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lord_n	earl_n	john_n	walter_n	10,439	5	10.9501	5	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A75552	The arguments upon the writ of habeas corpus, in the Court of Kings Bench. Wherein, are learnedly discussed, not onely the severall branches of the said writ, but also many authorities as well of the common as statute law: and divers ancient and obscure records most amply and elaborately debated and cleared. Together, with the opinion of the court thereupon. Whereunto is annexed, the petition of Sir Iohn Elliot Knight, in behalf of the liberty of the subject.	Eliot, John, Sir, 1592-1632.; England and Wales. Court of King's Bench.	1649 (1649)	Wing A3649; Thomason E543_1; ESTC R204808	64,168	98

Lord I say that if it had all been left out and he had onely said Detentus fuit per speciale mandatum domini Regis it had been sufficient but when he doth more it is superfluous and not necessary for it appeared before by whom he was committed and when he returns the Warrant of the Lords of the Councell it is not their words that commit him but they being the Representative Body of the King they doe expresse what the Kings command is but they signifie nothing of their own and therefore I desire your Lordship to deliver your opinion in that point of the Return whether it be positive or no. This cause as it greatly concerns the Subjects so it much concerns the King too I am sorry there should be any occasion to bring these things in question but since it is now here I hope I shall give satisfaction to your Lordship and to the parties too and I desire that I may have Munday for it Hide Chief Justice I think it is not best for us to declare our opinions by peece-meals but upon all the case together and as well as you are a stranger to the Return so are we and there be many presidents and Acts of Parliament not printed which we must see Doderidge This is the greatest cause that ever I know in this Court our Judgements that we give between party and party between the King and the meanest Subject ought to be maturely advised on for so are the entries of our judgements Quod matura deliberatione habita It was judged c. And we must see the presidents and Acts of Parliament that we hear mentioned Justice Jones Master Atturney if it be so that the Law of Magna Charta and other Statutes be now in force and the gentlemen be not delivered by this Court how shall they be delivered apply your self to shew us any other way to deliver them Doderidge Yea or else they shall have a perpetuall imprisonment Per Curiam Munday was appointed for the Atturneys Argument and in the interim the Councell for the gentlemen were by order appointed for to attend the Judges with all the presidents and unprinted Statutes which they mentioned and that they should let the Atturney see them also And the gentlemen being asked if they desired to come again answered they did and a Rule was entred for it On Munday the 27 of Tertio Michaelis 3º Caroli Regis in Banco Regis Sir John Corbet Sir Walter Earle Sir Edmund Hampden and Sir John Henningham Knights were brought to the Barre Heath Atturney Generall MAY it please your Lordship these gentlemen Sir Walter Earle Sir John Corbet Sir Edmund Hampden and Sir John Henningham upon their motion to this Court to have their Habeas Corpus and that themselves and the cause of their detaining them in their severall Prisons might be brought before your Lordship had it granted to them My Lord at the first motion of it the knowledge thereof of comming and that they had such a desire his Majesty was very willing to grant unto them as to all his Subjects this common case of Justice and though it be a case which concerns himself in a high degree yet he hath been so gracious and so just as not to refuse to leave the examination and determination thereof to the Laws of this Kingdome My Lord it is very true that this is a very great Cause and hath raised a great expectation and for the manner of it more then was necessary but my Lord I am afraid these gentlemen whom it concerns have rather advised their Councell then their Councell them but I shall take the case as now I finde it and as the gentlemens Councell on the other side have led me the way to it My Lord the exceptions that have been taken by the Councell on the other side to the Return made by the Warden of the Fleet and the rest of the Guardians of severall Prisons have been two for renewing of your Lordships memory we will read one of the Returns they are all alike Then the Return was read for Sir John Henningham by Master Keeling Heath Atturney May it please your Lordship against this Return the Councell of the Gentlemen have taken some exceptions and have divided their objections into two main points The one the form the other the matter To the form they have objected four severall things First that the Return is not positive but referred to the signification made by another as the Lords of the Councell Secondly that the Keepers of the Prisons have not returned the cause of the commitment but the cause of the cause which is not good Thirdly that the Return is imperfect for that it shews onely the cause of the detaining in Prison and not the cause of the first commitment And lastly that the Return is contradictory in it self for that in the first part thereof there is a certification that the detaining of these gentlemen in prison is Per speciale mandatum domini Regis and when the Warrant of the Lords of the Councell is shewed it appears that the commitment is by the command of the King signified by the Lords of the Councell and by your Lordships favour I will give a severall answer to every of these severall objections And for the first that the Return is not positive and affirmative but depends upon and hath relation to some other and therefore it is not good I doe agree that the ground is true that if the Return be not positive it is not good we differ onely in the Minor That the Return is not positive and affirmative for I agree that these Book cases that have been put are good Law as 27 Ass pl. 65. that if the Sheriffe return that he hath sent to the Bailiffe of the hundred and he gives him that answer that is no good Return for the Sheriffs ought to make the Return as of his own act without naming of the Bailiffe of the Hundred in his Return for if he return Quod mandavi Ballivo itineranti qui habet Retorn omnium Brevium executionem eorund per Cartam domini Regis qui mihi dedit nullum Responsum this is not good if he were not Bailiffe of a Franchise or Signiory for so is 21 H. 7. fol. 4. There hath been cited to maintain these objections 20 Ed. 3. the Record I have perused and there I finde that the Bishop said that it is found in Archivis in the Record c. that he was excommunicated but it was found to be in Archivis c. and that is no positive return that it is so I will oppugne what hath been said by the Councell on the other side it must be granted that if the return here be not positive it is imperfect and in 5 H. 7. 28. it is said that an imperfect return is no return at all it is all one but if the return was so that was not much materiall for then it were

Octabis Michaelis vide the Record I blame not you that are of Councell with these Gentlemen for urging this Record for this Cause is not expressed in your Record but that he was committed by command of the Councell onely but he was committed for suspition of felony with Sir Thomas Smith Vide the Record The next is in 40 Eliz. Edward Harecourts Case and Thomas Wendens Case I bring them together because they are both in one year in the 40 of Eliz. Edward Harecourt you say was committed to the Gatehouse by the Lords of the Councell and the Return was that he was committed by them Certis de causis ipsos moventibus ignotis and he was bailed Here is another in the same time committed to the same prison by the Lords in the Star-chamber it was Thomas Wendens case and he you say was committed by them Certis de causis as the other was and that he was bailed but you shall finde in the margin of the Roll Traditur in ball ' ex assensu Concilii dominae Reginae and that was the relation of the Queens Atturney so that you see how that president fits you The next are two more of the Gatehouse Beckwith and Reyner they you said were committed to the Gate-house brought their Habeas Corpus and the Keeper of the Gatehouse returned that they were committed by vertue of a Warrant from the Archibishop of Canterbury Henry Earl of Northampton Lord Warden of the Cinque Ports and others of the Privy Councell requiring the said Keeper to receive the said Beckwith and Reyner into his charge untill they should have further order from them in that behalf and you say they were bailed Vide the Record in Master Seldens aforesaid Now you shall see the direction to bail him he was bailed by the direction from the Lords of the Councell as appears by their Letter Vide as aforesaid Now we come to Caesars Case in 8 Jacobi you urged that to this purpose you say he was committed to the Marshalsey who upon a Habeas Corpus returned That he was committed Per speciale mandatum domini Regis and you say because the Return was so generall the rule of the Court was that it should be amended or else he should be discharged I will open to you what the reason of that rule was for that notice was taken that the Keeper of the Prison had used a false Return and had usurped the name of the King I know not how but the commitment was not by the Kings command and that was the cause that he had day given him to amend his Return but his body was remaunded to Prison as you shall see the Record Vide the Record c. The last president that you used was that of Sir Thomas Monson and that was so notorious and so late that I marvell that was offered at all it made me jealous of all the rest that was so notorious and now I have omitted none you brought me Vide the Record By this Record you may see that he was committed by divers Lords of the Councell and it was for the suspition of the death of Sir Thomas Overbury and it is notoriously known that he was brought hither to plead his pardon I will not tell you that you read all these presidents for you read none but urged them here before us but we required you to bring them to us and they were brought to us Master Corbet brought them all but one and that Master Noye brought it was in 22 H. 8. Parkers Case And one Master Holborn a man whose face I never saw before nor is he now in mine eye did yesterday bring us one president to this purpose and it was Sir John Brockets Case in 1 Jac. he was committed to the Gatehouse and upon a Habeas Corpus the Keeper returned that Commiss ' suit per Warrantum Dominorum de Privat ' Concilio cujus tenor sequitur in haec verba viz. To the Keeper of the Gatehouse c. vide Master Seldens presidents but see upon what ground he was bailed it was a speciall command of the Lords of the Councell Vide the Record These are all the Records and presidents that you ministred unto us in your Argument and that were delivered unto us for I have dealt faithfully with you and now you have seen them in the Cases I would have any man judge of the conclusion which you made the last day That when a man is committed and the case not known but it is certified to be by the Kings speciall commandment and the Habeas Corpus is procured by your selves and speeded by the King that we can discharge or bail them Then the presidents are all against you every one of them and what shall guide our judgements since there is nothing alledged in this case but presidents that if no cause of the commitment be expressed it is to be presumed to be for matter of State which we cannot take notice of you see we finde none no not one that hath been delivered by bail in the like cases but by the hand of the King or his direction If we should cease here you see you have shewn nothing to satisfie us and we know that you that be of their Councell will satisfie your Clients therein But you shall see that we have taken a little pains in this Case and we will shew you some presidents on the other side and I beleeve there be five hundreth of this nature that may be cited to this purpose I shall go retrograde and go backwards in citing the years of the presidents that I shall mention I will begin with 7 H. 8. Edward Page he was brought hither by the Steward of the Marshalseys who returned that he was committed Per mandatum domini Regis and he was remitted so that he was not delivered upon this generall Return but he was remaunded The next was 12 H. 7. there you shall see a president where one was committed his name was Thomas Yow he was committed for felony and also Per mandatum domini Regis and the Kings Atturney came hither and released the Kings command and thereupon he was bailed Master Noye It is all one with Parkers Case Chief Iustice Hide No for here were two causes of the commitment Hubbert was then the Kings Atturney and he signified in open Court that he was discharged by the Kings command and Postea traditur in ball ' pro suspicione feloniae The next was Humphrey Booths 9 H. 7. Rot. 14. you shall finde it much to that purpose as the other was before he was imprisoned for an outlawry and by the commandment of the King also and after that the release of the Kings commandment was certified to the chief Justice he was thereupon discharged Vide the Record The next is 7 H. 7. Thomas Brown Iohn Rawlings and Robert Sherman and others were committed Per mandatum domini Regis and for felony outlawry and other causes as appears by