Church catholick D. Whitaker saith the catholick Church contains not only the Church of our time but the Patriarchs Prophets Apostles and all the Saints which have been are or shall be to the end and is this Church which is made up of the Churches of these times visible These Monks must be exceeding sharp sighted saith Anton. Sadeel who see this Church and see the Apostles and Martyrs in Heaven 3. Nor hath Mr. H. cause to cast this signification of visible that it is taken for conspicuous and glorious Nor is it worthy the refuting that he â—aith that Bellarmin distinguisheth visible and conspicuously glorious for he must split a hair of the head as to its latitude who can distinguish Bellarmins fifteen notes many of his own side reduce them to a fewer number 2. Conspicuity of glory is but visibility in such and such ways as amplitude and multitude all the world over visibility in glory of preaching of working miracles and victory over their enemies and external prosperity which are things most visible and not done in a corner 3. Their own men speak not but as Mr. Hudson doth the Jesuits of Rhemes An. 3. on Matth. 5. explain this conspicuity The light of the World and City on a Mountain and Candle upon a Candlestick signifieth the Clergy and whole Church which must needs be visible to the World See how D. Fulk and Mr. Cartwright answers them Malderus a Bish. Antwer profess Lov. in 22. de virtu Theol. de Obj. fidei disp 1. Aâ— 10. q. 3. The Catholicks yield that the Church is not ever aequè conspicuam alike conspicuous Res. ad 3. Habet tamen suas proprietates visibiles It hath its visible properties true miracles works of holiness antiquity visible succession perseverance on the rock and this is all one as to be conspicuous and visibly glorious Gregor de Valentia Tom. 3. in 22. disp 1. q. 1. de Obj. fidei punct 7. 6. propriet p. 142 143. The Church is not adeo conspicua that it may be seen with the eyes but yet it may evidenter omni seculo conspici be evidently in every age seen known and pointed out by the finger as a City on a mountain Matth. 5. as the Sun in the Heaven Psal. 19. And disp 1. q. 1 punct 4. pag. 78 79. he proves the glory of miracles and other the like make the Church of Rome and not of Sectaries as he names us to be visibly known to all the world And Tannerus Tom. 3. de fide spe q. 1. dis 3. dub 3. n. 85. Insignibus quibusdam notis inter omnes alios coetus eminet its conspicuous and glorious above all other societies by these properties that it is One 2. Holy 3. Catholick in Doctrine Time Places And Causabon in Epistola ad Cardinalem Baronium Olim Ecclesia Catholica similis civitati supra montem positae nullo pacto dubia erat sed nota omnibus perspicua certa longè latèque per orbem diffusa sub Imperatoribus florens quorum dominatio ab ortu ad Occasum à Septentrione ad Meridiem porrigebatuâ— at distractionem imperii postea secuta est distractio Ecclesiae Catholicae ex illo tempore Ecclesia Catholica non desiit esse quidem sed minus illustris esse coepit So Iunius disp Theolo 43. Th 11. It may be there is no particular Church publicè nota publickly known on earth but that all have losed their external splendor And what this differs from conspicuity and glory let Mr. H. or any man shew and what glory and conspicuity is in the Christian Churches and what Sea-ebbings and flowings that glory hath read though all be not to be believed which some say Philip Nicolai l. 1. de Regno Christ. c. Bellarmin de notis Eccles. l. 4. c. 7. Io. Gerard. to 5. de Eccles c. 11. sect 5. n. 184 185 186. Euseb. l. 5. Hist. c. 24. Cyprian de unit Eccles. Tertullian contra Iudaeos c. 3. Vega. in opus de fid oper praesertim c. 3. Acosta Iesuit de procuratione Iudorum salutis 4. It s not to be passed that our Divines condemn a visible catholick Church only under one Pastor the Bishop of Rome the ministerial head and catholick Pastor of Pastors over all the catholick Church on earth and taking upon him to be Pastor of Pastors yea and the Church of Rome is perpetually visible and saith Valentia the Pope is the only head of this catholick visible Church The Hereticks saith Suarez deny in the catholick Church subjected to the Pope as the visible head proprietates ullas visibiles any visible properties by which it may be known from the Churches of Satan And therefore the Church must be invisible and therefore they deny omnem externam hierarchiam Ecclesiae caput visibile regulam fidei animatam visibilem all the external sacred order of Prelates the visible head the living and vâ—sible rule of faith That visibility of a head catholicâ— and visible body under that head we profess that we deny Now that the Pope should be the only Pastor of a Church which by no possibility he can see and that he is the only feeder of such a flock to him invisible Suppose he had the eyes of Arguâ— ten thousand times is that visibility of a Church catholick of a Church Diocesian which we deny and detest but we deny not but teach that the Church is visible in a right sense And 1. we teach that the catholick Church militant on earth is visible in its parts though it be not in its whole bulk and body all at once visible as Amesius who also is in some points for this new way of Independency So the whole body of the Heaven in both the Hemispheres is visible when enlightned with the Sun yet is not the whole Heaven all at once visible to any man living So the whole element of Water is visible not all at once and yet is so visible in its parts in the parts of the Sea Rivers Floods as it were non-sense to say such a part of the Heaven and of the Sea as in day light is obvious to our eyes were simply invisible in that sense that we say the mystical body of the catholick Church of sound Believers is invisible and believed but not seen 2. Therefore the Church catholick is 1. considered as comprehending all the families in Heaven and Earth Eph. 3. 15. Heb. 12. 22 23. Col 1. 20. this is the most large catholick Church consisting of elect Men and Angels 2. The catholick Church is that company of redeemed men for whom Christ died and it contains all that have been are or shall be that are clarified and presented without spot or wrinkle sanctified by the washing of water by the word Eph. 5. 25. Husbands love your Wives as Christ also loved the Church 27. that he might present it to himself a glorious Church c. and to this is the
believe all baptiz'd Infants are regenerate But the truth is the inward state of none can be said either a falshood or reality to the Church following the Rule of the Word in dispensing of Ordinances for in the like neither regeneration nor non regeneration can be the object of the Churches discerning Also this is to be observed that Christ hath made the sounder part of the visible Church the Church in the actual exercise of Ordinances For 1. Christ never gave a power to erre or to sin to his Church visible or to any part thereof as Nature gave not a power to the locomotive faculty to halt but to move therefore he cannot have given a power to a Synod as many but as proceeding right and to Members as choosing discerningly not as erroneously 2. Those must be the Church to whom the Promise is made they fulfilling the condition to wit he must promise his presence to those that are convined in his Name But if the larger part be the Church visible because larger and more numerous to whom the Promise is made then when the major part errâ—s and meets not in his Name Christ should be obliged to fulfil the promise to them that fulfil not the condition and ought not to fulfil the promise to those who meet in his Name and fulful the condition of the promise which is abominable for very often the larger part erres and meets not in Christs Name and the lesser part meets in his Name and shall those who fulfil the condition be defrauded of the blessing promised because they are fewer Obj. But so no questions shall be determined in Church meetings for two may say they onely meet in Christs Name Ans. These are but words for if they not onely say so but it be a real truth and if all the rest erre in that act these two are onely the visible Church though men judge them turbulent Schismaticks Hence by the way a word of that necessary and judicious question moved by Calvin Matth. 18. 18. What ye binde on earth c. Since the Church tolerateth many hypocrites and absolveth and looseth many who do but counterfeit and fancy Repentance shall we say that such are loosed and pardoned in heaven Some say by heaven here is meant the visible Church and they distinguish between Sin and Scandal and therefore that by binding and loosing here is meant not forgiveness or justification or absolution from the guilt of sin in heaven or in the Court of God or condemnation for that sin but onely deliverance from scandal and the removing of scandal and admitting of the man into the visible Church as a Member suppose his repentance be but hypocritical yet when the Church proceedeth impartially according to the Rule of Christ the sentence is ratifiâ—d by God and the man is loosed from the scandal though not from the sin the sin is yet bound before God because he hath not really repented otherwise the Church who knows not heart-actings and who really repent who not though proceeding right according to the Rule of Christ should not have the promise of ratifying in heaven what they do on earth fulfilled to them which cannot be said But taking it for a good observation that Calvin hath here that Matth. 16. Christ speaketh of binding and loosing concional by the Word preached but here Matth. 18. he speaketh especially of binding and loosing juridical in the Court of the Church by Excommunication or Absolution from that Sentence In the former consideration the question is easie No Pastor in preaching Gospel-promises or threatnings can binde but conditionally If the party do not believe and repent the mans sin is bound in heaven if he do believe and repent his sin is loosed in heaven As to the other we finde in the Word no such signification of binding and loosing in regard of scandal but they are ever spoken of in regard of sin and the guilt thereof And therefore 1. Calvin saith well That the speech of Christ is directed to no other than to those who duly and sincerely do reconcile themselves with the Church and the Lord being willing to comfort trembling consciences is not setting down a Rule for comfoâ—…g of â—ypocrites But by the contrary because hypocrites Soldly provoke to the Tribunal of God when for gross scandals they are justly cast out our Saviour saith The sentence of Excommunication is ratified in heaven The Scripture-rule is for such as obey and for those who fulfil the condition non de obliquis As to the doubt That the Church often absolves such who really repent not how then can the hypocrite be loosed in heaven when the Lord knows he does but fancy Repentance Ans. Two things hère are to be distinguished 1. The Churches proceeding in the external Court as relating to them if they impartially according to the Rule of Christ proceed and be not sudden in re-admitting but see the incestuous man near swallowed up though one mans measure of visible repentance be not the Rule to all before they confirm their love to him and forgive him 2 Cor. 2. Suppose his repentance be but counterfeit or not saving and real as was that of Ahab yet are they to receive him and admit him to the Ordinances and the Lord ratifies what they do in heaven As 1. The Lord ratifies Philips baptizing of Magus and the Lord approves the Servants inviting to the marriage-supper the man that wanted the wedding-garment for what the Lord commands that he must approve and ratifie in heaven 2. What in charitable judgements is praise-worthy that God also must ratifie in heaven yea it is praise-worthy in the Disciples when they heard Christ say One of you twelve hath a Devil one of you shall betray the Son of Man every one suspected and feared himself none of the eleven suspected Iudas but gave him charity 3. Without this God should not approve the gathering of Churches nor the casting of the draw-net in the Sea nor the sowing of seed upon all sort of grounds the way side the thorny the rocky the good ground that the chosen who are yet in the state of nature may be brought in and effectually called But in receiving in Excommunicates the Church would not be sudden In the ancient Church Sacrificers to Idols were six years before they were received they that defiled themselves with Beasts were debarred from the Sacrament thirty years Adulterers seven women who made away their Births ten years such as uncompelled denied the faith twelve years What other years Burchardus and Gratianus have may be seen Something for edification sure there was here 2. There is another thing here which concerneth the conscience of him who is to be received and when the Church-Court applies the sentence to the conscience for his personal pardon sure whatever satisfaction the people have for removing of the scandal the sentence of Absolution so relating to him is concional not properly juridical
and conditional not absolute and therefore is to be pronounced by the mouth of the Church the Pastor thus Be it unto thee according to thy Faith and Repentance and except the man really repent his sin is not loosed in heaven So then the Churches loosing from the scandal is conditional upon a seen condition of outward repentance morally sincere to the Churches apprehension but they simply and absolutely make him a Citizen of the Church and admit him to Ordinances according to the command of Christ both in private and publick Church offences If thy brother who offended repent forgive him but his loosing from the sin or guilt in heaven is ever conditional and never absolutely to be pronounced by the Pastor the mouth of the Church who cannot certainly know the condition Hence 1. the scandal is loosed in earth and heaven the Church impartially following the rule of Christ sometime when the sin remains and is bound in heaven 2. The Church may say the man is absolutely freed from the scandal so as the Church sins not in receiving him in if they follow the rule but he sins and the scandal is bound in coming in if he repent not and also as to the guilt he is freed from the sin only conditionally for the condition of removal of the scandal is seen and visible but the condition of the loosing from sin is invisible 3. Sometime the man is both loosed from the scandal and from the sin and every way loosed in heaven and earth when he both really and visibly repents 4. The Church should go as near in readmitting a fallen sinner and loosing him on earth as they can discern the Lords loosing in heaven the Corinthians seem to exceed in this 2 Cor. 2. 7. So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him 5. There is more of real Saintship required to receive in again one who hath been once a member and hath fallen and was cast out then to admit a member newly come from Paganisme 1. The larger the means of salvation have been the greater guiltiness as the scandal of a Christian is greater then the sin and scandal of a Sodomite Mat. 10. 15. Mat. 11. 22. Mat. 12 41 42. And therefore the repentance of the one must be more signal and larger then the repentance of the other 2. There is not such a measure of marriage-love required of a Virgin before she be married as after she hath been married and born children to the husband nor can any say there is so much knowledge required in a new Intrant that knows not the first elements of Philosophy as in one who hath studied seven years Hence 6. it is utterly false that as visible Saintship and real Repentance as far as can be is required of one excommunicate before he can be received in again so real visible Saintship as far as can be seen must be required in members before they be first admitted But I desire our Brethren if they judge the first receiving into the Church a loosing from sin and scandal as re-admission is they will teach it me Mr. H. If Baptism be the Seal saith Mr. R. of our entry in the Church then is not this covenant the formal cause of Church-membership Ans. If Baptism seal our membership then it is after membership and so not the formal cause of it Ans. There is in my argument no word that baptism is the formal cause of our membership Baptism is a seal of our solemn installing in the Church it 's a seal quoadnos as state and feising in houses or lands is Mr. H. Though children do not covenant personally yet they are included virtually in their parents Deut. 29. Ans. If Mr. H. mean Children not born as the place Deut. 29. doth evince what is that to the purpose we have no question with any whether unborn children have right to membership or to baptism non entis nulla sunt accidentia if he mean born infants are but virtual or potential covenanters as the seed is a tree in potentia and no tree actu so must Infants be no actual covenanters but in potentia only Anabaptists shall thank Mr. H. for this for then they are not actually holy Rom. 11. 16. nor actually to be baptized nor is God actually the God of Infants but some act is required of them to lay hold on the covenant 2. The Kingdom of Heaven then is not due to them nay not a halfe salvation but in potentia But our Saviour pronounced them actually blessed and said of such is the kingdom of God Mat. 18. 14 Mat. 19. 14. Mark 10. 14 15. Yea as Christ cannot bless unborn Infants not can he say of such is the kingdom of God if they be covenanters onely in potentia and be such only Mr. H. This covenant is either the covenant of grace or different from it Ans. The new covenant is either considered according to the benefit of saving grace given in it and so this is not the covenant Or 2. according to the means of grace offered and so the Church-covenant is contained within the covenant of grace and so the consequence is null A man may be in the covenant of grace who is not a Church-member and a man may be a Church-member who is not within the covenant of grace as Magus Ans. It is a doubt to me if Mr. H. understand his own distinction of Gods decreeing and commanding will for with Arminians he saith these are contrary wills 2. My argument is this The Church covenant is tither one and the same or a branch of the covenant of grace as it offers grace externally to all to Peter and Magus or then it is a different covenant That it is different Mr. H. denies for then it should not be warranted in the Gospel if it be a part of the Gospel-covenant how can they debar men of approved godliness and visibly within the covenant of grace from ordinances for such are implicitly in this covenant 3. Some are saith M. H. in the covenant of Grace that are not Church-members and contrary true but not if they be externally and professedly as Israel was for so to be Gods visible people in covenant is to be Gods visible Church Acts 2. 39. Gen. 17. 7. Rev. 11. 15. Isa. 19. 25. now we dispute whether the Church-covenant be not a branch of the covenant of the Gospel externally proposed Mr. H. yeelds it is only he saith the Church-covenant is not the covenant of grace according to the benefits of saving grace given in it true nor is the covenant of grace externally preached according to which Magus and Iudas and all such Church-members are in the covenant of grace the covenant of grace according to the benefit of saving grace given it to wiâ— a new heart and remission c. Then this cannot hinder but when one vowes to duties in baptism he also vowes he shall acquit himself in all duties of warning
congregation no Eldership Many suffered under Nero many under Maximinus So Euseb. l. 6. c. 28. under Valerian an 259. who killed Pastors and Professors as Eusebius l. 7. c. 10 11 12. especially godly Cyprian Now sure the Lord had as sweet and comfortable a providence suiting with the glorifying of his Name and advancing his Gospel by the death of so many Witnesses as if he had suffered them to meet in congregations to meet peaceably none desiring to take away their life or land as in Israels day for their meeting to serve God in congregations And it s an overturning of the Ordinances of God in the New Testament in which there is not given a land flowing with milk and honey and a promise of a temporal typical providence that they shall be free of persecution in following Church-duties and publick Worship congregational which is not existent in all ages Nor saith Mr. Ruthurfurd that Ministers are given to Ministers primarily but as they are members of the Body visible and chosen of God Ephes. 4. CHAP. V. Whether the Congregation as the Congregation doth excommunicate a delinquent or is it the Catholick visible Church which excommunicates MR. R. his meaning is that the congregation excommunicateth not as a congregation by a power which by order of nature is first in it self but by a power which by nature is first in the whole Eldership but yet not by an act coming from the privity knowledge and conscience of all the whole Catholick Body of Officers all the world over And so I grant that the Catholick visible Church doth not anteced ntly excommunicate leading witnesses and summoning and accusing and sentencing the person before the congregation as when Norwich puts a Traitor to death the State of England by the Law common to all England in and by Norwich putteth the man to death Nor doth Norwich as a single Corporation though neither simply as a Representative but acting as a part of the Body of England And the whole State doth this antecedently 1. Because the City doth this by the same power of Law common to all England quae sunt communiâ—ra sunt priora 2. Norwich puts this Traitor to death not as an enemy to that single Corporation onely but as a common enemy to the whole Kingdom 3. The City doth this by an innate power as an integral part of England for the peace and safety of the whole Kingdom yet doth not the whole Kingdom knowingly exercise an act of deliberate judicial authority in this for the man is put to death without the privity and knowledge of the whole Kingdom I used the comparison to cousen the inconsiderate Reader saith Mr. H. I hate cousening The left hand cuts off the finger of the right hand lest it infect with a Gangrene the whole body acted by the natural instinct and innate desire of self safety which is in the whole man But saith Mr. H. the chief officers are not at the mind and will and the other Churches as the whole man but the rest of the brethren are as the whole man who have an intrinsical power for the safety of the whole congregation to cut off an an infectious member Ans. Nor is the comparison to be strained I shall onely desire it to be taken as Mr. H. saith It s true the left hand doth not cut off the contagious finger but the whole man deliberate will and reason consenting thereunto and the finger is cut off not by the power of the left hand onely but the intrinsecal power of the body And it is so exactly in a particular congregation the chief officers as the mind and will and the rest of the Brethren as the whole have an intrinsecal power from Christ to remove an infectious member Ans. They have a power to remove him saith Mr. R. in his comparison not from that congregation onely but from the whole Catholick Body As the left hand cuts off the contagious finger not from the right hand onely but from the whole body It wrongeth Christ to say he hath given so selfie and narrow a power to liberate onely a body of 10 or 20 Independent members from the contagion of scandal but not to free five thousand and the associate bodies round about Let them perish Christ hath given no Organick or Church-care to the congregation toward them all saith Mr. H. 2. The comparison is not exact When the fraternity excommunicates all their officers where is the mind and will then for they excommunicate their own minde and will 3. Mr. R. never meant the comparison should hold in this That the Catholick Church as mind and will should put forth acts of deliberate reason antecedently to cite accuse sentence every delinquent in an Oecumenick Councel or some Catholick Judicature and to excommunicate all Delinquents before ever the congregation cite them With divers arguments he refutes an antecedent excommunication as if I held any such thing So Mr. H. loves to prove strongly what Mr. R. never denied But Mr. H. speaks nothing to my Argument if the mâ—n be cast out and bound on earth he must be bound only on that tract of earth where twenty Independents are But 1. Church binding in heaven and the guiltiness of the scandal is alike in all places and often more infectious to others if it be a taking heresie then to their own congregation 2. Who shall perswade that our Saviours sense is so hampered Let him be to thee as an heathen Mat. 18. 17. as thee only who art a member of the congregation whereof he is a member yea as touching Church binding neither is he a known guiltless visible Saint to all Churches on earth It is nothing but a naked evasion to say he is consequently cut off from right to ordinances in all other congregations for because one species of corporations hath condemned a man saith Mr. H. page 236. it follows not that therefore all have condemned him to imprisonment perpetual or the like Ans. Yea what one City doth in punishing a Malefactor by Law power common to all England that same all England doth in law for twenty Sons have by the same Law and Authority of the Fathers right of twenty Tables of twenty Families of the Father One is for sedition against his Father cast out of one Family whereof he is a fixed member the other nineteen though they know nothing of the fact and doe never actually cite him yet do legally and by the Law and the same very wil of the Father that ruleth them all cast him antecedently out or concomitanter or then another Law must appoint the other nineteen Families to cast him out So the same right idem numero that Peter hath to Christ and Ordinances in one Church he hath it in all and that same act of the Keyes administred according to the rule of the Word in one Church removing that right removes it from him all the World over 3. Visible Saints by this
shall not be the same spiritually politick body visible being of divers congregations contrary to Scripture expounded by Mr. H. and Mr. Cotton we being many are one body visible and visible of twenty congregations partaking of one bread and body of Christ. Now by this as a finger cut off Paul is not a finger cut off Iohn for Iohn hath all his ten fingers entire and Paul hath his nine fingers only So also if Thomas disobedient he cast out of only his own congregation he is never cast out of Church-right to Christ and ordinances in the rest of the congregations for excommunication by consequence is only a declaring by witnesses as Mr. H. saith pag. 242. that the man is cast out of his own congregation Now the declaring that Paul's finger is cut off is not a cutting off of his finger that is impossible Far less is it possible that the declaring that Paul's finger is cut off can be either a declaring that Peters finger is cut off or that that declaring is a cutting off of Paul's finger or a cutting off of Peters finger Therefore Peters being cast one of his own Church-right and Church only is no casting of him out of other Churches or real removing of his Church-right to ordinances in other Churches For that which was never really removed and Peter once had it must remain with Peter yet now Peter was never a member of any congregation but of one then membership to another congregation cannot be taken from him 4. A member is cast out as really scandalous his adultery obstinately continued in makes him be deprived of Christian fellowship with Brethren as Brethren Ergo he is deprived of the Christian fellowship of all Brethren For 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 followeth upon 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 And 5. It is thus confirmed his visible scandal is a Church-offence to one of a Sister-congregation and is apt to bring a Church-contagion to these of another congregation who are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 one body with him at the Lords Table and therefore are they now to look on him as an Heathen But who put him in that state if he be not really and formally cast out of that body when his own Church excommunicates him 6. He that hears not the Church heares not Christ and he that despiseth any Pastor sent in the name of Christ despiseth Christ Mat. 10. 4. Luke 10. 16. Iohn 13. 20. Now if this stand good one that despiseth his own Pastor only and his own congregation only though he despise all the godly Prophets Pastors and soundest Churches on earth despiseth not Christ nor his Father that sent him nor is he first in foro Dei bound in Heaven and guilty before God nor deserves he to be excommunicate for he hath not failed against that He that despiseth you despiseth me For that is true only when any despiseth their own Pastor or their own congregation And if so then when one is cast out and judgeth an heathen for not hearing of his own Church he is not heathen in Heaven and in foro Dei as touching his communion with other Pastors and other congregations 7. Peter before he was excommunicated had a real right to the Lords Table in all Churches on earth and so a sort of membership and visible communion with all these Churches Now if by the act of excommunication in his own Church this right be not taken from him then must it be taken from him by all the Churches and so all the Churches must excommunicate when one excommunicates and by the like all must admit one into membership when one admits into membership Mr. H. The Sister Churches Mr. R. receive members of other Churches to communion by an intrinsecal Church power Ans. By an authoritative Church power we can enjoyn our own members to come to the seals or else censure them but we cannot so deal with others if it shall seem good to them to refuse Ans. This only follows that the congregation hath a larger Church power over their own members both to censure them if they come not and positively to admit them if they come but Mr. H. must confess that the congregation admits strangers of other congregations by a meer private pâ—wer and by no Church power which is gross Erastianisme and makes it arbitrary to one single Pastor to admit some to the communion as he pleaseth and some not 2. By no Church power is the Sacrament tendered to strangers of another congregation so may the Minister give this seal to a stranger in his chamber which is a private communion for there is no authoritative Church power required to give it to some Whereas Paul saith it is a priviledge of the Church coming together to eat the Lords Body 1 Cor. 11. 17 18 21. 1 Cor. 10. 17. 3. This Supper must be given to our own Church members by Church authority to strangers by no Church authority 4. It is by accident that the congregation cannot compel strangers to come to this seal for in Collegio the Elders of the congregation may joyntly with the rest of the Presbytery censure these of another flock who altogether refuse the seals 5. Mr. H. grants that a congregation excommunicates in the general nature of a congregation Well then the general nature discourseth in man and so doth a Church in an Island excommunicate Ergo that Church proceeding according to the rule of Christ casts the man formally out of all the congregations on earth Mr. H. addeth yea the neighbour Churches are saith Mr. R. to exercise the punishment of avoiding the excommunicate person as an heathen which follows from a power which is no wayes in them what conscience is here Ans. A good conscience if we may carry our selves to a scandalous mâ—n so dâ—clared by two or three witnesses as we avoid his company far more upon the testimony of a whole Church are we to avoid his company Ans. Then nothing is left to the neighbour Churches but is he excommunicate or not by one onely congregation they had no hand in it onely they must believe the man is rightly cast out upon the word of five or six of the male-Church who are both Judge and Party This is what I said A declararation of Excommunication is no Excommunication And then must the congregations about with the meer judgment of discretion which women have eschew the man as a Pagan Obj. By Mr. R. his way you have the testimony of the Church only which did excommunicate Ans. Yea place is left to many Churches and Synods to judg this is another matter then four of the male-Church that are both Judge and Party who declare he is cast out Mr. H. One classical Church excommunicates not antecedenter But a man in the confines of two Presbyteries is excommunicated by the Presbytery only of which he is a member saith Mr. R. Ans. What ropes can tie the consequent with the antecedent What Mr. R.
and Gentile baptized unto one body 1 Cor. 12. 12 13 14 15 16 21 22. to tender the Supper upon occasion to them and their members as Scripture 1 Cor. 10. 16 17. and our Brethren teach and stand in need of the Church-praying Church-praising Church confirmation by pastoral teaching of eminent Teachers and of Church suffering c. by Martyrdome and otherwise Then must that congregation be a visible member with all visible congregaâ—ions on earth and by good Logick all the congregations on earth are one integral catholick visible Church 11. If the Apostle here condemn a Schism and Rent not from one single congregation onely but from the body of Jews and Gentiles baptized into one Spirit ver 12 13. 25. from the Churches of Galatia Gal. 5 20. from all Churches Iude v. 19. and commend union with all Churches because of one Faith one Lord one Baptism Eph. 4. 1 2 3 4. then he supposes they are one Body Cyprian B. of Carthage Cornelius B. of Rome justly excommunicated Novatus denying mercy to them that fell Ergo those great Churches made one visible body and the Novatians were not Schismaticks because they separated from one single congregation but saith Socrates they hindred the Churches from union Augustine and Optatus Melivit and the Fathers make the Donatists Schismaticks in separating from the catholick Church and denying there was any Church but their own in one part of Africa See Pet. Martyr learnedly disputing about Schism and Calvin See Aug. and Opt. Melivitan 12. It s true saith Mr. H. of all congregations that the members do and should care one for another Ans. And this 12 I bring for one Argument if this gloss of Mr. H. remove all member-care and all organical-care of suffering and joy such as is betwixt the members of the same body from congregations toward all other congregations as toward their fellow-members and limit member care and member fellow-feeling to only members of the same congregation then this gloss must contradict the holy Ghost 1 Cor. 12. 26. And whether one member suffer all the members suffer with it or one member be honoured all the members rejoyce with it for this gloss saith I the Church of Boston complete and independent within my self care not with member care for all the congregations on earth though they utterly perish nor do I rejoyce with the fellow-feeling joy of fellow-members at the honour and spiritual good of all the congregations on earth Sure this doctrine cannot be of God which is so contrary to Scripture for that was not typical in the Old Testament that the members of the Jewish Church should sorrow and rejoyce with members of that covenanted Nation as with those mâ—mbers of the same body as David Psal. 19. 2. 122. 1 2 6 7 8 119. 63. Moses Exod. 2. 11. Heb. 11. 24 25. Mordecai and Esther Esth. 2. 1 2. ver 15 16 17. cap. 21 22. and the captive people Psal. 137. 1 2 3 4 5. and Ieremiah cap. 9. 1 2 3. Ezekiel cap. 9. 8. 11. 13. Daniel cap. 9 16 17 18 c. but we are not to mourn with those that mourn nor to rejoyce with those that rejoyce as Rom. 12. 15 with a fellow-feeling affection as with members of the same visible body though their weal and woe be most visible to us as their Church and Saintship is except with those onely who are members of the same Independent congregation for they are not of the body of which we are members as the body of Socrates feels no member pain when the finger of Iohn is cut off 7. There is a body to be gathered into the unity of faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God a body to be glorified Eph. 4. 13. Now this is the Catholick Body of Christ and the Lords end why he gave Apostles Prophets and Doctors till we be all glorified and this Church is visible because gathered and edified by a Ministry they are the visible Church which is fed by Ministers The Church built upon the Rock against which the gates of hell cannot prevail can be no single congregation for the gates of hell prevail against the single congregation therefore it must be the Catholick Church which only continues to the end And this Church is visible for to the Ministers thereof are the Keyes given to open and shut the Kingdom of Heaven by the word preached seals and censures Matth. 16. Ergo there is a Catholick integral militant Church visible If Christ reign by the preached word seals and censures over the Kingdoms of the World Rev. 11. 15. over the Nations Isa. 2. 1 2. Psal. 2 8 9. Psal. 22. 27 28. Psal. 96. 10 11 12. Psal. 97. 1 2 3 4 c. Psal. 98. 7 8 9. Psal. 99. 1 2 3. and have a visible government in the house of David Isa. 9. 7. over the earth Isa. 11. 4 10 11. from sea to sea Psal. 72. 8 c. then is there a Catholick integral visible Church but the former is true Obj. All our Divines say it is a Popish tenet that the Catholick Church is visible our Divines acknowledge no Church visible but only a particular Church Ans. Mr. Hudson a learned and godly man reaps so cleanly that I shall not cast any sickle into his field noâ— is there need 1. The Papists contend for a catholick visible Church to set their man of sin over it this Church includeth some of them say Purgatory and Heaven and Hell of both which he bears the Keys Salmeron Cornel à Lapide they may be loosed that are under the earth by Keys as members of the body He gives saith Cornelius à Lapide pardons to the dead invisible members indeed not by way of juridical absolution for the dead are no longer subjects on earth but by way of suffrage Bâ—llarmin proves from Pet. Cluniacens that the dead in Purgatory are members of the catholick Church And the Pope saith Bellarmin as the chief dispenser of the treasures of the Church may bestow upon those in Purgatory bona opera poenalia quae in Thesauro sunt the good works of the godly done by way of suffering In this the Catholick Church cannot be visible 2. The Papists contend for a catholick Church visible such as we believe to be the catholick Church in the Apostles Creed So Bellarmin makes the name of Catholicks and the name of Christians all one and the catholick Church a tree from which through divers times and ages branches have been cut And so must be as Rodericus de Arriaga Catholick extending it self all the world over in divers ages and times Ad. Tannerus The Church is called Catholick for the Universality of the Doctrine and the Universality of Time from the beginning of the World to the end enduring â—or ever and for the Universality of the Place Now they make the Pope the head and chief Pastor of this
Elders are in office and oh if they had not luâ—ked and strengthned themselves in the shadow of such as carry on the publick resolutions and how a purging of the Church is possible except to him to whom nothing is impossible is hard to divine when the body of the Ministry of whom many are malignant were prelatical Arminian and diverted into us for the 〈◊〉 are ignorant of God laâ—y such as extrude out of their sessions out of their hearts godly praying Elders and call into their place scandalous men and persecute the godly When such I say are incorporate with the chief leading men of the publick Resolutions and that in opinion judgement way and common counsels and actings for furnishing Commissions publick Messages to Court and carrying on the course of desection and their followers expect they shall not be deserted by their Patrons and the body of people in congregations are ignorant prophane and loose and yet have suffrages in the election of Ministers and Elders contrary to the word of God and acts of our Church and when it s now as it was in the prelatical times the people love to have it so and when our Brethren and other opposers have that Catholick advantage known in all ages to wit the multitude for them and against us and Pulpits have sounded against us in the prelatical language casting into our bosome that Isa. 65. 5. stand by thy self come not near me for I am holier then thou 5. Nor look we on the receiving to Church-fellowship men known enemies to the covenant and cause of God who again and again had broken their engagement and of many like unto them any otherwise then as a taking of the name of God in vain and as an heinous abuse of the ordinance of Church-pardoning and readmitting of penitents 6. The admitting of many known unsufficient and unqualified and scandalous Ministers and Elders to office in the house of God and the polluting of the ordinance of the Lords Supper by admitting thereunto many ignorant and scandalous persons is to us no part of this Government Since we earnestly desire the laudable way of the provincial Synod at London for promoving of godliness and examining of such as are to be admitted to the Lords Supper and wait to see what the Lord will do for the help of a suffering people for the gathering of the dispersed of Zion and building among us the old waste places nor do we so faint but we look toward such refreshing words Isa. 27. 2. In that day sing ye unto her a vineyard of red wine I the Lord do keep it I will water it every moment lest any hurt it What is spoken to the whole the faith of an afflicted part may own it Isa. 60. 18. Violence shall no more be heard in thy land wasting nor destruction within thy borders but thou shalt call thy walls salvation and thy gates praise Isa. 62. 12. And they shall call them the holy people the redeemed of the Lord and thou shalt be called Sought out a City not forsaken Isa. 66. 13. As one whom his mother comforteth so will I comsort you and ye shall be comforted in Ierusalem and when ye see this your heart shall rejoyce and your bones shall stourish like an herb Isa. 58. 11. And the Lord shall guide thee continually and satisfie thy soul in drought and make fat thy bones and thou shalt be like a watered garden and like a spring of water whose waters fail not It were not the wisedom of any to disoblige Christ by either neglecting or hurting of such as desire to be owned by the Lord Jesus as his own hidden ones The Lord was not in the debt of Cyrus for his favour toward his people He can be angry at all who will not kiss the Son and better heaven in the length latitude of it were turned in a mass or web of fiery anger so it were but creature-wrath I were folded in that web then that I should lie under the Gospel-indignation and anger of the Son of God But no matter of a despicable handful of such as we are we are not the godly in Scotland nor did we ever say we was the onely or all the godly in Scotland but sure we was either looked on as of the same way An. 1648. With all that owned Christ and the godly in the Isle of Britain or then some did much dissemble with us though some with whom we took sweet counsel then do now say we was in an error An. 1648. As I intend to darken the reputation of no man so far less to undervalue the authority and name of the servant of Jesus Christ Mr. Thomas Hooker yea the Commandment of God layes laws on me to give testimonie to his Learning his dexterous Eloquence and Accuracy in Disputes and as Christian report bears to judge him one who walked with God and preached Christ not with the enticing words of mans wisedom but in demonstration of the spirit and of power Yet as I hugely differ from his esteem of these against whom he disputes in putting them all to the worth of a straw and every Pen to a nihil dicit he sayes nothing and ranking us among the opposers of Christs Kingdom Cerinthus Ebion Gnosticks Valentinians whom godly Fathers did oppose and with Boniface Hildebrand Papists against whom the Waldenses Wicliff Hush Ierom of Prague did witness and with Prelates Primates Metropolitans as if we were the Prelates successors who would keep a dominion in the hands of Elders so in the particulars in the following disputes I have apprel ensions far contrary to this man whose name is savoury in the Churches concerning the government of Christs visible Kingdom and should desire that holiness may shine more eminently in the Churches of Christ for the first declining of Churches hath its beginning from a loose and prophane walk of officers nor can Assemblies have any other issue then that of which Nazianzene complains when Pastors are ungodly then the Sun at noon day goes down upon the Prophets and Stars fall from Heaven and the glory of the Lord departs from the Temple And were our practice more concentrick with and suitable unto our rule the question of the constitution of visible Churches should be a huge deal narrower The God of power lead us in all truth Yours in the Lord Iesus SAMUEL RUTHERFURD LIB I. CAP. I. A Survey of the Survey of the Reverend and Godly Servant of GOD Mr. THOMAS HOOKER The company of Beleevers without Rulers is no Politick Church having power of Ordination What Locall Habitation doth to make Church-members Passing what this Learned and Godly man hath said Chap. 1 Part 1. in which some things may be noted as Escapes I come to Chap. 2. CHAP. 2. PART 1. c. 11. M. Hook THe visible Church is the adequate subject of our Inquirie Answ. The principall subject is Mr. Hooker his visible Church yea it is too narrow the adequate it
is not for the visible kingdome of Christ in concreâ—â— as ruled by Christ includes the elect and true Beleevers for whose sake are all officers word seales 1 Cor. 3. 21. 22. 2 Cor. 〈◊〉 15. Eph. 1. 22. M. H. The Church in her constitution is considered two wayes 1. as totum essentiale or homogeneum or as totum integrale In the former notion The Church as a City without a Mayor hath right to choose its officers and becomes totum organicum when officers are in it Ames Medu lib. 1. cap. 33. 18. Ans. 1. The argument must so runne What ever a City without a Mayor may doe that may a company of Beleevers so combined without officers doâ— Ans. Nothing more false but of this hereaster A civill free Corporation may appoint this or that Government 2. May limit the Mayor to one yeere to so much power no more but M Hooker his new Church cannot doe any of these Amesius there saith not a company of Believers without Officers is a Politick Church The Scripture in Old or New Testament never said it M. H. As for the manner Parish precincts or dwelling within the bounds of a parish cannot make an ecclesiastick right to Church-membership For 1. it is but a Civill right that a man hath to his house 2. Excommunication cutteth a man off from the Church as if he were an heathen but not from his house which is his by birth or purchase 3. Yea so Papists Turks Dogs should be Church members to whom Christ hath denyed all right Revel 21. 27. Ans. We grant Parish dwelling simply in a Professor gives not right to be a member of the City of God but Parish dwelling tali modo is a necessary condition without which they cannot be fixed members of that congragation to meet in one house suppone after supper as Act 207. 1 Cor. 11. 20 21 22. and therefore we condemnn our brethren who failing on the other extreme will have persons residing in Old England to be marryed members to one onely Congâ—…on vâ—…ble in New England and to no other visible Churchâ—… 〈◊〉 and deny all Church-communion of the Catholick 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to all visible Professors who are sojourners 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 â—â—â—range excommunicating of visible Professors 2. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 residence for shall they watch over one another as they are obliged by a Church oath suppose their Church be beyond the Line and they on this side of it 3. This full well shall gratifie Anabaptists who will have it no mercie that infants are born in Zion or in any Beleevers house as the Scripture saith it is Gen. 17. 12. Psal 87. 5. 1 Cor. 7. 14. Rom. 11. 16. the reasons are not so sure for birth does it not but to be born of such Parents at Corinth makes over to the Infants of Believers a to be born in Zion to be born in beleeving Abrahams house Gen. 17. 12. Psal. 87. 7. a right to be members of that Church else upon what right shall they be baptized As for the place Rev. 21. 27. Pignetus Pareus Piscator Diodati English Annotators Bullinger Nepar expone the place of the Church in heaven Marlorat and many others of the invisible Church and the Text excludes all from that Church but such as are written in the book of life and so to me it is unpertinent to the purpose and not concludent CHAP. II. Of visible Saints 2. M. H. reasons to prove that his visible Saints are only members of the visible Church are discussed MAster Hooker first states the question then brings reasons to prove such visible Saints to be the onely matter of the visible Church Saints in charity are such in practise and profession if we look at them in course by experience or report as they savour so much as they had been with Iesus From all which so much as rational charity directed by rule from â—kâ— Word a man cannot but conclude but there may be some seeds of some spirituall work of God in the soule Answ. If any one word of God were given to prove what must be proven it were good 1. That Magus all the three thousand Act. 2. all the multitude baptized by Iohn Mat 3. Mark 1. 5. Luk 4. were to Philip to the Church of Saâ—aria to godly Iohn Bapâ—ist to the twelve Apostles such in practice and profession as they savoured so much as they had been with Iesus so heavenly a savourinesse is not in one jot holden out in the Word the Baptist looks on them as vâ—pers and was it fit to omit the styles of Saints justified sanctâ—fied 2. The Tryers most have experience of their practice and profession this shall take dayes and moneths to eat as they say much salt with them the Apostles that same day in few houres time baptized them Act. 2. Who can believe that the huge multitude lived on Locusts and Wild Honey in the Wildernesse untill Iohn should experimentally find a generation of vipers moulded into a new frame to savour of the things of the spirit 3. There is nothing here of 1. Tryers and Judges 2. Nothing of a Judicaâ—ure 3. Nothing of Letters Witnesses Testimonies from the Churches 4. Nothing of the rule of the Word compared with their habituall conversation which must take a tract of dayes 5. Nothing of a sentence admitting some for their spirituall savourinesse rejecting others for that bad smell and denying them Church-fellowship untill they be better tryed all conjectures 1. The conclusion is not any thing but a may be and that may beare a may not be and if it were proven by the Word that Professors right to the Covenant of God to the Word Promises Seales depended upon mens rational judgement of Charity it might quiet the conscience But aâ— shall not the Lord be a God to a people except the people themselves judge in the judgement of charity that the people so consederate savour all of them as if they had been with Iesus and except they from experience can conclude there may be some seeds of some spirituall work of God in the souls of all these people Ah the Lord then cannot say to a nation and a society I am your God while first he asks the Churches leave M H. 1. Reason The members of Christs Body are fit alore to be members of a true Church because that is the body of Christ. 1 Cor. 12. 12. Ephes. 4. 12 13. But onely visible Saints who according to the rules of reasonable charity may be conceived to have some speciall good in them are onely members of Christs Body For to have a member which neither doth nor ever did receive any power or virtuall impression in the kind of it from the head is not onely against reason but against that reference and correspondence which the members have to the head Now visible Saints onely according to the former explication can be said by the rules of reasonable charity to have some virtuall influence of
contradictions not to appear I wrong them either wilfully which were in me wickedness or if of ignorance it is much weaknesse and more But 1. as Mr Hooker bringeth citations from Mr Answorth Mr Robinson why doth he not from his own writings bring the like for I alledge the same against his own way for the way of the Churches of New England Sâ—ct 3. ch 3. pag. 56 57. faith more then the brethren of the separation eveâ— did say The Lord Iesus is the head of the Church evâ—n the visible Church and the visible Church is the body of Christ Iesus 1 Cor. 12. 12. the habitation of God by the Spirit Ephes. 2. 22. the members of the visible Church are said to be the temples of the holy Ghost 1 Cor. 3. 16. espoused to Christ as a chast virgin 2 Cor. 11. 2. Sons and daughters of the Lord God almighty 2 Cor. 6. 18. how can they be members of the body or the spouse of Christ c. ex cept they in charitable disorâ—tion be 〈◊〉 indeed the holy Ghost describeth them to be Saints by calling 1 Cor. 1. 2. and faithful brethren Gal. 1. 2. and that not by external profession for these are too high styles for hypocrites but in some measure of sincerity and truth Let that be answered These who not onely in point of charity and not onely in external profession but in some measure of sincerity and truth must be the habitation of God by the Spirit the temple of the holy Ghost c. or then they cannot be admitted members of the visible Church must be internally justified sanctified and chosen before they can be members of the Church visible but such must all admitted members be by these places cited by the Churches of N. England M. H. or his defendants choose what they please and answer and I shall be cleared 2. From this passage by the way observe another argument of the Church of N. England ibid. Such should be members admitted to the visible Church as are exhorted to be followers of Paul as dear children Ephes. 4. 1. so must the arguments be I assume but all visible converts or non converts all known drunkards harlots Atheists c. are exhorted to be followers of Paul yea that exhortation obligeth all the known enemies of God in the visible Church to be renewed in the spirit of their mind to be converted from dumb idols to serve the living God for all are exhorted to obey the whole Gospel heare it even the scoffing Athenians Act. 17. 2. I argue from the fifth argument These cannot be judged fit matter for the visible Church and conâ—â—iâ—uting and edifying thereof who are more fit for the ruine and destruction thereof such as all hypocrites who will leave their first love and destroy the Church I assume but all latent hypâ—crites such as Iudas and Magus as wel as open hypocrites are more fit for the ruine and destruction of the Church and will leave their first love If it be said that latent hypocrites appearing to us to be Godly and converts may be judged mistakingly and erroneously to be fit materialls for the constituting and edifying of the Church are men 1 made members of Christs body and Christ made the head of Magus Iu as not by Christs command so much as by mens erroneous judgment 2 Then the visible Church hath all its essâ—…nce and nature founded upon judgment that may erre and upon no certain rule of the word 3 Then should the Apostles have taken more time and advised more maturely before they made Magus Ananias members of the visible Church 3. All the arguments brought by M. Hooker and the way of the Churches of N. England and Separatists doe conclude they must be really and internally sanctified before they can be such members as are in the Church of Rome Ephesus c. and M. Hooker putteth not a finger to them to answer these that I alledged 4. Let him answer that which M. Robinson hath pag. 97. all the Churches that ever the Lord planted consisted of only good as the Church of the Angels in heaven and of mankind in paradise God hath also the same ends in creating and restoring his Churches and if it were the will of God that persons notoriously wicked should be admitted into the Church God should directly crosse himself and his owne ends and should receive into the visible covenant of grace such as were out of the visible state of grace and should plant such in his Church for the glory of his name as served for no other use then to cause his name to be blasphemed pag. 98. In planting of the first Church in the seed of the woman there were only Saints without any mixture now all Churches are of one nature and essentiall constitution and the first is the rule of the rest Ans. I now perceive that M. Hooker and his followers in this point defend M. Robinsin and the Separatists as M. Hooker chap. 2. pag. 20 21. but I must say these words thus we have cleared the expressions of our brethren of the separation must be an owning of their cause Ans. But M. Hooker should also clear M. Hooker and his own from contradictions as well as M. Robinson for M. Robinsons argument must be thus or nothing Such as is the essentiall constitution of the first Church in paradise in Adam and Evah not yet fallen in sinne and the Church of the Angels in heaven before their fall such must be the constitution of all our visible Churches now for all Churches are of one nature and essentiall constitution saith he I assume But the Church in paradise and of Angels before either of them fell consisted of only such as were inwardly and effectually sanctified Ergo such must be the constitution of all our visible Churches now to wit they must consist of only inwardly and effectually sanctified and free of all sinne But the conclusion is absurd for if so our visible Churches must be as clean from sinne as the Church of Angels and of our first parents were when they were first created and yet M. Robinson saith pag. 112. for we doubt not but the purest Church upon earth may consist of good and bad in Gods eye of such as are truly sanctified and faithfull and of such who only for a time put on the outside and vizard of sanctity so M. Robinson the wit of man shall not clear these expressions from contradictions 2. If it be not the approving and commanding will of God for of that will given to men who planteth Churches he must speak or he speaketh nothing that the wicked be admitted into the Church then it is not Gods will that Magus Demas be admitted into the Church but this latter is absurd and contrary to both Mr. Robinson Iustif. of Separat pag. 12. and to Mr. Hookers Survey par 1. ch 2. pag. 23 24. and contrary to the Scripture Act. 2. 38 39 41
c. that are detestable to God not dear to God as every where the Scripture teacheth Mr. H. p. 40. The visible Church is called The Body of Christ 1 Cor. 12. 27. 28. Ans. The visible Church in the sense of Mr. H. as including Magus Iudas as such is not Christs body 2. Nothing is proved except it be made out that all and every one in Corinth were lively Members under the Head Christ in the judgement of charity otherwise it is a sinful addition to the Text. Mr. H. A Church may be visibly in Covenant which hath not an infallible assistance may erre in fundamentals fall away and not endure as the dayes of heaven and so are his first and fifth arguments answered Ans. It is I consess soon done if well Ans. It is true if men entertain such things as they call truths when they are but lies of Arminians it will be easie to wipe away all with a dry Negoconclusionem My first argument to prove that the invisible and not the visible single Congregation is the principal prime and onely proper subject of all the priviledges of special note given in the Mediator Christ is Par. 1. pag. 244 245. because that is such a subject of all these priviledges to which onely and principally the Promises belong that they are a seed enduring as the dayes of heaven Psa. 89. and can no more cease to be in Gods Covenant favour than the Ordinances of heaven can cease to be Jer. 31. 35 36. then the Mountains can depart Isa. 54. 10 c. But the visible Church of a Congregation is not such c. Judge Reader of the answer The fifth Argument Because the invisible Church of the Elect is such as cannot erre in fundamentals cannot fall from the Rock and not the visible Church of the Congregation whereof seven may be a Church and six of them such materials as Magus nor can such a Congregation bear as the first onely and prime subject these styles say I pag. 250. that are proper onely to the Elect Redeemed and really sanctified Church the styles of Christs Sister Love Dove Spouse Mystical Body of Christ. Mr. H. answers by yielding the Assumption A Church may be visibly in Covenant may erre in fundamentals may fall away And this is Mr. R. first and fifth Arguments Hence if perseverance and never falling away be a special priviledge given in the Mediator Christ and it agree not to the Congregational the onely visible Church and if it agree not to all visible Congregations then is not the visible Church the onely principal subject of such priviledges since the world was no Logick can say that a property can be denied of its first and onely subject That is a man and yet is not apt to laugh 2. To be visibly in Covenant is not a priviledge of special note that is a saving priviledge such as Perseverance to have the anointing and a new heart Of which saving priviledges I spake all along pag. 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 c. for to be visibly in Covenant agrees to Magus and to all rotten Members but these saving priviledges of perseverance agree not to Mr. H. his visible Church which may and doth fall away saith Mr. H. Judge then if these two Arguments be wiped away with a wet finger as saith Mr. Hooker Mr. H. p. 40 41. A Church may be visibly redâ—emed by the blood of God be called the Body of Christ the Sons and Daughters of God and yet not be really and inwardly such which is his second Argument The third is answered already Ans. This is with a hop and a skip to take away Arguments 1. Mr. H. should have done so much as repeaâ—ed the Argument But to be really redeemed to be the Body of Christ to be really to be I say in veritate rei the Sons and Daughters of God and not to be called so onely a generation of Vipers call themselves Matth. 3. the holy seed are priviledges of special note in the Mediator Christ as I spake pag. 244. and these priviledges agree not to the visible and nominal Church of which Magus is a Citizen as to the principal prime and onely subject as Mr. H. yieldeth and so yieldeth the Argument 2. A Church may be both visibly the Redeemed of God and called and be really the Body of Christ and invisibly be also the Redeemed of God by a figure as touching the sound and real visible Saints among them but that destroys Mr. H. his cause who will have all and every one in the judgement of charity redeemed even so many as are fed with Word and Censures 3. Mr. H. should have applied his answer to the Arguments but he saw it would not frame I have done it Let the second thoughts of some help here For Mr. H. must apply his answers to the cited places so Ier. 31. 33. I will put my law in their inward parts according to the judgement of charity and Ier. 32. I will put my fear in their hearts according to the judgement of charity And when the Lord saith I was a husband to Israel that is in the judgement of charity Isa. 53. He was stricken for the transgression of my people that is visible Saints and for Magus for my confederate people in the judgement of charity Ah! â—ee not men dare to adde their after-birth inventions to the truth of God Therefore Mr. H. addeth pag. 40 They who hold that a visible Church is redeemed externally cannot say by any good inference that Christ died for all such in Gods intention or that all such are chosen to glory or that God intendeth to save all such Ars. This is said not proved If Christ die for the whole world in the judgement of charity he must intend and decree in the same judgement of charity to save them by his death else he is conceived to die for them upon no intention at all I judge Christs dying for us essentially includes his intention to save to deliver from the present evil world Gal. 1. 4. If therefore this charitable judgement of Mr. H believed Christ died for all the Members of the Church of Ephesus suppose Magus to be a baptized Member he must in the same judgement believe that God intended to save Magus yea and Mr. H. must believe in charity by his death he intends to save all and every one in the visible Church all the earth over and so did choose to glorifie all the visible Saints and consequently all nations Isa. 2. 1 2. all Aegypt all Assyria Isa. 19. 25. all the Gentiles Isa. 60. 1 2 3 c. all the Kingdoms of the world Rev. 11. 15. for they are all the visible Kingdoms and Churches of Christ and charity shall forbid to believe that there be one reprobate in the visible Churches and shall necessitate Mr. H. to believe that God intends salvation and so chose to salvation every man and woman of them But
other Churches save our own no Church will be past Ans. The Popish and Lutheran Churches in which there is valid Baptism in which a Vow is made to walk in Church-wayes as observing one another shall have the formal cause of true visible Churches and so must be true visible Churches for they have this Covenant implicitely and virtually 2. How shall we be made from the Scriptures to see that the Baptist Mar. 1. 5. the Disciples of Christ who baptized moe disciple than Iohn Joâ— 5. 4. did tye by Oath one way or another and the Covenant being their complete Rule must be vocal and express are they so inchurched to engage to these Church-duties within their own Congregations the word hints at no such thing 3. There is a necessity of vocal Covenant always if it come nerest to the rule but where is the rule 4. What making of matter and form as so described and what reciding from the Rule of these Churches in the essentials is so well known to all as they must be most false Churches that are not made of visible converts which is the constitution of the Anabaptist Churches for bitter clamours and unworthy aspersions I wish Mr. H. had expressed them that the Reader might judge I judge that the Church of Christ in N. E. makes true the prophecy That the wilderness and the desert do there rejoyce and blossom as a Rose Isa. 35. 5. Judicious Mr. Cawdrey citeth Dr. Holmes making an explicite Covenant necessary Mr. H. Cohabitation which is necessary for our Churches is such as is fit for the end for the dispensing of Ordinances and Câ—nsures where they may conveniently meet Acts 14 27. 1 Cor. 11. 26. 14. 23. it suffers some exceptions The Church may send out some to begiâ—…â—…antations where they want able guides until they attain to a Church-state States may be compelled to send men to Sea for traffique and for war and yet no prejudice is done to the Rule of Christ they are said to cohabit where the place of their abode is in the issue Ans. If cohabitation be necessary for the attaining the end then as the Pastor cannot be a non-resident by necessity of a calling in Trading neither can ten godly Merchants be three years absent as Mr. H. sayes Solomons Merchants were but they must be non-residents and neglect Church watching â—nd break Covenant if it be said as it must be it should be the Ministers onely calling to reside and watch but the Merchant hath an extraordinary calling to trade beside Ans. This confirms us not a little no godly visible professors can tye themselves by Covenant or Oath to exercise the common Christian acts of a Church member onely to such a society but in an occasional and providential way for it is as unlawful to tye Church-worship to one society or place under the New Testament as it was to tie it of old to Bethel Gilgal Hos. 4. 15. 9. 14. 12. 11. Amos 44. which is a demonstration that a godly professor carrieth about a Soul with him stands in need of Church-feeding by the Lords Supper and other Church Ordinances in all the Christian world and that he is to warn admonish comfort all Church members and to labour to gain a trespassing brother not of the single Congregation only whereof he is a Member Matth. 18. and neither Scriptures nor sound Divinity nor the Law of Nature which is not destroyed by the Gospel will warrant to limit the word Brother as Mr. H. doth and his Brethren Matth. 18. 15 If thy brother trespass if he hear thee thou hast gained thy brother to a brother only of the Congregation of which the offended brother is a member as if Christ had not set down a rule Mat. 18. of gaining all brethren within the single Congregation or about it for the word Brother is of this latitude that it comprehendeth 1. All that may offend a Brother that is one not only within a single Congregation only of which the brother offended is a member but also one of another Congregation Now Mr. H. saith ye have no Church power over one of aâ—â—ther Congregation 2. He is a Brother whom ye are obliged to admonish Go tell him 3. He is a Brother whom thou must labour to gain Thou hast gained thy brother 4. He is a Brother who is obliged to hear the Church He will not hear the Church 5. He is a Brother who may be cast out Let him be to thee as a heathen 6. He is one whose sinnes â—ay be bound in Heaven Verse 16 17. 7. He is a Brother who if gained may pray and meet with others in a Church-way in the name of Christ. 8. He is a Brother who if he be gained Christ grants his desire and prayer Verse 19 20. 9. He is a Brother who is to be pardoned If he sin against Peter seventy times seven times Verse 21 22. 10. He is a Brother who ought to forgive his fellow-Brother as he would have God to forgive him Verse 14 25 35. Now it were a foul straitning of the word of Christ to say these ten agree only to a Brother in order to another Brother of the same single Congregation as if we did owe by Christs Doctrine in that notable Sermon Compassion Forgiveness Teaching Gaining c. to no Brethren but to those of the same Congregation where of we our selves are members 2. This Doctrine deprives godly travellers so journers savoury professors of the Lords Supper for three for six years of the Ordinance of the Lords Supper of Church-teaching Rebuking Prayer Church comforts of all Church-manifestations and of all Church communion with Christ the Head of the visible Church of all Church-presence of him that walks in the midst of the golden Candlesticks of all Church-influences of all Sanctuary-beauty for no scandal or sin but onely for going about a lawful duty in all the visible Churches on earth as is clear Cant. 1. 7. 2. 1 2 3 4. Psal. 27. 4. 73. 16 17. 84. 4 42. 1 2 3 4. Hib. 2. 12. Psal. 22. 22. 40 9 10. for it cannot take off the Argument to say The godly professor may have the same comforts but in an invisible way which he hath in his own Church in his native abode in a visible and Church-way for 1. This is to beg the question for hâ—s professed hearing praying with a forreign Church is as visible as at home 2. If Christ no where have deprived a man of the comfort of the Lords Supper whithersoever he come and profess himself a visible Saint no men on earth can deprive him but there is no more warrant why a visible Saint should not every where remember the Lords day by eating as he may pray every where in faith holding up pure hands for as he takes Gods Name in vain if he hate to be reformed so also to banquet with Christ not discerning the Lords body 3.
person doth also constitute him a man which is most false 2. The Texts in the assumption are widely mistaken Heb. 12. 22 23. But you are come to Mount Ziou that is to a single Independent Congregation nay read more v. 23. To the general Assembly and Church of the first-born which are written in heaven that is to a company of visible saints of which seven may be a Church saith the way of the Churches of N. E. and these sometimes say they and M. H. hypocrites such as Iudas and Magus If so then these must be called the City of the living God the heavenly Ierusalem the general Assembly of the first-born whose names are written in heaven It may grieve the godly that the word of God should be so perverted Oecumenius and Thtophylact and Galvin Piscator Marlorâ—â— English Divines Diedati Pareâ—s as also Cajetanus Esthius cal them the universal church of the elect The place 1 Tim. 3. 15. is not to be limited to the Church of Ephesus Pareus loquitur de columna ministeriali of a ministerial Church that preacheth the Gospel and so it s nothing to this purpose Calvin Beza Crâ—â—iger he means the Church indefinitely whithersoever Timothy should come let it be a particular Congregation it is made up of preaching Pastors who bear up the truth by the preached Gospel as the pillars say Piscator and Pareus bear up the house The place Eph. 4. 13 16. is meant not of a visible Congregation whose members are Magus and Iudas for Christ leading captivity captive and ascending gave not Apostles and Teachers finaliter for the saving and perfecting of the visible body as visible in Mr. H. his way which must be said if any thing be proved against us but of the body which is visible but not as visible but as he saved the Church inlived by Christ saith Beza He speaketh saith Calvin of the end of the Ministry Until we all meet in the unity of faith not that all men shall believe in Christ but he speaketh by a Synâ—cdoche saith he of the prâ—destinate only for they only come to the unity of faith who are chosen to glory Zanchius and grave and learned D. Bodius of Trochrigge in his learned Commentary as also Piscator Bullinger Sarcerius Marloratus Rollocus Diodati English Divines with the Text expound the place of the true mystical body For 1. Christ ascended for that body and sent Apostles not for Magus and such of Mr. Hookers visible saints 2. He intends the perfecting and edifying of that body verse 12. and Apostles and Pastors are theirs and for their salvation 1 Cor. 4. 21. 2 Cor. 4. 15. 3. Christ is the saving head only of that body and the visible Church is never called his body in Scripture because visible but by a figure because of the lively members among them drawing life from the head Christ Eph. 1. 22 23. Eph. 4. 16. Eph. 5. 23. Col. 1. 18. 4. He speaks of that body which shall come with all the saints to the unity of faith 5. Which grows up into a perfect man c. which is a living body from which I excommunicate Magus and Iudas And for the place 1 Cor. 1. 12 13. It 's not a single Congregation visible shew in all the Scripture where a single Congregation yea and every single Congregation never so few for were it but of seven or ten or twenty it is an instituted politick Church though wanting Pastors to our brethren is called Christs the body of Christ as this Church So Calvin Beza Martyr Nâ—â— parvae consolatio hac it is no small comfort that the Church is called Christs because it is his body for as Cyrillus saith Christ assumed the nature common to all 2. All the members of the body being many are one body so also is Christ yea thâ—se many are men of divers cases divers nations saith Pâ—rous yea Jews and Gentileâ— verse 13. And therefore this is the Catholike visible body 3. It is the body that have been all made to drink into one spirit in the Lords Supper but this must be the many members of divers Congregations 1 Cor. 10. 16. as our brethren confess 4. It is the body that lives by the spirit of Christ 〈◊〉 12. For when Christians are said to make one body it is not understood of a politick body only but saith Martyr of the spiritual and secret body of Christ which aims at life eternal and hath all thâ—se common God Christ the Holy Ghost the word of God Grace the Sacraments to wit Baptisme the Lords Supper called by a Synecdoche a drinking of the Wine in the Supper into one spirit which excludeth not the eating of the bread vâ— 13. and so sometimes he speaks of his body in regard of its parts to wit of single congregations where the sacraments are administrate and where there are Prophets Watchmen Pastors Ruling Elders as eyes and ears yet not fixed and married by a Church-Oath to one only single congregation and all along as of the Catholike visible body And it is true which Mr. R grants that a Church in an Island is a little City but so as it is a member of the Catholike visible body that hath no charters and priviledges spiritual different from these of the whole Mr. H. Arg. 2. They who have mutual power each over other to command and constrain in cases whereas they were free before must by mutual engagement be made partakers of that power But such are the Church of believers Ergo. The second part of the Assumption is clear by Matth. 18. where a legal order is set by which brethren only of the same Church ought to exercise power one over another not over infidels nor yet with other Christians for I rebuke a Christian of another Church I cannot call the Church he departs the place and refuses to come but I may in a legal way convince and bind Archippus for he is a brother and Mr. R. saith if the classis will not censure him the congregation may reject him Learned Whitaker saith That each of the congregation or counsel hath power over the Apostle Peter as a brother to censure him so saith Mr. R. Ans. The conclusion denied is not proved but this Ergo They must by mutual engagement be made partakers of this power The question is whether this Church-Covenant be the formal cause of membership visible to and in this onely Congregation and no other visible Church on earth 2. The proposition is false for before that engagement so monopolized and restricted to that one onely Congregation which were Will-worship these brethren being born of believing Parents and also solemnly by their covenant in baptism were engaged visible members of all the visible Church on earth and of this of Boston these round about where by providence they dwell they visibly professing the Gospel I deny not but it is lawful for a sojourning godly professor to promise to watch
he called it a Church and this Church page 94. but we ask the question whether the word Church Mat. 18. 17. Tell the Church 1 Cor. 1. 2. Unto the Church of God which is at Corinth And 2 Cor. 1. 1. 1 Thes. 1. 1. 2 Tim. 2. 15. be this congregational Church without the separable adjuncts of officers and the truth is the place Matth. 18. The principal copy of the Independent Church can mean no Church according to our brethrens way for no reason can say that the Keys of the Kingdom of Heaven Matth. 16 19. and the power of binding and loosing Matth. 18. 17 18. are given to the separable adjuncts of the Church but such are the officers saith Mr. H. page 92. and to such as are no essential parts of the instituted Church and of the only visible Church of the New Testament But M. H. makes it clear as he sayes that the Congregational Church is before the Officers and may be and is without them therefore officers can be no essential parts of the Church of the New Testament And so this Church void of Officers must be to our brethren the first and principal subject of all Government Rule Keyes Officers and what not Mr. H. being to evert Presbyterial Government he begins at the Pillars The Presbyterian Church consists of three Pillars 1. There must be several congregations made entire of such members to make up an integral body of Rulers and Ruled Ans. There is a crack in this Pillar it is not essential to a Presbyterian Church that all the congregation be entire and formed Churches having their own Officers distinct from the offices of others we cannot determine that Matthias had a determinate flock to which onely he was a fixed Pastor and Peter another and Iohn a third we rather judge the whole twelve fed in common sometimes in one congregation in this house dayly and sometimes in another but all the huge thousands could not feed in one house otherwise many congregations framed and fixed or not framed and fixed are all under one Presbytery as the Learned and Reverend Assembly at Westminster teacheth If the Pillars be dreams the house that M. H. storms is also a dream To the second Pillar we shall speak hereafter if the Lord will 3. These Churches send Rulers by way of delegation to whom they submit Ans. This also is a faulty Pillar 1. They so send as they may be present to hear dispute dissent to what is amiss nor are the Pastors delegates 2. They submit to them not simply But first reserving judgement of discretion Secondly and with liberty to appeal 3. The whole Elders of six congregations in a City may all meet in one common Presbytery without any delegation and that is a Presbyterial Church as is the meeting of a Congregational Eldership Mr. H. To their power of Iurisdiction the Churches must submit but it ariseth from a power of order or office to preach Ans. Well said then cannot they exercise the highest acts of jurisdiction to excommunicate all the Elders as Mr. H. saith page 92. they do for the people hath no power of order or official power to preach the Gospel and administer the Seals page 92. and yet Mr. H. saith they may communicate all their officers Mr. H. There is a Iurisdiction official that issues onely from the office this the officers have Answ. This Lenitive is a Corrosive Here is the matter the people have jurisdiction and do excommunicate but not by an official jurisdiction but by another power So a Midwife baptizeth in the Roman Church but not by a power of Order as a Priest but its valid An Usurper judgeth but not by a power derived from the Royall Power of the Soveraigne Ruler 2. By what Scripture can any power of the Keyes given by Christ onely to the Church of believers be given to separable adjuncts of the Church Mr. H. None is a steward unless appointed over the Family by Christ 1 Cor. 12. 27 28. Hence Papists and Prelats erre officers and offices are coronation-mercies and proceed from Christs ascension Eph. 4. 11 12. 2. They are means of worship instituted by him 3. He onely can blesse them Answ. 1. None are stewards to put in and put out stewards and excommunicate them but such as are appointed of God But believers without officers are no stewards at all 2. Censuring and excommunicating is an authoritative way of edifying 2 Cor. 10. 8. 1 Cor. 5. 4 5. 1 Thess. 3. 14. shew in all the Word where believers and private Christians are to edifie and build up in the faith their Pastors and that in an authoritative way The people so must 2. Be coronation-mercies and gifts given of Christ ascending to heaven for the perfecting of the Pastors and the work of the Ministery to gather in Apostles Evangelists Pastors to Christ. Whereas the Text saith the contrary That Pastors were given to gather in the people and the people or unofficed Brethren were not given to gather in Apostles 3. If Excommunication be a Worship administred by the Brethren upon Pastors then must a promise be made to unofficed Brethren who excommunicate Behold I send you as Matth. 10. 16. This we reade not Mr. H. He that is called and appointed an officer according to God and the Rules of the Gospel as he needs no other power but that of his office to authorize him to execute it So there is no power by rule or right that can hinder him in the due execution thereof Ans. This is a ground against both Episcopacy and Presbytery Presbyters may preach in other congregations than their own if they be officers over it as Bishops may in many congregations 2. The Pastor if called of God may do his office without horrowing a power from the Pastor of pastors to do it but he must preach hic nunc in an orderly way upon a day and time of the day appointed by the Church 3. He hath an office to preach and administer the seales any where yet must he have the call by desire consent or some other way before he can do it in another congregation 4. Nor can he rule or administer censures as his alone extra collegium without the authoritative concurrence of the Elders and tacit consent of the people though he be an appointed officer of Christ. So this ground is weak Other weak grounds we shall consider after CHAP. III. The Arguments of Mr. H. against the Presbyterian Churches are removed as weak MR. H. Arg. 1. If the Churches combined have no more power than they had before they were combined they can exercise no more Iurisdiction than before and therefore have no Presbyterian power are no Presbyterian Churches But they have no more power after their combination than before Ergo. The Assumption where the doubt onely lies is made out thus They who have no more office and officers than they had before they have no more
Elect of God have Ioh. 10. 27 28. except women aged children servants be excluded out of the number of the sheep of Christ this is a turning of the Gospel upside down to Popishly confine all the Priviledges of Saints the anointing the spiritual disceâ—ning what key will open the heart to some few male-believers 1. Aged 2. Incorporate so and so But I retort it thus To whom Christ hath given the onely qualifications spiritual of Rulers endued with power of judging those hath he called according to the rule of the Gospel to be such Rulers and they must dig their Lords talents in the earth if they improve them not for that end But the Lord hath given to all Beleevers as Beleevers of the same or of another flock whether in Churches this way or not to women as to males in some measure the anointing grace to know Christs voice Ergo. 2. Let it be observed that the tongue of the learned Esay 50. of which Mr. R. spoke to absolve and open heaven to a man swallowed up with griefe and a gift of a son of thunder to shut the gates of heaven against the obstinate and such as are to be delivered to Sathan are not required in the exercise of the keys of the Kingdome but onely such gifts as are in women is this a good frame of Church discipline Mr. H. God gives to men no calling to a place but he gives rules how they are to order and direct themselves in it But the Word hath no Canons how the people should order the Keyes Answ. Matth. 18. 15. If thy brother c. The Lord points his finger to the Fescuâ— and says Build up one another in the most holy faith 1 Thess. 5. 11 12 13. 2 Thess. 3. 14. Heb 13. 17. Rom. 16. 17. Observe those that cause dissentions among you c. Ans. My Argument is mistaken If there be Rules in the Word how Officers should acquit themselves 1 Tim. 3. 1 2 c. how Judges Kings c. so ought there to be Rules how unofficed brethren the onely Judges for Church-officers do but order and regulate judging as our Brethren say should behave themselves But this is not by our Brethrens way 2. The Reader may observe all along that Mr. H. and his way lays the Ax to the root of the Ministery for he ascribeth the Church acts of office of opening and shutting heaven of the learned Tongue of Excommunicating c. to unofficed men or then he denies that there is any necessity of such in judging and ascribes such acts and qualifications as are in women to their judging Church the very way of Anabaptists and rigid Separatists 3. Mat. 18. 15. shall make every Church-member brother or sister who are to gain by admonishing one another a Church-Judge to exercise the Keyes one over another I thought the power had been given not uni sed unitati to brethren in the Judicature not to stones scattered The edifying one of another and comforting one another and withdrawing from dividers are acts of love required of men women and of Christians of all ranks and by no word tied to those of the same single congregation but to all the Catholick Church should not women withdraw from dividers and therefore these places 1 Thess. 5. 11. 2 Thess. 3. Rom. 16. are abused 4. Ambrose Theophylact Oecumenius Paraphrastes Beza Calvin Marlorat nor any Interpreter dreamed the place Heb. 13. 17. was meant of unofficed brethren who watch and must give an account for souls yea Mr. H. expounds it of officers and yet he cites Heb. 13. 17. Obey them that are over you in the Lord i. e. Brethren of the male-Church obey brethren Mr. H The prwer of the Keys is larger then the power of office and therefore the Lord requires not so much abilities in the brethren as in the Officers Ans. The difference is said not proved 2. If God require the highest abilities in officers to the laying on of hands 1 Tim. 5. 22. to the highest censurer 1 Tim. 19. 20 21. compared with 1 Tim. 3. 1 2 c. 1 Tim. 3. 6. 7 c. then he must require these same far more in brethren the first and proper subject of all power or then the Lord calls them to highest actings and promises to them no gift to or for these highest actings such as delivering to Satan cutting off of members Mr. H. The Keys are given to Peter as representing Church guides Matth. 16. not excluding the consent of the people Ans. We so give the power radically and fiâ—stly to the Church of Believers as by them we communicate office power to the Elders though they be not the first subject Ans. Such a shifting of office-power from the Church of believers which yet is but the third part of the redeemed single Church to Elders if Christ teach Matth. 16. or elsewhere we rest Mr. H. If the Keys be given to the Church the house of wisdom Prov. 9. 1. of God 1 Tim. 3. 15. Heb. 3. 4. builded by Pastors Teachers Ephes. 4. 11 then not the Church of Believers without Pastors Mr. H. the assumption fails for a Church without Pastors is wisdoms house as we proved and is Act. 14. 23. Ans. Mr. H. answers nothing to the places Pro. 9. wisdom hath maids and a table the house in which Timothy was to walk was built by officers Act. 20. 28. 1 Tim. 3. 1 2 3. 1 Tim. 5 17 Give us a pattern of your homogeneal Church for clear it is the Church Act. 14. 23. was the Church of believers no politick ministerial Church until Paul and Barnabas with the free election of the people made them a politick Church so until Titus ordained Elders the Churches of Creet bear the name of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Cities and though these Cities were Churches yet could they exercise no politick actions nor frame Organs official to themselves until the first founder made them politick ministerial Churches Otherwise as Paul and Barnabas exhorted them to continue in the faith so they should have commanded them to use that radical power to create officers and not have encroached upon their power of the Keys Mr. H. Paul charging the Elders to feed the Flock or the Church Acts 20. implyeth there is a Church distinct from feeders Ans. No doubt there is a flock of redeemed and fed ones of men women children 1 Pet. 4. 2. Iam. 2. 2. Act. 15. 35. that were of late Catechised Gal. 6. 56. different from watchmen but Paul bids the feeders censure the grievous Wolves v. 29 30. but he bids not the fed Church do it far less implyes he that the third part of the redeemed was the male-Church and did or could exercise discipline over both officers and women servants and children Let us see that implyed Mr. H. If they want Officers saith Mr. R. they want the power of edifying Ans. They want the power of edifying as an
not so it differs not in nature from a General Councel and so must partake of its natural qualities as the natural properties of a man are in a same man Now beside that Christ gave the complete power of the Keys to the Apostles be sent them as his Father sent him as a Prophet to remit and retain sins Joh. 20. to be a teaching and baptizing ministry Mat. 28 20. which he never gave to the unofficed male-Church Christ also appointed an Assembly with them in Galilee and keeped it Mat. 26. 32. Mat. 28. 16. Mr. H. To define in Councels is no proper work in officers 5. For so saiâ—h D. Ames no Pastor of the primitive Church and few of the after ages should have fulfilled their Pastoral charge 2. That which is common â—o the Brethren is not proper to Pastors 3. Whitak It 's open popery to take it from Breth â—n Ans. Ames is miscited he states the question whether only Bishops have decisive votes Though it were proper to Bishops and Pastors yet it may be saith Ames communicated to other Ministers of God 2. It is not a Pastoral but an Officiall act that we contend for 3. It is a poor question for if learned godly men be chosen if they be not Doctors and ruling Elders they should be such 4. The Martyr hath a learned discourse 1 King 12. De Schismâ—te and hath nothing of the question but from Act. 15. he condemns Papists who exclude Laicks from Synods for Constantine subscribed the sixth Synod Basilius the eighth Synod nor is it Popery except Calvin maintain Popery for he gives to the people consenting to the Apostles and Elders judging and so doth Gualther nor doth Whitaker call it popery to seclude Laickes from defining but â—rom speaking discerning consenting I wonder that Mr. H. is so confident in this matter Mr. H. Arg. 3. If the power of the Keyes belong firstly to the Oecumenick Councel then it belongs to all others by vertue of that risibility agrâ—es first to man to Richard John not as these individual men but as thâ—y have the nature of man hence there can no power of the keys as ordâ—nation excommunication c be put forth but by vertue of an Oecumenick Councel giving in their influence first to that work which is contrary to the evidence of Scripture and the experience of all ages The proposition is proved by the rule of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 if none have this power but only this subject then this power can go no farther then this for this 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 require Ans. 〈◊〉 Mr. H. wrongs the Reader who sets not down my answer to this argument for p. 299. I say the power of the keys is not given to the Catholick Presbytery as to the first subject to be a mean of edification in an ordinary way but only in an extraordinary and occasional way in these things whâ—ch concern the power of jurisdiction belonging to the whole Catholick Church By Extraordinary I mean not that which is against or above a particular law of God but that which rarely falls out Hence I never make an Oecumenical Councel the first subject of the power of the Keys in its latitude as man is the first only subject of risibility the element of water of cold and heat for so as only man is risible and Peter visible for mans nature so only an Oecume nick Councel should firstly and principally excommunicate and ordain Ministers but I say the just contrary of this to wit that an Oecumenick Councel is onely the first and principal subject of that synodical power or of that certain power or special power that belongs to an Oecumenick Synod formally convened as such and so to this or that Oecumenical Councel because of the common nature of an Oecumenical Councel Yea This special power of the Keyes is but a part or a certain kind and species of the power of the Keyes in some rare and extraordinary things that belong to the Catholick Church But we are now disputing of the first seat and subject of the power of the Keyes in general in the latitude of binding and loosing opening and shutting the gates of heaven by preaching and censures And I deny expresly that an Oecumenick Councel is the first subject of the power of the Keyes in this general And so Mr. H. fights with a shadow Non concludit negatum So my Simile is never touched by Mr. H. as pag. 305. The light is first in the whole body of the Sun as the first and prime subject of light yet supposing now the received opinion of Astronomers that the Sun doth exceed the quantity of the Earth 167 it doth not follow that this or that part of the Sun hath no light in it intrinsecal but that which is derived from the whole body of the Sun for then this or that part of the Sun should have light derived to it extrinsecally from some other Now the power of the Keys is in the whole Catholick Body of Apostles Pastors Doctors Elders all the world over as they act respectively in Congregations Presbyteries and Synods of all sorts so that one part of the Catholick integral body of the Catholick Church for example hath not that power of the Keys due to them derived from the Presbytery to the congregational Eldership or from the Synod derived to the Presbytery and so forth by either ascending or descending But when Christ gave the whole power of the Keys to the body of the Apostles Mat. 28. 19. 16. 19. Ioh. 20. 21 22 23 Mar. 16. 15. they were the Body Representative I never call them an Oecumenick Councel and did immediately represent any Apostles to be chosen Matthias Paul Evangelists Pastors Doctors Elders that were to be even to the second coming of Christ and he promiseth his Ministerial Spiritual presence to them all immediately Mat. 28. 20 Go teach and baptize lo I am with you always administring Word Seals Censures according to the Rule even to the end of the world Now the Apostles were not to live preaching and baptizing to the end of the world therefore the promise must be made to them all though not yet born Now we reade not of deriving of any power to Synods Presbyteries Congregations by mediation of Churches for Christ instituted Synods Mat. 28. 16. Act. 1. 12 13 14 c. 6. 1 2 3 4 5. 13. 1 2 3 4 5 6. 15. 1 2 3 4 5 6 c. and that immediately he instituted Presbyterial Churches Act. 2. 4. 9. 5. 21 42. and Churches congregational to meet in one place 1 Cor. 11. 17. And as one part of the Element of water suppose we make 24 parts of all hath not natural moistness and cold from the other 20 parts but hath it as intrinsecally without the intervening influence of the other twenty three parts as they have So the Presbyterial and Congregational Eldership
hath said of the antecedent excommunication of the Catholick Church is plain by the former discussion CHAP. VI. Whether there be a whole Catholick integral visible Church MR. H. The Catholick Church hath sometimes such a respect aâ—s totum integraâ—e an whole integral Catholick Church So Aâ—es Ans. D. Ames maintains that there is not only such a respect but that there is a Catholick integral Church and he never dreamed nor any learned man of Mr. H. his Catholick Church affirmed of this or that congregation and is as much as to say Norwich is Catholick England The Catholick Church of Angels and men in all ages all times all places is not that integral Catholick visible Church which we make the subject of the Keyes But this integral Church militant as existing in divers ages is before the congregation in the Lords intention as the Lord intends the organick body of man and not a hand only and a complete world not a nation not a City only so his design is not for this or that congregation but for a world of visible Churches a whole seed a willing people Psal. 110. who is flowing to the mountain of the Lords house Isa. 1. 1 2. his flock and scattered sons Isa. 9. 7. under the government of Christ by the Word Seals Censures Luk. 1. 32 33. make them in their times and places all the world over visible by profession calling gathering feeding Ier. 33. 31 32. Zech. 8. 6 7 8. Psal. 2. 8 9. Psal 72. 7 8 9 10 11 12 c. Rev. 11. 15. Psal 22. 27 28. Iohn 15. 52. And the congregations come in here as secondary parts and parcels of Christs great visible flock Mr. H. denies this and it is as if a man would say there be two hands ten fingers two feet head eyes ears c. but should deny there is an whole organick body or as one should yeeld there are rivers floods fountains seas but deny there is such a thing as the integral element of water 2. This integral militant body is before the congregation in the relation of a Spouse that hath breasts and brings â—orth children Isa. 54 1 2. Cant. 3. 4. Cant. 4. 1 2 3 4 Cant. 6. 4 5 6 7 c. in the relation of a body wrought upon by a Ministry Eph. 4. 11 12 13. 1 Cor. 12. 12 13 14 15. the congregation is but his Spouse and body secondarily 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Some congregation of seven or ten where all may be of the stamp of Iudas and Magus is abusively called the Spouse 3. In duration and stability there is a Church gifted with a Ministry having the Keys of the Kingdom built upon the rock against which the gates of Hell shall not prevail Mat. 16. 17 18 19. induring as the dayes of Heaven which is so as the object of our faith Isa. 59. 21. Psal. 89. 28 29 c. Ier. 31 32 33 c. they are also a visible sheepfold of Jews and Gentiles Iohn 10. 16. the building of God the planting of the Lord Isa. 61. 3 4 5 6. Mich 7. 14 15. 5. 4 7 8. and the congregations little companies in mount Zion 4. There is a Church integral militant visible and in its choisest part invisible to whom as the subject and for whom as the end and object are given the covenant word promises of life ministry seals censures in their saving fruits as before is said Ier. 31. 31 32 c. Ier. 32. 38 39 40. Psal. 132. 11 c. these in an inferiour way the congregations have and enjoy 5. The whole and complete work of the spirit in the Ministry and Word is terminated upon the Catholick integral militant body Isa. 5. 20 21. Eph. 5. 25 26 27 c. and the congregation hath the waterings thereof in a lower way Mr. H. You cannot demonstrate out of Scripture that there is such a thing in the New Testament as a Catholick visible Church Mr. R. saith the subject 1 Cor. 12. 28. is a Catholick visible Church not a politick body under one head the Pope but the Catholick body of Christ mystical as visible Ans. The Catholick invisible body as visible I conceive not to consider a body invisible as visible is a contradiction as if a man would say I consider whiteness as blackness Ans. 1 Cor. 12. is neither meant of a politick body under the Pope 2. Nor a General Councel 3. Nor of a Catholick visible body that meet in the same place Such is not found under the new Testament whence he must mean that under the Old Testament There was a Catholick visible Church of the Jewes that meets in the same place at one time as the Brethren take a visible Church which is unpossible to be demonstrate in either Old or New Testament 2. Mr. H. hath from me no such expression as to consider an invisible body as visible though it be no contradiction as is blackness and whiteness in abstracto If Mr. R. had said visibleness may be considered as invisibleness Mr. H. should have better Logick why is it a contradiction The mystical body in common saith he is the invisible body True and the mystical body is both invisible being the really chosen of God and the object of our faith and the same invisible Church which shall be presented without spot or wrinkle before the Lord Eph. 5. 27. and the same Church and body is sanctified by the Word preached and professed and washed with Water in Baptism v. 26. and so visible And Eph. 4. the body which shall come to the unity of faith and to the perfect man the Stature of Christ Eph. 4. 13. is the mystical and savingly believing body and so invisible also the body of Christ gathered by the ministry visible and edified by the word preached and professed is v. 12. the same body and must be visible for Apostles Pastors preach to the visible Church A child in Logick can conceive the same politick body savingly believing to be invisible and also savingly professing what they believe to be visible So the twelve Apostles Act. 6. are both real and so invisible believers as no man doubts Iudas being in his place and the Scripture in it Mat. 19. 27 28 29. Luke 12. 32. Luke 22. 28 29 30. and he is not worthy to be refuted who denies the same twelve Apostles in another respect to be visible professors visible preachers of the Gospel So Peter as touching his soul is invisible and immortal as touching his body visible and mortal I cannot help it that Mr. H. conceives this to be a contradiction I observe saith he that Mr. R. puts visible in an equal latitude with mystical Ans. Adde to the observation that in this I take not visible for Mr. H. his visibility which agreeth to Magus and Iudas but that sincere and honest visible profession that for the most part is in the Catholick integral
place Eph. 1. 22 23. referred For which see Calvin Beza Zanchius on the place and especially solidly learned D. D. Boyd of Trochrigge learned and sharp Mr. Paul Baines in their learned Commentaries on Ephes. 1. 21 22. Hence Augustine It contains all the sanctified ones But we do not now contend with Papists concerning the catholick Church in its latitude of these two acceptions As 1. Whether the Elect Angels and the Glorified in Heaven and these that are to be members of the catholick visible Church but are not yet born are visible members 2. Whether the Pope be visible head and have the power of the Keyes to feed with word censures and seals the Elect Angels the Patriarchs Prophets Martyrs c. who are now preferred in glory 3. Whether the Church catholick in that latitude containing such noble members can erre in a general Councel or out of it or can erre in Fundamentals and cease to be a Church As to the latter acceptions our Divines condemn Papists who tell us that the Pope is the visible head of the visible catholick Church we say we believe there is a catholick Church but visible it is not And neither Mr. Hudson nor I nor any of ours do dispute for a catholick integral visible Church or for a catholick body of Presbyters and Officers that are have been and now are glorified and shall be born as if they were the first formal subject of the Keyes Mr. H. loses his time in blotting paper to make us dispute any such question and to bring in popish inferences against us in that But 3. there is an integral catholick visible Church to and for which Eph. 4. 11 12 13. 1 Cor. 12. 12 13 c. The Lord hath given all his Ordinances as by succession of ages it existeth on earth See the accurate Confession of Faith See judicious dispute of the Professors of Leyden by Anton. Walaeus worthy to be read of all in which they solidly observe that many confound the particular Church and the visible and invisible and universal Church which are indeed to be distinguished for the universal integral Church is in its own way visible 1. In its parts as is said before 2. In the community of profession of the same faith both in preaching confession and writings so that it hath no sense to limit visibility to one single congregation as our Brethren doe For our eyes may as well see two congregations and many to be visible Saints and to worship in a Church-way the same Lord Iesus as we see the members of our own one congregation 3. Whether Synods be for counsel and advice only as our Brethren say Or 2. For pastoral teaching and dogmatick determining of truths for edification as Mr. Cotton contrary to his Brethren teacheth Or 3. For jurisdiction it is against common sense to deny that the integral catholick Church is visible in Synods whether Occumenical or National or Provincial For the representative is as visible as the congregation And whereas our Divines say that the Church is invisible because faith which is the specifick and constitutive form of the Church is invisible and known only to God the searcher of hearts they are not so to be expounded as if this were their argument to prove that the catholick Church is invisible and the congregation only visible Nor do they use such an argument for such a conclusion for the true faith of a congregation is as invisible and known to God only yea the faith of one single member is as latent and invisible to the eye of sense and more latent then the faith of the whole catholick visible Church for faith is perswaded there is a visible Church for the Scripture saith that Christ hath a seed but the Scripture sayes not that this or that man or that this congregation hath saving faith It s true the profession of the catholick Church is because of the universality of Saints remoter from our senses and so less visible which hinders not that to be true which our Divines say that in time of great persecution the Churches knew not one another as saith Augustine who also compareth her to the Moon which is often â—id as in the time of Elias And Ierom tells that the Christian World sighed under Arrianism The Pope by cruel wars banished those called Waldenses Albigenses Pauperes de Lugduno Picardi until Wickliff rose there was saith D. Fulk about the time of 350. years great darkness See Cartwright Nor is it possible for Mr. H. to prove that when our Divines do say particular Churches are visible that they mean Mr. H. his particular Independent congregations only he is a great stranger in our Divines writings who knows not that from Matth. 18. Tell the Church they prove that a general Councel hath juridical power to censure Peter or the Pope Since learning was it was never counted a point of popery except all our Reformers be Papists which Mr. H. citeth from Turrianus if it be spoken in Thesi but he applies it to the visible body under the Pope in Hypothesi for it is but what Beda and others say from Scripture Eph. 4. 1 2. But as Papists in Thest speak soundly in the attribute of Omnipotency so here when in Hypothest applying the Doctrine of Omnipotency to their miracles to Transubstantiation to Adoration of Images they vanish in vain speculations Nor can we deny but some of our own have gone too far one in saying that the Churches of the Apostles were not so numerous but they met all in one place and that the Church of Alexandria Hierapolis Ierusalem were congregations that met in one place they would explain their mind in that point more circumstantiately if they were to speak thereof again But their purpose is in the point of Prelacy to prove a true conclusion of P. Bains that the Scripture gives no warrant to a Diocesan Church that is to 60 or 100 congregational Churches to be fed by Word Seals and Censures by one little Monarch called a Prelate whereas the Church fed so as is said is a single congregation meeting in the same place 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 2. There cannot be an ordinary exercise of the Keys by the weekly converse of the Officers of 80 or 100 Churches so many miles separated one from another 3. It s true Eusebius in divers places calls the Churches of Alexandria Hierapolis c. Parâ—â—cias congregational meetings and Ignatius writes to the Church of Ephesus that they should convene 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and Tertullian saith the Churches of his time met in one body All which is true of the Churches distributively But Cyprian shall resute them who says the Church of Carthage was one congregation Scripture Reason Fathers shall quickly speak against them who shall say the Church of Rome of Constantinople were one congregational Church under Cornelius and Chrysostome CHAP. VII Ordination not Election of the people gives the
Mediolâ—… as Secrates hath it l. 4. c. 30 c. saith the same See Magdiburg vol. 3. cant 11. c. 6. p. 140. See vol. 3. cent 13. c. 6. p. 260 261. The Magdeburgenses say the reason of multiplying of Officers Bishops Presbyters Deacons Lectors Canons Exorcists c. was in the end of the third Age Ecclesiastick congregations began to be multiplied 2. Metropolitans Archbishops Bishops Deacons Archdeacons in Rome in Constantinople as Sozomen l. 4. c. 2. in Alexandria as Sozomen l. 7. c. 19. and Optat. Milâ—vitanus l. 1. contr Parmen and the 14 Canon of the Councel of Neocaesarea ordains that in amplu civitatibus in large cities there should not be above seven Deacons Now sense and reason would say there could be no ground of appointing such a number of officers if Rome Constantinople Antioch Alexandria had been all one single congregation meeting 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 within the same walls and not a large Presbyterial Church 3. They must be great strangers to Rome who know not that there were at Rome many Churches and Meeting-places consecrated to the Saints and that the Synod of Nice as Ruffinâ—s and Athanasius say ordained the Bishop of Rome to care for the Churches of the Suburbs as the Magdeburgenses say yet all was called the Church of Rome See the Magd. burgenses vol. 2. cent 5. c. 6. p. 357 358. Of the Churches mixture of wheat and chaff see Aâ—gustins and Prosper who say Evil men if they infect not must be tolerated and the good not separated from because of the evil known to be such Otherwise Donatus and his never taught men to separate from latent hypocrites which are seeming and visible Saints as also they must be tolerated that they may be converted Augustine asserts a catholick integral visible Church in Ps. 56. Corpus autem ejus non est ista aâ—â— illa Ecclâ—sâ—a sed tâ—tâ— orbe diffusa for the whole Church saith he is made up of all the faithful having Christ for their Head For the ordination of pastors by the laying on of hands of the Ministers and consent of the people seâ— the Magdeburgenses So was Chrysostoâ—â—â— ordained consâ—nsu cleri populi Constantinopolitani as Socrates l. 6. c. 2. and Sozomen l. 8. c. 2. witness So saith Augustine that not the Church of Carthage onely and of Numidia sed propinquiores Episcopi the neareâ—â— Bishops and Pastors laid on hands See the Magdeburg For association of Churches see the Magdeb. vol. 2. cont 5. c. 7. p. 417 418. 422 493. The Magdeburgenses tell us of famous and celebrious Churches in the sixth Age in Asiâ—â— Africa and Europe in renowned câ—â—ies which had eminent Bishops in them and new Churches builâ— espeâ—ially Iustiman the Emperour built in Constantinople in Thraâ—iâ— the noble Church of Sophia incomparable for magnificence to any in-the world saith Eâ—agrâ—us and Nicephorus And where there be many places of meeting for Worship in great cities Constantinopie Autiâ—ch the Church of that city must be Presbytâ—rial not congregational to sounder Antiquity That the Church of Rome could not meet congregationally the multitude of Churches dedicated to Saints do evince Magdeb. cent 6. c. 6 p. 181. Quod saepe in publicis locis Romae Christiani ad sacra peragenda convenerint â—estantur innuâ—era â—lla delubra 〈◊〉 Sabellico expressa ut Templum Cosinae Damiani Saturnii Vaticanum Batjonae Sopâ—iae Euphemiae Marcelli Pancratii mentionâ—â—â— facit Gregorius Papa Templorum Petri Pâ—â—li Romae Agathae Caesaâ—ii Martyris Julâ—i Mariae Agnetis Foelicitatis Stephani Andreae c. It s true many of these Churches say the Magdeburgâ—â—ses were built not so much for the Worship of God as for Superâ—… yet no sober man can say the Christianâ— in Roâ—â— could mâ—â—â— in one congregation but that many Churches were needful See for association of Churches the Magdeburgâ—â—s That the visible Church is made up of good and evil see the Magdeburg who â—iâ—e Hayme and others though in this and former ages gross corruptions daily grew So the Magdeburgâ—â—ses vol. 3. cent 10. cite Thophylact for the same and Vol. 3. câ—nt 12. c. 7. p. 457 458. and cent 13. c. 4. p. 185. The Magdeburgenses ascribe the power of the Keys Matth. 16. to Peter representing Pastors and for this they cite Theophylactus and Radulphus Ausbertus Ausâ—…s gives so the power of binding and loosing to the Priests Eâ—â—â— in Evang. as excommunication shouâ—◠〈◊〉 by the mouth of the Church the Priest for when the Priest excommunicates the whole body of the Church acts in him See the Magdeb. cent 11. Ausel in Mat. 18. Quâ—râ—â— reâ—â—seritis nec 〈◊〉 Apostolis sed â—â—nibus Episcopis Prâ—… haec potest as concesâ—â— est See the Magdeburgâ—nses citing the Schoolmen Thomas Aquâ—â—â—â— Bâ—…tura Albertus to this purpose also For the notes of the true Church in the dark midnight of Popery Petr. Waldensis in France ann 1160. taught the same with us and yet Mr. Hooker refusing these marks tells us Truth is the Daughter of Time and excellently doth the twelfeth Age agree with the first Age. Of Pet. Waldensis were the Waldenses the sincere part of the Church giving â—estimony against the daily growing corruptions of Rome The Magdeburgenses in their Preface to the third volume of their History Cent. 10. Sunt autem not◠〈◊〉 soâ— propâ—â—â—◠〈◊〉 gaâ—manae Ecclisiae Christi verbi Dei praedicatâ—◠〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Sacramentoruâ— usus iustitutâ—â— Ã Christo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 studio conjunctus These men knew true Antiquity well Hâ—… Wâ—lif Ierome of Prague and the renowned Martyrs of Christ sealed with their blood the same truth as Antiquity witnesses of them Mr. 〈◊〉 calleth the preaching of the Gospel a common adjunct of the Church But we appeal to Antiquity though the Scripture be above all for a warrant of their Church Tertullian offendâ— at such who say the Apostles were ignorant of any thing to whom the Lord gave the Keyes to open and 〈◊〉 Heaven which secreâ—s the people know not and the Apostles dâ— that in opening and sâ—utting heaven which only God can 〈◊〉 Christ gaâ—â— the Kâ—… per â—um Ecclesiae to Peter and by him to the Châ—rch Epiphâ—niâ—â— assâ—â—â—◠〈◊〉 Universal Integral Church though the tongues be divers and God keeps carefully his Church spread through all the World as dwelling in one and the same house 〈◊〉 it s not in Pâ—rygia Cilicia and Paâ—phylia onely but all the World over And he cites that of Christ this cannot be a congregation Lactantius is for our notes of the Church not for Mr. H. the Phâ—yges Novatiani Valentiniani Marcionitae Authae piani aut Aâ—riani leave off to be Christians that then is the only catholick Church which retains the true worship of God Eusebius Pamphil. The Church is diffused all the world over East and West South and North. He expounds Matth. 16. the Church upon the Rock to be
the Ordinances and if the Gospel be there he is obliged to profess it as he is to confess and not deny Christ before men 2. If any of Israel goodwell in another city or town where another Priest shall teach is it in his choice to be taught by that Priest or not or was there no freedome under the Old Testament but there is freedome now Prove this difference from the Word 4. The Donâ—… in that contr Pâ—… l. 11. c. 14. A wicked Minister can no more convert quam vivificare quenquam mortuus potest than a dead man can give life So our Brethren they are not fit to be edifying matter who shall destroy the Church 5. August lib. Retract 2. c. 18. Ubicunqus autem in 〈◊〉 libris commemoravi Ecclesiam non habentem maculam aâ—… rugam non sic accipiendum quasi jam sâ—â— sed quâ— praeparatur ut sis Augustine owns no Church that in the esteem of Saints is without spot or wrinkle 6. Augustine condâ—… the Donatistâ— Aug. contr liter Petil. Episc. Donatistâ— l. 1. 〈◊〉 1. they were broken off from the catholick Church ab or bis 〈◊〉 sancta communiono that was sure no congregation for they set up congregations of their own but they said With themselves onely was the true Church 7. Petilianus said What hath righteousness to do with unrighteousness Augustine saith It s not righteousness taking part with unrighteousness Si Judas Petruâ— paritor sacramenta communiâ—… 8. Petilianus applied the Scriptures that are spoken of real Saints as Psal. 1. Blessed is the man and Psal. 23. The Lord is my shepherd he leadeth me c. to their onely members of separated Churches So do our Brethreu Mr. Cotton Mr. Hooker So Mr. Robinson Augustine answers These words belong not to baptized Simon Magus They are not the words of the tares of the chaff but of the wheat 9. Petilian said the Catholicks admitted all to be just and members of the Church qui verba legis noverunt that knew words of Scripture and Satan knew Scripture The same Mr. H. objects to us See Aug. 10. The question between us and the Donatists is Where is this Body visible for it were madness to think the question was touching the invisible Church where it is Where the Church is What then shall we do shall we seek it in our words or in the words of her Head the Lord Iesus See August It s known Augustine acknowledgeth in all these Writings a Catholick Church from Sea to Sea to which men should joyn themselves as to the visible society of Christ. 11. Our Brethren will have none to be baptized except they be baptized into a particular congregation And Aug. condemns the Donatists who will have it no baptism which is administred without the Church 12. Our Brethren will have so many conditions of the visible Church 1. That the matter be fit visible Saints 2. That the form be a Church covenant 3. That they meet in one place c. Augustine following the Word saith All of Jews and Gentiles in covenant are the visible Church 13. This or that congregation or believer may fall off the Rock defecit ex omnibus Gentibus Christiana Religio excepta parte Donati except some following Donatus and some in America aut alibi See Aug. 14. They who saith Augustine teach That the Church which was to take its beginning at Jerusalem is not that visible City but by a figure is the whole Church that is in heaven and earth may say that also is spoken by a figure It behoved Christ to die and to rise the third day Then Augustine thinks the Church of Jews and Gentiles all the world over to be one visible City against the Donatists and our Brethren Catholicks as August teacheth said that it was the minde of Cyprian that the tares were in the Church not lurking but seen to which the Donatists durst answer nothing they were so moved with the authority of Cyprian Cyprian clearly saith the Lord gave first to Peter upon whom he built his Church nor did he then build the Church upon the confessing Church power to binde and loose as also he saith after the Resurrection to the Apostles As my Father sent me so send I you To Cyprian then one place in Ioh. 20. expounds Matth 16. Now Cyprian never thought that Christ sent the people as the Father sent him And Cyprian soli Petro dixit Quaecunque ligaverâ—s Quando in solos Apostolos insuâ—â—â—vit Christus dicens accipite Spiritum Sanctum si eujus remiseritis pâ—ocata Cyprian proves that the Church is one and Baptism one What talk they then of multiplied visible congregations and multiplied Baptisms And see Cyprian Et quamvis Apostolis omnibus post resurrectionem dicat Sicut â—ifit me pater c. tamen ut unitatem manifestaret unam Cathedram Petri constituit c. Cyprian expounding Matth. 16. 18. And I say to thee Thou â—â—t Peter c. the Church is founded upon the Bishops and every act of the Church by these overseers is guided and therefore the lapsi should not have peace but by satisfying Church-discipline FINIS Isa. 15. 6 7. The adequate subject of Church discipline is not the visible Church as M. H. take 〈◊〉 it A Church without officers may not do what a civil corporation without rulers may do Pag. 13 14. What influence habitation hath to make Church-members Survey p. 1. c. 2. pag. 14 15. M. H. his visible Saints are not the onely fit matter of the visible Church nor is it proved but by conjectures Pag. 15. M. H. 1. Arg. Christ is two wayes a head by M. H. his way Or where Christ is in Scripture called the head of Magus M. R. desires to know Men are the confederate people of God visibly without any mans passing his judgment thereupon M. H. his Second Arg. part 1. pag. 16 17. M. H. 2. Arg. That reall Saints onely are members and subjects of the visible Church and of Christs visible kingdome the place Isai. 33. 22. doth not prove that M. H. his visible Saints are the onely matter of the visible Church Marlorat comment in Isai. c. 3â— 20. tentorium firmum adeo ut ne portae inferorum adversus eam praevaleant Matth. 16. 18. Ioan. Piscator v. 20. adhuc alloquitur pios Iudaeos Calvin in Locum quin dominus in medio ejus ideo non commovetur Muscul. 16. oves meas nemo rapiet è manu mea Calv. in vers 22. notandum hic quae vera sit ecclesia Dei scil Deum logislatorem regem agnoscit Bullinger in locum ita instruct à gratiâ Dei ut malis nec cedat nec frangatur sed semper permaneat firma Calvin vers 24. notatâ— dignum est quod soli ecclesiae cives hoc privilegio remissionis ornantur Gualter in loc ad solam ergo ecclesiam â—ujus cives illa