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ground_n	call_v	church_n	pillar_n	2,921	5	10.5182	5	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A77137	A defence and justification of ministers maintence by tythes. And of infant-baptism, humane learning, and the sword of the magistrate; which some Anabaptists falsely call four sandy pillars, and popish foundations of our ministry and churches. In which tythes are proved to be due by divine right to the ministers of the gospel. All common objections answered, and divers cases of conscience humbly proposed: with a light to clear them. / In a reply to a paper sent by some Anabaptists to Immanuel Bourne, late pastor of the church in Asheover in the county of Derby: now preacher to the congregation at Waltham in the county of Leicester. With a short answer to Anthony Peirson's great case of tythes, &c.	Bourne, Immanuel, 1590-1672.	1659 (1659)	Wing B3851; Thomason E1907_1	92,679	184

weak in the Faith receive but not to doubtful Disputations Besides there are several Disputations in print already enough to satisfie Yet if you John Darker would write your Arguments drawn out of the holy Scriptures to prove what you affirmed yesterday as I apprehended you That the godly preaching Ministers in England are all Antichristian and our Reformed and Reforming Churches Babylon and to be departed from and our preaching not to be heard with your hand and the hand of your cheif Teacher I should God willing give you my Answer And to this I subscribed my name Immanuel B●urne For your wresting and misrepresenting my words and opprobrious terms you give me and false consequences you put upon me I have learned not to give reviling speeches for reviling But I may tell you That you raise a false position like a man of straw and then you will father it on me and fight against me for it when it is a Bastard of your own begetting I pardon this also The Anabaptists Answer Then you proceed in a magesterial way and with a high vapour But Sir say you we must let you understand that those foundation-Principles of the Church of God which we suppose you well know would have been the matter of our discourse hath Scripture as clear to prove them as the Sun at noon day without the help of your consequences or illustrations and you set down divers of your grounds or foundation-principles as that God made the Heaven and the earth Gen. 1.1 That all men are sinners Rom. 3.23 That God made men upright Eccles 7.29 That God sent his Son to save sinners 1 Tim. 1.15 The Resurrection from the dead Joh. 5.29 Mr. Bourns Reply For Reply These are plain Truths and full proof without consequence But these Truths are not in controversie between us But now you come to shuffle in matters of controversie amongst the rest like a man that mingles corrupt wares among good the more easily to sell them and deceive the people As it follows in your Answer The Anabaptists Answer If I would dispute say you that the subjects of baptism are men and women and Repentance and Faith go before to fit them for it it is clear without dubiousness Act. 8.12.37 and 2.38 And you further tell me The Ana ∣ baptists Grounds of Separa ∣ tion That to satisfie my desire to know the grounds of your Separation and why you look upon us as none of the Church of Christ or Ministers of the Gospel for which in the whole you give three Reasons First Reason 1 Because as you conceive we frame not our Church of right materials that is as you explain your self not of men and women of riper years converted but of Infant children who can make no profession of Faith or Repentance Secondly Reason 2 A second ground is Because as you dream we walk in parallel with those the Scripture speaketh of who make merchandise of the word of God for which you name divers places of Scripture Micah 3.11 Ezek. 22 26 c. Jer. 5.30 31. and 23.14 15. Phil. 3.18 All which you wrest and most falsly apply to the godly faithful Ministers of Christ in England which most truly may be applied to your selves as I have proved at full and made ready to have sent you though now I shall not trouble the Press with it being nothing but your fals Quaking scandal and the like to be retorted upon you which I conceive is unchristian like Reason 3 Your third Reason or Ground of Separation is Because as your opinion is our Church standeth upon these four sandy Pillars or Popish foundations Four sandy Pillars 1. Humane Learning 2. Say you Baptizing as you call it but Rantizing or rather cousening of Babes in their cradles take away that say you and you would have no Church 3. Your Tythes or forced Maintenance the wages of unrighteousness say you after which you all run astray take away that and preach who will 4. The Magistrates sword which the Priests have run to in many Generations take away that say you which hath ever been the fundamental of your livelihood and then you would be in danger of starving amongst them whom you call Christians Mr. Bour●● Reply Now I see friends you have changed your method for before your first ground was admission of Infants to be members by baptism of our Churches And in your four sandy pillars you put Humane Learning before Infant Baptism I shall in like manner take liberty to change your method and for my Reply begin first with that which is your third sandy Pillar or popish Foundation as you may please to term it and this is our Tythes or forced maintenance which you call the wages of unrighteousness Because it is so much opposed and spoken against by too many in these times who are not onely adversaries to Ministers Maintenance by Tythes but to the Ministery it self First let us look into the Book of God even from the Creation read Genes ch 1. 2. and you shall find That howsoever the Lord the Creator of heaven and earth the chief Lord of all the world did and hath entrusted Adam and Eve and their sons and daughters with the keeping and possession of inferior creatures and dominion over them and with the fruits of the earth and the increase thereof yet the Lord hath reserved a twofold right yet in the creature First general over all the world and the kingdoms of the earth and goods therein to dispose of them when and where and to whom he pleaseth This the Scripture witnesseth at full He gave the land of Canaan to the seed of Abraham Gen. 15.18 And Hanna tells us that the Lord maketh poor and maketh rich he bringeth low and lifteth up 1 Sam. 27.8 And the Psalmist tels us The earth is the Lords and the fulness thereof Psal 24.1 So the Psalmist again bringeth in God himself speaking All the beasts of the forrest are mine and so are the cattel upon a thousand hills and if I were hungry I would not tell thee for the world is mine and the fulness thereof as is expressed Psal 50.10 12. And the word of the Lord to Jeremiah from the Lord Thus shall ye say I have made the heaven and the earth the man and the beast that are upon the ground by my great power and by my outstretched arm and have given it to whomsoever it seemed meet unto me And now I have given all these lands into the hands of the king of Babylon my servant as you may find recorded Jer. 27.5 6. This Daniel declares in the interpretation of Nebuchadnezzar's dream of the high tree in the midst of the earth which was decreed to be cut down The decree was for bringing down Nebuchadnezzar himself till he did know that the Most High ruleth in the kingdom of men and giveth it to whomsoever he will Witness Daniel ch 4.25 Thus hath God a general right over all the world and

English Nation You do own it but with a limitation I say nothing to your limitation I am sure for what I know you have no reason but to own the present Powers and to submit and obey the Magistrates and all other in Authority when they upon complaint do command the payment of Tythes to Ministers according to Law as in all other lawful commands and as Magistrates have a lawful power to compel so the Ministers of Christ may lawfully appeal to them for Justice and Right and although I would not have any of my Brethren to be contentious for trifles or small matters yet it is their duty to defend and not to lose the just Rights of the Church for succeeding ages especially in these dayes when Sacriledge is by so many accounted no sin as if God had no special right now to any thing in the world and so men could not rob God of any part of the Creature which is his either by Reservation or Consecration for maintenance of his worship and service but if this were so why doth St. Paul writing to his converted christian Jews at Rome such as were called to be Saints Rom. 1.7 demand the question and reason the case with them Rom. 2.22 Thou that abhorrest Idols dost thou commit sacriledg sacriledg sure then might be found to be a sin committed amongst Christians for such were these to whom St. Paul writ it is some question what kind of sacriledg the Apostle means but the Greek word used by the Apostle Rom. 2.22 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Sacrilegium committo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Proprie ●st Templa Despolione Gerh. in Loc. M. Leigh upon the Romans Calvinus in Rom. Hac ratione Ovidius metamorpho 3. Sacrilegum appellat lycurgum ob contemptu Bachi sacra in fastes sacrilegos manus quae numen veneris violarant signifieth to despoil and ●ob Temples or to despoil holy things things consecrated to Divine worship or maintenance thereof as if St. Paul had held as good a false Religion as a spoiling Religion and although Sacriledg is not worse yet it is as bad as Idolatry as that learned man Mr. Leigh well observes upon the place And godly learned judicious Mr. Calvin in his Commentaries The Apostle saith he understandingly opposeth Sacriledg to Idolatry as a thing of the same kind certainly both a like odious to God for Sacriledg is a prophanation of the Divine Majesty or of a worship and service or any thing that belongeth thereunto And this saith Mr. Calvin was not unknown to the Ethnick Poets who called those sacrilegious who contemned the holy things of their Heathen Gods and what can it be but sacriledg or a robbing of God when men violate and take away that which is Gods reserved by him for the maintenance of his worship and service for the taking away of that which belongs to God for the maintenance of his worship certainly is a sin which the Magistrate may take notice of as well as other especially when as it is a setled maintenance by the Laws of the Land as well as by the law of God and certainly the Ministers of Christ may lawfully appeal to the christi●n Magistrates for Justice as well as the blessed Apostle Paul did appeal to Caesar a Heathen Emperour against his unjust adversaries as you may read Acts 25.10 11. I stand at Caesars Judgement-seat where I ought to be judged to the Jews I have done no wrong I appeal unto Caesar I might shew you at large how good Kings and Magistrates have comforted and encouraged the Prophets of God The Levites they taught the people the good-knowledg of God before Christ witness good King Hezekiah the 2 Chron. 30.22 He spake comfortably to the Levites and commanded the people to give the portion to the Priest and Levites that they might be encouraged in the law of the Lord 2 Chron. 31.4 and good J●hoshaphat before him honoured the Levites as you may see 2 Chron. 20. And Nehemiah that good Magistrate contended with the Nobles in Judah for prophaning the Sabbath and whe● he perceived that the portion of the Levites had not been given them he contended with the Rulers and then brought all Judah the Tythes of the Corn and the New-wine and the Oyl unto the Treasury that the Levites might be supplied and they might be dist●ibuted to them according to their right as is recorded Nehemiah 13.10 11 12. And we hope that as God hath formerly so God will bless and honour this present Parliament to be a defence to all the godly faithful Ministers in the Nation though too many desire they may be their destruction What need I tell you of Constantine the Great that first christian Emperour what great respect he had to the Ministers of Christ Eusebius in vi●a Constantini witness Euseb●us in the life of Constantine or of those many christian Princes also who endowed and according to conscience duty as they believed gave and setled Tythes for the maintenance of the Ministers of Christ I have given a Catalogue of many before I might vindicate at full and justifie the authority of Parliaments christian Kings and Magistrates for punishing of offenders and their coercive power to compel refractory men to do their duties according to the just and good Laws of God and men established but I refer you and the Reader to that learned VVork of that learned and laborious man William Prynne of Lincolns-Inn Esq Entituled The Sword of the Magistrate supported That 's a Book not answered nor answerable so as to deprive the good Magistrates of their just Power given them by God and the laws of the Nation over which the Lord in his wise Providence hath placed them and thus I have done with your last ground of separation which you are pleased to call A Sandy Pillar and Popish Foundation that is the Sword of the Magistrate Rom. 13.1 2 3 c. but it is Gods Ordinance and that which you ought to obey even for conscience sake as we proved before And we must tell you that we do not make the Sword of the Magistrate the Fundamental of livelyhood as you imagine though we do bless the Lord that our good Mag●strates are not against us but for us yet we live by Faith and we hope the Lord will strengthen our Faith to depend upon him Hab. 2.4 Mat. 28.20 Heb. 13.5 who hath promised to be with us to the end of the world never to fail us nor forsake us nor do we fear starving amongst those we call christians when Tythes and all we had were plundered and lost we found by experience the goodness of God in opening christian hearts to communicate to our necessities and doubt not but if the Lord should suffer us to be brought to the like straights again Rom. 8.28 2 Tim. 4.18 yet we know all shall work together for our good God is the same God still and will provide for us here what he