Selected quad for the lemma: ground_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
ground_n	believe_v	faith_n	sense_n	1,482	5	6.9836	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A55387	The nullity of the Romish faith, or, A blow at the root of the Romish Church being an examination of that fundamentall doctrine of the Church of Rome concerning the Churches infallibility, and of all those severall methods which their most famous and approved writers have used for the defence thereof : together with an appendix tending to the demonstration of the solidity of the Protestant faith, wherein the reader will find all the materiall objections and cavils of their most considerable writers, viz., Richworth (alias Rushworth) in his Dialogues, White in his treatise De fide and his Apology for tradition, Cressy in his Exomologesis, S. Clara in his Systema fidei, and Captaine Everard in his late account of his pretended conversion to the Church of Rome discussed and answered / by Matthevv Poole ...	Poole, Matthew, 1624-1679.	1666 (1666)	Wing P2843; ESTC R202654	248,795	380

he_o be_v peter_n successor_n but_o for_o the_o proof_n of_o this_o i_o be_o by_o the_o learned_a romanist_n refer_v unto_o some_o passage_n of_o scripture_n as_o thou_o be_v peter_n feed_v my_o sheep_n etc._n etc._n unto_o tradition_n and_o the_o testimony_n of_o father_n and_o act_n of_o counsel_n that_o have_v either_o devolve_v this_o power_n upon_o or_o acknowledge_v and_o confirm_v it_o in_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n from_o whence_o it_o undeniable_o follow_v that_o the_o pope_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o naked_a affirmation_n of_o his_o own_o authority_n though_o deliver_v ●x_n cathedrá_fw-fr and_o with_o all_o immaginable_a formality_n be_v of_o no_o weight_n in_o itself_o and_o have_v no_o strength_n nor_o virtue_n in_o it_o further_o than_o it_o be_v support_v and_o demonstrate_v from_o such_o testimony_n of_o scripture_n father_n or_o counsel_n which_o will_v further_o appear_v from_o this_o consideration_n that_o upon_o supposition_n that_o the_o scripture_n have_v be_v silent_a as_o to_o peter_n supremacy_n and_o the_o father_n and_o counsel_n have_v say_v nothing_o concern_v the_o succession_n of_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n in_o st_n peter_n chair_n but_o have_v ascribe_v the_o same_o privilege_n which_o they_o be_v pretend_v to_o attribute_n to_o the_o pope_n to_o the_o bishop_n of_o antioch_n i_o say_v upon_o this_o supposition_n the_o pope_n pretence_n will_v have_v be_v adjudge_v extreme_o presumptuous_a and_o whole_o ridiculous_a from_o this_o than_o we_o have_v gain_v thus_o much_o that_o the_o pope_n authority_n and_o infallibility_n be_v the_o thing_n in_o question_n and_o but_o a_o superstruction_n upon_o those_o other_o forementioned_a foundation_n and_o not_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o credible_a for_o itself_o that_o it_o be_v not_o in_o itself_o a_o sufficient_a foundation_n for_o a_o papist_n faith_n and_o so_o that_o must_v be_v quit_v as_o impertinent_a to_o the_o present_a enquiry_n and_o we_o must_v go_v to_o the_o other_o particular_n and_o examine_v whether_o a_o papist_n without_o any_o reference_n to_o or_o dependence_n upon_o the_o pope_n authority_n or_o infallibility_n can_v find_v a_o solid_a foundation_n for_o his_o faith_n either_o in_o scripture_n father_n counsel_n tradition_n or_o the_o motive_n of_o credibility_n and_o if_o i_o can_v show_v that_o the_o papist_n according_a to_o their_o own_o principle_n can_v have_v a_o solid_a and_o sure_a ground_n for_o their_o faith_n in_o any_o of_o the_o now_o mention_v particular_n or_o if_o i_o can_v show_v that_o all_o their_o other_o pretension_n according_a to_o the_o principle_n of_o the_o most_o and_o learned_a papist_n depend_v upon_o this_o authority_n of_o the_o pope_n and_o without_o it_o be_v no_o solid_a foundation_n of_o faith_n that_o scripture_n father_n counsel_n and_o tradition_n be_v not_o conclusive_a nor_o oblige_v to_o i_o to_o believe_v without_o the_o pope_n authority_n and_o interpretation_n which_o i_o think_v will_v be_v make_v evident_a in_o the_o follow_a discourse_n than_o i_o may_v true_o conclude_v that_o they_o have_v no_o foundation_n for_o their_o faith_n therefore_o i_o pass_v on_o to_o the_o second_o head_n chap._n ii_o of_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n according_a to_o romish_a principle_n prop._n 2._o sect._n 1_o that_o the_o scripture_n in_o itself_o without_o the_o interpretation_n testimony_n and_o authority_n of_o th●_n church_n be_v not_o a_o sufficient_a foundation_n o●_n faith_n for_o private_a christian_n according_a to_o the_o doctrine_n the_o romanist_n this_o be_v so_o plain_a so_o often_o assert_v b●_n they_o so_o universal_o own_v so_o vehement_o urge_v in_o a●_n their_o treatise_n that_o if_o there_o be_v not_o a_o horrible_a per●versnesse_n and_o tergiversation_n in_o that_o sort_n of_o man_n wh●_n indeed_o by_o the_o badness_n of_o their_o cause_n be_v force_v to_o sa●_n and_o unsay_v give_v and_o recall_v affirm_v and_o deny_v the_o sam●_n thing_n as_o occasion_n require_v and_o the_o strength_n of_o a_o ar●gument_n force_v they_o i_o may_v supercede_v from_o an●_n further_a pain_n or_o trouble_v therein_o i_o shall_v therefore_o only_o observe_v two_o principle_n of_o the_o popish_a creed_n either_o o●_n which_o and_o much_o more_o both_o put_v together_o do_v plain_o and_o undeniable_o evince_v that_o according_a to_o their_o hypothesis_n the_o scripture_n in_o itself_o be_v no_o solid_a ground_n nor_o foundation_n of_o a_o christian_a faith_n 1._o that_o a_o christian_a canno●_n know_v and_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o believe_v any_o or_o all_o of_o the_o book_n of_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n without_o the_o church_n witness_v and_o authority_n 2._o that_o the_o sense_n of_o scripture_n be_v so_o obscure_a and_o ambiguous_a in_o the_o article_n of_o faith_n that_o a_o christian_a can_v discover_v it_o without_o th●_n church_n interpretation_n §_o 2._o for_o the_o first_o of_o these_o it_o may_v suffice_v at_o present_a t●_n mention_v two_o or_o three_o passage_n out_o of_o their_o approve_a writer_n baily_n the_o jesuit_n in_o his_o catechism_n of_o controversy_n make_v by_o the_o command_n of_o the_o archbishop_n o●_n bordeaux_n put_v this_o question_n 12._o to_o who_o do_v it_o belong_v to_o determine_v of_o canonical_a book_n and_o answer_n thus_o to_o the_o church_n without_o who_o authority_n i_o shall_v no_o more_o believe_v st_n matthew_n then_o titus_n livius_n when_o brentius_n allege_v the_o say_n of_o a_o papist_n that_o if_o the_o scripture_n be_v destitute_a of_o the_o church_n authority_n they_o will_v weigh_v no_o more_o than_o aesop_n fable_n the_o cardinal_n hosius_n reply_v 271._o that_o these_o word_n may_v be_v take_v in_o a_o pious_a sense_n for_o in_o truth_n say_v he_o unl_fw-la esse_fw-la the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n do_v teach_v we_o that_o this_o scripture_n be_v canonical_a it_o will_v have_v very_o little_a weight_n with_o we_o so_o charron_n plain_o tell_v we_o 3._o that_o the_o scripture_n have_v no_o authority_n no_o weight_n or_o force_n towards_o we_o and_o our_o faith_n but_o for_o the_o church_n assertion_n and_o declaration_n andradius_fw-la in_o express_a term_n deny_v 2._o that_o there_o be_v any_o thing_n of_o divinity_n in_o the_o scripture_n which_o bind_v we_o to_o believe_v the_o thing_n therein_o contain_v but_o the_o church_n which_o teach_v we_o that_o those_o boh_o k_n be_v sacred_a none_o can_v resist_v without_o the_o high●st_a impiety_n one_o may_v well_o cry_v out_o heu_fw-la pietas_n heu_fw-la priscae_fw-la fid●s_fw-la to_o disbelieve_v the_o scripture_n that_o be_v no_o impiety_n but_o to_o resist_v the_o church_n that_o be_v the_o high_a impiety_n to_o make_v god_n a_o liar_n that_o be_v no_o impiety_n but_o to_o make_v the_o church_n a_o liar_n that_o be_v impiety_n in_o the_o high_a you_o see_v now_o the_o reason_n why_o violation_n of_o the_o church_n authority_n be_v more_o severe_o punish_v at_o rome_n than_o the_o gross_a transgression_n of_o god_n lawe●_n because_o there_o be_v more_o impiety_n in_o they_o and_o so_o more_o seu●rity_n shall_v be_v exercise_v against_o they_o and_o pighi●_n use_v no_o less_o freedom_n tell_v we_o 2._o that_o the_o scripture_n have_v no_o authority_n with_o we_o either_o from_o themselves_o or_o from_o their_o author_n but_o mere_o from_o the_o church_n testimony_n thus_o you_o see_v that_o according_a to_o the_o system_a of_o popish_a theology_n the_o scripture_n do_v not_o discover_v itself_o to_o b●_n the_o word_n of_o god_n nor_o oblige_v my_o faith_n unless_o it_o brin●_n along_o with_o it_o the_o church_n letter_n of_o credence_n an●_n whereas_o in_o st_n paul_n day_n neither_o church_n nor_o apostle_n be_v believe_v further_o than_o they_o bring_v credential_n fro●_n scripture_n act_v 17.11_o and_o st_n austin_n in_o his_o day_n in_o hi●_n controversy_n with_o the_o donatist_n batter_v down_o thei●_n church_n by_o this_o argument_n that_o they_o can_v not_o show_v it_o in_o nor_o prove_v it_o from_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n now_o on_o the_o contrary_a the_o scripture_n be_v not_o to_o be_v receive_v unless_o it_o be_v confirm_v by_o the_o church_n authority_n and_o as_o tertullian_n argue_v of_o old_a placuerit_fw-la god_n shall_v not_o be_v god_n without_o man_n consent_n it_o be_v here_o as_o in_o deal_n between_o man●_n and_o man_n if_o i_o say_v to_o some_o unknown_a person_n recommend_v to_o i_o by_o one_o who_o i_o know_v and_o trust_v i_o shall_v not_o believe_v your_o profession_n of_o honesty_n for_o i_o know_v you_o not_o be_v it_o not_o for_o the_o testimony_n which_o my_o worthy_a friend_n give_v of_o you_o in_o this_o case_n the_o man_n profession_n of_o honesty_n be_v not_o the_o ground_n of_o my_o faith_n or_o confidence_n in_o he_o but_o only_o my_o friend_n testimony_n or_o as_o if_o a_o learner_n in_o philosophy_n shall_v say_v to_o his_o tutor_n i_o shall_v not_o believe_v that_o

to_o be_v true_a which_o i_o read_v in_o my_o book_n that_o the_o earth_n move_v be_v it_o not_o for_o the_o reverence_n i_o bear_v to_o your_o deep_a judgement_n and_o great_a ability_n here_o it_o be_v plain_a the_o read_n in_o his_o book_n be_v not_o the_o foundation_n of_o his_o faith_n or_o persuasion_n but_o only_o the_o reverence_n he_o bear_v to_o his_o teacher_n and_o just_o this_o say_v they_o be_v the_o case_n of_o the_o scripture_n to_o which_o purpose_n they_o allege_v and_o own_o those_o word_n of_o austin_n though_o they_o pervert_v the_o sense_n authoritas_fw-la i_o shall_v not_o believe_v the_o gospel_n unless_o the_o church_n authority_n do_v move_v i_o which_o if_o true_a in_o their_o sense_n than_o the_o church_n authority_n be_v the_o sole_a foundation_n of_o my_o faith_n and_o without_o it_o the_o scripture_n be_v a_o mere_a cypher_n or_o at_o least_o not_o sufficient_a to_o command_v or_o ground_n my_o faith_n which_o be_v the_o thing_n to_o be_v demonstrate_v the_o truth_n be_v the_o papist_n put_v the_o same_o scorn_n upon_o the_o scripture_n that_o the_o prophet_n elisha_n do_v upon_o that_o ungodly_a king_n jehoram_n 2_o king_n 3.14_o and_o bespeak_v it_o in_o the_o same_o language_n be_v it_o not_o that_o i_o regard_v the_o presence_n the_o testimony_n and_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n i_o will_v not_o look_v towards_o thou_o not_o believe_v nor_o reverence_v thou_o sect._n 3_o if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o although_o the_o church_n testimony_n be_v necessary_a before_o yet_o since_o the_o church_n have_v long_o ago_o consign_v the_o canon_n of_o the_o scripture_n my_o faith_n be_v now_o ground_v not_o only_o upon_o the_o church_n testimony_n but_o upon_o the_o scripture_n authority_n to_o this_o i_o answer_v 1_o that_o now_o as_o well_o as_o former_o the_o faith_n of_o a_o christian_a act_v by_o romish_a principle_n do_v not_o depend_v upon_o the_o word_n but_o bare_o upon_o the_o church_n testimony_n which_o i_o shall_v make_v plain_a by_o a_o instance_n i_o do_v not_o believe_v suppose_v i_o be_v a_o papist_n the_o pope_n supremacy_n because_o i_o read_v these_o word_n thou_o be_v peter_n for_o if_o i_o read_v those_o word_n in_o tacitus_n i_o shall_v not_o draw_v a_o argument_n from_o they_o unless_o happy_o i_o shall_v fall_v into_o as_o merry_a a_o vein_n as_o bellarmine_n do_v when_o he_o prove_v purgatory_n out_o of_o 7._o plato_n cicero_n and_o virgil_n but_o because_o the_o book_n wherein_o i_o read_v those_o word_n thou_o be_v peter_n be_v a_o book_n of_o canonical_a scripture_n and_o a_o part_n of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n there_o lie_v the_o whole_a stress_n of_o the_o argument_n and_o this_o i_o can_v know_v say_v our_o catholic_n master_n and_o be_o not_o bind_v to_o believe_v but_o for_o the_o church_n testimony_n which_o testimony_n as_o it_o be_v the_o only_a cause_n which_o make_v the_o scripture_n in_o general_a authentical_a quoad_fw-la nos_fw-la say_v stapleton_n so_o it_o must_v be_v that_o alone_a which_o make_v this_o place_n thou_o be_v peter_n argumentative_a quoad_fw-la nos_fw-la that_o be_v all_o the_o force_n that_o argument_n have_v to_o persuade_v or_o convince_v i_o be_v from_o the_o church_n and_o not_o from_o the_o scripture_n and_o the_o scripture_n make_v it_o canonical_a to_o i_o and_o its_o be_v canonical_a give_v the_o whole_a weight_n to_o the_o argument_n and_o quod_fw-la est_fw-la causa_fw-la causae_fw-la est_fw-la causa_fw-la causati_fw-la sect._n 4._o 2._o it_o be_v not_o the_o word_n but_o sense_n of_o scripture_n where_o the_o strength_n of_o the_o argument_n lie_v and_o that_o sense_n say_v they_o we_o can_v understand_v nor_o attain_v but_o by_o the_o church_n interpretation_n which_o lead_v i_o to_o the_o second_o principle_n of_o the_o romanist_n viz._n that_o the_o sense_n of_o scripture_n which_o be_v indeed_o the_o very_a soul_n of_o scripture_n and_o the_o only_a ground_n of_o faith_n and_o argument_n be_v in_o many_o matter_n of_o faith_n so_o obscure_a and_o ambiguous_a that_o there_o be_v a_o absolute_a necessity_n of_o a_o authentic_a and_o infallible_a interpreter_n and_o judge_n to_o acquaint_v we_o therewith_o that_o be_v the_o church_n or_o per_fw-la aequevalentiam_fw-la jesuiticam_fw-la the_o pope_n and_o it_o be_v absurd_a to_o expect_v and_o impossible_a to_o receive_v satisfaction_n of_o doubt_n and_o dceision_n of_o controversy_n of_o faith_n from_o the_o scripture_n which_o be_v but_o a_o dead_a letter_n unless_o the_o church_n animate_v it_o this_o be_v so_o notorious_o own_v by_o they_o all_o that_o it_o be_v needless_a to_o quote_v author_n for_o it_o that_o which_o i_o infer_v from_o hence_o be_v this_o that_o according_a to_o this_o hypothesis_n the_o scripture_n in_o itself_o i_o say_v in_o itself_o for_o that_o be_v all_o the_o present_a proposition_n pretend_v to_o prove_v be_v no_o solid_a foundation_n for_o my_o faith_n and_o indeed_o that_o it_o be_v a_o mere_a cypher_n which_o if_o your_o church_n be_v put_v to_o it_o may_v have_v some_o signification_n and_o value_n butelse_n none_o at_o all_o and_o that_o it_o be_v not_o the_o letter_n of_o the_o scripture_n in_o itself_o but_o the_o church_n interpretation_n which_o give_v weight_n to_o this_o argument_n and_o this_o plain_o appear_v from_o that_o say_n of_o their_o great_a master_n stapleton_n which_o deserve_v to_o be_v often_o man_n tion_v in_o rei_fw-la memoriam_fw-la and_o the_o rather_o because_o grotserus_fw-la 386._o own_v it_o and_o justify_v it_o when_o stapleton_n have_v assert_v in_o his_o triplication_n against_o whitaker_n c._n 17._o that_o even_o the_o divinity_n of_o christ_n and_o of_o god_n do_v depend_v upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o pope_n and_o when_o pappus_n have_v charge_v stapleton_n with_o that_o assertion_n gretsers_n defence_n be_v that_o stapleton_n do_v not_o mean_a that_o they_o depend_v upon_o the_o pope_n in_o se_fw-la &_o ex_fw-la parte_fw-la rei_fw-la but_o only_o quoad_fw-la nos_fw-la in_o respect_n of_o we_o and_o so_o say_v gretser_n it_o be_v very_o true_a for_o that_o i_o believe_v that_o christ_n be_v god_n and_o that_o god_n be_v one_o and_o three_o i_o do_v it_o be_v induce_v by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n testify_v that_o those_o book_n wherein_o such_o thing_n be_v deliver_v be_v divine_a and_o dictate_v by_o god_n ah_o i_o desire_v the_o reader_n to_o observe_v this_o as_o full_o open_v the_o mystery_n of_o the_o romish_a cabal_n and_o discover_v the_o dreadful_a tendency_n of_o popish_a principle_n make_v the_o divinity_n of_o christ_n precarious_a that_o the_o divinity_n of_o the_o pope_n may_v be_v absolute_a and_o certain_a and_o thus_o i_o trow_v the_o pope_n have_v quit_v score_n with_o christ_n for_o as_o he_o be_v behold_v to_o christ_n for_o his_o authority_n so_o now_o christ_n be_v behold_v to_o his_o vicar_n for_o his_o divinity_n and_o say_v he_o it_o be_v true_o say_v by_o tannerus_n nor_o need_v pappus_n to_o wonder_v at_o it_o that_o without_o the_o interpretation_n and_o testification_n 386._o of_o the_o church_n it_o be_v impossible_a to_o believe_v out_o of_o scripture_n alone_o that_o god_n be_v one_o and_o that_o there_o be_v three_o person_n who_o be_v it_o that_o dare_v charge_v these_o jesuit_n with_o equivocation_n i_o think_v they_o speak_v as_o plain_o as_o their_o great_a enemy_n can_v desire_v here_o you_o see_v the_o meaning_n of_o that_o distinction_n quoad_fw-la se_fw-la &_o quoad_fw-la nos_fw-la viz._n they_o acknowledge_v the_o scripture_n in_o itself_o to_o be_v true_a and_o canonical_a and_o it_o be_v a_o truth_n in_o itself_o that_o christ_n be_v god_n but_o so_o far_o as_o concern_v i_o i_o be_o not_o bind_v to_o believe_v either_o the_o one_o or_o other_o but_o for_o the_o church_n testimony_n which_o be_v the_o very_a thing_n i_o be_o now_o prove_v and_o hereby_o grant_v that_o the_o scripture_n in_o itself_o be_v no_o foundation_n of_o my_o faith_n and_o this_o be_v the_o more_o weighty_a because_o you_o see_v it_o be_v not_o a_o unadvised_a slip_n of_o one_o man_n pen_n but_o here_o you_o have_v it_o deliberate_o assert_v and_o defend_v by_o a_o triumvirate_n of_o popish_a author_n each_o of_o who_o work_n where_o that_o passage_n be_v be_v set_v forth_o with_o the_o approbation_n of_o several_a romish_a doctor_n of_o principal_a note_n §_o 5._o but_o peradventure_o quae_fw-la non_fw-la prosunt_fw-la singula_fw-la a_o juncta_fw-la juvant_n although_o neither_o the_o pope_n authority_n nor_o the_o scripture_n testimony_n alone_o will_v yet_o both_o together_o may_v constitute_v a_o solid_a and_o sufficient_a foundation_n of_o faith_n and_o the_o pope_n authority_n be_v assert_v in_o and_o demonstrate_v by_o the_o scripture_n be_v a_o sure_a soot_n for_o my_o faith_n to_o which_o though_o it_o may_v suffice_v to_o object_v the_o circle_n which_o be_v here_o most_o palpable_a

nothing_o be_v further_o from_o their_o thought_n and_o suppose_v a_o less_o number_n of_o the_o father_n do_v in_o that_o age_n contradict_v it_o though_o the_o contradictour_n happy_o either_o do_v not_o commit_v their_o opinion_n to_o write_v or_o if_o they_o do_v their_o write_n may_v be_v suppress_v by_o the_o major_a part_n as_o have_v be_v the_o lot_n of_o most_o age_n or_o by_o the_o injury_n of_o time_n be_v lose_v which_o the_o papist_n can_v say_v be_v impossible_a for_o the_o write_n of_o the_o father_n see_v they_o tell_v we_o that_o de_fw-fr facto_fw-la some_o of_o the_o book_n of_o holy_a scripture_n be_v lose_v the_o next_o age_n come_v and_o understand_v the_o truth_n of_o what_o i_o have_v now_o suppose_v the_o question_n be_v whether_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o major_a part_n of_o the_o father_n of_o the_o former_a age_n be_v a_o sufficient_a foundation_n for_o their_o faith_n in_o the_o pope_n supremacy_n and_o infallibility_n melchiôr_n canus_n say_v no_o now_o than_o the_o next_o age_n or_o age_n have_v happy_o forget_v such_o contradiction_n which_o the_o age_n immediate_o next_o remember_v the_o question_n be_v whether_o that_o foundation_n which_o be_v insufficient_a to_o the_o precedent_a age_n be_v now_o through_o their_o ignorance_n of_o such_o contradiction_n become_v sufficient_a to_o the_o follow_a age_n if_o they_o affirm_v it_o it_o will_v become_v the_o jesuit_n in_o point_n of_o gratitude_n to_o write_v a_o panegyric_n in_o praise_n of_o ignorance_n which_o be_v it_o seem_v not_o only_o the_o mother_n of_o devotion_n but_o of_o assurance_n and_o certainty_n of_o knowledge_n if_o they_o deny_v it_o they_o confess_v the_o weakness_n of_o their_o assertion_n in_o short_a he_o that_o will_v lay_v the_o foundation_n of_o his_o faith_n upon_o such_o a_o quicksand_n must_v either_o prove_v the_o negative_a that_o there_o be_v no_o such_o contradiction_n as_o we_o have_v suppose_v which_o be_v impossible_a or_o confess_v his_o faith_n rely_v upon_o the_o sand_n which_o be_v dreadful_a and_o again_o admit_v they_o have_v the_o consent_n of_o father_n in_o this_o tradition_n i_o have_v give_v several_a instance_n wherein_o they_o acknowledge_v they_o have_v depart_v from_o the_o consent_n of_o father_n and_o that_o there_o be_v several_a doctrine_n which_o if_o we_o believe_v the_o papist_n when_o they_o tell_v we_o the_o father_n own_v no_o doctrine_n but_o what_o they_o have_v by_o tradition_n the_o father_n receive_v by_o tradition_n wherein_o they_o be_v de_fw-fr facto_fw-la mistake_v and_o why_o may_v they_o not_o be_v mistake_v in_o this_o we_o all_o know_v how_o general_a the_o millenary_a opinion_n be_v among_o the_o father_n of_o the_o second_o and_o three_o century_n though_o it_o be_v say_v all_o come_v from_o the_o mistake_n of_o papias_n a_o honest_a but_o credulous_a doctor_n and_o dare_v these_o man_n venture_v their_o soul_n upon_o it_o that_o papias_n be_v the_o only_a credulous_a author_n and_o that_o this_o be_v the_o only_o mistake_v tradition_n or_o that_o it_o be_v impossible_a for_o those_o father_n who_o be_v so_o many_o of_o they_o impose_v upon_o by_o one_o credulous_a person_n in_o one_o point_n to_o be_v impose_v upon_o by_o another_o in_o other_o point_n all_o these_o and_o many_o other_o uncertainty_n must_v not_o only_o be_v allow_v but_o be_v lay_v in_o the_o very_a foundation_n of_o infallibility_n §_o 6._o the_o second_o particular_a be_v this_o that_o if_o the_o ancient_n do_v believe_v the_o infallibility_n of_o counsel_n yet_o it_o do_v not_o follow_v they_o believe_v it_o upon_o the_o account_n of_o such_o a_o tradition_n for_o they_o may_v believe_v it_o upon_o other_o ground_n it_o be_v evident_a they_o believe_v many_o nay_o to_o speak_v the_o truth_n all_o doctrine_n because_o they_o apprehend_v they_o to_o be_v contain_v in_o the_o scripture_n and_o why_o may_v it_o not_o be_v so_o with_o this_o why_o may_v not_o the_o father_n believe_v this_o if_o they_o do_v believe_v it_o upon_o the_o same_o misapprehension_n and_o mistake_n which_o the_o papist_n at_o this_o day_n run_v into_o concern_v the_o sense_n of_o those_o scripture_n which_o be_v allege_v for_o the_o infallibility_n of_o counsel_n and_o consequent_o the_o father_n opinion_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o counsel_n do_v not_o argue_v that_o they_o receive_v such_o a_o tradition_n from_o the_o apostle_n but_o only_o that_o this_o be_v their_o opinion_n wherein_o no_o less_o then_o in_o other_o point_n they_o be_v subject_a to_o error_n as_o i_o have_v prove_v §_o 7._o the_o three_o proposition_n be_v this_o it_o do_v not_o appear_v that_o the_o ancient_a father_n do_v believe_v the_o infallibility_n of_o counsel_n for_o trial_n hereof_o i_o shall_v refer_v myself_o to_o those_o argument_n and_o authority_n which_o be_v allege_v for_o the_o proof_n of_o the_o contrary_a position_n bel_n bring_v three_o argument_n to_o show_v that_o the_o ancient_a father_n hold_v that_o 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not_o believe_v it_o infallible_a 2._o the_o consequence_n be_v weak_a and_o deny_v by_o the_o protestant_n and_o therefore_o may_v be_v deny_v by_o the_o father_n if_o the_o consequence_n be_v infirm_a now_o it_o can_v not_o be_v strong_a then_o and_o for_o this_o we_o have_v the_o testimony_n of_o a_o papist_n s._n clara_n who_o tell_v we_o that_o calvin_n and_o robertus_fw-la baronius_n and_o all_o the_o protestant_n and_o some_o other_o who_o deny_v the_o infallibility_n of_o general_a counsel_n do_v nevertheless_o acknowledge_v it_o to_o be_v the_o supreme_a judge_n of_o controversy_n upon_o earth_n and_o that_o such_o a_o council_n have_v a_o determine_n and_o decisive_a power_n which_o all_o be_v external_o bind_v to_o obey_v to_o prevent_v schism_n 15._o nor_o be_v it_o unjust_a but_o necessary_a for_o the_o preservation_n of_o order_n and_o prevention_n of_o worse_a mischief_n that_o there_o shall_v be_v a_o supreme_a though_o fallible_a authority_n beyond_o which_o there_o may_v be_v no_o appeal_n and_o as_o it_o be_v no_o injustice_n that_o there_o lie_v no_o appeal_n beyond_o the_o supreme_a magistrate_n in_o civil_a affair_n though_o he_o be_v confess_v to_o be_v fallible_a so_o neither_o can_v it_o be_v any_o injustice_n that_o there_o be_v no_o appeal_n beyond_o the_o supreme_a ecclesiastical_a judicatory_a in_o church_n matter_n though_o it_o be_v fallible_a provide_v it_o be_v grant_v which_o the_o protestant_n with_o the_o father_n do_v assert_v and_o have_v prove_v that_o such_o judicatories_n do_v not_o bind_v the_o conscience_n but_o only_o regulate_v the_o outward_a act_n and_o prevent_v visible_a confusion_n §_o 8._o and_o the_o same_o answer_n will_v serve_v for_o bellarmine_n second_o argument_n which_o be_v this_o the_o father_n and_o counsel_n teach_v that_o they_o who_o do_v not_o acquiesse_n in_o the_o sentence_n of_o general_a counsel_n be_v heretic_n and_o deserve_v excommunication_n and_o therefore_o they_o think_v such_o counsel_n 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fair_a gloss_n upon_o a_o foul_a cause_n yet_o indeed_o the_o authority_n of_o they_o all_o be_v as_o vigorous_o dispute_v against_o by_o the_o most_o and_o learned_a romanist_n as_o by_o any_o protestant_n in_o the_o world_n you_o remember_v what_o their_o great_a master_n bellarmine_n tell_v you_o that_o infallibility_n and_o supreme_a authority_n be_v not_o partly_o in_o the_o pope_n partly_o in_o the_o council_n but_o whole_o in_o the_o pope_n what_o need_v we_o trouble_v ourselves_o further_o those_o four_o be_v now_o reduce_v to_o two_o scripture_n and_o the_o pope_n and_o those_o two_o must_v mutual_o prove_v one_o another_o there_o be_v no_o solid_a and_o sufficient_a ground_n for_o i_o to_o believe_v the_o scripture_n but_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o pope_n say_v the_o papist_n and_o there_o be_v no_o solid_a and_o sufficient_a ground_n for_o i_o to_o believe_v the_o authority_n and_o infallibility_n of_o the_o pope_n but_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o scripture_n for_o the_o father_n and_o counsel_n receive_v all_o their_o authority_n and_o infallibility_n from_o the_o pope_n can_v give_v he_o the_o infallibility_n and_o authority_n they_o receive_v from_o he_o now_o how_o senseless_a a_o resolution_n of_o faith_n this_o be_v though_o most_o of_o the_o papist_n have_v no_o better_a and_o no_o other_o you_o may_v perceive_v by_o some_o few_o instance_n it_o be_v as_o if_o a_o sudent_fw-la shall_v say_v thus_o i_o shall_v not_o believe_v such_o a_o book_n to_o be_v a_o excellent_a book_n but_o for_o my_o tutor_n testimony_n who_o tell_v i_o so_o and_o again_o i_o shall_v not_o believe_v my_o tutor_n testimony_n to_o be_v of_o any_o validity_n but_o for_o the_o testimony_n of_o that_o book_n concern_v he_o who_o will_v not_o laugh_v at_o such_o a_o assertion_n or_o as_o if_o a_o man_n shall_v say_v i_o shall_v not_o believe_v the_o honesty_n of_o richard_n be_v it_o not_o for_o the_o testimony_n of_o thomas_n and_o i_o shall_v not_o believe_v the_o 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their_o cause_n all_o the_o right_a that_o may_v be_v and_o give_v they_o all_o the_o favourable_a allowance_n they_o can_v desire_v i_o shall_v consider_v the_o singular_a conceit_n of_o their_o private_a doctor_n where_o the_o author_n be_v any_o whit_n considerable_a and_o their_o opinion_n have_v any_o thing_n of_o plausibility_n there_o be_v then_o another_o shift_n which_o some_o subtle_a romanist_n have_v late_o invent_v who_o perceive_v how_o their_o brethren_n have_v be_v beat_v out_o of_o the_o field_n by_o strength_n of_o scripture_n and_o argument_n in_o their_o conceit_n about_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o pope_n or_o council_n come_v in_o for_o their_o succour_n with_o a_o universal_a tradition_n and_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o present_a church_n this_o be_v the_o way_n of_o rushworth_n in_o his_o dialogue_n mr._n white_a and_o holden_n and_o sr._n kenelm_n digby_n and_o s._n clara._n their_o defence_n and_o discourse_n be_v this_o for_o i_o shall_v give_v you_o their_o opinion_n in_o their_o own_o word_n a_o man_n may_v prudent_o believe_v the_o present_a church_n for_o herself_o and_o aught_o so_o to_o do_v a_o man_n need_v not_o nor_o be_v not_o oblige_v to_o inquire_v further_o there_o he_o may_v safe_o fix_v infallibile_fw-la say_v s._n clara._n thus_o the_o l._n faulkland_n adversary_n that_o society_n of_o christian_n which_o alone_o pretend_v to_o teach_v nothing_o but_o what_o they_o have_v receive_v from_o their_o father_n and_o they_o from_o they_o and_o so_o from_o the_o apostle_n they_o must_v needs_o hold_v the_o truth_n which_o first_o be_v deliver_v for_o if_o they_o can_v teach_v falsehood_n than_o some_o age_n must_v either_o have_v err_v in_o understand_v their_o ancestor_n or_o have_v join_v to_o deceive_v their_o posterity_n neither_o of_o which_o be_v credible_a but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o they_o only_a pretend_v to_o teach_v nothing_o else_o etc._n etc._n ergo_fw-la they_o must_v needs_o hold_v the_o truth_n the_o acute_a mr._n white_n explain_v the_o opinion_n more_o exact_o and_o full_o and_o the_o strength_n of_o he_o and_o their_o notion_n i_o shall_v give_v you_o in_o his_o word_n 1._o the_o nation_n do_v understand_v the_o doctrine_n teach_v by_o the_o apostle_n and_o practise_v it_o and_o high_o value_v it_o as_o most_o necessary_a for_o they_o and_o their_o posterity_n and_o to_o be_v prefer_v before_o all_o other_o thing_n 2._o those_o first_o christian_n even_o at_o their_o death_n both_o can_v and_o will_v and_o therefore_o doubtless_o do_v most_o vehement_o commend_v this_o doctrine_n to_o their_o child_n and_o the_o father_n do_v always_o deliver_v the_o same_o doctrine_n which_o they_o receive_v from_o their_o parent_n and_o under_o that_o notion_n because_o they_o have_v receive_v it_o 3._o if_o any_o deliver_v another_o doctrine_n he_o can_v be_v prove_v a_o liar_n by_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o world_n or_o if_o all_o shall_v agree_v against_o their_o conscience_n to_o deliver_v a_o new_a doctrine_n under_o that_o notion_n scil_n of_o a_o doctrine_n deliver_v from_o their_o parent_n that_o whole_a age_n will_v be_v guilty_a of_o treachery_n and_o parricide_n and_o shall_v agree_v to_o murder_v themselves_o which_o be_v impossible_a 4._o there_o be_v a_o perpetual_a succession_n of_o pastor_n who_o take_v care_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n and_o it_o be_v evident_a that_o the_o pastor_n and_o people_n have_v the_o same_o faith_n 5._o and_o there_o arise_v heresy_n by_o which_o the_o truth_n may_v be_v more_o clear_v and_o they_o that_o maintain_v the_o ancient_a doctrine_n may_v be_v distinguish_v from_o innovator_n which_o innovator_n do_v not_o public_o reject_v the_o apostle_n doctrine_n but_o plead_v it_o be_v not_o right_o understand_v and_o the_o other_o part_n keep_v the_o name_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n 6._o it_o be_v necessary_a that_o that_o congregation_n which_o always_o keep_v the_o ancient_a discipline_n shall_v alone_o profess_v that_o she_o receive_v her_o opinion_n from_o christ_n by_o perpetual_a succession_n and_o that_o she_o neither_o do_v nor_o can_v receive_v any_o thing_n into_o the_o canon_n of_o their_o faith_n under_o another_o notion_n 7._o as_o certain_o therefore_o as_o one_o may_v know_v that_o the_o congregation_n of_o believer_n which_o at_o this_o day_n be_v call_v catholic_n be_v animate_v with_o a_o number_n of_o learned_a and_o wise_a man_n so_o certain_o will_v it_o be_v know_v that_o she_o be_v not_o conscious_a of_o any_o newness_n of_o doctrine_n and_o therefore_o there_o be_v no_o new_a doctrine_n 8._o follow_v age_n can_v be_v ignorant_a what_o former_a age_n believe_v about_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v explain_v in_o sermon_n catechism_n prayer_n and_o sacrament_n and_o such_o be_v all_o thing_n necessary_a to_o the_o catholic_n faith_n 9_o this_o doctrine_n deliver_v from_o hand_n to_o hand_n be_v confirm_v by_o long_a custom_n diverse_a law_n reward_n and_o punishment_n both_o of_o this_o and_o the_o follow_a life_n monument_n of_o writer_n by_o which_o all_o will_v be_v keep_v in_o it_o 10._o follow_v ruler_n can_v not_o change_v the_o doctrine_n of_o their_o predecessor_n without_o schism_n and_o notorious_a tumult_n in_o the_o church_n as_o daily_a experience_n prove_v 3._o to_o the_o same_o purpose_n also_o holden_n discourse_v in_o his_o treatise_n of_o the_o resolution_n of_o faith_n this_o be_v a_o new_a plea_n and_o deserve_v special_a consideration_n §_o 2._o for_o answer_v 1._o i_o give_v mr._n white_a and_o his_o worthy_a partner_n humble_a thanks_o for_o the_o great_a favour_n or_o rather_o justice_n do_v by_o they_o to_o the_o protestant_a cause_n for_o whereas_o this_o be_v the_o perplex_v question_n wherewith_o they_o think_v to_o puzzle_v we_o how_o we_o can_v know_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n without_o the_o church_n infallible_a authority_n and_o from_o the_o suppose_a impossibility_n thereof_o