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A41009 Kātabaptistai kataptüstoi The dippers dipt, or, The anabaptists duck'd and plung'd over head and eares, at a disputation in Southwark : together with a large and full discourse of their 1. Original. 2. Severall sorts. 3. Peculiar errours. 4. High attempts against the state. 5. Capitall punishments, with an application to these times / by Daniel Featley ... Featley, Daniel, 1582-1645. 1645 (1645) Wing F586; ESTC R212388 182,961 216

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gain nothing by their fathers or mothers faith but rather lose For if they remained still in their Judaisme not beleeving in Christ yet their children were to receive the outward seal of the covenant to wit circumcision whereby they were reckoned among Gods people and had such outward federall holinesse as that sacrament might give them Sith therefore this glosse of the Anabaptists no way agreeth with the scope and intention of the Apostle nor with the truth it selfe it remaineth that we admit of that interpretation which the best of the ancient and latter Expositors give of the text to wit the unbeleeving husband is so far sanctified by the faith of the wife and the unbeleeving wife by the faith of her husband that their children thereby are entitled to the covenant of grace and therefore the Ministers of God have a good ground and warrant to administer baptisme unto them which is the seal of their entrance into that covenant ARTIC 3. Concerning set forms of prayer ANABAPTIST NO set or stinted forms of prayer ought to be used in publike on private but all that pray ought to pray by the spirit in a conceived form variable according to severall occasions THE REFUTATION Though we condemn not all conceived or ex tempore prayer especially in private when we lay open our wants to our Father in secret and rip up our consciences before him yet set or stinted forms of prayer in publike are not only warrantable by Gods Word and verie profitable but in some case necessarie ARGUMENT I. What God appointed in the old testament as appertaining to his substantiall worship it being no part of the abrogated rites of the ceremoniall law may and ought to be observed by us under the Gospell But set forms of blessing thanks-giving and prayer were appoynted by God in the old testament and are no types and figures of Christ nor parts of the ceremoniall law Ergo they may and ought to be observed by us under the Gospell Of the major or first proposition there can be no doubt for that cannot be evill whereof God is the author and though the rites and ceremonies are different yet the substance of Gods worship is the same both under the law and under the Gospell The assumption or minor proposition is confirmed by the expresse letter of these texts Numb 6. 23. 24. 25. 26. Speak unto Aaron and his sons saying on this wise ye shall blesse the children of Israel saying unto them the Lord blesse thee and keep thee the Lord make his face shine upon thee and be gracious unto thee the Lord lift up his countenance upon thee and give thee peace And Deut. 26. 5. And thou shalt speak and say before the Lord thy God a Syrian readie to perish was my father and he went down into AEgypt and sojourned there with a few and became there a nation great mightie and populous c. And Hosea 14. 2. Take with you words and turn to the Lord and say unto him take away all iniquitie and receive us graciously so will we render the calves of our lips And Ioel 2. 17. Let the Priests the ministers of the Lord weep between the porch the Altar and let them say spare thy people O Lord and give not thine heritage to reproach that the heathen should rule over them wherefore should they say among the people where is their God ANABAP ANSWER The forms mentioned in holy Scripture were composed by those that were prophets and immediatly inspired by the holy Ghost such are not the composers of our liturgies and therefore the argument will not follow from the one to the other REPLY First the question is not now whether we ought to use no form but such as is immediately inspired by the holy Ghost but whether set or stinted formes either inspired or not inspired may or ought to be used in the church that they may we prove by Gods own command which must not be restrained to prayers immediately inspired and dictated by the holy Ghost for then none should pray but Prophets and by that reason as none that are not immediately inspired might use set forms of prayers so neither conceived or extempore prayers Secondly though none now pray by immediate inspiration yet we have now the spirit of supplication and we pray by the assistance of the holy Spirit and if our prayers in matter and form are agreeable to Gods word they are acceptable unto him and they cannot be unacceptable unto him hoc nomine for that they are delivered in set formes because God himself was the first author of them and hath left them in scripture for our direction and imitation Thirdly in our Liturgies a great part of the formes of prayer and thanksgiving used by us are formes composed by prophets immediately inspired by the holy Ghost as namely the Lords Prayer the Psalmes of David the Magnificat the Benedictus Nunc dimittis and the close of all our prayers The grace of our Lord Iesus Christ c. Why then doe they not at the least joyn with us in rehearsing these set formes If these may be rehearsed without quenching or restraining the Spirit why may not others also framed according to these patterns ARGUMENT II. Whatsoever the prophets and saints of God practised in the substantiall worship of God under the law may and ought to be a president for us But they used set or stinted forms of prayer and thanksgiving Ergo their practice may and ought to be a president for us The major or first proposition needs no proof because the substance of Gods worship is the same under the Law and under the Gospel and what the prophets and holy men of old did or spake they did or spake as they were moved by the holy Ghost 2 Pet. 1. 21. The assumption or minor is abundantly proved by manifold allegations out of the old Testament as namely Numb 10. 35 36. And it came to passe when the Ark set forwards that Moses said rise up Lord and let thine enemies be scattered and let them that hate thee flee before thee and when it rested he said Returne O Lord unto the many thousands of Israel and 1 Chron. 25. 6 7. All these were under the hands of their father for song in the house of the Lord with Cymbals Psalterie and Harps for the service of the house of God according to the Kings order to Asaph Ieduthun and Heman so the number of them with their brethren that were instructed in the songs of the Lord was 288. And 2 Chron. 29. 30. Moreover Hezekiah the king and the princes commanded the Levites to sing prayses to the Lord with the words of David and of Asa the Seer and they sang prayses with gladnesse The words of David are those which are extant in the book of Psalmes under the name of David the words of Asa are comprehended in those Psalmes which bear this title A Psalme of Asaph as namely Psal. 73 74 75
2. thou shalt not hearken to the words of that prophet for the Lord thy God proveth you it is true that argument with others makes a good proof There is no false prophet in the scripture the pen-men thereof were all true prophets and spake from the mouth of God I grant you they did yet by this argument alone you cannot convince an Atheist or a Mahumetan for in Mahomets Alc●●ron it is said that Mahomet was a true prophet and that the Angel spake to him from God you see to what a miserable plunge you are put if you have no more knowledge then meerly the translation of the English bible Secondly for the event of prophesies you speak of how prove you the event of them For the events of the latter prophesies are not set down in scripture as namely of the destruction of the temple and the dispersion of the Jews into all nations Travellers can testifie the truth of that Besides some here I doubt not can witnesse I believe it but these travellers their report and the testimonie of those witnesse you speak of are no ground of our christian faith you see therefore that you are still to seek and not able to convince any Jew Pagan or Mahumetan out of your translated bible without other helps of learning which you want Secondly I prove that none of your Lay-men who have not received holy orders may take upon them the sacred office of preaching the word and administring the sacraments The office of a minister is a holy office which none may meddle with but those who have a lawfull calling thereunto To which purpose I alledged divers texts out of the new testament before whereunto I will adde the fearfull judgments of God in the old testament which fell upon Lay-men who medled with the priests office As first the judgment that fell upon Corah Dathan and Abiram Numb 16. 3 Ye take too much upon you seeing all the congregation is holy every one of them and the Lord is amongst them wherefore then lift ye up your selvs above the congregation of the Lord v. 28. And Moses said if these men diethe common death of all men or if they be visited after the visitation of all men the Lord hath not sent me v. 31. And assoon as he had made an end of speaking all these words the ground clave asunder that was under them v. 32. And the earth opened her mouth and swallowed them up with their families and all the men that were with Corah and all their goods Secondly Uzza who put forth his hand to stay the Arke 2 Sam. 6. 6. 7. And when they came to Nachons threshing floor Uzza put his hand to the Arke of God and held it for the oxen did shake it v. 7. And the Lord was very wroth with Uzza and God smote him in the same place for his fault and there he dyed by the Arke of God Thirdly upon Uzziah who for taking upon him to offer incense which belonged to the priests office was stricken with a Leprosie that clave to him till his death 2 Chron. 26. 18. 19. 20. 21. And they withstood Uzziah the King and said unto him it pertaineth not to thee Uzziah to burn incense unto the Lord but to the priests the sons of Aaron that are consecrated for to offer incense go forth of the Sanctuarie for thou hast transgressed and thou shalt have no honour of the Lord God Then Uzziah was wroth and had incense in his hand to burn it and while he was wroth with the priests the Leprosie rose up in his fore-head before the priests in the house of the Lord besides the incense Altar And when Azariah the chief priest with all the priests looked upon him behold he was Leprous in his fore-head and they caused him hastily to depart thence and he was even compelled to go out because the Lord had smitten him And Uzziah the King was a Leper unto the day of his death and dwelt as a Leper in a house apart because he was cut off from the house of the Lord. Fourthly upon husband-men and heards-men that took upon them to prophesie Zach. 13. 4. 5. 6. And in that day shall the prophets be ashamed every one of his vision when he hath prophesied then they shall wear a rough garment no more to deceive But he shall say I am no prophet I am a husband-man for men taught me to be an herds-man from my youth up So you artificers may be ashamed of your prophesying and say I am a trades-man I am no prophet men taught me to exercise a handy-craft from my youth At this one Cufin being very angry said M. Doctor I am more lawfully called to preach the word then you and that I will prove by scripture You will have a hard task of it for neither my name nor yours are found in scripture neither is there any colour in all Gods word for any Lay-mans preaching much lesse such an illiterate artificer as you are He that is called by saints to preach is better called then he that is called by ungodly men But I am called by saints Ergo my calling is better then yours You are like the Pharisees who justifie your selvs what arrogancie and pride is it in you to tearm your societies a company of saints Neither were you called by saints nor I by ungodly men I am called by those who live in no known sins But you are called by bishops who lived in known sins Ergo I am more lawfully called then you Such a company of saints as you are two of your holy society was lately accused for a Rape How can you know that none of your society live in known sins who cannot say so of your self Much lesse of any of them For I appeal to your own conscience whether you and they in your prayers to God do not ask him forgivenesse as well for sins against conscience as for sins of ignorance as well for known as unknown sins besides have you no idle thoughts or fleshly lusts or desires in you I do not deny but I have And do you not know that these are sins I know they are Then by your own confession you live in known sins Though I know them yet I do not approve of them And can you prove that he who ordained me approved himself in any known sin He who ordained me was a learned grave and religious bishop who lived and dyed without spot or taint and I cannot sufficiently admire your boldnesse who charge him who ordained me with walking in known sins and approving them who knew not the man who he was take heed of these flanders the tongue that lyeth slayeth the soul. Whosoever he was he was but a particular man and Christ gave the power of ordaining to his church not to any particular men Though Christ hath
18 20. Hos. 4. 4 9. Mal. 2. 7. Ergo None ought to confound them ANABAP ANSWER By the Leviticall Law the Priests were distinguished from the people but that distinction is now taken away and by the Gospel any who hath the gift of Prayer and Interpretation of Scripture may both expound and dip and doe all such things as the Clergie of late have appropriated to themselves REPLY 1. The distinction of Priest and People is more ancient then the Leviticall Law and founded in the very Law of nature for the Indians have their Brackmans the Turks their Mufie●s the Heathen Romans had their Flamines and Arch-Flamines the Britaines and Galls their Druides Before the Law given we reade of Priests in Egypt and in Canaan and in Midian Melchizedech was a Priest to the most high God Gen. 14. 18. The Priests in Egypt had a portion by themselves Gen. 47. 22. Onely the land of the Priests Pharaoh bought not for the Priests had a portion assigned them and they did eat their portion which he gave them And Exod. 2. 16. there is mention of a Priest of Midian which had seven daughters 2. In the New Testament though the Leviticall Priesthood be taken away yet there still remaineth a distinction betweene the Clergie and Laitie for Christ Mat. 28. 19. giveth commission to his Apostles and their successors to teach all nations and baptize them and Iohn 20. 22. to remit and retaine sins and the Apostle evidently distinguisheth the Flock from their Pastours Act. 20. 28. Take heed to your selves and all the flock over which the holy Ghost hath made you overseers And Gal. 66. Let him that is taught in the word communicate to him that teacheth in all good things And Heb. 13. 17. Obey them that have the rule over you and submit your selves for they watch over your soules as they that must give account that they may doe it with joy and not with grief ARGUMENT II. That for which God inflicted most severe punishments in the Law ought not to be attempted by any that feare God But God inflicted severe punishments upon Lay persons for usurping upon and intermedling with the Priests function as namely upon Corah Da●han and Abiram Num. 16. 31. and upon Vzza 2 Sam. 6. 7. and upon Vzziah 2 Chron 26. 21. Ergo None that feare God ought to attempt any such thing ANABAP ANSWER These plagues and judgements fell upon the persons above named for other crimes namely upon Corah and his complices for their conspiracie against Moses and Aaron Uzza for his presumption and Uzziah for his pride not simply for those acts done by them which seemed to trench upon the Priests and Levites office REPLY 1. It is true that the former delinquents were guilty of other crimes For as Angels often appeare single but Devils by legions so eminent vertues are for the most part single and rare in men but enourmous vices are seldome alone Yet this no way dulleth the point of the argument For the Text is expresse that the particular punishments above mentioned were laid upon them for those illegall acts done by them to the wrong and prejudice of the Sacerdotall function For what saith the Text Corah and his company said to Moses and Aaron You take too much upon you seeing all the congregation are holy every one of them Ver. 18. They took very man his censer and put fire on them and that hereby they encroached upon the Priests office it is evident by Moses reproofe ver 9 10. Is it a small thing that God hath appointed you to stand before the congregation to minister unto them and he hath brought thee neere unto him and seek ye the Priesthood also Likewise it is said of Vzza that he put his hand to the Ark of God and that therefore the Lord was wroth with him and smote him in the same place And for Vzziah the case is yet clearer for the Priests withstood him and said unto him 2 Chron. 26. 18 19. It pertaineth not unto thee Vzziah to burne incense to the Lord but to the Priests the sonnes of Aaron yet Vzziah will be medling with the censer and be burning incense contrary to the Law and thereby he incensed the wrath of God against himselfe and immediately the leprosie rose up in his forehead before the Priests in the house of the Lord besides the Incense Altar 2. I grant Corah and his complices couspired against Moses and Aaron but the cause was Moses and Aaron withstood his ambition and would not suffer him to arrogate to himselfe the Priests f●●●tion Vzza was presumptuous but for ought appeares in the Text he shewed it in nothing but this that he without any calling from God presumed to touch his Arke and doe the office of a Priest Vzziah was proud and it was the height of his pride which moved him to burne incense and not content with his Scepter to meddle with the Censer I shall adde no more to enforce this Reason then the Application of the words of the Oratour to Mark Anthonie I wonder Anthonie that thou art not frighted at their ends whose courses thou followest So I very much marvaile that they who doe such things as Corah Vzza and Vzziah smarted for feare not that they shall suffer in the like kind or a worse without repentance For although the earth open not her mouth and swallow them up as she did Dathan and his fellow Conspiratours yet Hell will open her mouth and swallow them body and soule And though God smite them not with temporall death as he did Vzza yet he will with eternall And though their flesh be not infected with leprosie as Vzziah's was yet their consciences are most foule and leprous in the sight of God ARGUMENT III. All that take upon them to execute the office of a Priest or Minister of the Gospel ought to have a calling thereunto Heb. 5. 4. 1 Tim. 4. 14. But Lay persons whether Merchants or Artizans or Husbandmen or any the like have no calling to execute the office of a Priest or Minister of the Gospel Ergo they may not assume or arrogate it to themselves ANABAP ANSWER Gods conferring gifts upon any man is a sufficient calling as for the imposition of Episcopall hands it is an Antichristian rite and giveth the partie ordained no power at all REPLY There is a double calling necessary to a dispenser of the mysteries of salvation Inward and Outward The Inward enableth them the Outward authorizeth them to discharge their sacred function Where thers are gifts if God encline the heart of the party to enter into the Ministery there is an inward calling yet this alone sufficeth not without an outward calling either ordinary or extraordinary Extraordinary callings sith Miracles are ceased we are not now to expect nor if any pretend easily beleeve or give way thereunto and therefore wee must stick to the ordinary calling by the imposition of the hands of the Presbyterie