Selected quad for the lemma: land_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
land_n	case_n	pay_v	tithe_n	1,784	5	10.3560	5	true

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A78612	A pretended voice from heaven, proved to bee the voice of man, and not of God. Or, An answer to a treatise, called A voice from heaven, written by Mr. Gualter Postlethwait, an unordained preacher, taking upon him to exercise the pastoral charge, in a congregation at Lewis in Sussex. Wherein, his weakness, in undertaking to prove all protestant churches to bee antichristian, and to bee separated from, as no true churches of Christ, is discovered; and the sinfulness of such a separation evinced. Together with, a brief answer inserted, to the arguments for popular ordination, brought by the answerers of Jus Divinum Ministerii Evangelici, in their book called The preacher sent. By Ezekiel Charke, M.A. and rector of Waldron in Sussex. Imprimatur, Edmond Calamy.	Charke, Ezekiel.	1658 (1658)	Wing C2069; Thomason E959_5; ESTC R207673	108,343	141

to humour the people in their lusts Since among them they live and with them they have continually to do Whereas Patrons most of them live not in the places to which they present and have no power to put out whom they have once presented So that the power which hee claims for the people is far more likely to produce that evil than is the power of Patrons and instances might bee given that it hath done so But I forbear recriminating SECT 8. Of Tythes MR. P's fourth injunction to the Magistrate is concerning Tythes Away with Tythes that Old-Testament maintenance plainly distinguished from the New-Testament maintenance 1 Cor. 9.13 14. 'T is plain hee argues a Simili and like is not the same Gospel maintenance differs from Law maintenance in the very kinde Tythes are a legal Jewish Popish way of maintenance Either Tythes are paid by the light of nature or Moral command or else by a Ceremonial precept But not by either of the two former The instances of Abrahams and Jacobs paring them before the Law are not sufficient for Circumcision and Sacrifices were then and yet part of the Ceremonial ●aw and the institution of our Saviour Luke 10.7 urged 1 C●r 9.14 and explained Gal. 6.6 will not stand with Tythes These are out of the seed of the land the fruit of the Trees or the herd or the flock the Gospel-maintenance is raised out of all good things Therefore Tythes belong to the Ceremonial Law which to practise is to dig Christ out of his grave and a Character of Antichrist Neither will it avail for any to say that they take them not as Tythes for the Corinthians could not be so excused as to their eating things sacrificed to Idols c. Mr. P. knoweth or might know that there are several pleas for Tythes as the Ministers maintenance The Power and Laws of the Magistrate The right of Donation and The Divine Right And therefore since hee thought fit to give a reason of his excommunicatory sentence against them with relation to the last of those pleas hee should have done it in relation to the rest also Else though it shall happen that his strong arguing may cause men to quit them with one hand on the last account yet the other pleas being not impugned by him in particular they may hold them with the other hand on their account and so his away with Tythes may lose its labour Two Cords may hold them though the edge of his arguing should bee so keen as to cut the other 1 The Magistrates Power and Authority is generally acknowledged to have been given them by God in relation to the good of the Church and cannot fairly bee denied to extend it self by his appointment to the Teachers as well as to the taught in it Those must live and bee maintained as well as these the text hee quotes evinceth this 1 Cor. 9.13 14. and Magistrates are to take care that what God hath appointed may bee performed how are they else Ministers of God for good without exception or restriction Now the even so in this Text leaving his apprehension of the farther sense of it to bee considered under the last plea implies clearly that a set determinate and sufficient maintenance is to bee assigned and paid to the Ministers of Christ and established for them for such a one there was injoyed by the Ministers of holy things under the Law and surely the effecting of this falls under the Christian Magistrates care and is within the verge of his power But now certainly there is no reason why the Magistrate may not appoint as well a tenth as a ninth or an eleventh to bee the Ministers maintenance And having so fair a precedent before them as the determinate proportion once allotted by God to his Ministers n. a Tenth and no other mentioned in Scripture No reason can bee given supposing them not to consider that allotment as binding now why they should not pitch upon this rather than any other The equity of that proportion doth undoubtedly still remain it is the proportion which the wisdome of God chose and hee hath no where forbidden them to pitch upon that proportion or pointed out any other therefore that proportion they may best pitch upon and establish to bee the Ministers maintenance This proportion Christian Magistrates and ours in particular have pitched upon and established by Laws to be the Ministers maintenance and that out of the increase of the land which might easily be proved to be the most fit certain Maintenance the most suitable to al incident conditions of the land that can be found And why upon this account may not Tythes bee appointed and maintained by the Magistrates required by the Ministers and payed by the People What Law of God do those or these sin against herein Suppose the determinate proportion and way of maintenance not expressed and determined by God now in New-Testament-daies but onely that there should bee a fit Maintenance Doth not the determining of the way and proportion of maintenance belong to the Magistrate And is this way and proportion Jewish when they pitch not upon it on the Jewish account as any way a part of or subservient to the Ceremonial Law Or is it oppressive and unreasonable as some complain seeing it is the equitable way which the wisdome of God once appointed for his Ministers maintenance Is not here a sufficient bottome for any mans spirit to rest upon in relation to Tythes But if this were not enough 2 None can deny that men may give away and perpetually bequeath to others the tenth part of the profits of their goods lands and inheritances If any man of Mr. P's Congregation should bequeath to him and his Successours the future Pastors of that Congregation the tenth part of his own proper revenues for ever might not hee and his Successors lawfully claim and injoy it would not their title bee good to it Now thus it is in the case of Ministers claiming and taking Tythes in England as is sufficiently known to any that know any thing to purpose in this matter The first Monarchs of this Nation when all the Lands in England were their Demesn demised the Tenth of all the profits of them to the Ministers of holy things I shall here transcribe something of what is unquestionably recorded about it Mr. Treleyny of Tythes p. 13 c. Tythes are legally the Ministers own not given to him by the Subject as is now pretended but paid unto him as a rent-charge laid upon the land and that before the subject either Lord or Tenant had any thing to do in the Land at all It appeareth saith Sir Edward Coke by the Laws and Ordinances of ancient Kings and especially of King Alfred that the first King of this Realm had all the Lands of England in Demesne And at this time it was when all the lands of England were the Kings Demesne that Ethelwolph the second Monarch of the Saxon

race his Father Egbert being the first which brought the former Heptarchie under one sole Prince conferred the Tythes of all the Kingdome upon the Church by his Royal Charter King Ethelwolph saith Ingulph with the consent of his Prelates and Princes which ruled in England under him in their several Provinces did first inrich the Church of England with the Tythes of all his Lands and Goods by his Charter Royal. Hee gave saith Ethelward the Tythe of his possessions for the Lords own portion and ordered it to bee so in all parts of the Kingdome Hee discharged saith Florence of Worcester the tenth part of his Realm of all tributes and services due unto the Crown and by his perpetual Charter offered it to the three-one God The Charter makes it evident that the King did not onely give de facto the Tythe or tenth part of his whole Realm to the use of the Clergy but that hee had a right and a power to do it as being not onely the Lord Paramount but the Proprietary of the whole Lands The Lords and great men of the Realm not having then a property or estates of permanency but as accomptants to the King whose the whole Land was And this appears yet further by a Law of King Athelstanes made in the year 930. about which time not onely the Prelates of the Church as formerly but the great men of the Realm began to be settled in estates of permanency and to claim a property in those Lands which they held of the Crown and claiming so begun it seems to make bold to subduct their Tithes For remedy whereof the King made this Law commanding all his Ministers throughout the Kingdome that in the first place they should pay the Tythes of his own estate which hee held in his own hands and had not estated out to his Lords and Barons and that the Bishops did the like of what they held in right of their Churches and his Nobles and Officers of that which they held in property as their own possessions or inheritance So then the Land being charged thus with the paiment of Tythes came with this clog unto the Lords and great men of the Realm and hath been so transmitted and passed over from one hand to another until it came to the possession of the present owners who whatsoever right they have to the other nine parts either of Fee-simple Lease or Copy have certainly none at all in the Tythe or tenth which is no more theirs or to be so thought of than the other nine parts are the Clergies For in whatsoever tenure they hold their Lands they purchased them on this tacit condition that besides the Rents and Services they pay to the Lord they are to pay to the Clergy or those who succeed in their right a tenth of all the fruits of the earth and of the fruits of their Cattel and all Creatures tytheable And by how many Acts of Parliament Tithes have been confirmed to the Clergy on this account in the reigns of several of our Princes unto this day appears fully in the Treatises of learned Lawyers as also what care hath been taken for the true paiment of them These things considered it is evident that by Donation the Ministery of England hath as good a civil right to the Tithes as any other persons have to the other nine parts possessed by them And I fear therefore that many of those who are now so hot for the abolishing of Tithes would soon labour if they had power in their hands to extinguish Landlords Rents also Thus Tithes are made over and held may be claimed and ought to be paid on the account of the Magistrates lawful appointment determination and Laws and the right of ancient Donation in England And these two grounds well-considered are sufficient to satisfie any man that there is no need to take them away though the Divine right of them should not bee made good Sufficeth there is a firm civil right for them But yet because Mr. P. is so confident and peremptory in denying and opposing the Divine right of Tithes though as his manner is he answers not the many and weighty arguments urged by no mean Divines and Masters of reason for it I shall view what hee saith to that plea. Consider wee then that 3 Some plead for Tithes upon the account of Divine right alledging that this way of Ministers maintenance by Tithes was appointed by God before the Law and under the Law and is not repealed or any other substituted in its room by the Gospel And that therefore Tythes are due by a Moral and perpetually binding Law of God What says Mr. P. to this It is an Old-Testament maintenance Be it so this is that is pleaded The older the better as to evidence if it be not repealed The Sabbath is an Old-Testament Ordinance and hath no New-Testament Law exprest to establish it will he therefore say away with the Sabbath What saith he to the repeal of Tythe-maintenance It seems to me plainly distinguished from the New-Testament maintenance in that 1 Cor. 9.13 14. Plainly Every man hath not so good eyes as Mr. P. I see not the least appearance of any such thing in that text 'T is well he says to me plainly for I dare engage upon my little reading that no Expositor of note did ever see any such thing in this Scripture much less see it plainly Some of them have thought they have seen the contrary to this notion in it and have pleaded from the SO for the Divine right of Tythes but none that I know of did ever behold the maintenances plainly or indeed at all distinguished in it This sharpness of sight Mr. P. shall carry away the glory of Well but he will make us see it Behold we then 'T is plain says he he argues a Simili from the like and like is not the same Now it is plain to me that Mr. P. understands not the text and that he abuseth Logick though not out of ill will to it I suppose The Logick is too too bad even for a Midsummer Bachelaur For the axiome as used by him hath a gross fallacy in it A dicto secundum quid ad dictum simpliciter It is true that like is not cannot be the same Numerically but it may be the same Specifically and is and if Mr. P. had been better acquainted with Aristotle hee might have known so much 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 10. E● c. 3. Like things are not the same simply but they are the same as to species or kind Suppose then the Apostle to argue from the like when hee argues for a Gospel-maintenance from the consideration of the maintenance had under the Law doth it follow he must mean another kind of maintenance by that which he pleads for Are not Tythes paid under the Law and Tythes paid under the Gospel alike as Tythes paid and yet are not they the same as they are one kind of

maintenance May not Mr. P's Successor in his Church have such a maintenance as hee hath a maintenance like his and yet the same kind of maintenance But if Mr. P's Logick were as good as it is bad yet he hath no footing in the Text for his arguing hee plainly misunderstands it For the context compared with the text evinceth that the Apostles aim and scope is not to compare the maintenances as to their peculiar kind but to prove that maintenance is due to Gospel Ministers for their work as well as it was to legal Ministers for theirs A maintenance these had whereby they did live and had a subsistence suitable to their condition as Ministers of holy things and a maintenance thus sufficient whereby they may live as Gospel Ministers he argues those ought to have by the Lords Ordinance He that ordained that Legal Ministers should have a sufficient and honourable maintenance hath also yea and therein ordained that Gospel Ministers should have such a maintenance Gods Ordinance in this respect reacheth the one as well as the other and is accordingly applied by the Apostle to all Ministers of holy things as one in this thing vers 10. For our sakes no doubt this is written that is for the sakes of all Ministers of holy things God would have them subsist by a sufficient and honourable maintenance Thus this plain text is plainly nothing to his purpose But he hath more than one string to his bow Next comes an Argument that he thinks will doe the deed The summe of it is this Tythes are paid neither by the light of Nature nor by a Moral command for the instances of Abrahams and Jacobs paying Tythes will not evidence so much for Circumcision was of the Fathers and yet obliged to keep the whole Law and Sacrifices were as old as Cain and Abel yet part of the Ceremonial Law Again no Gospel-Law is inconsistent with a Natural or Moral Law but the institution of our Saviour for maintenance explained Gal. 6.6 will not stand with Tythes Therefore they are paid by a Ceremonial precept and belong to the Ceremonial Law which to practise is to digge Christ out of his Grave and a character of Antichrist Strange confidence this to build so peremptorily so deep so censuring a conclusion on such slenderly-proved premises Two Reasons he hath here why Tythes are not paid by a Moral command which pretend to overthrow two of those whereby they that are for the Divine right of them assert that they depend upon a Moral command 1 The instances of Abraham and Jacob will not serve the turn for it And why I pray We know the Priesthood to which Abraham paid was not Ceremonial and no Scripture tells us his payment was a branch of the Ceremonial Law The portion due to Melchisedecks Priesthood is due to the Priesthood of Christ it being after the order of his and so to Gospel Ministers as Christs servants If therefore Abraham in duty paid Tythes before the Law to Melchisedecks Priesthood are they not now to be paid to the Priesthood of Christ and received by his Ministers No saith Mr. P. for Circumcision and Sacrifices were before the Law and yet did belong to the Ceremonial Law and are abolished What a wonderful confutation is this For besides that hee saith nothing to what is commonly alledged concerning Melchisedecks Priesthood when that instance is urged doth it follow that because Circumcision and Sacrifices that were before and under the Law are abolished that therefore Tythes that were so are abolished also certainly by no Logick but Mr. P's For the two former we have express Scriptures declaring that they are abolished but not so for the latter It is not every thing that was appointed before the Law and continued under the Law and was not explicitely recommanded by the Gospel that is abolished for so the Sabbath it self should be abolished but what the declared will of God hath abolished Therefore Mr. P. hath but confirmed the opposite argument Abraham paid Tythes by command Mr. P. denies it not That command is not expresly and explicitely repealed as are those for Circumcision and Sacrifices Mr. P. doth not shew or say that it is What hinders then but that it should be looked upon as a Moral and perpetually binding command It must be his second Reason if any thing for his first says it is not in me 2 The Assumption says he is manifest because no Law appointed in the Gospel is inconsistent with a Natural or Moral Law of God But the institution of our Saviour explained Gal. 6.6 will not stand with Tythes these are out of the seed of the land the first fruit of the trees and the herd or flock The Gospel-maintenance is raised out of all good things that the person taught hath Tythes were paid the first tenth to the Levites and they paid the tenth of the tenth to the Priests c. This Reason is Mr. Hookers and saving the reverence due to so worthy a man may justly bee said to have no cogency at all in it Tythes may very well consist with Christs institution for Ministers maintenance as explained Gal. 6.6 For 1 Suppose this expression of the Apostle in all good things bee as comprehensive as Mr. Hooker would have it Yet it appears not but that under the Law Tythes were so paid No places in the Law of Moses that mention Predial Tythes do restrain the payment to them excluding personal Tythes The Law mentions the chief and comprehends under them the rest as may appear by considering that neither grass nor hony nor wax nor several other things that might bee mentioned are referrible to any of the mentioned expressions being neither of the seed of the Land nor the fruit of Trees nor of the herd or flock which yet no man doubts I suppose but were tithed Therefore Mr. Hooker could not on sufficient ground say that the Tythes under the law were not of all good things even in his sense Nay there is as express a place to prove that Tythes under the Law were paid of all good things as this Gal. 6. is for the communicating maintenance out of them under the Gospel which is Luke 18.12 I give Tythes saies the Pharisee of all that I possesse Is not all that I possess as fully expressive as all good things 2 May not Gal. 6. mean suitably to the Law In all good things that is in all things communicable and whereof a portion was to bee communicated to Ministers under the Law If it must bee understood in a limitted sense as who can doubt but it must in relation to many particulars where shall wee have a rule to limit it and bound it but the practice under the Law 3 What ever becomes of the Tythe under the Law wee are sure wee can match this expression in Gal. 6. with those whereby Abraham's and Jacob's paying of Tythes before the Law which is firstly to bee heeded in this businesse is

instructed and reproved Mr. L. one of his chief members who not long ago sinned against his Antipatronical doctrin For enquiring what course hee should take to bee settled in the Living where hee was hee in whose right hee held it being deceased and being answered by mee that hee must have recourse to the Patron Though hee then much inveighed against Patrons and declared that hee would have no recourse to him nor use him in this matter yet hee soon after addressed himself to him and procured himself to bee presented by him Quid non mortalia pectora cogis Auri sacra fames The Text Act. 14.23 whence Mr. P. queries Durst Paul and Barnabas impose a Minister on the people is mistaken by him but for once he doth not wrong the Presbyterian Author he quotes p. 72 73 which is a rare vertue with him about the import of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 For it is true that Reverend Calvin Beza and some others say that Paul and Barnabas are by this word to be deemed to have put the Election of the Elders to the suffrages of all in the Churches But others not a few nor mean hold that as they were Elders themselves and more than Elders so they chose and ordained Elders for the Churches by vertue of their Office as best able to appoint to them therein and that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 referres not to the peoples chusing by lifting up of hands but to the act of Paul and Barnabas who by imposition of hands ordained them Elders Scriptores Ecclesiastici saith Marlorat 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 usurpant pro solemni Ordination is ritu qui in Scripturis vocatur manuum impositio And indeed by the imposition of the hands of the Presbytery were Ministers put into office 1 Tim. 4.14 5.22 And as yet I have not seen one example of weight produced from Scripture of a Minister Pastor or Elder chosen by the people much lesse thereby constituted a Minister That Text Act. 1.21 c. reacheth not the case for the Apostleship is allotted to Matthias not by the choice of the Disciples but by divine decision and if the choice had been by the Disciples yet they were not all the Beleevers in Jerusalem but onely the one hundred and twenty who were all Ministers as hath been before evinced Act. 6 1. to 6. concludes nothing in the case in hand neither for probable it is as hath been shewed that the Deacons were not chosen by the multitude of the Disciples at Jerusalem but by the Presbytery and if they were chosen by the people it makes nothing here for it speaks not ad idem There is a wide difference between a Deacon and a Pastor though it were left to people to chuse their own Deacons yet it cannot hence bee concluded that de jure divino people have power to chuse their own Ministers Let Mr. P. consider what the Author whom he elsewhere so unhappily leans upon saies to this n. Mr. Bains in a place already quoted If any saies hee fail in any Office Diocesan Trial p. 84. Conc. 4. the Church hath not power of supplying that but a Ministery of calling one whom Christ hath described that from Christ hee may have power of Office given him in the place vacant Let the world as well as the Church p. 74 bee supplyed with Ministers according to Christ's institution But then say I they must not bee supplied with such as your self gifted brethren unordained for these are not Compleat Ministers according to Christs institution of which more afterwards And you have given no solid reason why presented Ministers that are tryed approved of ordained and sent to Congregations to administer Christs Ordinances should not bee in your account Ministers according to Christs institution That which is stuck at is the rights and properties of Patrons the taking away these is looked upon as a peece of injustice Remember Pharaoh King of Egypt and Sihon King of Heshbon how their hearts were hardened by abuse of righteous principles urging them against Gods command Mr. P. hath not yet produced a Command of God against Patrons properties And 't is a mystery to mee how Pharaoh can bee said to have stuck to righteous principles in oppressing so grievously the Israelites by whose means hee and his land had been saved from famine and refusing to let those injoy their liberty by whom hee and his land injoyed life and freedome Mr. P. hath a strange art in reasoning if hee can make it out that Pharaoh acted towards the Israelites as hee did from righteous principles I am sorry for men in these daies that make it a ground to break up Parliaments p. 75. and make Ordinances to preserve the right of Patrons c. Neither was that Parliament which Mr. P. intends broken up properly by any power but their own Nor was the reason of their dissolution either wholly or chiefly the preserving of the rights and properties of Patrons But the Committee having presented to this Parliament these proposals 1 That Commissioners bee sent down into the Counties and enabled to eject scandalous and unable Ministers and settle able Ministers in void places 2 That such as are or shall bee approved for publick Preachers of the Gospel shall have and injoy such maintenance as is already settled by Law 3 That upon hearing and considering what hath been offered to the Committee touching propriety of Tythes of Incumbents Rectors Possessors of Donatives or appropriate Tythes It is the opinion of the Committee that the said persons have a Legal propriety in Tythes Instead of concurring with the Honourable Committee a Party in this Parliament resolve 1 To put out of Office all the Ministers in the Land 2 To abolish the maintenance of Ministers by Tythes no other maintenance being provided in the stead thereof 3 That no Ministers should have been capable of being admitted to exercise their Ministery that would not have renounced their former call to the Ministery and taken up a new call from the People Hereupon the Major part with the Speaker resign up their power into his Excellencies hands whence they had it foreseeing that confusion and much evil would have ensued upon the execution of such Counsels Mr. P. would it seems have rejoyced to have seen them executed But not onely Presbyterians but also Independents that are not of his form blesse that hand of providence that disappointed them Sad would that day have been to England that should have brought forth the fruits of them His bitter insinuation that Patrons presenting p. 75. doth oblige Ministers to daub with untempered mortar and sew pillows under their elbows is very uncharitable and unreasonable Godly Ministers will bee rather ingaged by being presented to labour to edify the souls of Patrons And were Ministers chosen by the people and cast off by them when they please as Mr. P. would have it they would lye thereby under a far greater temptation