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A36095
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A Discourse of infant-baptism by way of a dialogue between Pædobaptista, a minister for infant-baptism, Antipædobaptista, his friend, against it, Aporeticus, an ingenuous doubter
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1698
(1698)
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Wing D1599; ESTC R27860
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30,411
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63
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wash it from horrid Uncharitableness Aporet If you please Sir we 'll dismiss this Part of the Controversy and pass on to that which is Historical Antipaedobaptista disowns the Consequence of the Opinion and his Practice is otherwise Paed. I know he doth but the most of his Fellows in this Controversy will have no Fellowship with us in the Lord's Supper because we are Unbaptiz'd and least some Men's Christianity get the Ascendant of their Opinion they are Pronounc'd by these Zealots worse than we and we in their Language set our Thresholds beside God's Threshold that is if I take them we are Idolaters Antipae I heartily wish a better Understanding amongst Christians But if you please we will according to Aporeticus his Motion now proceed to what is Alledg'd out of Antiquity and here I must be free with you I know little of Antiquity but what I see Collected by Writers of our Way Paed. I wish all Unskilfull Men would Express themselves with the like Modesty they would not so readily have been Impos'd upon nor deceiv'd others that trusted to them I shall give you an honest and short Account of what is considerable in this matter If you desire an Answer to Mr. Tombes the Learnedst Champion for your Way which most that have Written after him have Copy'd from you have it perform'd by Dr. Homes Mr. Baxter Mr. Danvers that takes the Magdeburgensian Centurists and gives you an Account out of them of the Practice of Antiquity neither doth them nor us Justice and has brought but small Credit to his Cause I have taken pains to compare his Extract with the Historians and I could give you several Instances of his unfair Dealings But I promis'd Brevity Antipae There are Two of the Antients that I have heard Quoted on our side Tertul. Lib. de Bap. c. 18. Veniant Ergo dum adolescunt veniant dum discunt dum quo veniant docentur Tertullian and Gregory Nazianzen Paed. Tertullian indeed tells his Thoughts concerning Children that were not in danger of Death such might have their Baptism deferred And obviating an Objection that might be made from the Words of our Saviour Suffer little Caildren to come to me He Answers Let them come when they grow up and know when they come 1. You see the Insufficiency of the Answer he makes It satisfies not the Objection Our Saviour bids Let the Children come and he Answers Let them come when they grow up Then they cease to be Children such as our Saviour speaks of If this Answer would have serv'd our Saviour little Children had never been brought to him 2. From this it is Evident that Children were then Baptiz'd or what needed the Objection or his Answer 3. That Christians in that time thought there was ground in that Scripture for Childrens Admittance into the Church and consequently their Baptisme Compare what he here says with what he Writes in another place where he makes a Descant upon these Words of the Apostle Now your Children are Holy You will see he uses an Exposition of that Text De Anima cap. 39.40 and compares it with another John 3.5 that must make him speak for Infant Baptism or nothing As for Nazianzen he gives us his Opinion That it would be better he thinks that Children should put it off till they can Answer some Questions I suppose in Imitation of the Adult Oratio 40. que est in S. Baptisma p. 458. ut cit a Vossio in Thes de Bap. p. 435. 436. See Sellers Remarks on the State of the Children of Believing Parents p. 417 418. And to the Question Whether Children were to be Baptized he Answers Roundly They should and urges it from Childrens Receiving the like Seal of Circumcision and to Argue from Circumcision to Baptism was usual amongst the Antients Antip. If the Primitive Church were of your Mind why put they off the Baptism of the Children of Believing Parents Paed. And I may Ask you why the Baptism of Believers was delay'd after their Profession of Christianity The Reasons in General were these Some deferr'd Baptism both that of their own and Children out of a kind of Novation Principle That Sinners after Baptism were Irremissible misunderstanding Hebr. 6. See Dr. Owen in Cor. and on Apostacy Others till they could have a Time Place Company River as Jordan or Administrator that pleas'd them some because they would not discover their Errours concerning the Trinity into whose Name they were to be Baptiz'd some because they would not give the Church Satisfaction in Confessing their Sins others because they were Resolv'd to live in their Sins and would not cut off their Sins by Repentance or lay any Obligation upon themselves to Strict Holiness Some for fear of Persecution frequent in those days Some out of Imitation of Christ who was not Baptiz'd till the 30th Year of his Age. Others on more pitiful Reasons as that they were unwilling to defray some little Charges and Expence that attended it Others out of meer Carelessness or because they were busyed in the Affairs of the World Which last I doubt not would prevail with many in our Time if they had not been prevented by their Godly Parents Antip. The Reasons seem probable But were there no Men in the First Times that set themselves against Infant Baptism Paed. The first that I find charg'd with it was Pelagius who once deny'd it and it was indeed for his Purpose For it would have strengthened his hands if he could have wrested so Considerable an Argument from the Orthodox as Baptism For the Ground of it that Children were Born in Sin and therefore needed this Sacrament Knock'd his Arguments against Original Sin on the Head But so great a Cloud of Witnesses were against him even the whole Church of Christ that he was forced to let it alone as too hot for his Fingers and grant That Children ought to be Baptized Usher Antiq. Ec. Brit. p. 148. 153. c. 11. per totum Edit 1687. and confess That the Catholick Church was always of that Beliefe and Wonder'd that any that Read the Gospel should be of another Mind The next we find were the German Anabaptists a Generation of Men that were raised up by the Devil to the Disgrace of the Reformation a Company of Ignorant Furious Enthusiasts Antipaed By speaking so harshly of them you Reflect upon us Paed. No further than you undertake their Vindication I perswade my self you have nothing common with them but your opinion of Antipaedobaptism I wonder any of you will turn advocate for them and to clear them cast Reproach upon the first Excellent Reformers as if they had dealt falsely and misrepresented them and link them with the malicious Papists I would Counsel you to have nothing to do with them for you 'll get no Credit by their Company Antipaed You are always throwing their actions in our Teeth Paed. I know no man that is Honest and considerate that will make any further Use of it than this That it is not likely that so very glorious a Truth of God as you hold this to be That God first suffered the Pelagians the first sacrilegious Oppugners of the free grace of God and then the German Anabaptists a Number of Brutish Ranters to be the discoverers of and then the Propagators Antipaed The Waldenses were for Antipaedobaptism Paed. They were so represented by the malicious Papists their Adversaries especially after the Reformation such as Baronius Spondanus c. The Truth is the chief Quarrel against them was for their Opposition to the Grandeur and Vices of the Clergy 'T is true some of them deferred the Baptizing of their Children but it was not because their Barbs Ministers were abroad and they would not have them baptized by the Roman Clergy If you would know what their real Principles were you must take an Account of them from 1. The Concessions of their Adversaries when Unprejudic'd and when they design not to disgrace them Some of them plainly Profess That for all the Noise about them they had ever distinctly declared what it was they held So Rob. Gaguinus Gag de Relig. gestis Francone Edit An. 1511. fol. 104. a Monk who Wrote a little before the Reformation Phil. Bergomas that Wrote about the same Time Bergom Suppleus Chron. fol. 282.298 mentions no such thing of them 2. From their own Publick Professions which you may find in Bishop Vsher de Succes See Dr. Cave Hist liter p. 632. Eccles Edit An. 1687. c. 6. per totum Fuller Hist Holy War B. 3. c. 10. c. 8. p. 107 Momens Hist Papal defended As also Illiricus by Voetius desperat causa P. p. 666. lib. 3. chap. 9 10. c. c. 10. p. 150. Besides you may Read in English Morland Perin Dr. Allex. Boyer in their Histories Antip. The Antient Britains were for us Paed. The Quarrel was not about Infant Baptism but about some ROMISH Rites and Additionals to Baptism See Bede Hist Eccles who is the Antientest Author Antip. Berongarius oppos'd Infant Baptism Paed. There is no such thing mention'd in the Councils against him Vsher de success p. 104 105. Aporet I am satisfy'd in the Account you have given us I Thank you for the Trouble you have taken FINIS These Books for Infant-Baptism Printed for Tho. Parkhurst at the Bible and Three Crowns in Cheapside 1. MUch in a Little an Abstract of Mr. Baxter's Plain Scripture-Proof for Infants Church-Membership 2. Some Brief Directions for Improvement of Infant-Baptism by Will. Bagshaw 3. An Argumentative and Practical Discourse of Infant-Baptism by Will. Burkit Vicar of Dedham 4. The Improveableness of Water-Baptism by John Collinges D. D. 5. Scripture Warrant sufficient for Infant-Baptism by Giles Firmin 6. Infant-Baptism of Christ's Appopntment by S. Petto 7. Scripture-Light about the Gospel-Ordinance of Baptism by Mr. Hughes Minister of the Gospel