Selected quad for the lemma: land_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
land_n	grant_v	king_n	tenant_n	1,714	5	9.7767	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A44019	Tracts of Mr. Thomas Hobbs of Malmsbury containing I. Behemoth, the history of the causes of the civil wars of England, from 1640 to 1660, printed from the author's own copy never printed (but with a thousand faults) before, II. An answer to Arch-bishop Bramhall's book called the catching of the Leviathan, never before printed, III. An historical narration of heresie and the punishment thereof, corrected by the true copy, IV. Philosophical problems dedicated to the King in 1662, but never printed before.; Selections. 1682	Hobbes, Thomas, 1588-1679.	1682 (1682)	Wing H2265; ESTC R19913	258,262	615

this pretence of immunity from contributing to the King but at their own pleasure for when they have laid the burthen of defending the whole Kingdom and governing it upon any person whatsoever there is very little equity he should depend on others for the means of performing it or if he do they are his Sovereign not he theirs And as for the Common Law contained in Reports they have no force but what the King gives them Besides it were more unreasonable that a corrupt or foolish Judge his unjust Sentence should by any time how long soever obtain the Authority and Force of a Law But amongst the Statute Laws there is one called Magna Charta or the Great Charter of the Liberties of English-men in which there is one Article wherein a King heretofore hath granted That no Man shall be distrained that is have his Goods taken from him otherwise than by the Law of the Land B. Is not that a sufficient ground for their purpose A. No that leaves us in the same doubt which you think it clears for where was that Law of the Land then Did they mean another Magna Charta that was made by some King more ancient yet No that Statute was made not to exempt any Man from payments to the Publick but for securing of every Man from such as abused the King's Power by surreptitious obtaining the King's Warrants to the oppressing of those against whom he had any Suit in Law but it was conducing to the ends of some rebellious Spirits in this Parliament to have it interpreted in the wrong sense and suitable enough to the understanding of the rest or most part of them to let it pass B. You make the Members of that Parliament very simple Men and yet the People chose them for the wisest of the Land A. If Craft be wisdom they were wise enough but wise as I define it is he that knows how to bring his business to pass without the assistance of knavery and ignoble shifts by the sole strength of his good contrivance A Fool may win from a better Gamester by the advantage of false Dice and packing of Cards B. According to your definition there be few wise Men now adays such Wisdom is a kind of Gallantry that few are brought up to and most think folly Fine Cloaths Great Feathers Civility towards Men that will not swallow Injuries and Injury towards them that will is the present Gallantry but when the Parliament afterwards having gotten the power into their hands levied Money for their own use what said the People to that A. What else but that it was legal and to be paid as being imposed by consent of Parliaments B. I have heard often that they ought to pay what was imposed by consent of Parliaments to the use of the King but to their own use never before I see by this it is easier to gull the Multitude than any one man amongst them for what one man that has not his natural Judgment deprav'd by accident could be so easily cozened in a matter that concerns his purse had he not been passionately carried away by the rest to change of Government or rather to a Liberty of every one to govern himself A. Judge then what kind of men such a multitude of ignorant People were like to elect for their Burgesses and Knights of Shires B. I can make no other Judgment but that they who were then elected were just such as had been elected for former Parliaments and as are like to be elected for Parliaments to come for the Common People have been and always will be ignorant of their duty to the Publick as never meditating any thing but their particular Interest in other things following their immediate Leaders which are either the Preachers or the most potent of the Gentlemen that dwell amongst them as common Soldiers for the most part follow their immediate Captains if they like them if you think the late miseries have made them wiser that will quickly be forgot and then we shall be no wiser than we were A. Why may not men be taught their duty that is the Science of just and unjust as divers other Sciences have been taught from true Principles and evident Demonstration and much more easily than any of those Preachers and Democratical Gentlemen could teach Rebellion and Treason B. But who can teach what none have learn'd Or if any man hath been so singular as to have studied the Science of Justice and Equity how can he teach it safely when it is against the Interest of those that are in possession of the Power to hurt him A. The Rules of Just and Unjust sufficiently demonstrated and from Principles evident to the meanest capacity have not been wanting and notwithstanding the obscurity of their Author have shined not only in this but also in Forreign Countries to men of good education but they are few in respect of the rest of men whereof many cannot read many though they can have no leisure and of them that have leisure the greatest part have their minds wholly employed and taken up by their private businesses or pleasures So that it is impossible that the Multitude should ever learn their duty but from the Pulpit and upon Holy-days but then and from thence it is that they learned their disobedience And therefore the Light of that Doctrine has been hitherto covered and kept under here by a cloud of Adversaries which no private man's Reputation can break through without the Authority of the Universities but out of the Universities came all those Preachers that taught the contrary The Universities have been to this Nation as the Wooden Horse was to the Trojans B. Can you tell me why and when the Universities here and in other places first began A. It seems for the time they began in the Reign of the Emperor Charles the Great before which time I doubt not but that there were many Grammar Schools for the Latin Tongue which was the natural Language of the Roman Church but for Universities that is to say Schools for the Sciences in general and especially for Divinity it is manifest that the Institution of them was recommended by the Pope's Letter to the Emperor Charles the Great and recommended farther by a Council held in his time I think at Chalon sur Saone and not long after was erected an University at Paris and the Colledge call'd Vniversity-Colledge at Oxford And so by degrees several Bishops Noble-men and Rich-men and some Kings and Queens contributing thereunto the Universities obtained at last their present splendor B. But what was the Pope's design in it A. What other design was he like to have but what you heard before the advancement of his own Authority in the Countries where the Universities were erected There they learned to dispute for him and with unintelligible distinctions to blind mens Eyes whilst they incroached upon the Right of Kings and it was an evident Argument of that Design

of Henry the third the Lords were descended most of them from such as in the Invasions and Conquests of the Germans were Peers and Fellow-Kings till one was made King of them all and their Tenants were their Subjects as it is at this day with the Lords of France but after the time of Henry the third the Kings began to make Lords in the place of them whose Issue failed Titulary only without the Lands belonging to their Title and by that means their Tenants being no longer bound to serve them in the Wars they grew every day less and less able to make a Party against the King though they continued still to be his Great Councel And as their Power decreased so the Power of the House of Commons increased but I do not find they were part of the King's Councel at all nor Judges over other men though it cannot be denied but a King may ask their advice as well as the advice of any other but I do not find that the end of their summoning was to give advice but only in case they had any Petitions for redress of Grievances to be ready there with them whilst the King had his Great Councel about him But neither they nor the Lords could present to the King as a Grievance That the King took upon him to make the Laws To choose his own Privy-Councellors To raise Money and Soldiers To defend the Peace and Honour of the Kingdom To make Captains in his Army To make Governours of his Castles whom he pleased for this had been to tell the King that it was one of their Grievances that he was King B. What did the Parliament do whilst the King was in Scotland A. The King went in August after which the Parliament September the 8 th adjourned till the 20 th of October and the King return'd about the end of November following in which time the most seditious of both Houses and which had design'd the change of Government and to cast off Monarchy but yet had not wit enough to set up any other Government in its place and consequently left it to the chance of War made a Cabal amongst themselves in which they projected how by seconding one another to govern the House of Commons and invented how to put the Kingdom by the power of that House into a Rebellion which they then called a posture of Defence against such dangers from abroad as they themselves should feign and publish Besides whilst the King was in Scotland the Irish Papists got together a great Party with an intention to Massacre the Protestants there and had laid a Design for the seizing of Dublin Castle in October the 20 th where the King's Officers of the Government of that Countrey made their Residence and had effected it had it not been discovered the night before The manner of the Discovery and the Murders they committed in the Country afterwards I need not tell you since the whole Story of it is extant B. I wonder they did not expect and provide for a Rebellion in Ireland as soon as they began to quarrel with the King in England for was there any body so ignorant as not to know that the Irish Papists did long for a change of Religion there as well as the Presbyterians in England Or that in general the Irish Nation did hate the name of Subjection to England Or would longer be quiet than they feared an Army out of England to chastise them What better time then could they take for their Rebellion than this wherein they were encouraged not only by our weakness caused by this division between the King and his Parliament but also by the Example of the Presbyterians both of the Scotch and English Nation But what did the Parliament do upon this occasion in the King's absence A. Nothing but consider what use they might make of it to their own ends partly by imputing it to the King 's evil Counsellors and partly by occasion thereof to demand of the King the power of pressing and ordering of Soldiers which power whosoever has has also without doubt the whole Sovereignty B. When came the King back A. He came back the 25 th of November and was welcomed with the Acclamations of the Common People as much as if he had been the most beloved of all the Kings that were before him but found not a Reception by the Parliament answerable to it They presently began to pick new quarrels against him out of every thing he said to them December the second the King called together both Houses of Parliament and then did only recommend unto them the raising of Succors for Ireland B. What quarrel could they pick out of that A. None but in order thereto as they may pretend they had a Bill in agitation to assert the Power of Levying and Pressing Soldiers to the two Houses of the Lords and Commons which was as much as to take from the King the Power of the Militia which is in effect the whole Sovereign Power for he that hath the power of Levying and Commanding of the Soldiers has all other Rights of Sovereignty which he shall please to claim The King hearing of it called the Houses of Parliament together again on December the 14 th and then pressed again the business of Ireland as there was need for all this while the Irish were murdering of the English in Ireland and strengthening themselves against the Forces they expected to come out of England and withal told them he took notice of the Bill in agitation for pressing of Soldiers and that he was contented it should pass with a Salvo Jure both for him and them because the present time was unseasonable to dispute it in B. What was there unreasonable in this A. Nothing What 's unreasonable is one question what they quarrel'd at is another They quarrel'd at this That his Majesty took notice of the Bill while it was in debate in the House of Lords before it was presented to him in the course of Parliament and also that he shewed himself displeas'd with those that propounded the said Bill both which they declared to be against the Priviledges of Parliament and petitioned the King to give them reparation against those by whose evil Counsel he was induced to it that they might receive condign punishment B. This was cruel proceeding Do not the Kings of England use to sit in the Lords House when they please And was not this Bill in debate then in the House of Lords It is a strange thing that a Man should be lawfully in the company of Men where he must needs hear and see what they say and do and yet must not take notice of it so much as to the same company for though the King was not present at the Debate it self yet it was lawful for any of the Lords to make him acquainted with it Any one of the House of Commons though not present at a Proposition or Debate in

King and both Houses of Parliament For the re-payment of which Money and Plate they were to have the Publick Faith B. What Publick Faith is there when there is no Publick What is it that can be called Publick in a Civil War without the King A. The Truth is the Security was nothing worth but served well enough to gull those seditious Blockheads that were more fond of Change than either of their Peace or Profit Having by this means gotten Contributions from those that were the well-affected to their Cause they made use of it afterwards to force the like Contribution from others For in November following they made an Ordinance for Assessing also of those that had not contributed then or had contributed but not proportionably to their Estates And yet this was contrary to what the Parliament promised and declar'd in the Propositions themselves for they declar'd in the first Proposition That no man's affection should be measured by the proportion of his Offer so that he expressed his good will to the Service in any proportion whatsoever Besides this in the beginning of March following they made an Ordinance to Levy weekly a great Sum of Money upon every County City Town Place and Person of any Estate almost in England which weekly Sum as may appear by the Ordinance it self printed and published in March 1642. by Order of both Houses comes to almost 33000 l. and consequently to above 1700000 l. for the year They had besides all this the profits of the Kings Lands and Woods and whatsoever was remaining unpaid of any Subsidy formerly granted him and the Tonnage and Poundage usually received by the King besides the profit of the Sequestrations of great Persons whom they pleased to vote Delinquents and the profits of the Bishops Lands which they took to themselves a year or a little more after B. Seeing then the Parliament had such advantage of the King in Money and Arms and Multitude of Men and had in their Hands the King's Fleet I cannot imagine what hope the King could have either of Victory unless he resigned into their Hands the Sovereignty or subsisting for I cannot well believe he had any advantage of them either in Councellors Conductors or in the Resolutions of his Soldiers A. On the contrary I think he had also some disadvantage in that for though he had as good Officers at least as any then served the Parliament yet I doubt he had not so useful Councel as was necessary and for his Soldiers though they were men as stout as theirs yet because their Valor was not sharpned so with malice as theirs was of the other side they fought not so keenly as their Enemies did amongst whom there were a great many London Apprentices who for want of Experience in the War would have been fearful enough of Death and Wounds approaching visibly in glistering Swords but for want of Judgment scarce thought of such death as comes invisibly in a Bullet and therefore were very hardly to be driven out of the Field B. But what fault do you find in the King's Councellors Lords and other Persons of Quality and Experience A. Only that fault which was generally in the whole Nation which was that they thought the Government of England was not an absolute but a mixt Monarchy and that if the King should clearly subdue this Parliament that his Power would be what he pleased and theirs as little as he pleased which they counted Tyranny This opinion though it did not lessen their endeavour to gain the Victory for the King in a Battle when a Battle could not be avoided yet it weakned their endeavour to procure him an absolute Victory in the War And for this Cause notwithstanding that they saw that the Parliament was firmly resolv'd to take all Kingly Power whatsoever out of his Hands yet their Counsel to the King was upon all occasions to offer Propositions to them of Treaty and Accommodation and to make and publish Declarations which any man might easily have foreseen would be fruitless and not only so but also of great disadvantage to those Actions by which the King was to recover his Crown and preserve his Life for it took off the Courage of the best and forwardest of his Soldiers that looked for great benefit by their Service out of the Estates of the Rebels in case they could subdue them but none at all if the business should be ended by a Treaty B. And they had reason for a Civil War never ends by Treaty without the Sacrifice of those who were on both sides the sharpest You know well enough how things pass'd at the Reconciliation of Augustus and Antonius in Rome but I thought that after they once began to Levy Soldiers one against another that they would not any more have return'd of either side to Declarations or other Paper War which if it could have done any good would have done it long before this A. But seeing the Parliament continued writing and set forth their Declarations to the People against the Lawfulness of the King's Commission of Array and sent Petitions to the King as fierce and rebellious as ever they had done before demanding of him That he would disband his Soldiers and come up to the Parliament and leave those whom the Parliament called Delinquents which were none but the King 's best Subjects to their Mercy and pass such Bills as they should advise him would you not have the King set forth Declarations and Proclamations against the Illegality of their Ordinances by which they Levied Soldiers against him and answer those insolent Petitions of theirs B. No it had done him no good before and therefore was not likely to do him any afterwards for the common people whose hands were to decide the Controversie understood not the Reasons of either Party and for those that by Ambition were once set upon the Enterprize of changing the Government they cared not much what was Reason and Justice in the Cause but what strength they might procure by reducing the Multitude with Remonstrances from the Parliament House or by Sermons in the Churches And to their Petitions I would not have had any Answer made at all more than this that if they would disband their Army and put themselves upon his Mercy they should find him more Gratious than they expected A. That had been a gallant Answer indeed if it had proceeded from him after some extraordinary great Victory in Battle or some extraordinary assurance of a Victory at last in the whole War B. Why What could have hap'ned to him worse than at length he suffered notwithstanding his gentle Answers and all his reasonable Declarations A. Nothing but who knew that B. Any man might see that he was never like to be restored to his Right without Victory and such his stoutness being known to the People would have brought to his assistance many more hands than all the Arguments of Law or force of Eloquence couched in Declarations