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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A08063 A discourse whether a noble man by birth or a gentleman by desert is greater in nobilitie; Nennio. English Nenna, Giovanni Battista.; Jones, William, Sir, 1566-1640. 1600 (1600) STC 18429; ESTC S112758 119,707 207

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great iolitie visite We may argue and say that if the Romaines did owe such honour vnto images much more was due vnto the liuing children because they were but an imitation of nature whereas nature her selfe was apparent in the children Now if this your reason M. Peter Anthonie had as much force in it as it sheweth I doubt not but it would appale me and giue so great courage vnto Possidonio that you might easilie persuade him he were wel worthy to haue one of these images erected for him And although that I shoulde frame no other answere therunto then I did to the last yet shuld I be still vpon a sure ground Neuerthelesse I wil vse such reasons in disproofe therof as I did to y e former For if thou saiest that their children whose images are erected to y e common view of al men do participat with their fathers vertues then I do affirm that thy allegation is true but if therein they differ then this their nobilitie and reputation is not transferred to them So likewise if the children of those who were represented by those images had beene worthy of such honour surely the Romanes who wanted no good counsell would willinglie haue granted it it followeth then that the honour was not done to the image whether it were of Marble or mettall but to the vvorthy memorie of his vertues whose lineaments the image did liuely set forth which could not be wel executed in y e person of their child being made in regard of their ovvne proper vertue and not in respect of any thing belōging to another Besides that there are and haue beene diuers persons who being descended of valorous and vvorthie parentes haue vvith shame darkened their brightnesse as we haue already affirmed And had it bin reasonable that the wise Romans should haue honoured those in such a manner in regard of their auncestors Surely no. And what wouldest thou say Possidonio if these men should lauishlie recken vp the worthy deeds of their predecessors or if they should publikely shevv their images wouldst thou indeed iudge them to bee noblemen God forbid nay so much more base ought they to be deemed that they hauing before their eyes the troden pathes which doe manifestly shewe them the waie to become noble they take a cleane contrarie course What doth then the worthinesse of bloud preuaile when as it is obscured by dishonest conditions And vvhat annoyance dooth the basenesse of bloud bring when it is honoured by noble vertues Surely none at all For in perfect nobilitie the obscurenesse or worthinesse of bloud is not to be considered But let vs proceed further thou diddest enter into the gouernment of cities and the administration of diuine offices saying that they were noble if I knew that this thy argument made any thing to the purpose I would willinglie answer it as I haue doone the rest but I will say nothing herein but that thou thy selfe vnderstandest not what thou diddest say for let vs yeeld it to be true what doth followe thereof Art thou I pray thee any of those gouernours Thou seest Possidonio how easelie thy strong reasons are resisted And art thou ignorant that many men oftentimes doe come to the degree of a Cardinall or of a bishop who haue no great store of gold in their cofers In former age there vvas no regard had neither of bloud as thou wouldest haue it nor of gold or siluer but vnto a man adorned with vertue whose life deserued praise As it fell out on a time in the Consistorie of Cardinals whoe beeing assembled in the Conclaue to chuse a newe Pope in his roome that was dead tvvo were in election to be preferred to that dignitie the one of them being descended of royall bloud the other of a meane familie Many of the Cardinals in regarde of the noble descent of the one would aduance him vnto the popedome and many in respect of the deserts and holie life of the other desired to place him in that high estate the one company of Cardinals opposing themselues against the other The latter alleadging that they sought to establish and create the successour of Peter a Preacher the son of a Smith not the sonne of Cesar Augustus In the end they hauing no respect to the worthines of bloud but to the perfection of both their liues the last for his Soueraigne vertues they contemning the great nobilitie of the other attained to the popedome Moyses did the like who might haue left his children the principalitie and dignitie but he made choice of Iosua vvho was not of his bloud to denote and signifie thereby that it is not bloud but the life of man that is to be considered therein Of which opinion amongst others was the Emperour Elius who would not permit that his sonne should bee chosen Emperour after him saying that the Empire did demaunde a manne worthie thereof and not bloud Vertue then and not nobilitie of bloud maketh a man of desert How manie Popes haue there beene who haue not beene of any noble stocke but issued of verie poore parentes as Felix the thirde whose father was a priest of a base linage Gelasius Agapites Theodorus Siluerius and many others attained vnto the Popedome albeit they were descended of a base stocke Yet was not their bloud so obscure but their vertue of as great woorth which made them merite so high a dignitie And there hath not beene onelie Popes borne of verie meane parentes but likewise kinges and Emperors and other valiant captaines Tullius Hostilius was borne of lovve degree who in his young yeares was a shepheard and was afterwards aduaunced to the gouernement of the Romaine Empire and vvas the third king of the Romaines Tarquinius Priscus was the sonne of Demaratus a marchant banished out of Corinth his natiue Countrie notwithstanding he became the fift king of the Romans Seruius Tullius who was borne in most base estate of seruitude was the sixt king of the Romaines Dioclesian Dalmat borne in Salone of a poore stocke became Emperor of Rome Likwise Maximinus the emperour borne in Thracia did descend of very meane parents Martius Rutilius was by bloud a Plebeian that is one of the common people and yet created Consull fiue times he triumphed ouer the Falisqui Cornelius Cossus was also by birth a Plebeian hee manfullie killed Laertes Tolomeus duke of the Fidenati whose riches and spoiles he consecrated to Iupiter Feretrian at Rome obtaining therein the second place he triūphed also ouer many nations Gneius Flauius his father was a bondman and yet he was created Pretor at Rome Terentius Varro and M. Perpennus Consuls Lucius Volumnus and Mamercus Dictators Q. Publius Philon Pretor all these did spring of meane parentes But their apparant vertue and singular value vvas so great that thereby they gaue great ayde vnto the Romaine common wealth The Soueraigne Orator Demosthenes amongst the Grecians was borne of one by occupation a Cutler scarce knowne amongst men And Euripides that most