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lord_n act_n king_n parliament_n 21,424 5 7.0688 4 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A69753 The generall demands, of the reverend doctors of divinitie, and ministers of the Gospell in Aberdene, concerning the late covenant, in Scotland together, with the answeres, replyes, and duplyes that followed thereupon, in the year, 1638 : reprinted in one book, by order of Parliament. Forbes, John, 1593-1648.; Henderson, Alexander, 1583?-1646. 1663 (1663) Wing C4226; Wing C4225; ESTC R6298 125,063 170

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scandal_n of_o dissent_v from_o other_o reform_a kirk_n and_o famous_a divyne_n 2._o the_o scandal_n of_o dissent_v from_o authority_n 3._o the_o scandal_n of_o perjury_n we_o answer_v that_o the_o controvert_v word_n of_o the_o covenant_n be_v right_o conceive_v and_o interpret_v according_a to_o their_o true_a meaning_n and_o not_o after_o the_o gloss_n which_o you_o have_v put_v upon_o they_o do_v put_v you_o out_o of_o danger_n of_o all_o the_o three_o scandal_n which_o you_o seem_v to_o acknowledge_v of_o the_o first_o two_o and_o may_v by_o the_o like_a reason_n acknowledge_v of_o the_o three_o of_o perjury_n we_o dispute_v not_o of_o the_o lawfulness_n of_o the_o oath_n give_v at_o your_o admission_n by_o what_o authority_n it_o be_v exact_v with_o what_o conscience_n it_o be_v give_v nor_o how_o you_o can_v answer_v for_o the_o scandal_n rise_v thereupon_o but_o conceive_v
thereto_o by_o prejudice_n then_o at_o satisfaction_n by_o search_v of_o the_o truth_n this_o reason_n be_v ground_v upon_o a_o mistake_n for_o although_o our_o demand_n at_o the_o first_o be_v intend_v for_o you_o only_o yet_o afterward_o we_o resolve_v to_o print_v they_o as_o also_o our_o reply_v the_o print_v whereof_o do_v nowayes_o depend_v upon_o your_o second_o answer_n not_o for_o love_v of_o contention_n nor_o desire_n of_o victory_n god_n know_v but_o for_o such_o reason_n as_o we_o have_v express_v in_o our_o preface_n to_o the_o unpartial_a reader_n who_o we_o hope_v we_o have_v satisfy_v in_o this_o point_n your_o other_o reason_n be_v that_o the_o ground_n of_o your_o answer_n to_o we_o have_v prove_v satisfactory_a to_o other_o who_o for_o age_n and_o learning_n be_v prime_a man_n of_o this_o kingdom_n and_o to_o who_o our_o modesty_n will_v not_o suffer_v we_o to_o prefer_v ourselves_o far_o be_v it_o from_o we_o to_o be_v so_o presumptuous_a as_o to_o prefer_v ourselves_o to_o so_o many_o learned_a and_o worthy_a divine_n and_o as_o far_o be_v it_o from_o we_o to_o measure_v the_o solidity_n and_o sufficiency_n of_o your_o answer_n by_o the_o hability_n or_o indument_n of_o these_o who_o have_v acquiesce_v in_o they_o if_o this_o your_o reason_n be_v good_a the_o papist_n may_v more_o probable_o accuse_v we_o of_o prejudice_n as_o indeed_o they_o unjustlie_o do_v because_o their_o answer_n to_o our_o argument_n have_v prove_v satisfactory_a to_o many_o thousand_o of_o those_o who_o for_o profundity_n and_o subtility_n of_o wit_n be_v inferior_a to_o none_o of_o the_o world_n but_o we_o regard_v not_o this_o slender_a motive_n remember_v these_o word_n of_o our_o saviour_n i_o thank_v thou_o o_o father_n lord_n of_o heaven_n and_o earth_n because_o thou_o have_v hide_v these_o thing_n from_o the_o wise_a and_o prudent_a and_o have_v reveal_v they_o unto_o babe_n even_o so_o o_o father_n for_o so_o it_o seem_v good_a in_o thy_o sight_n beside_o if_o you_o compare_v the_o divine_n ancient_a and_o modern_a who_o be_v of_o our_o judgement_n with_o these_o who_o favour_n your_o opinion_n either_o in_o number_n or_o in_o the_o excellency_n of_o their_o gift_n you_o shall_v find_v that_o in_o this_o the_o advantage_n be_v great_o we_o in_o the_o mean_a time_n you_o shall_v know_v that_o we_o can_v bring_v far_o better_a reason_n to_o free_v ourselves_o of_o prejudice_n than_o these_o which_o you_o have_v bring_v against_o we_o to_o wit_n the_o solidity_n of_o our_o argument_n which_o have_v put_v you_o to_o such_o strait_n pardon_v we_o to_o say_v that_o which_o every_o one_o who_o have_v eye_n may_v see_v that_o oft_o time_n you_o do_v not_o so_o much_o as_o attempt_v to_o answer_v they_o be_v glad_a to_o pass_v they_o by_o with_o the_o show_n of_o a_o argument_n in_o contrarium_fw-la or_o some_o other_o like_o shift_n our_o humble_a &_o earnest_a attestation_n in_o call_v god_n the_o only_a competent_a judge_n as_o witness_v of_o our_o sincerity_n in_o the_o inmost_a thought_n of_o our_o soul_n our_o serious_o profess_a resolution_n to_o concur_v with_o you_o if_o we_o shall_v get_v satisfaction_n from_o you_o the_o modesty_n ingenuity_n and_o peaceablenesse_n of_o our_o write_n to_o you_o and_o on_o the_o contrary_a your_o too_o great_a disdainfulness_n and_o asperitie_n in_o your_o second_o answer_n betray_v not_o only_o the_o weakness_n of_o your_o mind_n far_o by_o our_o expectation_n but_o also_o the_o weakness_n of_o your_o cause_n to_o unpartial_a reader_n who_o ascrive_v this_o to_o the_o pungent_a force_n of_o our_o argument_n judge_v that_o they_o have_v make_v you_o somewhat_o more_o choleric_a than_o you_o be_v before_o to_o this_o we_o will_v add_v the_o great_a reluctance_n which_o some_o of_o the_o most_o judicious_a subscribent_n do_v find_v in_o their_o conscience_n before_o they_o subscrive_v your_o covenant_n together_o with_o the_o limitation_n and_o reservation_n wherewith_o they_o subscrive_v it_o evident_o argue_v their_o strong_a apprehension_n of_o the_o dangerous_a ambiguity_n and_o haske_n sound_v of_o the_o word_n of_o the_o late_a covenant_n so_o that_o even_o these_o who_o be_v now_o join_v with_o you_o have_v be_v much_o affright_v with_o those_o thing_n which_o terrify_v we_o as_o for_o your_o protestation_n in_o the_o end_n of_o your_o epistle_n that_o you_o can_v no_o more_o be_v bring_v to_o our_o mind_n than_o you_o can_v be_v draw_v from_o the_o profession_n of_o our_o religion_n as_o it_o have_v be_v reform_v swear_v etc._n etc._n although_o this_o import_v no_o small_a prejudice_n possess_v and_o overrule_a your_o mind_n yet_o look_v to_o the_o invincible_a force_n of_o that_o truth_n which_o we_o maintain_v we_o even_o yet_o hope_v that_o at_o last_o it_o shall_v prevail_v with_o you_o especial_o consider_v that_o our_o controversy_n be_v not_o concern_v the_o reform_a religion_n whereunto_o we_o as_o sincere_o adhere_v as_o any_o whatsoever_o but_o concern_v the_o equity_n of_o that_o form_n of_o covenant_n which_o you_o late_o make_v wish_v you_o and_o all_o other_o to_o adhere_v true_o and_o sincere_o to_o the_o same_o true_a religion_n and_o to_o all_o the_o duty_n which_o in_o it_o be_v recommend_v to_o you_o we_o most_o humble_o and_o earnest_o pray_v the_o almighty_a god_n to_o pity_v his_o church_n in_o this_o kingdom_n and_o to_o unite_v all_o our_o heart_n in_o truth_n and_o peace_n in_o these_o most_o dangerous_a day_n which_o although_o they_o be_v to_o you_o day_n of_o gladness_n as_o you_o profess_v yet_o to_o those_o who_o love_v the_o peace_n of_o zion_n and_o the_o tranquillity_n of_o this_o kingdom_n they_o be_v sad_a and_o melancholious_a day_n in_o respect_n of_o the_o black_a cloud_n of_o god_n wrath_n hang_v over_o our_o head_n and_o threaten_v we_o with_o storm_n of_o fearful_a calamity_n which_o we_o pray_v the_o almighty_a god_n to_o avert_v the_o first_o duply._n in_o our_o dispute_n against_o the_o papist_n which_o have_v be_v frequent_a and_o by_o god_n grace_n not_o unfruitful_a as_o we_o have_v learn_v that_o to_o multiply_v objection_n against_o the_o truth_n be_v a_o thing_n easy_a as_o you_o say_v but_o fruitless_a and_o vain_a so_o also_o we_o have_v learn_v that_o to_o multiply_v evasion_n against_o solid_a argument_n bring_v for_o the_o truth_n be_v a_o thing_n no_o less_o easy_a but_o altogether_o unprofitable_a which_o we_o pray_v you_o take_v heed_n to_o how_o forcible_a be_v right_a word_n but_o what_o do_v your_o argue_v reprove_v job_n 6._o 25._o 2._o you_o say_v that_o our_o objection_n against_o your_o call_n and_o the_o warrant_n of_o your_o come_n to_o we_o be_v frame_v and_o publish_v in_o print_n before_o it_o be_v propon_v unto_o you_o and_o ere_o your_o answer_n can_v be_v have_v indeed_o our_o demand_n be_v at_o the_o press_n at_o your_o come_n that_o they_o may_v be_v in_o readiness_n but_o be_v not_o publish_v before_o yourselves_o in_o your_o sermon_n do_v public_o read_v they_o and_o dispute_v against_o they_o in_o audience_n of_o such_o of_o our_o people_n as_o be_v there_o present_a for_o the_o time_n albeit_o that_o write_a copy_n of_o they_o be_v deliver_v to_o you_o only_o and_o not_o at_o that_o time_n communicate_v by_o we_o to_o any_o other_o 3._o your_o authority_n which_o you_o acclaim_v be_v neither_o from_o his_o majesty_n nor_o warrand_v by_o act_n of_o parliament_n nor_o by_o the_o lord_n of_o his_o majesty_n counsel_n nor_o by_o any_o national_n synod_n of_o this_o kingdom_n nor_o by_o any_o judicatory_a establish_v in_o it_o and_o both_o in_o your_o first_o answer_n as_o also_o now_o again_o you_o profess_v that_o you_o come_v not_o hither_o to_o usurp_v the_o authority_n of_o any_o civil_a or_o spiritual_a judicatorie_a as_o for_o your_o multitude_n which_o you_o call_v almost_o the_o whole_a church_fw-mi and_o kingdom_n it_o be_v destitute_a of_o authority_n foresay_a make_v no_o warrant_n of_o ordinary_a call_n therefore_o you_o seem_v to_o pretend_v a_o extraordinary_a call_n from_o god_n allege_v a_o extraordinary_a necessity_n at_o this_o time_n which_o true_o we_o see_v not_o in_o any_o such_o degree_n as_o may_v deserve_v and_o warrant_v so_o great_a a_o change_n from_o the_o receive_a order_n which_o be_v public_o by_o law_n establish_v in_o this_o church_fw-mi and_o kingdom_n that_o say_v of_o the_o apostle_n let_v we_o consider_v one_o another_o to_o provoke_v unto_o love_n and_o to_o good_a work_n which_o you_o allege_v for_o your_o extraordinary_a employment_n import_v not_o a_o extraordinary_a call_n but_o a_o ordinary_a duty_n to_o be_v perform_v by_o all_o christian_n according_a to_o their_o calling_n 4._o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o the_o canon_n of_o counsel_n do_v so_o permit_v to_o pastor_n the_o care_n of_o the_o whole_a church_fw-mi as_o they_o must_v
to_o wit_n the_o forbearance_n of_o pearth_n article_n until_o they_o be_v try_v in_o a_o free_a assembly_n and_o first_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o the_o urge_n of_o the_o service_n book_n be_v a_o sufficient_a reason_n for_o forbearance_n of_o pearth_n article_n till_o a_o assembly_n we_o profess_v that_o we_o can_v not_o see_v the_o equity_n and_o force_v of_o this_o reason_n for_o the_o service_n book_n may_v be_v hold_v out_o albeit_o pearth_n article_n be_v not_o forbear_v at_o this_o time_n yea_o although_o they_o shall_v never_o be_v remove_v and_o the_o more_o obedient_a subject_n be_v at_o this_o time_n to_o his_o majesty_n law_n already_o establish_v the_o great_a hope_n may_v they_o have_v of_o obtain_v their_o desire_n 28._o you_o bring_v two_o argument_n to_o prove_v the_o lawfulness_n of_o the_o forbearance_n of_o novation_n already_o introduce_v one_o be_v that_o the_o article_n of_o pearth_n establish_v they_o be_v conclude_v only_o for_o satisfy_v the_o king_n and_o not_o to_o press_v any_o man_n with_o the_o practice_n of_o they_o and_o because_o the_o act_n itself_o you_o mean_v the_o act_n concern_v kneel_v give_v warrant_n to_o forbear_v the_o practice_n of_o they_o at_o this_o time_n when_o the_o memory_n of_o superstition_n be_v revive_v but_o this_o reason_n do_v nowise_o satisfy_v our_o conscience_n for_o to_o begin_v with_o the_o last_o part_n of_o your_o answer_n the_o memory_n of_o superstitious_a celebration_n of_o the_o lord_n supper_n be_v not_o renew_v in_o this_o kingdom_n for_o aught_o we_o know_v and_o if_o you_o mean_v that_o it_o be_v renew_v by_o the_o service_n book_n suppone_v that_o be_v true_a yet_o you_o know_v the_o service_n book_n be_v discharge_v by_o the_o act_n of_o counsel_n at_o his_o majesty_n commandment_n second_o the_o act_n of_o pearth_n give_v no_o warrant_n to_o forbear_v kneel_v upon_o every_o suspicion_n or_o apprehension_n of_o superstition_n re-enter_v unto_o this_o church_n your_o argument_n which_o you_o bring_v to_o prove_v this_o from_o the_o narrative_a of_o that_o act_n in_o your_o answer_n to_o our_o nine_o demand_n be_v confute_v most_o plain_o by_o we_o in_o our_o reply_n to_o your_o answer_n and_o we_o shall_v again_o speak_v of_o it_o in_o our_o duplye_n to_o your_o second_o answer_n concern_v that_o demand_n 29._o as_o for_o the_o other_o two_o part_n of_o your_o reason_n they_o be_v contrary_a to_o the_o very_a word_n of_o the_o act_n of_o pearth_n assembly_n the_o first_o part_n be_v contrary_a to_o the_o narrative_a of_o all_o these_o act_n wherein_o no_o mention_n be_v make_v of_o satisfy_v the_o king_n but_o of_o other_o motive_n take_v from_o the_o expediencie_n or_o utility_n of_o the_o matter_n themselves_o the_o second_o part_n be_v contrary_a to_o the_o tenor_n of_o the_o decision_n or_o determination_n of_o these_o act_n in_o the_o which_o by_o these_o formal_a word_n the_o assembly_n think_v good_a the_o assembly_n ordain_v kneel_v in_o the_o celebration_n of_o the_o sacrament_n festival_n day_n etc._n etc._n be_v enjoin_v 30._o we_o hear_v of_o a_o childish_a and_o ridiculous_a concept_n of_o some_o who_o think_v that_o these_o word_n the_o assembly_n think_v good_a import_v not_o a_o ecclesiastic_a constitution_n but_o a_o mere_a advice_n or_o counsel_n this_o apprehension_n proceed_v from_o ignorance_n for_o that_o phrase_n be_v most_o frequent_o use_v by_o counsel_n in_o their_o decree_n in_o that_o apostolic_a counsel_n mention_v act_n 15_o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d be_v express_o use_v verse_n 22._o 25._o 28._o in_o the_o counsel_n of_o ancyra_n can._n 1._o &_o 2._o the_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d be_v use_v in_o that_o great_a and_o first_o oecumenick_n counsel_n of_o nice_a can._n 5._o you_o have_v these_o word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d can._n 8._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d can._n 11._o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d in_o the_o three_o counsel_n of_o carthage_n can._n 1._o 2._o and_o 3._o the_o word_n placuit_fw-la be_v use_v &_o in_o codice_fw-la canonum_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la africanae_n gr●co_n latino_n passim_fw-la habetur_fw-la vox_fw-la placuit_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o from_o the_o greek_a word_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d the_o decree_n of_o the_o apostolic_a counsel_n be_v call_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d act_v 16._o 4._o yea_o also_o the_o civil_a decree_n of_o caesar_n augustus_n luke_n 2._o verse_n 1._o be_v call_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d edictum_fw-la placitum_fw-la and_o in_o the_o civil_a law_n the_o constitution_n of_o emperor_n be_v call_v principum_fw-la placita_fw-la instit._fw-la de_fw-la jure_fw-la naturali_fw-la §_o 6._o &_o 9_o quod_fw-la principi_fw-la placuit_fw-la legis_fw-la habet_fw-la vigorem_fw-la say_v ulpianus_n ff_n de_fw-fr constit._fw-la principum_fw-la lege_fw-la 1_o where_o quod_fw-la principi_fw-la placuit_fw-la signify_v as_o much_o as_o quod_fw-la princeps_fw-la constituit_fw-la 31._o your_o other_o reason_n which_o you_o bring_v to_o prove_v the_o lawfulness_n of_o the_o forbearance_n of_o pearth_n article_n be_v that_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o swear_v the_o forbearance_n of_o a_o thing_n indifferent_a in_o the_o case_n of_o scandal_n and_o sensible_a fear_n of_o superstition_n in_o other_o yea_o you_o think_v that_o by_o do_v so_o you_o have_v swear_v obedience_n to_o the_o commandment_n of_o god_n which_o forbid_v the_o do_v of_o that_o whereby_o other_o may_v be_v scandalize_v this_o reason_n move_v we_o no_o more_o than_o the_o first_o for_o as_o for_o your_o fear_n of_o far_a superstition_n it_o be_v now_o groundless_a and_o causeless_a in_o respect_n of_o the_o gracious_a promise_n contain_v in_o his_o majesty_n proclamation_n but_o although_o it_o be_v a_o fear_n just_o conceive_v and_o although_o the_o eschew_v of_o a_o evil_n just_o fear_v be_v a_o thing_n good_a and_o desirable_a yet_o we_o ought_v not_o for_o the_o eschew_v of_o 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that_o your_o answer_n to_o our_o first_o exception_n take_v from_o the_o obedience_n due_a to_o authority_n and_o from_o our_o judgement_n concern_v the_o administration_n of_o baptism_n and_o the_o lord_n supper_n to_o die_a person_n in_o private_a place_n have_v not_o give_v satisfaction_n 2._o we_o ask_v of_o you_o in_o our_o five_o demand_n how_o we_o can_v subscrive_v the_o negative_a confession_n as_o it_o be_v propound_v by_o you_o without_o contradict_v the_o positive_a confession_n approve_v by_o parliament_n hold_v a●no_fw-mi 1567._o since_o the_o positive_a confession_n chap._n 21._o declare_v that_o rite_n be_v changeable_a according_a to_o the_o exigency_n of_o time_n and_o consequent_o that_o no_o perpetual_a law_n may_v or_o aught_o to_o be_v make_v of_o they_o and_o the_o negative_a confession_n make_v a_o perpetual_a law_n concern_v the_o external_a r●●es_n of_o the_o church_n at_o least_o according_a to_o your_o judgement_n who_o urge_v the_o subs●riving_n of_o 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