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A45834 A stop to a lying pamphlet falsly called Truths plea for infants lately published by Mr. Alexander Kellie, in answer to a book lately published, intituled, Infants baptism disproved ... / by Jer. Ives ... Ives, Jeremiah, fl. 1653-1674. 1656 (1656) Wing I1106; ESTC R9585 6,806 16

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Origen was whom he brings as one of the Fathers that held Infants baptism See page 41 of his Bo●k Others against him and for the salvation of none but the Elect. Some have been for Episcopacy some for Presbytery some for Independancy some have been Brownists and have judged it abomination to come to any of his Assemblies some have been for the Cross in baptism others against it some for God fathers and God mothers others of them have judged it a Popish Inovatiou some have been for sports as May-poles and dancing upon the Lords day others have been zealous against it for this cause some of you have cut the ears and slit the noses and branded the cheeks whip't banish't pilloried and imprison'd others though they have been for Infants baptism alike zealous Again how have you Poedobaptists studied to destroy one another and take away the lives of one another witnesse the Gunpowder Treason the late Massacre in Savoy How cruelly did you persecute one another in Queen Mary's dayes And whereas he talks of turning with the Times who hath been more guilty of this then the generality of Poedobaptists who in Queen Mary's dayes were most of them papists in Queen Elizabeth's most were turned Protestants in the Bishops time most were for Bishops and in the Parliament time most were against Bishops and over and besides all these who are for Infants baptism and yet are thus divided Let me add to make full measure Master Rude multitude in all parts of the Christian world who are also very zealous for infants baptism And yet this man dares say None are more contradictious then Anabaptissts Can any man that hath not sinned away his conscience say such a thing without blushing And whereas he saith Many of us are turned to be Quakers and Ranters c. I Answer Who but a man that was minded to tempt his Antagonist to lay open his weaknesse would have opened his mouth so weakly For doe not most of the Quakers at this day consist of such as came from the Church of England and were never of any baptized Church But suppose they were of us as it is like some were yet they left us and their baptism too before they fell into these straines and we have by our dealing with them according to Christs rule left them upon their leaving the truth But now what multitudes are there at every Assize and Session both in City and Country that are condemned justly to the Gallowes some for Murder some for Theft some for Sodomy some for Incest some for Buggery some for Witchcraft some for Treason who all dye at the Gallowes Members related to the Church of England I doe not mention this as an Argument to prove the falsenesse of my Opposites Opinion No I scorn such unmanlike Arguments for there hath been and may be bad men of the best profession but to shew that my Antagonist had mightily forgot the many Errors and Vices of the Poedobaptists while he was blazoning before the world the Errors of the Anabaptists by which he would frighten the simple as though none were more contradious and unholy then we whereas nothing in the world is more false Though I could wish with my soule that we were all of us which he calls Anabaptists more holy that no occasion might be given to the Adversary to speak reproachfully who are apt enough to devise evill against us though we should give them no occasion as Mr. Kellie hath done against me laying to my charge the thing that I never spake But this is no new thing for if they have call'd the Master of the house Belzebub how much more they of his houshold I have now done with his new Arguments by which he confutes my Book and for the rest they are most of them old ones which he sent in a Paper to my house and I have answered them in my Book and he like a man in a Circle brings the Arguments denyed as a Reply to my Answers as you may see by viewing over my Book and his Answer to it How that most of his Reply to me is but a repetition of what I have already Answered I say again therefore if Mr. Kellie will meet me in publick let him appoint time and place and I shall justifie all that is said in my Book either as touching the controversie it self or any other words that have fallen from my pen save as I have said the Printers Errors which I had not time to correct when I sent my Book to him and I am sure his Book is not without many such Errors and therefore he hath shewn his weaknesse to carp at such things as the mis-citing of some Texts and the mis-spelling of some words although his Conscience could not but tell him they proceeded not from error of Judgement I shall now conclude with the words of Christ Mat. 12.36 But I say unto you that for every IDLE WORD men shall speake they shall give an account thereof in the day of Judgement FINIS