they_o receive_v true_a baptism_n the_o argument_n follow_v for_o baptism_n be_v a_o engraff_n into_o the_o true_a christ_n rom._n chap._n 6.3_o the_o antecedent_n be_v manifest_a in_o m._n penries_n judgement_n for_o he_o will_v not_o have_v they_o to_o offer_v themselves_o again_o to_o baptism_n therefore_o he_o be_v either_o a_o catabaptist_n or_o else_o there_o be_v and_o be_v even_o in_o his_o judgement_n true_a baptism_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n 2_o they_o which_o be_v circumcise_v in_o the_o time_n of_o jeroboam_fw-la and_o caiphas_n be_v account_v true_a circumcise_a person_n although_o at_o that_o time_n the_o state_n of_o the_o church_n be_v almost_o altogether_o pervert_v and_o corrupt_v therefore_o such_o as_o be_v and_o be_v baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n etc._n etc._n this_o argument_n be_v use_v of_o the_o great_a learned_a man_n of_o the_o religion_n and_o be_v allow_v of_o all_o the_o reform_a church_n 3_o caluine_n and_o beza_n be_v resolute_a for_o this_o calu._n jon_n chap_n 1._o v._n 16._o ezech_v 16._o v._n 20._o epist_n 103._o and_o 104._o beza_n confess_v chap._n 4._o art_n 49._o and_o chap_n 7._o art_n 11._o epist_n 10._o and_o 81._o viretus_fw-la have_v these_o word_n baptismum_fw-la qui_fw-la à _fw-la sacerdotibus_fw-la papisticis_fw-la collatus_fw-la est_fw-la etc._n etc._n that_o be_v we_o do_v allow_v popish_a baptism_n albeit_o we_o condemn_v the_o vain_a and_o superstitious_a ceremony_n which_o be_v use_v in_o it_o tract_n de_fw-fr commun_fw-fr fid_fw-we cum_fw-la papist_n cer_n pag._n 64._o of_o this_o judgement_n be_v all_o learned_a man_n and_o all_o reform_a church_n none_o dissent_n but_o catabaptist_n anabaptist_n m._n penry_n and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o fantastical_a order_n chap._n 21_o there_o have_v be_v and_o may_v be_v true_a baptism_n out_o of_o the_o church_n the_o donatist_n thought_n otherwise_o in_o augustine_n time_n but_o they_o be_v notable_o confute_v by_o augustine_n in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr baptis_fw-la contra_fw-la don._n 2_o true_a circumcision_n be_v among_o the_o edomite_n 3_o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v out_o of_o the_o church_n by_o heretic_n neither_o be_v nor_o may_v be_v rebaptise_v therefore_o they_o receive_v true_a baptism_n the_o antecedent_n be_v manifest_a for_o it_o be_v a_o rule_n in_o divinity_n and_o receive_v of_o all_o learned_a man_n baptizati_fw-la ab_fw-la haereticis_fw-la non_fw-la sunt_fw-la rebaptizandi_fw-la that_o be_v they_o which_o be_v baptize_v of_o heretic_n be_v not_o to_o be_v rebaptise_v the_o reason_n be_v where_o the_o essential_a form_n of_o baptism_n be_v observe_v non_fw-la haereticus_fw-la sed_fw-la haeretici_fw-la manu_fw-la christus_fw-la baptizat_fw-la that_o be_v not_o the_o heretic_n but_o christ_n do_v baptize_v by_o the_o hand_n of_o the_o heretic_n aug._n passim_fw-la de_fw-mi bapt_v count_v don._n it_o be_v not_o the_o baptism_n of_o heretic_n or_o schismatics_n but_o of_o god_n &_o the_o church_n wheresoever_o it_o be_v find_v and_o whithersoever_o translate_v aug._n the_o bapt_a contra_fw-la don._n lib._n 1._o cap._n 14._o the_o heresy_n be_v they_o the_o error_n be_v they_o etc._n etc._n but_o baptism_n which_o be_v christ_n must_v not_o be_v account_v they_o aug._n de_fw-fr baptis_fw-la contra_fw-la don._n lib._n 3._o cap._n 11._o cyprian_n be_v of_o a_o other_o judgement_n in_o the_o church_n of_o carthage_n but_o he_o be_v condemn_v for_o that_o error_n by_o the_o best_a church_n in_o that_o age_n 4._o the_o ark_n of_o the_o testament_n which_o be_v take_v of_o the_o philistines_n lose_v not_o the_o virtue_n of_o sanctification_n 1._o sam._n 4._o dagon_n can_v teach_v we_o that_o 5_o si_fw-la foris_fw-la nemo_fw-la potest_fw-la etc._n etc._n that_o be_v if_o no_o man_n can_v have_v any_o thing_n which_o be_v christ_n out_o of_o the_o church_n neither_o can_v any_o man_n have_v any_o thing_n which_o be_v the_o devil_n within_o the_o church_n aug._n the_o bapt_a contr_n don._n lib._n 4._o cap._n 7._o 6_o non_fw-la itaque_fw-la ideo_fw-la non_fw-la sunt_fw-la sacramenta_fw-la christi_fw-la &_o ecclesiae_fw-la etc._n etc._n that_o be_v they_o be_v not_o therefore_o not_o the_o sacrament_n of_o christ_n and_o the_o church_n because_o heretic_n and_o wicked_a man_n do_v unlawful_o use_v they_o they_o that_o be_v the_o heretic_n etc._n etc._n be_v to_o be_v amend_v or_o punish_v but_o the_o sacrament_n be_v to_o be_v acknowledge_v and_o reverent_o esteem_v of_o etc._n etc._n question_n how_o do_v heretic_n possess_v baptism_n answer_n baptismum_fw-la legitimum_fw-la habent_fw-la sed_fw-la non_fw-la legitimè_fw-la habent_fw-la that_o be_v heretic_n have_v lawful_a baptism_n but_o they_o have_v it_o not_o lawful_o aug._n de_fw-fr bapt._n cont_n don._n lib._n 5._o cap._n 7._o neque_fw-la licitè_fw-fr foris_fw-la habetur_fw-la &_o tamen_fw-la habetur_fw-la sic_fw-la illicitè_fw-fr for_o be_v datur_fw-la sed_fw-la tamen_fw-la datur_fw-la that_o be_v baptism_n be_v not_o have_v lawful_o out_o of_o the_o church_n notwithstanding_o it_o be_v have_v in_o like_a sort_n it_o be_v give_v out_o of_o the_o church_n unlawful_o notwithstanding_o it_o be_v give_v aug._n de_fw-fr bap._n contra_fw-la don._n lib._n 6._o ca._n 15._o if_o any_o shall_v ask_v whether_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o offer_v our_o infant_n to_o baptism_n out_o of_o the_o church_n etc._n etc._n because_o all_o learned_a man_n except_o the_o donatist_n etc._n etc._n in_o augustine_n time_n and_o m._n penry_n and_o his_o worthy_a disciple_n in_o our_o time_n have_v and_o do_v affirm_v that_o true_a baptism_n have_v be_v and_o may_v be_v out_o of_o the_o church_n my_o answer_n be_v negative_a as_o augustine_n be_v i_o refer_v the_o learned_a reader_n to_o his_o writing_n contra_fw-la cresc_n gram_n lib._n 1._o cap._n 23._o and_o de_fw-mi bapt._n contra_fw-la don._n lib._n 1._o cap._n 4._o chap._n 22._o i._o penry_n that_o no_o popish_a priest_n be_v a_o minister_n every_o minister_n must_v be_v at_o the_o least_o by_o profession_n a_o member_n of_o the_o true_a church_n no_o popish_a priest_n be_v by_o profession_n a_o member_n of_o the_o true_a church_n therefore_o no_o popish_a priest_n be_v a_o minister_n every_o minister_n have_v a_o office_n within_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n no_o popish_a priest_n have_v a_o office_n within_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n therefore_o no_o popish_a priest_n be_v a_o minister_n the_o proposition_n or_o first_o part_n of_o both_o these_o reason_n be_v set_v down_o evident_o and_o plain_o by_o the_o wisdom_n of_o god_n in_o these_o word_n for_o as_o we_o have_v many_o member_n in_o one_o body_n and_o all_o member_n have_v not_o one_o office_n so_o we_o be_v many_o be_v one_o body_n in_o christ_n and_o every_o one_o another_o member_n see_v then_o that_o we_o have_v gift_n that_o be_v diverse_a etc._n etc._n the_o place_n show_v clear_o that_o whosoever_o be_v not_o a_o member_n be_v not_o of_o the_o body_n if_o not_o of_o the_o body_n than_o no_o minister_n again_o whosoever_o be_v no_o member_n he_o have_v no_o office_n in_o the_o body_n if_o no_o office_n no_o minister_n he_o that_o shall_v object_v that_o in_o this_o place_n be_v mean_v a_o member_n of_o the_o body_n by_o election_n in_o the_o secret_a counsel_n of_o god_n and_o not_o in_o the_o acknowledgement_n of_o the_o church_n by_o profession_n will_v not_o deserve_v the_o answer_n because_o it_o be_v vocation_n and_o not_o election_n that_o make_v such_o a_o member_n in_o the_o church_n as_o may_v have_v a_o office_n therein_o of_o which_o sort_n the_o apostle_n speak_v in_o this_o place_n by_o vocation_n i_o mean_v that_o whereof_o the_o holy_a ghost_n speak_v where_o it_o be_v say_v many_o be_v call_v but_o few_o be_v choose_v neither_o can_v any_o man_n deny_v he_o to_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n which_o by_o outward_a profession_n submit_v himself_o unto_o true_a religion_n and_o such_o be_v the_o member_n whereof_o the_o apostle_n speak_v namely_o such_o as_o be_v member_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n judas_n be_v a_o member_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n though_o not_o belong_v to_o election_n a_o further_a proof_n of_o the_o proposition_n you_o shall_v find_v 1._o cor._n 12.26.28_o he_o be_v no_o priest_n in_o the_o old_a testament_n that_o be_v not_o a_o jew_n by_o profession_n yea_o and_o of_o the_o line_n of_o aaron_n too_o and_o shall_v he_o be_v account_v a_o minister_n among_o we_o that_o be_v a_o stranger_n from_o the_o profession_n of_o the_o truth_n and_o a_o profess_a idolater_n ishmael_n and_o esau_n be_v circumcise_v and_o the_o son_n of_o those_o father_n unto_o who_o the_o covenant_n be_v make_v even_o i_o will_v be_v thy_o god_n and_o the_o god_n of_o thy_o seed_n they_o and_o their_o posterity_n fall_v from_o true_a religion_n well_o admit_v that_o the_o profanation_n of_o circumcision_n have_v still_o continue_v in_o their_o house_n yet_o a_o man_n supply_v
observe_v i_o rest_v in_o his_o judgement_n i_o refer_v you_o to_o chap._n 15._o page_n 141._o 142._o m._n penry_n say_v that_o they_o which_o communicate_v with_o unpreach_v minister_n approve_v the_o sin_n of_o the_o unpreach_a ministry_n chap._n 10._o pag._n 119._o this_o be_v a_o anabaptisticall_a fancy_n for_o s._n paul_n as_o m._n penry_n write_v communicate_v after_o his_o conversion_n with_o those_o priest_n which_o be_v as_o unlearned_a as_o ever_o any_o chap._n 11._o pag._n 128._o i_o refer_v you_o beside_o to_o my_o answer_n chap._n 10._o pag._n 119._o m._n penry_n be_v bold_a to_o control_v almighty_a god_n for_o bar_v the_o uncircumcised_a israelite_n from_o eat_v the_o paschall_n lamb_n his_o word_n be_v these_o why_o shall_v the_o godly_a of_o the_o family_n be_v exclude_v from_o the_o action_n the_o cause_n why_o they_o be_v uncircumcised_a not_o be_v in_o they_o chap._n 8._o pag._n 89._o this_o be_v intolerable_a sauciness_n it_o become_v not_o dust_n and_o ash_n to_o dispute_v with_o and_o to_o countermand_v the_o majesty_n of_o god_n read_v my_o answer_n chap._n 8._o pag._n 91._o 92._o m._n penries_n judgement_n be_v that_o the_o touch_v of_o a_o dead_a man_n which_o be_v a_o legal_a uncleanness_n be_v sin_n chap._n 9_o page_n 110._o for_o proof_n of_o this_o error_n he_o quote_v two_o text_n of_o scripture_n most_o absurd_o i_o refer_v you_o to_o my_o answer_n chap._n 9_o page_n 111._o 112._o 113._o m._n penry_n say_v that_o caiphas_n high_a priesthood_n be_v the_o lord_n ordinance_n chap._n 10._o page_n 122._o this_o be_v a_o error_n for_o the_o lord_n ordinance_n be_v that_o only_o one_o shall_v be_v the_o high_a priest_n and_o it_o be_v manifest_a in_o the_o text_n that_o annas_n &_o caiphas_n be_v high_a priest_n together_o luke_o 3._o m._n penry_n say_v that_o he_o be_v assure_v that_o popish_a priest_n be_v no_o minister_n that_o be_v that_o they_o have_v no_o call_n at_o all_o chap._n 22._o page_n 160._o 162._o 163._o if_o this_o be_v true_a first_o a_o great_a number_n be_v unbaptise_v second_o caluine_n beza_n and_o other_o famous_a man_n and_o church_n which_o i_o do_v not_o think_v do_v err_v gross_o last_o only_a m._n penries_n judgement_n be_v sound_a which_o i_o be_o sure_a be_v a_o most_o absurd_a judgement_n read_v my_o answer_n cap._n 22._o pag._n 161._o 162._o 163._o and_o cap._n 18._o pag._n 154._o m._n penry_n affirm_v reader_n to_o be_v no_o minister_n and_o for_o any_o thing_n that_o be_v reveal_v in_o the_o word_n that_o they_o can_v deliver_v no_o sacrament_n and_o yet_o that_o which_o have_v be_v do_v by_o they_o may_v be_v a_o sacrament_n and_o what_o contrariety_n say_v he_o be_v there_o in_o these_o assertion_n in_o his_o exhort_v to_o the_o governor_n etc._n etc._n of_o wales_n pag._n 32._o then_o yesterday_o a_o sacrament_n and_o to_o morrow_n none_o goodly_a divinity_n such_o saint_n such_o shrine_n m._n penry_n say_v that_o he_o have_v no_o ministry_n which_o sin_v in_o execute_v the_o work_n of_o the_o ministry_n as_o administer_a sacrament_n etc._n etc._n his_o word_n be_v these_o the_o call_n of_o a_o unpreach_a minister_n be_v not_o the_o call_n of_o the_o ministry_n because_o he_o sin_v in_o intermeddle_v with_o the_o work_v thereof_o chap._n 25._o if_o this_o be_v true_a the_o contentious_a minister_n of_o philippi_n be_v no_o minister_n for_o they_o sin_v in_o execute_v the_o work_n of_o the_o ministry_n that_o appear_v in_o these_o word_n of_o the_o apostle_n some_o preach_v christ_n through_o envy_n and_o strife_n phi._n 1.15_o beside_o m._n penries_n ignorant_a levite_n be_v no_o priest_n in_o the_o old_a testament_n for_o they_o sin_v in_o execute_v the_o priesthood_n that_o the_o outward_a approbation_n of_o the_o church_n do_v not_o make_v a_o minister_n chap._n 12._o page_n 131._o if_o he_o mean_v that_o it_o do_v not_o furnish_v a_o minister_n with_o knowledge_n i_o grant_v it_o if_o he_o mean_v that_o it_o do_v not_o make_v he_o a_o minister_n to_o we_o than_o be_v the_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n no_o priest_n in_o the_o jewish_a church_n which_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n in_o m._n penries_n judgement_n be_v lawful_a priest_n though_o not_o good_a priest_n chap._n 11._o page_n 125._o read_v my_o answer_n chap._n 12._o page_n 132._o m._n penry_n say_v that_o unfitnesse_n to_o teach_v make_v not_o a_o nullity_n of_o the_o leviticall_a priest_n office_n chap._n 11._o page_n 125._o m._n penry_n say_v in_o a_o other_o place_n that_o no_o ministry_n be_v separate_v from_o a_o gift_n again_o whosoever_o preserve_v not_o knowledge_n in_o his_o lip_n be_v no_o minister_n in_o his_o addition_n page_n 57_o 58._o again_o to_o make_v a_o minister_n there_o be_v two_o thing_n require_v first_o a_o be_v or_o life_n which_o the_o lord_n only_o can_v give_v second_o a_o birth_n which_o the_o church_n as_o a_o instrument_n of_o the_o ordinance_n of_o god_n be_v to_o bestow_v upon_o he_o by_o his_o outward_a call_n these_o two_o thing_n be_v so_o essential_o to_o be_v require_v in_o a_o minister_n that_o whosoever_o want_v either_o of_o they_o he_o can_v possible_o be_v a_o minister_n again_o be_v it_o that_o a_o man_n have_v the_o outward_a call_n of_o the_o church_n yet_o in_o deed_n he_o be_v no_o minister_n unless_o the_o lord_n have_v give_v he_o the_o life_n of_o a_o minister_n by_o commit_v the_o word_n of_o reconciliation_n unto_o his_o hand_n in_o his_o addi_fw-la page_n 45._o 46._o m._n penry_n err_v great_o either_o in_o his_o first_o or_o last_o proposition_n if_o he_o can_v reconcile_v they_o he_o can_v work_v miracle_n the_o tough_a glue_n that_o be_v can_v not_o make_v they_o cleave_v together_o m._n penry_n offer_v disputation_n chap._n 16._o page_n 143._o inscitia_fw-la audax_fw-la none_o so_o bold_a as_o blind_a bayard_n read_v my_o answer_n chap._n 16._o page_n 143._o 144._o m._n penry_n have_v these_o word_n i_o dare_v arrest_n and_o attaint_v of_o high_a treason_n against_o the_o majesty_n of_o the_o high_a all_o both_o man_n and_o angel_n who_o either_o defend_v the_o communicate_v with_o unpreach_v minister_n lawful_a or_o communicate_v with_o they_o in_o his_o addition_n page_n 65._o sesquipedalia_fw-la verba_fw-la every_o word_n as_o big_a as_o a_o house_n great_a smoke_n but_o no_o fire_n thanks_n be_v to_o god_n your_o arrest_n be_v like_a goliath_n curse_n it_o be_v not_o so_o fearful_a as_o paper_n shoot_v thus_o m._n penry_n have_v trouble_v heaven_n church_n commonwealth_n and_o himself_o heaven_n for_o he_o be_v dust_n and_o ash_n have_v be_v too_o bold_a and_o saucy_a with_o god_n himself_o church_n for_o he_o have_v offer_v unto_o it_o for_o treasure_n not_o coal_n which_o have_v be_v very_o base_a but_o poison_n which_o be_v very_o dangerous_a commonwealth_n for_o he_o have_v undermine_v the_o chair_n of_o the_o magistrate_n i_o hope_v such_o coney_n will_v be_v look_v unto_o himself_o for_o he_o have_v contrive_v and_o broach_v many_o proud_a blasphemous_a &_o anabaptisticall_a fancy_n i_o perceive_v it_o be_v true_a which_o that_o famous_a man_n m._n caluine_n have_v write_v viz._n that_o a_o anabaptisticall_a head_n be_v immensum_fw-la deliriorum_fw-la mare_fw-la a_o vast_a sea_n of_o dotage_n calu._n contra_fw-la anabapt_n chap._n 1._o a_o defence_n of_o such_o point_n in_o r._n somes_n last_o treatise_n as_o m._n penry_n have_v deal_v against_o r._n some_o before_o that_o i_o answer_v m._n penryes_n book_n i_o be_o to_o desire_v the_o godly_a reader_n to_o consider_v weighty_o of_o this_o little_a which_o follow_v my_o two_o first_o proposition_n which_o m._n penry_n deal_v against_o be_v 1._o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n by_o popish_a priest_n receive_v true_a baptism_n touch_v the_o substance_n of_o baptism_n 2._o they_o be_v the_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n and_o the_o holy_a supper_n which_o be_v deliver_v in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n by_o unpreach_v minister_n i._o penry_n you_o handle_v two_o needless_a point_n first_o that_o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v by_o popish_a priest_n etc._n etc._n second_o that_o they_o be_v the_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n etc._n etc._n in_o these_o two_o point_n m._n some_o you_o have_v prove_v nothing_o that_o my_o writing_n have_v deny_v r._n some_o i_o do_v see_v as_o yet_o no_o difference_n between_o us._n if_o m._n penry_n deni_v they_o not_o to_o be_v sacrament_n which_o be_v administer_v by_o popish_a priest_n &_o unpreach_a minister_n he_o can_v not_o deny_v popish_a priest_n and_o unpreach_a minister_n to_o have_v a_o calling_n etc._n etc._n for_o it_o be_v a_o rule_n in_o divinity_n sacramentum_fw-la nullum_fw-la sine_fw-la ministro_fw-la that_o be_v no_o sacrament_n without_o a_o minister_n my_o third_o proposition_n which_o m._n penry_n censure_v be_v 3_o the_o godly_a be_v not_o pollute_v
out_o of_o tune_n i._o penry_n so_o that_o the_o question_n be_v now_o grow_v to_o this_o issue_n whether_o popish_a priest_n and_o our_o unpreach_a minister_n be_v minister_n or_o no_o who_o if_o i_o can_v prove_v to_o be_v none_o than_o the_o matter_n be_v clear_a that_o no_o man_n go_v unto_o they_o for_o the_o sacrament_n can_v assure_v himself_o there_o to_o have_v the_o same_o and_o this_o shall_v be_v a_o general_a reason_n equal_o belong_v unto_o both_o the_o point_n handle_v by_o you_o the_o particular_n whereof_o shall_v follow_v in_o their_o place_n r._n some_o if_o you_o can_v prove_v that_o i_o will_v commend_v and_o prefer_v you_o before_o martyr_n bucer_n caluine_n beza_n and_o other_o very_a famous_a man_n and_o church_n yea_o i_o will_v deny_v her_o majesty_n and_o a_o great_a number_n of_o her_o excellent_a subject_n to_o be_v baptize_v which_o i_o be_o sure_o be_v baptize_v the_o mark_v you_o level_v at_o be_v as_o i_o take_v it_o either_o to_o send_v many_o thousand_o to_o the_o font_n again_o or_o to_o make_v they_o guilty_a of_o contempt_n of_o baptism_n one_o of_o these_o two_o must_v needs_o fall_v out_o if_o popish_a priest_n and_o unpreach_v minister_n without_o any_o call_n do_v administer_v a_o sacrament_n you_o may_v level_v and_o level_a again_o at_o this_o mark_n but_o you_o shall_v never_o hit_v it_o the_o bow_n you_o shoot_v in_o be_v too_o strong_a and_o your_o arm_n be_v very_o weak_a beside_o you_o will_v fain_o have_v i_o confess_v that_o either_o popish_a priest_n and_o ignorant_a minister_n be_v lawful_a and_o good_a minister_n of_o god_n or_o that_o no_o sacrament_n be_v or_o be_v deliver_v by_o they_o i_o will_v grant_v you_o neither_o not_o the_o first_o for_o i_o abhor_v that_o defence_n not_o the_o second_o for_o i_o detest_v your_o anabaptisticall_a fancy_n the_o next_o thing_n you_o deal_v in_o be_v that_o neither_o popish_a priest_n nor_o unpreach_v minister_n be_v minister_n in_o which_o treatise_n you_o bewray_v intolerable_a both_o pride_n and_o ignorance_n what_o i_o like_v or_o mislike_v in_o that_o discourse_n appear_v in_o the_o end_n of_o this_o book_n thither_o i_o refer_v you_o i_o will_v now_o set_v down_o that_o part_n of_o my_o treatise_n which_o you_o fight_v against_o chap._n 7._o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n by_o popish_a priest_n receive_v true_a baptism_n touch_v the_o substance_n of_o baptism_n r._n some_o the_o popish_a priest_n do_v retain_v the_o essential_a form_n of_o christ_n baptism_n that_o be_v they_o do_v baptize_v in_o the_o name_n not_o of_o pope_n or_o idol_n but_o of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n therefore_o it_o be_v not_o man_n but_o god_n baptism_n which_o be_v deliver_v by_o they_o if_o it_o be_v god_n baptism_n i_o be_o sure_a it_o be_v true_a baptism_n master_n caluin_n call_v they_o catabaptist_n which_o deny_v that_o we_o be_v right_o baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n institut_fw-la lib._n 4._o cap._n 15._o sect._n 16._o i._o penry_n now_o to_o the_o examination_n of_o your_o reason_n bring_v to_o prove_v that_o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v in_o popery_n have_v receive_v true_a baptism_n your_o conclusion_n you_o must_v remember_v i_o do_v not_o deny_v though_o your_o reason_n prove_v not_o the_o same_o which_o be_v thus_o frame_v whosoever_o deliver_v god_n baptism_n they_o deliver_v true_a baptism_n but_o popish_a priest_n deliver_v god_n baptism_n therefore_o true_a baptism_n you_o have_v change_v the_o conclusion_n from_o that_o which_o be_v do_v unto_o that_o which_o be_v do_v but_o this_o oversight_n i_o omit_v the_o assumption_n you_o prove_v thus_o whosoever_o baptize_v in_o the_o name_n not_o of_o pope_n or_o idol_n but_o of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n they_o deliver_v god_n baptism_n but_o popish_a priest_n do_v baptize_v in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n therefore_o they_o deliver_v god_n baptism_n your_o proposition_n in_o this_o last_o sillogisme_n be_v most_o false_a and_o such_o as_o upon_o the_o grant_n whereof_o not_o only_o the_o communicate_v with_o unpreach_v minister_n may_v be_v advouch_v but_o also_o god_n whole_a ordinance_n in_o the_o institution_n of_o his_o holy_a sacrament_n quite_o overthrow_v for_o if_o it_o be_v true_a that_o there_o be_v no_o more_o require_v to_o make_v substantial_a baptism_n as_o you_o here_o require_v no_o more_o but_o to_o baptize_v in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o trinity_n then_o these_o impious_a absurdity_n will_v follow_v thereof_o 1_o that_o a_o amalekite_n may_v deliver_v true_a circumcision_n as_o touch_v the_o substance_n 2_o that_o true_a baptism_n may_v be_v administer_v unto_o a_o substance_n not_o capable_a of_o baptism_n but_o this_o odious_a instance_n i_o will_v not_o urge_v 3._o that_o a_o woman_n 4._o that_o any_o man_n not_o be_v a_o minister_n as_o a_o child_n of_o five_o year_n old_a a_o turk_n or_o jew_n may_v deliver_v true_a baptism_n as_o touch_v the_o substance_n for_o these_o pronounce_v the_o word_n of_o institution_n may_v retain_v by_o your_o reason_n the_o essential_a form_n of_o christ_n baptism_n and_o so_o to_o use_v your_o own_o word_n they_o baptise_v not_o in_o the_o name_n of_o pope_n or_o of_o idol_n but_o of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n shall_v deliver_v god_n baptism_n and_o not_o man_v if_o god_n baptism_n then_o true_a baptism_n i_o be_o sure_a in_o like_a manner_n by_o this_o reason_n they_o shall_v be_v catabaptist_n which_o deny_v man_n to_o be_v right_o baptize_v by_o turk_n or_o woman_n r._n some_o you_o deny_v not_o my_o conclusion_n i_o must_v you_o say_v remember_v it_o you_o have_v sing_v this_o song_n very_o often_o it_o need_v not_o a_o word_n have_v be_v enough_o if_o it_o have_v so_o please_v you_o you_o tell_v i_o you_o will_v omit_v a_o oversight_n of_o i_o you_o deserve_v no_o thanks_n for_o this_o courtesy_n therefore_o i_o will_v give_v you_o none_o but_o what_o i_o beseech_v you_o be_v my_o oversight_n forsooth_o i_o do_v account_n it_o as_o true_a baptism_n which_o be_v administer_v now_o as_o heretofore_o in_o the_o popish_a church_n call_v you_o this_o a_o oversight_n be_v it_o true_a baptism_n yesterday_o and_o be_v it_o none_o to_o day_n a_o marvelous_a case_n this_o be_v like_o those_o absurd_a fellow_n of_o who_o tertullian_n write_v in_o a_o other_o case_n hodie_fw-la presbyter_n quicras_fw-la laicus_fw-la de_fw-fr prescr_n adversus_fw-la haer._n that_o be_v to_o day_n a_o minister_n but_o to_o morrow_n none_o you_o be_v one_o of_o the_o strange_a divine_n that_o ever_o i_o hard_o of_o very_o ignorant_a very_o bold_a very_o absurd_a you_o be_v such_o a_o one_o as_o the_o apostle_n mention_v 1._o tim._n 1.7_o to_o proceed_v my_o reason_n you_o say_v proove_v not_o my_o proposition_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o any_o learned_a man_n it_o do_v if_o not_o in_o you_o the_o matter_n be_v not_o great_a for_o your_o judgement_n be_v not_o worth_a a_o rush_n the_o argument_n i_o make_v be_v in_o deed_n m._n caluines_n &_o a_o very_a sure_a one_o it_o be_v allow_v of_o all_o church_n that_o i_o can_v hear_v of_o it_o please_v you_o to_o set_v down_o my_o reason_n thus_o whosoever_o deliver_v god_n baptism_n they_o deliver_v true_a baptism_n but_o popish_a priest_n deliver_v god_n baptism_n therefore_o true_a baptism_n you_o say_v i_o prove_v my_o minor_n thus_o whosoever_o baptize_v in_o the_o name_n not_o of_o pope_n or_o idol_n but_o of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n they_o deliver_v god_n baptism_n but_o popish_a priest_n etc._n etc._n your_o answer_n be_v that_o my_o mayor_n proposition_n be_v most_o false_a &_o that_o upon_o the_o grant_n of_o it_o many_o absurdity_n will_v follow_v etc._n etc._n your_o deal_n with_o i_o be_v most_o absurd_a it_o shall_v appear_v thus_o my_o minor_a proposition_n set_v down_o by_o you_o be_v popish_a priest_n deliver_v god_n baptism_n you_o say_v i_o prove_v it_o thus_o whosoever_o baptize_v in_o the_o name_n not_o of_o pope_n or_o idol_n but_o of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n they_o deliver_v god_n baptism_n upon_o this_o you_o infer_v many_o consesequents_n at_o your_o pleasure_n viz._n that_o turk_n jew_n woman_n private_a man_n child_n may_v deliver_v true_a baptism_n touch_v the_o substance_n you_o pretend_v great_a sincerity_n answer_v i_o direct_o i_o appeal_v to_o your_o conscience_n if_o you_o have_v any_o do_v i_o ever_o deliver_v such_o a_o mayor_n proposition_n if_o i_o have_v quote_v the_o page_n set_v down_o the_o word_n if_o i_o have_v not_o which_o i_o be_o well_o assure_v of_o you_o have_v gross_o abuse_v i_o you_o may_v as_o easy_o fetch_v oil_n out_o of_o a_o flint_n as_o any_o such_o consequent_n out_o of_o my_o writing_n the_o godly_a reader_n may_v see_v by_o this_o little_a how_o near_o you_o be_v drive_v when_o you_o use_v such_o beggarly_a shift_n
to_o bombast_n your_o treatise_n honest_a matron_n use_v no_o paint_n but_o harlot_n do_v simple_a truth_n need_v no_o lie_n to_o welt_n and_o guard_n it_o gross_a error_n have_v need_n of_o such_o vermilion_n they_o which_o have_v either_o hear_v my_o sermon_n or_o read_v my_o writing_n do_v know_v very_o well_o that_o i_o allow_v none_o whatsoever_o without_o a_o calling_n to_o administer_v a_o sacrament_n or_o preach_v the_o word_n therefore_o neither_o woman_n nor_o private_a man_n yea_o my_o own_o word_n in_o this_o present_a chapter_n be_v as_o clear_a as_o the_o sun_n viz._n popish_a priest_n do_v retain_v the_o essential_a form_n of_o christ_n baptism_n etc._n etc._n which_o popish_a priest_n have_v a_o calling_n though_o a_o faulty_a one_o it_o be_v very_o strange_a that_o you_o can_v not_o see_v this_o i_o perceive_v the_o veil_n of_o malice_n do_v hinder_v your_o sight_n the_o odious_a instance_n you_o mention_v do_v best_a become_v your_o spirit_n it_o be_v suitable_a to_o the_o rest_n of_o your_o writing_n that_o be_v most_o absurd_a and_o childish_a i._o penry_n i_o will_v be_v fulsory_a that_o the_o error_n of_o the_o catabaptist_n or_o anabaptist_n can_v not_o be_v confure_v by_o you_o with_o sound_a reason_n than_o this_o you_o have_v bring_v and_o i_o will_v be_v also_o sorry_a that_o you_o shall_v defend_v such_o absurd_a consequent_n as_o i_o will_v drive_v you_o unto_o whether_o you_o will_v or_o no_o unless_o you_o revoke_v as_o i_o hope_v you_o will_v that_o which_o you_o have_v write_v pardon_v i_o i_o pray_v you_o i_o deal_v as_o reverent_o as_o i_o may_v with_o you_o retain_v the_o majesty_n of_o the_o cause_n i_o defend_v and_o i_o deal_v not_o against_o you_o but_o against_o a_o erroneous_a assertion_n which_o i_o now_o leave_v desire_v you_o very_o earnest_o that_o you_o will_v consider_v how_o unreverent_o the_o ordinance_n of_o god_n in_o the_o holy_a sacrament_n be_v deal_v with_o when_o the_o same_o be_v make_v to_o depend_v upon_o the_o pronounce_v of_o a_o few_o sill_z able_n without_o any_o consideration_n either_o of_o the_o person_n who_o be_v to_o administer_v or_o of_o the_o substantial_a form_n of_o consecration_n contain_v in_o the_o exposition_n of_o the_o holy_a institution_n of_o baptism_n &_o the_o invocation_n of_o the_o name_n of_o god_n all_o which_o be_v necessary_o require_v in_o the_o administration_n of_o baptism_n and_o can_v not_o possible_o be_v in_o egypt_n where_o all_o be_v and_o be_v cover_v under_o the_o darkness_n of_o a_o strange_a tongue_n r._n some_o you_o pretend_v great_a sorrow_n for_o i_o i_o do_v not_o thank_v you_o for_o it_o be_v sorry_a for_o your_o own_o absurdity_n which_o be_v many_o &_o gross_a the_o absurd_a consequent_n which_o you_o will_v drive_v i_o perforce_o unto_o unless_o i_o reverse_v my_o writing_n be_v easy_o number_v they_o be_v not_o one_o thanks_n be_v to_o god_n your_o lusty_a speech_n can_v not_o daunt_v i_o it_o be_v but_o a_o visor_n i_o have_v be_v 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it_o the_o erroneous_a assertion_n which_o you_o fight_v against_o be_v not_o i_o i_o do_v never_o so_o much_o as_o once_o think_v of_o it_o it_o be_v you_o use_v it_o as_o you_o listen_v you_o may_v be_v bold_a with_o it_o you_o give_v out_o that_o i_o make_v the_o sacrament_n to_o depend_v upon_o the_o pronounce_v of_o a_o few_o syllable_n without_o consideration_n of_o the_o person_n who_o be_v to_o administer_v it_o my_o answer_n be_v that_o you_o be_v a_o wicked_a slanderer_n you_o require_v three_o thing_n necessary_o in_o the_o administration_n of_o baptism_n first_o one_o which_o have_v call_v to_o administer_v it_o i_o agree_v with_o you_o in_o this_o second_o the_o substantial_a form_n of_o consecration_n contain_v in_o the_o exposition_n of_o the_o holy_a institution_n of_o baptism_n i_o dissent_v from_o you_o in_o this_o and_o yet_o do_v like_o sound_n preach_v as_o well_o as_o you_o last_o the_o invocation_n of_o the_o name_n of_o god_n i_o say_v amen_n to_o this_o then_o you_o add_v this_o minor_a but_o these_o can_v not_o possible_o be_v in_o egypt_n that_o be_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n etc._n etc._n will_v you_o stand_v to_o the_o second_o branch_n of_o the_o three_o if_o you_o do_v i_o may_v just_o conclude_v first_o that_o you_o account_v consecration_n not_o christ_n word_n in_o baptism_n as_o you_o ought_v but_o some_o gloss_n upon_o christ_n word_n which_o you_o ought_v not_o second_o that_o you_o deny_v any_o sacrament_n to_o be_v deliver_v by_o popish_a priest_n &_o unpreach_v minister_n etc._n etc._n and_o yet_o you_o have_v say_v often_o and_o have_v desire_v i_o to_o remember_v that_o you_o deny_v it_o not_o i_o do_v not_o wring_v your_o word_n and_o pull_v they_o out_o of_o joint_n as_o you_o do_v i_o such_o deal_n be_v a_o argument_n of_o a_o vile_a nature_n and_o wrangle_a spirit_n it_o be_v very_o far_o i_o thank_v god_n from_o i_o i_o do_v detest_v it_o if_o i_o be_v of_o your_o humour_n i_o can_v chase_v and_o pursue_v you_o hot_o for_o your_o inconstancy_n &_o error_n inconstancy_n for_o affirm_v and_o deny_v one_o and_o the_o self_n same_o particular_a error_n for_o give_v out_o that_o the_o word_n preach_v be_v necessary_o require_v to_o the_o essence_n of_o the_o sacrament_n if_o a_o sermon_n be_v necessary_o require_v to_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o sacrament_n these_o absurdity_n will_v follow_v first_o the_o sacrament_n be_v dead_a sacrament_n that_o be_v seal_v without_o writing_n and_o plain_a blank_n if_o there_o want_n a_o sermon_n second_o if_o baptism_n be_v no_o sacrament_n without_o a_o sermon_n then_o can_v it_o not_o regenerate_v or_o be_v effectual_a to_o any_o which_o either_o have_v be_v or_o be_v baptize_v without_o a_o sermon_n objection_n of_o the_o fantastical_a crew_n the_o popish_a priest_n have_v no_o lawful_a call_n therefore_o it_o be_v no_o true_a baptism_n which_o be_v deliver_v by_o they_o r._n some_o the_o argument_n follow_v not_o i_o confess_v that_o popish_a priest_n have_v no_o lawful_a call_n yet_o they_o have_v a_o calling_n though_o a_o faulty_a one_o they_o which_o be_v not_o lawful_o call_v unto_o the_o ministry_n be_v to_o be_v account_v in_o another_o place_n than_o they_o which_o have_v no_o call_n caiphas_n be_v not_o in_o deed_n the_o lawful_a high_a priest_n for_o he_o enter_v by_o money_n and_o the_o priesthood_n in_o his_o time_n be_v rend_v in_o piece_n yet_o because_o he_o sit_v in_o the_o high_a priest_n chair_n he_o be_v account_v the_o high_a priest_n a_o faulty_a vocation_n may_v hurt_v he_o that_o usurp_v a_o office_n but_o it_o do_v not_o defile_v those_o thing_n which_o be_v do_v by_o that_o party_n this_o be_v m._n bezaes_n judgement_n in_o his_o 142._o question_n if_o any_o shall_v gather_v of_o this_o that_o i_o allow_v the_o popish_a priesthood_n he_o deserve_v rather_o a_o censor_n than_o confuter_n for_o i_o confess_v that_o sacerdotium_fw-la papisticum_fw-la est_fw-la sacrilegium_fw-la that_o be_v that_o the_o popish_a priesthood_n be_v sacrilege_n i._o penry_n your_o distinction_n that_o popish_a priest_n have_v a_o calling_n though_o a_o faulty_a be_v a_o beg_n of_o the_o question_n for_o as_o i_o have_v show_v popish_a priest_n have_v no_o call_n at_o all_o in_o the_o church_n and_o therefore_o how_o can_v they_o sit_v in_o the_o chair_n of_o the_o ministry_n be_v there_o a_o ministry_n out_o of_o the_o church_n caiphas_n priesthood_n come_v afterward_o to_o be_v consider_v of_o r._n some_o the_o distinction_n which_o you_o say_v be_v i_o be_v in_o deed_n m._n bezaes_n it_o be_v term_v by_o you_o a_o beg_n of_o the_o question_n nay_o rather_o your_o answer_n to_o m._n beza_n be_v beggarly_a and_o none_o at_o all_o if_o popish_a priest_n as_o you_o write_v have_v no_o
call_n at_o all_o first_o luther_n which_o have_v imposition_n of_o hand_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n have_v no_o external_a call_n at_o all_o second_o in_o your_o judgement_n either_o no_o baptism_n be_v deliver_v by_o popish_a priest_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n or_o baptism_n if_o any_o be_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n be_v administer_v by_o private_a man_n for_o they_o which_o have_v no_o call_n at_o all_o be_v private_a man_n i_o need_v not_o drive_v you_o to_o absurd_a consequent_n you_o cast_v yourself_o headlong_o into_o they_o as_o into_o a_o dangerous_a quavemire_n your_o treatise_n wherein_o you_o have_v sow_v gross_a error_n thick_a and_o threefold_a be_v witness_n enough_o of_o this_o be_v not_o your_o disciple_n most_o unhappy_a which_o depend_v on_o you_o as_o on_o another_o pope_n you_o ask_v whether_o there_o be_v a_o ministry_n out_o of_o the_o church_n what_o my_o judgement_n be_v appear_v hereafter_o in_o the_o mean_a time_n you_o deny_v not_o that_o there_o be_v true_a baptism_n therefore_o consequent_o a_o ministry_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n which_o you_o say_v be_v no_o church_n caiphas_n priesthood_n have_v both_o search_v and_o find_v you_o out_o it_o bewray_v your_o gross_a ignorance_n chap._n 8._o they_o be_v the_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n and_o the_o holy_a supper_n which_o be_v deliver_v in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n by_o unpreach_v minister_n i._o penry_n you_o know_v m._n some_o what_o i_o mean_v by_o a_o unpreach_a minister_n namely_o every_o one_o learned_a or_o unlearned_a that_o can_v show_v himself_o by_o the_o good_a trial_n of_o his_o gift_n to_o have_v that_o fitness_n to_o reach_v whereof_o we_o read_v 2._o tim._n 2._o 1._o tim._n 3._o which_o ability_n the_o lord_n do_v not_o ordinary_o bestow_v upon_o any_o in_o these_o our_o day_n without_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o art_n especial_o the_o two_o handmaid_n of_o all_o learning_n rhetoric_n and_o logic_n and_o the_o two_o original_a tongue_n wherein_o the_o word_n be_v write_v r._n some_o if_o none_o be_v to_o be_v account_v minister_n ordinary_o which_o be_v not_o furnish_v as_o you_o prescribe_v and_o require_v many_o in_o the_o primitive_a church_n after_o christ_n ascension_n be_v no_o ordinary_a minister_n valerius_n a_o godly_a man_n who_o augustine_n succeed_v at_o hippo_n in_o africa_n be_v no_o ordinary_a minister_n possid_n in_o vita_fw-la aug._n cap._n 5._o samsucius_n a_o godly_a bishop_n be_v no_o ordinary_a minister_n aug._n epist_n 168._o augustine_n which_o be_v a_o famous_a man_n be_v no_o ordinary_a minister_n many_o profitable_a pastor_n in_o this_o age_n be_v no_o ordinary_a minister_n yea_o m._n penryes_n ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n who_o he_o allow_v and_o defend_v to_o be_v lawful_a priest_n be_v no_o ordinary_a minister_n if_o such_o as_o be_v baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n receive_v true_a baptism_n i_o trust_v they_o be_v right_o baptize_v in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n which_o be_v baptize_v by_o unpreach_v minister_n i._o penry_n the_o rest_n of_o your_o book_n be_v now_o to_o be_v examine_v your_o conclusion_n pag._n 22._o that_o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v by_o unpreach_v minister_n be_v right_o baptize_v as_o touch_v the_o substance_n of_o baptism_n i_o do_v not_o gainsay_v your_o reason_n be_v weak_a for_o how_o can_v we_o prove_v your_o conclusion_n if_o man_n shall_v deny_v popish_a baptism_n to_o be_v true_a baptism_n as_o i_o do_v not_o you_o know_v and_o he_o shall_v do_v i_o great_a injury_n which_o will_v lay_v that_o to_o my_o charge_n be_v it_o sufficient_a for_o we_o to_o say_v they_o be_v catabaptist_n which_o deny_v popish_a baptism_n how_o can_v this_o be_v prove_v and_o this_o shall_v not_o prove_v the_o matter_n doubt_v of_o r._n some_o do_v you_o answer_v of_o this_o fashion_n this_o be_v as_o far_o off_o as_o york_n from_o london_n the_o sum_n of_o your_o answer_n be_v that_o my_o reason_n be_v weak_a &_o that_o you_o deny_v not_o my_o conclusion_n be_v my_o reason_n weak_a because_o you_o say_v so_o if_o they_o be_v like_o your_o senseless_a answer_n they_o be_v strange_a stuff_n if_o you_o deny_v not_o they_o which_o be_v baptize_v by_o unpreach_v minister_n to_o be_v right_o baptize_v it_o be_v a_o necessary_a consequent_a even_o in_o your_o own_o judgement_n first_o that_o either_o unpreach_a minister_n be_v minister_n or_o that_o private_a man_n may_v deliver_v a_o sacrament_n second_o that_o it_o be_v and_o be_v a_o sacrament_n which_o be_v administer_v without_o a_o sermon_n they_o which_o deny_v that_o such_o as_o be_v baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n receive_v true_a baptism_n touch_v the_o substance_n of_o baptism_n be_v catabaptist_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o all_o learned_a writer_n and_o reform_a church_n i_o rest_v in_o their_o judgement_n r._n some_o if_o such_o as_o be_v baptize_v by_o popish_a priest_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n and_o by_o unpreach_v minister_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n receive_v no_o sacrament_n many_o gross_a absurdity_n will_v follow_v first_o very_o many_o be_v unbaptise_v and_o if_o they_o be_v unbaptise_v they_o sin_v grievous_o in_o not_o present_v themselves_o to_o the_o holy_a sacrament_n i._o penry_n shall_v we_o say_v that_o they_o sin_n in_o not_o present_v themselves_o to_o be_v baptize_v to_o who_o shall_v they_o present_v themselves_o who_o will_v baptize_v they_o r._n some_o what_o mean_a scholar_n in_o either_o of_o the_o university_n yea_o what_o russet_a coat_n in_o the_o country_n will_v shape_v such_o a_o answer_n in_o stead_n of_o answer_v my_o reason_n you_o ask_v i_o two_o question_n i_o must_v be_v content_a to_o answer_v there_o be_v no_o remedy_n your_o first_o question_n be_v shall_v we_o say_v that_o they_o sin_n in_o not_o present_v themselves_o to_o be_v baptize_v my_o answer_n be_v they_o do_v sin_n no_o learned_a and_o godly_a man_n doubt_n of_o it_o my_o reason_n be_v first_o baptism_n be_v externus_fw-la character_n that_o be_v the_o outward_a mark_n and_o badge_n of_o a_o christian_n so_o write_v that_o famous_a man_n m._n fox_n cap._n 14._o in_o apocal._n second_o the_o contempt_n of_o circumcision_n be_v grievous_o punish_v gen._n 17._o yea_o the_o angel_n will_v have_v kill_v moses_n because_o his_o son_n be_v not_o circumcise_v exod._n 4._o three_o they_o in_o the_o primitive_a church_n which_o have_v excellent_a grace_n present_v themselves_o to_o baptism_n which_o baptism_n before_o they_o have_v not_o so_o do_v many_o in_o jerusalem_n after_o peter_n sermon_n act._n 2._o many_o in_o samaria_n after_o philip_n sermon_n act._n 8._o many_o in_o corinth_n after_o paul_n sermon_n act._n 18._o your_o second_o question_n be_v to_o who_o shall_v they_o present_v themselves_o who_o will_v baptize_v they_o my_o answer_n be_v after_o a_o public_a profession_n of_o their_o faith_n in_o the_o christian_n assembly_n they_o must_v present_v themselves_o to_o be_v baptize_v of_o the_o minister_n so_o do_v cornelius_n in_o caesarea_n act._n 10._o lydia_n in_o philippi_n acts._n 16._o crispus_n and_o gaius_n in_o corinth_n act._n 18.1_o cor._n 1._o and_o a_o jew_n of_o late_a year_n in_o london_n i_o speak_v now_o of_o such_o as_o be_v of_o year_n and_o be_v unbaptise_v i_o hope_v you_o will_v not_o gather_v of_o this_o that_o i_o shut_v our_o infant_n from_o the_o holy_a sacrament_n of_o baptism_n if_o you_o shall_v you_o deserve_v rather_o to_o be_v censure_v by_o the_o magistrate_n then_o to_o be_v confute_v by_o argument_n r._n some_o if_o such_o as_o be_v baptize_v by_o popish_a priest_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n and_o by_o unpreach_v minister_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n receive_v no_o sacrament_n a_o great_a number_n have_v sin_v gross_o in_o partake_v the_o holy_a supper_n my_o reason_n be_v none_o uncircumcised_a may_v eat_v the_o passeover_n exo._n 12.48_o therefore_o none_o unbaptise_v may_v receive_v the_o holy_a supper_n i._o penry_n admit_v they_o sin_v in_o receive_v the_o lord_n supper_n before_o they_o be_v baptize_v shall_v they_o therefore_o be_v bereave_v of_o the_o comfort_n of_o baptism_n to_o affirm_v that_o this_o be_v a_o go_v backward_o be_v no_o reason_n because_o they_o be_v persuade_v that_o they_o have_v baptism_n otherwise_o they_o will_v not_o have_v be_v so_o far_o on_o their_o journey_n until_o they_o have_v be_v accompany_v therewith_o but_o they_o omit_v baptism_n of_o ignorance_n and_o not_o of_o contempt_n therefore_o they_o deny_v the_o receive_n of_o the_o lord_n supper_n to_o have_v be_v a_o sin_n any_o more_o than_o it_o will_v be_v a_o sin_n in_o they_o now_o to_o receive_v the_o lord_n supper_n if_o they_o can_v not_o have_v baptism_n baptism_n they_o will_v have_v if_o they_o can_v orderly_o come_v by_o the_o same_o because_o man_n will_v be_v so_o injurious_a unto_o they_o as_o
there_o be_v a_o nullity_n of_o a_o ministry_n before_o god_n either_o because_o the_o action_n proceed_v from_o a_o corrupt_a minister_n as_o psalm_n 50.16_o who_o god_n will_v not_o have_v to_o deal_v with_o his_o ordinance_n or_o from_o a_o corrupt_a and_o evil_a ministry_n which_o be_v none_o of_o god_n ordinance_n the_o action_n of_o the_o former_a be_v substantial_a in_o regard_n of_o we_o of_o the_o latter_a we_o know_v no_o substance_n it_o can_v have_v of_o the_o former_a there_o be_v a_o nullity_n only_o in_o the_o sight_n of_o god_n of_o the_o latter_a both_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o lord_n and_o also_o of_o us._n the_o nullity_n of_o our_o reader_n ministry_n be_v of_o this_o latter_a sort_n namely_o such_o as_o we_o ought_v in_o no_o wise_a to_o account_v a_o ministry_n whereas_o therefore_o you_o grant_v that_o there_o be_v a_o nullity_n of_o our_o reader_n ministry_n before_o god_n and_o yet_o affirm_v they_o to_o be_v minister_n you_o swerve_v from_o the_o point_n and_o so_o your_o answer_n be_v nothing_o to_o the_o purpose_n but_o a_o desire_v of_o the_o question_n after_o your_o usual_a manner_n as_o caiphas_n then_o and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o sleepy_a dog_n against_o who_o the_o prophet_n cry_v out_o be_v wicked_a man_n god_n will_v not_o have_v such_o to_o be_v his_o minister_n hither_o refer_v esay_n 1.13_o but_o as_o they_o have_v the_o ministry_n which_o god_n allow_v of_o they_o be_v minister_n unto_o the_o people_n this_o ministry_n our_o reader_n want_n therefore_o they_o can_v be_v no_o minister_n neither_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o lord_n nor_o of_o the_o church_n shemaiah_n be_v a_o wicked_a man_n and_o a_o false_a prophet_n so_o be_v the_o rest_n of_o his_o stamp_n the_o lord_n detest_v both_o they_o and_o their_o ministry_n zephaniah_n and_o caiphas_n high_a priest_n with_o their_o company_n be_v as_o wicked_a as_o any_o of_o the_o false_a prophet_n the_o lord_n abhor_v the_o man_n but_o their_o ministry_n be_v his_o ordinance_n hence_o m_o some_o it_o follow_v that_o neither_o the_o bribery_n of_o your_o caiphas_n nor_o the_o blindness_n of_o your_o ignorant_a levite_n can_v make_v such_o a_o nullity_n of_o their_o prietshood_n as_o they_o shall_v be_v no_o priest_n unto_o the_o people_n and_o therefore_o great_a reason_n why_o the_o parent_n of_o our_o saviour_n and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o godly_a whereof_o you_o speak_v page_n 28._o 29._o shall_v not_o leave_v the_o service_n of_o god_n for_o the_o pollution_n of_o the_o priest_n esay_n speak_v against_o blind_a watchman_n chap._n 56.10_o but_o chap._n 42.19_o 20._o it_o shall_v appear_v that_o they_o see_v many_o thing_n but_o keep_v they_o not_o i_o pray_v you_o confer_v the_o place_n and_o it_o can_v never_o be_v prove_v that_o any_o of_o they_o be_v so_o blind_a as_o they_o can_v not_o declare_v by_o preach_v the_o general_a use_n of_o the_o sacrifice_n and_o ceremony_n their_o want_n may_v be_v many_o but_o not_o like_o the_o insufficiency_n of_o our_o reader_n be_v it_o they_o be_v as_o insufficient_a yet_o their_o ministry_n may_v be_v allowable_a your_o answer_n consist_v of_o several_a branch_n i_o will_v handle_v the_o chief_a of_o they_o so_o brief_o as_o i_o can_v your_o first_o branch_n be_v that_o the_o ministry_n of_o the_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n be_v allow_v of_o god_n but_o that_o the_o outward_a call_n of_o our_o unpreach_a minister_n be_v not_o allow_v of_o god_n of_o this_o you_o conclude_v that_o the_o levitical_a priest_n be_v minister_n unto_o the_o people_n and_o consequent_o that_o joseph_n and_o the_o virgin_n mary_n be_v not_o pollute_v by_o their_o sacrifice_n but_o that_o our_o unpreach_a minister_n be_v not_o so_o to_o us._n if_o the_o action_n of_o ignorant_a minister_n be_v as_o you_o write_v not_o substantial_a in_o regard_n of_o we_o than_o you_o must_v deny_v which_o before_o you_o do_v not_o that_o any_o sacrament_n either_o be_v or_o be_v deliver_v by_o they_o i_o will_v fain_o know_v why_o the_o ministry_n of_o the_o ignorant_a levites_n shall_v be_v allow_v and_o not_o the_o ministry_n of_o ignorant_a minister_n i_o confess_v free_o that_o i_o take_v their_o case_n to_o be_v like_a howsoever_o you_o mince_v &_o shift_v the_o matter_n but_o ismel_n your_o meaning_n latet_fw-la anguis_fw-la in_o herba_fw-la there_o be_v a_o pad_n in_o the_o straw_n to_o proceed_v you_o stand_v very_o much_o upon_o the_o outward_a call_n of_o the_o minister_n in_o our_o church_n if_o you_o repel_v the_o unpreach_a minister_n for_o his_o ignorance_n you_o can_v not_o allow_v the_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n if_o you_o repel_v the_o unpreach_a minister_n because_o of_o his_o outward_a call_n you_o may_v by_o the_o like_a reason_n discharge_v the_o worthy_a minister_n in_o this_o land_n of_o the_o holy_a ministry_n for_o all_o have_v one_o and_o the_o same_o external_a call_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n if_o you_o be_v so_o affect_v the_o next_o news_n we_o shall_v hear_v of_o you_o will_v be_v that_o you_o shake_v hand_n with_o our_o anabaptisticall_a recusant_n vno_fw-la absurdo_fw-la dato_fw-la multa_fw-la consequuntur_fw-la that_o be_v every_o absurdity_n have_v many_o attendant_n the_o second_o branch_n of_o your_o answer_n be_v a_o compare_v or_o rather_o prefer_v the_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n before_o our_o ignorant_a minister_n nobile_fw-la par_fw-fr neither_o barrel_n better_a herring_n i_o must_v a_o little_a while_n examine_v this_o second_o branch_n of_o you_o you_o tell_v we_o that_o the_o want_n of_o the_o leviticall_a priest_n may_v be_v many_o but_o not_o like_o the_o insufficiency_n of_o our_o reader_n for_o proof_n of_o this_o you_o quote_v two_o text_n in_o the_o prophet_n esay_n the_o first_o be_v contain_v in_o these_o word_n their_o watchman_n be_v all_o blind_a they_o have_v no_o knowledge_n they_o be_v all_o dumb_a dog_n they_o can_v bark_v they_o lie_v and_o sleep_v and_o delight_n in_o sleep_v esa_n 56._o will_v you_o gather_v of_o these_o word_n that_o the_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n be_v more_o learned_a and_o better_o furnish_v then_o the_o ignorant_a minister_n the_o prophet_n esay_n say_v that_o these_o levitical_a priest_n have_v neither_o rem_fw-la nor_o spem_fw-la that_o be_v that_o they_o be_v woe_n begone_v if_o you_o will_v study_v seven_o year_n you_o can_v not_o devise_v to_o speak_v worse_o of_o the_o most_o ignorant_a minister_n in_o our_o church_n the_o second_o place_n of_o the_o prophet_n have_v these_o word_n who_o be_v blind_a but_o my_o servant_n or_o deaf_a as_o my_o messenger_n that_o i_o send_v who_o be_v blind_a as_o the_o perfect_a and_o blind_a as_o the_o lord_n servant_n see_v many_o thing_n but_o thou_o keep_v they_o not_o open_n the_o ear_n but_o he_o hear_v not_o esay_n 42._o esay_n in_o these_o verse_n call_v the_o leviticall_a priest_n blind_a and_o deaf_a not_o in_o body_n but_o in_o heart_n because_o they_o do_v see_v and_o hear_v god_n judgement_n with_o their_o bodily_a eye_n and_o ear_n and_o do_v not_o observe_v they_o with_o the_o eye_n and_o ear_n of_o their_o heart_n you_o can_v not_o conclude_v of_o this_o place_n that_o the_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n be_v deep_a clerk_n than_o the_o ignorant_a minister_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n the_o third_o branch_n of_o your_o answer_n be_v that_o the_o ministry_n of_o caiphas_n be_v the_o lord_n ordinance_n i_o deny_v it_o and_o do_v dissent_v from_o you_o in_o this_o my_o reason_n be_v caiphas_n have_v not_o the_o high_a prieshood_n alone_o therefore_o his_o high_a priesthood_n be_v not_o the_o lord_n ordinance_n the_o antecedent_n be_v manifest_a for_o annas_n and_o caiphas_n be_v high_a priest_n together_o luk._n 3._o the_o argument_n follow_v for_o the_o lord_n ordinance_n be_v that_o only_a one_o shall_v be_v the_o high_a priest_n calu_n luk._n 3.2_o you_o say_v nothing_o here_o of_o the_o contentious_a minister_n of_o philippi_n you_o take_v and_o leave_v at_o your_o pleasure_n it_o please_v you_o to_o call_v caiphas_n my_o caiphas_n and_o the_o blind_a levite_n my_o ignorant_a levite_n i_o shall_v be_v speed_v i_o perceive_v if_o i_o will_v receive_v all_o that_o you_o cast_v upon_o i_o before_o you_o do_v lade_v i_o with_o reverence_n now_o you_o throw_v caiphas_n and_o the_o ignorant_a levite_n as_o cobble_v stone_n at_o i_o you_o be_v very_o liberal_a but_o i_o refuse_v your_o guest_n i_o disclaim_v they_o and_o return_v they_o to_o yourself_o you_o be_v much_o fit_a to_o entertain_v they_o than_o i_o for_o you_o have_v magnify_v caiphas_n ministry_n &_o be_v a_o hot_a pleader_n for_o the_o ignorant_a leviticall_a priest_n that_o appear_v in_o your_o word_n which_o follow_v chap._n 11._o i._o penry_n vnfitnes_n to_o teach_v make_v not_o a_o nullity_n of_o the_o leviticall_a priest_n office_n
sum_n of_o my_o answer_n be_v contain_v in_o the_o writing_n of_o that_o french_a gentleman_n philip_n of_o mornay_n tract_n de_fw-fr eccle_n cap._n 10._o the_o name_n of_o schismatic_n be_v much_o fit_a for_o proud_a penry_n and_o his_o fantastical_a disciple_n then_o for_o godly_a magistrate_n and_o people_n who_o be_v most_o saucy_o deal_v with_o by_o the_o anabaptisticall_a crew_n question_n whether_o all_o our_o ancestor_n which_o live_v &_o die_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n be_v damn_v answer_n philip_n of_o morney_n do_v answer_v thus_o as_o our_o adversary_n make_v a_o difference_n between_o the_o church_n and_o the_o people_n snatch_v the_o name_n of_o the_o church_n only_o to_o the_o prelate_n which_o shall_v be_v common_a to_o all_o christian_n so_o we_o likewise_o do_v well_o put_v a_o difference_n between_o the_o people_n cleave_v to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o faction_n of_o antichrist_n between_o they_o who_o live_v under_o the_o popedom_n and_o the_o upholder_n and_o maintainer_n of_o the_o pope_n between_o the_o enchanter_n and_o those_o that_o be_v enchant_v between_o the_o pharisee_n who_o christ_n call_v a_o generation_n of_o viper_n and_o the_o poor_a sick_a woman_n who_o he_o call_v the_o very_a daughter_n of_o abraham_n we_o say_v that_o among_o the_o poor_a people_n which_o be_v so_o long_a time_n deceive_v under_o the_o darkness_n of_o antichrist_n there_o be_v a_o part_n of_o the_o body_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n but_o that_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o maintainer_n be_v the_o botch_n of_o the_o plague_n in_o it_o which_o stifle_v &_o choke_v it_o as_o much_o as_o it_o can_v etc._n etc._n and_o a_o little_a after_o etc._n etc._n we_o know_v that_o the_o most_o part_n of_o the_o people_n be_v ignorant_a of_o those_o pestilent_a doctrine_n which_o the_o schoolman_n leave_v in_o writing_n that_o be_v to_o say_v of_o the_o principal_a blasphemy_n of_o the_o papacy_n also_o that_o the_o more_o part_n do_v never_o believe_v that_o they_o can_v merit_v everlasting_a life_n by_o their_o own_o work_n whatsoever_o man_n preach_v thereof_o again_o albeit_o that_o through_o custom_n and_o ignorance_n they_o go_v to_o saint_n and_o image_n and_o frequent_v mass_n and_o pilgrimage_n yet_o notwithstanding_o in_o their_o conflict_n of_o death_n they_o always_o principal_o cleave_v to_o the_o cross_n of_o jesus_n christ_n we_o have_v a_o example_n of_o s._n barnard_n himself_o and_o we_o have_v see_v many_o more_o in_o our_o time_n saint_n barnard_n in_o certain_a place_n savour_v of_o the_o contagion_n of_o his_o time_n as_o it_o be_v hard_a he_o shall_v do_v otherwise_o but_o see_v his_o refuge_n when_o he_o be_v tempt_v of_o the_o devil_n in_o his_o last_o day_n i_o confess_v say_v he_o that_o i_o be_o not_o worthy_a of_o it_o i_o know_v that_o i_o can_v not_o by_o my_o own_o work_n obtain_v the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n but_o my_o lord_n have_v obtain_v it_o by_o a_o double_a right_n by_o inheritance_n from_o the_o father_n and_o by_o the_o merit_n of_o his_o passion_n now_o he_o be_v content_v with_o the_o one_o and_o give_v i_o the_o other_o and_o when_o i_o attribute_v it_o to_o myself_o by_o the_o gift_n which_o he_o have_v make_v unto_o i_o thereof_o i_o can_v be_v confound_v and_o in_o another_o place_n my_o merit_n be_v the_o mercy_n of_o the_o lord_n and_o i_o be_o not_o poor_a in_o merit_n because_o he_o be_v rich_a in_o his_o mercy_n i_o have_v great_o sin_v but_o i_o will_v comfort_v myself_o in_o the_o stripe_n of_o my_o lord_n even_o so_o likewise_o we_o assure_v ourselves_o in_o the_o mercy_n of_o god_n that_o a_o great_a number_n hold_v the_o foundation_n in_o jesus_n christ_n whereof_o the_o apostle_n speak_v albeit_o antichrist_n shake_v it_o &_o as_o it_o be_v endeavour_v to_o overturn_v it_o in_o they_o all_o that_o he_o may_v phil._n mor._n tract_n de_fw-fr eccle._n cap._n 9_o of_o this_o judgement_n be_v that_o famous_a man_n peter_n martyr_n in_o his_o commentary_n upon_o the_o epistle_n to_o the_o corinthian_n cap._n 15._o vers_fw-la 18._o i_o rest_v in_o their_o judgement_n chap._n 18._o that_o popish_a priest_n have_v a_o calling_n though_o a_o faulty_a one_o if_o popish_a priest_n have_v no_o call_n at_o all_o baptism_n be_v deliver_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n by_o private_a man_n which_o be_v a_o gross_a absurdity_n 2_o many_o popish_a priest_n after_o detestation_n of_o their_o popish_a error_n be_v allow_v minister_n in_o the_o reform_a church_n without_o imposition_n of_o hand_n etc._n etc._n therefore_o in_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o best_a church_n they_o have_v before_o a_o call_n though_o a_o faulty_a one_o those_o execellent_a father_n and_o martyr_n cranmer_n rydley_n hooper_n latymer_n etc._n etc._n which_o be_v sometime_o popish_a priest_n be_v allow_v minister_n of_o the_o gospel_n without_o imposition_n of_o hand_n etc._n etc._n caluine_n write_v of_o popish_a priest_n have_v these_o word_n si_fw-la verò_fw-la quis_fw-la istiusmodi_fw-la etc._n etc._n and_o a_o little_a after_o si_fw-mi obijcitur_fw-la pauli_n canon_n ille_fw-la quo_fw-la traditur_fw-la eligendum_fw-la episcopum_fw-la irreprehensibilem_fw-la esse_fw-la oportere_fw-la respondeo_fw-la non_fw-la hîc_fw-la agi_fw-la meo_fw-la quidem_fw-la iudicio_fw-la de_fw-la simplici_fw-la vel_fw-la absoluta_fw-la electione_n sed_fw-la de_fw-la approbatione_fw-la vel_fw-la restitutione_n ad_fw-la certum_fw-la munus_fw-la propter_fw-la interuenientem_fw-la corruptionem_fw-la and_o a_o little_a after_o duo_o sunt_fw-la in_o illo_fw-la statu_fw-la summa_fw-la vitia_fw-la vnum_fw-la quod_fw-la non_fw-la recta_fw-la ratione_fw-la instituti_fw-la sunt_fw-la ad_fw-la munus_fw-la eeclesiasticum_n etc._n etc._n the_o sum_n of_o m._n caluines_n word_n be_v that_o such_o popish_a priest_n as_o detest_a popery_n and_o be_v fit_a to_o be_v employ_v in_o the_o ministry_n may_v be_v allow_v or_o rather_o restore_v to_o the_o ecclesiastical_a function_n first_o because_o they_o be_v not_o before_o right_o institute_v second_o ad_fw-la corrigendum_fw-la praecedentem_fw-la defectum_fw-la that_o be_v to_o correct_v the_o former_a defect_n etc._n etc._n calu._n epist_n 373._o by_o which_o word_n it_o be_v manifest_v that_o popish_a priest_n even_o in_o the_o popish_a church_n have_v and_o have_v in_o m._n caluines_n judgement_n a_o calling_n though_o a_o faulty_a one_o the_o same_o m._n caluine_n in_o a_o other_o place_n have_v these_o word_n cogimur_fw-la fateri_fw-la penes_fw-la illos_fw-la esse_fw-la ordinarium_fw-la ministerium_fw-la that_o be_v we_o be_v compel_v to_o confess_v that_o papist_n have_v a_o ordinary_a ministry_n calu._n ezech_n cap._n 13._o v._n 9_o if_o m._n penry_n will_v take_v exception_n against_o m._n caluines_n writing_n &_o the_o judgement_n of_o all_o god_n church_n let_v he_o confute_v they_o very_o sound_o if_o he_o can_v do_v that_o he_o shall_v be_v account_v the_o rare_a man_n alive_a if_o he_o can_v not_o which_o i_o be_o very_o sure_a of_o he_o shall_v not_o be_v magnus_n apollo_n that_o be_v go_v for_o a_o patriarch_n as_o his_o ignorant_a follower_n do_v account_v he_o but_o he_o shall_v be_v dub_v as_o he_o be_v in_o deed_n a_o other_o nevius_n that_o be_v a_o loud_a and_o clamorous_a companion_n if_o either_o m._n penry_n or_o any_o of_o his_o fantastical_a crew_n shall_v think_v much_o of_o my_o speech_n i_o do_v not_o pass_v i_o confess_v free_o that_o sharp_a word_n be_v not_o sufficient_a plaster_n for_o such_o proud_a sore_n i_o hope_v the_o magistrate_n will_v consider_v further_o of_o he_o and_o such_o as_o he_o be_v duro_fw-la nodo_fw-la durus_fw-la cuneus_fw-la etc._n etc._n that_o be_v a_o wedge_n of_o iron_n be_v fit_a for_o knotty_a wood_n chap._n 19.20_o they_o which_o be_v once_o baptize_v must_v not_o be_v baptize_v again_o the_o covenant_n of_o grace_n and_o peace_n which_o be_v make_v and_o seal_v up_o in_o baptism_n be_v perpetual_a for_o almighty_a god_n remain_v ever_o faithful_a in_o his_o covenant_n therefore_o etc._n etc._n 2_o if_o baptism_n shall_v be_v iterate_v god_n fidelity_n which_o can_v be_v make_v void_a by_o our_o infidelity_n shall_v be_v call_v into_o question_n which_o be_v a_o heinous_a sin_n 3_o circumcision_n be_v never_o iterate_v therefore_o baptism_n may_v not_o baptism_n be_v to_o we_o as_o circumcision_n be_v to_o the_o israelite_n 4_o as_o the_o carnal_a generation_n be_v one_o so_o the_o spiritual_a generation_n be_v one_o semel_fw-la nascimur_fw-la semel_fw-la renascimur_fw-la 5_o it_o appear_v not_o in_o god_n book_n that_o any_o which_o receive_v baptismum_fw-la fluminis_fw-la be_v rebaptise_v baptizmo_fw-la fluminis_fw-la 6_o agrippinus_n the_o bishop_n of_o carthage_n be_v author_n of_o iterate_v baptism_n etc._n etc._n vinc._n lir._n cap._n 9_o chap._n 20._o there_o be_v true_a baptism_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n such_o as_o be_v and_o be_v baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n be_v and_o be_v engraft_v by_o baptism_n into_o a_o true_a christ_n therefore_o
be_v make_v by_o idolater_n i_o make_v no_o question_n and_o when_o do_v god_n give_v idolater_n leave_v to_o make_v minister_n see_v therefore_o that_o popish_a priest_n be_v no_o minister_n i_o see_v no_o show_n of_o probability_n whereupon_o my_o faith_n or_o the_o faith_n of_o any_o can_v be_v assure_v to_o receyve_v true_a baptism_n at_o their_o hand_n unless_o it_o can_v be_v show_v by_o you_o m._n some_o that_o either_o there_o may_v be_v faith_n where_o there_o be_v no_o promise_n or_o that_o there_o be_v a_o promise_n to_o receive_v a_o sacrament_n where_o there_o be_v no_o minister_n which_o no_o man_n of_o any_o christian_n modesty_n will_v affirm_v hence_o also_o it_o follow_v that_o neither_o the_o obstinate_a crew_n of_o recusant_n in_o this_o land_n who_o offer_v their_o child_n to_o be_v profane_v by_o traitorous_a and_o runagate_n jesuite_n nor_o any_o else_o within_o the_o body_n of_o the_o romish_a babylon_n can_v assure_v themselves_o that_o their_o child_n receyve_v the_o substance_n of_o baptism_n r._n some_o if_o by_o minister_n in_o your_o mayor_n proposition_n you_o mean_v lawful_a and_o good_a minister_n of_o god_n i_o agree_v with_o you_o if_o you_o mean_v otherwise_o i_o dissent_v if_o by_o idolater_n in_o your_o mayor_n proposition_n you_o understand_v not_o pagane_n but_o popish_a idolater_n my_o answer_n be_v that_o such_o as_o be_v call_v elect_v and_o ordain_v by_o they_o have_v a_o calling_n though_o a_o faulty_a one_o otherwise_o luether_o ridley_n cranmer_n hooper_n etc._n etc._n have_v no_o call_n at_o all_o for_o this_o point_n i_o refer_v you_o to_o that_o i_o have_v set_v down_o before_o chap._n 18._o of_o this_o treatise_n you_o ask_v this_o question_n viz._n when_o do_v god_n give_v idolater_n leave_v to_o make_v minister_n i_o answer_v even_o then_o when_o he_o give_v the_o israelite_n leave_v to_o make_v your_o ignorant_a levite_n priest_n and_o when_o he_o give_v foolish_a electour_n of_o magistrate_n leave_v to_o choose_v such_o magistrate_n as_o your_o foele_n candaules_n be_v that_o be_v almighty_a god_n give_v no_o leave_n at_o all_o and_o yet_o you_o be_v resolute_a that_o the_o ignorant_a levitical_a priest_n which_o may_v be_v well_o beg_v for_o idiot_n be_v lawful_a priest_n though_o not_o good_a priest_n and_o that_o such_o as_o be_v choose_v magistrate_n even_o against_o the_o wool_n have_v both_o the_o life_n and_o birth_n of_o magistrate_n it_o please_v you_o to_o say_v that_o because_o popish_a priest_n be_v no_o minister_n in_o your_o judgement_n that_o you_o can_v be_v assure_v to_o receive_v baptism_n at_o their_o hand_n then_o belike_o if_o you_o be_v persuade_v as_o all_o learned_a man_n be_v that_o popish_a priest_n have_v a_o calling_n you_o will_v be_v content_a that_o infant_n shall_v be_v present_v to_o baptism_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n which_o popish_a church_n in_o your_o judgement_n be_v no_o church_n at_o all_o what_o i_o think_v of_o that_o particular_a i_o will_v not_o present_o write_v but_o this_o i_o tell_v you_o that_o this_o argument_n do_v not_o necessary_o follow_v viz._n true_a circumcision_n be_v give_v in_o idumea_n and_o true_a baptism_n have_v be_v &_o may_v be_v give_v of_o excommunicate_v heretic_n therefore_o they_o of_o jerusalem_n in_o the_o former_a time_n may_v require_v circumcision_n among_o the_o edomite_n or_o they_o of_o hippo_n or_o carthage_n in_o latter_a time_n may_v require_v baptism_n among_o the_o donatist_n i._o penry_n my_o reason_n beside_o that_o they_o be_v no_o minister_n be_v these_o and_o i_o desire_v that_o they_o may_v be_v examine_v by_o you_o good_a m._n some_o where_o you_o must_v remember_v that_o i_o speak_v not_o of_o that_o which_o have_v be_v do_v yesterday_o but_o of_o they_o assurance_n that_o may_v be_v have_v of_o that_o which_o to_o morrow_n be_v to_o be_v do_v r._n some_o sir_n you_o desire_v i_o to_o examine_v your_o reason_n you_o shall_v have_v a_o easy_a suit_n of_o this_o for_o i_o be_o very_o forward_o to_o do_v you_o that_o pleasure_n you_o grant_v it_o to_o be_v baptism_n which_o be_v administer_v yesterday_o in_o the_o popish_a church_n but_o you_o doubt_v of_o that_o which_o be_v deliver_v to_o morrow_n then_o yesterday_o a_o sacrament_n and_o to_o morrow_v none_o you_o dare_v not_o for_o your_o ear_n say_v in_o flat_a term_n that_o it_o be_v no_o baptism_n which_o be_v deliver_v heretofore_o in_o the_o popish_a church_n for_o then_o many_o thousand_o who_o christendom_n you_o call_v in_o question_n will_v condemn_v you_o for_o a_o catabaptist_n but_o it_o have_v please_v you_o to_o set_v down_o this_o marginal_a note_n in_o a_o other_o place_n viz._n as_o i_o do_v not_o deny_v that_o which_o have_v be_v do_v to_o be_v a_o sacrament_n so_o if_o any_o can_v prove_v it_o to_o be_v none_o i_o will_v not_o withstand_v he_o in_o your_o exhort_v to_o the_o governor_n etc._n etc._n of_o wales_n pag._n 31._o if_o i_o be_v not_o well_o acquaint_v with_o your_o absurd_a write_n i_o shall_v wonder_v at_o you_o more_o than_o i_o do_v your_o reason_n such_o as_o they_o be_v do_v follow_v i._o penry_n where_o there_o be_v no_o true_a christ_n whereunto_o man_n can_v be_v engraft_v by_o baptism_n there_o true_a baptism_n as_o touch_v the_o substance_n can_v be_v get_v for_o what_o baptism_n be_v that_o which_o be_v not_o a_o engraff_n into_o the_o true_a christ_n but_o in_o popery_n there_o be_v no_o true_a christ_n whereunto_o man_n may_v be_v ingraff_v because_o he_o be_v not_o the_o true_a christ_n who_o either_o will_v not_o or_o can_v satisfy_v the_o wrath_n of_o god_n for_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o elect_a without_o their_o merit_n and_o such_o be_v the_o christ_n profess_v in_o popery_n and_o no_o other_o therefore_o man_n can_v be_v assure_v to_o have_v the_o substance_n of_o baptism_n in_o the_o popish_a church_n r._n some_o i_o deny_v your_o minor_a proposition_n for_o such_o as_o be_v baptize_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n be_v engraft_v 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substance_n of_o baptism_n out_o of_o the_o church_n and_o that_o by_o those_o that_o be_v without_o the_o church_n for_o then_o a_o sacrament_n may_v be_v have_v out_o of_o the_o church_n which_o be_v very_o impious_a and_o absurd_a to_o be_v affirm_v but_o popery_n be_v out_o of_o the_o church_n and_o so_o be_v all_o popish_a priest_n therefore_o no_o man_n can_v assure_v himself_o to_o have_v the_o substance_n of_o baptism_n in_o popery_n by_o any_o popish_a priest_n r._n some_o before_o that_o i_o deny_v any_o part_n of_o your_o reason_n i_o must_v tell_v you_o that_o i_o have_v prove_v already_o that_o true_a baptism_n have_v be_v and_o may_v be_v out_o of_o the_o church_n cyprian_a thought_n otherwise_o and_o therefore_o will_v have_v such_o as_o be_v baptize_v by_o excommunicate_v heretic_n to_o be_v rebaptise_v but_o he_o be_v and_o be_v condemn_v for_o that_o error_n by_o ancient_a &_o late_a writer_n you_o give_v out_o very_o peremptory_o that_o it_o be_v very_o impious_a and_o absurd_a to_o affirm_v that_o baptism_n either_o have_v be_v or_o may_v be_v out_o of_o the_o church_n so_o do_v the_o donatist_n in_o augustine_n time_n it_o be_v no_o great_a matter_n what_o you_o say_v your_o bolt_n be_v soon_o shoot_v your_o water_n be_v very_o shallow_a many_o point_n which_o you_o condemn_v in_o your_o consistory_n for_o gross_a absurdity_n be_v manifest_a truth_n in_o the_o sound_a judgement_n of_o all_o reform_a church_n so_o be_v this_o present_a particular_a touch_v your_o argument_n i_o deny_v your_o minor_n my_o reason_n be_v the_o popish_a church_n be_v a_o church_n though_o a_o unsound_a church_n and_o popish_a priest_n have_v a_o calling_n though_o a_o faulty_a one_o for_o proof_n of_o this_o i_o refer_v you_o to_o that_o which_o i_o have_v write_v before_o in_o this_o treatise_n if_o you_o like_v not_o my_o reason_n confute_v they_o i._o penry_n that_o there_o be_v no_o church_n at_o all_o in_o popery_n and_o that_o all_o popish_a priest_n be_v 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you_o say_v in_o your_o book_n m._n some_o page_v 33._o that_o you_o can_v press_v the_o argument_n of_o the_o magistracy_n against_o i_o very_o far_o whether_o you_o may_v or_o no_o that_o shall_v be_v consider_v when_o i_o deal_v with_o the_o point_n but_o this_o i_o be_o assure_v of_o that_o in_o this_o point_n you_o shall_v be_v drive_v either_o to_o defend_v the_o absurdity_n that_o baptism_n be_v to_o be_v have_v out_o of_o the_o church_n in_o a_o company_n estrange_v from_o christ_n which_o i_o think_v you_o will_v not_o do_v or_o urge_v so_o far_o as_o to_o the_o plain_a breach_n of_o a_o statute_n which_o far_o be_v it_o from_o i_o even_o in_o the_o cause_n of_o treason_n will_v you_o say_v that_o baptism_n may_v be_v have_v out_o of_o the_o church_n the_o assertion_n be_v absurd_a or_o will_v you_o hold_v that_o there_o be_v a_o church_n in_o popery_n the_o assertion_n be_v dangerous_a and_o i_o have_v prove_v it_o false_a it_o be_v dangerous_a because_o it_o affirm_v our_o 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be_v sometime_o popish_a be_v call_v reform_a church_n the_o very_a name_n of_o reform_a church_n do_v manifest_o import_v that_o the_o church_n of_o england_n germany_n denmark_n etc._n etc._n though_o popish_a and_o unsound_a be_v church_n in_o some_o sort_n before_o the_o reformation_n if_o you_o think_v that_o all_o the_o popish_a sort_n which_o die_v in_o the_o popish_a church_n over_o damn_a you_o think_v absurd_o for_o you_o dissent_v from_o the_o judgement_n of_o all_o the_o learned_a protestant_n and_o do_v presume_v to_o sit_v in_o god_n chair_n which_o be_v intolerable_a sauciness_n to_o say_v or_o write_v that_o true_a baptism_n have_v be_v and_o may_v be_v out_o of_o the_o church_n be_v a_o true_a proposition_n in_o divinity_n augustine_n do_v maintain_v it_o against_o the_o donatist_n the_o most_o famous_a man_n &_o church_n in_o our_o time_n be_v of_o that_o judgement_n i_o rest_v in_o that_o with_o all_o my_o heart_n you_o account_v it_o a_o absurd_a proposition_n the_o 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prince_n and_o this_o church_n and_o i_o doubt_v not_o but_o that_o blessing_n which_o god_n have_v give_v already_o to_o my_o last_o treatise_n and_o which_o his_o majesty_n will_v give_v to_o this_o will_v mar_v your_o market_n great_a word_n shall_v not_o fray_v i_o etc._n etc._n if_o your_o ignorant_a disciple_n will_v still_o magnify_v you_o it_o shall_v not_o be_v strange_a to_o i_o they_o do_v but_o their_o kind_n such_o as_o be_v learned_a &_o wise_a have_v &_o do_v find_v you_o out_o cognoscitur_fw-la quis_fw-la sit_fw-la ut_fw-la ut_fw-la laudetur_fw-la coruus_fw-la the_o most_o famous_a orator_n that_o ever_o be_v in_o rome_n and_o athens_n can_v not_o make_v the_o raven_n to_o be_v no_o raven_n tertullus_n commend_v felix_n act._n 24._o but_o felix_n be_v a_o absurd_a body_n and_o strip_v of_o his_o office_n by_o claudius_n caesar_n the_o samaritan_o commend_v simon_n magus_n act._n 8_o libanius_n the_o sophister_n commend_v julian_n the_o apostate_n socr._n lib._n 3._o cap._n 22._o eunomius_n commend_v aetius_n which_o be_v a_o pestilent_a heretic_n theodor._n lib._n 2._o cap._n 29._o you_o have_v protest_v many_o time_n in_o your_o treatise_n that_o you_o reverence_v i_o but_o here_o you_o offer_v i_o this_o choice_n either_o to_o defend_v that_o which_o be_v in_o your_o judgement_n a_o absurdity_n but_o in_o deed_n be_v none_o or_o to_o incur_v the_o danger_n of_o treason_n etc._n etc._n do_v you_o think_v that_o i_o have_v any_o the_o least_o cause_n to_o believe_v your_o glorious_a protestation_n joab_n pretend_v extraordinary_a good_a will_n to_o abner_n and_o amasa_n but_o he_o kill_v they_o 2._o sam._n 3._o and_o 20._o chap._n ishmael_n pretend_v extraordinary_a good_a will_n to_o they_o of_o sichem_n silo_n samaria_n the_o beast_n shed_v tear_n but_o they_o be_v crocodile_n tear_n for_o