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A27046 A third defence of the cause of peace proving 1. the need of our concord, 2. the impossibility of it, on the terms of the present impositions against the accusations and storms of, viz., Mr. John Hinckley, a nameless impleader, a nameless reflector, or Speculum, &c., Mr. John Cheny's second accusation, Mr. Roger L'Strange, justice, &c., the Dialogue between the Pope and a fanatic, J. Varney's phanatic Prophesie / by Richard Baxter. Baxter, Richard, 1615-1691. 1681 (1681) Wing B1419; ESTC R647 161,764 297

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be_v one_o that_o will_v not_o persecute_v and_o undo_v such_o puritan_n we_o have_v divers_a such_o presbyterian_a bishop_n usher_z bedle_n downam_n davenant_n hall_n etc._n etc._n and_o before_o they_o grindal_n abbot_n and_o the_o most_o of_o our_o bishop_n for_o queen_n elizabeth_n reign_n again_o i_o confess_v that_o it_o be_v some_o such_o presbyterian_o as_o these_o that_o raise_v the_o parliament_n army_n in_o england_n the_o two_o next_o section_n evince_v your_o error_n and_o calumny_n you_o pass_v by_o §_o 22._o be_v of_o no_o further_a use_n to_o we_o only_o about_o dr._n jo._n reignolds_n you_o be_v a_o most_o deceive_v and_o deceive_a historian_n 1._o you_o do_v not_o know_v etc._n etc._n but_o you_o may_v have_v know_v that_o there_o be_v extant_a in_o print_n his_o letter_n to_o sir_n francis_n knowles_n against_o prelacy_n for_o a_o mere_a moderatorship_n or_o presidency_n 2._o you_o say_v do_v he_o not_o live_v and_o die_v in_o full_a conformity_n with_o the_o church_n of_o england_n answ_n a_o know_a falsehood_n if_o a_o question_n may_v be_v false_a what_o matter_n of_o fact_n shall_v ever_o come_v to_o posterity_n by_o such_o hand_n without_o falsification_n if_o cartwright_n and_o reignolds_n the_o lead_v nonconformist_n of_o england_n be_v conformist_n sir_n i_o and_o hundred_o more_o have_v offer_v long_o to_o conform_v as_o far_o to_o the_o utmost_a as_o either_o of_o these_o do_v and_o yet_o we_o be_v unworthy_a to_o preach_v the_o the_o gospel_n of_o christ_n for_o want_n of_o conformity_n it_o may_v be_v leave_v it_o prove_v they_o to_o be_v presbyterian_o that_o will_v not_o prosecute_v we_o learn_v better_o whether_o ever_o dr._n reignolds_n do_v subscribe_v to_o the_o liturgy_n and_o ceremony_n whether_o ever_o he_o take_v the_o oath_n of_o canonical_a obedience_n or_o be_v not_o against_o the_o present_a prelacy_n whether_o he_o be_v for_o the_o cross_n in_o baptism_n etc._n etc._n but_o you_o very_o think_v that_o be_v he_o 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of_o they_o both_o i_o take_v the_o kitchen_n and_o coal-house_n to_o be_v part_n of_o the_o house_n and_o i_o have_v sometime_o business_n in_o they_o both_o but_o i_o be_o most_o in_o my_o study_n and_o chamber_n and_o i_o will_v take_v both_o chamber_n and_o colehouse_n for_o schismtick_n if_o ever_o i_o hear_v either_o of_o they_o say_v i_o be_o all_o the_o house_n or_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o be_v in_o no_o other_o room_n lord_n pull_v up_o the_o separate_n schismatical_a thorn-hedge_n which_o have_v curse_o divide_v thy_o family_n and_o flock_n chap._n ii_o the_o impleader_n truth_n examine_v §_o 1._o christ_n say_v that_o the_o devil_n be_v the_o father_n of_o lie_n and_o doubtless_o he_o have_v subtlety_n to_o excuse_v they_o and_o improve_v they_o and_o it_o be_v a_o great_a advantage_n to_o they_o that_o they_o be_v so_o disow_v by_o humane_a nature_n that_o it_o be_v take_v for_o a_o injury_n to_o humanity_n to_o charge_v any_o man_n to_o be_v a_o liar_n and_o a_o ruffian_n will_v say_v it_o deserve_v a_o challenge_n or_o a_o stab_n you_o will_v think_v it_o a_o paradox_n that_o natural_a dislike_n shall_v be_v turn_v to_o the_o advantage_n of_o a_o sin_n but_o it_o be_v but_o natural_a light_a convince_a the_o understanding_n not_o change_v or_o fortify_v the_o will_n against_o it_o and_o therefore_o it_o be_v but_o pride_n of_o reputation_n and_o impenitency_n that_o be_v indeed_o the_o fortress_n of_o the_o sin_n §_o 2._o according_o it_o have_v many_o time_n be_v my_o hard_a hap_n to_o have_v such_o book_n write_v against_o i_o and_o that_o by_o man_n who_o reputation_n be_v not_o undervalue_v by_o themselves_o or_o their_o follower_n as_o be_v to_o be_v answer_v chief_o by_o a_o mentiris_fw-la from_o end_n to_o end_n if_o it_o will_v not_o seem_v by_o custom_n to_o be_v uncivil_a and_o to_o tire_v the_o reader_n by_o turn_v a_o mintiris_n into_o a_o civil_a long_a parenthesis_n and_o this_o as_o frequent_o as_o gross_a falsehood_n be_v open_o say_v or_o intimate_v be_v tedious_a even_o when_o necessary_a with_o one_o i_o be_v put_v to_o use_v my_o arithmetic_n and_o to_o answer_v he_o by_o number_v the_o untruth_n assert_v but_o i_o have_v forbear_v it_o with_o other_o far_a more_o guilty_a lest_o their_o reverence_n and_o power_n shall_v make_v truth_n intolerable_a who_o passion_n or_o interest_n or_o error_n have_v make_v gross_a lie_n seem_v true_a and_o necessary_a §_o 3._o this_o impleader_n have_v be_v teach_v too_o much_o by_o the_o same_o master_n and_o have_v he_o not_o spend_v part_n of_o his_o book_n on_o doctrinal_n where_o his_o errata_fw-la be_v but_o mendae_fw-la but_o be_v all_o historical_a where_o there_o be_v too_o many_o mendacia_fw-la i_o may_v have_v be_v put_v to_o the_o way_n of_o answer_v beforementioned_a but_o be_v they_o mendae_fw-la or_o mendacia_fw-la they_o need_v aniendment_n and_o the_o reader_n may_v need_v a_o antidote_n against_o they_o §_o 4._o some_o beginning_n we_o have_v on_o the_o title-page_n pretend_v to_o show_v the_o reason_n of_o the_o sinfulness_n of_o conformity_n mend._n 1._o i_o pretend_v in_o my_o plea_n to_o show_v but_o the_o matter_n of_o nonconformity_n and_o historical_a narrative_n of_o our_o judgement_n and_o matter_n of_o fact_n pass_v by_o the_o reason_n or_o argument_n that_o must_v prove_v the_o thing_n unlawful_a though_o reason_n may_v be_v gather_v by_o the_o reader_n from_o the_o matter_n or_o history_n itself_o §_o 5._o the_o same_o be_v repeat_v p._n 1._o he_o pretend_v to_o give_v reason_n for_o the_o sinfulness_n of_o conformity_n m._n 2._o and_o he_o overpass_v the_o chief_a part_n of_o my_o book_n in_o which_o i_o state_n the_o case_n of_o government_n and_o separation_n on_o pretence_n that_o it_o be_v a_o dark_n and_o dirty_a way_n in_o which_o i_o have_v lose_v myself_o m._n 3._o and_o a_o little_a will_v satisfy_v he_o that_o regard_v such_o a_o easy_a dark_a and_o dirty_a answer_n §_o 6._o he_o guess_v that_o kneel_v at_o the_o sacrament_n for_o that_o be_v then_o discourse_v of_o be_v one_o and_o the_o chief_a of_o those_o many_o heinous_a sin_n of_o conformity_n mend._n 4._o it_o seem_v the_o man_n be_v present_a reader_n look_v to_o thy_o belief_n when_o thou_o be_v among_o such_o man_n 1._o there_o be_v not_o a_o word_n speak_v then_o against_o the_o lawfulness_n of_o kneel_v at_o the_o sacrament_n 2._o i_o open_o declare_v that_o i_o hold_v it_o lawful_a and_o none_o of_o my_o brethren_n contradict_v 3._o the_o thing_n which_o we_o prove_v unlawful_a then_o be_v cast_v those_o faithful_a christian_n out_o of_o the_o church-communion_n in_o that_o sacrament_n who_o dare_v not_o take_v it_o kneel_v for_o the_o reason_n which_o cause_v they_o to_o think_v it_o sinful_a §_o 7._o impl._n he_o will_v not_o urge_v the_o case_n but_o bare_o mention_v matter_n of_o fact_n 〈…〉_z much_o
that_o they_o be_v ruin_v if_o we_o be_v but_o suffer_v to_o preach_v christ_n gospel_n and_o to_o live_v out_o of_o a_o jail_n and_o think_v that_o if_o we_o offer_v to_o refel_v the_o slander_n that_o render_v we_o odious_a to_o they_o and_o do_v but_o speak_v for_o our_o ministry_n and_o liberty_n as_o every_o malefactor_n be_v allow_v by_o the_o judge_n to_o speak_v for_o himself_o we_o seek_v the_o ruin_n of_o our_o clergy-accuser_n do_v not_o heathen_n abhor_v such_o injustice_n as_o this_o my_o purse_n be_v less_o to_o i_o than_o my_o ministry_n and_o all_o that_o any_o man_n can_v take_v from_o i_o will_v be_v much_o less_o than_o forty_o pound_n a_o sermon_n and_o yet_o if_o any_o man_n on_o the_o highway_n or_o in_o my_o house_n shall_v not_o only_o take_v away_o all_o that_o i_o have_v but_o afterward_o prefer_v a_o bill_n against_o i_o as_o seek_v their_o ruin_n because_o by_o reason_n i_o entreat_v they_o to_o forbear_v and_o that_o in_o vain_a it_o will_v be_v one_o of_o the_o odd_a case_n that_o have_v come_v into_o westminster-hall_n i_o be_v once_o neighbour_n to_o a_o valiant_a knight_n who_o yet_o be_v so_o gentle_a that_o when_o the_o hooker_n in_o a_o moonshine-night_n be_v hook_v his_o clothes_n and_o good_n through_o the_o window_n and_o he_o lie_v in_o bed_n and_o see_v they_o he_o lay_v still_o and_o mild_o tell_v they_o gentlemen_z this_o be_v not_o well_o do_v these_o thing_n be_v not_o you_o if_o you_o be_v take_v you_o may_v be_v hang_v for_o it_o and_o by_o that_o time_n his_o sermon_n to_o they_o be_v do_v they_o have_v get_v what_o they_o come_v for_o and_o be_v go_v but_o i_o never_o hear_v that_o they_o enter_v a_o suit_n against_o he_o for_o seek_v to_o ruin_v their_o trade_n by_o his_o reprehension_n but_o if_o any_o of_o you_o have_v such_o a_o trade_n as_o will_v not_o endure_v the_o plea_n of_o innocent_a sufferer_n for_o peace_n or_o mercy_n without_o your_o ruin_n i_o will_v some_o one_o that_o you_o have_v more_o regard_n for_o will_v persuade_v you_o quick_o to_o lay_v by_o that_o trade_n lest_o when_o christ_n be_v judge_n and_o say_v inasmuch_o as_o you_o do_v it_o to_o one_o of_o the_o least_o of_o these_o you_o do_v it_o to_o i_o your_o clergy_n will_v not_o save_v you_o from_o his_o sentence_n be_v it_o but_o the_o devour_a of_o widow_n house_n it_o be_v not_o the_o long_a liturgy_n that_o will_v excuse_v you_o by_o a_o legit_fw-la nor_o will_v you_o escape_v with_o burn_v in_o the_o hand_n unless_o repentance_n now_o prevent_v it_o the_o evil_a servant_n that_o stuff_v his_o gut_n and_o beat_v his_o fellow_n presume_v on_o his_o lord_n delay_v you_o know_v be_v threaten_v with_o a_o sharp_a penalty_n §_o 11._o impl._n p._n 4._o no_o person_n of_o any_o note_n that_o i_o have_v hear_v of_o in_o all_o that_o party_n who_o be_v in_o place_n of_o trust_n and_o public_a employment_n do_v on_o the_o late_a test_n refuse_v to_o communicate_v with_o the_o church_n of_o england_n answ_n 1._o how_o far_o do_v your_o hear_n reach_v 2._o how_o many_o of_o that_o party_n have_v you_o know_v in_o such_o place_n of_o trust_n i_o suppose_v you_o know_v when_o the_o test_n in_o the_o corporation-act_n be_v impose_v that_o party_n be_v then_o turn_v out_o of_o all_o corporation-power_n in_o some_o place_n not_o two_o of_o the_o old_a stay_v in_o and_o be_v it_o any_o wonder_n then_o if_o none_o of_o that_o party_n be_v in_o such_o power_n 3._o and_o be_v communicate_v in_o the_o lord_n supper_n all_o the_o conformity_n that_o be_v scruple_v and_o what_o be_v all_o this_o to_o our_o controversy_n §_o 12._o impl._n when_o all_o our_o unite_a strength_n be_v too_o little_a to_o withstand_v the_o attempt_n of_o our_o common_a adversary_n it_o be_v a_o wonder_n to_o i_o with_o what_o confidence_n and_o what_o design_n he_o shall_v not_o only_o proclaim_v conformity_n on_o the_o minister_n part_v to_o be_v impossible_a but_o endeavour_v also_o with_o all_o his_o might_n to_o withdraw_v the_o laity_n from_o our_o communion_n m._n 14._o answ_n 1._o be_v it_o a_o truth_n that_o one_o that_o hold_v communion_n with_o your_o church_n and_o speak_v and_o write_v for_o it_o and_o dissuade_v none_o from_o it_o do_v endeavour_n with_o all_o his_o might_n to_o withdraw_v the_o laity_n from_o it_o can_v you_o not_o forbear_v this_o ill_a custom_n a_o few_o line_n together_o 2._o exit_fw-la ore_fw-la tuo_fw-la see_v reader_n the_o man_n confess_v the_o need_n of_o our_o unite_a strength_n hold_v he_o to_o that_o word_n and_o i_o repeat_v if_o he_o and_o the_o rest_n of_o that_o tribe_n do_v believe_v that_o it_o be_v moral_o possible_a that_o the_o two_o thousand_o silence_v minister_n and_o all_o that_o come_v after_o they_o shall_v believe_v all_o the_o thing_n which_o i_o name_v in_o my_o plea_n for_o peace_n and_o all_o the_o rest_n which_o many_o scruple_n be_v lawful_a for_o they_o to_o do_v i_o wonder_v not_o at_o any_o confusion_n calamity_n or_o corruption_n that_o shall_v befall_v a_o church_n that_o be_v conduct_v by_o such_o man_n who_o will_v have_v think_v that_o there_o have_v be_v such_o man_n among_o christian_n and_o pastor_n of_o a_o reform_a church_n but_o i_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o there_o be_v many_o such_o that_o think_v it_o moral_o possible_a that_o we_o shall_v all_o believe_v all_o conformity_n lawful_a they_o will_v never_o else_o have_v trust_v so_o much_o to_o mulct_n and_o jail_n as_o to_o think_v their_o church_n undo_v without_o those_o help_n they_o be_v not_o such_o stranger_n to_o sense_n and_o conscience_n it_o be_v the_o wear_n out_o of_o the_o present_a generation_n of_o nonconformist_n and_o allure_a or_o affright_v youth_n from_o follow_v they_o which_o the_o man_n of_o any_o brain_n have_v trust_v to_o judge_n by_o these_o evidence_n of_o this_o man_n wit_n and_o wonder_v 1._o by_o the_o great_a number_n of_o the_o thing_n which_o we_o judge_v sinful_a they_o may_v dispute_v man_n into_o their_o opinion_n in_o some_o few_o difference_n that_o can_v in_o so_o many_o 2._o the_o sin_n fear_v be_v so_o heinous_a as_o that_o conscience_n will_v not_o quick_o universal_o swallow_v they_o 3._o the_o number_n of_o the_o dissenter_n to_o dispute_v a_o few_o man_n out_o of_o their_o judgement_n in_o difficult_a case_n prove_v hard_a much_o more_o many_o hundred_o or_o thousand_o 4._o consider_v the_o quality_n of_o the_o silence_a minister_n can_v they_o think_v that_o such_o man_n as_o anthony_n burges_n sam._n hildersham_n mr._n hughes_n dr._n manton_n dr._n seaman_n etc._n etc._n do_v not_o consider_v what_o they_o do_v neither_o in_o their_o health_n nor_o before_o their_o death_n do_v they_o never_o read_v or_o hear_v what_o may_v be_v say_v for_o the_o new-conformity_n have_v they_o not_o learning_n or_o wit_n enough_o to_o understand_v it_o or_o have_v they_o no_o conscience_n live_v or_o die_v so_o many_o hundred_o that_o after_o their_o best_a inquiry_n and_o hear_v all_o remain_z nonconformist_n be_v unlike_a to_o be_v all_o bring_v to_o conform_v 5._o judge_n by_o old_a experience_n be_v old_a hildersham_n ames_n dod_n and_o hundred_o like_o they_o bring_v to_o conformity_n heretofore_o mr._n sprint_v dr._n burges_n and_o some_o other_o be_v but_o more_o be_v not_o do_v not_o even_o the_o westminster-assemble_o of_o old_a conformist_n forsake_v it_o assoon_o as_o they_o can_v 6._o judge_n by_o the_o change_n of_o the_o case_n and_o the_o write_n even_o of_o the_o old_a conformist_n such_o thing_n be_v put_v into_o the_o new-conformity_n as_o bilson_n hooker_n ʋsher_n and_o other_o old_a conformist_n have_v write_v against_o and_o will_v they_o also_o repent_v and_o change_v their_o mind_n if_o they_o be_v alive_a i_o again_o profess_v that_o i_o be_o bind_v in_o charity_n and_o reason_n full_o to_o conclude_v that_o have_v usher_n bilson_n hooker_n jewel_n preston_n sibbes_n whately_n bolton_n and_o all_o such_o yea_o dr._n jo._n burges_n sprint_v and_o such_o other_o of_o their_o mind_n that_o write_v for_o the_o old_a conformity_n be_v alive_a they_o will_v all_o have_v be_v nonconformist_n to_o our_o new_a imposition_n 7._o judge_n by_o the_o mean_n that_o be_v use_v to_o convince_v we_o be_v there_o any_o thing_n say_v that_o have_v such_o cogent_a evidence_n as_o to_o convert_v so_o many_o hundred_o man_n to_o your_o opinion_n do_v such_o man_n as_o dr._n twisse_n mr._n herle_n mr._n gataker_n mr._n vine_n etc._n etc._n want_v the_o instruction_n of_o our_o present_a lord_n to_o make_v they_o wise_a enough_o to_o conform_v when_o i_o know_v none_o of_o the_o conformist_n write_n that_o have_v so_o much_o as_o name_v some_o of_o the_o thing_n that_o we_o think_v worst_a of_o 8._o judge_n by_o present_a