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A00276 A dialogue betweene a vertuous gentleman and a popish priest [ ... ]pleasaunt and profitable, both for ministers and gentlemen, men and vvomen, old and yong, made by I.B. I. B., fl. 1581. 1581 (1581) STC 1039; ESTC S120239 70,214 160

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wel for of that minde haue I alwaies bene that it is no matter what we doe our selues nor how we liue for Christe by his death hath purchased pardon for al. Gen. Oh now I perceiue you are farre deceiued to thinke you maie liue at your pleasure and that Christe will be a baude to your sinne for Christe died not for vs to the intent that we should continue in sinne but that we * Rom. 6.4 should die vnto sinne and liue vnto righteousnesse● and let no man take such libertie by the death of Christ that he may liue as he list and yet goe for a good Christian for S. Paule saith * Gal 5.24 they that are Christes haue crucified the fleshe with the affections and lusts thereof and again * ● Tim. 2 9. all that will cal on the name of Christ mast depart from iniquitie Par. What are you there now I praie you let vs talke no more of that matter but let vs returne to our women againe which we had in talke but now me thought that communication did like me well I praie you by what tokens shall a man knowe a bad woman Gen. If she serue not the true God but false Gods of her owne inuention as did * 2. Chr. 5.16 Maacha whome her owne sonne Asa put from her authority and burnt the idole that she had made If she be as very a harlot as * Gen. 39.12 Putyphars wife which whould haue committed Whoredome with her seruaunt Ioseph if he had not beene the honester man Af she be as couetous as * Gen. 3.15 Rachell that was contented to giue another woman leaue to lie by her husband Iacob for a little Mandrago●as If she be such a one as Paul speaketh of that do wāder from * 1. Tim. 5.13 house to house idle and not idle onely but as a tatler and busibodie speaking thinges that are not comly If she be worldly minded wretchedlie giuen so drunken with the same that she set more by the carefulnes of the worlde then by Christ his Gospel as did * Luk. 10.4 Martha if she be as Popeholy as the péeuishe woman in the Popishe time that could not saie their Paternoster without a payre of beades If you find anie of these in a Woman praie for her that she maie amend her maners and haue grace to come out of the snare of the diuell of whom shee is holden captiue at his pleasure Par. I praie God amend them all and now you haue shewed me how I shal know the difference betweene a good woman and a bad I praie you let me heare what good councell you would giue vnto your women and maidens that might be a staie for them in their tender yeares Gen. I would wish them aboue al things first to seeke to serue God and leade their liues in his feare and by the example of Sara R●●uels daughter to fli●● vnto the Lorde in al their dis●●esses and to say with her oute of the 〈◊〉 of a good conscience * Tob. 3.16 thou knowest Lord that I had neuer desire vnto man but haue kept my soule cleane and from ●●●●●nely l●st I haue not kept company with such as passe their time in sporte neither haue ●●●iade my self partaker with their 〈◊〉 walke in light behauiou●●● husband haue I consented to take not for my pleasure but in thy feare and in any wise I would withe them to beware of gadding by the example of * Gen. 34.1 Dina the daughter of Lea which on a time would needs go abroade to see and to be seene and loste her virginitie before she came home let them beware of proud hear●● and wanton lookes by the daughters of Sion * Esai 3.16 which did walk with stretched out neckes coy lookes going tripping nicely and tinkling with their féet that these plagues fal not on them whiche the Lord promised the daughters of Sion that he would shaue their heades and discouer their filthinesse and take away the gorgeousnesse of their attire their Caules and the round tyres after the fashion of the Moone the sweete perfumes the bra●lets and the Wimples the bonnets the slops the headbandes and the Tablets the eare ringes and no●eiewels the costly apparel the vailes the crisping pinnes the glasses and the fine linnen the hoods and the launs and in steed of good smel giue them stinch and for their girdle a rent and for wel set hatre baldnesse and in steed of a stomacher a sackcloth and for their beautie sunburning Par. But what shal they haue for their Dublets doe you finde that mentioned in the Scriptures Gen. No I neuer did read of it and therfore I thinke there was no abhomination so great before Par. Why is it an abhomination for a Woman to weare a dublet thinke you Gen. The holy Ghost thought so when he gaue a commaundemente to the contrarie Par. I praie you what commandement is there for it Gen. This we may find writtten in Deutronomium that * Deut. 22.5 a Woman ought not to weare that which perteineth to a man nor a man that which perteineth to a woman for all that doe so are abhomination vnto the Lorde Par. Then by this saying it is no more lawfull for a woman to were a dublet then it is for a man to weare a Peticoate Gen. In deed as you saie they be both alike and both abhominable in the sight of God Par. I thinke our gentlewomen doe not know this that they doe now a daies so much vse it Gen. Whether they doe or no I knowe not but if they doe not it is through want of knowledge in the worde of God which is the cause of this and a great manie such faultes but if there be anie that doe know it and vse it I would wish them to leaue it if they set more by the fauour of God then they do by the pride of a dublet Par. Some there may bee that will reforme themselues if they haue committed this fault through ignoraunce but manie of them I thinke wil still continue as fine as a dogge in a dublet Gen. Well let them looke to this and all other such faults as they wil aunswere for it and because ignorance is the cause of manie of these faultes some there be that would frame themselues to better maners if they knew which way I would wish thē euerie morning before they attire them selues to set the bible before them as a glasse that they maie be sure to put on such cloths as they maie seeme comely in the sighte of God and there they shal see * 1. Pet. 3.3 the Apostle wil tel them that they must beware of embroidered haire or hanging on of Golde either putting on of gorgeous apparel and the hid man which is in the heart must bee without corruption of a meeke and quiet spirite which is before God a thing muche set by and after this maner
al the Phisitians in England are not able to cure this disease Gen. Why M. Parson where dothe it greeue you Par Oh at the heart at the heart Gen I maruell what it shoulde bee that doth take you so suddenly haue you not ben so troubled with it before Par. Oh no I neuer was in this case since I was borne before Gen. Be contented to tarrie the Lordes leasure a little while and you shall see that it will mend anon Par. Oh Lord help me oh Iesu help me God and our Lady helpe me Gen. Oh M. Parson that is very ill sayde do you not thinke that God can helpe you of himselfe but that you must intreate our Ladie to do somwhat for you in so saying you haue greatly dishonored God Par. Oh the Lord forgiue it me I confesse I haue offended him in it Gen. God bee praised that you are so soone reformed But I maruaile what it thoulde bee that doth trouble you so at this time Par. Oh it lieth heauie at my heart Gen. What should it be thinke you that doth lye so heauy Par. Oh it is my sinnes which are more then I am able to beare for now I feel my selfe pricked at the heart with griefe of my former life Oh Lord be mer●ifull vnto me a sinner Howe greeuously haue I offended so louing a father how wickedly did I enter into the ministery howe negligently haue I taught how vitiously haue I liued how many soules through my negligence haue gone to the Diuell and I haue bene carelesse and taken no thought for them oh forgiue me these mine offences or take mee out of this vale of miserye that I sinne no more Gen. Oh comfort your selfe and knowe that with the * Psal 130.7 lord ther is mercy and with him ther is plenteous redemption yea like * Psal 103.13 as a father pitieth his owne child so is the Lord mercifull to them that feare him Par. Oh how comfortable are these sayings nowe vnto me which sometime I loued not to heare thereof Oh my benefices my benefices that haue wrought mee this wo Fye vpon them fye vpon them fye vppon them Oh I was neuer so farre in loue with them as I do now detest and abhorre them Oh that al dumb doggs vnpreaching prelates popish priests non residentes and vnlearned ministers would learn by mine example to be wise in time Oh that such as can preach woulde preach and such as can say nothing would giue ouer the place whiche is vnméete for them Oh that suche as are set as Cyties vpon a high hill woulde preach Christe the Lorde and them selues seruants oh that this saying were not to true * Phil. 2.21 that euery man seeketh his owne no man that which is Christes oh that labourers might be sent into the Lordes haruest and loiteres might bee rooted out Oh that such as know nothing but to shear the Sheepe and feede themselues did nowe knowe so much as I doe for I neuer had such pleasure in keeping my benefices as I doe nowe finde ioy being willing to forgoe them You tolde me Gentleman that you thought your self happy to come in my company but I may blesse the time that euer I saw you Oh how much am I bounde to the Lorde the hath ordeined such a means to worke mee my saluation praised be his name therefore Gen. Oh the Lorde bee praised for euer that now I finde that in you which long I haue sought for My minde did giue mee that the Lord had his worke in you now experience doth teach mee that it is vnfeinedly true and I doubte not but you are now willing to forsake your benefices and to goe home with me Par. I am more willing to depart with them then euer I was to haue them and am so out of loue with thē that it gréeueth me to think on them and my desire is that I were so cleane discharged of them that I might neuer here more of them Gen. You shall not neede to take anye further care but ●●ntent your selfe and you shal haue that which is yours and be troubled no longer Par. But thinke you not that I maye haue my monye againe that I paied for them vnto my Patrons Gen. That question is not woroth the asking for they wil be farre from making a restitution that they wil not be knowen you paide any thing for them But I pray you what did your be●e sires cost you Par. I thinke my three benefices did stande me one way or another aboute a fiue hundred pounds Gen. What did they so Oh vnsatiable Symmonie I praie you in what order did they deale with you and with what shame lesse faces coulde they d●n●aunde monie for them Par. I haue of a long time kept secrete their counsell but now I will disclose their pollicie First you must obserue that my three benefices I had of three Patrons ● the first after sute made vnto him saide hee was contented that I should haue it before another on this condition that I would be thankful for the same and it should cost me nothing but my friends he said were contented to bestow the same vpon me and I should not be priuy of a peny that was giuen before the mony came to be paid and then I should reape the fruites of my benefice in two or three yeares after Another of my patrons would take no mony for hee knew it to be vnlawfull but if I would bestow a dish of Angels of Apples I shoulde saie vppon him when the time of the yeare did serue hee was contented I shoulde bee heard before another but the apples muste be very ripe and as yellowe as golde My third patron was counted a man of a very good conscience and he woulde no mony at any hand but his wife must haue a gowne and that made of Satten laid with a siluer lace and the coller stiffened with as manie olde angels as came to a hundred pounde and she was so in loue with the same that if it la●e in her she would neuer were other fashion and when her husband saw it he liked the stuffe so wel that he woulde haue a suite of apparell of the same making so that to make them this gorgeous suite of apparel I was faine my selfe to weare a thred bare coate I knowe not how long Gen. Oh most wicked and Diuelish deuises is there such chopping and changing buying and selling of mens souls but that the mercy of the Lord is aboue al workes the for so wicked an abhomination the earth doth not grone vnder vs as being wery to beare vs. Haue they such shifts to dazle the eies of mē or do they think by such means to escape the iudgements of God Let them know that when the Lord wil make inquisition for sinne and the secretes os al hearts shal be opened this their wickednesse shall shew it selfe and without amendment shal not go vnpunished Oh how happy are
you whome God hath drawne from dangerous dealings your happinesse is more then I can expresse you haue by these meanes gotten heauen and earth on your side the Lord himself doth fauor you the Sunn Moone will shew you a cheereful countenauce the earth shall serue for your pleasure the dew in the morning wil giue you a sweet sauor the flowers in the field wil cast you a pleasant smell The stones in the streetes are at league with you neither is there anye thing vnder the heauens that shal hurt you but all are sworne to your safety the Lorde shall send his Angelles to * Psal 34.7 pitch their tents about you so that al your enemies shal doe you no harme but death it selfe shall giue you the victorie when it commeth to playe his part it shall set you free from a greate many of miseries and * Apoc. 14.13 place you in an euerlasting happinesse But as for suche as continue in their wickednesse woe be vnto them it were better for them that they had neuer bene born for their state is accursed and the best of them is but * Mich. 7.4 as a brier or a rotten stake in a thorny hedge and though they florish a while as doth the flower of that field yet shal they wither as doth the grasse and * Esai 51.8 worms shal eate them euen as moths eat cloth and wool Wo be vnto them that through the stubbernesse of their hearts can not repente but heape vp for them selues wrath against the day of wrath and declaration of the righteous indgement of God * Rom. 2.5 which will rewarde euery man according to his workes Par. Then Woe the vnto all Patrons which buie and sell benefices Gen. Yea and happie are such Patrons as bestow them vpon such as are worthie of them and that take no monie for them but seeke onelie the glorie of God and the saluation of their brethren Parl Are there some such Patrons think you that doth so bestow their benefices Gen. Yea no doubt of it there are some such and that manie although because you haue not found them you think the contrarie Elias thought whē ther was a slaughter amongest the prophetes of the Lorde that there had bene none left that did serue the true God but himself beacuse he knew them not but the * 3. Kin. 19. ●4 18 Lorde tolde him that there were seuen thousand which he had reserued that did neuer bowe their knees to B●al So no doubt hath he now a remaant whome he doth preserue from that sinne of simmonie and do leaue it as a thing which doth highlie displease the Lorde the which number I beseech him dailie to encrease that the feete of the ministers ●●aie be * Esai 52.7 Rom. 10.15 beautiful and themselues mess●ngers that maie bring glad tidings of peace and tidinges of good things Par. I shall bee counted but a foole amongst my felows for playing of his part and they will make it a game to laugh at for dealing in this maner but the best waie is to giue them leaue and abide their skoffs with patience vntil the Lorde roote them out or giue them heartes of repentance Gen. You saie verie well it is our parts to * Psal 27.16 tarrie the Lords leasure and be contented to bear the railinges of our aduersaries for a while these daies will not continue for euer there will come a laughing time for vs when they shal weepe and howle for the miserie that shal come vpon them and shal be faine one day to saie of you this * VVis 3.5 is he whome we somtimes had in dirision we ●ooles thought his life madnesse and his end without honor but lo how he is counted amongest the Sonnes of God and his portion is amongst the saints these words shal the vngodlie saie with griefe of heart when themselues are tormented and you shal be comforted when you shal haue ioies vnspeakable and they shal be cast into vtter darknesse where shal be weeping and gnashing of téeth And nowe that you may set some order concerning your selfe and suche stuffe as you haue at home I wil send two of my men with you that shal deale for you as they woulde for me and in hope that it shal not be long before I see you againe Par. I thanke you sir moste heartelie and I praise God highlie that haue stirred vp such an instrument to cal mee to repentance I will ride to my benefices and discharge my selfe clean of them and with as much speed as I may I wil waite on you in the meane time I pray God blesse you and yours and continue that good mind in you which now you are of that you and I with al our housholde maie so serue God in this transitorie worlde that wee may ioie with him for euer in the world to come Gen. Amen FINIS A godly and necessary prayer into this booke O ETERNALL and euerlasting God which hast made thy dwellings aboue the heauens by the Scepter of thy mighte doest rule all the powers in the world all which should sound to thy praise and redounde to the honour of thy glorious name we most vile wretches whom thou hast made of the dust of the earth throw down our selues here before thy maiesty as vnworthy to be made thy footestoole submitting our selues vnto thee and acknowledging our sinnes we appeal to thee for mercye VVe confesse O Lorde that our wickednesse is great our misdeedes many our sinnes innumerable and thou art iust thy iudgements are ouer all the worlde and the punishments due for our sinnes are intollerable Forgiue them O Lord forgiue thē mollifie our hard hearts and gyue vs right spirites that we may see our sinne and learn to tremble before thy maiesty fear to offend any longer Oh be thou fauourable vnto vs or els we are lost for euer If thou be angry what may make vs merry if thou be offended how may we be pleased If vve haue lost thy fauour what friendship can help vs If thou withdraw thy grace from vs what good shal our riches do vs If thou be not on our side what shal we do with the help of man If we be whole in body sick in soule rich in substance poore in godlines haue the worlde at will and know not how to vse it If we haue such liberty to do waht vve vvould any yet so sinfull to do nothing as vve shoulde Oh the finne of so corrupt hearts what miserie vvill it bring vs vvhat vvoe will it vvorke vs howe many plagues are there ordeined for so great sinnes and vvhat a continuall paine vvill our vngodly pleasure purchase for vs O Lorde if thou let vs liue heere a vvhile in wealth ease to the end vve shal liue for euer hereafter in misery wo alasse that euer vve were born to see such wo●ul days oh far be that frō vs O Lorde and continue thy