that the two Parties in Parliament could not distinctly hear each other so as effectually to understand one another disturbed by the clamorous and obstreperous noise of English wickednesse which began to cry aloud for vengeance on a wanton nation even to the abrupt breaking off of the Parliament VVe have had no other design in the edition hereof then the generall good hoping that Readers of all sorts may gain benefit thereby Yea such young folk whose short capacities as yet are unable to reach the policie and State part in these pieces may better themselves by the very language and expressions therein Here may they observe the variety of eloquence in severall persons some large copious and exuberant yet not flashy empty and dilute some concise piccant and sententious yet not involved dark and obscure some participating of both which in my apprehension is the best kind of Orations However let not any think that all the Gentlemen of able parts assembled in the Parliament are registred in this book by their particular service to their Countrey seeing only such are entred herein who made set studied and premeditated Orations Many Worthies there were in that place who only were dexterous at short and quick returnes and which retrieved long debates with some short and compendious answer very effectuall to the purpose For sometimes a Stilletto blow may give a more deep and deadly wound then the point and edge of the sharpest Sword which requireth more time and room for the managing thereof Yea many a discreet gentleman who after long traversing of matters judiciously bestowed his Yea or Nay in the right scale thereof to weigh the balance down when in AEquilibrio of matters of high importance though otherwise not haranguing it in large discourses might return to his countrey with satisfaction to his conscience that he had well deserved thereof VVe are confident also that the Students of the Law may advantage themselves by severall Cases here largely reported And here all care hath been used in comparing Records herein cited with the Originalls though we dare not avouch it clear from all mistakes the greatest industry and exactnesse being subject to fallibilitie herein VVe have seen the Reports of late Iudges in print and could point at Erratas therein which we speak not to accuse them but excuse our selves if some faults be found in our quotations As for the Gentlemen whose speeches are herein related they are either dead or still surviving For the former we hope we have no cause to ask pardon of their memories and fear not their ghosts disquieting us for offering any injury unto them or that we shall fall into the disfavour of their Heires for misrepresenting any thing for their fathers disadvantage As for such who are still alive we appeal unto them making them the Judges of our integrity herein True it is that the dragge-net of no diligence can be of that capacity nor can it be so advantagiously cast as to catch and hold all particulars uttered in a long speech Minums will get through the holes thereof and there be those minutiae in a speech which will escape the attention of the quickest eare and transcription of the speediest hand But such things are lost without any losse as to the essentials of the matter and here all things of concernment are faithfully represented And may the Reader be pleased to take notice that this Book is no Monochord or Instrument of a single string no nor is it a single Instrument but the exact result of many collections We have compared varias lectiones or rather varias auditiones the copies as they have been taken by severall Auditours Sometimes one copie charitably relieved another nor was it long before the defects of the same copie were supplied out of that other transcription Thus neither is there being for Books nor living for men in this world without being mutually beholding one to another he who lends to day may be glad to borrow to morrow One thing let me mind the Reader that it may move him to a publick and communicative Spirit not enviously to engrosse to himself what may do good to others Some Gentlemen Speakers in this Parliament imparted their Speeches to their intimate Friends the transcripts whereof were multiplied amongst others the penne being very procreative of issue in this nature and since it hath happened that the Gentlemens Originalls have in these troublesome times miscarried yet so that the fountain as I may say being dried up hath fetch 't this water from the channell they have again supplied their losses from those to whom they civilly communicated a copy of their paines Thus none are loosers in fine by making others sharers in their endeavours And now give me leave to say that the History of the Parliament represented in this Book is fundamentall to the History of our Times and what valiant penne soever dare undertake the writing thereof it must lay its ground-work and take its rise from this Parliament Herein were vertually contained the seeds of all those troubles which since the heat of anger hath ripened to the full height and breadth thereof For what is said of Rebeckah that Twinnes were in her bowels which made their Mothers wombe the field of their fight wherein their unborn Infancy gave an Essay of that Antipathy which would be continued betwixt them when arrived at riper yeares the same was true here where the opposition betwixt two parties was begun with much violence and impetuousnesse Yet let not the similitude be uncharitably improved beyond my intent as fixing the odious character of Esau on either of them who hope and believe that both of them might be Iacobs at the first propounding plain pious and peaceable ends unto themselves Yea this may say to ensuing Parliaments as AEneas in the Poet to his sonne Disce puer virtutem ex me verumque laborem Fortunam ex aliis Nor can any true Patriot ever desire that men more honourable more knowing and able in all faculties of policie law and generall learning I may adde also more loving to or beloved of their Countreys ever should meet in Parliament who hence may take their pattern of many worthy and excellent vertues in Statists But oh let them farre exceed this in happinesse the abrupt end whereof was the beginning of all our miseries T. F. A TABLE of the severall Speeches Cases Arguments of Law and other passages contained in the first Session of the Parliament begun March 17. 1627. THe Kings Speech that day pag. first The Lord Keeper Coventryes speech the same day p. 3 The speaker Sir Iohn Finches speech March 19. pag. 7 The Lord Keeper Coventryes reply pag. 8 The Speaker Sir Iohn Finches reply pag. 9 The Lord Keeper Coventryes second reply pag. 14 M r. Goodwins speech March 22. pag. 18 Sir Francis Seymour's speech ibid. Sir Thomas Wentworth's speech pag. 20 The speech and Argument of Mr. Creswell of Lincolnes Inne concerning the
predictae doth not always imply or remaunding upon judgment or debate And this answer was given to this of Cesars Case that is the sixt of this Number The seventh is the Case of Iames Demetrius It was 12 Iacobi Rot. 153. Mr Attorney objected that this Demetrius and divers others being Brewers were committed per consilium Domini Regis to the Marshal-sea of the houshould and that upon the commitment so generally returned they were remaunded and that the Entry was immediate remittitur prefato Marescallo hospitii predicti where he observed that immediate shews that the Judges of that time were so resolved of this Question that they remaunded them partly as men that well knew what the Law was herein Here unto the Gentlemen of the House of Commons gave these answers First that the Remittitur in this Case is but as the other in Cesars and so proves nothing against them Secondly that immediate being added to it shews plainly that it was done without debate or any argument or consideration had of it which makes the authority of the presidents to be of no force in point of Law for Judgments and Awards given upon delibration onely and debate are Proofs and Arguments of weight and not any sudden Act of the Court without debate or deliberation And the Entry of immediate being proposed to Mr. Keeling it was confirmed by him that by that Entry it appears by this course that the remaunding of him was the self same day he was brought which as it was said by the Gentlemen of the House of Commons might be at the riseing of the Court or upon advisement and the like And this answer was given to this president of the Brewers The last of the 8. which Mr. Attorney objected is Saltonstals Case in the 13. Iacobi Regis He was committed per mandatum Dominorum Regis de privato Consilio and being returned by the Warden of the Fleet to be so remittitur prisonae predictae and in the 13. Iac in the same year remittitur generally in the Roll and these two make but one Case and are as one president To this the Gentlemen of the House of Commons answered that it is true the Rolls have such Entries of remittitur in them generally but that proves nothing upon the reason before used by them in Cesars Case But also Saltonstall was committed for another cause besides per mandatum Dominorum Consilii for a contempt against an order in Chauncery and that was in the return also And besides the Court as it appears in the Record gave several days to the Warden of the Fleet to mend his return which they would not have done if they had conceived it sufficient because that which is sufficient needs no amendment To this M r. Attorney replyed that they gave him a day to amend his return in respect of that part thereof that concerned the order in Chancery and not in respect of that which was per mandat Concilij But the gentlemen of the house of Commons answered That it appears not any where nor indeed is it likely at all nor can be so reasonably understood because if the other return per mandatum Concilij had been sufficient by it self it appears fully that the Court conceived the return to be insufficient And so the gentlemen of the Commons house concluded that they had a great number of presidents besides the Acts of Parliament and reasons of Common Law agreeable to their resolution and that there was not one president at all that made against them but indeed that almost all that were brought as well against them as for them if rightly understood made fully to the maintenance of their resolution and that there was not one example or president of a Remittitur in any kinde upon this point before that of Cesars Case which is before cleared with the rest and is but of late time and of no moment against the resolution of the house of Commons And thus for so much as concerned the presidents of Record the first day of the conference desired by the Lords ended The next day they desired another conference which the house of Commons at which it pleased the Committee of both houses to hear M r Attorney again to make what Objection he would against other parts of the Arguments formerly delivered by the house of Commons He then Objected against the Acts of Parliament and against the reasons of Law and his Objections to these parts were answered as appears in the answers by order given into the house of Commons by the gentlemen that made them He Objected also upon the second day against that second kinde of presidents which are resolutions of Judges in former times and not of Records and brought also some other Testimonies of opinions of Judges in former times touching this point First for that resolution of all the Judges in England in 34. of Queen Eliz. mentioned and read in the Arguments made at the first conference he said That it was directly against the resolution of the House of Commons and observed the words of it to be in one place that Persons so committed by the King or the Councel may not be delivered by any of the Courts c. and in another that if the Cause were expressed either in generality or speciality it was sufficient and he said that the expressing of a cause in generality was to shew the Kings or Councels Command And to this purpose he read the whole words of that resolution of the Judges Then he Objected also that in a report of one Ruswells Case in the Kings-bench in the 13. Iac. he found that the opinion of some Judges of that Court S r. Edward Coke being then Chief Justice and one of them was that a Prisoner committed per mandatum Domini Regis or privati Consilii without cause shewed and so returned could not be bayled because it might be matter of State or Arcanum Imperii for which he stood committed And to this also he added an opinion that he found in a Journal of the House of Commons of the 13. Iac. wherein S r. Edward Coke speaking to a Bill preferred for the explanation of Magna Charta touching imprisonment said in the House That a Prisoner so committed could not be enlarged by the Law because it might be Matter of State for which he was committed And among these Objections of other nature also he spake of the confidence that was shewed in behalf of the House of Commons he said that it was not confidence could add any thing to the determination of the question but if it could that he had as much reason for the other side against the resolution of the House grounding himself upon the force of his Objections which as he conceived had so weakned the Argument of the Commons House that notwithstanding any thing yet Objected they were upon clear reason confident of the truth of their first resolution grounded upon so just
before them and mature deliberation taken by them Now plainly in that case of the 13. Iacob there is not so much as pretence of any debate at Bar or Bench. All that is reported to have been is reported as spoken upon the sudden and can any man take such a sudden opinion to be of value against solemne debates and mature deliberation since had of the point and all circumstances belonging to it which have within this half year been so fully examined and searched into that it may well be affirm'd that the learned'st man whatsoever that hath now considered of it hath within that time or might have learned more reason of satisfaction in it then ever before he met with Therefore the sudden opinions of any Judge to the contrary is of no value here Which also is to be said of that opinion obviously delivered in the Commons House 18. Iac. as M r. Attorney objected out of the Journal book of the House But besides neither was the truth of that report of that opinion in the Journal any way acknowledged For it was said in behalf of the House of Commons that their Journals were for matter of order and resolutions of the House of such Authority as that they were as their Records but for any particular Mans opinion noted in any of them it was so far from being of any Authority with them that in truth no particular opinion is at all to be entered in them and that their Clerks offend when ever they do the contrary And to conclude no such opinion whatsoever can be sufficient to weaken the clear Law comprehended in these resolutions of the House of Commons grounded upon so many Acts of Parliament so much reason of Common Law and so many Presidents of Record and the resolution of all the Judges of England and against which no Law written not one President not one reason hath been brought that makes any thing to the contrary And thus to this purpose ended the next day of the Conference desired by the Lords and had by a Committee of both Houses The Proceedings against the Earle of SUFFOLK 14. April 1628. MR. Kerton acquainted the House how that the Earle of Suffolk had said to some Gentlemen that M r. Selden had razed a Record and deserved to be hanged for going about to set division betwixt the King and his Subjects And being demanded to whom the words were spoken he was unwilling to name any till by question it was resolved he should nominate him He then named S r. Iohn Strangwaies who was unwilling to speak what he had heard from the Earle but being commanded by the House and resolved by question he confessed That upon Saturday last he being in the Committee Chamber of the Lords the Earle of Suffolk called him unto him and said Sir Iohn will you not hang Selden To whom he said for what The Earle replied By God he hath razed a Record and deserves to be hanged This the House took as a great injury done to the whole House M r. Selden being imployed by them in the conference with the Lords in the great cause concerning the Liberty of the Persons of the Subjects The House presently sent S r. Robert Philips with a message to the Lords to this effect He expressed the great care the Commons had upon all occasions to maintain all mutual respect and correspondency betwixt both Houses Then he informed them of a great injury done by the Earle of Suffolk to the whole house and to M r. Selden a particuler Member thereof who by their Command had been imployed in the late conference with their Lordships That the House was very sensible thereof and according to former Presidents made them truly acquainted with it and demaunded Justice against the Earle of Suffolk he read the words saying they were spoken to Sir Iohn Strangwayes a Member of their House After a short stay the Lords called for the Messenger to whom the Lord Keeper gave this Answer He signified the great desire and care of their Lordships to maintain and increase the correspondencies betwixt both Houses and as a Testimony thereof they had partly taken into consideration the charge That the Earle of Suffolk being a Man of great place and Honour had voluntarily protested upon his Honour and Soul that there passed no such words as those from him to Sr. Iohn Strangwayes And the Lord Keeper wished that their Lordships speedy proceedings in this business might testifie their love and good will to the Commons House The next day being the 15. of April Sr. Iohn Strangwayes made a Protestation openly in the House wherein he avowed that notwithstanding the Earls denial he did speak those words positively unto him and would maintain it any way fitting a Member of that House or a Gentleman of Honour They ordered that this Protestation should be entered into the Journal book and that a Committee should take into consideration what was fit for the House to proceed to for the justification of S r. Iohn Strangwayes and what was fitting to be done in this Case and to examine Witness of the proof of the words Upon the 17. day S r. Iohn Elliot reported what the Committee had done That they had sent for and examined Sr. Christopher Nevill who related that upon Saturday being in the Lords Committee Chamber the Earle of Suffolk said thus to him Mr. Attorney hath cleared the business and hath made the cause plain on the Kings side and further said M r. Selden hath razed a Record and hath deserved to be hanged and the Lower House should do well to joyn with the Higher in a Petition to the King to hang him and added as a reason For Mr. Selden went about and took a course to divide the King from his people or words to that effect And being asked whether he conceived that those words of dividing the King from his people had relation to the whole and general action of M r. Selden before the Lords or to the particuler of razing a Record he conceived they were referred to the general action They had examined one M r. Littleton who confessed he heard the Earle of Suffolk speak to a Gentleman whom he knew not words to this affect viz. That he would not be in M r. Seldens Coat for 10000 l. and that M r. Selden deserved to be hanged The second part of this Report concerned the particuler of S r. Iohn Strangwayes wherein though the Committee found no Witness to prove the words spoken to S r. Iohn Srangwayes yet there were many circumstances which perswaded them of the truth thereof 1. That the same words in the same syllables were spoken to Sr. Christopher Nevill and that the Earle as he called to him S r. Iohn Strangwayes so he called to him Sr. Christopher Nevill 2. That the Earle of Suffolk called S r. Iohn Strangwayes to him and spake to him was proved by S r. George Fane and S r. Alexander S r. Iohn
speak confidently I did never see nor know by any Record that upon such a Retorn as this a man was bayled the King not first consulted with in such a Case as this The Commons House do not know what Letters and Commands we receive for these remain in our Court and were not viewed by them for the rest of the Matters presented by the House of Commons they were not in agitation before us whether the King may commit and how long he may detain a man committed therefore having answered so much as concerneth us I desire your Lordships good constructions of what hath been said Iudge IONES SAid he was here to deliver before us what judgement was given before them concerning the Habeas Corpus he answered no Judgement was given and the Matter of Fact was such as my brother delivered unto you yesterday These 4. Gentlemen were committed to the Fleet-Gate-House and Marshall of the Kings House-hold 4. Returns were made upon the Writs and every one of them had a Councellour appointed who had Coppies of the Returns A rule was granted their Councel heard and exception taken to the Return because it did not shew cause of their caption These were of no force in the opinion of the Judges the next exception was because no cause of their commitment was shewed which the Judges held to be all one in point of Law Then my Lords they alleadged many Presidents and Statutes of themselves which the Kings Attorney answered That Persons committed by the King or Councel were never bayled but his pleasure was first known We agreed at the Chamber of the Chief Justice that all the Statutes alleadged are in force but whether we should bayl them or no was the question therefore we remitted them quousque After which Mr. Attorney required a Judgement might be entered I commanded the Clark he should not suffer any such thing to be done because we would be better advised But some will say our Act is otherwise I answered no for we have done no more then we do upon ordinary Writ when we purpose to be better advised and that was onely an Interlocutorie order But my Lords put the case a Habeas Corpus should be granted for one that is committed by the House of Commons would they thinck you take it well he should be bayled at his first coming to the Court I thinck they would not and I thinck the King would have done so in this case now my Lords there is a Petition of Right and a Petition of Grace to be bayled is a matter of Grace therefore if a man be brought upon an Habeas Corpus and not bayled he cannot say the Court hath done him any wrong I have now served seven years Judge in this Court and my conscience beareth me witness that I have not wronged the same I have been thought sometimes too forward for the Liberty of the Subject I am my self Liber homo my Ancestors gave their voice with Magna Charta I enjoy that House still which they did I do not now mean to draw down Gods wrath upon my posterity and therefore I will neither advance the Kings prerogative nor lessen the Liberty of the Subject to the danger of either King or People this is my profession before God and your Lordships Iudge DODDERIDGE SAith it is no more fit for a Judge to decline to give an account of his doings then for a Christian of his Faith God knoweth I have endeavoured alwayes to keep a good conscience for a troubled one who can bear the Kingdom holds of none but God and Judgements do not pass privately in Chambers but publick in Court where every one may hear which causeth Judgement to be given with maturity Your Lordships have heard the particulers delivered by my brethren how that Councel being assigned to those 4. Gentlemen in the latter end of Michaelmass Term their Cause received hearing and upon consideration of the Statutes and Records we found some of them to be according to the good old Law of Magna Charta but we thought that they did not come so close to this Case as that bayl should be thereupon presently granted My Lords the Habeas Corpus consisteth of 3. parts the Writ the Return upon the Writ or schedule and the Entry or rule reciting the Habeas Corpus and the Return together with the opinion of the Court either a remittitur or traditur in ballium In this Case a remittitur was granted which we did that we might take better advisement upon the Case and upon the remittitur my Lords they might have had a new Writ the next day and I wish they had because it may be they had seen more and we had been eased of a great labour And my Lords when the Attorney upon the remittitur pressed an Entry we all straitly charged the Clark that he should make no other Entry then such as our Predecessors had usually made in like Cases for the difference my Lords betwixt remittitur and remittitur quousque I could never yet finde any I have now sat in this Court 15. years and I should know something surely if I had gone in a Mill so long dust would cleave to my cloaths I am old and have one foot in the grave therefore I will look to the better part as near as I can But omnia habere in memoria in nullo errare divinum potiùs est quam humanum THE LORD CHIEF IUSTICE SAith he shall not speak with confidence unless he might stand right in the opinion of the House and protested what he spake the day before was not said by him with any purpose to trench upon the Priviledges of this House but out of that respect which by his place he thought he owed to the King he said concerning the point he was to speak of that he would not trouble the Lords with things formerly repeated wherein he concurred with his brethren He said if it were true the King might not commit they had done wrong in not partly delivering for my Lords saith he these Statutes and good Laws being all in force we meant not to trench upon any of them most of them being Commentaries upon Magna Charta but I know not any Statute that goeth so far that the King may not commit Therefore justly we think we delivered the interpretation thereof to that purpose for my Lords Lex terrae is not to be found in this Statute they gave me no example neither was there any Cause shewed in the Return A President my Lords that hath run in a storm doth not much direct us in point of Law and Records are the best Testimonies These Presidents they brought being read we shewed them wherein they were mistaken if we have erred erramus cum Patribus and they can shew no President but that our Predecessors have done as we have done sometimes bayling sometimes remitting sometimes discharging Yet we do never bayl any committed by the King or his Councel
then by giving a confirmation upon this occasion we have bettered our Case very much Thirdly have not the Judges in the Kings-bench in open Parliament upon our complaint disclaimed to have given any Judgement in the point which generally before by the Parliament was otherwise conceived for now they say it was but an Award and no Judgement Will such a Notorious Act upon so important an occasion in so publick a place be quickly forgotten Nay will not the memorie of it for ever remain upon Records is not our Case then much better then when we came hither Fourthly will not the resolution of this House and all our Arguments and reasons against imprisonment without a Cause expressed which no doubt by the course we have taken will be transferred to posterity be a great means to stay any Judge hereafter for declaring any Judgement to the contrary especially if there be likelyhood of a Parliament is not our Case in this very much amended Lastly have we not received Propositions from the Lords wherein amongst other things they declared that they are not out of love with our proceedings is not this a great strenghtning to it but after so long debate amongst them about it they cannot take any just exception to it and doth not this also much amend our Case From all these reasons I conclude that the second Objection that by a confirmation we are in no better case then when we came together is also a weak Objection Now for reasons to move us to proceed in this course of accepting a confirmation First we have his Majesties gracious promise to yield to a confirmation of the old Laws from which we may rest most assured he will not depart If we tender him with all our Proposition to be enacted we have cause to doubt that we shall loose both the one and the other Secondly we are no less assured of the Lords joyning with us for in their Propositions sent to us they have delivered themselves to that purpose This is then a secure way of getting somewhat of great advantage to us as we have great hopes and in a manner assurance on this side So on the other side we have great doubts and fears that by offering our resolution to be enacted we shall loose all For first we have had already experience of the Lords that they are not very foreward to joyn with us in a Declaration of our Proposition to be Law If they stumble at a Declaration much more will they in yielding to make Law in the same point And have we not much more cause to doubt that his Majesty will not yield unto it seeing it toucheth him so near Is it not the notice of his pleasure that hath wrought thus with the Lords If we should clog our Bill with our Proposition and it should be rejected by the Lords or by the King is not our resolution much weakned by it And are we not then in far worse case then before we made it Our resolution for the rejecting of our Proposition will tend to a Justification of all that hath been done against us in this great point of our Liberty Let us then like wise-men conform our desire to our hopes and guide our hopes by probabilities other desires and other hopes are but vain This is my poor opinion in this weighty business Secretary COKES Message 1. May 1628. Mr. Speaker I Have a very short message to deliver from his Majesty that shews both his Royal care to be rightly understood of this House and no less care to understand us in the best part and to shew clearly it shall not be his fault if this be not a happy Parliament His Majesty hath commanded me to desire this House clearly to let him know whether they will rest upon his Royal word and promise made at several times and especially by my Lord Keepers Speech made in his own presence which if they do he doth assure you that it shall be royally and really performed After speaking of himself and the nature of his place under his Majesty he proceeded in these words GIve me leave freely to tell you that I know by experience that by the place I hold under his Majesty if I will discharge the duty of my place and the Oath I have taken to his Majesty I must commit and neither express the cause to the Jaylor nor to the Judges nor to any Councellour in England but to the King himself yet do not think I go without ground of reason or take this power committed to me to be unlimmitted Yea rather it is to me a charge burthen and danger for if I by this power shall commit the poorest porter if I do it not upon a just cause if it may appear the burthen will fall upon me heavier then the Law can inflict for I shall loose my credit with his Majesty and my place And I beseech you consider whether those that have been in the same place have not committed freely and not any doubt made of it nor any complaint made by the Subject Veneris 2. May 1628. A Report was this day made from the grand Committee for grievances concerning the cause of Nicholas Clegat Cittizen and Vintner of London imprisoned by the Lord Major and Aldermen of the said Citie for refusing to lend a certain summe of money assessed upon him by the Company of Vintners of London whereof he is free towards the proportion of money imposed upon the Company by an Act of Common-Councel of the said Citie in pursuance of a contract of Land with his Majesty By which report it appeared that the said grand Committee had unanimously agreed that the said Citie might make Acts of Councel so as they were consonant to Law and reason and for regulating and deciphering of trade agreeable to reason and the Law of the Realm and might leavy money of the Cittizens by Act of Common-Councel for building or repairing of their Walls Gates or making or cleansing of Sewers or other like causes tending to the general and publick good and welfare of the Citie or towards Triumphs or other like occasions tending to the Honour of the Citie in general but could not by such Act of Common-Councel tax or leavy money towards the purchasing of Lands or other like occasions forreign to the government of the Citie Whereupon it is resolved by the House of Commons super totam materiam that the said Commitment of the said Nicholas Clegat was unlawfull and that a Petition should go from the House to his Majesty for the inlargement of the said Nicholas Clegat his commitment by the Lord Major and Aldermen being since strengthned by special command Henry TOMPSON one of the Shrieffs and Robert HENISVVORTH Alderman of the Citie of YORK their submission for their indirect chusing of S r. Thomas SAVIL Knight I Henry Tompson one of the Shrieffs of the Citie of York do hereby acknowledge to have offended the Lord Major and all the Cominalty
shall or will at any time hereafter commit or command to Prison or otherwise restrain the Person of any for not lending money unto us or for any other cause which in our conscience doth not concern the State the publick good and safety of us and of our people we will not be drawn to pretend any cause which in our Judgements is not or is not expressed which base thought we hope no man will imagine can fall into our royal breast that in all cases of this nature which shall hereafter happen we shall upon the humble Petition of the party or access of our Judges to us readily and really express the cause of their commitment or restraint so soon as with conveniency and safety the same is fit to be disclosed and expressed That in all causes Criminal of ordinary Jurisdiction our Judges shall proceed to the deliverance and baylment of the Prisoner according to the known and ordinary rules of the Laws of this Land and according to the Statutes of Magna Charta and those other six Statutes insisted upon which we do take knowledge stand in force and which we intend not to abrogate against the true intention thereof Thus we have thought fit to signifie unto you the rather for shortning any long delayes of this question the season of the year so far advance and our great occasions of State not lending us many dayes for long continuance of this Session of Parliament Given under our Signet at our Pallace of Westminster the 12. of May in the fourth year of our Raign The KINGS Message by the Lord Keeper 21. May 1628. HIs Majestie commanded me to signifie to your Lordships that the business concerning your part presented by the Commons to the Lords concerning the Liberty of the Subject wholly depends upon your Lordships and because his affairs are pressing and that he is very suddenly to take a Journey to Portsmouth As also because his Majesty would have the business put in a good forwardness before his going thither his Majestie desires your Lordships this day to proceed to a resolution whether you will joyn with the House of Commons in the Petition or not M r. MASONS speech concerning the Addition propounded by the Lords to be added to the Petition of Right IN our Petition of Right to the Kings Majestie we mentioned the Laws and Statutes by which it appeared that no Tax Loan or the like ought to be levied by the King but by common assent in Parliament That no Freeman ought to be imprisoned but by the Law of the Land That no Freeman ought to be compelled to suffer Souldiers in his house In the Petition we have expressed the breach of these Laws and desire that we may not suffer the like all which we pray as our Rights and Liberties The Lords have proposed an addition to this Petition in these words We humbly present this Petition to your Majestie not onely with a care of our own Liberties but with a due regard to leave intyre that Soveraign power wherewith your Majesty is intrusted for the protection safety and happiness of your people and whether we shall consent unto this addition is the Subject of this dayes discourse And because my Lord Keeper at the last conference declared their Lordships had taken the words of the Petition apart The word leave in a Petition is of the same nature as saving in a grant or Act of Parliament when a Man grants but part of a thing he saves the rest when he Petitions to be restored but to part he leaveth the rest then in the end of our Petition the word leave will imply that something is to be left of that or at least with a Reverence to what we desire The word entyre is very considerable a Conquerour is bound by no Law but hath power dare leges his will is a Law and although William the Conquerour at first to make his way to the Crown of England the more easie and the possession of it the more sure claiming it by little but afterwards when there were no powerfull pretenders to the Crown The little of Conquest to introduce that absolute power of a Conquerour was claimed and that Statute of Magna Charta and other Statutes mentioned in our Petition do principally limmit that power I hope it is as Lawfull for me to cite a Jesuite as it is for Dr. Manwaring to falsifie him Suares in his first book de legibus cap. 17. delivered his opinion in these words amplitudo restrictio potestatis Regum circa ea quae per se mala vel injusta non sunt pendet ex arbitrio hominum ex ambigua convencione vel pacto inter Reges Regnum And the further expresseth his opinion that the King of Spain was so absolute a Monarch that he might Lawfully impose tribute without consent of his people untill about 200. years since when it was concluded between him and his people that without consent of his people by proxies he should not impose any Tribute And Suares opinion is that by that agreement the Kings of Spain are bound to impose no Tribute without consent And this agreement that Author calls a restraining of that Soveraign power the Statutes then mentioned in our Petition restraining that absolute power of a Conquerour if we recite those Statutes and say we have the Soveraign power intire we do not take away that restraint which is the virtue and strength of those Statutes and set at Liberty the claim of the Soveraign power of a Conquerour which is to be limitted and restrained by no Laws this may be the danger of the word entyre The next words delivered by the Lords as observable is the particle that because it was said that all Soveraign power is not mentioned to be left but onely that with which the King is trusted for our protection safety and happiness But I conceive this to be an exception of all Soveraign power for all Soveraign power in a King is for the protection safety and happiness of his people If all Soveraign power be excepted you may easily Judge the consequence all Loans and Taxes being imposed by colour of that Soveraign power The next word is trusted which is very ambiguous whether it be meant trusted by God onely as a Conquerour or by the people also as King which are to Govern also according to Laws ex pacto In this point I will not presume to adventure further onely I like it not by reason of the doubtfull exposition it admits I have likewise considered the proposition it self and therein I have fallen upon the dilemma that this addition shall be construed either to refer unto the Petition or not If it doth refer unto the Petition it is meerly useless and unnecessary and unbefitting the Judgement of this grave and great Assembly to add to a Petition of this weight If it hath reference unto it then it destroys not onely the virtue and strength of our
conteined but particuler Rights of the Subject and nothing at all concerning his Majesties Prerogative Secondly that answer was to give his Majectie satisfaction of all our proceedings in general and no man can assign any particuler in which we have broken it and this Petition justifies it self that in it we have not offended against the protestation and I know no reason but that this declaration should be added to all our Laws we shall agree on this Parliament as well as to this Petition The last reason given was that we have varied in our Petition from the words of Magna Charta and therefore it was well necessary that a saving should be added to the Petition I answer that in the Statute 5. E. 3. 25. E. 3. 28. E. 3. and other Statutes with which Magna Charta is confirmed the words of the Statute of explanation differ from the words of Magna Charta it self the words of some of the Statutes of explanation being that no man ought to be apprehended unless by indictment or due process of Law the other statutes differing from the words of Magna Charta in many other particulars and yet there is no saving in those Statutes much less should there be any in a Petition of Right these are the answers I have conceived to the reasons of their Lordships and the exposition I apprehend must be made of the proposed words being added to our Petition And therefore I conclude that in my opinion we may not consent to this addition which I submit to better Judgements The Reasons of the Commons House delivered by M r. GLANUILE why they cannot admit of the Propositions tendered unto them by the Lords May it please your Lordships I Am commanded by the House of Commons to deliver unto your Lordships their reasons why they cannot admit of the Proposition tendered unto them by you but for an introduction into the busines please you to remember that a Petition of Right was shewed to your Lordships wherein we desired you would joyn with us a Petition my Lords fitting for these times grounded upon Law and seeking no more then the Subjects just Liberty The Petition consisted of 4. parts The first touching Loan Aids and Taxes The second touching imprisonment of mens Persons The third touching Billeting of Souldiers The fourth touching Commissions issued for Martial Law and put in execution upon several Persons Groaning under the burthen of these we desired remedy and wish your Lordships would joyn with us which you having taken into consideration we must confess have dealt nobly and freely with us not to conclude any thing till you hear our just reasons for which we thank your Lordships and hope your Lordships will value those reasons which we shall now offer unto your Lordships The work of this day will make a happy issue if your Lordships please to relinquish this as we formerly upon conference with your Lordships have done some other things For the Proposition my Lords we have debated it throughly in our House and I am commanded to deliver unto you the reasons why we cannot insert this clause Neither your Lordships nor we desire to debate Liberty beyond the due bounds or to incroach upon the Kings Prerogative and lessen the bounds thereof The first reason I am to lay down is touching Soveraign power which I beseech you not to accept as my own being but a weak Member of that strong body but as the reasons of the whole House upon great and grave considerations First my Lords the words Soveraign power hath either reference or no reference to the Petition if no reference then superfluous if a reference then dangerous and operative upon the Petition and we think your Lordships purposes is not to offer unto us any thing that may be vain or to the hinderance of any thing wherein you have already joyned with us The Petition declareth the Right of the Subject which yet may be broken by the word Soveraign power and so the virtue of the Petition taken away The end of the Petition is not to enlarge the bounds of Law but their Liberties being infringed to reduce them to their ancient bounds and shall we by admitting of these words Soveraign power instead of cureing the wound launch it and cut it deeper The next point is the word trust a word of large latitude and deep sence we know that there is a trust in the Crown and King but regulated by Law we acknowledge in penal Statutes the King may grant another power to dispense with the Law but Magna Charta inflicting no penalty leaveth no trust but claimeth his own right therefore the word trust would confound this distinction Our next reason is we think it absolutely repugnant to any course of Parliament to put saving to the Petition In former times the course of petitioning the King was this The Lords and the Speaker either by words or writing preferred their Petition to the King this then was called the Bill of the Commons which being received by the King part he received and part he put out part he retified for as it came from him it was drawn into a Law But this course in 2. H. 5. was found prejudicial to the Subject and since in no such cases they have petitioned by Petition of Right as we now do who come to declare what we demaund of the King For if we should tell him what we should not demaund we should then proceed not in a Parliamentary course Now for that which is alleadged by your Lordships de articulis sup Chartas that my Lords is not like this that is saving upon particulars But this Petition consisting consisting on particulers would be destroyed by a general saving The saving de articulis sup Chartas are of three aids for Ransomming the Kings Person for Knighting the Kings eldest Son and once for Marrying the Kings eldest Daughter These by the form of the Petition shew that they came not in upon the Kings answer but upon the Petition First then followed the savings which under favour we think are no reasons to make us accept of this saving being not pertinent to the Petition These 23. Statutes 34. E. 1. were made to confirm Magna Charta so that there are in all 30. Acts to set Magna Charta in its purity and if some subsequent Statute have laid some blemish upon it shall we now then make the subject in worse case by laying more weight upon it God forbid In the next place your Lordships reason thus that this which you wish we would admit of is no more then what we formerly did profess when we sent the King word we had no purpose at all to trench upon his prerogatives It is true my Lords we did so but this was not annexed to any Petition for in that manner we should never have done it And here I am commanded with your favours to deliver unto you what a Learned Member of the House delivered unto our House
touching this point The King saith he and the Subject hath two liberties Two Mannors joyning one upon another the King is informed the Subject hath intruded upon him but upon triall it appeareth not to be so were it fitting think you that the Subject should give security that he should not incroach or intrude on that Mannor of his because the King had been informed he did so I think you will be of another minde wherefore I am commanded seeing we cannot admit of this addition to desire your Lordships to joyn with us in the Petition which being granted and the hearts of the King and people knit togeather I doubt not but his Majestie will be safe at home and feared abroad Sir HENRY MARTINS Speech MY Lords the work of this day wherein the House of Commons hath implyed the Gentleman that spake last and my self was to reply to the answer which it hath pleased the Lord Keeper to make to those reasons which we had offered to your Lordships consideration in justification of our refusall not to admit into our Petition the addition commended by your Lordships which reasons of ours since they have not given such satisfaction as we desired and well hoped as by the Lord Keepers answer appeared It was thought fit for our better order and method in replying to divide the Lord Keepers answer into two parts a Leagall and a Rationall The reply to the leagall your Lordships have heard my self comes intrusted to reply to the rational which also consisted of two branches the first deduced from the whole context of the additional clause the second inforced out of some part In the first were these reasons that the same deserved our acceptance First as satisfactory to the King Secondly to your Lordships Thirdly agreeable to what our selves had often protested and professed expresly by the mouth of our Speaker I must confess these motives were weighty and of great force and therefore to avoid misunderstanding and misconceit which otherwise might be taken against the House of Commons upon refusall of the propounded addition It is necessary to State the question rightly and to set down the true difference between your Lordships and us Now indeed there is no difference or question between your Lordships and us concerning this additional clause in the nature and quality of a proposition For so considered we say it is most true and to be received and imbraced by us In toto qualibet parte qualibet syllaba yea and were that the question we should add to this addition and instead of due regard say we have had have and ever will have a special and singular regard where to leave entire Sovereign power were to intimate as if we had first cropt it and then left it but our regard was to acknowledge and confess it sincerely and to maintain it constantly even to the hazard of our goods and lives if need be To which purpose your Lordships may be pleased to remember that strict oath every Member of our House hath taken this very session in these words I A. B. do utterly testifie and declare in my Conscience that the Kings highness is the Supreme or Sovereign Governour of this Realm in all Causes c. and to my utmost power will assist and defend all Iurisdictions Priviledges Preheminencies and Authorities granted or belonging to the Kings Highness or united or annexed to the Imperial Crown of this Realm c. So that your Lordships need not to borrow from our protestations any exhortations to us to entertain a writing in assistance of the Kings Sovereign power since we stand obliged by the most Sacred bond of a solemn Oath to assist and defend the same if cause or occasion so required So that the onely question between your Lordships and us is whether this clause should be added to our Petition and received into it as part thereof which to do your Lordships reasons have not perswaded us because so to admit it were to overthrow the fabrick and substance of our Petition of Right and to annihilate the Right pretended by us and the Petition it felf in effect For these words being added to our Petition viz we humbly present this Petition c. with due regard to leave intire your Sovereign power c. do include manifestly an exception to our Petition and an exception being of the nature of the thing whereunto it is an exception Exceptio est de regula must of necessity destroy the rule or Petition so far as to the Case excepted Exceptio firmat regulam in Casibus non exceptis in Casibus exceptis distruit Regulam Then this construction followeth upon our Petition thus inlarged that after we have Petitioned That no Freeman should be compelled by imprisonment to lend or contribute money to his Majestie without his assent in Parliament nor receive against his will Souldiers into his house or undergo a commission of Martiall Law for life or Member in time of peace We should add except his Majestie be pleased to require our monies and imprison us for not lending and send Souldiers into our houses and execute us by Martiall Law in time of peace by virtue of his Soveraign power Which construction as it followeth necessarily upon this inlargment so it concludeth against our Right in the premisses and utterly frustrateth all our Petition neither may it seem strange if this clause additionall which of it self in quallity of a proposition we confess being added to our Petition which also is true should overthrow the very frame and fabrick of it seeing the Logicians take knowledge of such a Fallacy called by them Fallacia à bene divisis ad male conjuncta Horace the Poet giveth an instance to this purpose in a painter who when he had painted the head of a Man according to Art would then joyn to it the neck of a horse and so marr the one and the other whereas each by it self might have been a peice of right good workmanship The second branch of my Lordkeepers rationall parte was enforced out of the last words of this addition by which his Lordship said that they did not leave intire all Soveraign power but that wherewith his Majestie is trusted for the protection safety and happiness of the people as if his Lordship would infer that Soveraign power wherewith c. in this place to be terminum diminuentem â— term of diminution or quallification and in that consideration might induce us to accept it but under his Lordships correction we cannot so interpret it For first we are assured that there is no Sovereign power wherewith his Majestie is trusted either by God or Man but onely that which is for the protection safety and happiness of his people and therefore that limitation can make no impression upon us but we conceive it rather in this place to have the force termini adaâ—gentis to be a term of important advantage against our Petition a term of restriction and that
vouchsafe us your noble Company in this Petition without surcharging it with this addition A tempore Our next argument is drawn a tempore from the unseasonableness of the time The wise man saith there is a time for all things under the Sun tempus suum And if in the wise mans Judgement a word spoken in its due time be precious as Gold and Silver then an unseasonable time detracts as much from the thing or word done or spoken We hold under your favours that the time is not seasonable now for this addition It is true that of it self Soveraign power is a thing alwayes so sacred that to handle it otherwise then tenderly is a kinde of sacriledge and to speak of it otherwise then reverently is a kinde of blasphemy but every vulgar capacity is not so affected the most part of men nay almost all men judge and esteem all things not according to their own intrinsick virtue and quality but according to their immediate effects and operations which the same things have upon them Hence it is that Religion it self receiveth more or less credit and approbation as the Teachers and Professors are worser or better Yea if God himself send a very wet Harvest or Seed-time men are apt enough to censure Divine power The Soveraign power hath not now for the present the ancient amiable aspect in respect of some late sad influences but by Gods grace it will soon recover To intermix with this Petition any mention of Soveraign power rebus sic stantibus when angry men say Soveraign power hath been abused and the most moderate wish it had not been so used we hold it not seasonable under your Lordships correction A loco Our next argument is drawn a loco we think the place where your Lordships would have this addition inserted viz. in the Petition no convenient or seasonable place Your Lordships will easily believe that this Petition will run through many hands every man will be desirous to see and to read what their Knights and their Burgesses have done in Parliament upon their complaints what they have brought home for their 5. Subsedies If in perusing of this Petition they fall upon the mention of Soveraign power they presently fall to arguing reasoning and discanting what Soveraign power is what is the Latitude whence the Original and where the bounds with many such curious and captious questions by which course Soveraign power is little advanced or advantaged For I have ever been of opinion that it is then best with Soveraign power when it is had in tacite venerationem not when it is prophaned by publick hearings or examinations Our last argument is drawn from our duty and Loyalty to his Majesty in consideration whereof we are fearfull at this time to take this addition into our Petition least we should do his Majesty herein some disservice With your Lordships we make the great Councel of the King and Kingdom And though your Lordships having the happiness to be near his Majesty know other things better yet certainly the state and condition of the several parts for which we serve their dispositions and inclinations their apprehensions their fears and jealousies are best known unto us And here I pray your Lordships to give me leave to use the figure called Reticentia that is to insinuate and intimate more then I mean to speak Our chief and principal end in this Parliament is to make up all rents or breaches between the King and his Subjects to draw them and knit them together from that distance whereof the world abroad takes too much notice to work a perfect union and reconciliation how improperly and unapt at this time this addition would be in respect of this end we cannot but foresee and therefore shun it and do resolve that it is neither agreeable to the Persons of such Councellors whom we are nor answerable to that love and duty which we owe to his Majesty to hazard an end of such unspeakable consequence upon the admittance of this addition into our Petition whereof as we have shewed the omission at this time can by no means harm the Kings Prerogative the expression may produce manifold inconveniences and therefore since the admittance of your Lordships addition into our Petition is incoherent and incompatible with the body of the same since there is no necessary use of it for the saving of the Kings rerogative since the moderation of our Petition deserveth your Lordships cheerfull conjunction with us since this addition is unseasonable for the time and inconvenient in respect of the place where your Lordships would have it inserted and lastly may prove a disservice to his Majesty I conclude with a most affectionate prayer to your Lordships to joyn with the House of Commons in presenting this Petition unto his sacred Majesty as it is without this addition The KINGS speech in the Higher House at the meeting of both Houses 2. June 1628. Gentlemen I Am come hither to perform my duty and I think no man will think it long since I have not taken so many dayes in answering of the Petition as you have spent weeks in framing it and I am come hither to shew you that as well in formall things as in essential I desire to give you as much content as in me lies The Lord KEEPER in explanation of the same MY Lords and you the Knights Cittizens and Burgesses of the House of Commons his Majesty hath commanded me to say unto you that he takes it in good part that in consideration how to settle your own Liberty you have generally professed in both Houses that you have no intention for to lessen or diminish his Majesties Prerogative wherein as you have cleared your own intentions so his Majesty now comes to clear his and to strike a firm league with his people which is ever decreed to be most constant and perpetual when the conditions are equal and known to be so These cannot be in a more happy estate then when your Liberties shall be an ornament and strength to his Majesties Prerogative and his Prerogative a defence to your Liberties In this his Majesty doubts not but both you and he shall take a mutual comfort hereafter and for his part he is resolved to give an example in so using of his power as hereafter you shall have no cause to complain This is the summe of that which I am to say to you Here read your own Petition and his Majesties gracious answer The KINGS answer to the Petition of Right 2. June by the Lord KEEPER THe King willeth that Right be done according to the Laws and Customes of the Realm and that the Statutes be put in due execution that the Subject may have no cause to complain of any wrong or oppression contrary to their just Rights and Liberties to the preservation whereof he holds himself in conscience as well obliged as of his Prerogative Sir JOHN ELLIOTS Speech 3. June Mr. Speaker WE sit here
the Pardons were all drawn by Mr. Attorney before there was any Warrant Mr. Cromwell saith he had by relation from one Doctor Beard that Beard said Doctor Allablaster had preached flat Poperie at Pauls Cross the Bishop of Winchester commanded him as he was his Diocesan that he should preach nothing to the contrarie Sir Robert Philips saith One Doctor Marshall will relate as much said to him by the Bishop of Winchester as the Bishop said to Doctor Moor. Mr. Kirton That Doctor Marshall and Doctor Beard may be sent for This Bishop though he hath leapt through many Bishopricks yet he hath left Poperie behind him That Cosens frequenting the Printing-house hath caused the Book of Common-Prayer to be new printed and hath changed the word Minister into Priest and hath put out in another place the word Elect thus Cosens and his Lord go hand in hand Sir Miles Fleetwood saith We are to give Mountague his Charge and by his books charge him with Schisme in error of Doctrine Faction in point of State Thirdly matter of Aggravation Sir Walter Earl QUi color albus erat nunc est contrarius albo saith Doctor White hath sold his Orthodox books and bought Jesuiticall books moves that Bishop White may go arm in arm with Mountague Ordered a select Committee to be named to digest these things that have been alreadie agitated concerning the Innovation of Religion the Cause of the Innovation and the Remedie Thursday 12. THe Sheriff of London upon his submission at the Barre is released his imprisonment in the Tower Sir Iohn Elliot made the Report for the Committee in the examination of the complaint of Merchants and delivered the Orders and Injunctions into the Exchequer At a great Committee for Tonnage and Poundage Mr. SHERVIL in the Chair MAster Waller delivered a Petition from Chambers Felke and Gilborn in complaint of an information against them in the Star-chamber about Tonnage and Poundage that by the restraint of their goods they are like to be undone Sir Iohn Elliot THe Merchants are not onely kept from their goods by Customers but by a pretended Justice in a Court of Justice as the Exchequer I conceive if the Judges of that Court had their understanding enlightened of their error by this House they would reform the same and thereby the Merchants suddenly come to their goods Mr. Transtort conceiveth this to be a difficult way for us to go Mr. Corington Let it be done which way the House shall think fit but I conceive the Merchants shall have their goods before we can think of the Bill Kings ought not by the Law of God thus to oppress their Subjects I know we have a good King and this is the advice of his wicked Ministers but there is nothing can be more dishonorable unto him Mr. Stroud That it may be Voted That the Merchants may have their goods before we enter on the Bill Chancellor of the Dutchie I shall speak my opinion because I know not whether I shall have libertie to speak or you to hear any more All the proceedings of the King and his Ministers was to keep the Question safe untill this House should meet and you shall find the proceedings of the Chequer were Legal and thus much not knowing whether I shall have a days libertie to speak any more here again Mr. Thesaurer There is none here but would think it a hard thing that a Possession should be taken from us without any order for Sequestration that therefore it was not to be suffered that these few men should so unjustly disturb the Government of the State Desires there may be no interruption but that we may proceed to settle the Tonnage Mr. Corington I hope we may speak here as I hope we may speak in heaven and do our duties and let no fear divert us Mr. Waller It is not so few as 500 Merchants are threatened in this Sir Robert Phillips moveth we may go to the King and satisfie him of these interruptions Mr. Noy We cannot safely give unless we be in possession and proceedings in the Exchequer nullified and information in the Star-chamber and the Annexion to the Petition of Right and other Records I will not give my voice to this untill these things be made void for it will not be a Guift but a Confirmation Neither will I give unless these interruptions be removed and a Declaration in the Bill That the King hath no Right but by our free guift If it will not be accepted as is fit for us to give it we cannot help it If it be the Kings alreadie as by these new Records then we need not to give it Mr. Selden secondeth the Motion of sending a Message to the Exchequer declareth a President of a Message sent into the Chancerie for stay of proceedings in a Cause and it was obtained and whatsoever the Judges return it cannot prejudice us the Law speaks by Record and if these Records remain it will to posteritie explain the Law Mr. Littleton For the Right there is no Lawyer so ignorant to conceive it nor any Judge in the Land to affirm it is against giving to the King or going on the Bill In this case by the Law a man cannot be put to a Petition of Right but shall recover without Right Ordered that a Message shall be sent to the Court of the Exchequer That whereas certain goods of the Merchants have been stayed by Injunction from that Court by a false Affidavit and that the Customers that made the Affidavit have upon examination of this House confessed that the goods were stayed onely for duties contained in the book of Rates that therefore that Court would make void the orders and Affidavits in this business Friday 13. A Petition against one Burges a Priest who was here complained of the last Session some new Articles complained against him that he could not get a Copie of his Articles out of the house untill he was fain to get one counterfeit himself a Puritan to get the same and other new misdemeanors He is Ordered to be sent for Sir Iohn Elliot A Motion for Priviledge of Merchants Order is That any man having a Complaint depending here in the mean time intimation shall be given to my Lord Keeper That no Attachment shall go forth against the Merchants Chancellor of the Dutchie reported the Message to the Chequer Court that the Treasurer and the Barons will forthwith take the same into consideration and return answer It is Ordered Mr. Secretarie Cook shall take care that intimation shall be given to the Citie about the Fast. Doctor More called in saith he was referred to the Bishop of Winchester to be censured for preaching a Sermon the Bishop said he had heard him preach and deliver many prettie passages against the Papists which pleased King Iames but he must not do so now That you have a brother that preacheth against Bowing at the high Altar or at the name of Iesus and that
the Secretarie Super totam maternam It is evident that the Colledge at Clarkenwell is a Colledge of Iesuits holden under a Forreign Supream power Sir Francis Seymour taxeth Mr. Attorneys affection and judgement in this and also declareth continual Letters from Mr. Attorney in stay of proceedings against Recusants You see in this how slightly Mr. Attorney hath put over a business of this weight to Mr. Long. Cross the Pursevant saith there was an Eleventh man in the New Prison and the Keeper of that Prison said he was delivered by Warrant from the Councel-board Sir Iohn Elliot No man could find a way on which to vent his malice so much to this Church and State as by protecting these men That this may be fixed home on that great Lord of Dorset that I fear hath defiled his fingers too far in this business and on Mr. Attorney whom I am sorrie I have occasion to nominate so often in this matter of Religion in stopping of proceedings against Recusants Mr. Recorder is ordered to be sent for and to be examined in this rather than to be sent for having had the Honor formerly to sit in the Chair Secretarie Cook saith we shall find that the King being mercifull in case of shedding bloud gave direction for the repriving of those Priests Sir Iohn Elliot I doubt not when we shall declare the depth of this to his Majestie but he will render them to judgement that gave him advice herein Sir Nath. Ritch These Iesuits are bound by Sureties to answer further at the Councel-board I wish these Bonds would produce these Men that by examination of them we may find out the whole pack of their Benefactors and Countenancers Mr. Long saith that he offering at Session the Evidence by order from M. Attorney the Lord Chief Justice Richardson interrupted him and told him he must speak to the point in issue whether Priests or no Priests and hereupon the Judges consulted amongst themselves Mr. Selden saith he was present at the Sessions and plain Treason was proved and nothing done in it The further examination of this is referred to a select Committee Munday 16. A Petition of Complaint against Sir Henry Martin for disposing of the goods of one Brown who died intestate to his own private use Sir Henry Martin If I prove not my self as clear of this as St. Iohn Baptist let me be reckoned to be a Jew Referred to the Committee for course of Justice At the Committee for Religion MAster Stroud That the Lord Chief Justice may be called to give an account of his stay of Justice in the execution of the condemned Priests which he ought not to have done though his Majestie signified his pleasure to the contrarie Chancellor of the Dutchie That was a thing ordinarie for a Chief Justice to do in Queen Elisabeths and King Iames times as also a Declaration in the Star-chamber that all condemned Priests should be sent to the Castle of Wisbitch and from hence though the King had given no order for the replevie he might have taken his Warrant for his proceedings Mr. Selden reporteth from the Committee for the further examination of Mr. Long concerning the proceeding at Newgate against the Iesuits whereby plainly appeareth that the evidence tendered in the Court at Newgate did plainly testifie these men to be Priests yet the Lord Chief Justice Richardson did reject the same against the sence of the rest of the Judges and Justices present whereby it is plain he dealt under-hand to some of the Iesuites Ordered That two Members shall be sent to each Judge that were present at the Sessions at Newgate who were said to be the Lord Chief Justice of the Kings Bench the Chief Justice of the Common-pleas Justice Whitlock Justice Iones and Justice Crook Tuseday 17. MAster Chambers preferreth another Petition in complaint of a Warrant newly proceeding from the Councel-board for the stay of the Merchants goods unless they payed the duties that were due in King Iames his time Sir Iohn Elliot You see as by the last answer from the Exchequer the Merchants were bounded within the Court to sue for their own so they are now debarred from all means of coming by their own It is Ordered that the Customers shall attend the House on Thurseday next In the mean time it is referred to the former Committee Ordered a Committee of six to Collect and take all the names at the Fast and to meet at eight of the Clock in the Morning Ordered That a Committee shall consider of a speedie way to put the Merchants in Possession of their goods without which it is warned we sit here in vain Sir Thomas Hobbie Reported from my Lord Chief Justice Hide that he doth not remember any Papers tendred by Mr. Long were rejected or that he affirmed they were dangerous persons and a Colledge of Iesuits but howsoever Mr. Long tendred nothing to prove them so but that he had diverse papers in his hand Mr. Wansford Reported from the Lord Chief Justice Richardson who saith that Mr. Long did discourse of the place and house but did not press the reading of any papers neither doth he know what was in the papers neither knew he any thing to prove the persons Priests Sir Thomas Barrington delivereth the answer of Justice Iones who saith the same papers were offered by Mr. Long but he knoweth not the Contents thereof nor the reason why they were refused but he came late for want of his health and the second day was not there at all The like was Reported by Sir Will. Constable from Justice Crook Sir Thomas Barrington saith Although that Justice Iones did not write the name of my Lord Chief Justice Richardson yet in discourse named him to be the man that said The point in proof is not whether they be Priests or no Priests Sir Nath. Ritch Here is a charge of a high nature on the Judges by Mr. Long. That Mr. Long now may make good his Charge or suffer for it for there were witnesses enough in the Court. Ordered Mr. Long to be here on Thurseday Morning Ordered That the Justices about this time shall be required to deliver in the names of all Recusants remaining about the Town and their conditions and what Countrey they be It is Moved That the Gentlemen of the Inns of Court and of the Chancerie may give in their knowledge what Recusants are there Sir Iohn Stanhope That the Court may give in the names of Recusants there likewise by what Warrant these be about the Town and what publick charge of Office any of these persons have also what Priests and Iesuites are in any prison in London for they have libertie sometimes to go five miles to say Mass. Wednesday 18. A Publick Fast was kept by this House in Westminster where were three Sermons Thursday 19. MAster Dawes one of the Customers called in to answer the point of Priviledge in taking Mr. Rolles his goods being a Member of this
I conceive it plain these Customers took the goods in their own right not in the Kings In this Priviledge is plainly broken wherein it is easily determined Mr. Banks In this case there is no interposing of the Kings Right and the King this Parliament hath declared as much That the Courts at Westminster do grant 12 days priviledge to any man to inform his Councel much more the Court of Parliament are to have their Priviledge The Kings Command cannot extend to authorize any man to break the Priviledges no more than it will warrant an entrie upon any mans Land without process of Law Mr. Soliciter If the King have no Right how can he make a Lease then this pretended interest of the Customers must needs be void and therefore the goods must not be taken on their own right but in the right of the King Mr. Selden If there were any right the pretended right were in the Subject First whether Priviledge in goods Secondly whether the right were in the Customers onely Thirdly whether priviledge against the King 1. If the Lords have no priviledge in Parliaments for their goods then have they no priviledge at all for they are priviledged in their persons out of Parliament 2. For the point of interest it is plain no kind of Covenant can alter the interest and questionless had the cause in the Exchequer appeared to the Barons as it doth to us they would never have proceeded as they did 3. If our goods may be seized into the Exchequer be it right or wrong we were then as good have nothing Sir Nath. Ritch 〈…〉 recorded the last Session and citeth other presidents in this House that a servant of a Member in Parliament ought to have priviledge in his goods Mr. Noy saith that these Commissioners had neither Commission nor Command to seize Therefore without doubt we may proceed safely to the other question That the priviledge is broken by the Customers without relation to any Commission or Command of the King Secretarie Cook saith It is in the Commission to seize but the Commission being read it is not found to be there Chancellor of the Dutchie saith Mr. Dawes mentioned that he seized these goods by virtue of a Commission and other Warrants remaining in the hands of Sir Iohn Elliot that therefore these Warrants may be seen whether there be no command to seize these goods Sir Nathaniel Ritch This days debate much joyeth me specially the motion made by Mr. Noy whereby it is plain we have a way open to go to this question without relation to the Kings Commission or Command and desire it in respect there appears nothing before us to incumber the question Chancellor of the Dutchie desires again these Warrants may be look into before we go to the question Mr. Kirton In respect this Honorable Gentleman presseth this so far that it may appear with what judgement this House hath proceeded Mr. Glanveil I consent these Warrants be sent for and read but withall if any thing arise that may produce any thing of ill consequence let it be considered from whence it doth come The Privie Councellers are contented with this Motion The Warrants being sent for and read it is plain there is no Warrant to seize Mr. Kirton If now there be any thing of doubt I desire those Honorable persons may make their objections Chancellor of the Dutchie I rejoyce when I can go to the Court able to justifie your proceedings I confess I see nothing now but that we may safely proceed to the Question Mr. Secretarie Cook saith as much Mr. Hackwell argueth against Priviledge in time of Prorogation Mr. Noy saith he had no doubt but that Priviledge was in force in time of Prorogation untill he heard this Argument of Prorogation of Mr. Hackwell and saith that he hath nothing from him yet that doth alter his opinion and citeth a cause wherein the Lords House hath this verie Prorogation adjudged the Priviledge Mr. Hackwell saith he is glad to hear it is so and he is now of the same opinion Decided by Question That Mr. Rolles ought to have Priviledge of Parliament for his goods seised 30 Octob. 5 Iac. and all sithence This Committee is adjourned untill Munday and the Customers to attend The Protestation of the COMMONS in Parliament on Munday 2. Mar. 1628. 1. WHosoever shall bring in an Innovation in Religion or by favour or countenance seek to extend or introduce Poperie or Arminianisme or other Opinion differing from the true and orthodox profession of our Church shall be reputed a Capital enemie to this Kingdom and Common-wealth 2. Whosoever shall counsel or advise the taking or leavying of the Subsedies of Tonage and Poundage not being granted by Parliament or shall be an Actor or an Instrument therein shall likewise be reputed an Innovator in the Government and a Capital enemie to the Kingdom and Common-wealth 3. If any Merchant or other person whatsoever shall voluntarily yield or pay the said Subsedie of Tonnage or Poundage not being granted by Parliament he shall likewise be reputed a Betrayer of the Liberties of England and an enemie to the same THE KINGS SPEECH in the House of PARLIAMENT Mar. 10. 1628. to Dissolve it My LORDS I Never came here upon so unpleasing occasion it being for the Dissolving of a PARLIAMENT therefore many may wonder why I did not rather choose to do this by my Commission it being the general Maxim of Kings to lay harsh commands by their Ministers themselves onely executing pleasing things But considering that Justice is as well in Commanding of Virtue as Punishing of Vice I thought it necessarie to come here to day to declare to you my Lords and all the world That it was onely the disobedient carriage of the Lower House that hath caused this Dissolution at this time and that you My Lords are so far from being causers of it that I have as much comfort in your Obedience manifested by all your carriage towards me as I have cause to distaste their proceedings Yet that I may be clearly understood I must needs say they do mistake me wondrously that think I lay this fault equally on all the Lower House for I know there are many there as dutifull Loyal Subjects as any are in the world I know that it was onely some Viâ—pers among them that did cast this mist of disobedience before their eyes although there were some there that could not be infected with this Contagion insomuch that some by their speaking which indeed was the general fault on the last day of the House did shew their obedience To conclude my Lords as those ill-affected persons must look for their reward so you that are here of the Higher House may justly claim from me that protection and favour that a good King bears to his Loyal and Faithfull Subjects and Nobilitie Now my Lords execute that which I Command you Lord KEEPER MY Lords and Gentlemen of the House of Commons the KINGS Majestie