the savour of the sweetest oyntmeut all over the House and houshold of God for they are for That way whatever we call it which they are perswaded is the way of Christ And the Searcher of all hearts knowes my desire touching him is 1. That he for after time may give no occasion to those with-out to blaspheme or to them with-in To thinke he is against the strictnesse and purity of the way of Christ 2. And that not one drop of the Anointing he has received from the Father may run-out in vaine but that in his pursuance after peace he may maintaine the peace of the Church by all meanes Keeping the unitie of the Spirit in the bond thereof So much to bespeake him and his patience while for my friends satisfaction I give judgement of his Booke in the same order as it lieth The Epistle first It is well compact a sheet compleat and answers M●Sympson sheet for sheet Yet Mr Sympson his second Position there stands unshaken upon its Basis of Truth That for a son of the same Mother to divulge the faults of his Brethren is not brother-like but quite beside the Rule of the Word and way of Gods holy ones Mr Edwards saith no and argueth the negat tels us in what cases the Brethren have divulged the faults of their Brethren But that was not to the case in question for it was not the case between his Brethren and him As I suppose every man will see that hath read the Apoll. Narr and his Booke against it which I did read next a sheet or two and there about I brake off for there me thought I met with too common and unbecomming language agreeable to a mans own spirit which like fire cannot be but it must break forth and so disagreeing to That spirit we should breath after that I cast downe the Booke with some distaste and then fell a dipping here I dipped and there I dipped a snatch and away as they say the dogge does in Nilus and for the same Logicke a dog hath because there are serpents there such biting things Indeed I discerned quickly the frame of the Booke and the spirit of the man heated above its due proportion in such matters and that my best way was to dip and away and so I hastened to the close of the booke the last leafe wherein the good man summons This Church and That and a third and all are but one to come at his call and to doe as he bids them * Truly Sir I could smile to see how the masters of their Assemblies stirre now like a mountaine which one man very imperiously bad come unto him the mountaine moved like
37. 13. Comming It is come if the Adversaries of the Lord be at the heightest and His servants at the lowest Now we must be glad because now will I arise saith the Lord when At this present time therefore be nothing terrified encouraged rather when the enemy is raised high even to the zenith of his exaltation then be encouraged for hearken and heare Now will I arise saith the Lord Now will I be exalted now will I lift-up my Isa. 33. 10. sélfe now now now now expect That the Lord will come-in to magnifie Himselfe before Israel and before the Sun And then the Adversary falls then then then as that Adversary Senacharib did by the sword of the Lord In whose hands I cannot tell but by the sword of the Lord he shall fall and the lower his fall shall be the higher his exaltation was Amen Therefore stand fast in one spirit striving together for the Faith of the Gospell and be nothing terrified by the Adversaries but by all these providences be mightily encouraged rather in the worke and service of the Lord through the Might and Power of the Lord Who hath made-forth to His servants a sure word of promise That He will give them an expected End Imprimatur JOSEPH CARYL 2 Chro 17. 16. 〈◊〉 Cor. 8. 5. 2 Chro. 32. 31. The Epistle and purpose thereof The Booke and frame thereof Even to our interiours we owe the duty of a good language * Nullum tam grave scel●s quod non ad judicium prius quim ad poena●● venire debet Luth. Upon the Gal. 5. * Ampliandi sunt savores Secreta domus deinde timeri Levit 6. 28. Answ. a Joh. 21. b Gal. 2. 2 Cor. 12. Phil. 4 8. a ●●●n Guil. Herauld pag. ●63 See Childes Portion p. 94. Ep. 〈◊〉 Cap. 〈◊〉 Te non p●… quantum in me est cum exceptione 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. * {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} c. Chrysost in Gen. c. 18. Est is liber planè aspis Per omnia sacra breviter simplicitèr sine convitiis disputet Calv. Ep. a Desputare nō rahire Eras. Ep. Latrant non ●oquuntur Cic. Brut. p. 161. in fol. S●ridet non loquitur Cal. ep. 339. O● estor causapugnet non contumel●i● Debem●● enim charitati c. Ep. b See Childs Portion p. 84. The Supposition Odi●sta dissidiorun nomina Lu●● * Greeks and Latines all conclude That no Theame or subject is more fruitfull for it has all the matter to work-on that our nature can give forth every ordinary man can shew eloquence here but the heathen man cals it a fierce kind of Eloquence Truci eloquentiâ Balbus promptus adversus innocentes Tacit. An. li. 6. b 〈◊〉 Sam. 12. 14. Phil. 1. 10. {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} Hom. God lifteth His enemiesup that He might cast them downe the lower He casteth downe His friends that He might raise them up the higher b Exod. 18. 12. * Psal. 93. Psal. 140. {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} Multes habet pro Catholic●s Cacolycos pro Evangelicis Disa●gclos Era● Ep. Dominus omnes ref●●get in suā gloriam V●…t Christ us arcano suo consilio scenas rerum bumanarun livre. 25. ●p 20. {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} a Psal. ●5 b John 7. 17. c {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} c. Chrysost. * Ab iratis 〈◊〉 perspicuè pax petitur augetur ●odium C●● de Juvent * {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} Chrysost 〈◊〉 Act. Ap. cap. 21. Hom. 〈◊〉 co a Salv. Funestam Religionis discordiam alibi priue cepisse hic priue desiisse ●rat Epolon a Sam. ●8 15. He that has read the Book knowes the meaning o● that Si in Scripto quidquid indignum Erasmo ostenderis ostensum protinus jugulabitar Sed si quid haeretic●●Ep l. 25. ●●●m Alex. {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} N●… ho mini est hominem vincere ●ed bonum est ●●mini ut cum veri●as vincat vole●●em quid c. Aug. 〈◊〉 ●asc Ep. 171. Sacrilegis proditoribus vene ficis Lact. Lib. 5. cap. 1. Ignorantiam meam c. See Childs Portion p. 38. * Valeat E●ci●● tradu●at nos triumphos agat de parvu●●s ad id genus calu●…arum satis animi praestabit Christus c. * Mat. 7. 11. Luk. 11. 13. a Joh. 7. Isa 50. 11. h Exod. 23. 1 i Judg 19. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ●5 4. * 1 Tim. 3. 5. Jer. Tit. 〈◊〉 13. {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} * Psal. 25●… Ne deserat●● Ecclesia propt●● servitutem qu● sine impietate sustineri possi lib. 1. ep. 107. d Joh. 7. 17. Ezek. 44. So they may find more favour then did the Priests of old * Ezek. 43. Ezek. 44. 10. Job 41. 15 16 17. Phil. 2. 8. Rev. 3. 10. Pe●ra nostra non pallet ad tonitrua ●ulgura non ●etuit c. Caelum ruat fiat voluntas tua Luth. 2. vol. p. ●74 Nec 〈◊〉 hoc nec mirum st Princeps m●n●… d●…viet Quid aliud saceret Psal. 2. psal. 93. Neh. 4. 16. b Isa. 26. 4. {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman}