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honour_n doctrine_n double_a elder_n 1,742 5 9.4785 5 true
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A77735 A brief ansvver to obiections of all sorts, against Presbyterian chvrches and their government. Bakewell, Thomas, b. 1618 or 19. 1650 (1650) Wing B528; Thomason E620_11; ESTC R206382 29,802 35

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not follow for he must be first baptised and so admitted into the universall visible Church which includes all particular congregations and gives him a right to partake in all publick Ordinances in case his knowledge and life be approved of by the Eldership without any rebaptising or any other covenant engaging whatsover but this Priviledge no Turk can have by living in one of our Parishes let him have never so much knowledge or holinesse till he he seal'd his professed obedience to to the Covenant of grace by Baptisme Obj. But you stand so much upon Baptisme so that if a man be but baptised though never so prophane you hold him still to be a member of your Church Ans It is true for so he is untill for his misdemeanour he be judicially cut off yea he is still a member while he is under the spirituall Physicians hands although by suspension he is disabled for the present to act as a member as as man sick in his body or in prison cannot use his freedome of the City yet he ia a freeman still for all that therefore the Church officers ought to take care of their patient and comfort him lest Satan get advantage and the man be swallrwed up of overmuch sorrow 2 Cor. 2.7.11 2 Thes 3.15 Ob. But more is required to make members of a Church than Baptisme to seal their professed obedience to the covenant of grace and the approbation of the Eldership to partake of the Lords Table for they must engage themselves to each other to walk in all the wayes of God Ans The covenant of grace being sealed by Baptisme is sufficient to bind them to walk in all the wayes of God 2. This professed obedience to that covenant is the onely form of all Christian Churches 3s That bond lies on all that have seal'd that covenant for ever 4. To make any other engagement than what Christ hath made for admission into the Church is the direct mark of the beast Revel 13.16 17. Ob. But King Asa and the people entred into a Covenant to seek the Lord 2 Chron. 15.1 and the Priests and Levites sealed such a Covenant Nehemiah 3.38 and it s foretold that in the times of the Gospel men shall bind themselves in a perpetuall Covenant Ier. 50.5 and Paul was not suffered to join himself with the Disciples till his engagement Acts 9.26.27.30 Ans 1. Concerning Paul the Disciples imposed no engagement on him at all onely Barnabas declared his conversion and how he preached boldly at Damascus in the name of the Lord Iesus and how he was with them at Ierusalem and how he had disputed against the Grecians who went about to kill him now when they knew this by Barnabas they brought him down to Cesarea and fent him on their businesse to Tarsus onely upon that report of Barnabas without any of his engagement to them and for those other Covenants they were not for admission of those without the Church to bring them in but of those already in it to walk more closely with God according to the Covenant of grace which they had sealed before at their Circumsion and often renewed at the Passeover and for that Prophecy to bind themselves in a perpetuall Covenant is either meant of those without that shall come in and seal the Covenant of grace or else it is no more but that Christians should do as the Iewes did before them that is to bind themselves to walk more closely with with God which was done both at our Protestation and at our solemne League and Covenant yet these men reproach our Church and Ministry in which and by whom they say they will be converted But is your Presbyteriall Government of Divine institution Ans Yes for God hath set in his Church Governments 1 Cor. 12.28 yea all the three persons in Trinity had a hand in it the father sends forth labourers into the Harvest Mat. 9.38 and the Son gave some to be Apostles some Pastours and teachers Ephes 4.11 and the holy Ghost made them overseeers Acts 20.28 and the Elders of Ephesus were those overseers ver 17. for the Apostles ordained Elders in every Church Acts 14.23 and after their decease they left others to ordain in every City or Church Titus 15. now these Elders were of two sorts first such as were both rulers and teachers for saith Paul obey them that have the rule over you who also speak unto you the word of God Heb. 13.7 17. those Bishops or overseers must be apt also to teach 1 Tim. 3.2 and there is also another sort of Elders which onely are rulers but do not labour in the word and Doctrine and if they rule well are worthy of double honour but more especially they that also both rule well and labour in the word and Doctrine 1 Tim 5.17 now both these have rule over the Saints Heb. 13.24 and worthy of this honour if they rule well Rom 12.8 But shall the Eldership judge and determine of all matters in the congregation Ans Yes they are to judge of all matters unlesse in case of appeals to Classes and Synods first because the Elders are charged to watch and keep the flock from the danger of wolves Acts 20.28 29 30. 1. Pet. 5.13 2. The stock for the poore is to be put into the hands of the Eldership Acts 11 29 30. 3. The Keyes of the Church are to be committed to them for binding and loosing Mat. 16.19 Iohn 20.23 4. All controversies in the Church are to be decided by them for if brethren cannot do it then saith Christ tell the Church Mat. 16.17 18. But shall the Eldership judge and determine who are fit to partake at the Lords Table and keep them back who are not fit to partake of that Ordinance Ans Yes for if they are to judge of all matters then of this also 2. Some were charged to keep the doore in the time of Administration 1 Chron. 26.12 to 19. and some had the charge of the holy place 2 Chron. 23.32.3 Some were blam'd for not putting a difference between the holy and prophane Ezekiel 22.26.4 The younger sort have in all ages and Churches been examined and catechised before admittance to the Lords table that they may offer unto the Lord a pure offering Mal. 1.11 But after admittance to the Lords table shall any be deferr'd from that Ordinance before any crime is laid to his charge or proved against him Ans No for it were unjust to punish a man before he be proved to be guilty of some offence deserving that punishment Secondly it would rend the Church in pieces to suspend any communicants before they be charged with any offence deserving i. t If the Eldership shall suspend both the godly and ungodly before they be charged with any offence and proceed to make a new admittance of those allready admitted the succeeding Eldership might do the like to those that they have admitted and so do and undo for ever Fourthly