vpon what you write Cap. 6. n. 59. We must be surer of the proofe then of the thing proued thereby otherwise it it no proofe that is the certainty of the proofe must be better knowne and more euident to vs then the thing proued But cap. 2. n. 8. you say the Scripture cannot be proued to be the word of God and a perfect rule of faith but onely by Tradition which is credible for it selfe Ergo the certainty of Tradition is surer that is better knowne and more euident to vs then the Scripture Yea further Tradition is a Rocke of our beliefe a principle so euident that it needes no further proofe This I proue by this argument grounded vpon your sayings That which is credible for it selfe and fit to be rested on must be so euident that it need no further euidence This you suppose Cap. 2. n. 45. lin 8. where you say I will neuer cease multiplying demaunds vpon demaunds vntill you settle me vpon a Rocke I meane giue me such an answere whose truth is so euident that it needs no further euidence But Cap. 2. n. 25 lin 5. you say The credibility of vniuersall Tradition is a thing credible of it selfe and therfore fit to be rested on Ergo the Authority of Tradition vniuersall or of the Catholique Church is a Rocke a rule a reason of belieuing so euident and credible of it selfe as it needes no further euidence The third Conuiction 14. VVE haue conuinced your errour by the ouerthrow of the ground thereof Now I proue the absolute infallibility of Christiā faith by the proper cause shewing why it is so and must of necessity be so grounding my proofes on truthes so cleere as they are by you granted Cap. 6. n. 9. lin 2. you say If we were required to belieue with certainty I meane a morall certainty thinges no way represented as infallible and certaine I meane morally an vnreasonable obedience were required of vs. And so likewise were it were we required to belieue as absolutely certaine that which is no way represented to vs as absolutely certaine Thus you Now I subsume But the Articles of our faith are represented vnto you as absolutely infallible not only as morally but as metaphysically and mathematically certaine in themselues This I proue by what you write Cap. 6. n. 3. lin 6. I do heartily acknowledge and belieue the articles of our faith be in themselues Truthes as certaine as the very common principles of Geometry and Metaphysickes But that there is required of vs a knowledge of them an adherence to them as certaine as that of sense or science that such a certainty is required of vs vnder paine of damnation this I haue shewed to be an errour c. Thus you Here you professe that you do heartily belieue the articles of our faith to be in themselues truths altogether infallible euen metaphysically certaine But you could not belieue them heartily as absolutely certaine Truth were they no wayes represented to your vnderstanding as absolutely metaphysically certaine What more cleere then this For how can you apprehend that truth by firme hearty faith which you do not apprehend at all Or how can you apprehend that truth at all with is no wayes represented to your vnderstanding Ergo the mysteries of Christian Religion are by the reasons and motiues of Christian Tradition represented to your vnderstanding as truthes most certaine and infallible in themselues How then are you not bound to belieue them as Truth absolutely and metaphysically certaine in themselues with an hearty adherence to them as certaine as that of sense and science The mysteries of Christian faith being represented to you as morally certaine you are bound as our confesse vnder paine of damnation to belieue them with morall assurance Ergo if they be represented to your vnderstanding as truth absolutely certaine you are bound to belieue them with absolute certainty equall to the certainty of mathematicall and metaphysicall science But they are so represented to your vnderstanding and you heartily apprehend them as absolutely infallible in themselues The fourth Conuiction 15. I conuince the absolute infallibility of Christian fayth by what you write Cap. 4. n. 11. lin 20. Which of vs euer taught that it was not damnable eyther to deny or to so much as doubt of the truth of any thing whereof we either know or belieue that God hath reuealed it Thus you I do not know of what sect you are and so I not say which of you but I cā say that you of what Sect soeuer you be haue taught that it is not damnable for men not to doubt of that doctrine which they belieue to be reuealed for you accuse Catholiques as blind as peruerse enemies of truth and of many the like crimes and in proofe thereof you say Cap. 6. n. 72. lin 15. My owne experience assures me that in this imputation I do you no iniury but it is very apparent to all men by your ranking doubting of any part of your doctrine among mortall sinnes Here you reprehend our doctrine that to doubt deliberately of the doctrine we belieue to be reuealed of God is a mortall sinne that is damnable for I hope your owne experience assures you that we belieue our Catholique doctrine and euery part thereof to be the word of God written or vnwritten With what reason and congruence then can you reprehend vs for holding that it is a mortall sinne to doubt of any part of our Religion which we hold to be the word of God Especially seeing you say Cap. 2. n. 122. lin 12. That if you be persuaded by the Deuil though falsely that it is diuine reuelation you are bound not to disbelieue it vnder paine of formall heresy But to our purpose we will take of your contradictions that part which is manifest truth that it is damnable to doubt of the truth of any doctrine we belieue to be reuealed of God and then I dispute thus There can be no more certaine nor stronger adherence to any doctrine then that which is so firme and vndoubted as the belieuer esteemeth it damnable and an heynous crime so much as to doubt thereof But this adherence to Christian doctrine you require as necessary damning all those that admit any voluntary doubt of the verity thereof Ergo an adherence to Christian doctrine most certayne equall to that men giue to the principles of Metaphysicke is required of Christians vnder paine of damnation yea stronger adherence seing a Christian is ready and ought to be ready to deny the principles of Metaphysicke rather then doubt of Christian doctrine proposed to him as Gods word by perpetuall Christian Tradition Finally it is vnreasonable that men should be bound vnder paine of damnation neuer to doubt of that doctrine which is not so much as represented vnto them as vndoubtedly and absolutely certaine It is a burthen intollerable to maintayne a thing without any staggering and doubting which is proposed only as
mistresse of all necessary truth euen by essence that she can no more depart from teaching proposing and maintayning all fundamentall Christian doctrine then from her owne being Nor do you onely so affirme the Churches essentiall infallibility in teaching all Fundamentals but also prooue the same by the word of God which proposes the Church of Christ as the pillar and ground of truth as built on the Rocke against which the gates of Hell shal neuer preuaile For these words at least euince as you confesse Cap. 3. n. 70. that there shall still continue a true Church and bring forth children vnto God send soules to HeaueÌ„ which could not be vnles she did alwayes without fayle teach all necessary truth so be an infallible guide in Fundamentals 4. Now this being a truth infallible that the Church cannot erre in teaching fundamentals let vs proceed to note and number the doctrines which you openly grant and proue to be consequent thereupon which be such as no more could haue byn desired A Sicilian Nobleman when Scipio Praetor of that country offered him one wealthy and talkatiue but of little wit for aduocate of his cause replyed I pray you Sir giue this man for Aduocate to my Aduersary and then I will be content to haue no Aduocate at all So we may say that the cause of Protestants about the Totall of their Religion and Saluation controuerted with the Church of Rome being abandoned by learned Protestants none presuming to appeare against euident truth so cleerely demonstrated by Charity maintayned it was the Roman Churches good luck you should preferre your selfe and be admitted for their Aduocate for you speake so wisely so pertinently so coherently for ProtestaÌ„ts as the Roman Church needs not any other Aduocate in her behalfe No Catholique Patron no learned man howsoeuer well seene in Controuersies of Religion nay the Author of Charity mainteyned himselfe could not haue spoken more fully grouÌ„dedly vnanswerably in the defence of the Roman Catholique Church then you haue done while you are perswaded that you plead against her as appeareth by these Conclusions the deduction whereof is confessed and expressed by your selfe 5. First there is euer was and shal be a true Church visible and conspicuous to the world that all men according to the will of God may be saued if they please by the meanes of her preaching ouer the world This you grant in saying that if the Church be an infallible guide in Fundamentals then this knowne infallibility must be setled in some knowne Society of Christians by adhering to which guide men may be guided to belieue aright in all Fundamentals 1. Tim. 2.4 No was the Apostle sayth God will haue all men to be saued and to come to the knowledge of truth and consequently he will haue the meanes which proposeth all the truth of Saluation infallibly guiding men to heaueÌ„ to be sisible so diffused in the world as all men may come to see her and learne of her and be saued if they will by the grace of Christ Iesus 6. Secondly this Church being an infallible guide in Fundamentals must be likewyse infallible in all her proposals in matter of fayth This sequell according to your good custome you both deny and grant You deny it pag. 177. saying that the Church though she be the ground and rocke of all necessary truth yet not the rocke and ground or infallible teacher of all profitable truth but may erre and mainteyne damnable errour against it But pag. 105. n. 139. you grant the Consequence saying To grant any Church an infallible guide in Fundamentals would be to make it infallible in all things which she proposes and requires to be believed and Cap. 3. n. 36. you say The Church except she be infallible in all things we can belieue her in nothing vpoÌ„ her word and authority which you proue by this demonstration vnanswerably Because say you an authority subiect to errour can be no firme and stable foundation of my beliefe in any thing And if it were in any thing then this authority being one the same in all proposals I should haue the same reason to belieue all that I haue to belieue one And therefore must do vnreasonably eyther in belieuing any one thing vpon the sole warrant of this authority or else in not belieuing all things aequally warranted by it Behold how earnestly you auerre and forcibly demonstrate what before you did so peremptorily deny that the Church being the pillar and ground of some Truth to wit of Truth necessary to Saluation must of necessity be the pillar ground of all sauing Truth because a Church subiect to errour in some things cannot be the ground and firme foundation of my beleefe in any thing whatsoeuer 7. Thirdly the true Church of Christ the pillar and ground of Truth to which it is essential to propose teach and mayntaine all necessary truth is one Society of Christians notoriously knowne by subordination to one vniuersall visible Head or Pastour This you grant saying that an infallible guide in Fundamentals or which is all one such a Church as shall alwayes without fayle be the pillar ground and teacher of all necessary truth must be one knowne Society of Christians by adhering to which we are sure to be gurded aright to belieue all Fundamentals one certaine Society of men by whome we are certaine they neither do nor can erre in Fundamentals one certayne Society of Christians which may be knowne by adhering to such a Bishop as their Head 8. Fourthly there being such an infallible Church in all her doctrines you suppose that we are not to find out which is the true Church by preexamination of the doctrine controuerted but by euidence of the marke of subordination to one visible Head find the true Church by whose teaching we are lead to all necessary truth if we follow her direction and rest in her Iudgement These foure sequels you teach to be inuolued and contayned in your grant that the Church is alwayes euen by ssâ—nce the pillar and ground of fayth the infallible teacher and maynteyner of all necessary truth whence we shall in the sixt and seuenth Chapter inferre the totall ouerthrow of your cause and shew saluation to be impossible against the Catholique Roman Church The second Conuiction 9. FOr the totall infallibility of the Catholique Church I propose this Syllogisme out of your sayings In matters of Religion none can be lawfull Iudges but such as are for that office appointed of God nor any fit for it but such as are infallible but the Catholike Church is lawfull Iudge endued with authority to determine controuersies of Religion Ergo she is appoynted of God and made by him fit for that office that is infallible In this Syllogisme as in the former both propositions be your owne the Maior you delyuer pag. 60. n. 21. For the deciding of ciuill controuersies men may appoynt themselues a Iudge But in matters of Religion
the markes wherby the true Christian Catholique Church is knowne which to be found in the Church of Rome only shall be shewed in the seauenth Chapter though I cannot but presume the thing is to euery considering man euident inough Wherefore Catholiques and all true Christians do not choose their Church or Religion by their owne naturall reason and witt but Tradition notorious and euident of it selfe Perpetuall Vniuersall Vniforme shewes them the Church and with her and in her that Religion which was for them chosen ordayned deliuered by the wisedome of Christ Iesus brought by him from the bosome of his heauenly Father You see then that in granting Tradition to be the ground of all Christian beliefe you haue graÌ„ted as much as we can desire and howsoeuer you be pleased to terme vs vnconsidering men yet we haue considered the sequels of your assertions perchance more deeply then you haue done your selfe That the assent to Gods VVord of Christian sauing Faith is not meere human morall and probable but Diuine infallible and certainly vnerring CHAP. II. THE contrary errour cozen german to the refuted in the former Chapter consequent therupon is often inculcated by you in your booke That an infallible faith (a) Cap. 6. n. 6. is not necessary vnto saluation nor for our walking vnto happinesse through a world of oppositions backt by the strength of flesh and blood A weake probable and credible assurance that there is an Heauen sufficeth though (b) Cap. 1. n. 8. versus finem vndiscernable from the beleefe we giue to other human hystories It is inough men belieue the Gospell and mysteries of faith (c) Cap. 6. n. 5. l. 28. as much as Cesars Commentaries or the history of Salust That men are not bound nor is it possible they should belieue (d) Preface n. 8. in fine thinges impossible in human reason (e) Cap. 6. n. 7. in fine That we should belieue the truth of any thing the truth whereof cannot be made euident with euidence proportionable to the degree of faith required of vs this for any man to be bouÌ„d to is vniust because to do it is impossible As sure as God is good he will not require impossibilities of vs but (f) Cap. 6. n 7. circa medium infallible certainty of a thing which though it be in it selfe yet is not made to appeare to vs to be infallible certaine is an impossibility These and the like nullifidian Pardoxes you often vtter and endeauour to proue which are plausible and applauded by those S. Peter termeth vnlearned and vnstable heads Varro who now passe vnder the name of Gallant wits whose life we may feare is sutable to the leuity and vanity of their Faith Nam quae venustas hic adest Gallantibus Quae casta vestis These doctrines I say be welcome to such as groane vnder the (g) Nam vera Religio omnino sine graui Authoritatis imperâ—o intri rectè nuilo pacto potest August de vtil Cred. Cap. 9. yoke of humble obedience to Gods word vnder Christian duty of belieuing things inuisible the reuealed manner whereof is incomprehensible to humane vnderstanding who because they find difficulty to do it will not endeauour by Gods grace to rayse their erring and wandring thoughts and stay them by firme and fixed faith on high and heauenly obiects For as (h) Ser. 2. de Asconsione S. Leo saith it is the vigour only of generous mindes to belieue without doubt what comes not within sight and there to rest with our heart whither we cannot reach with our eye And because you accuse Catholiques that they require men to yield vpon only probable prudentiall (i) Pag. 79. n. 70. Vpon prudentiall motiues fallible and vncertaine grounds motiues (i) Pag. 79. n. 70. Vpon prudentiall motiues fallible and vncertaine grounds most certaine assent to thinges impossible in human reason that the falshood of this slaunder may be made apparent I must briefly declare our Catholique doctrine together proue it which shall be of this your errour The first Conuiction 2. TO the constitution of an assent absolutely infallible fiue thinges concurre all which by the consent of Catholique Deuines are most certaine and infallible in the assent of Christian faith 1. The Obiect with is doctrine reuealed of God 2. The motiue and reason of belieuing which is the Authority of God reuealing whose veracity is altogether infallible 3. Because we belieue Reuelations not made immediatly to our selues but to the blessed Apostles it is necessary there be a Proponent of Gods word that is a Witnesse worthy of all credit an Authority whereon we may securely rely that those Christian doctrines were deliuered and preached by the Apostles as Diuine Reuelations This Proponent and Witnesse is the present Catholique Church deliuering what she receaued by full vniuersall tradition from her Ancestours or which is the same in effect vniuersall Tradition Now we hold tradition to be altogether as infallible as Scripture and that it ought to be receaued with the same reuerence with the same submissiue deuotion of pious beliefe as Scripture as you acknowledge that we do chap. 2. n. 1. 3. Fourthly that an assent be infallible it is necessary that the thing belieued be represented and proposed to the Vnderstanding of the belieuer in such manner as he may know the same to be infallible and that in belieuing it he cannot possibly erre For the manner of belieuing if it be not knowne to the belieuer to be infallible though it be infallible in it selfe will not make him sure and infallible This condition is found in the assent of Christian fayth for the things to be belieued are represented as cleer by noted and marked with diuine and supernaturall proofes that is confirmed with innumerable manifest miracles which the belieuers haue seen with their eyes or else know them by the report of whole worlds of those that beheld them by report so full constant brim as it is equiualent to the euidence of sense These Diuine proofes and markes euidently shew that the things marked with them are vnder the speciall care of God and of his infinite goodnesse that he cannot but prouide that the pious belieuer be not deceaued about them 4. Hereby is concluded that the Christian manner of apprehending the mysteries of faith is infallible more sure and certaine then any manner of naturall representation and apprehension of things can possibly be Naturall knowledge is eyther Physicall whereby we apprehend things as true because represented as such by the euidence of sense or Metaphysicall whereby we apprehend things as true by the light of vnderstanding which cleerly beholds the necessary connexion the thing apprehended hath with truth As in this proposition Euery whole thing is greater then any single part thereof our vnderstanding by the notion of the single wordes presently without discourse sees and belieues the truth of the speach Neyther of these
profitable to Saluation and yet she may neglect and violate this duty and be in fact the teacher of some errour Thus you giue vs euery where sal infatuatum infatuated salt salt vnsauoury You often set good salt on the table but instaÌ„tly you corrupt it and the good season and reason thereof by senselesse contradictions That the Church is by office the rocke and pillar of all truth in matter of fayth is good salt hath the fauour and sense of diuine infallible truth but that which followes that she may fayle in this office violate this duty is senselesse and spoken without any salt Do not you say that in Religion none is fit to be Iudge that is fit for the office of iudge but he that is infallible How then can the Iudge in matters of Religion endued with power to determine Controuersies of fayth violate his duety except you can conceaue that he that is infallible may fayle In lyke manner that the Church is by office by duety appointed of God to be the pillar and rocke of all truth both necessary and profitable to saluation is salt doctrine of heauenly fauour and wisedome worthy of God But what you presently add that in fact she may be the teacher of errour is extremely sottish For if the Church be a sure and firme foundatioÌ„ of Fayth how can she be fallible and subiect to errour Do not you say pag. 148. n. 36. lin 11. An authority subiect to errour can be not firme or stable foundation of my beliâ—fe in any thing What is this but that a fallible Church in something and which de facto teacheth errours cannot haue the office of pillar and ground of any truth much lesse of all truth How often doe you teach that God cannot command vs to doe things impossible or command vs to be what is not in our power to be Should God command you to be immortall were not that command vniust For you being by nature mortall according to the body and not able to shake that corruption of how can you be immortall except God take away mortality and bestow the gift of immortality on you Can God appoint that glasse be in office as strong and hard as marble or that sand be as firme and stable as a rocke without taking brittlenes from the one and vnstedfastnes from the other I conclude with this syllogisme wherin both Propositions being your owne you cannot deny the Conclusion God hath appointed the Church to be by office the pillar and ground of all Christian truth a firme and stable Foundation of fayth in all matters of saluation But a Church subiect to errour cannot be a pillar ground or foundation of Christian beleefe in any thing Ergo the Church is an infallible teacher of all truth an infallible guide in fundamentals and consequently in all her proposals That Protesters against the Church of Rome be Schismatiques and Heretiques and cannot be saued without actuall dereliction of their errours CHAP. VI. I SAID in the title Protesters not Protestants for though with you Protestants and Protesters be the same yet it is not so according to the acception of the word Protestant commonly receaued in England You define Protestants to be such as Protest against the corruptions and abuses of the Church of Rome Cap. 2. n. 2. Cap. 6. n. 56. all of them agreeing in this principle that the Bible the Bible and only the Bible is a perfect rule of fayth and action So that all pretended Gospellers and reformed Churches all that infinite diuersity of sects which agree amongst themselues as King Iames sayth in nothing but in vnion against the Pope Caluinists Lutherans Brownists Anabaptists Against Vorstins pag. 65. refermed EutychiaÌ„s Arians Sabellians Samostatenians or Socinians Tritheists and others innumerable are by you comprehended vnder the name of Protestants whome you maintayne to be free from damnable errour Preface n. 39. and in a safe way to Saluatson 2. But in England as all men know by the name of Protestants we properly vnderstand that part of the pretended English Reformation which is condistinct from Puritans and opposite against them Hence Protestants with vs be not the whole multitude of Protesting Biblists or of the pretended reformed Churches but only one branch of them the most moderate of all that which doth least exorbitate from the Doctrine and Discipline of the Roman Church Wherfore by Protesters in this discourse we shall alwayes vnderstand them euery one of them that oppose and Protest against any doctrine proposed as matter of fayth by the Catholique Roman Church of what Sect or Religion soeuer they be and that these cannot be saued by ignorance or by repentance without actuall detestation and abandoning of their errours in particular 3. For though they ignorantly iudge that they haue the truth on their side yet this ignorance doth not excuse their erring because it is not simple ignorance but such ignorance as is euer essentially inuolued and contayned in the crime of Heresy to wit the ignorance of Pride and Presumption ignorance wherby they preferre the seeming of their fancy or iudgmeÌ„t before Traditions Councells consent of Fathers miracles the plain proper and literall sense of Scripture which stand for the Roman Church and Religion These I say cannot be saued in their errours but are Schismatiques and Heretiques as I shall cleerely demonstrate in this Chapter euen by your owne sayings and Principles and first That they are Schismatiques 4. To proue this we must briefly declare what Schisme is The word Schisme comes originally from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifies any diuision cutting breaking renting away of any part from an entire whole thing as a bough from a tree a stone from a building any member from mans body By Metaphor the word is applyed to signify breaches and diuisions in any morall Body which is of two kindes Politicall and Mysticall In Politicall Bodyes or Temporall States Schisme happeneth when any part of the States departeth from the Communion and fellowship of others in being subiect to the supreme authority which ruleth gouerneth knitteth and keepeth the whole togeather whether this authority be Monarchicall Aristocraticall or Dâ—mocraticall Mysticall whole Bodies be only one the holy Catholique Church the Body of Christ of which to be a member as it is the sole and only state of Saluation so to be deuided from it is sinfull and damnable Schisme then in this sense may be defined A voluatary choyce whereby a Christian doth deuide and cut away himselfe from the Communion and fellowship of other Christians in the common knot of subiection subordination vnto the supreme Head and Authority of this Body I say voluntary choyce for no man can be made a Schismatique against his will Schisme being a sinne and a most grieuous sinne Euery Schismatique then deuideth himselfe from the Church by his voluntary choyce either direct as when one doth in plaine termes refuse and detest subiection to
are lawfully called and proceed orderly are great and awfull representations of the Church that they are the highest Tribunals the Church hath on earth that their Authority is immediatly deriued and delegated from Christ that no Christian is exempted from their censures and iurisdiction that their decrees bind all persons to externall obedience and may not be questioned but vpon euident reason Behold D. Potter cryes We Protestants say that Generall Councels are authorized of God to pronounce a Iudiciall definitiue sentence obliging all persons and you cry the contrary We say and are able to demonstrate that God hath not giuen any such authority to any Society Councell or Congregation of men How do you not feare least by thus contradicting your Potter Isa c. 45. you incurre the curse of the Prophet Vaequi contradicis fictori tuo testa de Samijs terrae Woe vnto thee that darest contradict thy Potter though thou art but (a) Samosatenian a Samian Pot-sheard 31. But I can easely make you friends with the Doctour shewing that else where you contradict your selfe and agree with him that Councels are authorized of God to pronounce a definitiue obliging sentence c. 4. n. 18. in fine I willingly confesse that the iudgement of a Councell though not infallible is yet so farre directiue and obliging that without apparent reason to the Contrary it may be sinne to reiect it at least not to affoard it outward submission for publique peace-sake Hence I thus argue Christian Councels haue power to pronounce a Iudiciall definitiue obliging sentence as you confesse and from that obligation you except no Christian and consequently they can bind all persons of the Church at the least to outward submission and externall obedience for peace-sake But none are fit to pronounce such a sentence but such a Congregation or Society of men as are by God authorized thereto as you also affirme Ergo a Christian Councell or Conuocation of Bishops is authorized of God to pronounce a Iudiciall definitiue sentence obliging the whole Christian world 32. And whereas you say with D. Potter that such Councels be not infallible and so may be questioned or reiected vpon euident reasons and that they do bind vs to externall obedience for peace sake but not to an inward assent that their Decrees are true you contradict what you write pag. 59. n. 17. In Ciuill Controuersies we are bound to obey the sentence of the Iudge or not be resist it but not alwayes to belieue it iust But in matters of Religion such a Iudge is required whom we should be obliged to belieue to haue iudged right So that in ciuill Cōtrouersies euery honest vnderstanding man is fit to be a Iudge but in Religion none but he that is infallible Now seing you say cap. 2. n. 22. That in matters of Religion the office of Iudge may be giuen to none but whome God hath designed for it a Generall Councell which hath the office of iudge to pronounce a Iudiciall obliging sentence in matters of Religion must of necessity be infallible and bind Christians not onely to outward submission but also to belieue that it hath iudged right and according to the word of God Except you will say that God doth assigne and authorize such Iudges as are not sit for the office nor such as the state of Religion doth require Besides to say that Generall Councels haue authority immediatly from Christ to bind all persons to externall obedience and yet that such Councels be fallible and false many times what is it but to say that Christ hath appoynted such Authority gouernement in his Church by the force wherof men are bound to dissemble and play the Hypocrites in matters of Religion For example Generall Councels haue defined That Communion in one kind is lawfull command all Christians to approue and practize it You are persuaded in conscience that this is vnlawfull a sacrilegious mayming of the Sacrament and yet by your doctrine That Councels bind at the least to outward submission and externall obedience you are bound outwardly to practise it and to make a shew as if you did iudge the same lawfull It is therefore euident truth the contrary impious that Generall Councels appoynted of Christ as the highest externall Tribunals the Church hath on earth and which bind all persons to externall obedience are infallible And if they be infallible then they who moued with conceyte of their priuate skill in Scripture which they pretend to haue gotten by the excellency of their wit discourse or by singular illumination from God reiect their iudgment and openly Potest that they may erre and haue erred are proued damnable Heretiques The eight Conuiction 33. PRotesters are Heretiques because they condemne and contemne that Church vpon whose authority they haue belieued Christ and Christian Religion For they haue receaued Christ and the grounds of Christianity by the preaching (a) Cap. 2. n. 101. and vpon the Authority of some Church as you say cap. 3. n. 33. lin 10. Now the Authority of this Church ought to be to them to firme and infallible as their Christianity so as they should rather not belieue in Christ then belieue any thing against them by whome they belieued Christ This you teach pag. 90 lin 2. Why should I not most diligently inquire what Christ commanded of them the Church of England before all others by whose Authority I was moued to belieue that Christ commanded any good thing Can you F. or K. or whosoeuer you are better declare to me what he sayd whom I would not haue thought to haue beene or to bee if the beliefe thereof had beene recommended to me by you c Surely if they were not at all and could not teach me any thing I would more easely persuade my selfe that I were not to belieue in Christ then that I should learne any thing concerning him from any other then them by whome I belieued him This is your discourse full of impieties because what S. Augustine sayth of the whole Christian Catholique Church you apply to the Protestant Church of England It is false that any true Christian belieues in Christ by resting on the Authority of the Church of England nor doth this Church if it make Christians propose her selfe but the Holy Catholique Church for the irrefragable witnesse of Christ It is impious that you would neuer haue belieued Christ nor Christianity if the beliefe thereof had beene recommended to you by vs that is by preachers of the Roman Church and Holy monkes sent you for that office from Rome It is Antichristian to professe that you would more easely not belieue in Christ then learne any thing concerning him from any other then them the Church of England by whom you belieued him so that if the Church of England should fall away from Christ into Infidelity you professe aforehand that you will fall away and become an Infidell with her 34. Hence it is cleere that the
Tradition of Christian doctrine from age to age from Father to sonne cannot be a fit ground but of morall assurance Cap. 3. n. 44. lin 55. Who can warrant vs that the vniuersall Traditions of the Church were all Apostolicall Thus you 9. This is your discourse to proue your Paradoxe that the assent of Christian fayth is fallible and only morally certaine But the foundation wheron you build your maine Principle Vniuersall Tradition is not infallible you your selfe ouer throw and establish the contrary ground that tradition vnwritten is as infallible as Scripture Cap. 4 n. 13. lin 19. Vniuersall and neuer-fayling Tradition giueth this testimony both to the Creed and Scripture that they both by the workes of God were sealed and testified to be the word of God Behold the Hypothesis that the articles of Christian Religion that is of the Christian Creed and Scripture are reuealed of God standes vpon a pillar firme and neuer failing If you say morally certaine and neuer failing not absolutely I reply obiecting vnto you another place where you expressely suppose your certainty of the Scripture to be absolute to wit of those bookes of which there was neuer doubt made Pag. 69. We do not professe our selues so absolutely and vndoubtedly certaine neither do we vrge others to be so of those bookes with haue been doubted as of those that neuer haue How cleerly and in expresse termes do you professe that your certainty of the Scriptures that were neuer questioned is not only probable and morall but absolute certainty vndoubted And how can it be otherwise seeing Tradition by liuely voyce conueyeth vnto vs what the Apostles deliuered about the Canon of the Scripture to wit which bookes were to be held as the word of God For no man can doubt but the Apostles deliuered what they had by diuine reuelation from Christ Iesns and the holy Ghost consequently that these bookes be the word of God is a diuine reuelation vnwritten as certaine as if it were written For as D. Field (b) D. Field of the Church l. 4. c. 20. pag. 238. sayth It is not the writing that giueth thinges their authority but the worth and credit of him that deliuereth though by word and liuely voice only 10. Perhaps you will tell me as you do Charity maintayn'd vpon another occasion cap. 2. n. 86. If D. Field were infallible and these wordes had not slipt vnaduisedly frō him this had been the best argument in your Booke Well then I must I see bring an Authour infallible in proofe that Tradition is equall in certainty vnto Scripture one so aduised as all Catholiques compared to his wisdome be but a company of blind vnconsidering men What if I find this Doctrine in your booke proued euen by the same argument D. Field vseth because being written giues not Authority to God's word then I hope you will say without any if that this is the best argument in my booke But where is this passage to be found Perchance if you were to find it your selfe you would be to seeke more to seeke if you goe about to reconcile your contradictions In which case you who vaunt your selfe for the witty Oedipus in soluing the Sophismes and Knots of Charity maintayned will perhaps be at a stop and be forced to say with Oedipus being to solue his owne riddle Ego ille victae spolia qui Sphyngis tuli Haerebo * Scripti fati tardus interpres mei 11. The place is Pag. 153. n. 45. where you speake thus to your Aduersary No lesse say you is S. Chrysostome for the infallible Traditions of the Church But you were to proue the Church infallible not in Traditions which we willingly grant if they be vniuersall as the Traditiō of the vndoubted bookes of Scripture is to be AS INFALLIBLE AS THE SCRIPTVRE is For neither doth being written make the word of God more infallible or being vnwritten make it lesse infallible In these words you affirme that Traditions vniuersall namely and principally that Tradition that the vndoubted bookes of the Scripture be the word of God are as infallible as Scripture You proue it because Neyther doth being written make the word of God more infallible or being vnwritten make it lesse infallible In which proofe you suppose that as Scripture is the written word of God so Tradition is the word of God vnwritten and therefore equall in certainty and infallibility to Scripture 12. Now the ground of your errour being by your contradiction thereof and by your confession yea by your demonstration of the contrary truth ouerthrowne I proue the assent of Christian fayth to be absolutely certaine in this manner Christian faith is an assent to this conclusion The doctrine of Christianity is true This conclusion is deduced from this Thesis Whatsoeuer God reueales for true is true and this Hypothesis The Christian Creed and Scripture be the word of God So that if both these propositions be absolutely certaine then the assent to the conclusion is infallible and absolutely certaine Now that both these Premises or Propositions be absolutely certaine I proue The Thesis Whatsoeuer God reueales is truth you grant to be absolutely and metaphysically certaine But the Hypothesis The Christian Creed and Scripture is diuine reuelation and the word of God is also absolutely certaine First because it is as you grant an vniuersall Traditiō as infallible as Scripture But Scripture is absolutely and metaphysically certaine truth because it is doctrine reuealed of God Secondly whatsoeuer God reueales whether it be deliuered in writing or by liuely voyce only is absolutely and metaphysically certaine But the Tradition That the Creed and Scripture is the word of God is diuine reuelation which the Apostles deliuered by liuely voyce sealing and confirming the truth thereof with workes of God as you confesse Ergo the Tradition that the Christian Creed and Scripture is of God is absolutely certaine and infallible Finally you say cap. 1. n. 8. in sine 2. edition cap. 2. n. 8. infine If a message be brought me from a man of absolute credit by a messenger that is not so my confidence of the truth of the relation cannot but be rebated and lessened by my diffidence in the relatour This you I subsume But the message of the Gospell is brought to me and to euery Christian from a man of absolute credit Christ Iesus the Eternall Sonne of God in whome are all the treasures of Diuine wisedome by a messenger of absolute credit to wit by the Church deliuering vniuersall Tradition which is as you confesse as infallible as Scripture Therefore our faith of the Creed and Scripture is not rebated or lessened by being deliuered by the perpetuall visible Church of Christ but is as infallible as if we had had the message immediatly from the mouth of our Lord and Sauiour 13. Iadde Tradition vniuersall is not only as infallible as Scripture but also more certaine in respect of vs. This I ground
pure and pions Christian fayth did hold against this conceyt of Christs earthly Kingdome 8. More false you are about the Communicating of Infants for you are not able to name so much as one Father of the second age which holds it The words of Dionysius Arcepagita the only witnesse produced in this cause being short of this sense as Vasquez (r) Tom. 3. in 3. p. Disput 212. c. 2. n. 13. sheweth S. Cyprian (s) Serm. delapsis is the first that mentioned this custome to communicate sucking Infants vnder one kind to wit giuing them to (t) Paruulis saltem sub specie vini tradatur drinke of the Chalice which custome was good lawfull as all Catholiks defend (u) Concil Trid. sess 21 c. 4. It is cleere that Pope Innocentius with (w) Nisi manducauerint carnem cius non habebuÌ„t vitam significat Baptizatos vitam habere non posse praeter Christi corpus cui vt incorporentur Sacramento baptismatis imbuuntur de poceat merit râ—â— miss lib. 5. c. 4. vide serm eiusdenâ— citatum a Beda in cap. 10. ad Cor. Claud. Sanchez Rep. 6. c. 7. S. Austine and other Fathers disputing against Pelagius who denied Originall sinne and taught that Children were saued dying without Baptisme did by the eating of the body of Christ and drinking his bloud necessary for Infants vnderstand no more then incorporation into the mysticall body of Christ which was done by Baptisme And this was in Infants to eate the body of Christ and drinke his bloud not with their owne (x) QuaÌ„uis suo corde ore id non agant August de peccat merit remiss lib 1. c. 20. mouth but by the mouth of the body wherof they are members to wit of the Church 9. I haue cleared the Catholick primitiue Church shewed her innocent of your slanders now I come to the second that mentitus es in caput tuum your owne false accusations light vpon your owne head that by your depositions you are proued more impudent then impudencieit selfe For c. 2. n. 163. in fine you say That it is euident and to impudence it selfe vndentable that vpon this ground of belieuing all things taught by the present Church as taught by Christ Errour was held For example the necessity of the Eucharist for Infants and that by S. Austen himselfe and therefore certayne this is no certayne ground of truth Thus you Now what you here prononce vndeniable by impudence it selfe your selfe deny contending that S. Austin held the necessity of the Eucharist for Infants vpoÌ„ the warrant of the Tradition of all ages since the Apostles which is a proofe distinct from the doctrine and practice of the present vniuersall Chusch as you say cap. 2. n. 53. lin vlt. The credit of Tradition is not the Tradition of the present Church which we pretend may deuiate from the ancient Now that S. Austen did ground vpon the credit of Tradition Apostolicall or of all ages you say cap. 3. n. 47. in fine The pactice of communicating Infants had euen then in the tyme of S. Augustine got the credit and authority not only of Vniuersall custome but also of an Apostolique Tradition Behold the necessity of Communicating Infants is held by S. Augustine vpon the warrant not of the present Church but of the Church of all ages and places which you euen in that very place allow to be a good warrant Yea you affirme that S. Augustine in thinking the necessity of giuing the Eucharist to Infants to be a Tradition of all ages since the Apostles to his tyme was not deceiued saying pag. 152. lin 32. The doctrines of the Millenaries and the Eucharist necessity for Infants haue beene taught by the consent of the eminent Fathers of some ages you meane the. 2.3.4.5 without any (y) A manifest falshood They were contradicted by Dion Areop de Eccles Hierar c. 7. By Clem. Alex. 3. Strom. in the secoÌ„d age By Caius S. Cyprian Dionys Alexan. Euseb in the 3. opposition from any of their contemporaries and were deliuered by them not as Doctours but as Witnesses not as their owne (z) Another impudent falshood For they deliuered their Millenary doctrine as an exposition of Mille Anni of the Apocalyps c. 20. v. 3. Opinions but as Apostolick Traditions Thus you Who now is more impudeÌ„t then impudence it selfe Do not you deny S. Austins persuasion of the necessity of the Eucharist for Infants to haue beene grounded on the bare vniuersall custome of the present Church And yet it is also false that S. Austine grounded the necessity of the Eucharist for Infants on the custome of the present Church or on the Tradition of all ages For though there were an vniuersall perpetuall custome of communicating Infants yet that doth not enforce that it was a thing necessary but only lawfull and godly because all vniuersall customes vsed in the primitiue Church were not necessary but pious S. Austine then his persuasion that the eating of the body of Christ was necessary for Infants he did build on the Scripture only the euidence thereof vpon this text (a) Ioan. 6.36 Except you eate the flesh and drinke the blooud of the Sonne of man you shall not haue life in your which testimony he termeth (b) De peccat merit remiss lib. 1. c. 20. Nisi pertinacia pugnaces neruos aduersus constantiamperspicuae veriatiâ— intendat diuinâ luce clarissimum diuinâ auctoritate certissimum so cleere as it cannot be resisted but by pertinacity it selfe 10. You contradict your selfe so farre as to proue your selfe to be a formall Heretike against God and his Word For you say (c) cap. 1. n. 13. cap. 4. n. 11. it is most impious for one to deny that to be true which he knowes or belieues to be Gods word In so much that if one be persuaded though falsely euen by the Diuell himselfe that it is the word of God if he disbelieue it you say he is (d) cap. 2. n. 122. a formall Heretike But you professe your selfe not only persuaded but conuinced not by the Diuels discourse but by the (e) cap. 2. n. 25. euident credibility of the thing that vniuersall Tradition since the Apostles is the word of God vnwritten as certaine and infallible as Scripture (f) cap. 3. n. 45. the rule of fayth to iudge all controuersies by And yet you say that this Tradition this word of God vnwritten is fallible yea false and erroneous in some particulars Could you haue professed greater impiety or more formall emnity agaynst God and his word 11. Thirdly by your contradictions and diuisions agaynst yourselfe you deuide your selfe from Christ saluatioÌ„ cap. 6. n. 1. you say that it is most absolutely indispensablely destructiue of saluation to deny Iesus to be the Christ or the Scripture to be the word of God But you are conuinced by your owne words to doe this by charging
you say men may attaine by fayth vnto saluation without Scripture though they be wholy ignorant of Scripture as you truly say with vs yea though they actually reiect Scripture and refuse to be ruled by it though the same be proposed to them by the whole Church as you say without vs and truth Ergo Scripture is not the only rule and meanes of Saluation 6. Hence you contradict your self when you say To (c) Cap. 6. n. 19. reiect Christ or to deny the Scripture is such an heresy the beliefe of whose contrary is necessary not only necessitate praecepti sed medij and therfore is so absolutly destructiue of saluation that no ignorance can excuse it so that the Church may most truly be said to perish if she Apostate from Christ absolutly or directly reiect the Scripture denying it to be the word of God Thus you so conrradicting you selfe that if what here you write so absolutly be true your doctrine that men wholy ignorant of Scripture yea though they reiect and deny it to be Gods word may be saued is not only heresy damnable in it selfe but also Heresy Apostaticall so absolutly and indispensably destructiue of saluation as no ignorance can excuse it You are a fit man to teach others the safe way of saluation who by your owne words are conuinced to runne a way absolutly destructiue of saluation 7. The second argument If the diuine authority of the Scripture be the only rule and guide of fayth then it is so appointed of God and God requireth of men that they should belieue Scripture to be their rule as being his infallible word his only doctrine But you say God requires not that men belieue the diuine Authority of Scripture yea they may reiect this light and the direction therof without doing against any diuine ordinance or appointment How then is Scripture the only rule of fayth the only meanes and way to saluation except you will say it is the rule appointed not of God but by your selfe the deep wisdome of your excellent wit We shall doubtlesse be well guided and besure not so misse if we follow you for our guide you will teach vs to goe euery way yea contrary wayes at once to belieue contradictions at the same tyme. Consider I pray you this your saying now refuted how contrary the same is to what you write cap. 6. n. 54. in fine where you set downe the totall Summe of your new chosen Religion I am fully assured that God does not and therfore that men ought not to require any more of any man but this To belieue the Scripture to be the word of God to endeauour to find the true sense therof and to liue according to it Quo te Maeripedes Quae te via ducet ad Orcum You goe contrary wayes yet both be damnable errours and lead directly to Hell One way to damnation is belieuing that God doth require nothing els no more then that we belieue the Scripture to be his word not the verityes contayned therin but only that we endeauour to find them This way you take and it is your (d) Cap. 6. n. 57. I am verily persuaded that I haue wisely chosen after a long deliberation new wise choyce the only (e) After a long vnpartiall search I cannot find any rest for the sole of my foot but vpon this rock only rock of rest for the sole of your foot wearied with a long search of the true way to eternal happinesse You haue indeed found rest not for the foot of your soule but for the sole of your foot because your Religion newly chosen hath no footing in your soule but only Ventosâ linguâ pedibusque fugacibus Hence your sole in your foot wearied to stand longe vpon any persuasion flyes from this way God requires of vs that we belieue the Scripture to be his word and no more to the playne contrary That God requires of vs that we belieue the verityes contained in Scripture not the diuine authority of Scripture or that it is his word Betwixt these two contraries you fly from the one to the other without any rest or end 8. Poore wearied commiserable creature One of those wauering babes tossed this way and that way with euery gust of different fancyes Behold the only rock of rest for Christian fayth is offered you in your owne words you haue it if you know what you say if you will not stand ouer by proud ignorance but vnderstand or stand with humble beliefe vnder this your owne saying Scripture is not so much of the being of Christian Doctrine as requisite to the well being therof For on this Catholicke saying of inuincible truth I ground my third argument and by it proue that not so much the being written in Scripture as the Being taught by the Church is the rule to know which is the Christian Doctrine and to belieue it For the Being proposed and taught externally is requisit not to the well being only but to the very being of Christian Doctrine because it cannot be credible and fit to be belieued of Christian men except it be externally proposed and taught them to be of God by some credible witnesse But the Being taught which is so much of the being of Christian Doctrine is not the being taught in Scripture For this is requisit but to the well being therof as you say Ergo besides being written and taught by Scripture another external being taught is requisite which is of the very essence of Christian doctrine which makes the same credible and fit to be belieued and this can be no other but the Being taught by the Church of Christ the pillar and ground of truth So that the rocke the solid firme substantiall reason of belieuing Christian Doctrine is the Being taught by the Church and the Being written in Scripture is requisit ad melius esse to the well being thereof because we belieue it better and more assuredly when we find that which is taught by the Church to be also written in Scripture though this be not absolutly necessary to the constitution of Christian Doctrine Behold what is contayned in your words Hoc fac viues hic sta quiesces follow the counsell of S. Austin (f) Si iam satis tibi ia ctatus videris finemque huiusmodi laboribus vis imponere sequere viam Catholicae disciplinae quae ab ipso Christo per Apostolos ad nos vsque manauit de vtil The cred c. 8. which I I haue noted for you in the margent and abandon that sandy banck an imaginary rocke the Scripture is the only rule of fayth from which you are carried away into a sea of inconstant swelling fancyes which fight together like waues to the dissolution of ech other The second Conuiction 9. THis Conuiction I ground vpon this truth◠that Scripture cannot proue it selfe to be the word of God which truth you deliuer ca. 2. n. 46. That the
Diuinity of a writing cannot be knowne from it selfe alone but by some extrinsicall authority you need not proue for no wise man denies it But then this authority is that of vniuersall Tradition not of your Church From this truth by you granted I thus argue That cannot be the onely rule or by it selfe alone a rule of fayth with is not of it selfe able to proue and shew that which it contaynes to be the word of God For the matter of Christian Faith being the word of God onely that which caÌ„not shew it selfe to be the word of God cannot shew it selfe to be matter of Christian fayth But Scripture alone by it selfe cannot proue it selfe nor consequently the doctrine it contaynes to be the word of God but to this end needeth the extrinsecall Authority of Tradition Therefore not Scripture alone but Scripture ioyned with the extrinsecall authority of Tradition is the rule of fayth 10. This defect of Scripture in respect of being the onely rule or by it selfe alone any rule of fayth you lay open cap. 2. n. 8. lin 7. Though a writing could not be proued to vs to be a perfect rule of fayth by its owne saying so for nothing is proued true by being said or written in a booke but onely by Tradition which is a thing credible of it selfe yet it may be so in it selfe Thus you I would gladly know how can Scripture be the onely rule of fayth or by it selfe any rule of fayth if nothing be proued true nothing shewed to be the word of God barely by being written therein but onely by the light of Tradition ioyned vnto Scripture 11. Hence I inferre if Scripture by it selfe without Tradition cannot be a rule of Fayth nor shew any doctrine to be of God how much lesse can it be a rule of fayth against the vniuersal Tradition of the Church It is deep vanity in you and dull inconsideration of the consequences of your doctrine to boast as you do cap. 3. n. 40. that by Scripture you can confute the Church which taught you Scripture to be the word of God aswel say you as of my Maister in Physicke or the Mathematickes I may learne those rules and principles by which I may confute his erroneous Conclusions Thus you who verily are such a maister you speake of For you deliuer rules and principles by which you may be confuted your selfe For do not you often inculcate this Principle that the Scripture is knowne to be the word of God only by Tradition onely by the testimony of the ancient Churches If then you proue by Scripture any TraditioÌ„ of the ancieÌ„t Church to be against Scripture you shall not proue that TraditioÌ„ of the Church to be against the word of God but that you haue no sure ground to belieue the Scripture to be of God and that you were vnwise to belieue it vpon the warrant of Tradition as you say you do For the rule which may be false in one thing caÌ„not be a sure ground of beliefe in any thing May I learne this lesson of my good Maister your booke which being your scholler hath taught me many rules and principles by which I might confute his maister Pag. â—5 lin 23. The meanes to decide Controuersies in Fayth and Religion must be endued with vniuersall infallibility in whatsoeuer it propoundeth as a diuine truth For if it may be false in one thing of this nature we can yeld vnto it but a wauering and fearfull assent in any thing Thus you Wherefore if Tradition be not endued with vniuersall infallibility if it may be false in any one thing it proposeth for diuine truth it cannot be belieued with firme assent in any thing at all Now the principles of Physicke or Mathematicks are belieued because euident of themselues and not vpon the bare word tradition and authority of the maister For a scholler if he be not assured of those rules principles otherwise then by the word of his maister cannot by the authority of these rules and principles proue any thing against his maister but onely against himselfe that he is a foole eyther in belieuing these rules vpon his Maisters bare word or else in thinking he can by those rules conuince his maister of falshood In like sort you shew small iudgement discretion who persuade your selfe you are able to proue some Church-TraditioÌ„ to be against the word of God by Scripture which Scripture you belieue to be the word of God onely vpon the warrant of vniuersall Church Tradition for this is a thing impossible and implicatory as any considering man will see wherfore not only Scripture but Scripture ioyned with Tradition is a rule of Fayth consequently it is not possible to confute any Church-Tradition by Scripture The third Conuiction 12. THis conuiction is grounded on this truth that vnlearned men cannot be assured they haue the incorrupt text or the true TranslatioÌ„ of Scripture but onely by the word of the Church This you affirme pag. 79. lin 7. 2. Edit pag. 75. lin 36. It were altogether as abhorrent from the goodnesse of God and repugnant to it to suffer an ignorant lay mans soule to perish meerly for being mislead by an indiscernable false Translation which yet was commended vnto him by the Church which being of necessity to credit some in this matter he hath reason to rely vpon either aboue all other or as much as any other as it is to damne a penitent sinner for a secret defect in that desired absolution Thus you from which I conuince two thinges First that the Scripture is not the rule Secondly that the Church must of necessity be still visible and infallible in guiding men to heauen The first I proue in this fort The only rule of fayth must be for the capacity of all men aswell vnlearned as learned simple as iudicious occupied in worldly affaires as disoccupied The only rule I say must be able to assure all men of the Scripture that the Text and the Translation thereof is not corrupt in any substantiall matter But Scripture is not able to do this as you do confesse and consequently there is a necessity that men vnlearned men of meane capacity men occupied in worldly affaires trust the Church Ergo not Scripture alone but Scripture ioyned vnto the authority of the Church is the rule of fayth 13. Secondly that the Church is visible and an infallible guide I proue You say It is repugnant to the goodnesse of God to suffer the soules of men to perish for their trusting the Church which they had reason to trust aboue all other being of necessity to trust some If this be true and it is most true then God is bound in his goodnesse to prouide that the Church which is to be trusted aboue all other be not so bidden as it cannot without extreme difficulty be found nor fallible that it cannot without extreme danger be trusted 2. Edit cap. 6. n. 20. pag. 322. li.
three arguments as well to be briefe as because these be so full conuincing and well grounded euen by such an Aduersary as you are that more will not be required The first Conuiction 1. IF the Church be an infallible guide in fundamentals or which is all one an infallible teacher of all necessary truth then is she a certaine Society of ChristiaÌ„s of one denomination of one obedience subiect to one visible head in fallible in all her Proposals But the Church is such an infallible teacher of all necessary truth or such a guide in fundamentals In this argument both propositions are yours and I shall set downe your words fully whereby you not onely deliuer but also demonstrate them The Major you acknowledge ca. 2. n. 139. You must know that there is a wide difference betwixt being infallible in Fundamentals and being an infallible guide in Fundamentals The former we grant for it is no more but this that there shall be a Church in the world for euer But we vtterly deny the Church to be the later for to say so were to oblige our selues to find some certaine Society of men of whome we might be certayne that they neither do nor can erre in fundamentals nor in declaring what is fundamentall and what is not and consequently to make any Church an infallible guide in Fundamentals would be to make it infallible in all thinges she proposes to be belieued This therefore we deny both to your Church to all Churches of one denomination that is indeed we deny it simply to any Church For no Church can be fit to be a guide but only a Church of some certain denomination For otherwise no man can possibly know which is the true Church but by a praeexamination of the doctrine controuerted and that were not to be guided by the Church to the true doctrine but by the true doctrine to the Church Heereafter therefore when you heare Protestants say the Church is infallible in fundamentalls you must not conceaue them as if they meane as you do some Society of Christians which may be knowne by adhering to some one Head for example to the Pope or Bishop of Constantinople c. Thus you deliuer the sequells of this proposition the Church is an infallible guide in fundamentalls which are in a word our whole Catholique doctrine about the Church that if that proposition be by you granted expressely and cleerely yea proued inuincibly from Scripture you must returne againe to the Church of Rome or else by your owne iudgment be damned to Hell specially because you repeate the same consequences of the granting of an infallible guide in fundamentalls and both approue and proue them Cap. 3. n. 39. lin 11. speaking to your Aduersary Good Sir you must needes do vs this fauour to be so accute as to diâ—tinguish between being infallible in Fundamentalls and being an infallible guide in Fundamentalls That shee shall be alwayes a Church infallible in Fundamentalls we easily grant for it comes to no more but this that there shall be alwayes a Church But that there shall be alwayes such a Church which is an infallible guide in Fundamentalls this we deny For this cannot be without setling a knowne infallibility in some one knowne Society of Christians as the Greeke or the Roman or some other Church by adhering to which guide men might be guided to belieue aright in all Fundamentalls A man that were destitute of all meanes of communicating his thoughts to others might yet in himselfe and to himselfe be infallible but he could not be a guide to others A Man or a Church that were inuisible so that none could know how to repayre to it for direction could not be an infallible guide and yet he might be vnto himselfe infallible 2. Thus you haue told vs cleerely and fully what will follow if you grant the Church to be an infallible guide in Fundamentalls which sequells be so much denyed and detested by you as one would thinke it were impossible you should be so forgetfull as to affirme it And yet you do cleerely say that the Church is not only infallible in Fundamentalls but also an infallible guide in Fundamentalls being euen by essence not only a belieuer of all necessary truth but also a teacher or mistresse thereof Cap. 2. n. 164. initio The visible Church shall alwayes WITHOVT FAYLE PROPOSE so much of Gods reuelation as is sufficient to bring men to heauen for otherwise it will not be the visible Church yet it may sometymes adde things hurtfull nay in themselues damnable And cap. 2. n. 77. in fiae n. 73. initio you grant that the Apostle termeth the Church of God the pillar and ground of truth not only because by duty it is still the teacher of all truth though not so euer in fact but also because it alwayes shall and will be so yet say you this is short to prooue your intent that the Church is infallible in all her proposals vnles you can shew that by Truth is certainly meant not only necessary to SaluatioÌ„ but all that is profitable absolutly simply ALL. For that the true Church alwayes shall be the MAINTAINER and TEACHER of ALL NECESSARY TRVTH you know We grant and â—â—st grant for it is of the ESSENCE of the Church to be so and any coÌ„pany of men were no more a Church without it then any thing can be a man not be reasonable Thus you Verily were it possible for a creature to be a man not reasonable you deserue to carry away the title of a true vnreasonable man from all men that hitherto haue ranked themselues in the number of Writers You are a true man for that you deliuer manifest truth made good by strong reasons you are an vnreasonable man in that you wilfully and obstinately stand in defence of the contrary falshood I will briefly note first your contradictions secondly the sequels therof 3. In the words cited in the first place you distinguish betwixt a Church infallible in Fundamentals and such a Church as is an infallible guide in Fundamentals granting the true Church to be the former but not the later iesting at your Aduersary as though his confounding them did argue in him want of such an acute wyt as you suppose your selfe to haue But in the second citations you do vs the fauour to be so acute so perspicacious so sharpe-sighted as to penetrate into the very essence of the Church and out of that Closet of Truth pronounce that to be infallible in Fundamentals and to be an infallible guide in Fundamentals be inseparably coÌ„ioyned in the Church and that to grant the former to the Church and deny the later were to deuide the Church from its very essence For I hope you will not be so acute as to distinguish betwixt an infallible guide in Fundamentals and such a Church as is alwayes in fact without fayle the teacher the proposer the maintayner in a word the
definition or declaration of the Church Now you and your Protesters hold the sense of Scripture proposed by the meere in ward euidence of the text onely and alone to be the last and vttermost euidence of credibility a Christian doctrine can haue the rocke and pillar of beliefe Ergo when you accuse ech other of disbelieuing euident and plaine Scripture you accuse ech other of the formall proper crime of heresy so that Protesters are according to S. Paul delinquishers of the Church conuinced and condemned by their owne Iudgement The second Conuiction 10. THey that protest against the pillar ground rocke of that Credit and Authority which doth vp hold propose and expose all truth of Saluation vnto Christian beliefe and make the same worthy of all credit in respect of us erre fundamentally and are damned Heretickes This is manifest by what is prooued in the Preface of this Chapter But you protest against such a Rocke for you protest against the Catholique present Church of euery age since the Apostles Cap. 5. n. â—â— circa medium Cap. 5. n. 91. paulo post medium as subiect to fundamentall and damnable errours and euer stayned euen in the second age immediately vpon the death of the Apostles with vniuersall errours whose Catholique externall Communion you haue forsaken because vniuersally polluted with superstitions as you confesse and professe to glory therein Now that the present Catholique vniuersall Church in euery age is the pillar (c) Cap. 5. n. 52. Cap. 3. n. 77. n. 78. ground rocke that is teacher of all Christian truth by duty and office and in fact alwayes the pillar and ground that is the maintayner and teacher of all necessary truth which she could not be vnles she were infallible in all her proposals (d) Pag. 108. n. 139. Cap. 2. n. 139. these things you grant as hath bin shewed at large in the fift Chapter Ergo Protesters are guilty of Heresy as ouer throwers of the rocke pillar last Principle of Christian fayth 11. Moreouer you graunt Tradition vniuersall to be the last Principle of Christian fayth euident of it selfe and so the pillar and ground of all truth fit to be rested on But by making the Church fallible and subiect to errour in deliuering Apostolicall Traditions you destroy this Rocke and make the same no ground to be rested on in any kind of truth For say you an authority subiect (e) Cap. 3. n 36. lin 12. to errour cannot be a firme foundation of my beliefe in any thing and Cap. 5. n. 91. lin 40. expressely to this purpose you say If the Church were obnoxious to corruptions as we pretend who can possibly warrant vs that part of this corruption did not get in and preuaile in the 5. or 4. or 3. or 2. age c. The errour of the Millenaries was you say in the second age vniuersall and what was done in some was possible in others Now seing the authority of the Scripture and of the foure Ghospels and our whole Christian fayth depend vpon the tradition of the primitiue Church you that make the authority of the primitiue Church and Tradition subiect to errour and fallible how do not you erre most fundamentally destroying the last stay and only rocke to be rested on by Christian beliefe Tradition primitiue vniuersall being vncertaine and fallible what certainty can Christians haue of the Scriptures being from God (f) Pag. 63. lin 34. Only by the testimony of the ancient Churches the testimony of the ancient Churches the only meanes of our certainty in this point being vncertaine The third Conuiction 12. IF the Roman Church be the pillar ground rocke that is the teacher both by duty and in deed of all Christian truth then Protesters against the Church of Rome be Heretickes as you graunt and must needes graunt But the Antecedent is true and proued euidently by what you graunt and by what hath been shewed to be consequent of your grants that there must be alwayes a Church of one denomination alwayes in fact euen by essence the teacher of all fundamentall truth visibly discerned from other Christian Societies by this note of Vnity and Subordination to One. Now if there must be alwayes such a one Church the Roman must of necessity be this Church Supra c. 6. conuict 2. This consequence you denied as we noted before which now I make good by this Argument The Church which can must and in fact doth performe the office of guide and directour must be of one denomination subiect to one certain Bishop and also vniuersal Apostolicall one the same euery where for matters of fayth But there is no Church of one denomination in the world noted with these markes but only the Roman Ergo the Roman and only the Roman is that Church of one denomination and obedience Cap. 3. n. 39. lin 18. wherein a knowne infallibility is settled by adhering to which men are guided to belieue aright in all fundamentals The maior proposition of this argument I prooue by what you write pag. 91. (a) Cap. 2. n. 101. where you apply a testimony of S. Austin against vs Euery one may see that you so few in comparison of all those on whose consent we ground our beliefe of Scripture so turbulent that you damne all to the fire and to Hell that any way differ from you c. Lastly so new in many of your doctrines as in the lawfulnes and expedience of debarring the Laity the Sacramentall Cup the lawfulnes expedience of your Latin seruice Transubstantiation Purgatory the Popes infallibility authority ouer Kings c. So new I say in respect of the vndoubted Bookes of Scripture which contayneth or rather is our Religion and the sole and adaequate obiect of our fayth I say euery one may see that you so few so turbulent so new can produce nothing deseruing authority 13. This whole discourse though the last two lines only be sufficient to my purpose I haue produced at large that the Reader might see by this patterne for all your Booke is of the same stile methode and pith what a Kilcow-Disputant you are that is a curst Cow with short hornes yea without hornes at all for your Heart is not so curst and fierce in vttering what you conceaue to the discredit of the Roman Church but your Vnderstanding is as weake and faynt in proouing what you say You haue heaped togeather many doctrines of the Roman Church which you traduce as nouelties but in all your discourse there is not any strength of Argument to shew them to be such So we cannot say of you Cornu ferit ille caueto for you strike vs only with the bare forehead of impudent assertion without proofe yea without offer or proffer of proofe Nor could you prooue them these being for the most part all manifest Christian truths which you would haue taken vpon your bare word to be errours For how can you prooue that
cause to admire your ignorance in Latin yea want of iudgment in playing Monus at her Translation For euery man of wit and common sense must of necessity perceaue that S. Irenaeus could not meane corporall resorting to Rome without being ridiculous For though we should grant that conuenire may signifie to resort yet it is cleere that it doth not signify barely to resort but to resort or come to a place together to meet there in one assembly Now it is ridiculous to thinke that S. Irenaeus would haue all Churchs and all the faythfull on euery side to be bound not only to come to Rome but also to come thither all at the same time at once It is therefore manifest that S. Irenaeus doth attribute powerfull principality to the Roman Church Bishop ouer all Christian Churches by reason wherof all other are bound and obliged in duty to come together with the Church of Rome not by corporal repayre to the Citty but by consent of mind to the Roman Fayth But this more powerfull Principality this Iudicial Authority and Headship the Roman Bishop could not haue by gift of men as you confesse Ergo he had it by diuine appointment as the successour of S. Peter in whom by the voyce and word of our Lord it was instituted So that Protesters by opposing the Church of Rome and S. Peters successour oppose the ground and pillar of all Christian truth and so are Heretiques The sixt Conuiction 27. THE visible Church is the Iudge of Controuersies and therefore infallible in all her Proposals so that to oppose her is as much as to oppose God himselfe and consequently whosoeuer opposeth against the Doctrine of the visible Church is an Hereticke This argument is proposed by the maintayner of Charity c. 6. n. 15. to which you answere cap. 6. n. 13. First you deny the Church to be Iudge of Controuersies How say you can she be the Iudge of them if she cannot decide them and how can she decide them if it be a question whether she be Iudge of them That which is questioned it selfe cannot with any sense be pretended to be fit to decide Controuersies Secondly you say If she were iudge it wold not follow that she were infallible for we haue many Iudge in our Courts of Iudicature yet none infallible Thus you How could you possibly be so obliuious as not once to imagine that both these answeres are direct Contradictions of what you before affirmed Cap. 2. n. 162. you say The Church hath authority of determining Controuersies of fayth according to plaine and euident Scripture and vniuersall Tradition and to excommunicate the man that should persist in errour against her determinations Now if she be not Iudge if her authority be questioned how can she do this Secondly she being Iudge of Controuersies that she must be infallible though Iudges in the Courts of Ciuill Iudicature be not such you affirme cap. 2. n. 17. We are to obey the sentence of the ciuill Iudge and not resist it but not alwayes to belieue it iust but in matters of Religion such a Iudge is required whome we should be bound to belieue to haue iudged right so that in ciuill Controuersies euery honest and vnderstanding man is fit to be a Iudge but in Religion none but he that is infallible Thus you whose words cōtaine an vnanswerable demonstration against your selfe that the Church being Iudge to determine Controuersies of fayth must of necessity be infallible 28. Thirdly you say That though she were a Iudge infallible yet to oppose her declaration would not be to oppose God except the opposer know that she doth infallibly propose the word of God I answere that to oppose the Propenent of fayth (a) Cap. 2 n. 26. That which is either euident of it selfe and seen by its owne light or reduced vnto setled vpon the principle that is so which is euidently credible of it selfe or euidently reduced to such an euident credible Principle is Heresy a vertuall opposing of God and his Reuelation For the Proponēt being a witnesse worthy of all credit the disbelieuer of this proposition must of necessity assent except he be mislead by Passiō against the truth reueal'd or by pride against the proposer therof as I shewed in the preface to the argumēts of this chapter The seauenth Conuiction 29. THE Church gathered togeather in Generall Councels or a Generall Councell of Christian Bishops haue Power to propose define with infallibility the Cōttouersies of Religion bind all Christians vnder paine of heresy to belieue their definitions But Protesters oppose Generall Councels such definitions of fayth which they know and confesse to haue beene enacted by them contending that such Christian Assemblies representing the whole Christian Church are fallible and haue beene many times false as is notorious Ergo they contradict the infallible Proponent of Christian Fayth preferring their owne priuate fancyes and so are guilty of Hereticall obstinacy and pride The maior Proposition of this argument is euident and vndeniable by the perpetuall Tradition and practise of all former Christian ages euen of the Primitiue times For though then they could not meet together all in one place yet they did assemble generally in different places determine the Controuersies of Religion against Heresies that did arise In proofe hereof the testimony of Tertullian is cleere and direct mentioning generall Councels gathered by command no doubt of the Roman Bishop De iciunijs cap. 13. Aguntur praecepta per Graecias illas certis in locis Concilia ex vniuersis Ecclesiis perquae altiord quaeque in commune tractantur ipsa representatio totius nominis Christiani magna veneratione celebratur Behold the notorious Antiquity of the Catholique Tradition about the venerable Authority of General Councells to determine the highest matters of Religion as being the representatiue Church or representations of the whole Christian Name Wherfore Protesters who contemne this Tradition euidently certaine or credible of it selfe and oppose Generall Councels cannot be excused from damnable Hereticall pride 30. But Tradition though neuer so perpetuall and primitiue full and vniuersall will not grow in your garden except the same be watered from your Well with whome nothing is well but what is your owne Thus you write c. 2. n. 85. lin 6. This we know that none is fit to pronounce for all the world a Iudiciall definitiue obliging sentence in Controuersies of Religion but onely such a Man or such a Society of men as is authorized thereto by God And besides we are able to demonstrate that it hath not beene the pleasure of God to giue to any Man or Society of men any such authority The truth of the first part of this saying will establish the authority of Generall Councels from God when the falshood of the second shall be confuted by D. Potter yea by your owne contradiction thereof D. Potter writeth pag. 165. We say that such Generall Councels as
saying of S. Augustine I would not belieue the Gospell vnlesse the Authority of the Church did moue me I would more easely persuade my selfe that I were not to belieue Christ then that I should learne any thing concerning him from any other then them by whom I belieued him this Profession I say though most euident truth caÌ„not without impiety be applyed to any church which is not indefectible and infallible in all her Proposals It is euident truth because the proofe must be to vs more manifest and we surer of the truth there of then the thing proued thereby otherwise it is no proofe as you say Cap. 6 n. 59. in fine But the only proofe the only motiue and reason we haue to belieue Christ that he liued on earth and that his doctrine and Religion is contayned in the Christian Scripture is the Catholique Church and her word and Tradition as you often grant Therefore as S. Cap. 5. n. 64. lin 8. Augustine sayth how can we haue euidence of Christ if we haue not euidence of the Church that she cannot erre in her Proposals And if true Christians be surer of the Tradition of the Church then of Christ then according to reason they may sooner disbelieue Christ then the vniuersall Church But you Protest against the visible Catholique Church that she is not free from damnable errours in fayth and damnable corruptions in practise that Church by whom you haue belieued Christ if you do truely and Christianly belieue in him How then can you be Christians or haue any grounded assurance of fayth concerning him You will say that you haue belieued in Christ not by this present Catholique Church but by the Church of all ages This is vaine because you can haue no assurance of the Church of all former ages and of what they belieued and taught but by the word and testimony of the present Nor do you hold the Church of all ages infallible Cap. 5. n. 91. post medium yea you expressely teach that the same was presently vpon the Apostles death couered with darkenesse and vniuersall Errours how then be you not heretiques and false Christians who belieue Christ and Christianity vpon no other or better ground then your owne fancy The ninth Conuiction 35. PRotesters destroy by their doctrine the being essence of the Catho Christian Church But the doctrine destructiue of the Church or the deniall of the holy Catholique Church is a damnable blasphemous heresy Ergo Protesters be Heretiques of the worser and more damnable sort You deny both Propositions of this Argument yet you teach principles by which they are demonstratiuely cleered against you The maior is proued because you often teach and it is the mayne point of your Religion that the whole Catholique (a) Pag. 291. lin 9. or c. 5. n. 88 in â—edio Church is subiect to errours to damnable errours yea (b) Cap. 5. n. 7. Cap. 3. n. 36. li. 12. to fundamentall errours in some kind But this doctrine doth totally and essentially ouerthrow the being of the Church For you grant that the Church is alwayes by essence the Rocke and ground c that is alwayes the actual Teacher of all necessary truth so that they who take this from her take her essence from her Cap. 5. per to â—uÌ„ and essentially destroy her being But he who sayth that the Church is subiect to errours in matter of fayth maketh the Church not to be the pillar and ground of truth for you say An authority subiect to errour cannot be a firme and stable foundation a pillar and ground of beliefe in any thing Ergo they that make the Church fallible and subiect to some errours in some proposalls of fayth destroy her essence Hence your distinction of a true Church and of a pure Church free from errours and that there was euer shall be a true Christian Catholique Church in the world but not a pure vnspotted Church from all errours this distinction I say by you repeated many hundred of times is vayne for I haue demonstrated that impurity in matter of fayth yea possibility to be impure and erroneous in any Proposals of Fayth is against the very essence of the Church The minor also you deny See Edit 6 n. 9. circamed Cap. 2. n. 13. lin 12. If Zelots had held that there was not only no pure visible Church but none at all surely they had said more then they could iustify but yet you do not shew nor can I discouer any such vast absurdity or sacrilegious Blasphemy in this assertion Thus you And this fancy then did so occupy the short capacity of your brayne that the contrary declaratioÌ„s which you make in your Booke were driuen quite out of your mind Pag. 336. lin 25. Into such an heresie which destroyeth essentially Christianity if the Church should fall it might be said more truly to perish then if it fell only into some errours of its owne nature damnable for in that state all the members of it without exception all without mercy must perish for euer Thus you teaching that if the Church perish essentially and remayne Christian not in Truth but only in name that all the members thereof without exception all without mercy perish with it Can any absurdity be more vast and full of horrour then this You teach this immanity to be consequent vpon the totall destruction of the Church and yet say that you cannot discouer any such vast absurdity in that destructiue doctrine So small a matter it seemes to you to grant that all Christians since the dayes of the Apostles perished euerlastingly 36. Is it not sacrilegious blasphemy to make Christ a false Prophet who sayd that the gates of Hell should neuer preuayle against is Which promise doth import as you acknowledge cap. 3. n. 70 that she shall alwayes continue a true Church and bring forth children vnto God and send soules to Heauen Now they who contend that there was for many ages no Church make this promise of our Lord to be false Therefore they are guilty of most sacrilegious Blasphemy as the Maintayner of Charity said and none will deny that hath in him any sparke of Charity towardes Christ The Conclusion 37. ANd now giue me leaue Courteous Reader to make an end For what hath been said may more then abundantly suffice to shew the vanity of this mans enterprize who would cut out a safe way to Saluation through the flint of Heretical obstinacy If any thinke this cannot be performed against such a volume by a Treatise so small as this is for bignesse not comparable vnto his let him examine comparatiuely the strength the pith the arguments of the one with the other and I do not doubt but in this comparison the Prouerbe will also be found true A Cane non magno saepe tenetur aper 38. The Crocodile that vast venemous Serpent of Nilus is conquered and made away by a litle fish tearmed Ichneumon which watching an