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A85315 Stablishing against shaking: or, A discovery of the Prince of Darknesse (scarcely) transformed into an angel of light, powerfully now working in the deluded people called, Quakers: with a sober answer to their railings against ministers for receiving maintenance from their people. Being the substance of one sermon preached Feb. 17. 1655. at Shalford in Essex. / By Giles Firmin (pastour of the church there) upon occasion of the Quakers troubling those parts. Firmin, Giles, 1614-1697. 1656 (1656) Wing F967; Thomason E885_13; ESTC R202074 45,528 65

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thing in Rev. 6.9 10 11. there is mention made of many slain for the Word of God c. these had white robes given them c these who were slain must needs fall under the X Persecutions under the heathen Emperours and may well in a speciall manner look to that horrible butchery under Dioclesian but if you know those times you will finde there were abundance of Bishops slain in those times I mean Bishops who were above Presbyters in the Church and you shall finde abundance of ceremonies humane inventions in those times in the worship of God yet we finde God doth not show such disdain of them as you doe now he gives them white robes Thus Bp Cranmer Ridley Hooper and abundance of Ministers ordained by those Bishops but suffered gloriously for the testimony which they held the Lord will own them with honour in the Day of Judgment how then you come to cast off so many Ministers of Christ so able in the worke of the Gospel as none have been more able since the Apostles dayes no nor so able so godly in their conversation to whose Ministery God hath sealed in the spirituall children he hath given them and onely because they were ordained by Bishops who yet were Ministers and did Ministeriall work doe you provide to answer for this at that day Some men will scarce own any mans Ordination but that which is by such Bishops and you will own no Ministers who are ordained by such if you two should meet who would be the strongest Parnel Gol p. 26. makes this a proof against our Ministery that it is earthly because in thus many years we have wrought no better reformation 1. But Parnel the English Ministery through grace will show the greatest reformation in the world and yet none in the world opposed like it We can show the souls who confesse by us the Lord inlightened them turned them and hath built them up 2. Then Isaiahs and Ieremiahs with other of the Prophets Ministery was earthly for I am sure they wrought but little reformation 3. What was Christs Ministery earthly also he complains Isa 49.4 that he had laboured in vain 4. What you will have many called and many chosen Christ saith the contrary Conclusion To conclude I dare affirm that there is as true and as able a Ministery in England this day as ever was since the Apostles died and if any Quakers or Separatists will undertake to prove the contrary so they will argue and not babble they shall soon finde those who will answer them While therefore you cast filth upon these I plead not for every particular Minister and upon all the Churches you show your light to be of Satan c. Argum 11 Major That Light which brags of the infallible spirit and yet cannot speak good sense or reason that Light and Spirit must come from Satan not from Christ Minor But such is the Quakers light and infallible Spirit Ergo. Major The Spirit of Christ is a Spirit of wisdome but he that speaketh irrationally nonsense he doth not speak wisely the Spirit of God is a most rationall Spirit and where it speaks it speaks like it self Acts 6.10 They were not able to resist the wisdome and the Spirit by which Stephen spake Thus Paul Apollos c. they spake rationally carried such strength that none could answer them Ministers must be men able to convince 1 Tit. 9. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 those that talk irrationally will never 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 I know Satan can speak rationally sense also which makes us wonder what he means to take such instruments unlesse it be because he is at the last seeing witty Jesuits cannot doe the businesse now try if foolish Quakers can doe it this also I know that reason being a beam of God there can be no true reason for sin or errour Also though abundance of Gods people are weak and shallow yet they never speak truth but they speak sense and reason But here we have a pack mightily insulting over the Ministers because they doe not assume to themselves the infallible Spirit in that notion which the Quakers boast they have it and yet cannot speak rationally Let us hear a little Qua gl● of God p 3 4. there they undertake to answer the arguments the Apostle brings 1 Cor. 9.9 10 11 c. to prove the maintenance of Ministers They that preach on the Gospel must live upon the Gospel This scripture shames you and shews your Gospel will not maintain you but you seek to Magistrat s●● and the Ministers of the Gospel are ashamed of such a pack of teachers This is his answer so He that thresheth thresheth in hope Oh how have they threshed in hope all this while and got forth no corne but are faine to seeke to the Magistrates for me●nes and food So Thou shalt not muzzle the month of the Oxe Oh you shamelesse teachers your mouthes must be muzled have been treading all this while and no corne trodden out to feed you but are faine to seek to the Magistrates Doe not these men speak gallantly Is not here evidence of the infallible Spirit But if these Quakers would have spoken like men thus ye should have said True those who preach the Gospel those who thresh those who tread out c. that is those who doe perform the work of the Lords Ministers in teaching Iabouring faithfully they may challenge maintenance by these Scriptures But you doe not thresh labour c. in the Lords work Therefore you cannot claim maintenance from these Seriptures now you had spoken rationally and there had been matter of shame indeed that we should have called for corn and not wrought but now you have cast all the shame upon the people that we preaching labouring threshing c. are denied our corn our maintenance and are forced to goe to the Magistrates our nursing fathers Isa 49 v. 23. for it Like a man who hath been plowing and threshing halfe a yeare for another when he comes to demand his wages he is denied the man goeth to the Magistrate to be helped the Quakers cry out Oh thou shamelesse man hast thou been plowing and threshing so long and now art fain to goe to the Magistrate c. Doth the man deserve shame or he who deny him his due So here Thus Priests Igno p. 2. The teachers of the world sprinkle Infants telling people its an Ordinance of God which is contrary to the Scriptures and quotes in his margent Gal. 3.1 Luc. 1.26.36 Let any one reade those Scriptures and see how they oppose it he quotes no other Scriptures In the next The teachers of the world call people unto a Sacrament for the which there is no Scripture here they act contrary to the Scriptures quoting Gen. 29.28 the words are these and Iacob did so and fulfilled her weeke and he gave him Rachel his daughter to wife also and Gen. 10. but no verse These are all the Scriptures Here
answer fully applying what he faith to the Objection thus So we the Quakers having the infallible spirit which gave these commands d●e by the same seeing you abuse them without scripture take them away Now your answer is complete But First I say those carnall things as you call them are so spirituall that all the perfection the Quakers brag of will not be sufficient to perform one of them in the holy manner the letter as you call the Word requires Secondly You talke of the Infallible spirit but you have not given us the signes of it as Paul did 2 Cor. 12.12 nay the Satanicall spirit by which you are acted hath not given you so much wit to ca●ry your selves cunningly but you doe so manifestly crosse Christ and the Apostles that people must throw away their Bibles and naturall Light before they can believe you Thirdly You mistake in the brazen Serpent for it was not ordained as a means of worship in the Church but onely for the time while Serpents stung them in the Wildernesse they were to look to it typifying Christ but when they were past Serpents in Canaan there was no use of it yet Hezekiah wanted no meanes whereby he might certainly know the minde of God Fourthly The worship then instituted was not taken away because abused but because the Ceremoniall part was fulfilled Fiftly Jesus Christ the Lord of the Church may institute what means of worship he pleaseth his Apostles did converse with him fourty dayes after his resurrection Acts 1.3 speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdome of God They had order what to doe but I hardly think the Quakers were there then with him and heard that doctrine they teach us Sixtly Then the Spirit of God teach us to deny God that which he hath had since the world began viz Externall worship for prayer sacrifices and the teaching of the family by the Father of the family these parts of worship we finde at the beginning after that more But now God must have none at all how shall we know there is a God in the world if we take away his worship Seventhly Christ must then be a great destroyer of the Law and not a fulfiller Mat. 5.17 for he must quite blot out the second Commandment as the fourth and fifth by these Quakers Eighthly The right performing of the worship of God will cost pains and exercise of graces but the spirit in the Quakers have taken them off from that burden Conclusion Since then the Quakers Light destroy the Ordinances of Christ hence I conclude their Light is the light of Satan not of Christ Argum 7 Major That Light denyeth a great work of Christ in the hearts of them who believe in him that is the light of Satan not of Christ Minor But so doe the Quakers light Ergo. The Major is so clear that it needs no proof for to deny a a saving work a great part of his redemption this cannot come from Christ Minor But the Quakers light denyeth a great worke of Christ in the hearts of them who believe I mean such a work as must necessarily be in all such that is a worke of inherent holinesse the new creature distinct from Christ's person and from his imputed righteousnesse to our Justification The Quakers in these Books I have have spoken confusedly and covertly yet this must be their doctrine or some other notion being Christed with Christ Godded with God which I verily think they ayme at Naylor Saluta p. 20. hath these words But say you this is that righteousnesse we believe in and by which we are justified by that blood which was shed at Jerusalem and by that obedience that was in him and by that holinesse but that the want of his righteousnesse in us or that want of Christ or his blood in us can hinder our Justification that we deny and look upon it as heresie it is Christ without us that hath satisfied for sinne his righteousnesse faith patience love obedience c. it s these without us that whoever believes in shall be saved and by this faith the ungodly is justified Pag. 23. We can doe nothing neither doe we desire to doe any thing yet can we doe all things that he wills through him that is in us Pag. 2. While you live sinne lives and if we say we have no sinne we deceive our selves this is well but where he alone lives there is no sinne c. I deny not but we are justified by the righteousnesse satisfaction of Christ without us as opposed to Inherency in us But I utterly deny that God ever imputes that righteousnesse to us but withall he works inherent righteousnesse in us so as no man can be in a state of Justification or shall ever see God who hath not this inherent work of holinesse in him Heb. 12.14 I deny also that a person whom the Lord actually justifieth is an ungodly person in that instant its true he is ungodly if you compare him with the Covenant of works he is a transgressor of it which is the scope of the Apostle in the Rom. 3.4 Rom. 3.4 To cut all men off from seeking life in that Covenant and to bring them to the righteousnesse of Christ but look on him in reference to the Covenant of grace he is now a believer or else he cannot be justified and such a believer as hath received Christ to Union and now trusts to Christ for Communion of benefits whereof justification is one He that prates of his justification before this Faith he doth but prate of that which he shall never finde That absurd notion of faith justifying onely Declarative I would have opposed had this place been convenient I affirme also that the work of inherent holinesse which maketh us new Creatures is a distinct thing from Christ his person though among our New-England notions this was received when the errours raged there that Christ was the new Creature but for the 2 Cor. 5.17 they made miserable Grammar of the verse undertaking to be the Interpreters of the Originall read it thus if any man be in Christ the new Creature and thus indeed Christ being perfect no wonder though the Quakers are perfect for there is nothing in them but Christ And thus we see the meaning of that which we have so wondered at that men and women who could not tell how to live honestly among men keep promises keep from pilfering deale justly no nor can scarce doe it at this day since these Quakers came are on a sudden mounted aloft and tell others they are perfect No wonder for if Christ be the new Creature the new Creature then cannot grow for Christ cannot be more perfect then he is I affirme also that those who desine to doe nothing as saith Naylor they are not in Christ if we speak of adulti Rom. 7.21 and their wills are renewed I know not what to make of that phrase While you live sin live to take it
of this life c. But how then shall he live I shall adde no more God hath provided for us expressly in the New Testament though the maintenance we have fall short abundantly of what the Priests had in the Old Test 5. The LORD did never upbraid any Church-Officer for taking tithes or maintenance who did his worke nor ever thought the worse of for that nay how often he blames the people for not bringing in the tithes Mal. 3.8 9 10. and other Texts The Lord did ever beteame his Ministers honourable wages Whence you doe but wickedly to upbraid us with those Texts unlesse you could prove us to be no workers I doubt not but Christ in glory doth take himself to be faithfully preached by the Ministers of England I will not say every one why then not maintained 6. But observe these Quakers how they provide for themselves by Scripture Naylor Saluta c. p. 37. 38. he speaks against the Magistrates because they imprison some of their Sect calling themselves Pilgrims and tells them that God foreseeing their doings hath commanded all that own him to entertain strangers and made a Law for it which you have made a Law against and quotes Levit. 19.34 Heb. 13.2 Observe how they have provided for themselves when they wander up and down to mislead souls and trouble the Churches yet you must entertain them they have two Scriptures for it But Naylor 1. Doe the Spirit that is infallible teach men to lye as you doe against the Magistrate hath he made a Law against Gods Law in this point no true stranger will say it but idle persons Vagabonds Rogues persons who worke not in their callings what should become of the Nation else 2. Will two Texts serve to prove that Naylor or others when they wander up and down yet they must be entertained men must provide you lodging food c. and will not five Scriptures that speak for Ministers maintenance be as strong for them to require it are not the people bound as well to provide for us as men to entertain you you are the persons who oppose Gods Law not the Magistrate For shame leave off quoting of Scriptures thus 3. But Naylor you might have read a little further to the 7 17 ver there you shall finde that these Hebrews to whom the Apostle writes had Rulers over them and they were to obey them their duty to entertain strangers so to have Rulers and obey them but your Sect and so others with you are not such as those Hebrews from whom you fetch your proof for you rail at those who are such and at the people who have such Thus then by the Quakers principles I hope we may yet call for our maintenance 7. Our Lord Christ who Mat. 10.8 bid his Disciples that as they had received freely so give freely that is as Christ had freely given them those gifts of healing c. by which they might have soon been very rich the 1 8 ver show what they had received yet Luke 10.7 he bids them eat and drinke for the labourer is worthy of his hire If they must carry no purse with them ver 4. he intended they should be maintained and shew plainly it was their duty to maintain them for he could have furnished them with money but would not For Paul Magd. ●en● 1. l. 2. p. 451. it plainly appears by Acts 18.3 that though he were brought up to Learning which at that time was so famous in Tarsus that it excelled Athens Alexandria and other Universities and so Paul was learned acquainted also with heathen Poets as appears yet withall he was also taught a Trade he was of the same craft with Aquila he did not learne it of Aquila then but before he came Paul had his trade for Paul being of the Tribe of Benjamin though he were learned yet he could not come into the Priesthood and so had none of the Tythes to maintain him he must maintain himself So those Elders of Ephesus Act. 20. and other Elders they all had their trades by which they maintained themselves before ever they heard of the Gospel then no wonder though Paul and those Elders did sometimes work Paul being a single person might easily maintain himself 2. Paul having the Spirit in that manner need not trouble himself to attain any thing needfull to his work and I doubt not the ordinary Elders at that time yet had another manner of assistance than we have now for to have them men so able to teach and convince gainsayers Tit. 1. these gifts could not be reached so quickly but though they did labour and study for them yet the Spirit might assist more than now he doth for the speedy fitting of persons 3. It was a free act in Paul that he for this time upon some reason moving him did suspend his power 1 Cor. 9.12 if he were absolutely bound to it why not others also v 6. So if any now who have means sufficient for themselves and their posterity will preach freely they may but neverthelesse there remains a duty on the peoples part to maintain them as such that preach the Gospel v. 14. though they be otherwayes able to live Neither hath the Scripture given any such caution that if Ministers have good estates of their own then the people should not give them the double honour Though the Priests were never so rich yet that did not hinder them from taking Tythes Though Kings have great Lands yet the people pay Customes So in any other Art or place whatever men are in for the reason holds The labourer is worthy c. But what are these things to us when first our fitnesse to this work is not so easily attained those Languages wherein the Scriptures were writ which cost us much time to attain to as without which no man can be a good Text-man they never bestowed any paines about The customes to which the Apostles allude often they knew them because their own but we cannot till we read and know them by Learning The Errors which Ministers are to oppose are abundantly multiplyed over they were in the Apostles time thus I might speak for the necessity of Arts without which men cannot be sufficient Ministers all things put together prove that he who will be a Minister had need give his whole time let him study and pray as bard as he will let him live a hundred years in his strength yet he that will be a Minister indeed will say he finds all little enough if it were no more to be a Minister but to step off a shop-board and get into a Pulpit and speak some honest practicall things which people have heard from others and know something it may be from their own experience then it were easie work indeed and well might the people grumble at the maintenance of such Hence we see Paul in his Epistle to Timothy who was not bred up as others he must give himselfe