Pined in Iob 19 v. 26. nu 3. sayes a Iesuite when I see and heare some wise man of our age as Fran. Suarez a Iesuite for example and vpon occasion bring him into my Commentaries then when I cast mine eyes vpon many of the ancient Fathers Here antiquity must giue place to a Iesuite and yet if the Protestants do but one halfe of this they are audacious and impudent vpon their bold presumption This is that Erasmus l Annot in Hieron Praef. in Dan. tom 3. p. 28. noted of them long agoe When it is for our purpose the authority of Hierome is woorth any thing when otherwise it is not for our purpose it is worth nothing and afterward they condemne vs because we beleeue them not The examples how they cast off Fathers and Councels and all antiquity are innumerable they do it in euery question that fals out betweene vs whensoeuer they ioyne in the triall with vs and they confesse that they may be refused because they may erre Guido the Carmelite m Guido de Perpin de haeres c. 7. pag. 8. edit à Bad. Ascens an 1528. sayes Albeit the writings of the holy Doctors be to be handled and read and receiued with due reuerence yet is their authority neither so firme nor inuiolable but it may be lawfull to contradict them or doubt of them where they are not prooued and confirmed euidently and expresly by the holy Scripture and where the Church hath not determined their firme and vndoubted soothfastnes Whence it followes that an opinion cannot precisely be conuinced of heresie by the saying of the Doctors for where where is not infallible truth there is no certaine faith since certaine faith leanes vpon infallible truth yea there can be no infallible assent that a man should firmely cleaue to such things for when there is no infallible truth there can be no certaine and vndoubted faith But in the saying of the Doctors there is no infallible certaine or vndoubted truth partly because they sometime doubt themselues in their owne sayings whether they haue erred therein or no partly because their disagreement is a testimony of falsity and what disagreement there is among the Doctors no man doubts that hath read their writings It is not necessary therefore vndoubtingly to beleeue them but it is lawfull to THINKE AGAINST THEM DISALOW THEM AND REIECT THEM without any danger of heresie So he And yet you see how busily my aduersary taxes Protestants for neglecting the Fathers like the crabfish that chid her yong one for creeping backward and yet went backward her selfe it were an honester course and more relishing of piety for our aduersaries to spare our dissenting sometime from the Fathers as they do their owne onely inquire whether we dissent with reason as themselues sometimes do but this were labour and expence a Iesuites pen can afford railing and facing a great deale better cheape CHAP. XXI 2. Which is the Militant Church 3. And the Catholicke 4. The Church of the Elect inuisible 5. A rancid conceite of the Iesuite Pag. 113. A. D. This Church which consisteth of Professors M. White * White pag. â—9 100. calleth the Church Militant that which consisteth onely of the Elect he calleth the Catholicke Church but to keepe the Antithesis he should rather call it the Church Triumphant not Triumphant as we Catholickes take the name for the happiest part of the Church which is now glorious in heauen but as it being a Church inuisible in earth may triumph indeed as hauing no need to feare any persecutions in that none in time of persecutions can finde theÌ„ out nor can know them nor consequently can persecute or hurt theÌ„ for being members of Christs true Church But as in this respect it may be called the Church Triumphant so on the other side it may be called the Church Lamentant as hauing so iust cause to lament in that the members of it being vnknowne not onely to the world but to one another can haue no societie one with another requisite to the nature of a true Church nor can performe those offices which should be done in and onely in the true Church nor can tell whom to repaire to for instruction in faith or for counsaile in direction of manners or for the comfort of the holy Sacraments nor can haue any knowne Pastours to gouerne the Church nor any knowne sheepe to obey these Pastours nor can haue any Historiographer to write their actes thereby to edifie men with the vertues exercised by them or so much as to make it appeare to posterity that such a company hath bene according to Christs promise alwaies extant in the world In this respect it may be called a Church Lamentant or a Lamentable Church 1 MY Aduersary being in a deepe discourse about the persons and societies of men to whom alone God vouchsafes the assistance of his Spirit for the vnderstanding and beleeuing the things of faith thinks himselfe interrupted by a speech of mine in the place quoted touching the Church Militant and Triumphant the which if he had misliked he should haue confuted in it owne place where I vsed it to shew the true state of the question concerning the visiblenes of the Church saying the question is of the Militant Church though we say also that the Church mentioned in the Creed euery member whereof is saued be in some sort inuisible too in that the Church Triumphant in heauen which is one part of the Church mentioned in the Creed is to vs that liue here inuisible and onely beleeued This speech my Aduersary according to his disordered and cowardly Method vsed in all his booke durst not confute in it owne place where it lay but drawes in backwards by the taile into the den of his discourse as * Apollodo de orig deorum they say Cacus did the oxen he stole from Hercules that he might the better descant vppon it when his Reader by this his glancing at it cannot know the purpose whereto I intended it nor the ground whereupon I affirmed it 2 That which he sayes is foure things First that I call that which consists of Professours the Church Militant the which you see he mentions so that one would thinke he meant to condemne it yet he dares not but onely craftily repeats it to expose it to censure with the rest that followes for a Catech. Roman pag. 112. edit Colo. an 1507. Bellar. Eccl. mil. c. 1. his owne side speakes in the same manner D. Bannes b 22. pag 94. edit Venet. apud Dâ—mian Zâ—nar 1602. sayes The Church which VPON THE EARTH LIVES IN WARFARE is called Militant One way as it is a congregation of such as professe the faith of God another way as it is congregated not onely by faith but also by Baptisme In this therefore there is no fault but all is well for this part of the Church on earth that liues in the Camp warfaring with the
it is impudencie to denie his conclusion so apparently proued on the other side we dare not grant it for feare of the people Here is neuer a true word First his conclusion is not proued For the arguments which he propounded to demonstrate it he hath not followed nor vpholden but leauing them in the field behind him he runs away without so much as looking behind him and in all his Reply rescues not one of them Secondly his conclusion is iustly denied and without impudencie for it is no impudencie to denie that which cannot be proued but it is impudencie to require men to beleeue that which hath no proofe He speakes of his proofes as he doth of his Church all is eminent illustrous apparent plaine visible to all when yet no man sees them Thirdly the reason why we grant not the Church to be in his sence visible is not for feare of the people nor because we cannot giue the Professors of our faith in euery age but because it is the truth which with all his boasting he cannot remoue for albeit the Church neuer failes but abides perpetually visible in some degree to the end yet is there not alway therein a visible companie by profession and gouernment distinct from the rest that is free from the generall corruption that preuailes in the Church of which company onely the question is He maintaining that the Church cannot erre nor be subiect to any such corruption but hath alway in it eminent professors and speciall congregations that are neuer infected with any part of the corruption nor need reformation which persons and congregations appeare as visibly and distinctly to all men as worldly kingdomes are distinctly seene and knowne and we holding the Church to be perpetuall onely because there are alway in the world which hold the true worship of God and to be visible in regard it may at all times be seene though heresie may so preuaile and persecution so arise that a visible companie shall not appeare which is not in some measure touched with the common errors or needs not repentance and reformation All which is so true that I challenge the Replier and prouoke the zealousest of my aduersaries to say ingenuously if the learned Papists alledged Digress 17. say not in effect as much themselues 2 Our answer therefore is direct and plaine both to the conclusion and the reasons and so direct that the Iesuite hath no stomack to reply but exceeding grosly falsly expounds affixes a meaning to vs that we neuer meant First he says we distinguish two seuerall Churches whereof we call the one the Catholicke Church mentioned in the Creed containing onely the elect the other the Militant Church containing as part of the Catholick the professors of the true faith whether good or bad beleeuers or hypocrites elect or reprobate Next he sayes the reason why we thus distinguish two seuerall Churches is that when we are hunted out of the one we may runne into the other This he expounds something more plainly That which as I guesse for he hath no certaintie of what he sayes driues them to admit such a Church militant distinguisht from the Catholicke is least if none should be said to pertaine to the Church but onely the elect it would follow that men might despaire of attaining true faith which is not had but by the teaching of the Church for as much as they could neuer know who are elected Thirdly he says this Militant Church which other Protestants commonly call the visible Church M. White will needs defend to be sometimes inuisible That these things may the better be vnderstood and answered note FIRST that by the word Church taken in his full latitude The Church we meane the whole companie of all those whom God calls to the knowledge and profession of his truth and so to saluation Of which calling and separation from the rest of the world liuing in Atheisme and idolatry without the knowledge or acceptation of those supernatural verities that leade to God it hath the denomination and is called the Church as if you should say a companie called or gathered forth of the rest of the world But one church Note SECONDLY that the Church absolutely and simply considered in this latitude is but One as the state and company of the kingdome of Great Brittain is but one in as much as all and euery one called to this grace of how different state qualities or condition soeuer belong one way or other to this companie for the faith being but one and the maner of calling by reuealing the same but one the companies that receiue and professe it how many soeuer respectiuely yet absolutely and abstracting from particular conditions of times and persons can be but one Note THIRDLY that in the Church being absolutely but one there are sundry differences and respects that is to say the persons called to the faith of Christ are of diuers sorts as the kingdome of Great Brittain being but one yet is diuers waies considered For some part of the Church being reduced from the state of this mortall life reignes with God in heauen and is glorified with that glorie whereto it was called when it was here on earth The triumphant Church This we call the Triumphant Church because as triumphers they enioy the reward due to conquerers The other part of the Church is that which successiuely in all ages liues here in this world professing that it desires to follow the Triumphant The militant Church and enioy eternall life this we call the Church Militant because it lies as it were in the campe fighting against the world the diuell and the flesh vnder the banner of Christ waiting for the victorie But among these againe there are two sorts of people the first all such as are called effectually The Church of the elect these are the elect onely whom God not onely calls but inspires also effectually to obey his calling and to liue holy and vnblameable in such sort that they shal infallibly be saued in the life to come The inuisible Church This company we call the inuisible Church because God onely sees who are his we can see the men and by their fruits hope they are Gods elect but to speake precisely no mortall eie can discerne them to be Gods elect but God alone by reason hypocrites and the reprobate do many times resemble them in shew and profession The second sort of the Militant Church are hypocrites and vnsound members that are not called effectually but disobey the truth whereof they make profession such are heretickes schismatickes and all the wicked that will not obey the truth whom we call the false and malignant church The malignant Church Note FOVRTHLY that howsoeuer the elect liuing here vpon earth and effectually called be inuisible in the sence deliuered yet when we say the Church militant is sometimes inuisible we meane it of the Church Militant that liues in
the world and outwardly professes the faith of Christ whether they therein that do it be the elect or others for we onely speake of the place and companie where the truth is professed and may be found which may well be where the wicked and the elect are mingled together Note FIFTHLY that the Church is called Catholick or vniuersal in two sences first the Church taken in his full latitude Catholicke Church for the whole company of all that are called both in heauen and in earth visible and inuisible elect and hypocrites is called the Catholicke Church in as much as it comprehends all that haue bene called to the profession of the Catholick faith then againe for so much as any part may synecdochically be termed after the name of the whole it sometimes fals out that the Militant Church or any part of it iâ— called the Catholick as well as the Militant and Triumphant together But when the elect alone most perfectly haue the Catholicke faith and not onely vse the faith ministerie and Sacraments reuealed but also enioy the effectâ— and benefits thereof which the false Church neuer doth hence it comes that they principally and as the vniuersall members thereof are called the Catholicke Church mentioned in the Creed a Alià s omnes homines etiam infideles etiaÌ„ damnati dicerentur pertinere ad corpus Ecclesiae tanquam eius meÌ„bra quod est absurdum Turrecrem sum l. 4. part 2. c. 20. ad 6. idem l. 1. c. 57. the rest in very deed and truth not being of the Church at all for Bellarmine b De Eccl. l. 3. c. 10. pag. 13â— d sayes The Church chiefly and in her intention gathers together onely the faithfull but when dissemblers and such as beleeue not truly are mingled that fals out besides the intention of the Church for if she could know them she would neuer admit them or being admitted she would presently exclude them Againe c Ibi. pag 141. a Heretickes faining themselues to be Catholickes are not of the Church indeed but onely in reputation and outward appearance 3 This being the manner how we distinguish and hold touching the Church and the manner thereof now I answer that which the Rplier hath reported * Ad. 1. To the first it is false and malicious that we make two Churches for the Catholicke Church mentioned in the Creed and the Militant make but one Church which in one sence is called Catholick and Militant in another For the multiplication of diuers states degrees and relations belonging to a thing multiplies not the essence of the things as he that deuides the world into parts or distinguishes the climates or shews the diuersitie of the inhabitants doth not distinguish seuerall worlds but affirmes diuers states and conditions in one and the same world I am ashamed when I reade d See Staplet relect pag. 36. our aduersaries that should haue learning and shamefac'dnesse or at least ordinarie wit thus wrangling with vs as if we made two Churches * Ad 2. To the second it is likewise false and fitter for a parasite that sets himselfe onely to boast and reproach then for a diuine For our answer is plaine and direct that the Church considered in such state as it is ordained and fit to teach men the true faith and as mortall men can haue accesse to it which belongs onely to the Militant state is sometimes so ouerwhelmed with persecutions â—nd heresies that a true Church entirely teaching the faith of Christ without errors and freely vsing the word Sacraments and Ecclesiasticall discipline apart from the rest of the Church cannot be seene in all the world And our aduersaries arguments being applied to this neither hunt nor pursue vs so but we can answer them without flying into the Church of the elect for we do not say that the elect alone are thus obscured but euen all whether elect or reprobate that openly hold the state mentioned in this sence that not onely the elect are inuisible not to be discerned with mortall eye for they are alwaies so in this world but the whole Church Militant containing both elect and others is at some times so defaced and obscured that the world cannot see where the substance of faith is holden without errors mingled And so it is meerly vntrue that the Replier sayes touching our flying to the Church of the elect For as I answered in e Pag. 100. THE WAY though we hold the Catholicke Church mentioned in the Creed euery member whereof is saued to be inuisible because God alone sees who are elected yet the Church thus considered is not it that we speake of in this question but the Militant whereof we say it IS ALWAY manifest to the world but a companie therein that needs not reformation is NOT ALWAY manifest And whereas he sayes we will neuer be able sufficiently to proue the Church spoken of in the Creed and in the Scripture where the promises of the Spirit are made to the Church to containe none but the elect he is deceiued For though this be not materiall to the point in hand and without any disaduantage to our cause might be granted yet the best learned of his owne side say as we do that none are simply absolutely and vniuocally of the Church but the elect alone as I haue shewed immediatly before For f Eph. 5.23 Col. 1.18 the Church being nothing else but the bodie of Christ and Christ being the Sauiour of his bodie how shall hypocrites and other euill men whom he neuer saues be truly said to be his Church And when g Jtaque neque pro illu qui non saluantur obtulis suam passionem qui nunquam participauerunt ipsius merita neque pro eis qui iustificati non sunt Patrem orauit Christus Non pro mundo inquit rogo sed pro eis quos dedisti mihi Dicitur autem mortuus esse pro omnibus quia mors illius sufficiens fuit ad satisfaciendum pro omnibus Omnium delictis pro innumerabilibus alijs si essent ad perducendum omnes homines ad Dei gratiam And. Vega. pro concil l. 4 c. 10. pag 49. the effects and power of Gods calling and the benefits of his grace and the redemption of Christ reach no further then to the elect alone neuer touching the wicked that l ue among them how can the wicked either perfectly or properly be long to the Church But as I said this is not materiall to the point in hand and therefore I will not diuert into it our assertion being that not the elect alone are alway inuisible but sometimes also all the congregations of the world wherein they liue and professe Christ are so corrupted or oppressed that albeit the substance of sauing faith contained in the Creed and rule of faith be retained in them yet there is no congregation visible that hath not diuers corruptions needing reformation hanging on them
gracions and fauorable speeches of Papists better then they deserue in Parliament and otherwise yet this cursed generation of Amalek could neuer be reconciled but still conspired his death many times ouer and then the ruinating of all by POWDER and at this day by bookes openly published against him traduce his Name Religion and Gouernment that the meanest subiect in his kingdome could not be baselier entertained with railing and presumption Seminaries and Iesuites leading the ring in all this and applying thereto the holiest things of their religion so farre forth that hardly an instance can be giuen of any iniury or vnloyall part against him since his blessed raigne among vs but these Romane priests haue bin the authors d 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Simoc. hist Maurit p. 200. as if the sacred maiestie of a kingdome were no lesse to be played with then childrens trifles You that are thus without humanitie vnnaturall â—â—pious cruell murderers how can you be called Christians e Pro Athan. lib. 1. pag. 65. sayes Lucifer Calaritanus to the Arrians and I to the Iesuites 2 But forsomuch as these Assasines so desperately deny their profession and pleade their innocencie denying that which their religion teaches so manifestly I will take a little paines to confirme what I haue said something more fully the rather because they beare the world in hand we belie and slander them and such as know no more then the Iesuites tell them imagine it is so indeed and therefore I say still and here write it in capitall letters that THE CHVRCH OF ROME TEACHES DISLOYALTIE AND REBELLION AGAINST KINGS AND LEADES HER PEOPLE INTO ALL CONSPIRACIES AND TREASONS AGAINST STATES AND KINGDOMES this I shew by the doctrine and assertions of the chiefest Diuines therein Augustinus Triumphus f Sum de eccl potest q 40. art 1. The Emperor of heauen may depose the Emperor of the earth in as much as there is no power but of him But the Pope is inuested with the authoritie of the Emperor of heauen he may therefore depose the Emperor of the earth g Art 3. The Emperor is subiect to the Pope two waies first by a filiall subiection in spirituall things in as much as spirituall gifts from him as from the fountaine are deriued to the Emperor and to all the children of the Church Secondly by a ministeriall subiection in his administration of temporall things For the Emperor is the Popes minister by whom he administers temporall things Aluarus Pelagius h De Planct eccl l 2. c. 13. p. 3. The Pope hath vniuersall iurisdiction ouer the whole world not onely in spirituall but in temporall things albeit he exercise the execution of the temporall sword and iurisdiction by his sonne the Emperour as by his aduocate and by other Kings and princes of the world The Pope may depriue Kings of their kingdomes and the Emperor of his empire i Cap. 21. The Pope may depriue him of the empire that is disobedient and persecutes the Church Such shall euery Prince be expounded to be that receiues not the Popes religion Capistranus k De Pap. concil author pag. 65. The Emperor if he be incorrigible for any mortall sinne may be deposed and depriued The sentence of the Pope alone without a councell is sufficient â—gainst the Emperor or any other It is manifest therefore how much the Popes authoritie is aboue the imperiall câ—lsitude which it translates examines confirmes or infringes approues or reiects If he offend he punishes deposes and depriues him and when he iudges his sentence to be vniust he reuokes and abrogates it Thomas of Aquine l 22. q. 12. art 2 Any man sinning by infidelitie may be adiudged to lose the right of dominion as also sometime for other faults The infidelitie of those that haue receiued the faith may sententially be punished in this that they shall not beare rule ouer beleeuing subiects for that would tend to the great corruption of the faith and therefore so soone as any one for apostacie from the faith by iudgement is denounced excommunicate IPSO FACTO HIS SVBIECTS ARE ABSOLVED FROM HIS GOVERNMENT AND FROM THE OATH OF ALLEGIANCE whereby they were bound vnto him And least it might be thought that the meaning is onely of such Kings as are vnbeleeuers and apostates marke how Cardinall Tolet expounds it m Refert Allen answer to the book of Engl. Iust p. 68. Note that albeit S. Thomas named onely an Apostata yet the reason is all one in the Princes case that is excommunicated For so soone as one is denounced or declared an excommunicate all his subiects be discharged of their obedience For though the crime of a Prince be notorious yet before declaration be made thereof by the Church the vassals are not assoiled from obedience as Caietan well holdeth which declaration being made by the Church they are not onely discharged of their loyaltie but are bound not to obey him any more except it be for feare of their liues or losse of their temporall goods As it was in England in the time of Henrie the 8 whom though the subiects were bound not to obey after he was denounced excommunicate yet for that he was a cruell man and would either haue killed or spoiled them they were excused in obeying him So he Which words being reported by D. Allen he addes of his owne Thus doth this notable Schoole-man write neither do we know any Catholicke Diuine of any age to say the contrarie But he deceiues the reader touching the point of excommunication For the doctrine is that subiects are discharged from obedience before the Prince be denounced or declared Dominicus Bannes n 22. pag. 590. idem Greg. à Valen. vbi infra Where there is euident knowledge of the crime the subiects may lawfully if they haue strength exempt themselues from the power of the Prince before the sentence declaratorie of the Iudge This conclusion is followed by Caietan and it is the more common opinion with Thomas his disciples and they approue it Excommunicating therefore or not excommunicating denouncing his disobedience by the Pope or not denouncing it is all one to the discharging of his subiects from their alleagiance if the King giue not the Pope contentment o Nam in casu posito adest semper voluntas interpretatiua Pontificis ratiha bitio ipsius Sed haec voluntas obtinet vim sententiae Bann vbi sup For the Popes will hath the force of a sentence and where the King will none of his religion or will not subiect himselfe to his lust his will is alway expounded to be against him and the euidence of his deed obtaines the force of a sentence And so to proceed Franciscus Victoria p Relect. pa. 83 I say the Pope hath most ample power because when it is necessarie to a spirituall end he not onely may do all things that secular Princes may but he may create new Princes and remoue
56. hereticall and temerarious or further then as he held it with violence and passion Let him reade the Bull and he shall finde therein many propositions that himselfe will not condemne The second is that as an euill worke of his nature merits eternall death so a good worke of it owne nature merits eternall life yet t Sicut se habet culpa ad poenam ita opus virtutis ad gloriam Sed culpa ex condigno meretur poenam ergo actus virtutis ex condigno meretur vitaem aeternam Tho. 2. d. 27. art 3. Quae quidem satis indicant non minus sempiternam foelicitatem iustorum esse praeclaris operibus debitam quà m aeternos cruciatus eorum sceleribus qui nō nouerunt Deum Andrad orthod expl pag. 517. God giues as wel euerlasting life and glory to men for and according to their good workes as he giues damnation for the contrary workes Rhem annot Rom. 2. n. 6. this is generally holden among all their Diuines The eight proposition is that in such as are redeemed by the grace of Christ there can be found no good merit which is not freely giuen to him that is vnworthy yet the Iesuite sayes here that all our workes merit by the grace of Christ which is false if the Bull censure truly for to haue no merit but such as is freely giuen to him that is vnworthy and to haue merits that are not freely giuen but the partie is worthy are contrary The 14 is that our workes at the last iudgement shall receiue no ampler reward then by the iust iudgement of God they deserue yet Vega u De Iustificat q. 5. holds this opinion The 30 is that no tentation can be resisted without the grace of Christ yet x Abulens in Matth 19. q. 178. Gregor Arimin 2. d. 28. Cassal quadrip instit par 1. l 1 c. 25. Bellarm. grat lib. arb l. 5. c. 7. many Schoole men hold it The like may be shewed in other propositions there censured and yet commonly holden by the learned in the Church of Rome whereupon I conclude that the Bull is no sufficient argument to proue the place I cited out of Baius not to be the doctrine of the Church of Rome but the Iesuite would vse the name thereof to serue the present turne when he had no true vnderstanding of the drift and purpose of it CHAP. VIII 1. The Papacie brought in by Satan 2. The Iesuites spirit of contradiction 3. The Church of Rome reuolted The fiue Patriarchs were equall at the first 4. Plaine Scripture against the Papacie 5. The ignorance of popish laitie 6. Corruption of writings by the Papists 7. Reformation desired long afore it came 8 9. Aduice giuen to A.D. A. D. In the same Preface I finde many other notable vntruths Pag. 27. as § 3. where he affirmeth that the Papacie was brought in by Satan at the first and is still continued onely to seduce the world 1 BY the Papacie I meane all that masse of innumerable errours in doctrine and Church-gouernement wherein they differ from vs and of it I do confidently affirme as a §. 48. n. 1. I expound in THE WAY that in processe of time it grew as a scabbe or a disease in the Church which in the beginning knew no such faith and forsomuch as b Mat. 13.25 all innouations are tares the enemy that sowes tares among the wheate is the diuell therefore I affirmed and yet doe that the Papacie was brought in by the diuell as all other heresies were And forsomuch as c Parum enim interest an cum daemone quis habitet an cum viro Apostata Effrem test pag 793. Mihi certe ille nunquam aliud quà m diabolus erit quia Arianus est Hilar cont Auxe sub fin there is little or no difference betweene the Diuell and an Apostata or an hereticke therefore I adde that to communicate with the Papacie is to follow d 1. Tim. 4.1 the doctrine of diuels A. D. And againe Pag 28. that Catholickes seeke nothing but to be contrary to Protestants and euen hate the name of peace 2 I did not onely say this but I shewed it also first by relating the paines that in vaine and to no purpose hath bin taken with them to bring them to reconciliation and namely at the conference at Regenspurge where diuers points being agreed it is well knowne how Ecchius a man of an vnquiet spirit e See his Apol. adu Bucer sup act colloq Ratispon laboured to dissolue the agreement and discredit all that was done with the Emperour and States that had taken so much paines therein Then by the froward words of two Iesuites Bellarmine and Maldonate whereto I adde a third as refractary as they Lorin a Iesuite hauing related the iudgement of sixe great learned men against the vulgar Translation in a certaine place f Comment in 2. Pet. 1. pa. 62◠sayes They please him not for this cause because he would haue Catholickes more fauourable to the vulgar Translation and more to abhorre the sence of heretickes That is to say rather then they shall agree with vs in the truth he would haue them follow the old Mumpsimus in a lie This is the malepart spirit in our aduersaries that I speake of whereby the Reader may guesse what loue they haue to peace when vpon hatred against vs because they will not be said to yeeld they will not accept of that which themselues thinke may be truth Pag. 28. A.D. Also § 6. where he affirmeth that the present Romane Church in wholy departed in the questions controuerted from the ancient and retaineth nothing but the title and that the ancient Church of Rome professed the same faith which Protestants now professe 3 This matter is purposely shewed in g Digr 49. 51 THE WAY and handled at large in this Defence and it is not onely true but so easie also to be shewed that the Iesuite durst not so much as looke in the face that which I here added to demonstrate it He thinkes his deniall is confutation enough and so it is possible with his followers that reade his Reply but list not to heare what I added to make my word good First out of Pelusiot how a Church may lose the faith and yet retaine her name still As Lais many a day after she was turned curtizan yet was called Lais still and then out of Balsamon and Nicephorus two Patriarkes in the Greeke Church That in ancient time the Pope had not this primacie nor Rome the royaltie that now they haue To them I adde another testimonie out of Theodore Stuclites h Lib. 2. ep 129. ad Leo. Sacell The diuine and heauenly points of faith are committed to none but those to whom Christ said Whatsoeuer you binde vpon earth shall be bound in heauen and whatsoeuer you shall loose vpon earth shall be loosed in heauen But who are
Popes Supremacie e Hom. 49. in op imperf Paris in 8. an 1557 See Bellar. de verb. Dei l. 4. c. 11. §. Sexto profert Posseu appar to 1. pag. 847. Chrysostome where he iustifies the Scriptures f Ind. expurg Hisp pag. 18. Gregorie Nyssen where he speakes against the worship of creatures Why do you g Iâ—d ex purg Belg. pag. 12. professe that in the old Catholicke writers you beare with many errors and when in disputation they are opposed against you you extenuate and excuse them and many times by deuising a shift denie them and feine some fit sence vnto them Why do you take order that h Posseu biblio select l. 1. c. 48. pag. 38. in the publicke Libraries of Princes and others euery one shall not see the manuscripts Greeke Latin or any other which are not permitted by the Church because these also must be purged What is the meaning of that speech which i Apparat. verb Anton. Florent Posseuine the Iesuite vses of Antoninus and his writings that he now enioying the blessed light of heauen no doubt desires that all his writings should be reviewed and occupied purer then of old they were Say now and dissemble not is it not a violent presumption that the Fathers are cleare for Protestants when Papists thus purge and censure their writings in such things as are in controuersie betweene vs and are they not resolued in this damned course of purging bookes when they thinke the authors in heauen reioyce to see their workes hereby made purer Verily Erasmus k Ep. ad Card. Mogunt said that many things are condemned in Luthers bookes as hereticall which in Austin and Bernard are read for good Diuinitie And our contentment is that daily experience shewes this to be true l Ph. Camerar medit hist to 2. pag. 39. Macro l. â— c. 8. They write how the Romanes at the siege of Carthage according to their maner first coniured the Dij tutelares out of it afore they proceeded Be thou a God he or she that protectest the people or citie of Carthage but specially thee the Patron thereof I worship thee first and then intreate thee to abandon Carthage the citie the places the temples euery thing thereof and to come away to vs and ours and dwell in our citie our places our temples and be our Patrons So do we vow you playes and sacrifices Thus play our aduersaries in printing the bookes of the ancient Fathers and Schoole-men If thou be a God or a Goddesse come forth if a doctrine or a period that protectest the Church of the Protestants come away we intreate thee forth of the Text forth of the Table forth of the Margent into our Indices expurgatorij and we vow to sacrifice you in the fire A D. Againe that Protestants haue done nothing against the Church of Rome but innumerable people in all ages wished it long ago 7 I said another thing immediatly before this that the Iesuite skips We haue the mercies of God to pleade for vs whereby our Church hath bin miraculously vpholden When they threatned God defended vs when they practised and expected our ruine God disappointed them when they wrought all manner of treasons yet God deliuered vs. The conscience of his owne guilt and the enuie of our well-doing would not let him mention this yet here againe I commend it to him that by considering the behauiour of his side towards vs he may the better discerne what they are And to that he hath obserued I answer that I shewed the truth thereof in the same place by the example of Gerson and testimony of Nauclere which the Iesuite dissembles because his occupation is not to obserue the grounds of my speeches but to raile me downe yet the m Reformationê autem generaleÌ„ ecclesiae extremè necessariam fore nostru temporibus mores corrupit totius orbis praenuntiant cum reuera penè omnis caro corrupit viam suaÌ„ Iac. de Parady Collect. de sept stat eccl willingnesse to accept reformation and the ioy of all nations when it came and the detestations they shewed of the Romish tyrannie that had oppressed them shewes I said the truth And if I had to do with an aduersary of any worth or that were fit for a discourse or saw it otherwise needfull to satisfie others I would in confirmation hereof repeate my words that I then vsed What ceremonie what doctrine what custome what one parcell of their superstition haue we refused but the world long since complained of it The tyrannie and oppression of old Babylon was neuer so complained of I will onely mention the speech of Gerson that was Chancellour of Paris almost a hundred yeares before Luther whose bookes from the beginning to the end containe almost nothing but complaints of the Churches state he n Tom. 1. pag. 241. E. sayes Let experience answer what hurt what danger what confusion the contempt of the sacred Scripture which yet is sufficient for the gouernment of the Church vnlesse Christ were an vnperfect law-giuer hath brought let the Cleargie be viewed which should haue married heauenly wisedome which is peaceable and chaste if it haue not committed fornication with that adulterous harlot earthly humane and diabolicall wisedome The state of the Church also is it not all become as it were brutish and monstrous That many doubt not to consult that this state of the Church were better to be gouerned by the inuentions of men then by the diuine Euangelicall law as if the soule were lesse then the bodie and spirituall food lesse then carnall This assertion on my faith is not onely false but blasphemous for the doctrine of the Gospell by the professors thereof hath enlarged the Church as farre as heauen which the sonnes of Agar seeking after earthly wisedome haue thrust into the mire and it is the mercie of God that it is not wholy fallen The which things because my conscience testifies I speake not for gaine or of ambition or for mine owne credit but for the maintenance of the truth and common good because this court of Diuines hath little promoted the truth if not contemned it which notwithstanding hath purchased to it selfe all the glorie it can Pag. 28. A. D. All these be very grosse vntruths and some of them such as not onely Catholickes but also learned Protestants will confesse to be false yea euen M White himselfe either must confesse himselfe to be blockishly ignorant or carelesly inconsiderate or else he must grant that he hath affirmed these things against his owne knowledge and conscience Which being so I might here make an end without saying any more as hauing giuen the Reader a taste of M. Whites want of truth and sinceritie sufficient to make any discreet man beware how he giueth credit to these his writings 8 Away with this intollerable bragging and let the pen be put into the hands of some if any such be
their own and I haue so truly alledged them that the quotations being many hundreds this Iesuite in all his Reply hath not so much as enterprised to answer one of them but onely that of Baius whereby the Reader may guesse whether in this my assertion I haue lied or not He sayes there be so many blacke lies as there be instances in my words and I confesse I haue often heard of the sound of a lie that it hath rung so lowd that it might be heard from Rome hither though of the colour I neuer heard before vntil the Iesuites began to paint them yet the argument I vsed to proue that I said the purging and razing and forbidding so many of their owne writers is vnanswerable N. D. in his Warnword and A.D. in his Reply and he that scribbled I know not what against M. Crash may satisfie such as are full gorged with preiudice but let the indifferent reader judge if the publishing of bookes which the authors whose names they beare neuer writ and the razing and purging of their writings be not a manifest signe that they find the doctrine of their Diuines in former times to be against them and to crosse the present opinions of their Church The which their practise the Iesuite makes a light matter but it must be better considered It is our plea against the Church of Rome that the doctrine thereof is altered and that we hold nothing but what the learned in that Church taught as well as we many a day since And this we are ready to shew in euery question out of their bookes a This is so manifest that it cannot be denied 1. First the books thus purged are extant which are of the chiefest of their Diuiâ—eâ— Caietan Folydore Masius Ferus Alphonsus Molineus Eugubinus Lud Viues Erasmus Duarenus Faber Rhenanus and innumerable others 2. The directions for the purging of all authors by putting into them and taking out of them and razing what they writ called Judices expurgatorij according whereunto they are to be newly printed are extant one set forth in Flanders another in Spaine a third in Portugall a fourth in Naples a fift at Rome all which are publickly to be seene of which sort there are many more that we haue not yet come by and dayly more are made as the Iesuites and their gouernours can espie in any booke what they mislike In these Indices you may see what is to be put out and what to be foisted in in the bookes mentioned 3. There is strait order that no bookâ— be printed before it be thus purged The Spanish Index sayes in the preface thereof that of necessitie some things must be wiped out and cut off The King of Spaine authorizing the Index of Flanders sayes in his letters pattents prefixed that for the propagation of religion he had caused all the Libraries both publicke and priuate to be purged and learned men to be imployed in the reading and reuising of bookes that they might the better and in shorter time be purged commanding all Prelates secretly without the priuitie of any to haue an Expurgatory Index by them and according thereunto to blot out in bookes the places noted 4. Pope Leo the tenth in a certaine decretall appoints and ordaines that hereafter for euer no man shall print or cause to be printed any booke or writing in the citie of Rome or in any other place vnlesse first by his Vicar or Minister of his Pallace or by some Bishop or other thereunto deputed it be diligently examined and subscribed 7. Decretal pag. 534. To what purpose this examination is intended appeares by the rule of the Trent Councell Such bookes as handle good matter and yet haue some things interlaced by the way which belong to heresie or impietie may be permitted after they are purged by the authoritie of the Jnquisition Ind. lib. prohiâ— reg 8 Againe Such as publish Manuscript bookes before they be examined and allowed shall be punished Reg 10 Let Bishops and Jnquisitors haue facultie to purge all bookes whatsoeuer according to the prescript of this Jndex They which are put in trust with correcting and purging bookes must diligently looke into all things and attentiuely note them not such things onely as manifestly offer themselues in the course of the worke but if there be any thing that lies priuily in the Annotations Summaries Margents Tables or in the Prefaces or Epistles dedicatorie of such bookes the things to be corrected and purged are these that follow hereticall assertions or such as are erronious sauouring of heresie scandalous offensiue temerarious and schismaticall such as they will expound any thing to be that hath bene written contrary to the present Iesuitisme though it were holden neuer so generally in the Church of Rome heretofore such as induce any noueltie against the rites and ceremonies of the Sacraments and against the receiued vse of the Church of Rome Prophane nouelties also deuised by heretickes But in the bookes of later Catholickes written since the yeare 1515. if that which needs correcting can be mended by taking away or adding a few things let it be done otherwise let it be altogether blotted out instruct post Ind. 5. Posseuine the Iesuite sayes that in the publicke Libraries of Princes and others speciall care is to be had that Manuscript bookes not permitted by the Church be not open to the view of euery one because they also must be purged Bibl select pag 36. and that Antoninus an Archbishop in the Church of Rome 140 yeares since now enioying the light of heauen no doubt desires that all his writings should be reuiewed and occupied purer then of old they were apparat verb Anton. Flor M. Witherington sayes It is not the Popes manner to permit either the deeds or opinions of their predecessors which helpe the papall authoritie to be impugned or called into question and therfore as well the Pope himselfe as the Ordinarieâ— of places and Inquisitors are carefull enough that no bookes come abroad which any wayes derogate from the Popes authoritie and if that they do come abroad that they be suppressed or not read by any without speciall facultie till they be purged which is the cause why it is so hard a thing in these times to find any clause in the bookes of Catholickes calling the Popes temporall power in question or to know what such authors thought touching the same power who most an end are enforced to speake their mind in the words of the censors Apol. n. 449 Hasenmullerus speaking of this practise of the Inquisitors reports many things that it were too tedious to report pag. 275. And the like doth Iunius praef Ind. exp Belg. to whom I referre thee Wherein to preuent vs daily they raze and wipe those things out and put the contrary in and so publish their bookes the most diuellish and dishonest course that euer any sect vsed to helpe themselues and burne vp the old editions that are the true
copies which the Authors writ and whereby that should be tried that we say So that in the ages to come when the old copies shall be worne out and their New-purged ones shall haue gotten a little antiquitie these desperate Termagants will resolutely deny that euer any such thing was written or any such purging vfed so it shal be generally maintained that the things that the Iesuites and censors haue clapt into their bookes were written by the authors themselues If this can be answered what do pillories and papers ordained for forgers when not a poore parchment of euidence but the deeds and euidences of the Christian world shall thus be forged and all antiquitie be Iesuited and reduced by this practise to the new cut 2 In the meane time I answer the Iesuite that I wil stand to my offer if he will let the triall be made by bookes vnpurged such as are the true copies that the authors published that there is no point of our faith but many learned in their owne Church hold it with vs and no point of Papistrie that we haue reiected but some of them haue misliked it as well as we and his two instances of the Masse and Reall presence I accept though I haue answered them a Pag. 158. letter m. 178. lett e. 379. lett f. in THE WAY so directly that it was his best policie to dissemble it and to require me for my credit to do that which I had done alreadie For to his first demand How many learned men of our Church haue denied the Masse to containe a sacrifice in such sort as Protestants do denie I answered b Vbi sup in two seuerall places For the vnderstanding whereof and the applying my said answer to this place the Protestants denie that Christ in his last Supper which the Iesuite absurdly calls the Masse offered any propitiatorie sacrifice properly so called according to the reall notion of the word sacrifice of his bodie and bloud This I shewed by the testimonie c Can. loc l. 12. c. 13. Suar. com 3. d. 84. f. 2. Azor instit moral tom 1. l. 10. c. 18. of three seuerall Papists to be denied by some Catholickes in the Councell of Trent and they consequently denie as we do that the Priest offers any such sacrifice d Christus ea quae ab alijs obseruanda instituit ipse primitùs obseruarit Tho 3. q. 81. art 1.0 In hac quaestione initium sumendum est ex facto Christi quod exemplar est actioniâ— nostrae fundamentum ac primum initium huius mysterij Fra. Suar. vbi sup pag. 949. because the Priest now doth no more then Christ did then in his Supper They therefore that denie Christ offered any sacrifice denie it also in the Priest And then I alledged a discourse of Thomas where he propounds the question Whether in this Sacrament Christ be immolated that is sacrificed and his answer is that the celebration of this Sacrament is called the sacrificing of Christ for two causes First because images are vsed to be called by the names of the things whose images they be as when we behold a picture on a table we say this is Cicero Now the celebration of this Sacrament is a certaine image representing the passion of Christ which is his true sacrificing and therefore is called the sacrificing of Christ Next in regard of the effect of Christs passion because by this Sacrament we are made partakers of the benefit of our Lords passion In which words making no mention of such reall and vnbloudie sacrificing as the Church of Rome now teaches it is more then plaine that he beleeued it not For if he had he would haue vttered it as fully as he doth other things Besides these I ad the Master of Sentences who e If we talke of all Diuinitie the bookes of Peter Lombard Master of the Sentences is held to be the first methodicall worke that drew all diuinitie into a certaine forme Walsing p. 128. professing to set downe all the points of Diuinitie most exactly as our aduersaries say yet no where in all his booke mentions this kinde of sacrifice but f 4. d. 12 §. Post haec quaeritur propounding the question Whether that which the Priest doth in the Eucharist be properly said to be a sacrifice or immolation and whether Christ be dayly sacrificed or were onely once sacrificed his answer is To this it may briefly be said that which is offered and consecrated by the Priest is called a sacrifice and an oblation because it is a memoriall and representation of the true sacrifice and holy immolation made vpon the altar of the crosse and Christ died once vpon the Crosse and was there sacrificed in himselfe but he is dayly sacrificed in the Sacrament because the remembrance of that which is once done is retained These words shew plainely that some learned men in the Romane Church haue denied the Masse to containe a sacrifice euen in such sort as Protestants denie it 3 So there be also that affirme the reall substance of Christs bodie to be no nearer them that receiue the Sacrament then heauen is to the earth as the Caluinists hold For Picus Mirandulus g Conclus pag 64. nu â—4 pag 65. nâ— 20. sayes the bodie of Christ is sacramentally on the altar but locally in heauen and one bodie cannot be in diuers places at once And the opinion of the Caluinists is no otherwise then h Effectum tandem vt in hanc insaniam prorumperet Berengarius vt verum corpus sanguinem Christi non esse an pane vino docuerit haec haeresis apud Heluetios hoc nostro tempore per Caluinum reuocatae est Prateol Elenc verbo Berengarius Berengarius and yet Waldensis i Sacrament Eucharist c. 19. pag. 17. tom 2. writes that there were many that with the Church of Rome condemned Berengarius for his maner of speaking which yet thought as he did And k THE WAY pâ—g 349. I alledged a saying of l 4. d. 10. q. 1. §. Quantum Scotus that from the beginning since the matter of this Sacrament was beleeued it hath euer bene beleeued that Christs bodie is not moued out of his place in heauen that it might be here in the Sacrament and yet it was not in the beginning so manifestly beleeued as touching this conuersion Where Scotus affirmes that it hath not alway bene beleeued that the bodie of Christ is moued out of heauen to be in the Sacrament * Note touching the forme of recantation prescribed to Berengarius by Pope Nicolas wherein the Pope enioynes him to say J confesse the bread and wine after consecration to be the true body and bloud of Christ and to be sensibly handled in the hands of the Priest yea broken and chewed with the teeth of the faithfull Which words are read de Consec d. 2 ego Bereng and pressed by the
Papists to explicate proue their transubstantiation that it is confessed to be too grosse and meerly false if the words be vnderstood as they sound of the bodie of Christ So the Glosse Nisi sanc intelligas verba Berengarij in maiorem incides haeresim quà m ipse habuit §. Dentibus Turrecremata Nec iste modus loquendi est tenendus Ibi. nu 1. §. Respondeo Hervaeus Quod quidem vocabulum vt sc à dentibus tereatur non est extendendum sed exponendum restringendum vt sit sensus non quod corpus verum Christi teratur dentibus sed quod illae species sub quibus realiter est tereantur dentibus Et ideo est alia opinio communior verior c. 4. d. 10. qu. 1. pag. 17. But this Glosse is proued vntrue by this that the words thus expounded containe nothing against Berengarius opinion who had denied onely the grosse and reall presence of Christs flesh it was sometime therefore beleeued by some bodie in the Church of Rome belike that his blessed bodie touching the place and maner of presence was as far from them that receiue the Sacrament as heauen is from earth This for the reall and spirituall presence If the Iesuite dare put his Transubstantiation to the triall let him looke into m Digress 49. nu 9. THE WAY and hearken what many of his owne learned men say of it and when he hath done let him take a view of the poore answer that in this his Reply he hath made vnto them Pag. 32. A.D. The fourth marke is set downe by M. White in these words The most points of Papistrie are directly and at the first sight absurd and against common sence and the law of nature If he meane that they seeme at the first sight absurd c. to the seduced people of his sect who neither beleeue nor rightly vnderstand either the things by vs beleeued or the reason or authoritie for which we beleeue them then it may be he saith true but nothing to the purpose For if this were a sufficient marke to make vs misdoubt our religion by the like reason other heretickes or infidels who do not beleeue the mysteries of the blessed Trinitie the Incarnation c. might thinke to make vs misdoubt the truth of these mysteries because they who neither beleeue these mysteries nor rightly vnderstand them nor the reasons and motiues which make vs beleeue them will say that these mysteries are directly and at first sight absurd c. yet in truth they are not absurd nor against but aboue our reason and sense so I say to M. White although other points of our religion seeme to him absurd yet in truth they are not absurd neither are they contrary to but at most aboue the reach of naturall reason 4 I do not obiect against the religion of the Papacie that it is but aboue the reach of reason For many mysteries of the true faith are so the which we must beleeue and n Nec quisquam potest intelligentiam Dei apprehendere nisi qui toto se despecto conuersus ad sapientiam Dei omnem quaerendi ratiocinationem transtuleriâ— ad credendi fideÌ„ Oros l. 6. c. 1. not examine by sence but that many points thereof are absurd and directly against sence and the light of nature which no peece of true religion is as for example that a man endued with reason should fall downe and adore and inuocate an image o Shewed in THE WAY §. 50. n. â—6 51. n 7. and below chap. 54. the which in the Church of Rome is taught and practised As many other points are as absurd as it But if it be true which the Iesuite sayes that they are mysteries which we vnderstand not being a seduced people not acquainted with the authority whereupon they are beleeued that is another matter that I knew not before for they are to blame that will demand reason for the mysteries of Rome that haue authoritie beyond reason p Apoc. 17.5 whose forehead hath the word Mysterie written in it and I had forgotten q Quia in his quae vult ei est pro ratione voluntas Nec est qui ei dicat cur ita facis Gloss §. Veri c. Quanto de transl ep Sacrilegij instaâ— esset disputare de facto suo Glos §. Quis enim d. 40. Non nos Jta nos ad iudices reuocas ac si nescires omnia iura in scrinio pectoris nostri collecata esse sic flat sententia Loco cedant omnes Pontifex sum Paul 2. Platin. p. 304. a rule in his law that forbids men to aske any reason of his doings But in the mean time where are the Iesuites r Introd q. 4. p. 100. prudentiall motiues without which nothing ought to be beleeued because the vnderstanding cannot assent to the thing propounded without some probable motiue For religion bids not men be stockes A. D. And one cause why the common sort of Protestants do at the first sight thinke them absurd is because they haue not heard points of our doctrine truly related and declared as our Authors declare them nor the reasons and authorities set downe for which we beleeue them but haue heard such ignorant or malicious Ministers as M White make false relation of points of absurd doctrine to be held by vs which we do not hold but abhorre As to go no further M. White falsely relateth in this very place that we hold the Pope to haue right to Lord it ouer the Scriptures Fathers Councels Church and all the world That we teach also men to murther the King to pay no debts to blow vp the Parliament to dispense with murther and whoredome c. These and such like be not points of our doctrine but shamelesse and slanderous vntruths by which simple people are drawne by ignorant or malicious Ministers to mislike our doctrine in generall and to be apt to haue a worse conceit of euery point of it in particular especially at the first sight then by due examination they shall finde it to deserue 5 Not Protestants onely thinke Poperie absurd but many Papists also censuring the points I haue named and misliking them shew plainly that I spake true yet the Reply sayes the cause why the common sort of Protestants thinke Poperie absurd is because they heare not the points of Papistrie truly related but their ignorant and malicious Ministers charge them to hold what they hold not This is false for first these Protestants that thus condemne Papistrie do dayly reade the Papists owne bookes which are not restrained and prohibited with a The reading and vse of Lutheran bookes forbidden not onely the vulgar but all others of what state degree order or condition soeuer they be though Bishops Archbishops or greater onely the Jnquisitors are excepted by a Decretall of Iulius the 3. See Sept. Decr. l. 5. tit 4. de lib. prohib c. 2. that seueritie wherewith
vs where is there among all the Texts that can be alledged one rule or example that we should pray thus to a liuing maÌ„ as they do to a Saint Saue me ô Sauior redeeme me ô redeemer and as is the praiers that I alledged If one of the theeues vpon the Crosse when our Sauiour died should thus haue praied to b Ioh. 19.25 the holy Virgine standing by as the Friar lately did in France when he was to be executed for murdering a man to haue his wife c The praier of a Friar vpon the scaffold when he died for a murther in France an 1609. Boter comment l. 16. p. 300. But ô thou the solace of such as are in miserie our Loadstarre in the middest of this raging sea the aduocate of men the Arke of the Testament the altar of sinners by thy suffrages ô Virgine effect with thy Sonne that I may haue my desire would the Iesuits I maruell commend his deuotion as the reporter doth the Friars zeale or if this example fume into the Iesuits head were it lawfull for a man vpon his death-bed to inuocate the liuing standing by as the d Fra. Ximenius of Toledo Gomec de reb Ximen l. 7. pag. 242. great Archbishop did the dead when he died himselfe to be his Patronesse All the Saints but aboue all the mother of God Michael the Archangell Peter and Paule Iames and S. Francis or if at an open Sessions at the Councell of Trent Sato or Mus or one of the Friars should haue begun hs Sermon with a praier to Cardinall Barrhomaeo sitting by mutatis mutandis as e Stephanus Arch. PatraceÌ„s in conc Later sub Leo. p. 621. an Archbishop sometime began his at the Councell of Lateran with his f Omnium spleÌ„dot decus perenne Virginum lumen genetrix superni Gloria humani generis Maria Vnica nostri Sola tu Virgo doÌ„inaâ—s astris Sola tu terrae maris atque coeli lumen inceptis faueas rogamus inclita nostris Vt queam sacros reserare sensus qui lateÌ„t chartis nimiuÌ„ seueris ingredi celsae duce te benignae Maenia terrae inuocation of the Blessed Virgine O blessed Charles our Churches hope and glorie of our fading light The best of all our Cardinals in Consistory shining bright Thou onely shewest the way that leads to heauens blisse vertues lore Thy life our safest loadstarre is to guide vs to the heauenly shore I pray thee giue me of thy grace and fill me with thy verities that I may boldly speake in place and beate downe Luthers heresies If I say the Friar should haue made such a prayer to him would not his fellow Cardinals haue enuied his deitie thought that inuocation would haue come soone enough after his death when he had bene Sainted The liuing therefore are not praied vnto nor intreated to pray to God or make intercession for vs nor any waies made mediatours by their intercession and merits as the dead are for that were against the office of Christ but only as feeling members of this state that see and know the wants each of other and that haue a calling from God thereto they ioyne their praiers to the rest of the body no mans merits or aduocation being interposed but euerie one with and for others immediatly flying to Iesus Christ 6 A third reason why it is lawfull to intreate the praiers of the liuing rather then the dead is for that the liuing whoÌ„ we intreate to pray for vs vnderstand and see our particular wants and are in state to take knowledge of our desire to be praied for as when Saint Paule bad the people pray for him they heard and vnderstood him what he desired which the Saints in heaven departed though full of glorie and great indowments do not And here it is not enough to bring coniectures and with shew of wordes and disputations to leade our iudgement as in this cause our aduersaries haue taken great paines to pull vpon themselves a learned error but afore I can pray in this fashion to the dead with faith if all other difficulties were cleared I must haue a sure ground in my conscience that they heare me And he that will perswade me to beleeue they do must not come with Iffs and And 's and Metaphysicall speculations and the seeming opinions of men but with that which may bring full assurance and may support faith as the Holy Ghost doth g 1. Tim. 1.15 This is a true saying and worthie of all men to be receiued h Ioh. 4.22 We worship that we know i 2. Cor. 4 3. We approoue ourselues to euery mans conscience Let it be made thus sure vnto vs that when I pray the Saints heare me and it shall willingly be receiued and beleeued This reasoÌ„ doth not immediatly proceed to shew that praying to the dead robbes Christ of his office but onely that it is against faith which being shewed thence it will easily be concluded that then Christ is robbed of his office because all prayer against faith is against Christs mediatorship in some part of the latitude thereof Now if it so please the reader let vs see what assurance the Church of Rome can giue that the Saints know our praiers 7 First it is cleare that in all the Scripture there is nothing to prooue it but the contrary For k 2. Reg. 22.20 wheÌ„ Iosiah should die God told him his eies should not see the euill which he would bring vpon Ierusalem And Salomon l Eccl. 9 5. saies the dead know nothing at all And m Es 63 16. the Prophet in a praier he makes to God saies Thou art our Father though Abraham be ignorant of vs and Israel knowes vs not the which texts shew manifestly that the dead haue as little knowledge of our state here as we haue of theirs there Or if it were otherwise God would somewhere haue reuealed it especially the reuelation thereof being so necessary for the confirmation of this point touching inuocation which n Superfluum videtur abeis ordinariè petere vs pro nobis oreni quia non possunt ordinariè cognoscere quid agamus in particulari Bellar. de purgat l. 2. c. 15. §. praetere a animae by the Iesuites owne confession is in vaine where they do not ordinarily as in Purgatory heare our prayers the which for the most part being seated in o Plerunque hoc negotium plus gemitibus quam sermonibus agitur plus fletâ— quam affatu August epist 121. c. 10. the heart and thence immediatly without any noise of words ascending vp who can vnderstand them but he that searches the heart which Philo p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Philo iudae pag. 328. Paris sayes is the musicall and loud instrument of our voice and is heard by no mortall creature but onely by him that is immortall and vnbegotten 8 Secondly our aduersaries could neuer giue themselues satisfaction
Diuell the world and the flesh in that respect by the Papists owne confession is rightly called the Church Militant 3 Next he sayes the Church which consisteth onely of the Elect I call the Catholicke Church Which he dares not denie neither when he bethinks himselfe a little better how the Catholicke Church mentioned in the Creed c Catech. Rom. in symb § Sanctorum communionem is no other then that whereto belongs the Communion of Saints the forgiuenesse of sinnes the life euerlasting and though the reprobate and vnbeleeuers mingled among these are called also by the name d Shewed cap. 39. n 6. yet are they no true or vniuocall members thereof in as much as e Eph. 5.23 Christ is the Sauiour of his body but the Church wherein they liue as mice and vermine liue in a mans house is called Catholicke in respect of the Elect. 4. The third thing he sayes is that this Church Militant and Catholicke to keepe the Antithesis I should either haue called the Church Triumphant not as Catholickes meane Triumphant but because being visible it may triumph indeed in that no persecutors can find know or hurt them But this foolish conceite auoids not that I said but idlely and rudely flies from it for the Church which in that place I affirmed to be inuisible is not the militant but the Church of the Elect alone which considered apart by it selfe and abstracting from all other respects our aduersaries themselues confesse to be inuisible in that they hold f Possunt homines aliquibus coniectutis opinari quinam sint qui ad hunc piorum hominuÌ„ nun erum pertineant certò autem scire minime possunt Haec Ecclesiae pars est incognita Cate. Rom. p 113. no man can iudge who are elected nor see the glorified triumphing in heauen and so they lie open to the Iesuites raw conceite as much as we 5 Fourthly he giues a reason why I should rather haue called the Church Triumphant then Militant or Catholicke because being as Protestants hold inuisible it neede feare no persecution but may triumph indeed when no man can hurt or finde them And then spinning out the conceite he sayes It may also be called a Lamentant or a lamentable Church in that being inuisible members thereof can haue no fellowship one with another nor performe those offices which should be done or tell where to seeke for instruction Sacraments or Pastors nor finally haue so much as a Historiographer to write their actes c. In this respect the Protestants inuisible Church may be called a Church Lamentant or a Lamentable Church This is the Iesuites crudity and yet a well digested answer to that I said touching these matters would haue more preuailed with all that loue the truth For how and in what manner we hold the Church to be inuisible and how all this that is obiected may be answered I haue shewed at large g §. 17. ad 24. in the WAY And here I onely admonish my aduersary that he had a Lamentable cause in hand and as Lamentable a faculty to mannage it when with a flegmaticke iest he mentions that which yet in the place where he was put to it thought it his best course to say nothing to it CHAP. XXII 1. Reports made by Papists that the Protestants are without religion They hold the iustification of the Gentiles without the Gospell or knowledge of Christ 2 No saluation but in one true religion 3 The Repliers tergiuersation Page 131. A. D. The conclusion of my first Chapter to wit that faith is necessary to saluation was chiefly intended to be set downe against such as thinke it sufficient to leade a morall honest life without care of imbracing either one White p. 2. or other faith Both my aduersaries grant this my conclusion therefore I need not say much about this matter 1 The conclusion here mentioned that faith is necessary to saluation was not chiefly intended against such as thinke a morall honest life sufficient without care of imbracing faith but against the Protestants whom a Wright Art 1. Posseâ—in bibl select l 8 c. 1. ad 12. they report to haue no Faith nor God nor Religion but to be meere Atheists Hosius and Prataeolus b Prateol elench l. 1. c 77. pag. 71. write that we worship the Diuell and as Catholickes forsooth worship God 9. times aday so we inuocate and worship the Deuill 10. times aday D. Stapleton sayes c Qu. 3. quod lib. p. 621. There is no Religion at all in vs neither true nor false neither earnest nor fained and what opinions they haue raised of vs in Italy and Spaine all men know neither is it credible that he thinks the faith of Christ to be so necessary to saluation as here he sayes for many Diuines of his Church allow saluation to the Gentiles who haue no faith but only morall honesty of life d Sleid. comment an 52. p. 690. This was preached at the Councell of Trent and published by e Andrad orthod explic p. 291. a principall man of the Councell the Diuines also of Collen f Bale cent 14. c. 59. pag. 220. set foorth bookes concerning the saluation of Aristotle wherein they maintained that as Iohn Baptist was the forerunner of Christ in the things of grace so Aristotle was his forerunner in the things belonging to nature Yea g Acost de Indorum salut l. 5. c. 3. Grego de Val. â—om 3. pag. 302. a Iesuite blabs it out that certaine Schoole Doctors of this time very graue men confirme that saluation may be had without any knowledge of Christ the which is true and these Doctors h That the Gentiles which know not the gospell are iustified and saued by their morall life and beleeuing that there is a God rewarding such as come towards him without the knowledge or faith of Christ is an opinion that hath great patrons in the Church of Rome Gregory of Valenza sayes it is holden by Vega Soto and Victoria to whom CASSALIVS de quadripart inst part 1. l. 1. c. 12. adds Aquinas Lyra Abulensis Bruno Dionysius Carthus Arboreus Laudunens Durand Capreolus Paludanus Ludouicus Viues and himselfe thinkes it may be holden safely Nullum in hac parte discrimen rimendum videtur si quis sibi concessa optione sententiam hanc vel illam obnixè tucatur pag. 51. ANDRADIVS Vt quis cum Deo arctissimo charitatis iustitiaeque vinculo prioribus illis seculis constringeretur nullam aliam fidem requirebat Paulus quam credere Deum esse inquirentium se munificentissimum remuneratorem esse Hanc qui accepta à rebus creatis disciplina fuerint consecuti quid est quod à iustitiae sinibus excludantur c. pag. 290. orth expl VEGA Atque hinc persuaderi potest non solum iustificari posse homines sed saluariâ—â— sine fide Christi explicita cum haberi possit ignorantia inuincibilis
all men is NO PROPER and FORMALL act of willing in God because he hath no imperfect act of willing as they call VELLEITIE but onely * Voluntatem signi a signification of will which onely is METAPHORICALL and INTERPRETATIVE in that he carries himselfe towards men as if he had that act of willing Thus thinke Caietan and Marsilius Others say the formall and proper will of God reaches not to the saluation of all men for that cause because it is not fulfilled but onely to the giuing of sufficient meanes which will onely to appoint sufficient meanes is formall in God and thereof God is said to will the saluation of all men and of this minde are many Schoole men This will of God b In 1. Tho. disp 83. nu 22. saith Vasquez whereby he would the saluation of all men euen of the reprobate verie many Schoole-men especially the newer thinke to be onely a CONDITIONATED will which they call a VELLEITIE whose act is not absolute and perfect but vnder condition Now the probabler opinion c 1. p. q. 19. ar 6 concl 2. comm saith Dominicus Bannes is that there is FORMALLY no will in God which is signified by the name of velleitie Whence it followes that since by the doctrine of Thomas and many others this Antecedent will is but a VELLEITIE it cannot be formally in God But to take downe this raw student yet a little more Soto Maior d Soto Maio. in Tim vbi sup pag. 274. saith This word God will the saluation of all men by the good leaue of so many ancient Authors we will not onely expound of will PROPERLY so called which is Gods good pleasure but of his antecedent will that is to say an IMAGINARY and METAPHORICALL will according to the which it is no inconuenience to say God will haue all men to be saued of which antecedent will or will IMPROPERLY so called Damascen speakes And e Pag. 276. againe Damascens antecedent will is but a GENERALL METAPHORICALL and IMPROPER will which they call a VELLEITIE Here you see that Damascen and Thomas his antecedent will is but a velleitie and this velleitie is no will simply or formally in God and therefore I spake not ignorantly but after the minde of the best Schoole men that write when I said out of Durand that this antecedent will is not simply properly and formally the will of God but knew well enough what I said and such as hold the contrary that this antecedent will whereby God is said to will the saluation of all men is simply properly or formally the wil of God f Opus est fateri non omnem voluntatem Beneplaciti semper impleri Magal in Tim. pag. 252. are driuen to hold a paradoxe that Gods absolute will which is defined to be the will of his good pleasure may be defeated and not accomplished which is a desperate shift and contrary to the doctrine of g Tho. 1. p. q. 19. art 6. Magist 1. d. 46. ibi Scot. Occham Dionys Capreol d. 45. q. vnic art 2. concl 5. Caiet in 1. Tim. 2.4 Dom. Ban. 1. p. q. 19. art 6. concl 2. in sum text Perer. select disp in Ioh 1. nu 73. the best ancient Diuines in the Church of Rome and directly against the Scripture which saith h Psal 135.6 Our God hath done whatsoeuer pleased him in heauen and earth i Rom. 9.19 Who hath resisted his will k Eph. 1.11 who worketh all things according to the counsell of his owne will 7 Thirdly he saith that in our ignorance possible we vnderstand not this distinction of Gods antecedent and consequent will and that is the cause why we mislike the exposition of Saint Pauls words thereby which may be true and himselfe also as ignorant therein as we For be it spoken in good time Ludouicus Viues a man of his owne side hath l In August de ciuit lib. 22. c. 1. obserued that the late Diuines of the Church of Rome either to solue or cut asunder things obiected against them haue found out so many wils of Good pleasure of Signification Antecedent Consequent of simple Complacencie or Displicencie that it were to be wished they would better explane what they say in words suited to common sence and not with these absurd nouelties of words seeke for admiration Neuerthelesse because my aduersary is so peremptory in charging vs with ignorance that we vnderstand it not and so confident of his owne exposition that any iudicious wit by the very sound of words must needs grant it to be a good and a true exposition let the triall hereof proceed betweene vs and let it be obserued whether my confident Iesuite with his wit so iudicious hath hit the bird in the eye 8 The question therefore is whether we vnderstand the distinction of Gods antecedent and consequent will touching the saluation of all men right because we mislike the exposition of Saint Pauls text made thereby or rather whether himselfe haue giuen the true exposition thereof For the deciding whereof note first that m Capreol 1. d. 45. qu. vnic art 2. concl 4. Molin concor qu. 19. art 6. disp 1. Vasquez 1 p. disp 83. c. 3. Rispol de praedifin lib. 1. q. 1. dub 2. the Schoole-men who are the principall Diuines that haue bene in the Church of Rome and labour most to fit it to the text yet differ and are contrary one to another in expounding it Ariminensis n 1. d. 46. qu. vnic ad 1. sayes This distinction is vnderstood by some one way and by some another Gregorie of Valence o Tom. 1. disp 1 q. 19. punct 2. sayes All Diuines do not declare after one manner what is to be vnderstood by the names of Antecedent and Consequent will but they expound it diuersly It is therefore an obscure and perplexed distinction conceiued in diuers sences that on our part the matter were not great whether we vnderstood it or no but on our aduersaries part it is ridiculous to tell vs we vnderstand it not when they vnderstand it not themselues and to expound the Scripture by it when all Scripture should be expounded in words plaine and manifest Note secondly that Damascen p Can. loc lib. 11. c. 2. Suar. 3. p. to 2. Suar. 3. p. to 2. disp 43 sect 3. Baron because some make him elder by almost 400 yeares who liued 750 yeares after Christ was the first that euer expounded Gods will to saue all men in these termes Capreolus q Capreol vbi sup sayes he brought in this distinction And r Valentian vbi sup Gregorie of Valence He seemes to be the first that thus distinguished the will of God Damascens words be these ſ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 de orthod fid l. 2. c. 29. We must know that God ANTECEDENTLY will haue all men to be saued and obtaine his kingdome for he made vs not to punish vs but to partake