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A41319 An answer to Mr. Thomas Grantham's book, called, A dialogue between the Baptist and the Presbyterian by Martin Finch. Finch, Martin, 1628?-1698. 1691 (1691) Wing F942; ESTC R7436 100,803 186

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a thing which he never purposed and intended to be be done yea which he resolved to hinder the doing of therefore it is one thing for God to command us to do a thing and another thing for God to purpose and intend this thing shall certainly be effected Yea take another instance concerning Pharaoh Exod. 4.21 And the Lord said unto Moses When thou goest to return into Egypt see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh which I have put in thine Hand but I will harden his Heart that he shall not let the people go God sent a Command to Pharaoh to let the People of Israel go out of his Land Exod. 5.1 but before ever Moses came to Pharaoh with this Message and Command God said to Moses I am sure that the King of Egypt will not let you go no not by a mighty hand Exod. 3.19 So here you see that God as Sovereign Lord may give out a Command to shew his Authority over Man and require a thing of Man as his Duty when he doth not intend to enable a Man to do it Yea when God intends to harden a Man's Heart that is intends to leave Man to the Corruption of his own Heart that he shall never do what God commands him If you will not adore the Incomprehensible Majesty and Ways of God but compare him with Man put Laws upon God that he must do as Man is bound to do then I say this borders upon Blasphemy if it be not down-right Blasphemy against the most high God CHAP. III. An Answer to this Author's Letter to Mr. H. wherein this Author pretends to bring several places of Scripture for Vniversal Redemption IT seems Mr. H. sent a Paper of Verses to this Author He answereth these Verses by a Letter and with this very Humble and Civil Direction To the Nameless and Nonsensical Poet indeed I have seen these Verses and truly to speak my Judgment of them tho' this Author calls them Nonsensical yet they were written with great Judgment excepting the Scriptures which this Author quotes which are excellent in themselves however wrested and mistaken by Men I think there is more Truth and good Sense in those Verses than in all this Author's Book 'T is true he that made those Verses did not shew himself to be a good Poet but he shewed himself a knowing Christian and tho' I have known the Person many years yet I could not have expected that he could have framed so many solid Arguments against Universal Redemption and if I had known before hand that he would have written to this Author I would have advised him to have written in Prose and not in Verse Good Poetry is one thing and good Sense is another These Verses were against Universal Redemption This Author in Answer to this Letter brings several Scriptures for Universal Redemption which are now to be explained When the Papists bring for Transubstantiation the words of our Saviour This is my B dy We deny Transubstantiation but we don't deny the words of our Saviour but shew the meaning of the words to be otherwise than they understand them So in dealing with this Author we do not deny the Scripture we hold that Christ dyed for all for every Man for the whole World that is for all the Elect for all Believers of all Nations of all Ranks throughout the whole World and we say no more is intended in any of those Expressions but that this Author and those that are of his Opinion mistake the meaning of the Scriptures Before I come to explain the Scriptures this Author brings for Universal Redemption 1. Let it be considered that the words all every the World and the whole World do not always signify all Adam's Posterity but must be taken in a limited restrained Sense yea sometimes but for a few that there is nothing can be concluded from those Expressions but by considering the Subject matter spoken of and the Circumstances of the places of Scripture where those Expressions are used 1. As for example of the word all it is not always meant of all Adam's Posterity but sometimes of but few Persons Psal 145.14 The Lord upholdeth all that fall whereas Men fall into sin and misery yea the greatest part of mankind into Hell it self and the Lord doth not prevent these things The meaning is only that those that are upheld and kept out of Sin and Misery here or Hell hereafter he it is that upholds them but this all that the Lord upholds are indeed but a small number in comparison of those that God doth not uphold The Jews said to John chap. 3.26 He to whom thou barest witness behold the same Baptizeth and all Men come to him when it was so few that came to Christ so that John saith vers 32. that no Man comparatively received his Testimony 2. For that Expression every Man it is often to be taken in a limited restrained Sense Luk. 16.16 The Law and the Prophets were until John since that time the Kingdom of God is preached and every Man presseth into it It was only some of all sorts and very few in comparison of those that were then living in the World 1 Cor. 12.7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every Man to profit withal when indeed the manifestation of the Spirit there spoken of the extraordinary gifts of the Spirit are given to few very few but the meaning is only that to every one of those to whom this Manifestation of the Spirit is given it is that they may profit others with it Again 1 Cor. 4.5 the Apostle speaking of the Day of Judgment saith That then shall every Man have praise of God which is meant only of every true Believer for the greatest part of Adam's Posterity shall not then have praise of God but have the Sentence of Eternal Damnation pass against them 3. As for the word World and whole world these Expressions are sometimes taken too in a limited restrained Sense John 12.19 The Pharisees therefore said amongst themselves Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing Behold the World is gone after him whereas it was but few very few of Men then living in the World that went after Christ and owned him in any Sense it was only of a few in that little Country of Judea that were there spoken of Luk. 2.1 And it came to pass in those Days that there went out a Decree from Caesar Augustus that all the World should be taxed it was but all the Jews as some Expositors think however it was but all that were subject to the Romans which were far from being all Mankind then living in the World I might give many more Instances that the word all and every Man the World and all the World are taken in a limited and restrained Sense sometimes and that nothing can be collected rightly from such Expressions but as the Matter treated of and the Circumstances of the place shall require 2. I would
and spiritual judge which Doctrine gives grounds of most Encouragement Support and Comfort if the Lord please to set it home by his Spirit CHAP. VI. Of God's Eternal Decrees what should come to pass in Time and of his governing and disposing of things in the World for his own Glory THis Author in his Epistle to his Book falls upon the Assembly of Divines concerning God's Decrees and according to the manner of the Man leaves out that which should clear their Sense and Meaning that so he might expose them The Words in the Assembly's Confession are these God from all Eternity did by the most wise and holy Counsel of his own Will freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass yet so as thereby neither is God the Author of Sin nor is Violence offered to the Will of the Creatures nor is the Liberty or Contingency of Second Causes taken away but rather established This Article is almost word for word the same with the Eleventh Article of the Episcopal Divines in Ireland 1615. long before the Assembly at Westminster so that one would think it was taken thence God from all Eternity did by his Vnchangeable Counsel ordain whatsoever in Time should come to pass yet so as thereby no Violence is offered to the Wills of the Reasonable Creatures neither the Liberty nor the Contingency of the Second Causes taken away The Reader may see what a Harmony there is about God's Decrees between the old Episcopal Divines and the Assembly of Divines at Westminster There have been two sorts of Atheists in the World the first sort of Atheists denied the Existence and Being of God the second sort of Atheists denied God's governing the World the Lord keep this Age from being Atheists either of these ways If the Evills of Afflictions that befall us came merely by Second Causes and Instruments and were not determined and decreed by God how should we sanctifie God's Name and humble our selves under the mighty Hand of God As Job did when he said The Lord hath given and the Lord hath taken away Blessed be the Name of the Lord. This Men drive at in this Atheistical Age to throw down the Soveraignty Independency and Immutability of God to make him change in his Purposes and Intentions as Men do and to make Contingencies to God as there is to Man It is come to this daring Boldness that Men have asserted in Print that God hath not determined the Period of Men's Lives nor other things of that nature But who I pray shall order what shall come to pass but that blessed God who hath made àll things for himself for his own Glory for the Glory of his Wisdom Power Justice and Mercy And who is fit to govern the World but he that made it Ay but the great Objection that blinds the Ignorant is That if God have from Eternity decreed all things that come to pass then he hath decreed that Men shall fall into those Sins that they do fall into Answer And what then Do not we say that yet God is not the Author or Approver of Sin neither is there any Violence offered to the Will of the Creatures Men sin as freely as if there were no Decree of God to leave them to commit those Sins We say that God's Decrees are not the Cause of Sin neither is God the Author of Sin Nihil isto contradicentius aut impossibilius nempe Deum esse Authorem peccati Nothing is more contradictory or impossible than this Proposition that God is the Author of Sin saith Dr. Twisse Yet he is one that this Author puts in his Black Bill Well but this Author scrapes together several Passages quoted by Mr. Pierce and other Writers out of Calvin Luther Zuinglius Beza and others which are very strange concerning God's determining Men's Sins What do you say to these Expressions I answer 1. That Mr. Pierce and this Author might have spent their Time better than to quarrel with Calvin Luther and those eminent Instruments in the Reformation This is very pleasing to the Papists and those that are Popishly affected for they hate the Names of Calvin Luther Zuinglius and those Divines that God made use of to communicate so much Light to the World And if this Author knows it not I will now tell him that Bellarmine long since in his Writings doth inveigh against them upon this very Account concerning God's Decrees and Over-ruling Hand about the Sins of Men. 2. I say I shall not meddle with any of his Quotations One may cut out Snips out of Authors whereby the true Sense and Meaning of the Authors may be quite altered 3. I say I shall not take upon me to justifie all the Phrases and Expressions of Learned and Godly Men They may sometimes in haste express themselves not so prudently and warily in such a tremendous Mystery as this is The truth is God's mysterious Administration concerning Sin in ordering and over-ruling it to his own Glory is past our finding out 'T is best to say O the Depth And that to be sure though we cannot comprehend it he is righteous in all his Ways and holy in all his Works I would have all Persons very cautious about this Point both of the one side and the other and keep close to Scripture-Expressions which I shall now set before this Author and those of his Way and do fear that till they learn more Sobriety Awe and Reverence of God they would openly quarrel against the Scripture it self in this Matter if they durst Let us then hear what the Scripture saith in this Matter When Joseph's Brethren did wickedly and unnaturally sell him into Egypt Gen. 45.5 saith Joseph God sent me before you to preserve Life And Ver. 7. God sent me before you to preserve you a Posterity in the Earth And Gen. 50.20 But as for you ye thought evil against me but God meant it for good 1 King 22.19 20 21 22 23. And he said Hear thou therefore the Word of the Lord I saw the Lord sitting on his Throne and all the Host of Heaven by him on his Right Hand and on the Left And the Lord said Who shall persuade Ahab to go up and fall at Ramoth Gilead And one said on this manner and another said on that manner And there came forth a Spirit and stood before the Lord and said I will persuade him And the Lord said Wherewith And he said I will go forth and be a Lying Spirit in the Mouth of all his Prophets And he said Thou shalt persuade him and prevail also Go forth and do so Now therefore the Lord hath put a Lying Spirit in the Mouth of all these thy Prophets and the Lord hath spoken Evil concerning thee Exod. 4.21 And the Lord said unto Moses When thou goest to return into Egypt see that thou do all these Wonders before Pharaoh which I have put in thine Hand but I will harden his Heart that he shall not let the People