Selected quad for the lemma: honour_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
honour_n	david_n	king_n	saul_n	1,226	5	9.8585	5	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A38441	Englands third alarm to vvarre stirring up the whole land as one man to help the Lord, and His servant David, all the faithfull in the world, against most bloudy adversaries mighty hunters before the Lord : in which		1643 (1643)	Wing E3058; ESTC R9479	87,068	101

consisted in suffering rather then in obeying rather in bearing from the hand what the Power inflicted Magistratibus ex animo deferendus honor etiam Tyrannis Ans then in doing what the Power commanded This is true for there is an obedience in suffering and so no resisting of the power for he that suffers from the hand of the Ruler for what his conscience will not suffer him to doe he doth not resist but obeyes the Ruler And yet we must note That there is a wide difference betwixt giving obedience to that the Heathen Emperours commanded by their Lawes and obedience to that which Kings now command against Law Christians then did take-up the burden of their Ruler with a bended knee as the Lord Verub expresseth it and as I may interpret it i. e. They made their body bow unto it not their conscience They suffered for that they could not obey as the three Worthies in Daniel who yeelded-up their bodies ●o the dispose of their King and so The LORD Whom they served kept their bodies untouched by the fire who would keepe their consciences free from polution It is otherwise with Christians now They are called to liberty To obey their King ruling by Law The ●igher Power which GOD has set over them and which the King cannot commit to an Edomites hand If he d●es it ought to be resisted for it is a terrour to the good not to evill workes Cleane contrary to t●at a Minister of GOD should be And whereas it is said We must give honour to Magistrates though Tyrants we grant as much for it hath beene and is the manner of all the children of GOD so to do David did so witnesse his words and humble deportment before Saul But David did not give his throat to Saul though Saul was King and David a private man yet he read no Law nor could see Reason for that but all Law and Reason against it There is one argument more from the example of the Jewes if not shrinking-up their hands into their sleeves after the Persian manner yet bowing their hands behinde them in hom●ge to their Emperours person and commands Philo relates the story in his Ambassie to Cajus as followes Caligula would set-up his Image in the Temple of Jerusalem that Abomination in that Sacred Place So he would do And for that end Petronius was sent unto them to assure them That Caligula their Emperour would have it so and for that purpose an Army of foot and horse was in a readinesse to shoulder-in the Image if by faire meanes he prevailed not The Jewes with their wives and children met the Emperours Ambassadour stand before him as children before their parents with their Armes bent behinde them assuring the Ambassadour by that reverentiall posture of their bodies That as they were not so mad as to withstand their Lord so they were not so mindlesse of their duty to GOD as to suffer that abomination to be brought into their Temple unlesse over the heads of themselves their wives and children trampled upon all the way thither as the myre in the streets And so they quitted themselves say they of themselves like men in hese two great points In preserving entire the service of their GOD And the b●nd of allegeance to their Prince This is the very posture of good Subjects Ob. to carry their hands bent behinde them while they suffer the Rebels to ride over their heads And that is the objection from hence I confesse this Story speakes as fully to Doctor Fearnes purpose Ans as any we have read yet will it not satisfie his tender conscience nor any understanding man For he must heare Reason A wise man will not show his teeth that cannot bite his offer that way may cause all his teeth to be struck out I will shrinke my hands up into my sleeves or turne them behinde me if I am not able to use my hands Againe If the Jewes at that time would expose themselves wives and children to the lust of one domineering Lord That is no rule for Christians so to doe Nay it was no rule for the Christians after them So we will answer practice with practice For they being oppressed by the hand of an Heathen Emperour Lucinius sought helpe from a Christian Emperour who gave them aid and thereby they oppressed him that oppressed them Though yet it makes a wide difference to live under them whose will is their law and will doe what they list And under him who is under a power which must rule him and his commands Whereof b●fore The case is cleared without controversie the King is not the higher Power Yet before we conclude let us heare how the Heathen have resolved this matter Whose is the power The Kings Who has the power over the King The Law Then the Law is the higher power sayes Plutarch in his Moralls But me thinkes Aristotles words are yet more notable he sayes He that will have the Law to be the higher power 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Polit. lib. 3. sub finem 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 obliquos agit 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Ibid sets GOD uppermost and the Law next to Him But he that will have man to be the higher power sayes a Beast may be it A Beast Yes so sayes Aristotle and his Reason must be this though I finde it not in the place for it is sufficient that he sayes a Beast Man may be carried by his sensuall part then he walks like a Beast and acts like a Beast his Reason and Judgment may be steeped as was said in his affections Lust may sway him Anger too and turne him from the rule of Law and Reason both yes that it may the best men living and all the while the man is so carried he acts like a Beast Therefore we must not place the higher power in him What is the higher power then The Law What is the Law It is as the minde of the Law-giver Senate or Councell should be void of all sensuall Desire and Appetite I expresse it as well as I can I would it were expressed better and better thought upon for truely it is very excellent I conclude then that is the higher power that can doe me no Wrong but all the Right that can be because it is void of all manner of Malignity from selfe se●fe-seeking or selfe-pleasing Then it is a Truth as cleare as the Sun-beame That the King is not the higher power he is a Man and may doe and does much wrong for there is a Malignity in man even in the best of men and will be there so long as selfe is in him I am now to make further discovery of this malignant spirit in Saul persecuting of David so we proceed in the Story where we shall read that which may be a great disheartning to Israel now while they looke downward upon number and strength of men But if they looke upward setting their faces

not so uncharitable as to thinke That all these three thousand were all murtherers They that were acquainred with Sauls minde and willingly followed the Commandement Those all were murtherers in the highest degree there is no doubt of all that But some there were a very few who followed Saul and crossed his commandement what they could So did Jonathan and how many more I cannot tell And others there were who followed Saul as sheepe are driven by the Shepheard when hee meanes to plunge them into the waters They did not properly follow Saul but were driven by the hand of violence as some of late have beene and as Saul himselfe was by the Divell To exemplifie this by the Edomites practice at this time The Edomite now in the North we have no other name for him has exercised such cruelties upon the inhabitants there to force them to his side tying their heads and heeles together till from some of them breath departed And by these Turkish inforcements he has gained many bodies to his side but David has their hearts And so we may conceive and so judge it was with men in Sauls Host because the Sacred Scripture gives us that allowance For we reade of no execution done upon Israel upon their Cities but by Saul and the Edomite Saul spake indeed to all his Servants That they would kill David and wee make no doubt many were active Instruments that way for the Edomite could not doe all his executions alone But that all this Host was ingaged upon this service and would have answered Sauls bloudy will had they come to a set Battell is more then I can tell or any man in the world for we have not a word for it Onely to cleare this and to say as much as needs in reference to the present ti●e also for all is plaine all along this I will say That whosoever amongst those three thousand did follow Saul and his Command though grieving for Conscience not asleep or seared will regret and recoile give checke sometimes and yet approving An. lib. 14 cap. 〈◊〉 In some Bookes the fourth Moerens ac laudans as Tacitus speakes of Burrhus in a case not unlike I say All such as followed Saul so though grieving yet approving and commending what Saul did these were as one of them Edomites murtherers in true judgement and Scripture account And if the Sacred Scripture accounts these men murtherers then GOD accounts them so and then what will their Commission and Warran● profit them Or can it b●are them out in these outrages they have committed when they are indeed the fiercest enemies that ever the Church had But I will draw-up to a conclusion of this matter with some few observations from all wee have read First 1. Here an Edomite has done all the mischiefe a Right-hand to Saul in his bloudy execution What was hee A meane man sure an Heards-man then he was lifted up higher and made Steward of Sauls house set over his Servants there Conferring of honours upon him engaged him to Saul and his service so Saul made him Generall in the Field O! This preferment these hono●rs are a sweet bait it takes a man strangely it will take a man quite from D●vid that hath not his heart engaged to his GOD Saul knew what he did when he ra●l●d the Edomite to honour he shall doe what Saul will have him doe He is more then a man who can shut his eyes against the glory of the world and contemne it for Davi●s s●ke A man without ●ruth of Grace is like a ship without ballast it cannot endure a stonne That can be content to passe over with a carelesse eye the pleasures and profits of the Court. and endure afflictions with David the friends of GOD. An HOTHAM who had the boldnesse when time was and GODS pleasure to maintaine David and his cause to out face a Prince could not out-face the glory of the world he is taken with the bait of honour gaine or I know not what and so hath undone what he did and made himselfe infamous to all generations The King has that at his dispose which will worke upon all complexions but honour for the proud workes strangely brings many to his side and makes them RIGHT for his service David is in a Wildernesse has little for himselfe and lesse for his friends but they that serve David serve Him heartily nothing can win them to Davids side but meere conscience of duty to GOD and His cause LORD stablish the heart with Grace a sleeting thing we are never sure of it and must never be secure about it shew it the excellencies in the LORD JESUS then we shall not be taken with the ●omp of the world Acts 24. a Phantasie nor be offended at the troubles of David Secondly there were many Noble many Rich many Stout many valiant men and many wife men on Sauls side but yet they must not be a dishonour to Israel all these must come-in under one Head and the Edomite their Generall must beare the envie and dishonour of that Naturall war for it is as Naturall for the Edomite to warre with David as for the fire to burne It is not said Israel smote Nob No The Edomite smote Nob and all his helpers some Israelites no doubt yet they goe under that name So here are two Kingdomes smitten with the sword Who smote them It shall not be said This Prince or That Prince This Noble-man or That Noble-man No The Edomite did it It shall not lye as a reproach upon England it shall cause her sorrow that her owne children whom she has dandled upon her lap have to their power eat out her bowels It is a grievous thing And that those Brethren in evill who ought themselves unto this Church should prove such vipers and doe her such mischiefe This is grievous But the dishonour of it shall not lye upon this Mother-Church but upon Rome it shall lye upon the children of that Edom and the Church shall remember them to all generations Who in the day of Ierusalem said Rase it rase it even to the foundation thereof Thirdly though we doe not question Ionathans sincerity being well resolved at that point that he was a good man and a true friend to David and did him great service at the Court yet I thinke wee may question whether his bands of nature or Court-bands all very strong no doubt were strong enough to bind his bodily presence to continue with his father all the time his father persecuted David I determine nothing here because the Scripture is silent but thus the Scripture speakes out and we may set a marke upon it that if Ionathan was not slaine first which yet the Text seemes to say yet thus it was 1 Sam. 31.6 Saul died and his three Sonnes and his Armour-bearer and all his men that same day together TOGETHER they went along with Saul in a bloudy Path he did drive-on furiously but