Selected quad for the lemma: king_n
Text snippets containing the quad
|
ID |
Title |
Author |
Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) |
STC |
Words |
Pages |
|
A44185
|
The case stated of the jurisdiction of the House of Lords in the point of impositions
|
Holles, Denzil Holles, Baron, 1599-1680.
|
1676
(1676)
|
Wing H2453; ESTC R20018
|
41,330
|
118
|
as_o 37_o h._n 8._o the_o only_o print_a act_n of_o subsidy_n in_o all_o his_o reign_n which_o begin_v thus_o we_o the_o king_n majesty_n most_o humble_a faithful_a and_o obedient_a subject_n the_o lord_n spiritual_a and_o temporal_a and_o the_o commons_o in_o this_o present_a parliament_n assemble_v etc._n etc._n have_v consult_v together_o and_o determine_v to_o beseech_v his_o majesty_n most_o humble_o to_o accept_v and_o gracious_o to_o receive_v at_o our_o hand_n the_o simple_a token_n or_o gift_n which_o we_o do_v herewith_o present_v to_o his_o majesty_n free_o with_o one_o consent_n grant_v the_o same_o most_o humble_o beseech_v his_o majesty_n to_o accept_v the_o same_o as_o it_o please_v the_o great_a king_n alexander_n to_o receive_v thankful_o a_o cup_n of_o water_n of_o a_o poor_a man_n by_o the_o high-way-side_n etc._n etc._n and_o a_o little_a after_o they_o say_v wherefore_o we_o the_o say_v lord_n and_o commons_o do_v by_o our_o mutual_a assent_n and_o agreement_n with_o one_o whole_a voice_n and_o hearty_a good_a will_n by_o the_o authority_n of_o this_o present_a parliament_n give_v and_o grant_v to_o the_o king_n highness_n etc._n etc._n here_o then_o be_v but_o one_o consent_n one_o whole_a voice_n one_o hearty_a goodwill_n to_o give_v and_o grant_v and_o one_o act_n of_o give_v and_o grant_v of_o the_o lord_n and_o commons_o and_o yet_o the_o lord_n must_v have_v no_o hand_n in_o this_o give_n as_o be_v tell_v they_o at_o this_o conference_n and_o they_o be_v tell_v further_o that_o the_o thanks_o be_v give_v to_o the_o commons_o alone_o and_o that_o be_v true_a it_o be_v it_o seem_v the_o king_n pleasure_n so_o to_o do_v but_o this_o course_n be_v not_o always_o observe_v sometime_o both_o be_v thank_v and_o the_o law_n be_v they_o shall_v be_v so_o in_o the_o indemnity_n of_o lord_n and_o commons_o 9_o h._n 4._o nor_o can_v the_o act_n of_o a_o king_n use_v his_o pleasure_n sometime_o to_o vary_v from_o the_o exactness_n of_o a_o law_n make_v a_o alteration_n in_o the_o nature_n and_o force_n of_o that_o law_n but_o that_o still_o it_o remain_v the_o same_o to_o show_v what_o then_o shall_v have_v be_v do_v however_o the_o king_n be_v please_v to_o do_v otherwise_o and_o what_o will_v be_v do_v or_o at_o least_o ought_v to_o be_v do_v at_o a_o other_o time_n and_o now_o we_o will_v go_v with_o they_o to_o walsingham_n and_o see_v if_o history_n make_v more_o for_o they_o than_o record_v though_o neither_o be_v history_n a_o sufficient_a proof_n for_o thing_n of_o this_o nature_n neither_o be_v walsinghams_n or_o any_o of_o those_o monk_n write_n the_o most_o authentic_a history_n in_o the_o world_n but_o let_v we_o see_v what_o walsingham_n say_v p._n 475._o he_o say_v his_o diebus_fw-la clerus_fw-la &_o populus_fw-la primo_fw-la quintam_fw-la decimam_fw-la &_o postmodum_fw-la tricesimam_fw-la bonorum_fw-la suorum_fw-la regi_fw-la angliae_fw-la in_o subsidium_fw-la concesserunt_fw-la and_o p._n 488._o he_o say_v pro_fw-la confirmatione_fw-la harum_fw-la rerum_fw-la omnium_fw-la dedit_fw-la populus_fw-la anglicanus_n regi_fw-la denarium_fw-la nonum_fw-la bonorum_fw-la suorum_fw-la &_o clerus_fw-la cantuariensis_n decimum_fw-la &_o clerus_fw-la eboracensis_fw-la quintum_fw-la quia_fw-la proprior_fw-la damno_fw-la fuit_fw-la what_o do_v this_o signify_v but_o that_o the_o laity_n give_v so_o much_o and_o the_o clergy_n so_o much_o and_o certain_o the_o lord_n will_v be_v acknowledge_v to_o be_v part_n of_o the_o laity_n therefore_o the_o laity_n give_v they_o be_v comprehend_v an_o other_o quotation_n be_v urge_v from_o p._n 566._o the_o word_n be_v eo_fw-la tempore_fw-la incohatum_fw-la est_fw-la parliamentum_fw-la quod_fw-la protelabatur_fw-la inutiliter_fw-la fere_n per_fw-la annum_fw-la quia_fw-la postquam_fw-la parliamentales_fw-la milites_fw-la distulissent_fw-la diu_fw-la concedere_fw-la regi_fw-la subsidium_fw-la in_o fine_a tamen_fw-la fracti_fw-la concessere_fw-la taxam_fw-la petitam_fw-la grandi_fw-la communitatis_fw-la damno_fw-la but_o how_o they_o will_v prove_v hence_o that_o the_o commons_o give_v this_o subsidy_n alone_o be_v difficult_a to_o tell_v all_o that_o can_v be_v gather_v from_o it_o seem_v to_o be_v but_o this_o the_o knight_n in_o parliament_n which_o may_v be_v take_v for_o the_o whole_a house_n of_o commons_o hold_v off_o a_o long_a time_n but_o at_o last_o yield_v and_o give_v the_o tax_n demand_v to_o the_o great_a prejudice_n of_o the_o commonalty_n do_v it_o follow_v therefore_o that_o when_o the_o house_n of_o commons_o have_v pass_v it_o at_o last_o the_o lord_n do_v not_o assent_v and_o join_v in_o the_o grant_n certain_o no_o man_n will_v say_v it_o and_o for_o their_o last_o quotation_n out_o of_o p._n 564_o in_o h._n 4_o this_o time_n that_o subsidium_fw-la denegatum_fw-la fuit_fw-la proceribus_fw-la renitentibus_fw-la the_o word_n be_v these_o in_o quadragesima_fw-la sequente_fw-la rex_fw-la convenire_fw-la fecit_fw-la apud_fw-la sanctum_fw-la albanum_fw-la clerum_fw-la regnique_fw-la barones_n sed_fw-la proceribus_fw-la renitentibus_fw-la nil_fw-la actum_fw-la fuit_fw-la and_o no_o wonder_n that_o the_o lord_n dissent_v nothing_o be_v do_v yet_o whether_o this_o be_v a_o parliament_n or_o only_o a_o great_a council_n non_fw-la constat_fw-la more_o like_a to_o have_v be_v only_o a_o great_a council_n and_o that_o the_o king_n have_v propound_v matter_n of_o money_n to_o they_o as_o he_o do_v afterward_o in_o the_o parliament_n of_o the_o 9th_o of_o his_o reign_n to_o the_o house_n of_o lord_n and_o as_o this_o very_a writer_n say_v that_o he_o have_v do_v a_o little_a before_o to_o these_o same_o baron_n at_o london_n viz._n post_fw-la festum_fw-la purificationis_fw-la rex_fw-la accerssitis_fw-la londiniis_fw-la regni_fw-la baronibus_fw-la tract_n abat_fw-la cum_fw-la eisdem_fw-la de_fw-la regni_fw-la regimine_fw-la deque_fw-la pecuniali_fw-la subventione_n sibi_fw-la ferenda_fw-la sed_fw-la proceres_fw-la regiis_fw-la votis_fw-la tum_fw-la minimè_fw-la paruere_fw-la all_o this_o be_v but_o a_o great_a council_n and_o no_o parliament_n if_o so_o be_v walsingham_n give_v a_o true_a account_n of_o what_o pass_v for_o he_o do_v not_o mention_v the_o commons_o to_o have_v be_v summon_v at_o all_o or_o that_o they_o be_v there_o however_o be_v they_o or_o be_v they_o not_o there_o it_o make_v nothing_o for_o the_o manager_n purpose_n to_o prove_v the_o commons_o sole_a giver_n and_o then_o for_o what_o he_o observe_v that_o the_o lord_n not_o agree_v a_o act_n do_v not_o pass_v be_v what_o no_o man_n yet_o do_v ever_o doubt_v of_o the_o statute_n of_o 1_o e._n 3._o c._n 6._o where_o the_o commons_o complain_v that_o when_o they_o have_v grant_v a_o aid_n and_o the_o taxer_n have_v tax_v they_o and_o they_o have_v pay_v the_o money_n there_o be_v inquisition_n afterward_o and_o the_o taxer_n put_v to_o fine_a and_o ransom_n signify_v nothing_o to_o prove_v they_o be_v the_o sole_a granter_n of_o that_o aid_n and_o the_o 18_o of_o e._n 3._o n._n 14._o it_o be_v by_o agreement_n that_o the_o lord_n shall_v accompany_v the_o king_n and_o pass_v the_o sea_n with_o he_o and_o the_o commons_o they_o grant_v for_o the_o commonalty_n at_o large_a in_o the_o county_n two_o fifteen_o and_o for_o the_o city_n and_o burrough_n two_o ten_o the_o record_n say_v et_fw-fr pour_fw-fr ceste_fw-fr cause_n les_fw-fr ditz_fw-fr grant_n granterent_fw-la de_fw-fr passer_n &_o lour_v aventurer_n ovesque_fw-la lui_fw-fr &_o la_fw-fr dite_fw-fr commune_fw-la luy_fw-fr grantà _fw-la pur_fw-mi meisme_n la_fw-fr cause_n sur_fw-fr certain_a form_n deux_fw-fr quinzismes_n de_fw-fr la_fw-fr communaltee_n &_o deux_fw-fr dime_n des_fw-fr citees_n &_o eurghs_n etc._n etc._n this_o be_v sometime_o practise_v as_o have_v be_v already_o show_v both_o in_o this_o king_n time_n and_o in_o e._n 4th_n and_o once_o in_o queen_n eliz._n that_o the_o two_o house_n do_v agree_v to_o act_v several_o as_o here_o the_o lord_n to_o serve_v in_o person_n when_o the_o commons_o give_v money_n so_o some_o time_n the_o lord_n will_v charge_v themselves_o and_o their_o tenant_n apart_o which_o in_o those_o time_n be_v a_o great_a part_n of_o the_o kingdom_n and_o take_v in_o the_o clergy_n that_o be_v bishop_n and_o abbot_n and_o prior_n who_o hold_v per_fw-la baroniam_fw-la more_o than_o half_a the_o kingdom_n and_o the_o commons_o do_v charge_v themselves_o apart_o this_o in_o a_o extraordinary_a way_n which_o alter_v not_o the_o case_n of_o their_o joint_a gift_n when_o they_o will_v grant_v aide_n in_o the_o ordinary_a parliamentary_a manner_n as_o for_o what_o be_v say_v of_o the_o 36_o e._n 3._o c._n 11._o be_v but_o take_v out_o of_o poultons_n collection_n of_o statute_n in_o print_n there_o indeed_o it_o be_v say_v that_o the_o three_o year_n subsidy_n grant_v by_o the_o commons_o to_o the_o king_n shall_v be_v no_o example_n for_o the_o time_n to_o come_v but_o if_o the_o record_n itself_o have_v be_v consult_v with_o it_o will_v have_v show_v that_o the_o lord_n and_o commons_o grant_v this_o subsidy_n it_o be_v
for_o in_o that_o parliament_n we_o find_v nothing_o of_o this_o nature_n the_o complaint_n of_o the_o commons_o to_o the_o house_n of_o lord_n for_o their_o speaker_n be_v imprison_v and_o their_o desire_n to_o have_v he_o release_v which_o will_v not_o be_v grant_v be_v indeed_o that_o parliament_n but_o to_o hugh_n brice_n case_n 8_o e._n 4._o a_o clear_a answer_n may_v be_v give_v that_o what_o be_v therein_o do_v be_v by_o act_n of_o parliament_n in_o a_o legislative_a way_n the_o commons_o petition_v in_o these_o word_n please_v it_o therefore_o your_o highness_n by_o the_o advice_n and_o assent_n of_o the_o lord_n spiritual_a and_o temporal_a in_o this_o parliament_n assemble_v and_o by_o authority_n of_o the_o same_o to_o assign_v name_n and_o appoint_v the_o full_a reverend_a fader_n in_o god_n thomas_n cardinal_n archbishop_n of_o canterbury_n etc._n etc._n then_o name_v several_a lord_n both_o spiritual_a and_o temporal_a the_o three_o chief_a judge_n of_o the_o three_o court_n and_o some_o of_o the_o house_n of_o commons_o to_o be_v the_o person_n to_o examine_v that_o business_n and_o hear_v those_o complaint_n against_o brice_n the_o master_n of_o the_o mint_n the_o king_n answer_n be_v le_fw-fr roy_fw-fr le_fw-fr voet_n with_o a_o save_n to_o his_o prerogative_n royal_a conceive_v it_o it_o seem_v to_o be_v some_o derogation_n to_o it_o that_o the_o commons_o shall_v be_v admit_v to_o any_o part_n of_o judicature_n though_o by_o a_o special_a law_n for_o it_o for_o this_o be_v a_o perfect_a act_n of_o parliament_n in_o which_o the_o three_o estate_n concur_v in_o their_o legislative_a capacity_n which_o have_v no_o affinity_n with_o the_o judicial_a power_n exercise_v by_o the_o lord_n in_o their_o house_n as_o the_o high_a court_n of_o judicature_n as_o for_o his_o precedent_n of_o 2_o h._n 5._o where_o he_o say_v it_o be_v assign_v for_o error_n in_o the_o house_n of_o peer_n that_o the_o lord_n give_v judgement_n without_o the_o assent_n or_o a_o petition_n of_o the_o commons_o it_o be_v the_o earl_n of_o salisbury_n case_n to_o reverse_v the_o judgement_n give_v upon_o his_o father_n and_o it_o be_v true_a indeed_o it_o be_v assign_v for_o a_o error_n but_o it_o be_v as_o true_a it_o be_v not_o allow_v to_o be_v one_o for_o his_o writ_n of_o error_n be_v reject_v and_o that_o judgement_n be_v affirm_v and_o strange_a it_o be_v that_o he_o shall_v produce_v this_o for_o a_o precedent_n to_o prove_v a_o partnership_n of_o judicature_n in_o the_o commons_o be_v a_o strong_a one_o against_o it_o and_o as_o well_o may_v at_o any_o time_n a_o plaintiff_n bill_n in_o chancery_n be_v produce_v for_o evidence_n against_o a_o defendant_n in_o some_o other_o suit_n even_o when_o the_o bill_n have_v be_v dismiss_v and_o his_o next_o precedent_n be_v just_a such_o a_o other_o to_o show_v that_o the_o king_n and_o commons_o alone_o without_o the_o lord_n have_v make_v act_n of_o parliament_n for_o which_o he_o quote_v 1_o e._n 6._o c._n 5._o it_o be_v a_o statute_n against_o convey_v horse_n out_o of_o england_n and_o it_o be_v true_a that_o in_o pulton_n collection_n it_o be_v so_o print_v as_o enact_v by_o the_o king_n and_o commons_o without_o mention_n of_o the_o lord_n but_o if_o the_o journal_n of_o the_o lord_n house_n have_v be_v consult_v it_o will_v have_v show_v that_o the_o bill_n begin_v in_o their_o house_n be_v read_v the_o first_o time_n the_o one_a of_o december_n upon_o a_o thursday_n the_o second_o time_n upon_o a_o wednesday_n the_o seven_o the_o three_o time_n upon_o saturday_n the_o 10_o and_o send_v down_o to_o the_o house_n of_o commons_o by_o the_o king_n attorney_n and_o solicitor_n the_o 22_o d._n of_o december_n upon_o a_o thursday_n the_o house_n of_o commons_o send_v it_o up_o again_o with_o a_o proviso_n to_o be_v add_v which_o proviso_n be_v allow_v of_o by_o the_o lord_n and_o the_o bill_n dispatch_v the_o saturday_n after_o it_o be_v therefore_o a_o foul_a mistake_n to_o say_v this_o bill_n pass_v without_o the_o lord_n and_o it_o may_v be_v modest_o say_v of_o all_o his_o precedent_n both_o concern_v the_o legislative_a and_o the_o judicature_n that_o upon_o better_a consideration_n he_o will_v not_o find_v cause_n of_o great_a encouragement_n from_o they_o to_o argue_v the_o foundation_n of_o either_o power_n in_o order_n to_o that_o super-structure_n which_o he_o will_v rear_v whither_o in_o diminution_n of_o that_o power_n which_o be_v challenge_v by_o the_o house_n of_o peer_n in_o the_o legislative_a for_o imposition_n or_o maintenance_n of_o that_o which_o he_o pretend_v to_o for_o the_o house_n of_o commons_o in_o point_n of_o judicature_n and_o now_o we_o come_v to_o his_o particular_a answer_n to_o the_o reason_n give_v by_o the_o lord_n and_o to_o so_o much_o and_o so_o many_o of_o those_o answer_n as_o seem_v to_o contain_v any_o thing_n of_o weight_n and_o material_a to_o be_v reply_v unto_o we_o shall_v give_v that_o reply_n that_o be_v necessary_a but_o as_o for_o that_o which_o be_v jocular_a and_o have_v something_o of_o reflection_n in_o it_o as_o too_o much_o of_o it_o have_v only_o this_o shall_v be_v say_v auferat_fw-la oblivio_fw-la si_fw-la potest_fw-la si_fw-la non_fw-la silentium_fw-la teget_fw-la to_o the_o one_a reason_n then_o give_v by_o the_o lord_n which_o be_v that_o the_o happiness_n of_o the_o constitution_n be_v to_o have_v one_o house_n to_o be_v a_o cheek_n to_o the_o other_o his_o answer_n be_v that_o the_o lord_n have_v a_o negative_a voice_n to_o the_o whole_a be_v a_o sufficient_a check_n to_o the_o house_n of_o commons_o it_o be_v reply_v that_o to_o have_v a_o negative_a voice_n be_v not_o to_o be_v a_o check_n a_o negative_a voice_n be_v one_o thing_n a_o check_n be_v a_o other_o the_o king_n have_v a_o negative_a voice_n to_o what_o both_o house_n do_v yet_o he_o can_v be_v say_v to_o be_v a_o check_n to_o the_o house_n the_o two_o house_n have_v each_o of_o they_o a_o negative_a voice_n to_o the_o convocation_n grant_v subsidy_n yet_o they_o can_v be_v say_v to_o be_v check_n to_o the_o convocation_n but_o each_o to_o other_o in_o their_o legislative_a capacity_n have_v both_o a_o check_n and_o a_o negative_a voice_n which_o be_v different_a operation_n of_o that_o legislative_a power_n for_o proper_o to_o be_v a_o check_n be_v to_o have_v a_o trust_v repose_v in_o one_o to_o examine_v the_o act_n of_o a_o other_o and_o both_o be_v trust_v by_o and_o accountable_a to_o a_o three_o person_n by_o who_o authority_n and_o for_o who_o service_n both_o be_v employ_v and_o he_o that_o be_v the_o check_n can_v whole_o reject_v what_o the_o other_o have_v do_v be_v it_o a_o account_n or_o any_o thing_n else_o he_o can_v only_o examine_v it_o if_o it_o be_v right_a and_o if_o any_o error_n be_v he_o can_v correct_v it_o and_o reform_v it_o and_o make_v it_o such_o as_o that_o he_o who_o employ_v they_o both_o may_v receive_v no_o damage_n nor_o prejudice_n by_o it_o and_o this_o be_v the_o proper_a work_n of_o the_o house_n of_o peer_n as_o they_o be_v a_o check_n to_o the_o house_n of_o commons_o for_o they_o have_v a_o negative_a voice_n beside_o which_o be_v not_o now_o the_o question_n but_o only_o as_o they_o be_v a_o check_n and_o so_o they_o be_v trust_v both_o by_o the_o king_n and_o people_n as_o well_o as_o be_v the_o house_n of_o commons_o not_o only_o in_o money-matter_n but_o in_o all_o thing_n else_o cognisable_v by_o the_o parliament_n if_o the_o house_n of_o commons_o give_v money_n so_o to_o the_o king_n as_o the_o subject_n can_v bear_v it_o if_o out_o of_o trade_n so_o as_o trade_n can_v bear_v it_o which_o be_v the_o proper_a question_n now_o 〈◊〉_d out_o of_o the_o estate_n of_o the_o people_n so_o as_o they_o be_v not_o able_a to_o pay_v it_o the_o king_n himself_o suffer_v in_o all_o this_o as_o well_o as_o the_o people_n it_o will_v be_v his_o damage_n his_o loss_n at_o the_o last_o nay_o the_o great_a damage_n and_o loss_n will_v be_v his_o at_o the_o long_o run_v perhaps_o immediate_o for_o as_o the_o say_n be_v he_o that_o grasp_v too_o much_o hold_v nothing_o so_o if_o more_o be_v give_v than_o can_v be_v pay_v nothing_o may_v be_v receive_v a_o thing_n which_o king_n james_n of_o bless_a memory_n do_v well_o understand_v and_o therefore_o in_o the_o session_n of_o parliament_n 7_o mo_z the_o 21._o of_o march_n he_o call_v both_o house_n to_o he_o to_o whitehall_n upon_o occasion_n of_o a_o aid_n then_o demand_v and_o there_o among_o other_o thing_n say_v this_o to_o they_o if_o you_o give_v more_o than_o be_v fit_a you_o abuse_v the_o king_n and_o hurt_v the_o people_n and_o such_o a_o gift_n i_o will_v never_o accept_v for_o in_o such_o