driue it nay yet further I say that if the Church of Leyden vvho first receiued him and that by the vertue of that Couenant if they had come to see their errour in so doing yet vvould it not follovv that hee should bee desmembered seeing hee vvas separated but the Church ought to acknovvledge their sinne in so doing and to see that hee corrupted not other Reu. 2. 20. with his errour and that reason helpeth him not from Gen. 29. 24. where hee saith As Zilpah vvas not nor could bee rightfully Leahs handmaide except shee had bin Labanes first rightfully by whose gift shee was transmitted and conueyed vnto her Answer I grant that Laban could not rightfully giue her except shee had bin his rightfully before but if Laban had stollen her and Zilpah had run avvay and come to Leahs into the land of Cannan then Leahs might haue bought her or haue hiered her and yet Laban should haue no injury offered vnto him vnlesse his stealling her made her his rightfully vvhich neâ—… man ought to say So likewise neither the Church of Leyden nor any true Church ought not to receiue any from such an vnseparated people seeing they haue but stollen the ordinances of God and haue no right vnto them And whereas hee bringeth these reasons to proue his deepe intrest in the bussines let all know that no conceited intrest vvill beare out any to maintaine an errour and therefore all his reasonings is of little weight And for that hee saith that the Couenant vvas by the Churches both here and there also in the time of those vvorthy gouernors now at rest in the Lord esteemed truely Christian I pray let vs examme the trueth of this that the Churches both here and there did so esteeme for our selues I may say that the Church neuer did receiue it and therefore not so esteeme it neither vvas the voice of the Church euer taken concerning that Couenant but vvhen they showed their minde to bee contrary vnto it and condemned it Or doth Mr. Robin thinke that because our teacher who was a mise informed did a little whille esteeme of the Couenant that therefore the Church must so esteeme also and thought that wee must doe as these which consented to this letter which followed oâ—… suffered him in all or the most of his declinings And for that Church which is present in the place vvhere those Couenantmaker are as wee are truely informed by themselues they did neuer receiue it How is this true then vvhich Mr. Robin sayd but if it had bin so what vveight is there in that reason to helpe the Couenant much like vnto the reason of the Pharises Iohn 7. 48. which sayd against Christ doth any of the Rulers or the Pharises beleeue in him but this people vvhich know not the law are cursed Therefore I conclud it is not the esteeme of Churches nor of gouernors which giueth authority to such things but the word of the Lord and where hee saith the party intended by you should by your grounds not haue bin cast out but left out of the Church Answer Our grounds inforce not that conclusion seeing the person vvas novv become a separated person and a member of the Church of Leyden from whence wee receiued him as before I haue showed in the next place there is a syd and a halfe of the printed letter spent to excues and to justify Mr. S. in that speech in the vvhich hee seemed to imitat Paule Actes 24. 14. but of that I haue spoken before yet still I answer that those his speechs did proue his stifnes in that his former course and therefore of reconciliation wee had no hope while hee so stod and continued and for Mr. Robinson profering to come and to justifie Mr. S. in that his former proceding to the which I answer wee know well that hee vvas redy to that bussines and that hee was one vvith him in that his errour and therefore just cause wee had not to bee redy to giue him intertainment to come as a moderator to middle the matter seeing wee find no such president in the booke of God yet this wee hold and professe that if any can show that vvee haue sinned in any thing vvee ought and are redy to heare them and this haue vvee signified vnto the Church of Leyden by letter and therefore the way vvas open for them to come in that manner In the next place hee saith And wheras the course well begone and tending to pacification was as wee vnderstand interrupted and broken of vpon a ground taken from the course of not calling againe into question ciuill judgments once passed by the judge according to right let it not bee greiuious vnto you if wee a little warne you of that dangerous foundation vpon which it seemes you to much build your manner of procedings in the Church Answer To hould that matters being ended according to right ought not at mens pleasures to bee called into question againe I see not this proued to bee dangerous by all that which Mr. Rob. haue sayd For if matters rightfully ended should at mens pleasurs bee called into question vvhen vvould their bee an end of contention either in the Church or in the common wealthes and for the distinction which hee puteth between the ending of ciuill judgments of the casting forth of the sinner by the Church namly that repentance should follow to these distinctions Wee agree and signifie withall that if wee could see that good worke in these persons in question there vvould bee quickly are conciliation but yet further I ansvver to take away occasion from such as take an occasion to cauill at things equall that wee hold it lawfull although a matter bee rightly ended yet vvee may go ouer it againe as the occasion may bee offered yea and more then once and this wee haue practised in this matter in the publique with these men diuers times but yet it vvill not follow that at mens pleasurs wee must do this and bring our liberty into bondage and so to vphold contention But wher hee saith that a larger extent of discretion this vvay fevv causes in any age can persuad to then this in hand considering both the ground and cariage of the thing and the number of the persons opposite and vvith these intrest of all other Church in the bussines Answer The comparison of any age is more fit to shovv eloquence and to set a glose vpon the thing in hand rather then to proue that for vvhich it is brought and for the ground and cariage of the thing I haue before spoken of it to the which I refere the Reader and for the number of the persons opposite I answer although I am sory they are so many yet I am glad they are so few seeing these men are such suttell opposers labour so much to corrupt the mindes of the simple and hauing with them Ioab the captaine and Abiather the Preist I meane Mr.
being but a weeke betweene that none of the Church could minde that the sentence vvas altered but hee them fevv vvith him for hee knovvs their is freedom of exception to ◅ll but one thing more is to be obserued concerning the difference betvveene the dealing of this men and those brethren vvhom hee accuseth in that meeting for vvhen his matter vvas in the publique hee refused to debat the matter but vvould haue it tourned to priuate but those brethren whom hee accuseth did not only lay dovvn vvhat they did in that their meeting but offered themselfes to the triall of all that if any could shevv it to be otherwayes they should do it and not only once but divers times vvas this in question and allwayes they offering themselfes to triall And vvhereas hee speaketh of a thing yet worse for either the elder alone or these priuy counsellers vvith him stod not to this secōd agreement the Church made but vvrote another with alteration addition and diminishing besides the Churches knowledge and consent and sent it for the churchs minde and act Answer first vvher hee speaketh of the second agreement I knovv but one agreement tvvise spoken of and the occasion is manifested before tvvo if the alteration which hee speaketh of had bin by him sett dovvne then it may be it would appeare to be but that vvhich hee had commission from the Church to doe as he himselfe granteth in some thing but vvheras hee speaketh of adding and diminishing these things are yet to proue for I knovv not of any such thing neither any man that I knovv of did see the letter or gaue any counsell concerning it after it cam from the publique but the elder himselfe But vvheras hee saith that they were cast out vpon a very suspicion that a fevv of them met to writ to contradict the Churches action Answer I can not but marueil at him that hee should thus ran into this vntruth to say that it vvas but suspicion did not hee himselfe confesse yea of himselfe manifest both to the elder and also to others before it came to the Church besides some that heard the letter reade and I hope hee dares not deny But that hee did grante in the publique in the generall that his letter was the apposing of the letter of the Church although hee would not in the particulars debat the matters And after hee vvas cast out hee sayd vvhat did hee but take avvay the erronist grounds vvhich Mr. Delaycluce vvrit in the letter and therfore he thinking his errour is a trueth it may be hee thinketh so to deceiue the reader so likevvise hee calleth the laying dovvne of the matter in the Church the false information of the elder and that tvvo of them vvere singled out and selected from the rest First I ansvver vvhat doth hee call the false information of the elder I hope hee knoweth that both himselfe to other vvith him did manifeste to the elder themselses that they had vvritten in opposition to the Church and so consequently contrary to that trueth vvhich the Church maintained in the letter vvas it not this that the elder informed the Church of hee also saith that tvvo vvere singled out from the rest in vvhich hee vvould giue the reader to vnderstand as if all that those tvvo had got to their meeting vvere at the first knowne vvheras in deed it vvas othervvayes for although it was knovvne that they had a meeting to that porpose yet euery particular person vvas not then knowne but those tvvo opposites made knowne themselses to the elder of the Church pretending to him as if they vvould submit it to correction the elder refused to meddle vvith it himselfe but told them that it parteined to the Church they consented to haue it come to the church but vvhen it vvas propounded and laid downe their then they refused to answer or to debat the matter nor yet to deliuer vp the letter and the reason that they pretended vvas because the elder in the laying dovvne of the matter sayd that that vvhich they had done vvas a thing of an euill nott and vvas this a sufficient reason to refuse to debat the matter vvhat i◅ the elder had done like Moses Numb 32. ◅4 or like the messenger of the Church Iosua 22. 18. or like Ely 1. Sam. 1. 14. all these vvere directly charged vvith heauy charges and they vvere cleare yet did they Christi◅lik debat their matters cleared themselues but these opposites ◅ere but touched presently they kiked and so fullfilled the common prouerb that agalled horse backe is soon harte but they ought rather to haue approued themselse or to haue submitted themselues to the meanes to come out of their sinne as Dauid saith Psalm 141. 5. Let the righteous smite mee it shall be a kindnes and let him reproue mee it shall be an excellent oyle which shall not breake my head Wher was their pretended committing it to correction when vpon so little occasion they refused triall in the ◅ght place where it should be tried And for that speech which hee saith the informer speake that it might be holy just good for ought hee knew this was a speech spoken to prouoque him to ansvver ◅hilles they were a reasoning together And the best of vs may escape words some times in reasoning that will not stand yet is not this man the clearer for all that But wher hee saith that the matter was follovved by interrogatories to finde out sinne Answer sinne was found when his vnrestynes in his errour was found and this being novv manifested and layd dovvn to the Church wee needed not make much cerching to find the sinne but rather to vse the best meanes wee could to draw them out of their sinne which then did appeare and hovv could this be done but their must be questiōs or demandes or as hee termeth them interrogatories and a little after hee calleth them intraping demandes but hee must not shifte the thing so for did not hee alltogether refuse to debat the matter in the publique saying they were not according to the rull Matth. 18. dealt with all therfore they refused to debat the matter in the publique and hee knoweth vvell that when any is asked a question that is not meet or reasonable they may and doe refuse to ansvver and so might hee have done if hee could haue shevved vnlawfull questions but in that hee did refuse alltogether to answer or to debat the matter therin was their sinne of opposing of gouernment and hovv contrary vvere they in this to the seruants of God of old Numb 32. 14. 15. 16. Iosua 22. 21. Who although they were charged with heauy charges and had not sinned yet they ansvvered and cleared themselues But these although they had sinned yet they refused to debat or to ansvver and neglected the meanes to come out of their sinne and for his saying it vvas contrary to Matth. 18. I refer the reader to the
haue had communion with vs but hee seeing himselfe to haue resistance heare after this hee vvent to Leyden and creept into that Church and so made of them a bridge to git in vnto vs. 4. The Samaritanes in their corrupt estat fathered themselues vpon the ancient Patriarches of the Church Iohn 4. 12. 20. and contended with the true Church as hauing the trueth with them So likewise these account their mixed estat to be the true vvay of God and condemne vs for vvholly separating from the false Church and contend vvith vs for it 5. Although these Samaritanes vvere thus corrupt in their estat yet had they attained vnto the chiefe pointes of faith concerning the Messias as may appeare by the speech of the Woman Iohn 4. 25. vvhich vvas one not stricke in life vers 18. conuersation I say if shee vvhich vvas but a Woman could say so much what may wee thinke was amongst the other Samaritanes and also wee may see how redily they receiued Christ as vers 39. 42. showeth and yet for all those points of Doctrine which they had receiued notwithstanding they were condemned by our Sauiour Christ Iohn 4. 22. as worshipping they knew not what which teacheth vs how to judge and esteeme of such mixed religions And now these Couenantmakers allthough they agree with vs in the chiefe pointes of faith yet seeing they continue in their corrupt estat being vnseparated from the false Church wee are taught of Christ how to esteeme of them and so leaue them to be the successors of the Samaritanes and their right heires Now this is the Couenant which Mr. S. maintaineth and for the which hee so bestored himselfe when it was condemned and doth not hee lay afar ground to keepe men in the way of desemblation and so to remaine in the false Church by the maintaining of this Couenant yee to be a snare to such as haue left them if once they be possessed with this errour and let vs take himselfe for an example for although hee had left the Church of England both as it was a nationall Church and also the Parishes holding both to be false and being come so far reason should haue taught him neuer to haue to doe with such a Samaritanesh people againe in Church communion seeing they remain◅ as they did vnseparated yet since hee was cast out from vs hee went and had communion with them and baptized his child with them also and vvhy went hee not rather to the assemblies seeing that that is their most proper Church estat they being yet vnseparated and for that their priuat meetings it is but a schisme in Babell in that their doing they make a breach in both estats both in their antichristian estat and in their pretended seruing of the Lord 2. Kings 17. 33. 34. as the Holy Ghost testifieth of their predecessor And further I say to him concerning ◅is clamours who of our Church hath tourned their backe vpon vs excepte those which hee is the cause of about these troubles in question vvhich hee through much labouring and others with him hath inticed but if hee meaneth those of the Church of Leyden which hath declined or apostated is it not more probabell or rather to plane that they haue taken their ground from Mr. Ro. their Pastour which hath opened so many pathe wayes for them first in setting out a book for priuat communion vvith the members of the false Church 2. in the maintining of hearing in the assemblies to be no communion 3. in the maintaining of this Samaritanesh Couenant 4. in that booke called Apologie hee doth not only vvith smoth vvords darken the trueth vvhich formarly hee maintained But also hee saith plainly speaking of the Church of England in the 58. page and hee speaketh it in the name of the Church of whom hee is Pastor that their faith doth not consist in the cōdemning of others wiping their names out of the bead roull of Churches And a little after hee saith neither requier vvee of any ours in the confession of their faith that they either renounce or in one vvord contest vvith the Church of England in this it appeareth that hee is ashamed and runeth from separation and of this his alteration hath the aduersaries of the trueth taken nottise of long before this last book came out so as I. P. saith speaking of his book called the justification of separation Which hee sett out in the defence of the trueth it being a good vvorke yet thus hee speaketh of Mr. Rob. concerning it that hee openly pluckes out some of the bowells therof vvith his owne hands and now seeing this is so why doth this man indeuour to lay the fault vpon vs which withstand these errours and therfore wee are of him and them euill spoken of but as it is vsually seen that such as run from their masters do speake euill of them so such as decline do speake euill of them that oppose them therfore lett none merueill that wee are euill spoken of by Mr. S. and by those that assist him for it hath bin thus allwayes with the Lords people in former times yea euen the Apostells of our Lord Jesus hath thus bin dealth withall and now to these opposites I speak wheras one of them twoo hertofor hath spoken to this effect that if the Couenant could be desproued that then they ought to acknowledge their euill in the things for the vvhich they were cast out and although but one of them speake it yet seing hee speak the trueth and as it ought to be therfor I wish them both to consider it and for vs if the Lord giue repentances vnto them wee shall be glad and hould our armes open to receiue them but alas vvhat hope is their of it seeing this man hath so many times imitated the practise of Absolom vvhich vvent in to his fathers concubins that so all should haue no hope of reconciliation between them so the third time hath hee printed his contention to the world as if hee did meane to continue an adversary and therfore by these hee bideth battell but if his cause were better then it is yet great is the euill hee doth therin in causing the name of the Lord to be scandelled Another pathe way which hee maketh for libertines is in the maintaining of his refusing to answer which is before spoken of by vvhich president of his wee see the euill effect that hath followed for suerly by his example the lo◅se ones of the Church and such as are corrupted begin to oppose that diligent watch as ought to be keept in the Lords house and with his example and his bussie writing and printing and priuate corrupting of mens minds labouring to corrupt all that hee thinketh hee can worke vpon as by experiance wee haue seene and in deed not keeping to the things as they are as I haue showed before Therefore that his sin in this point may the better appeare I
but I will grant him to be the diuells snare layare as before I haue showed and I also grant that hee and some with him hath in snared and troubled the mindes of some which hath troubled vs now that hee being a chiefe instrument in this our troubles or strugling as he tearmeth it let him take the shame of it vnto himselfe and let him and all know that wee are commanded to striue ernestly for the faith once giuen to the Saincts Iude 3. and for vs I hope wee shall haue cause to say as the Psalm saith Our soule as a bird is escaped out of the snare of the fowler the snar is broken and wee are escaped Psalm 124. 7. And for to looke for help at the hands of men vvee leaue that vnto him which doth so labour for it and it shall bee sufficient for vs to haue the vvord of the Lord for our warrant to satisfie the conscience of all that feareth the Lord. And wheras hee saith that wee creept basely for helpe or reliefe I know no such thing yet obserue how contrary hee is vnto himselfe one whille hee saith wee reject the helpe of all and hear hee saith that wee creept basely for reliefe and neither of them are true as hee would make the Reader to vnderstand for I haue answered before that wee reject the helpe of none in due order and as their is just occasion And vvheras hee saith novv they vnconsciennably inuent slanderes hoping after so long time past they may now boldly change the causes of our differances and say vvee were cast out for a tempting to lead them to idolatry and so all wee haue published is no other then lyes vvhich they novv threaten to manifest to all the vvorld ANSWER Wee vvill leaue the inuenting of slanderes vnto himselfe vvho hath so laueshly let his tong and pen run that way as hath bin showed neither will vvee change the causes of our differances and therfore I haue layd it downe before that they were cast out for a factious or vnlawfull meeting 2. For contempt of gouernment in their refusall to answer or to debat their matter and 3. for contention in the manner of cariages these were the heades of their causes of their casting out But now doth hee thinke by this his clamours to stay vs that wee shall not speake or lay open his sin in the perticulars as vvee haue just occasion vvhich is contained in chose generall heads and seeing hee would not debat his matter before hee vvas cast out but vvould haue it tourned backe in to priuat therfore although hee hear of it in the publique vvee do him no injury seeing hee administers the occasion and if vvee should not lay open the perticulars to proue the faction or vnlavvfull meeting hee I suppose vvould take the aduantage therof therfore let the Reader obserue the ansvver before giuen but that any hath so spoken as hee settes it dovvne I knovv none yet if there did any so speake they shot some thing nearer the marke if the perticular bee looked into And vvhereas hee saith that vvee euer haue shuned triall to such clamours I haue ansvvered before But wheras hee saith that this letter doth manifest it wher also contrary to our saying is confearmed that they censered vs for not acknovvledging intraping demandes for Christ government and a lavvfull peacable meeting for faction Answer Hovv this letter doth manifest this vvhich hee saith it vvill in the ansvvering thereof appeare in the meane time to him I ansvver vvee might vvonder how Mr. Rob. can conferm that vvhich hee speaketh of seeing hee vvas altogether ignorant hovv things were caried and then on the other hand considering hovv hee vvas corrupted vvith the same errour and more errours of like natur vvhich also receiued him by that Samaritanest Couenant and also receiued for trueth this mans information and those that assist him considering of these things wee may obserue what caried away his affection but for answer I giue this man to vnderstand that Solomon Prouerbes 18. 17. hath told vs the condition of such as hee is therfore the greatest and first complainers are not allwayes the most clears of euill and therefore now let such as know the trueth judge and consider what is sayd betvveen vs concerning this matter Hear follovveth the ansvvering of the Letter of the Church of Leyden WEe receiued your letter Brethren but not ansvvering either our expectation or the vvaightnes of the bussines in hand ANSWER THis waightie bussines vvhich hee speaketh of vvas a reconciling of those persons vvhich vvas cast out for these things in question and hovv should vvee answer their expectation seeing those opposites were so stiffe in their sinfull course as that speech doth manifest which one of them spake aluding to Paule Actes 24. 14. in vvhich speech hee vvould seem to imitat Paule but although it vvas good in Paul to vse that speech and showed his fearmnes in the trueth yet vvas it euill in Mr. S. to vse that speech in the behalfe of his sinne and it showed his stifnes in the same and therefore no hope of reconciliation they so standing in that minde And vvheras Mr. Robin vvould seen to justifie him for his stifnes saying first touching the person intended by you I should not seeme strange to any if hee were most forvvard vvho vvas deeply interested in the bussines and that so far as his Church estat and membership must necessarily stand or fall vvith that Couenant impugned by you as the branch vvith the roote Answer I denie that his membership should stand or fall by that Couenant for wee receiued him to vs one these two grounds first as a member coming from the Church of Leyden vvith vvhom wee vvere in communion 2. As being a man capable because hee vvas fully separated from the false Church and this hee had manifested vnto vs before wee receiued him and although the Church of Leyden vvhich held the Couenant true did so receiue him by that Couenant yet wee allwayes rejected that Couenant and did not receiue him by that Couenant vnto vs for vvee hauing novv another ground to go vpon First that hee vvas a man absolutly separated 2. That hee being novv a member of a true Church vvhich vvas in communion vvith vs and allthough Mr. S. vvas contrary to himselfe in that hee vvas novv separated yet held that Couenant true yet else how should wee beare vvith him in the differance of his judgment according these Scripturs Rom. 14. 1. and Phil. 3. 14. 15. alwayes prouided that hee keept his errour to himselfe and not to corrupt others their vvith and this vvill stand vvith the Scriptures that so vvee receiued him yet if any can show vs other vvayes that it will not stand but that wee ought to haue don more then there is a remedy by faith and repentance in Christ to helpe all our a mise doings and not to run vnto such extreme conclusions as Mr. Robin would
Robinson and his people to establish them in their straying and wee hauing bin to backeward to withstand them in these their doings These things considered it is the Lords mercy that wee are preserued but if these opposers were many more then they bee it is no argument of weight to cause vs to yelde to any vndirect course whereby the trueth should bee betrayed but obserue I pray you that one if not more then one of those persons whom Mr. Robin would at aime haue respected yet a little before hee calleth a light person and I will not striue with him about it seeing his or their change was like the Barbarians Act. 28. 6. and for the intrest of all other Churches in the bussines I answer I knovv no proper intrest that any Church had in this bussines for the which they were cast out but our owne in which they were members for vnto vs it did appertaine to looke vnto their faction in the vvhich faction they indeuoured to corrupte our members vvith that their errour and hath not euery Church a particular right to vvatch ouer their owne members therefore I conclude that this is but a glose to deceiue the minde of them that readeth it And vvheras hee telleth that satisfaction for the manner of the cariage hath bin tender by the parties censured Answer Wee should haue bin glad if they did tender repentance for the matters themselues and had they not bin vpholden by these men in these their errours it may bee before now long they might haue repented of the matters also for they were as stiffe at the first when they vvere cast out for the manner as the matters And where Mr. Robinson saith that in a matter of meere counsaile and aduise more then which neither the Church of London requiered nor you could afford them any particular person aduised with and hauing their reasons of differances from the Church persuasion may and in causes of weight such as this was ought by speech or vvriting as their is occasion signifie that their different judgment and aduise to them whom it concernes prouided the same bee done in good manner and with due respect to the Church Answer The trueth ought to bee respected and also the Church which maintained the trueth but neither of these was so respected as they ought as before bin showed by those men in that their doings Moreouer I could except against this that it was not properly counsail or aduise in this point in question vvhich that Church desired but to let this passe I ansvver might not any heriticke haue such pretences to broch their errours by such smouth grounds or termes as these bee vnder the pretence of counsaile or aduise what if the Church of Smyrna Reu. 2. 8. being solissited by a seducer to receiue the doctrine of Balaam and should therefore send to the Church at Pergamos Reu. 2. 12. for their counsaile to know whether they ought to receiue it or reject it if then the Church of Pergamos did giue them counsayle not to receiue it and that by the word of God might those others vvhich vvere corrupted vvith that errour in that Church gather themselues apart from the Church and send their counsaile to receiue that errour and so oppose the trueth and the Church in their procedings M. Robin saith yea in smouth tearâ—…es But I say no because that if the vers 14 Church of Pergamos and Thyatira Reu. 2. 20. were blamed for suffering them before to teach and deceiue the Lords people then their sinne would bee more to lett them go on to corrupte the Lords people although they should plead with Mr. Rob. smouth termes of counsaile or aduise and therefore the Scripture out of Prou. 11. 14. is by him abused neither is their any liberty taken away from any seeing none hath liberty to broach errour and herein was the Church to vse authority and also to show reason vvhich vvee haue done and vvhen wee did it although it was at the request of the Church to vvhome vvee vvrit then this man toke an occasion thereat to make all this trouble Further hee saith That seeing both Moyses in the Law Deut. 19. 15. and Christ in the Gospell Matth. 18. 15. 16. 17. ordains that euery matter should bee established by two or three witnesses Answer There were more then tvvo vvitnesses vvhich knew the facte vvhich they had done from their one mouth besides some that were their but what need is here not to presse for vvitnesse vvhen themselues allwayes confessed the fact only here is the difference they thinke it was well doing and so Mr. Robinson saith also but wee say and knovv it to bee euill why then do they not lay this contention a syd and stand to maintaine their cause to make it good or to acknowledge their euill and for these Scriptures by him alledged wee acknowledge the force of them that no man which denieth a fact can bee condemned vnder two witnesses but what of this I hope they should also acknowledge that if there bee no witnesse yet if a man do freely confesse a fact worthy of death that then that man should dye and yet those Scriptures not in the least broken for Dauid which put the Amalakit to death knew these Scriptures alledged and also hee knew that hee broke them not because his owne mouth was as sufficient as many vvitnesses Now if no more vvere sayd it were sufficient to gainsay that vvhich Mr. Robin saith that wee do herein against Moses and Christ and the Law of the nature it selfe where hee bringeth Actes 24. 8. 13. Yet further I answer Mr. Robin faileth in his ground for hee taketh it for granted from Mr. S. information that vvee went vpon suspected euills and this Mr. S. runeth vpon also bringing our 8. position as before is showed seeing then they mise in the ground all falleth at once and now you may see how well the Church of Leyden hath made good their charge and which Mr. S. boasted of before And therefore Mr. Rob. clamours of that large liberty which hee speaketh of and saith hee can maintaine will here fall to the ground But vvhere hee saith And novv brethren vvhat shall wee say more vnto you our and all other Churches aduise you reject in confidence of your owne vnerring judgment and proceding in this matter Answer For vs wee confesse that wee are subject to erre yet ought wee not therefore to forsake any part of the trueth for tanting words which Mr. Robinson herein vseth to reproch vs withall and also maketh a show of that which is not wherein hee dealeth like Mr. S. vvith vvhom hee is a brother in euill But vvhat and where are those other Churches hee speaketh of hee should therefore haue keept himselfe to his ovvne Church vvhich had consented to this euill Letter vvhich hee hath written but if hee could shovv other Churches vvhich did so aduise vs were it not a vvorthy argument to conuince vs. Therefore I